I told you that the Tories would eat the Lib Dems for breakfast. They will eat the country for lunch. Then they will kill a few foxes and eat those for dinner. The Lib Dems ought to have let them rule as a weak, Minority Govt and let them carry the can and get slammed next time around, with the Lib Dems picking-up the South.

Well the right wingers of the Libdems could have opted for this…. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_Unionist_Party

I have just heard on Radio 4 that Vince Cable has been put in charge of banking reform. Which is nice. The City spivs will be grumbling into their champers.

The LibDems have just committed ritual electoral suicide in our constituency that is for sure. As a local party worker I know how much work was done to establish that we were different and were reformers. Fat chance of ever selling that again.

Give them a slap-up dinner and half a bottle of champagne, they hop straight in the back of the van.

Tony, so when you told voters you believed in PR and the inevitable coalition government that follows, did you tell them we’d only ever have Lib/War Criminal coalitions? Or what did you expect?

Let’s see if Nick Clegg keeps his views on the subject of _Control Orders_.

See his article of February 2007, ‘This is a fork in the road’ reproduced here:

http://preview.tinyurl.com/2wa97tn

“Control orders are unique in that they give a politician, rather than a judge, the power to curtail someone’s freedom without even giving the individual the reasons why.”

Let’s also see how how the Toty/Lib Dem coalition will deal with ‘T e r r o r i s m’…..maybe ‘Al-Q’ will set off a wee frightener, just as was done when Gordy Brown took over from Blair.

Research the name of “Thomas Lund Lack” a detective inspector with the Metropolitan Police, who was threatened with the OSA & then pled guilty to ‘misconduct in public office by disclosing a secret Joint Terrorism Analysis Centre report to a journalist’. ( see http://preview.tinyurl.com/3xlv6c7 )

The JTAC report forewarned that an ‘attack would happen’ around the time of the premiership exchange (Blair/Brown) of June 2007, which is just what happened with the TigerTiger & Glasgow Airport terrorstuff.

There’s more to this politics stuff than meets the eye…..

bert

I am quite hopeful on control orders, but who the Home Secretary will be will make a lot of difference and that seems the most important thing we do not yet know.

Good questions. I believe in STV as a fairer representation of what democracy should be delivering. If we were where we are now because of a fair election via STV, then there would have been no deception. There would have been a fair election so the numbers would not be random, unrepresentative, unfair and unrealistic as they are. I agree that STV will deliver coalitions and the LibDems are more than ready to get on with making democracy work.

What we have this morning is anything but democracy, it is a cooked-up dirty deal for power-sharing. The sort of ‘old politics’ which is precisely what Nick Clegg avowed to replaced with ‘new politics’. I agree that with STV we’ll have to get used to power-sharing, but the only way it will work is if (i) the numbers are right in the first place and (ii) the voting public understood the ground rules before the election which created the numbers.

Where we are now is a pathetic media-driven re-run of 1974. The LibDem Executive has sold out just to get at most a year’s worth of sniffing power from closer proximity than otherwise.

I doubt if the Conservative party workers will be any more enthusiastic overall than we are, but at least they have their leader in No.10 in charge.

This result makes me even more sceptical about the Westminster system, or representative, parliamentary, democracy.

I think, ideally, I’d like to see a far more direct, federal, devolved, democratic system; only this would require a substantial and structural re-distribution of power in society, and I just don’t think the current system is interested in seeing its own demise.

I believe this result, and political constalation, is even more of the same old, same old, not “new politics” at all. The Liberal’s support for the grossly expensive and unecessary Trident system, shows just how little change there is going to be in practical terms.

Mmmm – I remain hopeful on Trident, too. I expect the Tories may twig we can’t afford it pretty quickly.

Cheer up Craig. You want Scots independence and it will be easier with a reasonable man who actually wants to abolish his own job in favour of Home Rule.

Also, if LibDems get Justice and Home, that’s a combination of Great Offices – let Liam Fox deal with budget cuts rather than Paddy. We can trumpet abolishing tax for low paid and stopping inheritance tax.

LibDems should make their advances on civil liberties, let Hague deal with the mess in Afghanistan and be impotent in Europe, and lets see if we can reform the Lords and the Lothian question…to start with!

They’re both going to eat the little people for breakfast.

I see they’re going for Cable’s CGT increase, but the Tories have managed to get an opt out for business. Hey fuckin ho.

That means that only the little people buying a few shares or whatever will get hit.

Well done Vince.

Craig,

The press has been quiet about the new Home Secretary, however a PA report of 9 hours ago states:

“One glaring omission on Tuesday night was the identity of the new Home Secretary.

It was looking increasingly like the Tories’ shadow Chris Grayling had missed out on the crucial position, with his Lib Dem rival Chris Huhne and Conservative shadow education spokesman Michael Gove being tipped for the role.

”

Michael Gove, Oh FFS….

http://stefzucconi.blogspot.com/2007/12/policy-exchange-hate-tank-busted.html

More on the case of Thomas Lund Lack here:

http://preview.tinyurl.com/3xy4lq

Dep PM is actually the best post for NC. He’s not a hostage to fortune, as he would be if he was something like Hom Sec. In the absence of DC he will become defacto PM and do PMQs etc (and in case you may have forgotten, that will be in about 4 months time).

Dale is hearing rumours of Gove for Justice or Home Sec.

So that’s civil liberties down the toilet too.

This is already looking like a total waste of space. All the Lib Dems are doing is propping up a Tory govt and allowing them to do things they wouldn’t otherwise be able to do as a minority.

The Lib Dems have got nothing substantive at all other than green leather and jags.

It’s not Huhne anyway, as he’s getting environment or some other waste tip.

Dale is saying Gove.

God fuckin help us all!

“The growing political distance between Scotland and the UK will in retrospect be the most important narrative of the next five years”

Probably a good result for the SNP, in a bitter sort of way. We now have a big stick to beat the ‘Liberals’ – their collaboration with the Tories, and another big stick to beat Labour – they could have stopped the Tories but didn’t.

Some were puzzled by Salmond’s offer to join a rainbow coalition with Labour, the Great Satan, but it was a clever finesse: if Labour agreed they would further damage the Union in English eyes (bloody Scots running things again), if they didn’t they would damage the Union in Scottish eyes (vote Labour, get Tory).

I beg to differ, Craig. I don’t think there is a chance in hell of Trident being cancelled, for a variety of reasons that have precious little to do with what we can, or cannot afford.

Also, I don’t believe we’ll see a “fairer” electoral system based on PR either, at least not the kind of PR you would recognise as PR.

In my opinion the Liberals have had it too “easy” for too long. They could adopt attitudes and policies that were essentially “free” and without “cost” because they were so removed from having real power and responsibility. They didn’t have to face the challenge of paying a price for their policies. Now, however, things have changed. The Liberals will be forced to show their true colours and where they actually stand on a whole range of issues. This will be a difficult transition for them. Like waking up from a dream, and stepping into the harsh light of reality.

Personally I think we need to constantly remind ourselves that campaign rhetoric and nice speeches designed to appeal to everyone, more or less, are one thing; but government is something else entirely. Promisses made on the campaign trail are worth virtually nothing.

Futhermore, can one really have a “fair” electoral system in an “unfair” society?

Murdoch will still have the Sun at his disposal, and I won’t. Democracy requires Democrats and an engaged citzenry to function. Do we have that anymore? Haven’t we really become “consumers” rather than citizens?

I am, what I consume. Isn’t this the prime characteristic of modern man in the post-political world, where the ideology and culture of the market reigns supreme?

Still, Craig, I hope you’re right about this new government, not so much for myself, as I’m economically bulletproof, even in this Depression, at least for the present; it’s “ordinary people” that concern me. I think they are going to be crushed under the wheels of permanent depression.

Fuck me, remind not to invite you lot to a party.

Just a thought but all those who rightly castigated labour on human/civil rights will now see what difference the new government makes. IMHO probably not a lot!

Paul J

‘I refuse to presume this government will be worse. It hardly can be worse – but we shall see.’

Indeed Murray, they wanted us to invade Iraq much sooner. Poor Iran.

paul

I am hopeful you are wrong. I don’t believe even Tories are as hostile to civil liberties as NuLab. But time will tell.

It will be interesting to see whether New “Labour” learns any lessons from defeat. I support parties based on their policies, not tribal loyalty, so if they remembered some socialist principles, renounced their 13 year attack on civil liberties and changed their foreign policy etc, I’d consider voting for them in future. I suspect they’ll elect a Millipede as leader however, and carry on just as before with the same corrupt war mongers in place. Unfortunately, despite this, they may well get back in again at the next election when people vote against the party/parties they blame for the cuts, having forgotten who was responsible for the deregulation which brought about the need for the austerity measures in the first place.

BBC now reporting that Gove is “quite likely” to get the Home Office.

He’s a well-known civil libertarian with a special fondness for muslims.

Alan Johnson has ruled himself out of the Labour leadership contest.

New politics all round then.

PR for the House of Lords, will you cheer up now FFS?

The simple truth is that PR for the HoL doesn’t matter a fig in the grand scheme of things.

Hasn’t it crossed your mind that if the Tories don’t mind PR for the HoL why do they mind it for the Commons.

It’s people like you that mean the rest of us can’t buy two packets of paracetamol at the chemists.

Craig

“I am hopeful you are wrong. I don’t believe even Tories are as hostile to civil liberties as NuLab. But time will tell.”

You’ve a short memory, or maybe you weren’t on the wrong end of the Tories during the 80s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqE3SqSpT50

I remember Thatcher very well. People forget just how universally she was hated in her early years.

It took the Falklands war to garner her any support.

And I have to say that this is all beginning to look a bit samey.

Owen Lee Hugh-Mann

The Labour party will do all it can to win back the support of their financial/madia masters. They and most of the trade union leaders are the shepherds and their members and supporters the sheep. Labour will do anything to win back the support of their masters, anything.

Watch as they support (one way or another) the tory party in the coming years, they will say one thing and do another, all for show that will be Labour.

Liam Fox gets Defence.

Watch out Iran.

“Liam Fox says military force must remain an option in 2010′s confrontation with Iran

In an interview with today’s Sunday Telegraph, Shadow Defence Secretary Liam Fox warns that 2010 is the year in which Iran’s nuclear ambitions must be confronted. Unlike the Government which rules out force, Dr Fox says that the military option must remain on the table.”

“Dr Fox said Iran is the “biggest single emerging threat that we face” but claimed not enough is being done to prevent it becoming a nuclear weapons state.

He warned that it was essential to thwart Iran’s attempts to arm itself with nuclear weapons or risk Egypt, Saudi Arabia and Turkey following suit.

He attacked those who claim that renewing Trident, the British nuclear deterrent system, will be too expensive.”

Suhayl: “I told you that the Tories would eat the Lib Dems for breakfast. They will eat the country for lunch. Then they will kill a few foxes and eat those for dinner.”

It would be okay if they actually ate the foxes. It would be no worse then than pheasant shooting or whaling, or perhaps bullfighting.

Brian: “Fuck me, remind not to invite you lot to a party.”

If you’re serving fox on toast then remind me not to come.

Tony: “The simple truth is that PR for the HoL doesn’t matter a fig in the grand scheme of things.”

PR for the HoL would be fine if it actually had any power. Even its ability to send bills back for a year or two for review would be okay but I take it they don’t even have that power any more.

The Labour party have the biggest role of all to play for the tories in the coming years, they will not be found wanting. This was truly a three-way coalition.

angrysoba, vegetarian I’m afraid, but if you’re all gonna stand around moaning that your glass is half empty then please don’t bother.

Libs in coalition, PR in the HoL, sane heads around the cabinet table – Liberal ideas are on the rise. I’ve only been wasting oxygen for forty years, but never has our country been more under the influence of Liberal philosophy than it is this morning, but it sounds on here that most people can barely restrain the razor blade over their wrist.

brian at May 12, 2010 9:10 AM

Lol, so true.

Vince Cable on Sky News saying they (Lib-Dems) are getting their way on tax reform – well, that’s a good start.

Jeez, let’s wait and see how this pans out.

What a lot of Jonahs! How does it feel living in the belly of a whale?

I really despair of the British obsession with seeing the worst of everything. How about giving this a chance – by their deeds ye shall know them, and all that?

BTW Craig,

Unless and until Scotland leaves the UK it’s not Scotland’s oil, it’s the UK’s oil. You of all people ought to know that – weren’t you involved in drawing up the maps, in an earlier incarnation?

Different parts of the UK can’t grab bits of the national income when it suits them, but demand equal shares of the rest, it doesn’t work like that.

And even if Scotland were to become independent (which I will wager a small sum they would never vote for once the true figures were put to them) they wouldn’t get anything like all the hydrocarbon reserves – something about the trend line of the border?

Or does Scotland get to “access its own hydrocarbons” but still get the English taxpayers’ money? According to the Wikipedia entry (not always 100% reliable, I know), identifable country-based spending per head in the nations of the UK in 2006/7 was:

England £7,121

Scotland £8,623

Wales £8,139

Northern Ireland £9,385

John D Monkey

Yes, I was heavily involved in negotiating up the UK’s continental shelf boundaries. I look forward to doing the same for Scotland eventually.

The higher public spending per head in Scotland comes nowhere near the revenue the UK gets from Scotland’s hydrocarbons.

Nick Clegg was a protege of Leon Brittain former Home Sec in the Thatcher admin.

Apparently young Nick wanted to be a Tory MP.

Well he’s achieved something rather similar, eh.

This according to the much missed Tony Howard who knows all their little secrets.

“What a lot of Jonahs! How does it feel living in the belly of a whale?”

Unfortunately, all too often, it turns out that ‘pessimist’ is a synonym for ‘prophet’.

Terry,

Nick worked for the EU commission and at one stage Leon Brittain was his Commissioner. In the same sense I worked for Geoffrey Howe, Malcolm Rifkind and John Major when I was at the FCO. That is not a snippet, it is bollocks.

Clegg was a Tory in his youth and is on the right of the Lib Dems. That is no secret. But at least he’s not a war criminal like the scum we just got rid of. Let’s see what he does in government.

A friend of mine for nearly 20 years now would agree with you. When I first knew him he could be a laugh, especially after a couple of drinks, but after 20 years of moaning that life is a miserable pile of shit I think it’s fair to say he’s been proved correct, at least in his own case.

I might drop him a line and point him to this blog, I’ve got a feeling he would be amongst friends. Not that he’d look at it that way though.

Craig,

this may be nit-picking, but isn’t there a difference between being a member of a EU Commissioner’s cabinet, and a FCO official? Are the former not specifically appointed by the Commissioner (Brittan in this case) much like political appointees? Ready to stand corrected.

On the wider issue of what to expect from this government, on liberal reforms a wait-and-see approach is a fair stance. Can’t see that Hague’s “British foreign policy”, in contrast to Cook’s aim of “moral foreign policy” can lead to any improvement however. Plenty of scope for Labour to re-group in opposition and eventually renege on much of their more pernicious work in government…

PeterL,

Clegg was not appointed to the commission by Brittain – he was there already.

Face up to it folks it’s a slam dunk formula for Middle East peace talks going nowhere as a precursor to war with Iran. The uniformed British public have been duped into more ‘war of terror’ by the main media. Murdoch needs sensationalism to drive his newsreels and that means conflict.

In the planning stage already is another ‘heads up’ terror incident to galvanise the new coalition into preventing any change to control orders as Brian’s insight suggests, and weaken the case for scrapping ID cards. Friends of Israel will underwrite the score to keep us in our bunkers.

The Lib Dems are now enslaved and powerless; Trident, war, terror and ‘Big Brother’ politics are ‘de rigeur’ – Thanks people – now bury your heads in the sand for five years.

Craig

I know that Clegg joined the Tory party whilst at university. The problem is that he has denied it.

On the other matter of Leon Brittain, what Tony Howard said is that Clegg wanted to become a Tory MP. He said that very specifically on TV at about 10.52 am this morning. he also said that he was a protege of Leon Brittain.

You’re not suggesting that you were a protege of your Conservative political masters at the FCO, are you? Nor are you suggesting that you wanted to become a Tory MP, are you?

Sometimes people just join the party that offers the easiest ride to the top. It’s quite common. Not everyone adheres closely to Scottish principle, and certainly not the European Catholic aristocracy.

I want to be hopeful, but when I look at the cabinet line-up, I can’t help but be pessimistic. Craig, I would be genuienly interested to hear your views on Liam Fox as Defense Secretary.

There is a range of attitudes expressed here, |Brian, but personally speaking, just because I expect New “Labour” to continure in it’s wicked ways under a Cameron-clone Millipede brother, doesn’t mean I’m depressed. Perhaps you’re projecting your own feelings? Politicians and bankers tend to make me angry rather than depressed, and anyway, I happen to think the LibDem-Con coalition is a better prospect than the ironicaly titled “Progressive” alternative which would have perpetuated a government of corrupt authoritarian war criminals that was way past its ‘sell by’ date.

With Fox at “Defence” and Hague at the FO-WW3 becomes all the more likely.

Hague recently expressed alarm that Hezbollah were reportedly moving into the Bekaa Valley in Lebanon.This grave development was deemed one for which Iran,according to Hague,would face serious consequences.

Anyone with a semblance of knowledge re-the Middle East,or merely familiar with the work of Robert Fisk who’s based in Lebenon,knows Hezbollah have been in the Bekaa Valley since at least the late-1970s!

Looks like the Wall Street/Bank of Rothschild will get their new war.It’s a trick they pulled on the back of the long depressions they created in the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries.

Shamefully the public still remain oblivious to the role played by international finance in revolution and war over centuries past.

Look out for the next false-flag mega-event-coming soon to a state near you!

Craig

“The higher public spending per head in Scotland comes nowhere near the revenue the UK gets from Scotland’s hydrocarbons”

I think you’ll find that the amount of revenue from oil fluctuates quite wildly (in line with world oil prices).

Sometimes it does go way above the identifiable spending amount, at other times it has gone below (see HMRC website). Because of that it would probably be unwise to plan anything on the basis of what you may get from oil, you’d probably end up way out (in either direction).

As a PS, there is no guarantee that oil prices will remain high, both Con/LD are wanting green policies/technology, if there is big progress in these areas (esp globally) the price of oil may fall through the floor.

‘now bury your heads in the sand for five years.’

In the next five years this three-way coalition are going to be doing more then just ‘bury’ ‘heads’ they are going to ‘bury’ untold numbers of bodies, six feet under.

hi ho hi ho it’s off to war we go

Craig,

It will be interesting to see how the new coalition Government plays out in Scotland, where neither party is strong.

As regards the oil, I wasn’t necessarily saying one was equal to the other, I don’t know the figures, more pointing out the fear many of us have that Scotland wants to eat its cake and still have it (as the original quote goes).

Surely what I said is correct, that it’s not “Scotland’s oil” unless and until Scotland is an independent country? And almost none of the oil is actually under the land of Scotland or accesssed directly from that land – so its ownership depends on international treaties and agreements as to who owns the sea bed and what lies under it. Wouldn’t Scotland want a fair share of the money if it were all off the coast of some other part of the UK?

That said, I’d be interested in knowing what the net figures for an independent Scotland are likely to be. Scotland keeping its fair share of the hydrocarbons and own taxes, but getting nothing from the rest of the UK, etc. – I’ve never seen an independent calculation of these.

Presumably an independent Scotland would want to have some joint arrangements with the UK for areas where it was not cost-effective or logical to duplicate function. Defence (but not Trident)? Air traffic? Met Office? etc.

And what proportion of the remaining hydrocarbons would Scotland get if it were to decide to leave the UK? Am I right in thinking that a lot of the gas is in the English sector? And what if Orkney and Shetland decided to remain in the UK – or wouldn’t they get a say?

11.16am

Oil prices are going up. In the medium to long term, supply is dwindling and demand is rising inexorably – due to China, India Brazil etc. Our wind turbines are insignificant.

Spending in Scotland has never exceeded Scotland’s hydrocarbon revenues.

“In the planning stage already is another ‘heads up’ terror incident to galvanise the new coalition into preventing any change to control orders”

Mark, how do you know about this? Who told you?

If you have any information on this terror incident about to happen aren’t there people you should be notifying?

Well, it would appear that we are comprehensively phuqqed. My party, the Libdems, acquired an extra 800,000 votes this time; I wonder how many were former Labour voters, and I also wonder how betrayed and angry they feel? My partner is a lifelong Labour supporter who switched to LD, and this morning she’s furious to realise that her vote played a part in putting Cameron into office.

I’m not quite ready to tear up my membership card, but I won’t be making donations or offering to work on campaigns. I do, however, intend to misbehave.

John D Monkey,

England has some gas but 90% of the hydrocarbons are Scottish. There will need however to be a formal maritime boundary negotiation – which I hope I will be ble to be part of.

Having got rid of a government of proven warmongers, why so many people are urgent to presume this lot will also go to war is beyond me. I am willing to wager that this government will not start any new wars. The Lib Dems will be against it and most of the Tories – unlike New Labour – are not neo-cons.

mike – same question I asked earlier, if you’re only happy to go in to coalition with Labour aren’t you playing for the wrong team?

“Shamefully the public still remain oblivious to the role played by international finance in revolution and war over centuries past.

Look out for the next false-flag mega-event-coming soon to a state near you!”

This isn’t analysis. This is just utterly boring old toss drivel that boring old supercilious idiots like you spout off about whenever you want to look clever.

“I prophesy a bomb will go off somewhere and only smarty pants me will know that the real culprit is an all-powerful omnipotent mysterious power that only smarty pants me knows about.”

I wondered a few times while New Labour were in government whether the Tories could be any worse. They showed during the election campaign that they can.

It’s like Clinton or Obama vs the Bush administration. The foriegn policies of Obama and Clinton involved bombing thousands of civilians and starving millions. The Bush administration’s added in the Iraq war and greatly expanded torture programmes.

No matter how bad the main left/liberal party is the main right/conservative party always manages to be worse.

mike

I agree entirely this wil be an electoral disaster. But I still think it could be a better government than the one we got rid of – that-s a very low bar indeed.

‘Oh what a tangled web we weave,

When first we practise to deceive!’

The three-way coalition

Craig – most Conservative MPs voted for war on Iraq. More Labour MPs voted against it than Conservatives (though still a minority of Labour MPs).

The Conservatives are just as much neo-cons as ‘New Labour’

angrysoba, try looking up Operation Gladio.

Well at least Gove didn’t get Justice or Home. I’m sure he’ll be doing damage somewhere though.

It seems as though the Tories have put two relatively nice Tories into Home and Justice, just to put us all at our ease.

How long this situation will remain is the question.

But clever move anyway. No point frightening us yet. Blair was a very nice man in the beginning too.

There is one outstanding seat to be contested – Thirsk & Malton – postponed due to the death of a candidate. Will the Lib Dems be standing against the Tories? What about future by-elections, or the next general election for that matter? It seems to me that the Lib Dems will have to bust this coalition before they can stand again as an independent party.

‘There will need however to be a formal maritime boundary negotiation – which I hope I will be ble to be part of.’

After all this I don’t think any sane person would have you judge anything Craig, sorry, but it is the truth.

Duncan -

I don’t think that’s true (5 of support for the war). I am pretty certain most New La MPs voted for the war, by a large majority. You are propagating a silly left wing myth.

angrysoba, Tom Lund-Lack, a retired detective inspector working as civilian with the Counter Terrorism Command at

Scotland Yard, became aware of an ‘Al-Queda’ plot in April 2007, _scheduled_ to happen when the prime ministership was to change in June/July 2007:

See page 15 of this PDF:

http://preview.tinyurl.com/36k7eak

“[Thomas Lund-Lack] was jailed for eight months in 2007 for leaking information about a planned al-Qaeda attack on the West…”

The Sunday Times article arising from Lund-lack’s leak is reproduced here:

http://preview.tinyurl.com/3xy4lq

“Another plot could be timed to coincide with Tony Blair stepping down as prime minister, an event described by Al-Qaeda planners as a “change in the head of the company”.

” _

THE TIGER TIGER/GLASGOW AIRPORT PLOT, happened right on cue.

Those wacko Met Police Conspiracy theorists……..

“angrysoba, try looking up Operation Gladio.”

Oh, I’ve looked that up in the past. So, what’s your point? Hezbollah is a front-group for the Tory Party?

Duncan is correct.

“Tony Blair has won Commons backing to send UK forces into battle with Saddam Hussein – but also suffered another major backbench rebellion.”

“But the revolt among Labour MPs was still up on the last vote with 139 backbenchers opposing Mr Blair compared to 122 at the last vote.

Fifteen Tories defied their leadership by voting against the government.”

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/2862325.stm

angrisoba used to hang out with Cathouse Larry and the hopeless 911 disinfo gang.Neither of them have a scintilla of reasoning capability.

angrisoba probably thinks a gladio is a flower with sword-shaped leaves!

Check out the guy’s blog-I rest my case-a complete half-wit.

That an oxymoron?

Look it up,angri!

“That an oxymoron?”

Asks a moron.

Sorry Craig, but it’s no myth – it’s an easily checked fact (see the links below)

More Labour MPs voted against war on Iraq than Conservative MPs on every division – by a factor of 10

It’s a fact, not a myth. The majority of Labour MPs voted for war – but a large minority – over 100 – voted against it. The highest number of Conservatives to vote against any Iraq war bill was 15.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/2862397.stm

http://www.publicwhip.org.uk/division.php?date=2003-03-18&number=118

>I refuse to presume this government

>will be worse. It hardly can be worse -

> but we shall see.

What a load of crap, Mr Murray. According to you, Obama was going to be great.

In 1997, the Tories were kicked out because people had had enough. Labour told us “things can only get better”.

Now, we’re meant to believe the Tories and Clegg, who are telling us, albeit in different words, that things can only get better.

You really do take the public for idiots. But that’s what I expect from a former British Ambassador who calls Labour “evil”, while overlooking all the atrocities – domestic and foreign – committed by the Tories. It was the Conservatives who facilitated the Rwandan massacre, Mr Murray, in which one million people were butchered and hacked to death, including children and babies:

“The US and Britain also argued that before…troops could be deployed, there needed to be a ceasefire, even though one side was massacring innocent civilians. The Czech republic’s ambassador confronted the security council saying that wanting a ceasefire was ‘like wanting Hitler to reach a ceasefire with the Jews’. He later said that British and US diplomats quietly told him that he was not to use such inflammatory language outside the security council.

“Britain and the US also refused to provide the military airlift capability for the African states who were offering troops for this force. The RAF, for example, had plenty of transport aircraft that could have been deployed.

“Britain also went out of its way to prevent the UN using the word ‘genocide’ to describe the slaughter. Accepting this would have obliged states to ‘prevent and punish’ those guilty under the Geneva Convention.”

All these facts, and more, are in a book entitled “Rwanda: A People Betrayed” by Linda Melvern, a journalist.

The only reason you set up this blog, it seems, is to get back at Labour for how you were treated. You don’t give a damn about anyone in this country, otherwise you’d be calling the Tories evil, too.

There is no democracy in this country anymore – that’s the reality you’re denying, Mr Murray.

When are Craig’s fans going to wake up and realise he’s as corrupt as the politicians.

other richard – I agree with you on Rwanda, but you’re wrong about Craig.

We are still a democracy too – a corrupt democracy that’s far too easily influenced by Murdoch and his cheap tricks, but still a democracy.

Craig

“Oil prices are going up. In the medium to long term, supply is dwindling and demand is rising inexorably – due to China, India Brazil etc. Our wind turbines are insignificant.”

China, India, Brazil and others are also coming under increasing pressure to get their energy in a far cleaner manner. I’m not certain why you mention wind turbines as they are “old” technology when I was talking about how new technologies will be developed (including new generations of batteries being developed in Japan)?

“Spending in Scotland has never exceeded Scotland’s hydrocarbon revenues.”

Never is a very long time, perhaps you’d care to be more precise on the period that you are talking about. If you do actually mean never I would also be interested to hear where you get your spending figures. Are you saying that less public money went to Scotland than the following(year and total oil revenue for UK – HMRC figures):

1980/81 3.7 Bn

1988/89 3.2 Bn

1989/90 2.4 Bn

1990/91 2.3 Bn

1991/92 0.9 Bn

1992/93 1.3 Bn

I see that Millipede has already got his supporters out punting his candidacy for Labour leader, both Postman Pat and Hissy Fit Flint having already declared their support.

I think the Labour party needs to have a good long hard look at itself and reject those responsible for its crimes, the Blair gang, Lord Manderlay and associates of.

As we saw in the substantial vote against the Iraq war by Labour MPs there are quite a few who would reject Millipede’s candidacy even amongst the parliamentary party.

Millipede has little or no support amongst the Unions and certainly not amongst local Labour activists.

It’s important to ensure that his campaign doesn’t gather a head of steam.

Let’s move away from the neocon influence and back to core Labour values, and then we can more easily attack the more committed neocons in the Lib Dem and Conservative party and do it with integrity.

angrysober,

We must set our sights on Riyadh and the Saudi neoconservatives. They want the benefit of a strike on Iran without taking any public responsibility for the American action.

Riyadh is fully aware that the nuclear bomb threat from Iran is just hype, a raison d’etre for a strike. Clearly they are sensitive to Iran’s dominance in the area by her political links to powerful actors in states where the central government is weak. Those links are based on a mixture of shared ideology, sectarian affiliation, common antipathy toward the United States and Israel, and short-term self-interests, in different degrees in different cases.

The Saidi’s were passive on Iraq in the beginning, now they strongly support Ayad Allawi for obvious reasons.

Substantial majorities in both houses of Congress seem to be chomping at the bit to confront Iran. Even Barack Obama’s administration seemed to see its policy of engagement with Tehran as a “last chance” before more forceful measures.

So here in the UK the foundations for war/strike/pre-emption have begun with the right people in the right places.

Hague believes we have become a ‘foreign land’ a mindset influenced by the “compassionate conservatism” ideology of George W. Bush and he will attempt to ‘cure’ society by one means or another ready for the onslaught. I expect him to visit Riyadh soonest.

Sorry Craig but I stand by my predictions.

Just one more fact I omitted – Trident – no, even under pressure from Nick, the Conservative party and backers will never ever give up our SSBN’s – why? -certainly not from a threat from North Korea or Iran; the fleet (ours and France)and their ‘targeting dossiers’ are the ‘stalemate’ in the game of chess with China – who will be furious when the oil pipeline feed abruptly stops flowing to them after the pre-emptive strike.

“Different parts of the UK”

Huh? Colonies must subordinate their wishes to the preferences of the conqueror, and there are no borders except those accepted by the emperor? Your ‘UK’ is a fiction, an instrument whose utility was limited to the cats who drank the cream. It is fading – it is a Cheshire cat. Its residual spectral grin is hideous.

Ian Duncan Smith – arch criminal – leading British War-monger!!!

When the Washington administration started to twitch about Saddam Hussein, Duncan Smith was gung ho. He stated unequivocally that the Conservatives would support military action even if Bush did not seek UN authorisation.

It was Duncan Smith’s ardent support for war that changed Blair’s thinking in that he was never going to risk allowing the Tories to be the pro-American, pro-war party and Labour to return to its 1980s position of being “soft” on defence and anti-American.

The political calculation was therefore straightforward. As far as Blair was concerned, if he had opposed the war he would have destroyed the New Labour coalition and given up vital ground to the Conservatives.

Rupert Murdoch’s newspapers were a key factor in this respect. Murdoch was a passionate supporter of Bush’s foreign policy. Blair knew Murdoch would have switched his newspapers’ support to the Conservatives if he had sided with the loathed Chirac and Shroeder in opposition to the war. In its 2005 election endorsement for Labour The Sun backed Blair for a single reason ?” his support for Bush in Iraq.

Can you see how it all fits together?

We are in trouble friends – serious trouble.

I agree Mark – i hope the Lib Dems will vote down any plans for British involvement in an American war on Iran if one’s started – but it’s not guaranteed that they will.

tutti-frutti little richard seems to have done v.little research on Rwanda.

The Melvern account largely follows the bog-standard Hollywood Hotel Rwanda genocide story/establishment narrative.This was the PR blanket under which the Anglo-US elites, who instigated the current wars across the Great Lakes region for the sake of gorging themselves on its vast mineral resources, covered themselves.

“Darfurism” is a another product of the same establishment narrative used to cover the imperial ambitions of Western powers in Sudan.

The idea that the Tories were uniquely responsible for the carnage in Rwanda is preposterous.It’s akin to the same one-sided view of the conflict in Yugoslavia peddled by writers like Brendan Simms in Unfinest Hour.

At least even Simms made the point that NO-ONE who contributed in the Commons debates on the Balkan wars throughout the 1990s had any real expertise on the region at all!

The same cross-party ignorance characterised the political response to Rwanda as well.

The ethnic conflicts in both Yugoslavia and Rwanda were Western proxy wars where our clients, the Croat/Bosnian and KLA muslim militias in the former and the RPF in the latter, were sponsored and given diplomatic cover by the West.

There are far more reliable sources on Rwanda than Linda Malvern.

globalresearch has extensive articles by real commentators like Keith Harmon Snow, Barrie Collins, Peter Erlinder.Robin Philpot’s Rwanda 1994, Colonialism Dies Hard is worth reading too and is available online.

If you seek authentic knowledge rather than just to make cheap and inaccurate party political points these rather than Melvern should be your first port of call.

Incidentally your reading of Melvern seems, like your criticism of the Tories, quite superficial.She certainly never made a case for their being especially responsible for the carnage.Like Andrew Willis in Silent Accomplice, Melvern lays responsibility primarily at the door of the French.

Citing the French insistence at the UN Security Council in April 1994 that the conflict then ignited was a civil war and that the necessity for an immediate ceasefire overrode any need for the Council to discuss genocide, Melvern also noted the French role in propping up the Habyrimana Hutu-dominated government in the 1991-94 lead-up to the carnage.

While the castigation of the French role in precipitating the genocide was a popular view within Anglo-US establishment circles because it neatly air-brushed their own role the writers above largely take the view that it was these powers as well as Belgium rather than France that began the conflict by backing the initial RPF invasion from Uganda in 1990 in the first place.

The general point re-politicians meekly following the course prescribed by the military-industrial complex seems ominous for those of us who fear that the lot that just got into power will with the US and Israel instigate WW3 on the back of some false-flag event some time soon.

By the way, in the case of Rwanda, the false-flag event that triggered the genocide was the double assassination of Habyrimana and the Hutu President of Burundi in the plane shoot-down that immediately preceded the Hutu killing spree.

Former UN General Secretary Boutros-Ghali cited CIA complicity in this triggering event as key to what then transpired.Conveniently UN mission chief, Romeo Dalliere never accounted for the disappearance of the cockpit black-box voice recorder.Nor has the US pressed the UN to unravel the shoot-down mystery.The black-box is ensconced in a safe in the UN building in NY.

Likewise Linda Melvern has re-iterated ad-infinitum on gate-keeper sites like DN that we will never know who was responsible for the events that sparked the killing.

All very convenient for those who gained most material benefit from the numerous wars that have followed.

“THE TIGER TIGER/GLASGOW AIRPORT PLOT, happened right on cue.

Those wacko Met Police Conspiracy theorists……..

Posted by: bert at May 12, 2010 12:07 PM”

Bert, you’re the wacko conspiracy theorist. The man you are talking about didn’t say he thought there would be a false flag attack at all. That’s your wacko conspiracy theorist take on it.

More dishonesty and lies.

angry-airhead

For want of knowledge you’re always going to be at a disadvantage in any debate.

If you have nothing meaningful to contribute-PISS OFF!

“If you have nothing meaningful to contribute-PISS OFF!”

Make me.

As for nothing to contribute at least I don’t bung the same old vocabulary of “neo-con, Zionist, bankers, international finance, false-flag, war, revolution” into a Markov list and regurgiatate said words in any and every situation.

Your supercilious garbage is boring.

“Make me”-quote of the decade from air-head angry.

For razor-sharp wit and repartee you have no equal (LOL) !

You infantile dingbat!

With your playground mentality and desperate need for approval I can’t really believe you’re an adult yet.

Are you feelin’ lucky,punk? Make my day!

I’m embarrassed for you. Bet it took you all day to find “supercilious” in your JUNIOR dictionary.

Stop lowering the tone of one of the better blogs and piss off back to your own Jackanory site!

Never mind “supercilious” angri can’t even spell “regurgitate”!

These professional disinformationists are so amateur!

Reminds me of those cretins like Cathouse Larry,technidick et al they deployed to defend the official 911 story.

The establishment must be tottering on its last legs to imagine the likes of angri-airhead and Cathouse Larry can make their case!

Just checked out angri’s blog.

Jeez,what a load of horse-crap! The guy is special needs,I reckon.

Dat angri fren a Larry bore me shitless!

Since me anna Massa tungstein got togeder wid Larry’s lady I lerned a lot bout der world.

I spendin’ mitey long time on der net dees dayz cozza I biginnin’ realize all da Goddam info anybody needs issa out dare iffa dey need it.

Dissa angri anna Larry jussa hangin’ roun a stop us findin’ truth wos really happnin’ roun der worl’.

Ingota tell ya iffa I wassa igorant assa dis angri guy I’d jussa shutta uppa my mowth cossa dares few lessa peeple less gon’ wase dare live wenna dey finly discover wossa really goin’ down out dare!

The “angri-airhead” is a product of the dumbed-down state education system.

Phrases like false-flag terror,revolution,war,international finance will have no meaning for vacuous articles like angri whatsoever.

The guy has no capacity for abstract thinking.If you mentioned the Churchs waning influence in our secular world he would think you were talking about some specific church down his road.He would have no conception of the general idea of the chuch as religion or as a more general reference to man’s spiritual life.

Numbskulls like this have been getting “A” levels and degrees in recent decades as part of the Tory/NuLabour grade inflation scam.So they turn up on blogs like this with outrageous delusions about their intellectual abilities.

Sad but true,angrisoba and Larry can actually delude themselves into thinking they are at the races in the reasoning sweep-stakes.

(LOL!)

We beg to differ!

Maybe angri’ll get Cathouse Larry to bail him out.

No sir!

Ol’ Larry still bit tied down now workin’ for Massa Silverstein on sum big time false-flag dey plannin’ gon’ save der Fed.

Dey gon pull one real soon an’ make it look lak dem Pershuns done it.

Mite be down in Cape Town doorin’ der World Series dey sayin’.

Massa Silverstein sayin’ dat afemath a 911 wearin’ mite thin now an peeple gwine back dat ol’Vietnam Sindrome ware dey loosa der will to fite for anyting an’mo’.

Massa Silver sayin’ Massa O’Bama need one big ol’ war keep him upp in dem polls an’ issa comin’ real soon!

Larry anna Mas Silver workin’ on it rite now yawl!