I fear you might have just fed the trolls.

Tenuous I know but also not wanted

The iPhone app from the home office

(quote)

One mystery remains: the Home Office refused to reveal spending, citing entirely invented security concerns. The revelation that Al-Qaeda may be forcing up the price of government mobile software work will strike real fear into the UK population. Either that or your phone already contains a tracking app (the Blunkett?) which is recording your every move.

(/quote)

Apologies for off topic!

Ah, don’t fear the trolls, anonmymous poster at 9:44am! Food or no food, the truth will out in spite of all the trollery in the world. The trolls know who they are, and they know that everyone else knows who they are. But what of ogres?

I challenged quite a lot of this stuff on the ‘American and Israeli Religious Nutters’ thread, but the perps really did not want to engage in conversation – lots of shouting, lots of abuse. Perhaps rather than talking people down off the ceiling as was my intention, I have been, in fact, feeding the trolls myself?

Most likely will return under another disguise.Maybe they are angry.

Ishmael,

Not angry, fascist.

Re Jon

Engaging people on the internet? Wow there is a thought

I think the nature of anonymous posting takes people to another level which face to face they would never reach. I was the web admin for a group which wanted to boycott Israeli universities (see Mona Baker). Whenever I got death threats I told people my address and guess what? Never got a visit.

Paul

“I challenged quite a lot of this stuff on the ‘American and Israeli Religious Nutters’ thread, but the perps really did not want to engage in conversation – lots of shouting, lots of abuse.”

Yes. Whether they were all the same or not (dreoilin’s comment on their punctuation was well-spotted), they were collaborating to make a set of points, and showing no willingness to engage with anyone saying anything else, just spraying contempt for anyone who failed to adhere to their whatever-it-was. I have no comment on the nature of the agenda because I always found their tone of voice to be so offputting that I never read further. It’s a relief to see the back of them, to be honest.

Though I’m sure there’ll be more. I notice that the anonymous poster of the long (and ostensibly irrelevant) revisionist cut&paste just above has found a way to dodge the restriction on posting links.

“Not angry, fascist”.

Possibly unfair. I suspect the Apostate/Steelback/Freeborn entity is a disillusioned Marxist for whom the discovery that the Russian Revolution was funded by Rothschild/Rockefeller banking interests was a defining and embittering realisation.

Well I don’t have specialist knowledge of chemistry and the colour walls go after exposure to poison gas, so I guess I will have to admit you are right, the holocaust never happened!

On the other hand, I have read Primo Levi’s accounts of what occurred in Auswitz, I have visited several of the Polish death camps myself and I know what happened.

Underneath the Reichstag, allied intelligence obtained thousands of documents detailing horrific experiments conducted on those in captivity. Those documents will never be released. The Nazi’s were not gentlemen.

“Those documents will never be released”.

In which case we’ll never know what’s in them.

Re Ishmael

Surely the results from Dachau were released?

The cyanide poisoning claim has been answered again and again.

But the conspiracy-tards will keep bringing it up again and again.

Should be a lesson to those who believe that the Holocaust happened, but believe that 911 was an inside job. The same crap gets recycled, even after being definitively answered.

Tomorrow is the anniversary of the London bombings. Lies, confusion, failings and evidence kept secret even within the walls of MI5. WE MUST DEMAND A PUBLIC INQUIRY – to reveal the truth that has been kept from the British public for too long.

“You need to look into the dark corners of the “war on terror” Robin Cook MP

Richard Norton-Taylor guardian.co.uk, Friday 21 May 2010

“MI5 and police failures under spotlight in London bomb inquestsAllegations of flawed intelligence before 7/7 suicide attacks to be investigated by coroner without jury.

52 people died when terrorists blew up a bus and three tube trains on 7 July 2005 Photograph: Peter Macdiarmid/PA

Inquests into the deaths of 52 people in the 7 July London suicide bombings will investigate alleged failings of MI5 and the police before the attacks, a coroner decided today in a ruling that received a mixed response from relatives.

Lady Justice Hallett said the inquests, due to start in October, would include the “alleged intelligence failings and the immediate aftermath of the bombings” and would be heard without a jury. Survivors would have a limited role but the inquests into the deaths of the four bombers would not be held at the same time.”

Craig,

I support your decision. As an aside, let me add that I suspect that many of the most strident anti-semites and HD are in fact Hasbara boys trying to deligitimize any critizism of Israel.

B

Joe, nope, you’re paranoid and they’re Jew haters like most of the people at this blog. They just take it one slightly extra step.

For someone so against evidence obtained by torture its odd that you unquestioningly believe a story based on evidence obtained via torture.

Larry from St Louis very rarely made any criticism of Apostate under his various names; others did. Larry gives no support to Craig or others for their disapproval of Apostate. I find myself in agreement with many commenters on this blog, but never with Larry. I do not hate Jews, and I wouldn’t visit this site if I found widespread hatred of Jews here.

Larry is a hypocrite and a liar.

Oh, I think I’ve had some harsh words for Apostate. To be sure – he’s a deranged disgusting asshole. Hope that works.

But Clark, surely you have some sympathy with the claim that the Jews did 911. And doesn’t that qualify you as a Jew hater?

Yawn.

But Larry, surely you have some sympathy with the claim that the Muslims did 911. And doesn’t that qualify you as an Islamophobe?

I am also not of the view that there is widespread anti-semitism here; I think that should be obvious to any reasonably-minded person. But it is probably correct to say that the balance of sympathy is with the Palestinians – which needless to say is not the same thing at all.

Gut gemacht, mein herr.

I am also not of the view that there is widespread anti-semitism here; I think that should be obvious to any reasonably-minded person. But it is probably correct to say that the balance of sympathy is with the Palestinians – which needless to say is not the same thing at all.

The interesting trick is to find sympathy for both, wherever appropriate.

You delete comments you don’t like? Really? Why?

You’re absolutely right Craig. Holocaust denial and anti-semitism are not tolerable, any more than any other kind of extreme racism or bigotry.

Neil – He allows the vast majority of comments he dislikes and disagrees . It’s extremely rare for him to delete comments and they have to be very extreme before he does it.

Larry, I do not think so. Moreover, I suspect this ain’t news for you.

Craig, you are quite right to shut down holocaust deniers. To my mind holocaust denial is not only wrong and historically inaccurate; it is also cruel to the survivors and the relatives of the dead. Despite this, anti-Semitism and holocaust denial, are still around today. Six million people murdered in cold blood ?” and some idiots would seek to rewrite this recent history.

To my surprise, even with my own issue, I see some evidence of a latent anti-Semitism still today. As you know my issue (defamation, threats, harassment by MI5/6 on behalf of high establishment interests) has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with Jews or Jewish matters, or any religious or ethnic group for that matter; Yet I get emails from people (not Muslims) who seek to blame Jews for the evil that my wife and I have been subjected to and that I write about. Nobody ever blames Muslims, or Protestants, or Catholics, or Hindus ?” just Jews.

But nowhere on this site are holocaust denial lies and anti-Semitic issues stirred up more than by MI6′s agent provocateur ?” the Larry the liar team ?” presumably in a nasty tactic to divert attention and shut down debate on the real issues. It reminds me a little of the CSIS Agent Provocateur, Grant Bristow, who stirred up neo-Nazism in Canada all these years ago. Be careful that evil Anti-Semites are not used as an excuse to stifle debate.

Roderick,

You’re really going to anger people here by claiming that I’m MI6. They think I’m IDF or CIA.

Heh btw, did you figure out the best piece of evidence that you’re being followed by any intelligence service? Again, your crazy letters to the media or the government really don’t constitute evidence for this purpose.

The problem with our world is that an oligarchical elite who control the creation of money and, through that mechanism, our money system have taken almost total power over our political system, our media, the Corporate world and, indeed, our very minds. Society is brainwashed into a kind of helpless, passive subservience to whoever is doling out orders from the top.

Amongst that elite Jews are a minority but, looking around at the actors on stage in the US political, corporate and media arena particularly, they do appear to have become a dominant faction. Our failure to restrain the activities of Israel raise the question, which part of our alliance is the dog and which the tail. Going by the observable facts, it is a fair statement to claim we live in a Zionist country.

The ‘holocaust’ has, understandably, manufactured a ferocious social cohesion amongst the Jewish people who have very largely supported the Zionist cause (and all Israel’s actions against its neighbours) over the last decades.

I believe that our oligarchical elite are our real enemy. Not Muslims, Not iraqis, not Iranians, not the BNP…..but our own lying manipulative elite who are determined to subjugate the entire earth under a one- world government controlled by them.

Has it ever occurred to ordinary Jews that their situation is the very same as ours? That their elite is acting against their best interests?

……that their own elite intend to betray them too?

That they are being used as a tool to divide and conquer, to create the great war that will bring about such desperation on such a scale that we will willingly accept any plausible nightmare the monied elite place before us in its aftermath?

I believe that World War Three began a few days ago when Iran realised that the USA was not only imposing crippling oil sanctions against it, but allies of the USA were doing the same making it impossible for Iran to tranfer goods and continue normal trading and movement of people with its neighbours.

This will cripple Iran to the point of collapse.

This is exactly the same policy that the USA implemented against Japan before Japan’s attack on Pearl Harbour. Japan was squeezed into a tight corner. America wanted the attack. Its biggest and best ships were not sitting ducks at Pearl Harbour. They were placed safely out of harm’s way. The USA wanted war then and they clearly want it now.

America has Iran surrounded by its highly armed bases, missiles, nukes etc. It recently sent an armada to the Persian Gulf to intimidate Iran from yet another direction.

As Iran’s economy falters will it wait to fall or attack while it still has the strength. If it does not attack will CIA/Mossad choreograph another false-flag attack to justify an attack on Iran?

What is very clear is that the decision to go to war has been made.

Iran is no match for the USA nor, of course, combined western forces. It is no pushover either. It is not Iraq. Iran can cause us all great problems simply by shutting down the straits of Hormuz and cuttingg off 1/5th of the world’s oil supply.

To the Iranians the USA and Israel (and probably ourselves) are one entity.

Israel is a very small place.

Are Jews in Israel being set up to be massacred in huge numbers again?

Is it not likely that Jews, having been used, will be betrayed like the rest of us?

just to say that actually Larry had a pretty prime role, at the start of this year, in challenging Apostate. Harry’s Place have banned him too, by the way.

What’s happened to Larry since, I have no idea. Agree his postings are now as silly and disruptive as it gets. He must know too well that this board is not anti-semitic, for example. I can sort of understand a blind, inculcated, obedience to the Israeli regime, perhaps stemming from the fear that Israel itself may be destroyed in this god awful process, but the paucity of arguments in support of its behaviour, and the need to resort to childish abuse instead, would worry me, if I were him/them.

I have no blind inculcated obedience to the Israeli regime.

@Richard, re: sympathy for the Israelis – yes, indeed.

@Roderick – I advise not responding to Larry. He may be happy to waste his own time by posing questions that are intended to be unhelpful, but the only effect of replying is that your time is wasted. Perhaps that is the idea!

Technicolour,

which threads are you referring to? I’d like to look back and check them. As I remember, Larry did not engage with Apostate’s arguments, but merely took the opportunity to shout “Anti-semitism! If it isn’t deleted now, it proves that you’re all anti-semites!”

Right, Clark, because at that time Murray was deleting references to his 911 nutters (like you), while not deleting the Holocaust denier verbiage.

Mmm. Clark, I’d trust your judgement, actually. Just got lost in reading old threads but didn’t find the particular one I was thinking of.

Still ‘Apostate’ et al certainly hated Larry. And he may have mainly shouted ‘anti-semitism’ at them, but he was absolutely right. If life wasn’t too short, I would wonder why he continues to do it when it’s so obviously wrong.

There is no way this latest larry is the same as the old one anyway. Million pounds. (Honk Kong Phooey)

How come people have just starting to use grave accents ‘ as apostrophies and quotes. They’re double spaced so it looks like this ‘ ere in proportional. (sub-optimal typography)

@Anon poster, be a sport and choose a nick – i beseech thee.

Technicolour,

theatrics, I’d say, rather than hatred. Extremists use each other, it is simply a ploy; criticise the the opposite extreme, and attempt to tar the moderates with the same brush. See above; apparently, I’m a “911 nutter”. No reference given, of course.

“@Anon poster, be a sport and choose a nick – i beseech thee.”

I second this – it’s hard to hold a coherent conversation with someone when you don’t even know which comments are theirs.

I tend not to even try.

Clark, yes, saw that after I posted. Stupid stuff.

Good way of looking at it, theatrics, rather than hatred, thanks.

Sandcrab,

seconded; I do wish people would pick a name to sign their comments.

I didn’t know that those were grave accents. I used to mistakenly use them instead of the single quote. It got used twice on this thread by being repeated in a copy – and – paste.

Clark,

I don’t think you quite realise what silliness you previously expressed on this blog.

heh, Only curious as i just started noticing them ”””””

I hope the steelborn pack revise their prejudices and get positive in time.

The new larry i dont care about, he is just a generic troll. The old one was fascinatingly invidious.

Yes, indeed, both the actual anti-Semites who waste a lot of other people’s time and those who, at every opportunity, accuse everyone else except fellow-trolls of being an anti-Semite and/or lunatic are attempting to discredit the boards of a site and any comments/ commentators critical of imperial power. The very fact that time is spent attacking certain people illustrates the systemic viciousness of their agenda. I have no time for these people, ‘Larry’(whatever incarnation is extant at a particular time), ‘Barker’, et al.

Theatrics, yes. And arrogance and a certain distillation of imperial hubris. Also vitriol, directed at people whom they want off this board. A pity some left, possibly partly as a result. Never any acknowledgement of the validity of others’ positions or existence – especially if those others are not white – and all of this leads one to the unmistakable underlying stench of visceral racism.

I talk with imperialists all the time, I have no difficulty with that. Officers, diplomats, whatever. Some are very interesting people, even though they might have radically different world-views from me.

But there are imperialists, and then there are imperialists.

“accuse everyone else except fellow-trolls of being an anti-Semite”

Yes, the people who deny the Holocaust are anti-Semitic. You should get that right.

There’s some genuinely sick individuals in this comments section, and you treat them as pals, Suhayl.

I don’t have much respect for Craig Murray, but at least he has the decency to call them out for their indecency.

You seem to lack that capacity.

No one here has ever called anyone anti-Semitic without it being deserved.

[Paul Johnston]

I have no idea. They exist, are very detailed. I would never say that I knew the guard who watched over Rudolf Hess, in Spandau, who claimed that several strange people visited Hess before his death. He thought SAS. If I did it is likely I would be thrown off.

“Yes, the people who deny the Holocaust are anti-Semitic. You should get that right.”

Did I ever argue against that, anywhere, ever? No. So why are you telling me to “get that right”.

“There’s some genuinely sick individuals in this comments section, and you treat them as pals, Suhayl.”

Like who, specifically? Clark, Richard, technicolour, sandcrab, Nextus, Mark Golding, Polo, Paul Johnston, Duncan McFarlane, Abe Rene, Ruth, Jon, Jives, Vronsky, Angrysoba? They all seem pretty well to me. One might disagree with one, or more, of them on this or that, or even on their entire world-view. But “sick”? No, I don’t think so. So, to whom exactly are you referring? You know, I’ve had as many arguments with apostate et al as anyone else. At one point, the character known as ‘anarchore’ (apostate by yet another name?) told me on this website that I was wearing “a Rothschildian star” (whatever the… that is)!

“I don’t have much respect for Craig Murray, but at least he has the decency to call them out for their indecency.”

Why don’t you respect Craig Murray? You deign to post lots of comments on his website. Angrysoba – hardly someone with whom I or many of the commentators on this blog would tend naturally yo agree on many things, though one can have a civilised conversation with him – has told you already that Craig’s human rights stance is unimpeachable and criticised you for attempting to attack it.

“You seem to lack that capacity.”

Yes, you like to say this, don’t you.

“No one here has ever called anyone anti-Semitic without it being deserved.”

Perhaps not, but you do attempt to link the terrorist attacks on the USA of 2001 with almost everything else on this website, even when there is no link whatsoever. So what’s that about? Are you not fond of lumping those who might have doubts about official narratives on this or that matter with anti-Semites? There certainly are anti-Semitic narratives about relating to those attacks, and I have always condemned such stupid narratives. I repeatedly point out that Islamist terrorists do exist – look at Pakistan – and delineate the histories thereof.

Now, clearly, I attack fundamentalists of all hues, including anti-Semites, I constantly attempt to demonstrate the complexity of the world and of human society, including that inherent in the USA, yet you continue to attack me. Why is that?

You see, there’s never really been any true engagement on your part, no attempt to try to understand where the other person might be coming from. No, there are just short, snappy condemnations and assertions of linkage with crackpot theories and anti-Semitic rants. That’s doesn’t hold any water with anyone.

Huzzah! (icon shaking Suhayl warmly by the hand)

Thank you, technicolour, thank you (icon takes a bow).

Larry the lamb is a CIA moron who got upset and threw his toys out of his pram. He thinks he is smart, when he is really a bona fide muppet, and laughs at all of you. Even 10 year olds have figured out 9/11 was a false flag attack. For God’s sake, Andreas Von Bulow – ex-German Secretary Of Defence complete with a security service background – even went on TV and said it was a false flag attack! Like someone of his stature with any reservations whatsoever would do that?

As for ‘The Holocaust’, why don’t you all define it before using the term ‘Holocaust Denial’? Everyone has been subjected to mass brainwashing. What happened has been exaggerated and used as political capital ever since. That’s a sick slur on those that did lose their lives, whether Jewish or not. The power of the ‘Holocaust Industry’ is greatly derived from indoctrination in primary/secondary schools. The gruesome images of emaciated bodies being bulldozed in a pit are ingrained on young minds and not forgotten. It has been turned into a puerile black versus white debate of did happen/didn’t happen. That is exactly what they want of course. Anyone that questions the offical narrative is immediately branded with a kneejerk ‘denier’ reaction. Ha ha ha. I think it’s sick for any human being on this planet to feel even slightly intimidated, let alone deported and murdered. Jews, amongst others, were intimidated and sent to camps. Exactly how many died and by what means is not faithfully covered in the official narrative I don’t think. A lot of time has passed and ‘The Holocaust Industry’ is losing it’s power. Who knows what fresh crap the Zionists have lined up for planet earth…

Craig, the torture inquiry will go nowhere really. The genie is out of the bottle. When that happens, they powers that be decide to move in and take over the issue. They manage it and apply the principal of damage limtitation. It’s a small victory in a war against tyranny, but nothing will change in the grand scheme of things. The sad fact is that we don’t live in a genuine democracy, not by a long shot. Well done though, as we do need these small victories. I hope you are in good health and happy Craig. Peace.

I do not deny the Holocaust, but I know a little about the ‘stuff’ found underneath the Reichstag and in Concentration camps.

mengeles despicable research on humans, just as Werner von Brauns expertise on rockets was used to build up NASA, was used by researchers all over the world, some on it basic genetics, all of it a horrific undertaking.

The scientific value of experimenting on humans and the datas that was used by the victors after the war, has never come fully to light.

I hope it will, because the silent complicity takes the shine of morality as it is preached by some. It also puts the torture inquiery into a different light.

@somebody – the Abercrombie posts are highly likely to be a spambot – they are just repeating old posts in order to look like non-spam posts, and are posted to benefit from the search-engine link ranking. The site would benefit from an anti-spam system, such as Akismet.

“The site would benefit from an anti-spam system, such as Akismet.”

Certainly. Though, given the absence of any such, I’m suprised how little spam there is. Comments from other blogs had given me the impression of complete inundation (anybody doing unfiltered smtp email ? How much junk do you see ? Lots and lots …)

What a load of totalitarian hysterical bollocks!

The comments deleted by Ubersturmfuhrer Murray made reference simply to the fact that the “Jewish Holocaust” received disproportionate coverage and paled into insignificance beside far better documented historical events like the Jewish Donmeh-perpetrated genocide against the Armenians and Jewish participation in the Russian Revolution and genocidal Bolshevik gulag that followed in its wake.

Mr Murray has taken it upon himself to delete links that provide evidence of Jewish participation in both the latter “Holocausts”.

Mr Murray has I believe been driven to very publicly install the totalitarian doctrine of Holocaust fundamentalism which has no basis whatever in law by his wish to curry favour with prevailing interests in the entertainment industry who might sponsor his latest media project.

The link to Christopher John Bjerknes’

jewishracism.com was deleted because Murray wants you to believe that the phenomenon of Jewish racism cannot exist. He wants you to think that Jews are incapable of genocide when both history and the present provide evidence in abundance that the case is utterly unsustainable.

The primary goal of the Donmeh Jews who overthrew the Sultan in 1909 was to establish an apartheid Jewish state in Palestine. They also sought to instigate a world war that would slaughter entire Christian populations like the Armenians in Turkey and the Balkans.

This has all been extensively documented in Bjerknes’ book available online:The Jewish Genocide of the Christian Armenians.

http://jewishracism.com/Jewish_Genocide_Enlarged.pdf

The Zionist plan to instigate genocidal wars between Christians and Muslims and internecine warfare within both faiths owes much of its longevity to the ignorance of those like Mr Murray who pretend they can ignore history.

While those who question the official “Jewish Holocaust” story are deleted those who deny proven role of Zionists in the Armenian genocide, the Ukranian famine and the Soviet gulag are denying a reality which has taken and is still responsible for far more deaths worldwide.

To pretend otherwise is either sheer folly or abject careerism or in Mr Murray’s case probably both!

You wiped them out Freeborn!

Murray, Cathouse, Clark, Techniprick, the lot!

These guys hate the Truth and all Her works!

The cat’s in Ghana, huh ?

If the Obersturmfuhrer has incontestable documentary evidence that the official Jewish Holocaust story is true why does he not publish it here?

Revisionists have extensive documents to support their claims;where is the evidence to support Murray’s insistence on our fundamentalist adherence to the official claims about 6m deaths?

It doesn’t exist.

That’s why they have to invent, ring-fence and sanctify the “truth” of an historical event that would be patently unsustainable in the face of proper historical enquiry.

Where’s your evidence Mr Murray?

Are there any other historical events about which you would like to ban free enquiry and debate?

I still haven’t finished reading Hannah Arendt’s Origins of Totalitarianism. I often wonder why it’s taken me so long.

Though Arendt’s account is cited as the definitive one, I think, were she alive today she would find that totalitarianism had not gone away. It’s still ubiquitous today in incipient form on blogs like this.

Arendt found that the origins of totalitarianism exist in in the minds of those whose unquestioningly accept official versions of reality.

Such minds become attached irrevocably to state falsehoods when they perceive the truth as a threat to the comfortable complacencies about the world with which they have grown up.

For people possessed of such a restricted form of consciousness when the truth becomes uncomfortable or impedes their career advancement they will abandon it and condemn those who, notwithstanding any insult or stigma, steadfastly pursue it.

Stop insulting people’s intelligence,Mr Murray.

We come here to get away from state propaganda not to applaud its “celebrity” (LOL) endorsement!

Shouldn’t this thread be called:

TRUTH NOT WANTED HERE!

Hey the Obersturmfuhrer’s been appointed official state censor for the Ghanaian government. Ergo he’s not here!

Now all you Hasbara shills:Cathouse, angrisoba, clark, technicolor et al out there know you’ve lost on every other blog and you’re sure not about to reverse the trend here. Especially not now the Obersturmfuhrer’s in Accra.

As for the dumb dingbats who are Hasbara fellow-travellers like robinson et al isn’t it about time you actually did some reading?

The level of debate has dipped significantly in recent weeks. That’s from appallingly superficial adolescent PC posturing and Murray brown-nosing to the currently horrendously supine “we’re not Holocaust-deniers” refrain mode in which you’re all pathetically trapped now.

Evidently you airheads had a bit of a witch-hunt against “Holocaust-deniers” before the Obersturmfuhrer got on the plane.

The only real “Holocaust-deniers” are those who deny that Jews were responsible for the deaths of millions of Christians in the Ottoman Empire and in Bolshevik Russia long before the Holocaust you been trained to wet your pants about even supposedly started.

Come on make your case-or sorry their (Zionist) case,why don’t you?

Waiting for Craig to bail you out again?

T’ain’t gonna happen this side of Accra,guys!

Odd, I’ve heard it said in various gossipy circles that actually the past hundred years has been a ‘Christian’ plot to make Jews and Muslims, traditionally pals, fight each other. I guss that thesis doesn’t include Edard siad, a Christian, or Georg Habash, late lader of one of the Palestinian factions, etc., etc., etc.

But Jimmy Giro, over on the other thread, sees it all as a feminist-ZanuPF-socialist-harriet-harmanite-damn-bloomin-wimmin-mothers-sisters-aunties’ plot. I feel like bruning my bra – except I don’t have one (honest!).

And of course, the people who follow Sarah Palin et al see it all as a Muslim plot to overthrow their “way of life” (what, hunting bears in Alaska, listening to Merle Haggard and waitress-winking at TV screens?).

At the risk of being called a dingbat UnderSturmfuehrerobermarshallheintzbakedbeanswhatsitsonofagun, history and power are complex and cannot be distilled into a simple paradigm. This does not deny that plots occur – they do – or that certain people/ organisations do not work together to maintain/ extend their power, of course they do. But the whole of history does not dance to a single tune. It’s a medley! A cacophony! The trick is to try and tease out the vrious melodies.

Miaow.

Edward Said, I meant! And George Habash.

“Edward Said, I meant! And George Habash.”

‘heintz’ ?

Now this is interesting. Very interesting. I don’t know to make of it.

Being ‘banned’ appears to have had a very significant and sobering effect on the Apostate/Steelback/Freeborn/tungsten entity: it has started inserting spaces after full-stops and commas.

Did it think no-one would notice?

Dingbat!

LOL!!

We’re getting quite a collection, aren’t we?

It’s Zionists. No, darnit, let’s not mince our words: it’s all Jews. Sorry, got that wrong – it’s women. All the shrieking harpies and harridans, evil plots, parvenues and false-witnesses. No, it’s the Muslims. Yes, and I’ll refer to them as Moslems instead, it looks more disapproving! Actually scratch that, it’s One World Government and the NWO. Lizards, too. Dang it, it’s [changes mind, cools off, and smokes a joint].

Heinz – not Heintz! – was an originally German, but naturalised English, singer who was in the Tornados and later had a hit in the 1960s on which Richie Blackmore played guitar. ‘Just Like Eddie’, I think it was called, a tribute to Duane Eddy. What it had to do with beans-means… I have no idea.

Is this the cacophony theory of history,Mr Saadi?

The cock-up theory is the one to which we’re all supposed to subscribe isn’t it?

Now it’s the equally fallacious and obfuscatory cacophonous theory of history promulgated heretically by you in defiance of the Obersturmfuhrer’s diktat that’s de rigeur is it?

How faddish the intellectually stifling PC world you inhabit has become-I mean without you guys having even noticed.

Mind you since two major Holocausts also appeared to have disappeared down your Frankfurt-sponsored plughole of historical amnesia what’s a PC fad here or there going to matter to objectivity

in history?

On the issue of Jewish-perpetrated Holocausts documented by writers such as Bjerknes you evidently have nothing to say.

I wonder why?

Like the primary evidence cited by Bjerknes for the Donmeh genocide against the Armenians that for the Bolshevik Jews’ genocidal cultural war against their perceived enemies in the Russian Orthodox Church and intelligentsia is overwhelming.

Your late night conversations with Zionist morons like Larry have clearly addled your capacity for real historical enquiry!

I think the eloquent interjections of ‘dingbat’ and ‘LOL’ will, in time, become the new QED. I personally find it quite persuasive, and am flummoxed for a response if it is deployed.

“Just like Eddie”, I’d managed to repress that memory. What it meanz … hot air ?

Jon

You claim a first in computer science as evidence of your capacity for intellectual debate don’t you?

You also claim to write better than Apostate (LOL)!

In fact the additions to knowledge you have provided on this blog are conspicuous by their absence. And the piffle above is no exception.

As someone said before-you’re not at the races,pal!

Ooh, Marx !

@Freeborn, err.. no, I didn’t. As you know, one of your personalities insisted I didn’t have any qualifications, so I disproved the assertion. Strangely, according to you, qualifications then became old hat, and evidence for Zionist controlled thinking… or some such.

I’d ask you what academic or non-academic qualifications you have, but I would expect to have my question ignored. You mock, insult and refuse to debate to such an extent that it’s almost like… you want to discredit moderate anti-Zionism. But perish the thought!

Exactly, Richard, that must’ve been the subtext, I think, though it difficult to know.

Yeah, the cacophonous, cornucopic theory, that’s it! What I mean is there are lots of different narratives and struggles for power and hegemony occurring, all the time. It’s not one big thing. No, I don’t buy the cock-up theory – though of course cock-ups do happen – but my sole point in this is that to try and squeeze all dynamics and narratives into a single, over-arching narrative, as one might try to do in a fiction, say, is just not reflective of reality.

This is not to let the Uber-Zionists (or corporate capitalists, or arms dealers or organised criminals or Sarah Palin) off the hook, far from it. It is to attempt to place them in their place and analyse how they work and to do it in a rational, rather than a hysterical, manner, as an historical phenomenon rather than as a gargantuan, almost superhuman power running back into the antediluvian mud of the Jurassic Era that cannot possibly be undone, a kind of demonic force from the belly of Hell. If we start to think that way, then actually, they’ve won because they have colonised our minds so that we have deified them.

For all the Hasbarah shills like Larry, angrisoba, clark kent et al out there-you better believe the anti-Zionist team are back and we ain’t going away either.

Not till the Lieberman internet shut-down arrives anyway;or the Zionists get their Holocaust fundamentalist law.

The a-z team will be here to expose the the manifold Zionist crimes against humanity it’s your job to cover up.

And while Obersturmfuhrer Murray is out of town you’ve got no-one to protect you have you?

Feeling lucky punks?

Jon

It has to be said that your contribution above is predictably excruciating yet again.

Are you just too thick to get your head around the idea that flaunting academic qualifications before strangers is just not done. It’s arrogant and rude and in your case a computer degree is completely irrelevant anyway.

As for your ridiculous point re-”moderate anti-Zionism” being brought into disrepute-grow up for Christ sake!

What the Bejeez do you imagine “moderate anti-Zionism is?

Can one be a moderate anti-Nazi?

No Zionism and Nazism are pernicious enslaving doctrines responsible for three Holocausts at least.

Neither doctrine is one anyone should be moderate about-they are both evil.

Just like you’re not very bright!

Freeborn: I see your campaign against not only CM but a lot of the regular contributors here continues. You make a particular point of going after Jon, claiming he’s “not very bright.” Hmm. That would be by comparison with yourself, and your “a-z” team, I take it?

Then help me out, if you’d be so kind. What exactly do you believe you’re achieving here, with this sort of message and tone? Do you think this manner of persuasion is likely to win anyone over, or take the cause and belief systems you favour more seriously? Any success here, with the effort thus far expended?

Of course, there’s the old “I’m exposing the hypocrisy / showing the truth” etc. etc. arguments, but we all know (or should do) that it’s never the joke that’s funny, it’s the way that one tells them.

If you want anyone to be persuaded, and persuasion is generally an incremental process, why deliberately set about putting oneself in opposition to that person, and make that person far less receptive to your message? Just the tone employed will give a casual reader the notion, “Whatever they’re for, I’m against it”, and reinforce every prejudice that a Zionist (in this example) would want one to have about people like yourself. Furthermore, you are likely to get anyone to widen the distance between their own stance and the one you claim to promote, and make yourselves very uncomfortable company in which to be seen.

You and your mates do this so consistently and with such effect, I do find myself wondering which side you are genuinely supporting!

glenn

You sound like a cross between an admonishing headmaster and Jane Austen!

Helping adolescent pals who can’t fight their own corner is so noble of you!

Look instead of turning this thread into some Boys Own Bonding Club why don’t you try and add something insightful to the argument?

It’s frightfully boring when all you do is try to sound so reasonable and smug.

It’s plain intellectual posturing of the the worst kind.

Freeborn is absolutely right about moderation about destructive ideas like Zionism being absurd and counter-productive.

He like the other a-z team contributors here has cited evidence to support his ideas. The evidence may be deleted on this blog but it’s all over the fantastic learning resource we call the internet in case you hadn’t noticed.

What exactly have you done apart from try to bail out a computer engineer with nothing worthwhile to say.

Grow up, dingbat!

“Freeborn is absolutely right” – ah, you might be adept at using different psuedonyms, whatever-your-name-is, and perhaps you even use different proxies too. But all of your obnoxious split-personalities are all the one angry you, and strangely enough each of your monikers agree with others. To your credit, you’ve stopped using the comma without the following space, but your aggressiveness, your overuse of the exclamation mark, your posting times and your lack of paragraphing still give you away as one and the same.

As you know, I wasn’t “flaunting” my academic credentials at all: you asked me what academic credentials I had.

I googled you last week, and it was telling to see that, on an openly racist anti-Jewish blog, on a topic called “Ugly Jews”, you posted in full agreement under your “Steelback” alter-ego. You are a deeply racist, unpleasant and anti-social individual, and I hope in time you can sort that out.

I ask “freeborn” a question, “Apostate” answers… well, I guess you’re all interchangeable enough so one need not worry about such things.

So let’s see if I’ve got this straight – you denounce Jon for being “not very bright”, then denounce me for “intellectual posturing”, while calling me a “dingbat” for trying to sound “reasonable”. That’s a pretty fine line of intellectualism that you demand of your correspondents!

In all your self congratulation, adoration of your other halves, and free application of ad hominems, perhaps you found yourself with insufficient time for anything else – not one single word was spent actually addressing the point I put to you.

Why you intellectual pygmies are allowed to take yourselves seriously I cannot begin to fathom.

I guess it comes with the PC territory you inhabit.

In your PC World it’s enough to ascend the moral high-ground and denounce all who disagree with you as anti-semite or some such term of opprobrium (read psychological weapon from the Zionist arsenal).

Evidently to even speculate on the physical features of different peoples is taboo in Jon’s tiny constricted

world.

Far be it for me to suggest that Bette Midler,Streisand of Amy Whitehouse are not the prettiest females around. No we can’t say such things anymore!

Funny how jewcy.com ran a similar article last week re-ugly Jews. FYI jewcy.com is a Jewish magazine/blog.

Funny how many of the most virulently anti-semitic mags in the 1920s in Germany were actually run by Jews.

The facts are always unwanted when they’re uncomfortable.

Grow up you pair of dingbats!

Doesn’t matter how many times you say it, Apostate, it doesn’t make it true – particularly when you failed to respond with even a sentence to the point I put to you.

Needless to say, I’ve never called anyone an anti-semite for disagreeing with me, and doubt that Jon did either. You made that up. Why have you got to make stuff up, isn’t fact and the truth good enough?

I used to play a boardgame called Dingbats – it was great fun. If anyone here wants to chill out, it’s recommended.

Just had a look at Jewcy, seen it before. The one article I could find about a ‘Jewish look’ did use the word ‘ugly’, but it was (a) written by a Jewish woman, and (b) triggered much discussion on the merits or otherwise of looking Jewish. So, not racist or self-hating – perhaps self-deprecating? Not at all the same as the intense racist hatred on the website I found.

Meanwhile whilst I am disappointed to find Natalie Portman endorsing organised religion of any flavour, she’s still gorgeous. Anyone here seen the movie Garden State? Aside from the lovely Natalie, the soundtrack is awesome, and features The Shins heavily.

My name is NOT Neil Barker, my name is Neil Murray. I am being forged here, so please be very, very careful. Allegations of rape will lead to this site being shut down.

This is not a threat – it’s a gentle warning.

So whoever this site belongs to, you’d better delete and apologize quickly.

I will repost this on all comments that affect me.