On Being Hurt

by craig on August 27, 2011 10:22 am in Uncategorized

I am aware that this post will cause some to laugh at me. I am aware that it may make me look pompous and self-seeking, and that my small hurts are nothing compared to what is happening to people in Libya. I am also aware it is impolitic to expose vulnerability when you are involved in internet debate.

What prompts me to write about a longstanding disappointment is this phrase from Chris Floyd yesterday:

Thus Craig Murray was not jumped in an alleyway, or killed in an obscure and ambiguous “accident” of some sort, as might have happened in imperiums of old. He was simply shunted to the sidelines and rendered “unserious” by official disapproval.

Which played on feelings that had been re-awakened by a post on Subrosa a couple of weeks ago, on whether Scotland should have its own honours system.

I could never be accused of craving honours. I have turned down three, the highest of which was Commander of the Royal Victorian Order. When I refused that one, I was given instead by the queen a letter rack hand made by Viscount Linley – and made extremely well. I donated it last month to the auction to meet Julian Assange’s legal fees, and it raised £500 (there is supposed to be a second part to this auction where the items now go on ebay to see if there are higher online bidders. That hasn’t happened yet because of Paypal’s blocking of Wikileaks).

I turned down British honours because it would be hypocritical to accept them for two reasons: I believe in Scottish independence, and I don’t believe in the monarchy. I was actually asked my reason by the queen in Warsaw, and I admit I stressed the Scottish nationalist bit more than the republican bit. She was not in the least put out by it.

With this background, you may be surprised to hear that what has hurt me so much is becoming perhaps the only Rector of a Scottish university in hundreds of years not to be awarded an honorary degree. (At Dundee I am not sure about Tony Slattery, whose rectorship never really started because of health issues).

The university senate debated a year ago whether I should be awarded an honorary degree and decided, with the strongest of steers from the university administration, that I was neither “respectable” nor “distinguished” enough. The matter was brought back again to the university senate by Dundee University Students Association, and again rejected. At university court, the current Rector, Brian Cox, formally minuted his dissent.

As to being distinguished, apart from being a British Ambassador and bestselling author, I have a first class MA (Hons) from Dundee University, was twice elected President of Dundee University Students Association and became Rector of Dundee University. If that is undistinguished, then Dundee University has a remarkably low opinion of itself.

I also find it rather curious that I am “undistinguished” but my two immediate predecessors as Rector, Lorraine Kelly and Fred Macaulay, were evidently “distinguished” enough. I should love to know the criteria.

It is not to do with the job done as Rector, because I attended many more committee meetings than my recent predecessors. This of course is exactly what the university administration did not want me to do. I argued strongly against cuts in university departments and student provision, against tuition fees, against allowing the special branch on campus, and tried to revive the notion of a democratically run academic community. I also attended regular meetings of other rectors, and with the Scottish parliament.

An academic from another university saw me in Edinburgh last week and out of the blue congratulated me on my rectorial installation address. I put a lot of effort into that speech, and it is surprising how often people do read and refer to it – I have been congratulated on it by Charlie Kennedy and Elaine C Smith, for example. But plainly a Rector able to make an interesting contribution on the philosophy of higher education is not what the university administration – which is just itching to bring in high tuition fees for all students – wants.

In a life which has spurned honours, I am hurt because I really care about Dundee University. I spent seven years of my life there plus three as an active Rector. If you sliced me, Dundee University runs through me like a stick of rock. That is why, on being spurned for an honorary degree, I feel emotionally like I have indeed been sliced. This really has hurt me.

Here comes the ridicule…

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117 Comments

  1. Dick the Prick

    27 Aug, 2011 - 10:35 am

    Flip it, like Groucho Marx; don’t be a member of any club that has Lorraine Kelly as a member!

  2. My version: It’s par for the course: Fuck ‘em.
    .

    Spielberg version: You are the Rector of Our University, Craig. [Cue music, child and large dog].

  3. I respect your courage. It’s not easy to admit to being hurt.

  4. What a loss for Dundee university..

  5. I’m surprised you react to such an asswipe in the first place – to misquote Dennis Healey, being criticised or sneered at from lloyd is a bit like being savaged by a dead sheep.

  6. Dear Craig,

    Your emotional reaction to such a petty and unecessary snub is perfectly understandable and normal. I think it’s disgusting, but not unexpected. That you express sadness and shock at your treatment does you credit, it shows that you still, despite everything, believe in decency, truth, and right. Alas none of these qualities are the ‘gold-standard’ in contemporary life, at least not if one wants to make a career for oneself inside the ‘golden circle.’

    I cringed when I heard you shout out at a public meeting a couple of years ago that ‘Zionism is bullshit’ I thought, he must be nuts, absolutely, incontrovertably, right; but he’s signed his own ‘death warrent’, for that alone he will never be forgiven.

    But one can look at things from a different perspective. That the more you are snubbed by the establishment and sidelined as a looney or loose cannon, someone who went ‘native’, the more and better human being you have become. That you should wear every snub, jibe, and attack, as badges of honour, with pride. You can hold your head up high and look yourself in the mirror of truth and not want to vomit at the reflection you see, and many lesser men, in our dishonourable and criminal age, can do that?

  7. Never underestimate the vindictiveness of certain parts of the establishment. That having been said the support of the students union & current Rector is, in my opinion, a fitting accolade.
    As for the value of such things, well Kissinger seems to have collected any number of honorary this & thats………………..

  8. I turned down British honours because it would be hypocritical to accept them for two reasons: I believe in Scottish independence, and I don’t believe in the monarchy. I was actually asked my reason by the queen in Warsaw, and I admit I stressed the Scottish nationalist bit more than the republican bit. She was not in the least put out by it.

    I hope you don’t take this as ridicule but did the Queen quip back, “Blame James VI!” or something much wittier.
    .
    I’m a republican myself, but you have to love the old dear Liz.
    .
    By the way, what happened to Clark? I hope he’s okay because he hasn’t commented here for a while and had been a very regular commenter. I don’t agree with him most of the time but would hate to think that my disagreements with him have caused him to not comment any more as he seemed to suggest before.

  9. Exclusion from the gilded halls is a sign that you are saying, writing and doing something right. You are a rational dissident. Take it as a compliment. Millions of us know that they are shite and you are diamond. Diamond cuts through shite.

  10. Clark’s been here often, Angrysoba, on other threads.

  11. Craig,
    Lorraine Kelly and Fred MacAulay are popular Scottish entertainers who are safely British Establishment and not controversial at all. Anodyne and family friendly would be good words to describe them.

    When Dundee University said not “respectable” and “distinguished” enough what they meant was not “establishment” enough and not respectful enough to the Labour party. That’s the criteria.

  12. Nothing for it Craig, but to drown your sorrows at Frew’s and have a fish supper from the Deep Sea.All your cares will melt away with the bouquet of the malt vinegar.
    I’m sure Dundee remembers you.

  13. Or a fried Mars bar. Or is that a West of Scotland fing? Is the breezy east, we say, “You’ll have had yer fried Mars bar, then?”

  14. Donnie Darko

    More a Mennies man. Used to live above the Deep Sea – it closes whenever you might be hungry!

  15. “This really has hurt me.”
    .
    Such is life.

  16. Craig: a refreshing and honest post, and one that certainly should not come replete with apologies. This is what makes you very readable, and I wonder if some of us would love to be open enough to exercise such candour and vulnerability on the internet. Perhaps one day I will give it a go!

  17. With such hallowed media personalities as Lorraine Kelly and Fred MacAulay to conjure with, they must be scraping the barrel a bit anyway and they now need populist figures to give ‘uni’, as they like to call it, street cred to sell it to the kids and get away from the crusty outdated academic image that universities had when they were free and admitted only the academically gifted. They certainly don’t want intellectuals and judging by the latest exam results fiesta they won’t be getting many coming through the doors.

  18. why does/would anyone covet an honorary degree ?
    .
    doesnt make sense to me.
    .
    unless one is looking for approval, or to be loved
    .
    but then one doesnt need an honorary degree to achieve that accolade.
    .
    funny how the system bribes one, freezes the mind, and directs ones emotions.

  19. These petty small minded bureaucrats might have got their rocks off by denying you an honorary degree but you’ll always have this blog reader’s – and I suspect many others – profound respect and admiration.

  20. It is perfectly natural to feel a slight on being passed over in the dishing out of such minor gongs – so long as you keep it in perspective. A couple of my books have made it onto the long lists for SF/fantasy awards, only to see my hopes cruelly dashed when, wouldja believe it, I miss the cut for the short leet. Ho, and indeed, hum.

  21. Craig – if getting an honorary degree was your goal in being Rector, you went about it totally the wrong way. Telling the Principal you outranked him and rubbing his nose in it at your inaugural speech was loadsa fun but hardly ingratiating.
    Like Wendy says, if you did to receive honours, like the other media monkeys, that’d be self-serving and contemptible. Your refusal to suck up to the organ-grinders suggested you’re neither. Why spoil it now?
    Their reluctance is totally predictable – a sign of a job well done – you shouldn’t be hurt by it. Not a bit.

  22. To be shunned by the ruling class must mean you’re doing something right! Why would you want to be honoured anyway? These awards thingies are more about the givers than the recipients.

  23. Macaualy and Kelly. Cox has some gravitas but that might just be how he comes across as an actor, not sure what he is like in life and principle. Students at Scottish universities have also elected people like Ross Kemp. When it comes to rectoring, you are the rose in the dungheap.

    If it helps, remember that the recently deceased Jimmy Reid was not considered biddable enough to stand for Labour. There is little appetite in officialdom for prophets or whistleblowers.

  24. Can I take back the bit about Reid? He did stand for Labour in Dundee but was unsuccessful. Nothing like spouting off ignorantly before doing your research…

  25. Craig,

    Only “discovered” you and your blog a couple of months ago. Your outpouring above ably shows

    1. the humanity that always shines through the expression of your opinions and

    2. the absolute necessity for you to continue to stand up to “them”.

    We think it. You get up and say it and do it: please do not let your hurt deflect you one scintilla.

  26. There was something a bit hyposcritical in a Scottish republican having a job as a diplomat for the United Kingdom.

  27. “My offence is that I have not kept silent upon the lessons I have learned from life; I have scorned what most men cherish—money-making and the administration of their property, military command and mob-leadership, and all the various political offices, cabals and backstairs intrigue.” (Plato, The Apology of Socrates, p. 56)

  28. Sounds to me as though you’ve distinguished yourself in not being “honoured”.
    .
    You’re the exception that proves a rule. A tawdry rule as it turns out.
    .
    Dundee have simply been foolish in highlighting this rule. It’s an error petty and vindictive people often make and it’ll taint them as long as they exist as an institution.
    .
    Reminds me of the Professor Norman Finkelstein case at DePaul.

  29. Wizard of Oz

    27 Aug, 2011 - 2:11 pm

    From the rock-bound coast of Maine to the Sun…. oh – oh, no — – ah – Well, be that as it may. Back where I come from we have universities, seats of great learning — where men go to become great thinkers. And when they come out, they think deep thoughts — and with no more brains than you have…. But!, they haven`t got one thing you have…An immortal soul.
    .
    Therefore, by virtue of the authority vested in me by the Universitatus Committeeatum e plurbis unum, I hereby confer upon you the honorary degree of Th.H. Yeah — that…that`s Dr. of Humanity.

  30. Wizard of Oz

    27 Aug, 2011 - 2:19 pm

    and…conduct, extraordinary valor, conspicuous bravery against wicked witches, I award you the Triple Cross.
    .
    You are now a member of the Legion of Courage!.

  31. Well Mr Murray I personally think you shouldn’t win any such award! I used to follow your blog and tell all kinds of people about how great I thought you were, how you were “a heavyweight” who was standing up for the common man etc. Then I realised, after one of your posts that underneath it all you are a scum-bag with delusions of grandeur. The post you wrote abou the dumbing down of the BBC with the introduction of local accents, or some such nonsense.
    Not everyone is able to reach higher education, or indeed has much time for academia, that doesn’t mean they are stupid or shouldn’t be listened to- and if you think you can only measure a man by how eloquent, articulate or educated he is, you are an arse! It’s pathetic attitudes like that that undervalue tradesmen and engineers that were once the backbone of this country. Now we just have lawyers, politicians and celebraties! Wow!
    Sorry everyone for my lack of eloquence, probably bad grammar and spelling… but really, what are any of you doing about the problems this country faces- massaging each others academic egos.
    I was going to alter this thread (how can an engineer be an engineer without academics…) to make it less open to ridicule. But I can’t be arsed due to my slight regional accent… it makes thinking harder…..

  32. Mods @Yvonne Ridley 27th August 2011
    ‘I’m surprised you react to such an asswipe in the first place – to misquote Dennis Healey, being criticised or sneered at from lloyd is a bit like being savaged by a dead sheep.’
    .
    Is it possible to check whether that comment came from Yvonne Ridley, whose website was linked to? It doesn’t sound like something she would say or the language she would use.

  33. For what its worth, you have shared your hurt with us and it is understandable that you should feel like that.

    But we also know that it is those who wanted higher tutiton fees and who begged MI5 to come on campus who have used their administrative office to divert whats rightfull yours.

    Just think how it would feel if they now turn around and grudgingly agreed to give you this accolade next year? Would you really want the honorary degree if its handed over by THEM?
    They do not deserve to stand next to you

    Nice one nextus, so fitting, has society really evolved since then?

  34. Craig, I sympathise. I think that the reason you were snubbed in this way was because you have a blog. “Respectable and distinguished” people don’t have blogs. They have dinner parties with sociey’s affluent where they discuss society’s effluent.

  35. “Respectable and distinguished” people don’t have blogs.
    .
    They have blogoirs.

  36. @Angrysoba – heh, I was thinking that!

  37. Someone has to give you a row, so I’ll do it. You should regard these snubs by the establishment as positive feedback, clear evidence of your worth. Try a thought experiment: what if these bastards did offer you honours? Wouldn’t there be a tiny bit (maybe a big bit) of your mind wondering just exactly where you had so far capitulated that your harmlessness could be formally recognised? You are unhonoured by people whose opinion of honour is counterfeit.
    .
    Socialists tell a story of two old Labour activists walking around a town park. They see a tree which has gone rotten, with nasty, ugly things wriggling in holes in the bark.
    .
    “They say we’re like those – things”, says one.
    .
    “Aye, those were the days!” says the other.
    .
    So wise up. The people who it’s unwise to be loved by, hate you with a passion. Furthermore, if I and a few others have their way there will be no ‘honours’ system in Scotland after we have extracted ourselves from sinking hulk of the SS Ukania, so you’re on to nothing there either, I’m afraid. Well, perhaps a pint or two.

  38. The university management has an interest in disempowering the role of Rector … whose main function is to champion the students’ interests in university decisions. Stephen Fry was the last Rector who successfully campaigned in the media on behalf of the students – against the 7% rise in Hall fees (though the university’s response was to bring in Sanctuary Management Services the following year) … and against semesterization (which was later unilaterally imposed during MacAulay’s tenure). Since then the endemic culture of new managerialism has employed surreptitious tactics to bypass democratic opposition, chiefly by buying off or sidelining the opposition … the students’ association was bought off with institutional perks for key members of the executive and a hefty refurbishment grant … and Craig Murray was ignored and sidelined as a recalcitrant Rector. The people responsible will no doubt have honours duly bestowed on them … which shows they’re not worth having, in my opinion.

  39. I would also turn down the commitment ‘to defend the faith. You are a defender of faith Craig, or truth. Therefore trust in yourself and reveal everything you know that goes against that faith. I know you will be honoured.

  40. Someone has to give you a row, so I’ll do it. You should regard these snubs by the establishment as positive feedback, clear evidence of your worth. Try a thought experiment: what if these bastards did offer you honours? Wouldn’t there be a tiny bit (maybe a big bit) of your mind wondering just exactly where you had so far capitulated that your harmlessness should be formally recognised? You are unhonoured by people whose opinion of honour is counterfeit, obscenely so.
    .
    Socialists tell a story of two old Labour activists walking around a town park. They see a tree which has gone rotten, with nasty things wriggling in holes in the bark.
    .
    “They say we’re like those – things”, says one.
    .
    “Aye, those were the days!” says the other.
    .
    So wise up. The people who it’s unwise to be loved by, hate you with a passion. Furthermore, if I and a few others have their way there will be no ‘honours’ system in Scotland after we have extracted ourselves from sinking hulk of the SS Ukania, so you’re on to nothing there either, I’m afraid. Well, perhaps a pint or two.

  41. Dear Craig

    You have been treated shabbily, but remember this, you went to Dundee University, the administration just work there.

    It’s a disgrace but their disgrace, they care so little about the place that they refuse to uphold tradition.

    Dundee isn’t the only shabby university in Scotland with discredited management, I also highlight Glasgow University and their failure in my blog.

    Yours sincerely

    George Laird
    The Campaign for Human Rights at Glasgow University

  42. Off topic./
    .
    Doctors unleash legal challenge over inquest Dr David Kelly never had
    .
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2030663/David-Kelly-inquest-Doctors-unleash-legal-challenge.html

  43. Private Eye is reporting that Dundee University had received £713,000 from Gadaffi in recent years.

    That’s right, the man whose agents shot a British policewoman, funded the IRA, blew up a plane over Scotland, gave human rights awards to a Holocaust denier and so on.

    Tut tut.

  44. Craig, Fuck them…who needs a few scabby bits of tin or a few poxy certificates to prove to the world you have achieved something….Floyd is a pathetic tick who has the literal capacity of my left bollock….Use that brain of yours and write an article on this piece of shit…no doubt it will be all over the place in days…dig up some dirt on him and then shove it literally so far up his arse he will be vomiting his phoney denials for months…..

  45. Hi Craig, I’m a political novice and have no academic education but I enjoy reading your blog because it’s permeated with your personal integrity. No official recognition will ever add to that.
    .
    The psychopathic crooks that run the global political agenda must be envious of the power and influence that come from personal integrity, something they will never experience.

  46. David Peters

    27 Aug, 2011 - 5:59 pm

    Craig -

    Every member of every university should read your installation address – it’s brilliant.

    Frazer – Floyd wasn’t actually criticising Craig, quite the opposite. I don’t think Craig thought he was either, just the passage he quotes out of context in sparking these thoughts.

  47. “Every member of every university should read your installation address”
    Where is that installation address?! :)

  48. David Peters

    27 Aug, 2011 - 6:09 pm

    Levantine

    It’s the last link in Craig’s post.

  49. I don’t know who went to this place, …. — whoever. Their spirit is dead — if they ever had one — it’s gone. You’re building a rat ship here. A vessel for sea goin’ snitches. And if you think your preparing these minnows for manhood you better think again. Because I say you are killing the very spirit this institution proclaims it instills! What a sham. What kind of a show are you guys puttin’ on here today. I mean, the only class in this act is sittin’ next to me. And I’m here to tell ya this boy’s soul is intact. It’s non-negotiable. You know how I know? Someone here — and I’m not gonna say who — offered to buy it. Only Charlie here wasn’t sellin’.
    .
    Sir, you are out of order!
    .
    Slade: Outta order? I’ll show you outta order! You don’t know what outta order is, Mr. Trask! I’d show you but I’m too old; I’m too tired; I’m too fuckin’ blind. If I were the man I was five years ago I’d take a FLAME-THROWER to this place! Outta order. Who the hell you think you’re talkin’ to? I’ve been around, you know? There was a time I could see. And I have seen boys like these, younger than these, their arms torn out, their legs ripped off. But there isn’t nothin’ like the sight of an amputated spirit; there is no prosthetic for that. You think you’re merely sendin’ this splendid foot-soldier back home to Oregon with his tail between his legs, but I say you are executin’ his SOUL!! And why?! Because he’s not a Baird man! Baird men, ya hurt this boy, you’re going to be Baird Bums, the lot of ya. And Harry, Jimmy, Trent, wherever you are out there, FUCK YOU, too!
    .
    Stand down, Mr. Slade!
    .
    Slade: I’m not finished! As I came in here, I heard those words, “cradle of leadership.” Well, when the bow breaks, the cradle will fall. And it has fallen here; it has fallen. Makers of men; creators of leaders; be careful what kind of leaders you’re producin’ here.

  50. David…If so I stand corrected…dosen’t change my feelings on the matter though…

  51. In essence, the general and very simple rule in most political and cultural (where there is no objective measure of quality) fields is this: If your work serves the interests of power, you are rewarded handsomely. You become a paragon, your ‘brand’ is marketed, translated, and everybody hangs on your every word. If your work in some manner opposes the interests of power, you become, at the very least, an unperson.

  52. Paul Johnston

    27 Aug, 2011 - 8:35 pm

    @George Laird
    You have been treated shabbily, but remember this, you went to Dundee University, the administration just work there.
    I work at Manchester University as part of the “administration”, assume you use the term “just” as some sort of insult.

  53. I think I can understand your hurt, but as your readers have pointed out, it was because you did the job properly that they refused you the honorary doctorate. They are establishment. They are self serving. They’d rather cut a few teachers and scrap a few courses than let one member of the bloated and overpaid management go. They didn’t much care for your honesty. No more, in fact, than the Labour government did.

    I suspect that they are Labour through and through, and time after time you have blown Labour our of the water.

    Fred McCauley is an entertaining enough man, but not in the least distinguished; Lorraine Kelly is a daytime tv presenter, I think, and, as I understand it, a sort of Z list celebrity. I’m not sure that I’d consider it much of an honour to have the same degree as she has.

    I don’t comment here often, but I read most of your posts. You’ve a cracking intellect and you are, it seems, afraid of nothing in your quest for truth and decency. You’re basically a decent and good man, frequently treated indecently and badly because you refuse to accept the standards that others accept in order to curry favour.

    I admire and respect you. (Not that that is any substitute for an honour in most people’s eyes…!!)

  54. Mary, I have no definite result on Yvonne Ridley. There is a contact form on her blog; you could submit a query.

  55. Not Yvonne Mary – She would not make the mistake of writing ‘lloyd’ instead of ‘Floyd’ in my opinion.

  56. Craig

    you are correct in saying the administration at D.U. are itching to bring in higher tuition fees, I was at a graduation there this summer, a long and boring speech was based on the dire need for the university to be allowed to charge fees to keep up standards.

    Lorraine Kelly and Fred Macaulay Yeah they got their honorary degrees for services to keeping Scotland on it’s knees, chained to the UK.
    There’s a whole lot of other BBC Scotland media stars who are deserving of the same accreditation

    Clydebuilt

  57. If Brian Cox is awarded an honorary degree, MAYBE he’ll dedicate to you.

    The more I hear about Brian Cox the more I like him.

  58. Yes. I have a high opinion of Brian Cox too.

  59. You mean the physicist looking for the ‘god’ particle? Maybe is doesn’t exist after all.
    .
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-14596367

  60. If you feel bitter you shouldn’t. You should be angry.
    Not because you were snubbed, but because they have snubbed the students who elected you to represent them.

  61. Craig

    A moving article which shows that brave and humane folk, like yourself, are hurt and vulnerable like the rest of us.

    “If you prick us, do we not bleed? if you tickle us, do we not laugh? if you poison us, do we not die? …” – ( Merchant of Venice, Act III, scene I).

    Thank you for this article. It makes your analysis of politics all the more persuasive and reassuring that it comes from someone is only too human.

  62. Nonsense like that always hurts, but in the end it’s Dundee University management that looks foolish and small minded. I learnt in recent years to abide by ‘Ruiz’s Four Agreements’ one of which is . Don’t Take Anything Personally’.

    The other three are:

    ‘Be impeccable with your word’.
    ‘Don’t make assumptions’.
    ‘Always do your best’.

    I’m sure you’re doing fine with those three.
    Take Care and Cheer Up.

  63. Thanks Mods and Mark ref Yvonne Ridley. I will ask her.
    .
    On Being Hurt – you could always book a session with ‘Jackboots’ Smith Craig. What a dreadful woman. She has no shame.
    .
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/mps-expenses/labour-mps-expenses/8727376/Jacqui-Smith-the-conman-and-the-one-to-one-mentoring.html

  64. deepgreenpuddock

    28 Aug, 2011 - 8:24 am

    The withholding of the honorary degree says a great deal more about the withholders than the person withheld from.

    Of course it has the appearance of the actions of the small-minded and petty. Presumably the names of these people (who withheld the degree) is known. Can they be named? Can they be asked to account for their actions? Probably not, but if their behaviour is flushed into visibility, or they find themselves exposed, they may well be forced to respond.

    One must assume that they wished to avoid the situation where they were giving an honour to someone who might well excite the interest of the red tops. (Not difficult to see the headlines). They would have been fearful of any adverse publicity, which might affect intake, especially of rich kids from repressive places abroad who might not be comfortable with CM being honoured. But these people do seem craven and spineless specimens. It really gives a powerful insight into the kind of people who now administer public institutions.

    I notice there is a learned discussion on the deep-fried Mars bar. Ownership of this culinary innovation is claimed by the fish and chip shop in Stonehaven. Apparently, one night as the wind and sleet whipped off the dark and freezing North sea, and not a sane soul but the fryer’s friend was afoot, and nary a customer, they turned to frying all kinds of novelties to distract themselves from their loneliness, and provide amusements, on a night when amusements were few. Even Tam o’shanter stayed home that night.

    First it was a Snickers but the peanuts were rendered bitter by the heat , then some jelly novelty dinosaurs,
    ( a disaster as hot dinosaur juice dripped out of the batter), then some maltesers, which exploded. Finally perfection. The mars bar became a succulent, sweet, soft, warm and oleaginous delicacy with the added dimension of a firm crusty coating.
    History was made in those lonely hours near the North Sea.

  65. DeepGreenPuddock, thank you indeed for that inspiring, apetising and engaging culinary information! I will treasure it as I do all nuggets of folk wisdom. News signs for the road: ‘Welcome to Stonehaven, Inventor and Capital of the Deep-Fried Mars Bar’.

  66. I came to this via Subrosa.
    I don’t think you should be hurt , I think you should be offended particularly when you mention the ” distinguished ” previous rectors and their honourary degrees.
    You seem to offend the “establishment” rather like Jack Vettriano – so laugh all the way to the bank or whatever pleases you and continue to be a concerned human being of insight and interest.( a rather convoluted way of saying “lang may yer lum reek!)

  67. Who is Chris Floyd?

    It’s hard to be a truth teller; it takes a courageous person to speak truth to power when you risk your career and maybe your life doing so. You have done your best to light the moral path for us all when the world is spinning out of control.

    You are cut from the same cloth as Norman Finkelstein. Have you seen the movie ‘American Radical?’ You’re a rock, even if you don’t realize it.

  68. Another You Could Not Make It Up. I thought Al Jazeera and CNN got the gold medals for fakery.
    .
    Letter to BBC concerning Fake Tripoli Celebrations
    Posted by Plus Ultra on August 28, 2011, 2:07 pm
    .
    Sent the following to the BBC on 25 August 2011:
    .
    Hello,
    .
    I’d like to file a complaint regarding the BBC’s coverage of the NATO-led rebellion in Tripoli. On the 24 August 2011, two news presenters reported on a ‘massive throng’ of supporters entering Tripoli’s Green Square.
    .
    One presenter noted that the video is of ‘people in Tripoli.’ The other presenter commented on ‘scenes of jubilation’ occurring in the same area. However, upon closer inspection, it appears that the footage is not from Tripoli, but from another location. In fact, the footage appears to be from Green Square in India, not Libya.
    .
    See the following video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Atl_JgLesYE
    ,
    As you can see, neither of the presenters are able to identify the ‘Indian’ flags that are being waved before them. Instead they go on with their report as if it truly is ‘from Tripoli’, forgetting that Green Square is surrounded by buildings and not in some sort of grassland location (which we can see in the above video).
    .
    Given this fact, I think the BBC should apologise for its coverage or at the very least issue a statement confirming this outrageous error. I am rather amazed that an apology has not already been issued already. In any event, I do hope you will respond to this complaint in detail and explain why we – the viewers – were provided with such wrongheaded coverage from the region.
    .
    Thanks
    .
    Plus Ultra
    .
    Reply from the BBC a mere three days later – good going!
    .
    Reference CAS-955929-MQBZ98
    .
    Thanks for contacting us regarding ‘Breakfast’ broadcast on 24 August on BBC One.
    .
    We understand you were concerned that incorrect footage was shown during a report on the latest developments from Tripoli, and that images from India were broadcast instead.
    .
    We forwarded your complaint to ‘Breakfast’ Editors who explained in response that they realised within moments that they were showing the wrong footage and quickly took it down.
    .
    They also apologised immediately and pointed to how the problem was caused by confusion over a ‘feed’ coming in to television centre from the international agencies.
    .
    We apologise for any concern this may have caused and we’d like to assure you that your feedback has been registered on our audience log. This is a daily report of audience feedback that’s made available to many BBC staff, including members of the BBC Executive Board, programme makers, channel controllers and other senior managers. The audience logs are seen as important documents that can help shape decisions about future programming and content.
    .
    Thanks again for taking the time to contact us.

    Kind Regards

    Leigh Mallon
    BBC Complaints
    .

    A few points:
    ,
    1) Can anyone locate this apology on the BBC’s website?
    2) If not, who apologised to whom? Was it an internal apology – from someone in the BBC to someone in the BBC – or was it a broadcasted apology, to the audience?
    3) Even if the breakfast editors ‘took it down’ the damage was already done. Surely the ‘feed’ should have been checked out before it was aired?
    4) How can you take down a live transmission that has ‘already’ gone out?
    5) What does their ‘confusion’ over the feed mean? If they were confused by it, then they shouldn’t have sent it out – surely? And why didn’t the presenters say that it was a live feed from a different agency? Who sent out this feed? Who is responsible for it being broadcast at this time and not at another time?
    6) Does anyone know if anything particularly important was happening in Green Square India on 25 August? After all, the BBC notes that this is presumably a live ‘feed’?
    .
    Very unusual stuff. Worth chasing up?
    .
    Re: Letter to BBC concerning Fake Tripoli Celebrations
    Posted by gabriele on August 28, 2011, 2:13 pm, in reply to “Letter to BBC concerning Fake Tripoli Celebrations”
    .
    well done – i’m not aware of those apologies but from the video it is clear they didn’t realise within moments since they kept commenting on it and let the video play
    .
    how such an incorrect footage could possibly be broadcast is behind my understanding
    : Worth chasing up?
    definitely!

  69. Osama bin Laden

    28 Aug, 2011 - 7:50 pm

    [Mod: disruptive, deleted]

  70. The only countries not attacked seem to be their own and Greenland.
    .
    http://killinghope.org/images/interventions_map.png

  71. Craig, the UK establishment does not have the slightest respect for academia unless it can be used for its own propaganda purposes. They are not likely to assist you in exposing truth. How can you possibly be hurt by that fact? Join a cause which has some integrity, such as Islam, and work for the sake of God. I think you will find it more rewarding than working for the Taghoot,
    ( scumbag, lying, Satanist, self-serving liars ).

  72. Shame my post went missing – is it pending Mod?

  73. grow up

  74. @Mark – nothing pending, no.

  75. That’s great coming from Wtc who I assume is yet another pseudonym for LfStL.
    .
    Did anyone see the first series of this? I didn’t. Worth watching?

    .
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/aug/28/coalition-preposterous-political-satire

  76. @Mary – don’t think wtc and Larry are one and the same.
    .
    @wtc – if you want people to reply, it might be helpful to explain who or what you’re responding to. Bit unclear at the moment!

  77. Johnm

    I am uncomfortable that this analysis, which I entirely agree with, comes from an American citizen. What I particularly like about this piece is his clarity that the present lull in political pressure on Islam in this country is actually the calm before the storm.
    Mouth-foaming New Labour Zionists like Blair and Blears will be replaced by a an EDL style of Gulag culture for anyone who wants to criticise New World Order materialism. The UK government actively supports all Islamic groups who look scary and short-trousered and un-British. Then they will expose the hatred of Western foreign policy by Muslims and the thinking rest of us, and threaten us with punishment for thought crimes for not worshipping the Big Society slogan and for being different.

    Nobody dreamed that Blair would become a war criminal by having his g……lies twisted and a shotgun to his temple by the Zionist mafia who control the banking system; Cameron has more to hide and more to lose than him. Already we have seen him, baby-mouth Sloane-ranger that he is, launch a new million-people-hitting war on a Muslim country. Look back at Blair’s record at this time in his term of office and he was still sweeping up Mrs Thatchers doggy-do in Yugoslavia.

    Maybe it’s time to stay on holiday permanently this time.

  78. Wtc is a ‘shill’ – are we certain posts cannot be intercepted.

  79. Jon thanks. I assumed wtc stood for world trade centre, the subject that LfStL gets off on.

  80. Off-Topic sorry but I believe these links are so important now that the Independent tells is the British government has applied a blanket ban on all kind of marches and protest gatherings in London amid fears of violence and disorder, starting September 2nd 2011.
    .
    David Halpin on behalf of Dr David Kelly RIP
    .
    Robin Cook MP PBUH
    .
    Jeff Farrer PhD Physicist
    .
    Kamal Obeid MSc Civil & Stuctual Engineer
    .
    Richard Humenn WTC Chief Electrical Design Engineer
    .
    Ron Brookman MSc Structual Engineer
    .
    a href = http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeWNITKBFto“>Stephen Barasch MSc High Rise Architect
    .
    a href = “http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lU-vu2JvZY”>Niels Harrit PhD Chemical Scientist
    .
    a href = “http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0fkDmi78Og”>Lynn Margulis PhD Presidential Medal for Science

  81. We learn from the independent that the British government has applied a blanket ban on all kind of marches and protest gatherings in London amid fears of violence and disorder, starting on September 2nd 2011. I regard this decision to be a continuation or a a perpetuation of fear driven policies by a corrupt and deceptive government. We realise fear has silenced many Americans. Yet we can reflect fear like a mirror with knowledge. Here is a comprehensive lecture from my good friend David Halpin who I admire, trust and respect and who like a powerful mirror is just one of a growing number of like minded people who will relect fear and ensure our new leaders are principled, with expertise and good heart not the psychopathic murderers that correctly represent our communities.

  82. Craig Murray bought the horrors of torture into good people’s minds and I hope in time he will be rewarded for his bravery. Meanwhile this piece honours and amplifies his courage.
    .

    Jane Mayer, a key historian of the “dark side” of our history, emphasized the impact on some CIA agents of their involvement in crimes of torture and suffering, also citing a leaked Red Cross report that sets up Bush teams for international war-crimes trial. [Village Voice, Aug. 27, 2007]
    .
    She quotes a former CIA officer as saying: ‘When you cross over that line of darkness, it’s hard to come back. You lose your soul. You can do your best to justify it, but … you can’t go back to that dark a place without it changing you.’”
    .
    CIA/MI6 agents are also human beings – I know one.
    .
    Human Rights Watch tells us President Obama rejected an independent criminal investigation of the highest-profile officials, including Condoleezza Rice, John Ashcroft, Cheney’s council, David Addingtonand John Yoo, author of the cruel, aptly dubbed “torture memos” from the Ashcroft Justice Department that gave the “legal cover” to allow torture.
    .
    ACLU Foundation constitutional lawyer, Stephen Rohde, discloses FOI lawsuits filed by the ACLU and the Center for Constitutional Rights have yielded more than 100,000 pages of documents detailing these war crimes.
    .
    (“getting-getting-away-with-torture, July 28 2011 truthout.org)
    Defense Department records, of the deaths of “detainees” in American custody.
    .
    Unknown numbers of these deaths have also I believe taken place in CIA “black sites” and during CIA “renditions” to countries known for torturing, These so called “ghost prisoners” have disappeared into eternity because such information remains ‘most secret’ and unavailable.

    President Ronald Reagan in 1988 and ratified by the American government in 1994a law qualifying the U.N. Convention against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment that states:
    .

    “No exceptional circumstances whatsoever, whether a state of war or a threat or war, internal political instability or any other public emergency, may be invoked as a justification of torture.
    .
    “An order from a superior officer or a public authority may not be invoked as a justification of torture.”
    .
    The Geneva Conventions, mandates each contracting party “shall be under the obligation to search for persons alleged to have committed, or to have ordered to be committed, such grave breaches (of the Geneva Conventions), and shall bring such persons, regardless of their nationality, before its own courts.”
    .
    President Obama, IS THEREFORE OBLIGATED to bring the list of Bush presidency war criminals I have sighted here and elsewhere into the American courts or, before that, be subject to an independent criminal investigation.
    .
    Britons of all political parties, faiths and backgrounds are themselves obligated to insist that that this coalition government also brings lawsuits against MI6 personnel responsible for torture and these agents are compelled by law NOT to assert false national security concerns that prevent these war crimes from even being heard in our courts under the perversion of “the state secrets” doctrine.
    .

    We owe it to our next generation and their children to take responsibility for our worldwide shame of having become a torture nation complicit with America. As we condemn other nations’ crimes against their citizens of Bahrain, Syria, Libya, Yemen Zimbabwe, et al, our British government makes it easier for those countries to escape accountability by utterly denying our own complicity in the cruel, inhumane, degrading torture that has given terrorists around the world so valuable a means for recruiting more terrorists.
    .
    With thanks to Nat Hentoff for his inspiration and thoughts.

  83. There is this other horror going on 176 miles to the east of Libya
    .
    http://arabnews.com/middleeast/article494983.ece
    .
    I wonder if the organ harvesters teams are at work in Libya as they were purported to be in Haiti after the earthquake.
    .
    btw There is no location given for Palestine on Google Maps.

  84. “CIA/MI6 agents are also human beings – I know one.” Mark Golding.
    .
    So do I. Though in my case, ‘know’ would be an exaggeration. ‘Have acquaintance with’ might be a more apt description. Does one ever really ‘know’ such people? Do their families even ever really ‘know’ them? The answre is likely to be (what else?) both yes and no.
    .
    “She quotes a former CIA officer as saying: ‘When you cross over that line of darkness, it’s hard to come back. You lose your soul. You can do your best to justify it, but … you can’t go back to that dark a place without it changing you.’” ” Mark Golding.
    .
    That CIA Officer ought perhaps to have read, and digested, ‘Macbeth’.

  85. Mark This is a chilling account of how a human was seized, rendered, interrogated and imprisoned. The CIA even have an acronym for the torture – EITs – Enhanced Interrogation Techniques.
    .
    http://harpers.org/archive/2011/07/hbc-90008139

  86. “The whole story is disturbing and sad” I agree wholeheartedly. Thank-you Mary.
    Suhayl – the person I know is just a communications ‘engineer’ albeit clandestine – even so at the interview he was assessed on the ability to ‘talk oneself out of a possible ‘outing’ situation or in human terms, the aptitude to lie?!

  87. Tunnelling thru the propaganda – do we find a vision now lost forever in Libya?
    .
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cw8cHwyq7LI

  88. How about these evil words, scripted in Tel Aviv, Washington and London I should think? Our descent into Hell is going faster and faster.
    .
    Arab spring has created ‘intelligence disaster’, warns former CIA boss
    Michael Scheuer says rendition should be brought back as lack of intelligence has left UK and US unable to monitor militants
    .
    Charlotte Higgins guardian.co.uk, Sunday 28 August 2011 12.26 BST
    .
    Michael Scheuer, the former head of the CIA unit in charge of pursuing Osama bin Laden, said the Arab spring had ‘delighted al-Qaida’. Photograph: Murdo Macleod
    .
    The Arab spring has “delighted al-Qaida” and caused “an intelligence disaster” for the US and Britain, the former head of the CIA unit in charge of pursuing Osama bin Laden has warned.
    .
    Speaking at the Edinburgh international book festival, Michael Scheuer said: “The help we were getting from the Egyptian intelligence service, less so from the Tunisians but certainly from the Libyans and Lebanese, has dried up – either because of resentment at our governments stabbing their political leaders in the back, or because those who worked for the services have taken off in fear of being incarcerated or worse.
    .
    “The amount of work that has devolved on US and British services is enormous, and the result is blindness in our ability to watch what’s going on among militants.”
    .
    The Arab spring, he said, was “an intelligence disaster for the US and for Britain, and other European services”.
    .
    Scheuer headed the Bin Laden unit at the CIA from 1996 to 1999, and worked as special adviser to its chief from 2001 to 2004. The author of a biography of Bin Laden, he now teaches on the peace and security affairs programme at the University of Georgetown.
    .
    He said: “The rendition programme must come back – the people we have in custody now are pretty long in the tooth, in terms of the information they can provide in interrogations.
    .
    “The Arab spring has been a disaster for us in terms of intelligence gathering, and we now are blind both because of the Arab spring and because there is nothing with which to replace the rendition programme.”
    .
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/aug/28/arab-spring-intelligence-disaster-scheuer?intcmp=239

  89. Ha, ha, ha. Good one, Mary, thanks for the info. He’s just trying to sow alarm. Fuck Scheuer and all aboard his shite ship. Perhaps if he hadn’t tortured people across the globe, he’d have had more pals. Roll on, the Arab Spring! Throw out the dictators, throw out out the CIA! And while you’re at it, screw Al Qaeda.

  90. Mary, a search on “Palestine” works on Google Maps for me; the graphic places Jerusalem slightly south of the centre of the map. I haven’t found Palestine marked as a name of a country, but Google Maps seems inconsistent about that; it seems to depend upon the scale.

  91. So Scheuer wants to restart rendition. There simply do not exist words to describe such evil. And it was apparently totally ineffective in helping Scheuer’s unit locate Osama bin Laden, so this man presumably wishes to cause pain for the sake of it.

  92. Amnesty International have an e-mail campaign to prosecute Bush and Cheney for torture:
    .
    http://www.kintera.org/siteapps/advocacy/ActionItem.aspx?c=6oJCLQPAJiJUG&b=6645049&aid=16400

  93. “Throw out the dictators, throw out the CIA! And while you’re at it, screw Al Qaeda.”

    Expose the zionists and the tasks above are accomplished in one hit.

  94. Clark I am on my home default page, normal scale, searching for Palestine and am given these choices:
    Palestine TX United States
    Palestine Grove Merton
    Palestine IL United States
    Palestine Andover
    Palestine St Belfast
    !!!
    .
    Palestine as such does not exist in the Zionist set up or mindset. Google was set up by two people. One of them is Sergey Brin who is a fervent supporter of the little democratic state that has no borders. He even went over in 2008 to celebrate Israel’s 60th birthday.
    .
    Other maps refer to Palestine as the Occupied Palestinian Territories.

  95. Mary, I see what you mean; the suggestions as you type into the search box. If you type as far as “palestini”, it will offer you “Palestinian Territories”. Searching on the whole word “palestine” does seem to lead to the right piece of map.
    .
    I don’t know whether Google deserve blame for this. Currently, Palestine is not recognised as a state by UN General Assembly.

  96. Imagine being from ‘Palestine, Texas’. When people in Texas ask where you are from and you say, ‘Palestine’… I wonder if one day soon, they’ll twin with Nablus (!)
    .
    Ha ha ha!
    .
    I’m in a slapstick mood this evening. Pie-in-the-face and so on.

  97. I watched this video of Sergey Brin interviewed by an Israeli interviewer:
    .
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIx5F0vbjB4
    .
    The interviewer is quite hard on Brin about Google search results on the word “jew”, pointing out that jewwatch.com was at the top of the list. Brin responded as I would expect any techie geek – he said that Google’s algorithm determines the results, and he would not like that to be tainted with ad-hoc adjustments. As a wanabe programmer, I approve of that as a matter of pride in ones work. Brin also dismissed the interviewer’s complaint that Google Earth displays details of Israeli military installations.
    .
    Brin did start to sound defensive and evasive when the interviewer raised the issue of how much data Google holds upon users, and particularly about whether those users can be identified as individuals.
    .
    Palestine, Texas: out of about 18,000 residents, nearly 4000 work for the Texas Department of Criminal Justice… Probably not my sort of place.

  98. Seeing as we’re way off-topic and the riot posts are all days ago, I thought I’d post this African proverb from Zoe Young’s blog:
    .
    http://www.zoeyoung.net/
    .
    “If the young are not initiated into the village, they will burn it down just to feel its warmth.”
    .
    And a poem – How Do You Respect Fuck All?
    .
    http://youtu.be/hIHKf3Q-h1A

  99. Re. Google:
    .

    Dr. Katherine Albrecht, another person i have a lot of respect for, is the spokesperson for a service called Startpage.com That service allows you to search Google through an anonymous proxy over SSL. That means you can use Google without Google storing your personal information.
    .
    Try Google on Dr. Katherine Albrecht and RFID

  100. Texas Rangers! I once got shown around the elegant pink granite State Capitol in Austin afterhours by a tall Texas Ranger. I got to sit in the Governor’s seat (Ann Richards was Governor then). Of course, as the world knows to its cost, George W. Bush unseated the relatively decent (and now late) one-time teacher, Ann Richards to launch his disgusting political career as Governor of Texas. So George W. Bush got to sit in the seat in which I sat. Ha! That is an honour for George W. Bush. If I’d known the mass-murdering Bush was going to sit there, I’d have invited Sweeney Todd.
    .
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ann_Richards

  101. Clark – I type the whole word Palestine and get those choices I listed. Ignoring those and clicking on Palestine, I get a map of Israel. A few indeterminate white dotted lines indicate the Gaza Strip and the West Bank but do NOT indicate the wall or the settlements or the appropropriation of East Jerusalem by Israel.
    .
    This is another map which shows Palestine as several islands. Bantustans like S Africa.
    .
    http://bigthink.com/ideas/21423

  102. You probably know the website Uruknet which over many years has put up mainly factual reports and stories about the horror of what has gone on in Iraq, Afghanistan and Palestine amongst other places. Google have censored them on several occasions and have done the same to other similar sites. Wonder why.
    .
    http://www.uruknet.de/?p=m43505
    URUKNET CUT OFF FROM GOOGLE NEWS AGAIN!
    Uruknet
    .
    April 28, 2008
    .
    Google is at it again! On April 24, 2008 Google has stopped indexing Uruknet.info as a news source.
    .
    (The latest Uruknet article included in the Google News index is THE US POWER STRUCTURE Who Really Runs the World (April 24, 2008)
    .
    We wrote to Google News but we didn’t get any reply.
    .
    We therefore kindly request our readers to write to Google asking Uruknet.info to be reinstated as a news source.
    .
    Please, send your complaints to google.news! Click here to fill a speedy form.
    .
    This is the fourth time that Google discontinues indexing Uruknet, only to reinstate it following many complaints sent in by our readers.
    .
    You can read the previous episodes below.

    /….

  103. Finally, I have tried typing the word ‘jew’ on Google and I was being sent to Jews Sans Frontieres. Rejecting that, I finally got this long hectoring page at the top of the search page. Why are they intervening? Type in christian or muslim and you get dating site ads both at the top of the pages. Enough said. The revenue matters to Google.
    .
    http://www.google.com/explanation.html
    .
    Bing and Yahoo give Wikipedia results, miscellaneous and images etc. No lectures.

  104. “Enough said. The revenue matters to Google.”
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-14708119
    .
    I don`t use Google. I also don`t go near anything to do with Murdoch.

  105. Mary, the results you are getting from Google are different from mine. This is presumably due to differences in settings between our two systems, our previous search histories, and how reliably the Google system can identify us, etc. My top results for “jew” are “Jews – Wikipedia”, “Judaism – Wikipedia”, jewwatch.com. The Google “Explanation” page that you linked is the 6th major heading.
    .
    “Jew” differs in linguistic usage from both “Muslim” and “Christian”. For instance, someone might describe people or countries as “Muslim” or “Christian” but never as “Jew”; that would be “Jewish”. So I think that the explanation page and Sergey Brin’s answer in the interview make sense; “jew” is likely to be part of a search term by those critical of Jews, and Google returns results suitable for them.
    .
    It certainly seems that Uruknet is excluded from Google News. Uruknet is not excluded from Google Web search; for instance, try this search term:
    .
    palestine site:uruknet.de
    .
    Regarding maps, I have never found a key to Google Maps. Some borders are shown as dotted; I think that some of these may be contested borders; look at, say, Kashmir for a comparison. The map placement for a search on “palestine” does show Israel, but it has to if it is to include Gaza. Google Maps generally doesn’t seem to concentrate upon depicting political situations.
    .
    I tried other search engines for a while, but I kept going back to Google which found what I was looking for when others didn’t. But Google is more than just web searching; they gather data on us at almost every site we visit. We can minimise this with the Google Sharing and NoScript add-ons for Firefox.

  106. Two statements haunted Robin Cook before his untimely death. One of them was:

    7th July 1999 – the Libyan Government, “had accepted general responsibility for Yvonne Fletcher’s death, expressed its deep regrets to her mother, and paid compensation.”

    Who says the SAS are looking for PC Fletcher’s killer – Oh yes, ‘The London Evening Standard…’ Last I heard the SAS had left Bani Walid and were complaining about ‘f*cking sand in everything.

  107. Demonization of Colonel Khaddafy[sic]
    .
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q11R56Y0Dx4
    .
    Sadly the video lacks credible evidence so is disregarded by majority. Further video sources are required like these three.
    .
    youtube.com/watch?v=uxMs-t76X58
    .
    youtube.com/watch?v=qogT-DDKHgQ
    .
    youtube.com/watch?v=17H0pG7Yxw8

  108. Otp.informationdesk@icc-cpi.int

    NATO members that have been participating in air strikes in Libya include France, Britain, the United States, Canada, Denmark, Belgium, Netherlands, and Italy.
    .
    I would like to make formal charges against the NATO alliance for war crimes committed in Libya.
    .
    France, Britain, United States, Canada, Denmark, Belgium, Netherlands and Italy are joint members of the NATO alliance, and have all broken their UN mandate, and committed a catalogue of war crimes in Libya.
    .
    Because of their influence over the main stream press in my country (UK), I cannot even give a full and complete list of their crimes.
    But the following crimes are documented, and I demand that the ICC take appropriate action, and have the leaders of the NATO alliance charged with these heinous crimes.
    .
    13 May 2011: The murder of 11 Muslim Imams in Brega.
    .
    30 April 2011: The bombing of the Downs Syndrome School in Tripoli
    .
    30 April 2011: The bombing of a Gaddafi residence, murdering Saif Gaddafi, his friend and 3 Gaddafi children.
    .
    12 June 2011: The bombing of the University of Tripoli. Death toll not yet established.
    .
    22 July 2011: The bombing of the Great Man made Waterway irrigation system, which supplies most Libyans with their drinking water.
    .
    23 July 2011: The bombing of the factory which makes the pipes for the water system, and the murder of 6 of its employees.
    .
    8th August 2011: The bombing of the Hospital at Zliten. Resulting in the murder of a minimum, of 50 human beings, many of them children. The bombing of hospitals is against all international laws, and a most grievous crime.
    .
    9 August 2011: The bombing of the village of Majer, resulting in the murder of 85 civilians. 33 Children, 32 women and 20 men.
    .
    The persistent on going bombing of the civilian population in Zliten and Tripoli, death toll not yet established. NATO are committing genocide and I DEMAND that the ICC address this matter with urgency.
    .
    David Cameron has admitted that UK special services have assisted the terrorists on the ground, this is against the UN mandate which allowed NATO to intervene in Libya, and is a war crime.
    .
    Many of the rebels have been identified as Al Qeada members, NATO working with known terrorists is a war crime, and against all international laws.
    .
    It is also my belief that NATO lied about their reasons for invading Libya, I demand that the ICC investigate these lies, and hold the NATO alliance responsible.
    .
    I also charge the ICC with working with NATO to spread propaganda and fear among the Libyan people, namely by announcing that the NTC had in their custody Saif al Islam Gaddafi and Muhammad Gaddafi, the night the terrorists (NTC) entered Tripoli. This was lies, and clearly shows collusion between the TNC terrorists and the ICC.
    Libya is not Afghanistan or Iraq, and NATO will be held accountable for their crimes in Libya.
    .
    As this is a matter of great urgency, I demand that the ICC address these charges immediately, as the genocide is on going.
    .
    I am not a lawyer, and I have no legal training, but as a citizen of the UK & EU I demand justice. NATO are acting illegally, UK tax money is financing this travesty, and under EU and international law the ICC must deal with the charges I have documented, with the utmost seriousness.
    .
    Yours Sincerely Sandra Barr
    .
    http://www.facebook.com/notes/sandra-barr/charging-nato-with-war-crimes/10150299952068781

  109. Otp.informationdesk@icc-cpi.int
    .
    NATO members that have been participating in air strikes in Libya include France, Britain, the United States, Canada, Denmark, Belgium, Netherlands, and Italy.
    .
    I would like to make formal charges against the NATO alliance for war crimes committed in Libya.
    .
    France, Britain, United States, Canada, Denmark, Belgium, Netherlands and Italy are joint members of the NATO alliance, and have all broken their UN mandate, and committed a catalogue of war crimes in Libya.
    .
    Because of their influence over the main stream press in my country (UK), I cannot even give a full and complete list of their crimes.
    But the following crimes are documented, and I demand that the ICC take appropriate action, and have the leaders of the NATO alliance charged with these heinous crimes.
    .
    13 May 2011: The murder of 11 Muslim Imams in Brega.
    .
    30 April 2011: The bombing of the Downs Syndrome School in Tripoli
    .
    30 April 2011: The bombing of a Gaddafi residence, murdering Saif Gaddafi, his friend and 3 Gaddafi children.
    .
    12 June 2011: The bombing of the University of Tripoli. Death toll not yet established.
    .
    22 July 2011: The bombing of the Great Man made Waterway irrigation system, which supplies most Libyans with their drinking water.
    .
    23 July 2011: The bombing of the factory which makes the pipes for the water system, and the murder of 6 of its employees.
    .
    8th August 2011: The bombing of the Hospital at Zliten. Resulting in the murder of a minimum, of 50 human beings, many of them children. The bombing of hospitals is against all international laws, and a most grievous crime.
    .
    9 August 2011: The bombing of the village of Majer, resulting in the murder of 85 civilians. 33 Children, 32 women and 20 men.
    .
    The persistent on going bombing of the civilian population in Zliten and Tripoli, death toll not yet established. NATO are committing genocide and I DEMAND that the ICC address this matter with urgency.
    .
    David Cameron has admitted that UK special services have assisted the terrorists on the ground, this is against the UN mandate which allowed NATO to intervene in Libya, and is a war crime.
    .
    Many of the rebels have been identified as Al Qeada members, NATO working with known terrorists is a war crime, and against all international laws.
    .
    It is also my belief that NATO lied about their reasons for invading Libya, I demand that the ICC investigate these lies, and hold the NATO alliance responsible.
    .
    I also charge the ICC with working with NATO to spread propaganda and fear among the Libyan people, namely by announcing that the NTC had in their custody Saif al Islam Gaddafi and Muhammad Gaddafi, the night the terrorists (NTC) entered Tripoli. This was lies, and clearly shows collusion between the TNC terrorists and the ICC.
    Libya is not Afghanistan or Iraq, and NATO will be held accountable for their crimes in Libya.
    .
    As this is a matter of great urgency, I demand that the ICC address these charges immediately, as the genocide is on going.
    .
    I am not a lawyer, and I have no legal training, but as a citizen of the UK & EU I demand justice. NATO are acting illegally, UK tax money is financing this travesty, and under EU and international law the ICC must deal with the charges I have documented, with the utmost seriousness.
    .
    Yours Sincerely Sandra Barr
    .
    facebook.com/notes/sandra-barr/charging-nato-with-war-crimes/10150299952068781

  110. An illustration here of the massive power of the UK Jewish lobby. How many of us can bring influence to bear on a Minister or a Government department to make them deny the truth?

    .
    UK: Minister says ‘wall is a land grab’– and is censored by Israel lobby
    .
    http://alethonews.wordpress.com/2011/08/30/uk-minister-says-%e2%80%98wall-is-a-land-grab%e2%80%99%e2%80%93-and-is-censored-by-israel-

  111. Thank you Mark for letting us know about that lady who is standing up for the truth, and for justice, although the latter is very hard to obtain in this country unless you are rich and powerful.

  112. Vanessa Redgrave is another woman whom I greatly admire. She has humanity within her. She was able to deal very well with the local BBC and ITV news presenters who were trying to talk her down last night and not allowing her to make her points.
    .
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/aug/31/dale-farm-travellers-planning
    .
    Dale Farm Travellers seek more time for planning applicationsHigh court decides whether to issue 28-day injunction against eviction notice issued by Basildon council
    .
    Patrick Barkham guardian.co.uk, Wednesday 31 August 2011 11.48 BST
    .Dale Farm campaigner Grattan Puxton (left) and actor Vanessa Redgrave (right) meet members of the McCarthy family at the site in Basildon, Essex. Photograph: Ian Nicholson/PA
    .
    Almost half the residents of Dale Farm could find legal homes nearby if Basildon council would consider two planning applications, Traveller supporters said before asking a high court judge to suspend evictions at the Essex site.
    .
    An emergency injunction is being sought against the eviction notice to more than 80 families living on the outskirts of Basildon to allow applications to be considered for smaller sites on brownfield land owned by the government, one of which is within sight of Dale Farm.
    .
    The high court will decide on Wednesday whether to issue a 28-day injunction against the eviction notice issued by Basildon borough council.

    ~~~

    Remember the Third Reich and the Roma?

  113. Remember how rendition flights were allowed to use Scottish airports and also Shannon? Also for delivering prisoners to Guantanamo?
    .
    Reprieve, a group that fights for prisoners denied justice in the name of the “war on terror”, will tell Mr MacAskill that 24 CIA jets stopped to refuel on Scottish soil at least 107 times between 2001 and 2005.’ {http://news.scotsman.com/ciatortureflights/CIA-torturers-passed-through-Scotland.3319950.jp}
    .
    How US firms profited from torture flights
    Court documents illustrate how US contracted out secret rendition transportation to a network of private companies
    .
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/aug/31/us-firms-torture-flights-rendition
    .
    As memories of this grotesque horror dim, we read that Israel is awarding Blair a medal for his efforts in the peace process. Orwell lives.

  114. I liked this story. It is a wonder that Little Dukdukdiyan the hummingbird was not incinerated by a NATO Hellfire missile.
    .
    http://libyasos.blogspot.com/2011/08/flight-of-hummingbird.html

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