Would you like to be shot with a red gun or blue gun, sir? That is the limit of the choice being offered the UK electorate as New Labour announces it will keep the Coalition public spending plans and the Coalition benefit cuts. Given it will also throw away £100 billion on Trident, and New Labour initiated the rampant privatisation of the Health Service, PFI, Tuition Fees etc., my point could not have been more eloquently proven that the UK electorate is no longer offered any meaningful choice by the neo-con parties.
It also of course demolishes completely the Gordon Brown argument that Scots need to stay in the Union to put New Labour in to power. Who carries out Tory policies is not the question; and why a nation should surrender its freedom just to make sure Ed Balls has a ministerial car and salary while he implements Tory policies, is not a question which to me has an obvious answer.
The only meaningful political choice any part of the UK population will have in the foreseeable future is the Scottish Independence Referendum. If Scots do not take their chance, all they have ahead is economic decline and the collapse of public services. The choice could not be more stark.
Fred
Will you be voting in the referendum then ?
H
As I am sure you know, lex sanguinis is not applicable in the EU. Germany was forced, quite rightly, to change its immigration laws as racist. I suspect that Scotland’s nationality law will be remarkably similar to that of the UK. The variation in nationality laws between EU states is actually not that wide.
The British empire is finished therefore the union between Scotland and England is finished.It’s as straightforward as that.
Vote Yes 2014.
“Fuck all nations.” N_
Reminds me of the imperative version of Bill Bragg, as in,
“I’ve had relaytions
With gerls from many naytions…”
And then, in not dissimilar vein, one has Tony, with his apetising,
“Its The Only Thing My Wife and I Know, That Works Brilliantly Against Thrush.”
Ah, this blog is an excellent political blog, but also at times is joyously and affectionately insane!
The love – it must be love – b/w Habbabkuk (no doubt a culinary sibling of Captain Kebabhook and Major Yakultbook?) and April Showers/Flaming June (even the names are suggestive of a porn movie) is most touching.
In the spirit, then, of Ogden Nash, goodnight, all. Sleep tight. Don’t forget to eat your yoghurt and dream of Humphrey Boggart.
@Fred
“Scotland leaving Britain would be more like Texas leaving the United States.”
OK. Fine. The election data. It’s all there if you care to look and see how much *say* Scotland has in governance. It’s been explained often enough. If you haven’t seen the data then any wise person would advise hauding yer wheesht tae ye hiv.
On to the Texas thing. Let’s pretend we accept your idea of Scotland being like Texas. What evidence is it you would require to justify Scotland, or Texas leaving the Union? Would that be… hmmmm let’s see… a democratic Yes vote? I thought so. That’s right. A democratic vote. Until we have that vote how else will you know what Scots want? They did after all elect the SNP to govern… and SNP party that had in it’s manifesto…. now why would Scots vote for a party promising policies the Scots don’t want? They voted for a party promising a referendum. That party won. That party is holding the referendum, asking the Scots if they would prefer Independence. But you know how the Scots will vote in 2014? That’ a fine shiny Tardis you’ve got there, isn’t it! Can you take me to 2024 please? That’s when I retire and I’d like my bus pass early.
Thanks.
(Minor interesting aside for old readers: the latest Al-Hilli thread has recently gone through the 15K barrier).
@Helen
Your analogy about America getting independence still sucks as the descendants of the few Americans we didn’t kill are mostly living on reservations, they didn’t even get the right to vote till 1965.
People in Scotland get the same representation in Westminster as any other geographical region, constituencies are based on head of population. That’s how a democracy works. Plus they get their own parliament at enormous expense.
I don’t need a crystal ball because nice people do surveys and ask people how they would vote, like the one just done by the University of Edinburgh which showed 60% of 14 to 17 year olds would vote against compared to 21% for.
What is the real support for independence now?
Is there any way the pro-independence blogs joined forces to do a reliable poll themselves without involving any of the polling companies?
It is unbelieavable that 70% don’t support independence or don’t care, given that that they will be shot by either a blue or red or purple gun in the event of a no vote.
“Is there any way the pro-independence blogs joined forces to do a reliable poll themselves without involving any of the polling companies?”
The whole idea of using polling companies is that they are independent and unbiased therefore the result is reliable.
I’m sure your pro independence blogs could take a poll and make it say just what they wanted it to say but nobody would take any notice of it.
Actually it surprised me how many young people have the sense to see through Salmonds propaganda, think it surprised him too. Wonder if he will still go ahead with letting 16 year olds vote now it seems they aren’t as stupid as he thought they were.
I would agree to Scottish independence if Scotland voted to work towards a transitional RBE economic model.
Else Scotland will remain standing, status in quo complete with the usual fiat philosophy of selfishness, greed and increasing fiscal divide between the haves and the have nots.
OK that said let’s get to the ‘spondulie’ and consider the bread before it goes stale.
If Scotland joined the Euro, then hey-! fiscal decisions are taken away from Scotland and Scotland would face the same
cock-up’s,constraints in ensuring economic stability as other small euro area Member States (Greece?).A new Scottish currency will ensure
Scotland is screwedhigher transaction costs and a Scottish flight to hold assets in an established currency. Of course Scotland could print it’s own money out of thin air. (même vieux même vieux =fiat collapse).Scotland could use sterling with or without formal agreement. In both recipes England would shaft/fleece a Scotland without control and at severe financial risk.
Thus the fiscal or rather the monetary route is a blind alley, a stumbling block for the wary Jock Tamson’s bairns. Advice you won’t see in the 16yrs+ referendum teacher packs
The Al Hilli thread has become almost a blog-within-a-blog. However, its continuing active existence does remind one that that crime has yet to be solved and that unlike, say, the murders of Alexander Litvinenko and Gareth Williams, it seems to have been put by the MSM on the most posterior of back-burners. No investigative journalists appears to be pursuing the case – or at least, if they are, they are not reporting on it. Might it be that, in the context of the mass murder of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis and others across the Middle East over the past 10 years in various configurations of conflict, pursuing information relating to the deaths of a few more “wogs”/”ragheads”/”sand-niggers”, etc. is deemed by the MSM to be of strictly limited public interest? In that context, we ought to be grateful to the bloggers who continue to post on that particular thread for at the very least, keeping the case in the public eye.
The coroner in the Litvinenko inquest that never was has asked for a public inquiry. Some long grass is required into which the ball can be kicked.
Coroner requests public inquiry into Litvinenko death
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22786081
Another tough guy busy bashing the shit out of the poor, and showing how he can help the rich to keep paying less taxes, keep the Trident, and help the banksters. Boy how spoilt for choice are we in our selectoral demokracy?
@Suhayl
I agree our derogatory language is shameful, cheap, and pointless and is entirely demeaning only serving sinful aims.
Rasicm in the context of immigratiin policy as Craig puts “as racist“.
So to preserve a racial and cultural heritage in the sub-structure of human race is racist therefore wrong.
There is very little comment on the burning down of the Islamic centre in Muswell Hill yesterday. Imagine if it was a synagogue or a building belonging to another religion.
Oh dear, Suhayl, you’re at it again. In your rushed early morning effort at finding racism, you have overlooked the documentary “Alps Murders” scheduled for broadcast this evening on Channel 4, and articles about the Al Hilli case appearing in the Guardian, Express and Telegraph in recent days.
Flaming June:
Suhayl Saadi:
This is the “new normal” (the heady days of Miranda aka Emily aka Tonykins aka bLiar), the daily rituals of two minutes hate are coming to fruition and no one wants to lose momentum. Thus the quiet and “reserved” approach of the Media.
For certain there are those on this board and elsewhere, whom are rejoicing at the notion of the “Mozy” getting their arse kicked, and hoping come the Kristallnacht II these “Mozy scum” will be carted off to the concentration camps (economy is tanking and needs slave labour).
Sickening, isn’t it?
Well as a raging Nationalist, I wait for the day I can dig out my kilt, paint myself up with a bit of woad and sharpen the Claymore. Not that I would actually do anyone harm, but it will be a hell of a party !
Hopefully we’ll get independence, not because I have anything against the English but at least we will be able to have a proper identity as a country which should benefit everyone in the current UK. There are already issues with English people thinking there in a different country when they are handed Scottish notes as change and regularly demand English notes, whenever a BBC presenter refers to the north of the country they are usually speaking about Newcastle or Liverpool, the English think the Scots are leeching off them and the Scots think London is leeching of Scotland. The last point helps the powers that be keep us all divided and bickering amongst ourselves just as the Edinburgh, Glasgow divide is used in the same manner (Glasgow’s the capital city because it’s the biggest, no Edinburgh is, no Perth is etc, etc , etc).
When it comes to Alex Salmond and whether the SNP can lead the country it doesn’t matter, as soon as Independence is achieved there will then be Labour, Conservative, Liberal Democrats, SNP all running on a new playing field and a new election will probably have to take place almost immediately so that the democratic process can appear to be working.
The Queen will still be head of state because she isn’t going to let us be independent without keeping control so we will be able to join the commonwealth, if we ever have to leave.
International finance will get involved and things could either go well or badly but at least people would only have to march on Holyrood to throw the a**holes out, which would be far more likely than them ever marching down to London.
@MJones…well structured post. Don’t know about Er Maj and the rest of the parasites. I suppose if we can keep Air Miles Andy off the golf courses, I would be happy with that. Can Er Maj actually keep control ? Not if we are an independant country and we don’t want her, or that prat Charles and his horsy wife either. Personally I would prefer Harry. He would be far too busy getting hammered in Edinburgh pubs and chasing Uni students to do any real harm.
@MJones
You are coming out with all the rubbish that generates racial hatred of the English in Scotland. If Scotland is north why do they call the top of it Sutherland? Because it was south to the Vikings who named it. People round where I live call Edinburgh south, I have never heard an English person complain about it. Why do commentators talk about the Lowlands? They aren’t as low as Norfolk.
Nobody has to accept Scottish bank notes, they are not legal tender. The reason on why some businesses in England don’t want to accept them is because people forge them then try to pass them on in England where people aren’t familiar with them, you can’t expect a shopkeeper in England to familiarise themselves with every Scottish bank note, there are so many different ones.
http://www.bexhillobserver.net/news/bexhill-news/beware-of-fake-20-scottish-banknotes-1-4695519
I once asked a barmaid in Leeds if she accepted Scottish notes, “all except Clydesdale” she replied “Clydesdale charge my bank to exchange them back to sterling”
I see the Nationalist propaganda machine is at it again with the headline “Scottish independence: Scotland and UK could be ‘closest of allies'”
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-22790613
That isn’t going to happen, it won’t happen because so many Scots are being encouraged to hate the English and I have no doubt that should Scotland become independent it won’t be long before Salmond is giving the people of England reason to hate the Scots.
Indigo
5 Jun, 2013 – 11:08 am
“The answer in Scotland has to lie with getting the media on board and somehow getting the message across. How that is achieved with BBC Scotland dominating the airwaves I just don’t know … wish I did.”
Join the YES campaign the largest participative campaign ever in Scotland. This will eventually overcome the establishment controlled media. Don’t believe the polls, in the day’s before the 2007 elections to the Scottish Parliament the BBC issued a poll showing Labour winning by 14% the SNP ended up beating Labour. In 2011 the SNP thrashed Labour they won an overall majority in a system designed to stop that happening. The polls issued by the BBC and the remainder of the media showed Labour winning up untill a few weeks before the election.
There are cracks apearing in the Unionist camp. read John Macallion’s article in Newsnetscotland.
http://newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-opinion/7521-cracks-in-labour-support-for-better-together-are-widening
http://www.yesscotland.net/
Fred may find that this clarifies his thinking on Scottish banknotes…but clarifying his thinking would be a big ask IMO.
http://www.scotbanks.org.uk/legal_position.php
It’s not that the three Scots banks concerned don’t try to help easily-confused English shopkeepers:
“…in Scotland three Banks – Bank of Scotland, Clydesdale Bank and The Royal Bank of Scotland – are still allowed to issue banknotes.
The Scottish banks issue notes in denominations of £5, £10, £20, £50 and £100. Only the Royal Bank of Scotland continues to issue a small volume of £1 notes. Information about the legal position with regard to Scottish banknotes can be obtained by selecting “Legal Position” from the menu on the left of your screen.
To aid identification the Scottish banks have all agreed to issue notes of specific value in the same predominant colour. Thus £5 notes are blue, £10 notes are brown, £20 notes are maroon/purple, £50 notes are green and £100 notes are red.”
And if you live north of Edinburgh, Fred, and voice the generalised slanders that you repeat incessantly here, it’s no vast surprise to me that you are loathed and shunned by decent Scots when you put your blethering neb oot the door. But not because you are English. Because you’re an [epithet deleted because this is a nice blog -K]
Errrrmm Scottish banknotes are legal tender !
O/T
Scotland
On a day when Hague/Kerry have shipped Shi’a troops from Baghdad, kitted them out in Hizbullah colours, and routed their darling AlQaida’s competitors FSA and the people of AlQusayr, we are talking about CIA-smoked Salmond.
The manipulators of Muslim countries sitting in Jerusalem Washington and London need the stooge they need delivered by their mercenaries of choice. To tick all boxes the stooge will probably be a lady from the Muslim Brotherhood.
It just goes to show that you tickle anybody you like to fanatasise about freedom, even seasoned diplomats and Syrian freedom fighters. Then you give them what suits the NWO masters.
Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose, or whatever the equivalent is in your language.
“And if you live north of Edinburgh, Fred, and voice the generalised slanders that you repeat incessantly here, it’s no vast surprise to me that you are loathed and shunned by decent Scots when you put your blethering neb oot the door. But not because you are English. Because you’re an [epithet deleted because this is a nice blog -K]”
Oh I’m not loathed and shunned by the decent Scots, it’s only the racist bastards like you I have problems with.
Try writing what you just wrote about a Pakistani and see where it gets you.
The only folk i see posting racial hatred in the independence debate are Unionists like Fred.
“Errrrmm Scottish banknotes are legal tender !”
No they aren’t, I said they weren’t then Komodo posted a link proving they weren’t pretending it said something different.
Look Scottish notes are not commonplace in England, shops out of tourist areas can go years without seeing one, there are three notes of each denomination from three banks and there are forgeries, it’s plain common sense that a shopkeeper wouldn’t accept one when he doesn’t have to.
How come the Nationalists are using this to stir up racial hatred?
“The only folk i see posting racial hatred in the independence debate are Unionists like Fred.”
Why would a Unionist be wanting to stir up racial hatred?
Fred
The view I was trying to show was that Great Britain doesn’t really work as a country and it has nothing to do with racism or hatred. From a Scottish perspective I watch the BBC (BRITISH Broadcasting Corporation) and expect them to class Thurso or Aberdeen as the North of Britain because that is the north of Britain
There has always been confusion as to what is being discussed at a national level as certain English people use the two terms Great Britain and England to mean the same thing and it seems only since devolution that they are being corrected on radio or television as there is now a clear legal difference.
You talk about me sounding racist but all of these small discrepancies amount to the fact the English don’t want to recognise Scotland as a country which to someone who is Scottish is extremely insulting and demeaning.
The English have only started identifying the St George cross as their national flag in the last 10 years maybe, they always use to use the Union Jack when I was growing up again not recognising that it wasn’t an English flag but the flag of England, Wales and Scotland combined.
When you talk about the Scottish being encouraged to hate the English what you are actually discussing is the little things over the years that have happened in Scotland under rule from London such as the poll tax, trident, etc, take your pick, where it appears that and the English government treats Scotland as some kind of testing ground or backwater to be used and abused. The people of Scotland know that Charles the pub landlord or Peter the plumber has nothing to do with these decisions and hold nothing against them.
It may be part of the Scottish culture to hate the English just as it is in England to hate the French or Germans but this is something else and nothing to do with independence. If anything independence would probably bring us closer together because we would see ourselves as two distinct countries, both speaking the same language, on the same island and the joke would be “ooh, remember when we used to rule you, ho, ho, ho” instead of “ooh your just a bunch of alcoholic blah, blah, blah”