We’re Not Dead Yet

by craig on July 15, 2013 11:08 am in Uncategorized

Many thanks for all the very kind messages.  I appear to be back on full  fighting form again and will resume blogging shortly.

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344 Comments

  1. Great news and have a swift recovery Craig!

  2. Great news!

  3. Great news! Relax and enjoy the sun!

  4. Much to the chagrin of the plutocrats, oligarchs, and the coattail hangers thereof, you have made it and comeback. Glad to hear you are OK. Wish you a full recovery and good health.

  5. Beeston Regis

    15 Jul, 2013 - 11:40 am

    Get well soon n all that!

  6. Glad you’re OK and thanks for letting us know.

  7. Excellent news Craig. You have been sorely missed.

    (btw in the replay of Murder in Samarkand on Radio 4 Extra, I was reminded that you had an injury to your calf muscle when you were in Tashkent. Hope that it never recurred.)

  8. Excellent – hope you recover quickly and this treatment really does fix whatever the problem was.

  9. Glad you are back, and I hope we have a discussion about the Anglo-American disposition matrix in all its ramifications.

  10. Uzbek in the UK

    15 Jul, 2013 - 12:40 pm

    Glad you are back Mr Murray. Take good care of yourself.

  11. Congrats!! I’m looking forward to it as I am sure are many others.

  12. Uzbek in the UK

    15 Jul, 2013 - 12:43 pm

    While you were away:

    It is reported that diplomatic immunity was removed from Gulnara Karimova by Uzbek Foreign Affairs Ministry. This is something that puzzled many as this would not have happen without authorisation from her father.

  13. Well done, Craig. You’ve passed the first test of survival – ie not dying. Don’t worry about the blog, I’ve found a backdoor in your system that allows me to delete posts as if by Jon.

  14. Thanks, Jemand. That explains it.

  15. Excellent news.

    Noli spurios te contundere!

  16. Oh good. I’d only just blundered in here and I was beginning to enjoy it in an indignant kind of way.

  17. Good to have you back in circulation again. Take time to recover fully.

  18. Uzbek:

    Her immunity comes with the job she’s just been removed from:

    http://www.eurasianet.org/node/67246

    I’d guess she was kicked out by / at the request of the UN, rather than her old man.

    Moral, perhaps – whoever else you rip off, don’t screw with Russians?

  19. Analysis of Karimova’s possible fall from grace:

    http://atimes.com/atimes/Central_Asia/CEN-01-170613.html

  20. [Mod/Jon: commentary about contributors wishing to censor the comments aren't helpful, please keep it constructive]

  21. Alhamdulillah.

  22. Quite poor censoring, Jon, as Jemand said it allows him to delete posts as if he were you – something he has apparently done – not that he was just wishing to do so.

  23. Trowbridge, in retrospect I probably didn’t need to remove your comment, but it’s worth noting that Cracker Jemand was joking :)

    Good to have you back, Craig.

  24. Glad to hear you are recovering well, Craig! :)

    Quick question: have you ever come across a state which runs a consulate at its own airport?

    That’s what Russia does at Sheremetevo airport in Moscow.

  25. Some actions are not to be joked about, like the names of the Asiana pilots involved in the crash at SFO.

  26. Don’t rush it… get better properly before you throw yourself back into your hectic life.

  27. A good day just got even better!

    Great to hear you’re on the way back to us Craig. I’ve missed your observations and can’t wait to see you posting again.

    But be sure to take it easy, let the healing take root and enjoy good company.

    No danger of us all falling silent in the meantime.

  28. What a stretch Trowbridge. If the pilots had been able to stretch even fractionally to yours, it would’ve been an ordinary smooth landing.
    ——
    Health is everything Craig. One takes it for granted until one becomes ill. But then in recovery a new inner intelligence of listening to one’s body can come into being. Stay well now.

    I’m starting my own new stage of a health-kick at 7am tomorrow. Famous last words.

  29. sorry to hear you havent been so well. You were certainly on good form at the Musselburgh meeting. Hope its one of many still to come.

  30. Uzbek in the UK

    15 Jul, 2013 - 3:51 pm

    I am afraid this could be more serious than ‘not screwing Russians’. Gulnara has many powerful opponents inside Uzbekistan but they were dormant until quite recently. It is rumoured that Gulnara and her father have different views on succession (of her father). She wants to be become next on his throne whereas he (quite rightfully) understands that her power comes with his presidency and on her own she will face many challenges and will ultimately fail to preserve balance of power in clan politics.

  31. Trowbridge, I’m sorry that I deleted your post, but I had to because it was too controversial. You do realise that all of ‘Jon’s’ posts explaining deletes, are mine, don’t you?

    Anyway, thanks Komodo for the links to news of Gulnara Karimova’s descent into political obscurity. Hopefully she will be able to avoid an unfortunate car accident before releasing her next album, tentatively titled “Rainbows and Cotton Fields”. One dollar from every million album sales will be donated to a worthy charity administered by Googoosha herself and deposited in a safe Swiss bank account to ensure compliance with financial regulations.

  32. Uzbek in the UK

    15 Jul, 2013 - 4:00 pm

    Jemand

    I do not think that assassination of Uzbek princess is on the table. Not at least until her father is on the throne, and least likely after that. It is unlikely that she will succeed him and it is very likely that she will emigrate (after her father is removed from Ok-Saroy legs forward) and live peacefully in one of her many multimillion mansions.

  33. I’m not the one stretching, Villager. Jemand said he was censoring what appears here – a most destructive claim for the site, if true.

    Asiana is taking the Fox TV station in Oakland to court for damaging it and its pilots – what is bound to reveal who gave the word to the NTSB intern in Washington to corroborate the vile rumor, and if it is his boss, its report will require only stretching.

  34. Oh, I see, Jemand, engaging in more of your so-called joking.

    Either you are gone, or I am!

  35. Jemand:

    I trust you can see what I just deleted here. Urgently, please. The NSA is getting impatient.

  36. Good God, what a weird site….

    Wait for the advertising to subside for a less publicised activity of the fragrant Gulnara:

    http://www.anorak.co.uk/340260/celebrities/gulnara-karimova-the-yoga-photos.html/

  37. Komodo, you are either serious, or you are joking. I’m assuming that you are somewhere in between – seriously joking or joking about being serious. Either way, the deletions you claimed to have made are, in actual fact of reality, very very real and this is no joking matter, as Trowbridge has correctly observed. Seriously! Forget the NSA, that’s just a front for something much much bigger. I’ll reveal more when it’s safe to do so. I’m assuming Craig uses an encrypted line and Norton Home Security.

    On this topic of being serious, inter alia Craig’s irregular attention-seeking on health matters that we have all agreed are too expensive for the NHS, I want to raise the subject of quantum field lensing of naturally occurring cosmic rays, used by the US military to disrupt telegram communications in India. Google it, it’s real.

  38. Re Gulnara’s yoga poses. Hmmm, yes. Now if she would just bend her knees to the floor, that would do the trick.

  39. Ahh, yes.. No sooner said than done.

    http://www.anorak.co.uk/340260/celebrities/gulnara-karimova-the-yoga-photos.html/?pid=76911#img

    I hope this comment survives my current round of deletions.

  40. “Not dead yet”…

    Welcome back Craig – woefully missed.

    ATOS and austerity.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGFXGwHsD_A

  41. lucythediclonius

    15 Jul, 2013 - 4:59 pm

    excellent will this get through the spam filter

  42. great news Craig is getting better and the Canaries have signed Leroy Fer, a Dutch under 21 champion, can’t be bad.

    The cat with no name is still in limbo, stuck here in Rockland departure lounge without a visa. I asked Putin, but he says he has just got a cat to cheer up Ms. Kabayeva’s children.
    Its not that I’m desperate, but I did mention that I did not want a cat and rather have lots of other stuff on my mind recently.

    Shall now join Cryptonym for a holiday, anybody feeling able to look after an animal, get in touch with Clark please, I’m off

  43. Flaming June

    15 Jul, 2013 - 5:36 pm

    Hope Google Translate got this correct for me Nevermind.

    ‘Frohe Festtage und sichere Fahrten’

    Sorry I can’t help with that poor unwanted cat. My dog does not like cats.

  44. @ Craig,
    Pleased to hear that you are bouncing back.
    I can but ask:-
    What is your take on the Martin case in the US and how, if at all, might one relate the US case to that of Stephen Lawrence in the UK?
    For my part I have thought for a long while about this case:-
    1. America is not what it ought to be – coming from genocide against the Native Americans.
    2. America is not what it should be – advancing on the backs of the free labour of the Africans.
    3. America might be what it could be – integrating the brightest and the best from around the world along a path of global justice.
    And , I now lament the result of this case.
    I am not a lawyer qualified in, nor called to the Bar in the US. I am British trained and twice over qualified to practice law under British jurisprudence. That is what I know and do.
    I am aware that the US shares and has inherited the British Common Law system of justice. I have worked with American lawyers on cases and been in US courts and interfaced with experts and US lawyers over decades. Again – I am not a US trained attorney.
    However, my simple questions are:-
    - Night watchman told by 911 dispatcher to leave the youngster?
    - Night watchman, in cross-examination by the prosecution, found to have fabricated a story and is caught multiple times in his lies?
    - Night watchman pursues the youngster and makes comments that are recorded which reveal his preconceived notions about the youngster being a criminal ?
    - Night watchman makes claims about the incident and circumstances and provides video taped recounting of the events to the police, then is found to be significantly inconsistent in relation to his overall statements.
    - Night watchman pursues and stalks and confronts the youngster.
    - There is an altercation, that never would have happened if the dispatcher’s instructions had been followed.
    - Night watchman has, under US law, limited powers, and had been properly instructed by the 911 dispatcher.
    - Night watchman shoots and kills the unarmed 17 year youngster – and night watchman is a 28 year old man with martial arts training and weighs over 200 pounds relative to a “threatening” 160 or so pound kid?

    Well – American justice? – NOT GUILTY?

    Over to you.

    CB

  45. I hope you’ll recover and reeturn to shining your light on the injustices in our world. Thanks!

  46. Flaming June

    15 Jul, 2013 - 8:17 pm

    This, written by a Canadian I assume, chimes with some of what you say Courtenay.

    The (Florida) Law, Sir, Is an Ass
    by Bill Annett / July 14th, 2013
    http://dissidentvoice.org/2013/07/the-florida-law-sir-is-an-ass/

  47. @ Flaming June,

    “ Flaming June” – what a novel and attractive pseudonym.
    “ Flaming June” rides with Wild Bill Hicock on the blog trail. Great thought.
    Ha….just kidding.
    Cheers!
    Read it – thanks for sharing.
    CB

  48. Glad to hear you’re back. I wish you a speedy recovery – it’s always more speedy when surrounded by loved ones – and look forward to your next full post.

  49. Thanks be. Been looking for news, and am so glad to see this. Rest and be well.

  50. Flaming June

    15 Jul, 2013 - 9:22 pm

  51. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    15 Jul, 2013 - 10:23 pm

    Craig, it’s good to hear that you’re improving/improved. Best wishes for a full and speedy recovery.

  52. “I appear to be back on full fighting form again”

    Excellent news, Craig.

    May the road rise up to meet you.
    May the wind be always at your back.
    May the sun shine warm upon your face,
    and rains fall soft upon your fields.

    And all that jazz …

    Take it easy

  53. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    15 Jul, 2013 - 10:30 pm

    Glad to hear you’re fit as a fiddle, Craig….Give us a preview.

    On the Zimmerman trial, I’m afraid the jury had to find NG because of prevailing self-defense laws in Florida. When the prosecution and LE investigators screw the pooch there is nothing, other than jury nullification, for the jury to do except follow the elements of ‘reasonable doubt’. It’s a tragedy.
    However, the jury system is one part of the legal morass that I find little fault with.

  54. From the link I sent to Courtenay.

    ‘And yet the nonsense of George Zimmerman’s deliverance — like some junior grade St. John XXIII — goes much further. It’s the triumph of man-made law over god-given Justice.

    “Not guilty,” pronounced the six white (one possibly hispanic) female jurors, two of whom were married to lawyers and a third was the mother of a lawyer. (We might have guessed.) They might just as logically have declared George Zimmerman the best-dressed dude in the courtroom.’

    And Zimmerman’s Dad is a retired judge.

    This is a new piece about the case by Randy Shields on DV. http://dissidentvoice.org/2013/07/a-perfect-symmetry/

  55. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    15 Jul, 2013 - 10:50 pm

    The jury selection process and voir dire are quite fair as both parties can exclude jurors with a profile which may hinder their side. I don’t know about 6 jurors. It’s supposed to be a unanimous 12. That part bothers me, but the prosecution has many more tools and unlimited funds for their cause. It could be one of many mistakes the public prosecutor made.

  56. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    15 Jul, 2013 - 11:05 pm

    Some details on the jurors. Haven’t found why only 6. Probably austerity demands as many courts are going to digital recording of the trial to save money over court reporting.

    http://tamaratattles.com/2013/07/05/juror-descriptions-bios-voir-dire-statements-from-george-zimmerman-trial/

  57. I do not know the US law but thought the number was strange.
    Would the alternate jurors have been there to replace any of the main jurors going off sick or for some other reason?

    ‘The prosecuting and defense attorneys referred to the jury members as five white women and one black or Hispanic woman. CNN does not have access to the juror questionnaires and cannot confirm the ethnicities of the jurors.

    Four alternate jurors — two women and two men — will hear the case as well. Nelson asked Zimmerman if he agreed with the jurors selected to serve on the panel, and he said he did.’

    All-female jury to try Zimmerman
    http://edition.cnn.com/2013/06/20/justice/florida-zimmerman-trial

    Off now to attempt some sleep on a hot and humid night. Quite unusual in the UK these days!

  58. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    15 Jul, 2013 - 11:12 pm

    One selected juror was dismissed for unknown reasons, and yes they had alternates.

    This is the reason for 6….only in Florida.

    Williams v. Florida, a Supreme Court ruling in 1970, it was decided that at least six persons is “large enough to promote group deliberation, free from outside intimidation, and to provide a fair possibility for obtaining a cross-section of the community.”

  59. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    15 Jul, 2013 - 11:41 pm

    The light of day has always been an antiseptic. Why would anyone argue it isn’t good to air our Security State laundry? Go Edward….geevum.

    http://www.uscourts.gov/uscourts/courts/fisc/105b-g-07-01-rbw-signed-order-130715.pdf

  60. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    15 Jul, 2013 - 11:45 pm

  61. Many welcomes back, Craig! That was a brief sojourn indeed. (The longer your absence between posts, the more likely that dry rot sets into your blog, courtesy of the incessant Flaming Nora and her caustic adversaries. Back in the nick of time :-)

    You’ve often exposed examples of clandestine international bullying by hegemonic states, wrt Uzbekistan, Gitmo and Wikileaks. But now that the Snowden affair has completely pulled the pants off the intentions of the US administration, we can see that Obama has a stonking world-domination boner. It’s no longer a case of whether people recognise it, but whether they can smack the bloody thing back to flaccidity. I reckon Putin is playing a canny game by ignoring it. I’d be interested to hear your thoughts.

  62. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    15 Jul, 2013 - 11:54 pm

    Yes, Craig, you have been rather quiet about the SnowWald affair. Is this the first time you’ve heard this?

  63. A source has explained to me the close links between Israeli and Saudi intelligence. President of the Council of National Security Bandar bin Sultan is known to hold regular meetings with Israeli security chiefs in Riyadh, Tel Aviv, Arab and European capitals.

    Prince Bandar has a fat wallet with around $180,000 paid to British SAS trained mercenaries for terrorist training activities in Lebanon and Syria. (operating out of Dubai)

    The Bandar account was useful we remember for payments between January 2000 and the September 2001 to Saudi intelligence operatives al-Bayoumi and Basnan, handlers for September 11th 2001 hi-jackers Nawaf Alhazmi and Khalid Almihdar.

    http://www.larouchepub.com/other/2012/3929war_thrt_grows.html

  64. “Lord Advocate Frank Mulholland instructed Police witch-hunt against media leaks.”

    http://scottishlaw.blogspot.de/2013/07/lord-advocate-crown-office-target.html

    “Department of Justice memo codifies spying on the press”

    http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2013/07/15/memo-j15.html

    “Under conditions of deepening social inequality and with social tensions rising, Britain’s ruling elite are trampling on fundamental democratic rights like their counterparts in the United States and across Europe.”

    http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2013/07/15/jsa-j15.html

    “Like serfs in the dark ages, American citizens can be picked up on the authority of some unknown person in the executive branch and thrown in a dungeon, subject to torture, without any evidence ever being presented to a court or any information to the person’s relatives of his/her whereabouts.”

    http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2013/07/13/coup-detat-paul-craig-roberts/

  65. National Sheriff’s Association Releases Statement on Florida Neighborhood Watch Tragedy

    NSA has no information indicating the community has ever even registered with the program.

    http://www.lawofficer.com/article/news/national-sheriff-s-association-0

    “The Neighborhood Watch Program fosters collaboration and cooperation with the community and local law enforcement by encouraging citizens to be aware of what is going on in their communities and contact law enforcement if they suspect something – NOT take the law in their own hands,” continued Executive Director Kennard. “The alleged participant ignored everything the Neighborhood Watch Program stands for and it resulted in a young man losing his life. Our thoughts and prayers are with the family of Trayvon Martin during this terrible time.”

  66. The world is doing a decent job keeping the pressure on in Craig’s absence, preparing for the US government’s imminent disgrace in the most public forum in the world. The HRC’s preeminent independent legal experts are going to carve the US regime up like a turkey, in calm and dulcet tones, and everybody in the world can watch the video stream. The US government will go all out to keep the subject population unaware but the outside world will be watching very closely.

    Mobilizing shame. It dismantled the Warsaw Pact, and it will dismantle the NATO bloc.

  67. Great news, such a relief to hear that you are back in good health Craig.

  68. @ Flaming June and Ben Franklin,
    One said:-
    “One selected juror was dismissed for unknown reasons, and yes they had alternates.
    This is the reason for 6….only in Florida.
    Williams v. Florida, a Supreme Court ruling in 1970, it was decided that at least six persons is “large enough to promote group deliberation, free from outside intimidation, and to provide a fair possibility for obtaining a cross-section of the community.”
    Interestingly the historical jury base from England was 12. The larger the jury pool, the better the chance for a just verdict, was the original formulation.
    The lesser and halved in Martin’s case seems to have been manipulated for a conviction. We might contrast the verdict with the one below:-
    http://www.opposingviews.com/i/society/florida-mom-marissa-alexander-serve-20-years-firing-warning-shot-while-george-zimmermant
    What a fucked up and unjust world we live in.
    CB

  69. https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=SUJtMlEwd6Q#at=872

    Hey Craig, your book Murder in Samarkand got a mention on RT by Richard Stallman, about the case phone listening hacking.

  70. willyrobinson

    16 Jul, 2013 - 7:00 am

    Speedy recovery – w

  71. Great news.

  72. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 7:33 am

    See the provenance of P Charles’ private secretary who appeared before Mrs Hodge’s committee yesterday attempting to justify the fact that no capital gains or corporation taxes are paid by the ‘Duchy’ which is a £847m enterprise.

    Note his previous in the National Security Secretariat in the Cabinet Office. What is that Orwellian sounding office?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Nye_(courtier)

    ‘Top Charles aide William Nye defends Prince’s tax-exempt status
    William Nye claims Duchy of Cornwall’s £847m property empire is a ‘force for social good’

    The most senior aide to the Prince of Wales denied on Monday that the landed estate which pays the heir to the throne £19m a year is a “medieval anomaly” and insisted its tax-exempt status was not “unfair”.

    William Nye, the private secretary to Charles, told the House of Commons Public Accounts Committee that the Duchy of Cornwall, which presides over a £847m property empire, was a force for social good and could not be compared to a conventional corporation or commercial entity.

    The scrutiny of the Prince’s tax status, under which he voluntarily pays income tax on the Duchy’s annual surplus but the estate itself is exempt from capital gains and corporation taxes, follows stinging criticism by the same committee of tax avoidance by companies such as Amazon, Google and Starbucks.

    In a rare clash between the legislature and the Crown, Mr Nye was repeatedly asked to justify the status of the Duchy, established in the 14th century by Edward III to provide an income to the heir to the throne, as a “private estate”, despite being immersed in complex investments and property deals.

    The Independent revealed last month that among the Duchy’s recent and confidential investments on behalf of the famously aesthetic Prince Charles is a sprawling £38m supermarket distribution hub used by Waitrose in Milton Keynes.

    Research by Channel 4’s Dispatches programme shows that his mother, through the Crown Estate which holds land on behalf of the monarch, also owns an adjoining warehouse on the same industrial estate used as a distribution centre by John Lewis…..

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/top-charles-aide-william-nye-defends-princes-taxexempt-status-8710049.html

    We are not ‘all in in together’. We are the idiot serfs still doffing our forelocks.

    The council and advisory committees of the ‘Duchy’ consist mostly of the great and the good, landed gentry, bankers including Lord Rothschild, farmers and lawyers amongst others.

    http://www.duchyofcornwall.org/managementandfinances_structure_princescouncil.htm

  73. Good to see you up and about again…

  74. @ Nevermind:

    Its not that I’m desperate, but I did mention that I did not want a cat…

    I’m sorry to have to tell you this but your wishes are irrelevant. The cat is satisfied with its treatment and has graciously condescended to join you. You are now a cat- “owner”. Note the quotes.

    Now break out the quail-and-avocado Whiskas, bitch.

  75. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 8:37 am

    Remember Obama posing in a slave prison and at Robben Island?

    He should go down to Louisiana to the State Penitentiary which is called Angola Prison and inform himself of what is happening there under his watch.

    Two men have been locked up in solitary confinement for 36 years for crimes they did not commit. They are now confined in a maximum security dormitory. One of them Herman Wallace is 71 and has cancer.

    http://politicalprisonerradio.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/louisianas-continued-torture-of-71-yr.html

    http://www.angola3.org/thecase.aspx

    And we won’t mention Guantanamo.

  76. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 8:52 am

    Yes Komodo when you visit and get into conversation with the locals, you know that his name and that of the ‘duchy’ are dirty words. There is a feudal set up there with one of his bods installed in a fine house on St Mary’s.

    Totally feudal. See Bona Vacantia http://www.duchyofcornwall.eu/latest/

    and they bunged back a load of pdfs in answer to this FOI request.
    https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/minutes_and_correspondence_betwe_5

    Droit du seigneur does not seem to be applicable AFAIK!

  77. From a quick tour of the web, I’m getting the impression that Nye did a pisspoor job in front of the PAC – he’s on very shaky ground in continuing to maintain the Duchy is simply a private estate. He’s trying to dodge the right hander – if it’s not an estate, it’s a corporation and should pay tax – but the left hook is yet to come – if it is a private estate, why the fuck isn’t it subject to English law? And how come Charlie can veto Parliament?

  78. “From a quick tour of the web, I’m getting the impression that Nye did a pisspoor job in front of the PAC – he’s on very shaky ground in continuing to maintain the Duchy is simply a private estate. He’s trying to dodge the right hander – if it’s not an estate, it’s a corporation and should pay tax – but the left hook is yet to come – if it is a private estate, why the fuck isn’t it subject to English law? And how come Charlie can veto Parliament?”

    Don’t you know?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornish_nationalism

    It’s called Nationalism.

  79. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:28 am

    Saw this in the Guardian.

    David Kelly 10 years on
    Share 9

    The Guardian, Monday 15 July 2013 21.00 BST

    Tomorrow it will be 10 years since the suspicious death of the biological weapons scientist, Dr David Kelly. His death is a matter of continuing public and professional concern.

    Ten years after the Hillsborough disaster, the truth was still deeply concealed. Only recently, with the publication of the independent panel report, has the extent of the cover-up become recognised.

    Ten years after Dr Kelly’s death the truth is similarly concealed. As doctors, we have multiple serious concerns about the medical, forensic and other evidence supporting the official story that Dr Kelly committed suicide. We believe that there are serious deficiencies in the investigation of Dr Kelly’s death by Thames Valley police.

    In the interests of justice, both an inquest into Dr Kelly’s death and an Independent Police Complaints Commission investigation into what we consider to be a deficient and dishonest investigation by Thames Valley Police are required.

    Dr Andrew Watt, Dr Stephen Frost, Dr David Halpin, Dr Christopher Burns-Cox

  80. Fred, old son….granted the nationalists would like Cornwall to be independent, and given they’re under a feudal regime at the moment, they’ve got a case (Fred: -No they haven’t. They’re horrible antiEgnerland racists and should be put up against a beached whale and shot) given all that too, there’s a major anomaly here which affects the UK’s constitutional integrity. If it is to remain part of England , it should be subject to English law, or formally, as in the Isle of Man, conceded its own law, on a democratic rather than feudal basis. Even you should be able to see that having what is in effect a Norman hereditary despot running part of the UK on his own behalf isn’t quite the ideal for which our forefathers bled and died?

    Angarrack, linked by FJ above, is evidently a nationalist (yeah, yeah, Fred. You said that already. Probably an alcoholic too) but this point is valid from whatever POV you adopt, except, obviously, the Duke of Cornwall’s:

    In the Bruton v Duchy case, the judge dismissed out of hand representations made by the duchy to the effect that it was a private estate, even going so far as to say that duchy officers were “confused and unclear”. Having examined the circumstances of the duchy for a mere six weeks, even he could see that this patently false stance was untenable.[xvii]

    However, In spite of the court ruling that the duchy is an emanation of the state, the duchy and HM Government are both still insisting upon it being a ‘private estate’[xviii]. We cannot leave unchallenged a situation where the existence of a powerful constitutional component of the British Isles is strenuously denied in public but vigorously asserted in private.

  81. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:40 am

    It goes without saying that the ‘bean bag rounds’ being used by the LA Police that I reported about earlier have been used by the IDF in the ‘West Bank’.

    A report from 2011

    Tear Gas In Oakland Connects The 99 Percent To The West Bank’s Struggle For Freedomhttp://thinkprogress.org/special/2011/10/28/355372/tear-gas-oakland-west-bank-struggle/?mobile=nc

    The manufacturers are Defense Technology of Casper, Wyoming.
    http://www.defense-technology.com/specialty_impact.aspx
    ‘We Are Your Force Option’. HQ Jacksonville, Florida. Quite so.

  82. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:42 am

    Totally agree with Komodo on Cornwall etc. Off for a swim.

  83. Dr David Kelly – Thanks Mary – a comment took my attention:

    Dark actors are still at large and committing horrendous crimes whether it is against the Iranians, Syrians, Egyptians or other nations. Apart from their fatal and devastating part in the biological weapons they very willingly provided to Saddam to use against the young Iranian soldiers and a large community of Iraqi Kurds (Halabja), they are still committing devastating crimes against the whole population of Iran by starving them on daily basis with their criminal and inhumane sanctions using the pretext and convenient lies about Iran’s non-existent nuclear weapon program.

    David Kelly R.I.P.

  84. Sorry to have to break my silence already.

    Last night a prominent Norfolk anti incinerator campaigner had some problems with the police and some heavies, not all has come out yet. He had a heart attack after being beaten up and had his phone swiped and computer confiscated.

    If its of any interest I shall keep you informed.

    Now break out the quail-and-avocado Whiskas, bitch, Komodo wants you for breakfast, once you had yours.

  85. Look forward to Criag’s return.

    I am not sure if anybody has caught any recent statements from President Karimov. They are quite delusional. I think there will be quite a power struggle when he goes. It is certainly true that greed has caught up with Gulnara and her options are narrowing faster than her pop career is crashing.

  86. Nothing in your paper Nevermind except this about a cover up.

    Revised plan drawn up for Norfolk incinerator
    http://www.edp24.co.uk/news/politics/revised_plan_drawn_up_for_norfolk_incinerator_1_2279761

    What does Ms Chloe Smith have to say about it? Just imagine that Craig was the MP.

    I see that the usual gangsters-in-charge have their hands on Cory which was originally a coal and waste carrying company working on the Thames.

    In 1972 Ocean Group plc bought Cory.[33] In 1979 Cory bought Thames and General Lighterage, making Cory the largest waste carrier on the Thames.[33] In the 1980s Cory withdrew from coal and oil distribution to concentrate on waste transport and disposal.[47] In 1981 two Cory group companies were merged to form Cory Waste Management.[47] Cory Environmental Municipal Services Ltd was formed in 1989 and the two companies were merged as Cory Environmental in 1990.[47] In 1997 Cory Environmental grew by buying Local Authority Waste Disposal Companies from Essex County Council and Gloucestershire County Council. In 1999 Cory bought Parkhill Reclamation, increasing Cory’s presence in the West Midlands and North West England.[47]

    In 2000 Ocean Group plc merged with NFC plc to form Exel plc, which in 2005 sold Cory to Montagu Private Equity.[48] In March 2007 Montagu sold Cory to a consortium of investors consisting of ABN Amro Global Infrastructure Fund, Finpro SGPS and Santander Private Equity.[48]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cory_Environmental

    Cory Environmental http://www.coryenvironmental.co.uk/page/Seniormanagementteam.htm

  87. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 1:00 pm

  88. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 1:11 pm

    “Second question. Has she walked him down the aisle yet?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2245827/Minister-Chloe-Smith-proposes-boyfriend-Sandy-McFadzean-whirlwind-4-month-romance.html
    ___________

    How trivial. Surely this is an item for “Hello” magazine and not this blog?

  89. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 1:38 pm

    Perhaps it is not known by some here that Ms Smith was the successful candidate in a by election in which Craig also stood. We like to keep up with news about her such as her disastrous showing on a Newsnight programme and her previous employers Deloittes. The latter receive large amounts of remuneration from the ConDems. They are also Tory donors.

    eg
    City firm Deloitte picks up Government contracts worth nearly £7m after bankrolling the Tories

    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/city-firm-deloitte-picks-up-89118

    and that was two years ago. Probably a lot more is now going into their coffers with the NHS privatisation etc.

  90. That’s unionism for you (Fred)

    ok, it’s not funny, but couldn’t resist.

  91. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 2:39 pm

    @ Flaming June re. Chloe Smith :

    “We like to keep up with news about her such as her disastrous showing on a Newsnight programme and her previous employers Deloittes.”
    ______________

    Perhaps so, but your squib about her getting married is just tittle-tattle, isn’t it, and of no conceivable relevance to her as a politician.

    It’s the sort of “comment” which – multiplied by the dozen – cheapens this blog and is likely to have the normal reader scratching his or her head.

  92. “Fred, old son….granted the nationalists would like Cornwall to be independent, and given they’re under a feudal regime at the moment, they’ve got a case ”

    It pleases the Cornish nationalists to pretend that the County of Cornwall and the Duchy are one and the same and that this should grant Cornwall some special status but in the meantime places them under the well polished jackboot of the Heir to the Throne.

    The truth is that the Duchy actually owns very little of Cornwall and most of it’s properties are outside the county.

    http://www.duchyofcornwall.org/aroundtheduchy.htm

  93. The case of Michael Bruton -v- Information Commissioner and the Duchy of Cornwall and the Attorney General to HRH the Prince of Wales is also relevant to the Duchy’s claim to be providing a social benefit (see earlier posts).

    Bruton sought information under the Environmental Information Regulations,2004, regarding his concerns for a marine conservation area: “First, to ascertain whether
    consents or permissions had been given to the Fishery in the SAC. Second, to ascertain whether an environmental assessment had taken place before consents or permissions were given so as to ensure that there would be no detrimental environmental effects on the SAC. Mr Bruton feared that the Fishery was cultivating and harvesting predominantly non-native Pacific oysters of both the fertile diploid and triploid variety and he was concerned that it might have already introduced stocks to the SAC. Mr Bruton also believes that the oyster fishery involves dredging activities which may harm the site’s nature conservation objectives.”

    The oyster farm was operated by a tenant of Charles’s. The request (to the Duchy of Cornwall) was refused. On spurious grounds, as it turns out. Even HRH’s own personal Attorney-General, Jonathan Crow QC couldn’t make the Duchy’s case stand up.

    Crow – legal heavyweight -:
    http://www.4stonebuildings.com/barristers/jonathan-crow-qc.asp

    The tribunal’s judgement:

    http://www.informationtribunal.gov.uk/DBFiles/Decision/i600/20111206%20Decision%20&%20Ruling%20EA20100182.pdf

  94. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 3:12 pm

    I should place these recent posts about the Duchy of Cornwall under the rubric of the anti-Monarchy tendency which I think it’s fair to say is one of the articles of faith for most of the people who comment on this blog.

    I would however assume that most of those commenters would agreed on the need for some Head of State or other. If this is so, I’d be interested to hear their thoughts on how the Head of State should be chosen in the UK : should it be by direct universal suffrage (case of, eg, Vth republic France, USA) or should it be by Parliament (case of IIIrd and IVth republic France,Greece, Italy, etc)?

  95. Good news Craig, I wish you a swift recovery!

  96. Habby raises an interesting point.

    Should we choose our head of state by birth, as Habby prefers, or by vote?

    Anyway, whilst you’re all dwelling on that, let’s not forget that the issue Habby wants to divert attention from is actually Charlie boy’s very interesting tax arrangements.

    http://www.standard.co.uk/comment/comment/dan-jones-time-to-overhaul-prince-charless-feudal-tax-affairs-8710671.html

  97. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 3:39 pm

    Gross hypocrisy there about ‘cheapening this blog’ @ 2.39pm. Pots and kettles
    spring to mind.

    ~~~

    Here pots of money spring to mind. While many of the British citizenry are in dire straits and even penury, Goldman Sachs made profits of £1.86nbn in just three months and they are not alone.

    Goldman Sachs doubles profits to $1.86 billion – beating Wall Street estimates
    Goldman’s net income rose from $927 million to $1.86 billion, year-on-year

    ‘Goldman’s results echoed similar trends in the investment banking units of JPMorgan Chase & Co and Citigroup Inc, whose fixed-income trading businesses also benefited from increased client activity early in the quarter.’

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/goldman-sachs-doubles-profits-to-186-billion–beating-wall-street-estimates-8711189.html

  98. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 3:42 pm

    That was 1.86 billion dollar bills not 1.86 billion £1 coins. Can you picture the stacks?

  99. The PoW owns Cornwall in the same sense as HM owns most of the rest, Kempe.

    …the whole of Cornwall is a territorial possession not of the Queen in right of her Crown, [the government of the UK], but of the Duke in right of his Duchy [the desperately denied and hidden de jure instrument of Cornish governance]. The legal process is called bona vacantia [vacant goods] and it ensures that land reverts back to its presumptive, ultimate and absolute sovereign owner. The legal mechanisms are enshrined in the Administration of Estates Act 1925 [as amended] and the Companies Act 1985 [as amended]. Two Acts of Parliament that, we are told, are operated by the UK Government through its Treasury Solicitors legal department. However, regards bona vacantia, UK Treasury Solicitors has no jurisdiction in Cornwall.

    http://www.duchyofcornwall.eu/latest/?page_id=130

    (commentary)

    Both the Duchy of Cornwall and the Duchy of Lancaster—since 1399 held by the monarch in a personal capacity—have special legal rights not available to other landed estates: for example, the rules on bona vacantia, the right to ownerless property, operate in favour of the holders of the duchies rather than the Crown, such that the property of anyone who dies in the county of Cornwall without a will or identifiable heirs, and assets belonging to dissolved companies whose registered office was in Cornwall, pass to the duchy.[14][15] In 2007, £130,000 was realised from the right of bona vacantia. The duke owns freehold about three-fifths of the Cornish foreshore and the ‘fundus’, or bed, of navigable rivers and has right of wreck on all ships wrecked on Cornish shores, including those afloat offshore, and also to “Royal fish”, i.e. whales, porpoises, and sturgeon.[16] The Duchy of Cornwall is the Harbour Authority for St Mary’s Harbour.
    {Wiki}

    I’m not arguing for the Free Kernow lot. I’m arguing for constitutional consistency. And the argument goes well beyond Cornwall.

    Writing in the Guardian, lawyer David Gollancz commented that: “The duchy exercises a unique range of legal powers, which elsewhere are reserved for the crown…. It seems anomalous, and worrying, that such a huge estate, created and conferred by law and exercising significant legal powers, should be able to escape public scrutiny by calling itself a private estate.”[21] The requirement for the Prince of Wales to give consent to draft bills that could affect the interests of the Duchy of Cornwall is not a new power granted to Prince Charles, but a centuries-old parliamentary practice that involved the same requirement for consent being conferred on previous Dukes of Cornwall
    (Wiki)

    That’s not just parts of Cornwall, please note. Half of the Duchy’s 209 sq. miles of investment land is in Devon, and there’s more elsewhere. He pays bugger-all corporation tax on it, while paying personal tax, admittedly at the highest rate, on whatever he chooses to declare, in the strictest possible secrecy, to a trustworthy ear at HMRC. Bear in mind that his living expenses are tax-deductible against his job, which is being the Prince of Wales. For instance.

    He was in Bude for three hours yesterday. Hope you didn’t forget the Union Jack.

  100. Glad you’re feeling better, Craig. Here’s Chumbawanba to join me in welcoming you back:

    “We’ll be singing
    When we’re winning
    We’ll be singing

    I get knocked down
    But I get up again
    You’re never going to keep me down

    Pissing the night away
    Pissing the night away

    He drinks a whiskey drink
    He drinks a vodka drink
    He drinks a lager drink
    He drinks a cider drink”

  101. Anyway, whilst Habby exeunts backwards, bowing and scraping for gaudy trinkets, it’s probably worth revisiting Heathcote Williams’ celebration of our most glorious Faerie Queen:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jIukrdRhnpw

  102. Herbie 16 Jul, 2013 – 3:38 pm

    “Should we choose our head of state by birth, as Habby prefers, or by vote?”

    Neither. By lottery. Seriously.

  103. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 3:55 pm

    “direct universal suffrage” (USA) – not quite accurate on reflection because there is the Electoral College. But a good enough example of a system other than election by a Parliament (Congress for the USA)

  104. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 3:58 pm

    Hague and cohort fielding questions from the Foreign Affairs Committee.

    On now http://www.parliamentlive.tv/Main/Player.aspx?meetingId=13628

    Developments in UK foreign policy
    Witnesses
    i. Rt Hon William Hague MP, First Secretary of State and Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, Sir Simon Fraser KCMG, Permanent Under-Secretary, and David Quarrey, Director, Middle East and North Africa, Foreign and Commonwealth Office

  105. Monarchy generally- I’ll bite, for a change. It’s a valid question and relevant. No objection, provided it’s constitutionally ringwalled from having any influence whatever on
    a democratic government (we need one of those too). Provided also that it doesn’t need vast estates and money beyond anyone else’s wildest dreams to perform its perfectly useful function. Provided it isn’t Tony Blair, and provided it isn’t the topic of incessant front page coverage when one of its relatives is in pup….it can be hereditary if it likes, and good luck to it. Otherwise make it a Lottery prize or choose it annually from the Mail Online’s sidebar of lovely ladies.

  106. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 4:01 pm

    Not many members of the committee there. Have they already jetted off for the hols?

    Membership Foreign Affairs Committee

    Richard Ottaway MP (Chair) Conservative
    Mr John Baron MP Conservative
    Rt Hon Sir Menzies Campbell QC MP Liberal Democrats
    Rt Hon Ann Clwyd MP Labour
    Mike Gapes MP Labour
    Mark Hendrick MP Labour
    Sandra Osborne Labour
    Andrew Rosindell MP Conservative
    Mr Frank Roy MP Labour
    Rt Hon Sir John Stanley MP Conservative
    Rory Stewart MP Conservative

  107. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 4:02 pm

    @ Herbie

    So what would your preference be?

    Or perhaps you could envisage yet another method (eg A_Node’s lottery idea)?

    I ask because I’m sure you’ve carried your thought a little further than the simple “get rid of the Monarchy”. Haven’t you?

    ________________

  108. A.Node got in before me. Yes.

  109. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 4:05 pm

    Stop P Charles’ meddling for a start.

    Prince Charles’s letters to ministers to remain private, court rules
    Judges reject Guardian attempt to force publication of ‘black spider memos’ that would reveal efforts to influence government
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk-news/2013/jul/09/prince-charles-letters-mps-private-court

    Last week, the Rt Hon Jeremy Hunt had an audience of P Charles. What was that about? Not a social chat.

  110. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 4:07 pm

    @ Herbie

    “Anyway, whilst Habby exeunts backwards,….”

    ___________

    I think you’ll find that “exeunt” is a third person plural, whereas “Habbabkuk” is third person singular.

    But please don’t let me “distract” you from giving us your thoughts on how a President of the UK should be elected. Off you go!

  111. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 4:24 pm

    @ Flaming June

    I’ve noticed that you frequently post about the Royal Family (a couple of times just today, for example) and usually in a not too friendly way, so I assume that you would be for a republic to replace the monarchy.

    Would you therefore not wish to contribute to the debate and to the question “how should a President be elected or chosen”?

    It would seem to be a reasoable and relevant question for a republican to think about, would it not?

  112. You’re plural, Habby.

    Anyway.

    Best to have system closer to that of the US, with funding for political parties and no private lobbying, bribing nor any of the rest of the nonsense currently in vogue.

    I’d aim too for the head of state to be chosen from outside the ranks of the political parties.

  113. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 4:32 pm

    @ Flaming June:

    “Gross hypocrisy there about ‘cheapening this blog’ @ 2.39pm. Pots and kettles spring to mind”
    ___________

    Must call you out on that, I’m afraid – right of reply and all that.

    YOU have frequently posted on tittle-tattle like people’s husbands or wives. An egregious recent example was your comment about what Voctoria Beckham was wearing at Wimbledon (“some sort of lingerie” or something similar was your insight, if I remember correctly).

    I challenge YOU to find ONE single post from ME containing similar irrelevant tittle-tattle.

    If you can find one, you can talk about pots and kettles.

  114. Komodo, you’re quoting from exactly the kind of nationalist website I was talking about.

    Cornwall is not a feudal state, it’s an English county with the same sort of local democracy as any other English county and which is represented by six MPs at Westminster.

    Incidentally Cornish nationalist contested all six seats at the last election and all six lost their deposits. Three came last, that is pulled fewer votes than the Monster Raving Loony Party and all the other joke candidates. There is little real support for Cornish independence because most people there realise that unlike Scotland Cornwall simply doesn’t have any resources to support it.

  115. Oh by the way, I do agree that the Duchy should be paying it’s fair share of taxes.

  116. Flaming June

    16 Jul, 2013 - 4:40 pm

    Too trivial to reply to @ 4.32pm and anyway I am off out to a thé dansant once I have changed into my frock and put on my dancing pumps. It’s all one big merry round.

  117. Habby

    It’s difficult to argue that comment on slebs is irrelevant to political debate in this country, since they and their doings are so central to much of public discourse.

    They are very much the public face of wealth, and whilst often they act as distractions from more politically attuned wealth, they’re certainly a manifestation of what our culture and system has become.

  118. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 4:48 pm

    @ Herbie :

    “Best to have system closer to that of the US, with funding for political parties and no private lobbying, bribing nor any of the rest of the nonsense currently in vogue.

    I’d aim too for the head of state to be chosen from outside the ranks of the political parties.
    __________

    Thank you for that.

    I’m sure it’s entirely my fault, but I’m having a little difficulty following you completely.

    In the first para you say a system “closer” to that of the US. Which other differences would you envisage other than the money aspect you go on to mention? Would you, for instance, retain the two essential features of the US system (direct universal suffrage and the Electoral College) as are?

    You mention “funding” for political parties, which implies that Presidential candidates would be chosen by parties : is that correct?

    If so, how would you reconcile that with your further idea that the Head of State should be chosen from outside the ranks of politicians? Would that be a realistic idea?

    And a last thought : would it not be anti-democratic and discrimnatory to lay down that a serving or former politician should not be a candidate?

    ~~~~~~~~~~

    I think this discussion has already revealed that it’s quite simple to say “get rid of the Monarchy” but slightly less simple to propose legal, realistic and practical alternatives. But perhaps Flaming June will come up with something none of us has thought of., this is why I should very much like her to join in.

  119. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 4:56 pm

    [Mod/Jon: excessive commentary about Flaming June's contributions - this question is a direct repeat anyway]

  120. Graham Derrick

    16 Jul, 2013 - 4:58 pm

    Dear Craig, good to know you’re on the mend. In your next blog please include as many details as you like as to the standard of the NHS treatment you have received. A useful way to build up an impression of the care provided is from many anecdotal accounts.
    Best, Graham Derrick

  121. Habby

    To answer your last point first. You say;

    “it’s quite simple to say “get rid of the Monarchy” but slightly less simple to propose legal, realistic and practical alternatives.”

    seemingly unaware that many many countries have managed to do precisely that!!

    leaving the reasonable suspicion that your curious complacency in this matter is borne of some personal or otherise beneficial interest in the status quo, and indeed negating your subsequent detailed questions on procedure.

  122. Habby

    It’d be remiss of me not to correct your schoolboy howler.

    You suggest that it would be:

    “anti-democratic and discrimnatory to lay down that a serving or former politician should not be a candidate”

    yet the principle separating executive from legislature is fundamental to most systems of government, including our own, until the current botched system emanating from what your antecedents called The Glorious Revolution.

    Make no mistake. Ours is a cobbled together nonsense which even old Tories like Quentin Hogg argued was an elective dictatorship. This is because in our system the executive and legislature are much more often than not, one and the same. With the Party system and whipping, it has just become worse and worse.

  123. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 5:37 pm

    @ Herbie

    “..seemingly unaware that many many countries have managed to do precisely that!!”
    __________

    No, I think you’ve misunderstood; I’m perfectly aware that other countries have worked out arrangements and have indeed pointed out what seem to be the two major options – direct election or election by Parliamentarians. I was asking you (and others) which of the above two options (or any other option) they’d advocate.

    “..leaving the reasonable suspicion that your curious complacency in this matter is borne of some personal or otherise beneficial interest in the status quo..”

    You’ll remember that Craig once asked contributors to stick to the subject matter and not speculate on the contributor’s motives (which, he said, they could anyway not know). So it would be more conducive to rational discussion here if you were not to voice your ‘suspicions’ and certainly not to use them as a pretext for avoiding legitimate questions as you appear to wish to do.

    (You’ll find my questions at 16h48, above.)

    Thank you.

  124. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 5:47 pm

    @ Herbie

    “You suggest that it would be:

    “anti-democratic and discrimnatory to lay down that a serving or former politician should not be a candidate”

    yet the principle separating executive from legislature is fundamental to most systems of government,…”
    __________

    I’m not quite sure where the schoolboy howler is, Herbie.

    It happens to be the case that in most republics the President is a former politician (a legislator, if you will) and I’m sure you wouldn’t wish to accuse all those countries of blurring the line between the executive and the legislative, would you?

    The point you also seem to have overlooked is that the party politician ceases, constitutionally, to be a party politician the moment he or she becomes President.

    So, having cleared that up, do you feel like answering the couple of clarifications I asked for at 16h48?

    Thank you.

    PS – other anti-Monarchists (or indeed Monarchists), feel free to join in!

  125. Habby

    If the current system is a cobbled together nonsense, which it is, then why would anyone with an interest in the matter not wish to change it?

    Further, why would anyone wish to retain it?

    Eh?

    That’s the first step, Habby. The desire for change.

    As I’ve shown above, there is no argument that it’s impossible to change, however much you may wish to pretend that’s the case with the old bogging down in detail trick.

    Since there’s no argument that it’s impossible to change our current system, for the moment we need only line up along Change or No Change.

    It really is as simple as that.

  126. Planet of the Arabs: A montage of Hollywood’s relentless vilification of Arabs and Muslims

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mi1ZNEjEarw&feature=youtu.be

    ——————-

    Why do you go as far afield as the U.S. to find a country where the people elect their president?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_presidential_election,_2011

  127. “The point you also seem to have overlooked is that the party politician ceases, constitutionally, to be a party politician the moment he or she becomes President.”

    That’s part of the problem obviously. These party politicians will forever be linked to the legislature.

    Perhaps you think we can just ask them to cross their hearts and hope to die should they let their old mates influence them, or you’re particularly enamoured of revolving door politics.

    There are many many better people outside of politics than within, and it’d be a shame not to call upon their public service.

  128. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 6:18 pm

    @ Herbie

    I think I’ll make this the last one because it’s become fairly clear you don’t wish to answer the questions.

    Let me just say that I don’t think I said that it was “impossible to change” from a monarchy to a republic. On the contrary, it’s perfectly possible to do so – most present day republics were once Monarchies. And you are in error in your belief that asking questions about how republicans would envisage the election of the President is “bogging down the discussion in details”. In the real world, Herbie – to all but simple blowhards – details are important, are they not?

    You also said that “the desire to change” is the “first step”. That is true. But is it not also true that it is for those who wish to change from the status quo to make their case for doing so? This, I regret to note, you have also failed to do.

    So, in summary

    - you have not tried to make a reasoned case for changing from a Monarchy to a republic

    - you have failed, or are unwilling, to answer a few eminently practical questions to which such a change would ineluctably give rise.

  129. Sir Humphrey says:

    “- you have not tried to make a reasoned case for changing from a Monarchy to a republic”

    I have. Several times. I’ve pointed out that anyone who knows anything about the British Constitution knows that it’s a hodge podge, poorly cobbled together and resulting in what Lord Hailsham has called an elective dictatorship.

    That’s reason enough to change it. It’s certainly more than reason enough to question the bona fides of anyone trumpeting the current system as the best thing since sliced bread.

    “- you have failed, or are unwilling, to answer a few eminently practical questions to which such a change would ineluctably give rise.”

    There’s no need to get bogged down in the details at this stage. These are things that a Commission would look at, over a long period of time I’d imagine.

    All you need to know is that the system needs changing. You’re either for that or against it.

    What we certainly don’t want is any attempt by you to pretend that any change is so horribly complex that we’d best leave well enough alone, and that’s all you’re up to.

    Typical vested interest bureaucrat, in fact.

  130. Sofia Kibo Noh

    16 Jul, 2013 - 7:23 pm

    Habbas. 4 07pm

    ” “Habbabkuk” is third person singular.”

    Don’t be silly Dads!

  131. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 7:35 pm

    @ Herbie

    I shall now resume the discussion as you have moved away (wisely) from the theme of Monarchy/Republic wrt to the Head of State to the theme of the “Constitution” writ large, ie the political system applying in the UK.

    Firstly, let us leave aside as unworthy

    1) your by now usual suppositions as to motive (“Sir Humphrey”, my “bona fides” and “typical vested interest bureaucrat”; these are not arguments;

    2) your assertions (“trumpeting the current system as the best thing since sliced bread” and “pretending that any change is horribly complex”); these are inaccurate ans well as not being arguments.

    On the substance of your argument – such as it is – I would say the following two things:

    1/. You appear to be saying that the British (unwritten) constitution needs to be changed because it is a “poorly cobbled together hodge-podge which has led to an “elective dictatorship”.

    Given that these judgements of yours are subjective (there are many who would disagree) and leaving aside for the moment that there is no (written) constitution of long standing in the world that has not, like the UK constitution, evolved over time (in the case of written constitutions, by way of “amendments to the Constitution”), I’d be interested if you could flesh out in just a little detail in which way(s) the UK constitution is a “poorly cobbled together hodge podge, and also what you would consider to be the essential features of a new constitution that would meet with your approval.

    This leads me to my second point, which is really a variant on the point above :

    2/. Although I recognise its attractiveness (and convenience) as an argument, I’m not convinced that “all you need to know is that the system needs changing” but that there is no need for any, even broad, detail at this stage. I don’t think that its intellectually (as opposed to emotionally) valid to say something needs to be changed without having much of a clue what is wrong with the present system and what should be the main features of the new, supposedly better system. Hence my invitation to you under point 1.

    Remember now – we have moved away from the Monarchy, at your volition, so please keep your arguments focussed on your new theme of choice, the UK constitution and don’t move inot yet something else!

    Thank you

  132. “That’s unionism for you (Fred)”

    Nationalism, Unionism, two sides of the same coin. If you paid attention you would have seen me criticising Unionists.

    You really can’t comprehend anything but your “us and them” mindset can you?

  133. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 7:38 pm

    @ Dreoilin

    you’re right, Ireland just didn’t come to mind. But you musn’t assume that I live next door :)

  134. We’ve had this monarchy-versus republic discussion here on a number of occasions, actually, when the poster-formerly-known-as-Alfred [cue puff of sulphurous coriander emanation from the genocidal Indians of Leicester!], and others, put forward the various well-trodden, and somewhat valid, arguments for a constitutional monarchy.

    Personally, I’d like Britain a republic (there are a number of workable models) and have no aristocracy. But Britain’s problems run far deeper than that and just getting rid of the Crown and titles, on its own, would not alter these basic problems.

    So, either abolish the monarchy… or make me a Duke! Give me a pair of white rhinestone boots, a white cowboy hat and a louche swagger and I’m sorted. There are far too many damn barons and baronesses running around with their coronets bouncing off their heads, Alice Through the Looking Glass-style, as it is.

  135. “But you musn’t assume that I live next door.” Habbabkuk

    Habbabkuk, you’re not the boy next door? Aw, how disappointing. I’d always imagined you as a Bay City Roller.

  136. Habby

    The British Constitution includes the Monarchy, does it not, so how can you conclude that we’ve moved away from the Monarchy?

    I’m tempted just to refer you directly to Lord Hailsham’s excellent work on the subject of our “elective dictatorship”, and he knew a bit about this stuff, inside and outside and from a Tory perspective.

    But, I’ll give you a few pointers:

    British constitution enshrines in practice the unity of executive and legislature. They are one and the same, much much more often than not.

    This worked better when the party system was less rigid. Now it’s an abomination.

    Best practice is separation of executive and legislature, as was recognized in the emergence of Parliament itself and indeed even in the hodge podge cobbled together version where, in its stead, there’s now a pretence at separation of powers between monarch and parliament, the Queen appointing ministers and the other pretences in prerogative powers.

    The Queen isn’t the executive. None of the Privy Council committees, including the Cabinet are hers to control.

    These are factual distinctions.

    So, in Blair’s time, he controlled both parliament AND executive, running his own show pretty much as he liked. That’s the elective dictatorship.

    The question then becomes, do you want to retain this elective dictatorship or do you want a separation of powers between executive and legislature. Checks and balances, if you will.

    I should say, for clarity, that the hodge podge reference to British Constitution is not a reference to change through precedent etc but rather to the manner of its inception in the turbulence following civil war and Protestant Reformation.

  137. If anyone wants to watch an interesting take on Judaism/Being Jewish/Israel and related items, then feel free to watch this:

    http://www.youtube.com/user/zionget?feature=watch

  138. Good on you, Craig, and well done for avoiding the Liverpool Care Pathway.

    I note that the Murrayista misery-mongers are out in force today, moaning about feudalism and the downtrodden people of Cornwall, of all things. Still, at least it makes a change from Israel!

    A suggestion for the Miserables: get yourself down to Kernow while the fine weather lasts, and enjoy the serf!

    Life is grand!

  139. “I note that the Murrayista misery-mongers are out in force today, moaning…” Anon.

    Is this mammary alliteration ‘after Margaret Thatcher’, as in “moaning minnies”?

    And what of The Bay City Rollers, prithee?

  140. Sofia Kibo Noh

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:05 pm

    @ Dad! All over the place, again.

    Apologies for the disgraceful ad hominem (7 23pm). I really have no idea how many of you there are.

    Re monarchy, you might as well argue for the desirability of intestinal worms.

    On value-for-money grounds alone the UK monarchy seems to be a no-brainer.

    The estimated total annual cost of the monarchy to taxpayers is £202.4m, around five times the official figure published by the royal household (£38.3m last year).

    That much would pay for 9,560 nurses.

    The British monarchy is 112 times as expensive as the Irish president and more than twice as expensive as the French semi-presidential system.

    How could anybody seriously want that?

    Loads more data at: http://www.republic.org.uk/valueformoneymyth.pdf‎

    Saoirse, comhionannas, bráithreachas!

  141. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:07 pm

    More like the Mormon Tabernacle Choir, Suhayl

    More mammaries will be necessary to suckle the throngs.

  142. “9,560 nurses…”

    Or 10,000 very small nurses.

    Here’s to the republic!

    But jngs ma boab! Alex Salmond still wants the Queen! Actually, one suspects he simply doesn’t want to frighten some people away from voting, ‘Yes’ to independence.

    Give Alex a cowboy hat and rhinestone boots, I say!

    You know what Kig Farouk said, don’t you?

  143. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:26 pm

    @ Herbie

    “The British Constitution includes the Monarchy, does it not, so how can you conclude that we’ve moved away from the Monarchy?”
    _________

    It does indeed, and I concluded that you had moved away from the Monarchy to the “Constitution writ large, ie the political system applicable in the UK” (the words I used)because you declined to answer a few key questions regarding how you thought a President should be elected, choosing instead to start talking about the UK constitution and issues such as the separation of powers between the executive and the legislature.

    Your references to Lord Hailsham reinforce the idea that you have enlarged the discussion in that his “The Dilemma of Democracy” – which I happen to possess (but thanks for the “pointers, anyway :) )is almost entirely about Parliament and says little about the Monarchy.

    Anyway : now that you’ve given us your “pointers”, would you care to advance a little on the question(s) I put to you on your new theme? You’ll find them in my post at 19h35 under point 1/.

    (Please don’t confine yourself to just saying something like “a better separation of powers between the executive and legislative branches of govt.” but give us your ideas on how you think this – and other improvements- could be achieved in your opinion.).

    Thank you.

  144. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:28 pm

    I think someone feels a pinch to the ‘Eminences’ of it’s own choice.

  145. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:32 pm

    @ Anon

    “Life is grand!”
    _______

    I don’t remember giving you a franchise on my “La vita è bella, life is good!” but it of course goes without saying that you’re very welcome!

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Loved the “enjoy the serf” as well :)

  146. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:36 pm

    @ Suhayl

    “You know what Kig Farouk said, don’t you?”
    _____________

    No, but let me guess (since he was very sexually active despite his girth) : “Give me 9560 nurses”?

  147. Flaming June:

    “That was 1.86 billion dollar bills not 1.86 billion £1 coins. Can you picture the stacks?”

    No i can’t but, simply, because my brain won’t go there towards a futile visualisation. Sounds, though, that you would like to picture them sitting under your mattress. Do i sense some envy here? What kind of mind is drawn to picture someone else’s ‘stacks’ ?
    ——
    ” Not many members of the committee there. Have they already jetted off for the hols?”
    Envy again or the new MP police?

  148. “The estimated total annual cost of the monarchy to taxpayers is £202.4m”

    I very much doubt the veracity of this estimation, but supposing for a moment it is correct, it would represent approximately half the annual aid sent to Pakistan. A healthy scepticism is in order whenever one sees “x amount would pay for y amount of nurses”. Always nurses, because that really tugs at the Murrayista heart-strings.

  149. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:47 pm

    202 mil seems about right for just keeping the gardens up. It’s a pittance that would only pay for a few thousand nurses, so not even worth mentioning.

  150. “The whole world is in revolt. Soon there will be only five Kings left — the King of England, the King of Spades, the King of Clubs, the King of Hearts, and the King of Diamonds.” King Farouk of Egypt.

    But who knows, he may well have said, “Give me 9,560 nurses”!

    Numbers of nurses are always quoted by the media in relation to almost anything. I don’t know what it is, specifically, about the numbers of nurses. It’s almost like a currency in the world of soap opera news.

    Having said all that, I agree with Sophia Kibo Noh.

    !!Send 9,560 murses to take over all the palaces!! Al together now: Inhale, exhale… !! Blow away the house of cards!! But Comrade Kibo, don’t let those nurses near the champagne…

  151. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:54 pm

    @ Anon

    And, do you know, I read something recently to the effect that nowadays it costs about £4 million to build one mile of motorway.

    So that would be about 50 miles of motorway a year we’re not building because of the Monarchy.

    Thing is, though, no mile of motorway would last 60-odd years as well as Her Majesty has.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    La vita è bella – Long live Her Gracious Majesty!

  152. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 9:55 pm

    Nurses are the true caregivers. Physicians, not so much.

  153. I think this may be where Sophia Kibo Noh got the figures from? But of course, at root, it’s not about figures.

    http://www.republic.org.uk/What%20we%20want/In%20depth/Royal%20finances/index.php

  154. Good stuff, Habbabkuk. I always thought Cornwall could do with a motorway.

    Am so sorry for the above transgression. As many of the eagle-eyed investigators here think I am you, I thought I would play along for a while and give them all the evidence they needed. You see, poor Dreoilin has had a run of bad luck lately, and so I thought she could do with a breakthrough!

  155. “Thing is, though, no mile of motorway would last 60-odd years as well as Her Majesty has.” Habbabkuk.

    Eek, you sound like Norman St John Stevas. I need a parenteral anti-emetic. Let me call a care-giver! Let me call a nurse!

  156. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 10:04 pm

    10,000 nurses needed to pave a mile in Lancashire. Pretty good pay for the week.

  157. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 10:09 pm

    Musical interlude on topic.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmOe27SJ3Yc

  158. We’re seeing a lot of this ‘republic’ web link, Suhayl, but I doubt it takesinto account the economic benefits of the Monarchy in terms of tourism and Diana mugs. But you’re right, it’s not about money, but principle. So thank Her Maj for 60 years of unimpeachable public service.

  159. “Saoirse, comhionannas, bráithreachas!”

    Sofia, you’re a tonic. :)

    Habbabkuk, fwiw, I think you’re in the United States. My comment about “so far afield” was addressed to nobody in particular.

    Mention of rhinestone boots reminds me, I used to listen to a lot of this great singer
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prJyb7W605c

    and for Suhayl, who mentioned the bobbies two ba two:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWB1Sqsx1jo

  160. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 10:13 pm

    @ Anon

    £200 millions (if correct, of course) is equivalent to about £3,50 per head of the UK population, illegals included. And that is equivalent to about 1p a day.

    I believe it now costs at least 10p to have a pee in one of those public paying lavatories.

    Absolutely scandalous! (both, I hasten to add)

    Peep peep!

  161. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 10:13 pm

    Jack Nicholson as the NHS. They like nurses.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYDP3nBh_E4

  162. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 10:26 pm

    @ Suhayl

    “Eek, you sound like Norman St John Stevas.”

    Ouch! A bit below the belt, that, don’t you think?
    _________

    @ Anon

    No transgression at all! The more people who think and write “Life is grand!” the better! Because it is.

  163. ” do you know, I read something recently to the effect that nowadays it costs about £4 million to build one mile of motorway. ”

    Must’ve been along time ago, latest figures from the Highway agency that I can find put the cost of a mile of three lane motorway at £30 million but that skyrockets if it has to be put in a tunnel or on an elevated section. The five mile elevated extension to the M74 in Glasgow cost £692 million.

  164. Habbabkuk (La Vita È Bella!)
    Unblock? NO

    Anon (Habbys bumchum)
    Block? YES

    Villager (Habbys new bumchum)
    Block? YES

  165. Sofia Kibo Noh

    16 Jul, 2013 - 10:47 pm

    @Anon. 9 42pm

    “Always nurses, because that really tugs at the Murrayista heart-strings.”

    Can you supply links to back up other times when dastardly Murrayistas have used nurses for that purpose?

    I was just thinking in terms of value to society.

    Value of 9,560 nurses = Value of 1 monarch?

    How difficult is that to work out?

    Of the various forms of government which have prevailed in the world, an hereditary monarchy seems to present the fairest scope for ridicule
    Edward Gibbon

    Seditious mutterings here from the Flaming chicken run. NSA megafolder: FJwe7fh87

  166. resident dissident

    16 Jul, 2013 - 10:47 pm

    Best wishes for a speedy recovery.

    Does Craig’s use of the Royal “we” in the blog title have any significance? Given the support of some of his acolytes for the Syrian and North Korean monarchies perhaps he is planning to offer himself as a replacement for Liz Windsor who clearly doesn’t meet the exacting standards they set for monarchs.

  167. What you need to be on ‘full fighting form’ (craig) is (‘surely’?!) a good ‘support crew’ (?!) …

  168. resident dissident

    16 Jul, 2013 - 10:52 pm

    Yes Exexpat – but who is on your list for stringing up come the revolution. All good revolutionaries have a list or seven dont they?

  169. Resident Dissident
    Unblock?

  170. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 10:56 pm

  171. And no ‘we’ aren’t fucking stooge($) asif 4 asad bunch of bastards such as the dprk regimeß or suck as ..

  172. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 11:07 pm

    @ Kempe

    My God, that much?

    Was I at least right in my estimation of the price of taking a leak? I hope you’re not going to tell me it costs 50p.

    At £30 million minimum per mile, that means that every year 6,5 miles of motorway don’t get built because of Her Majesty.

    Appalling!

  173. Kibo
    “Apologies for the disgraceful ad hominem (7 23pm). I really have no idea how many of you there are.”

    That doesn’t sound like a very sincere apology when in the same breath you accuse Habbabkuk of sock-puppeting. And, Kibo, dear friend coming from you of all people? I’m disappointed that the daughter struggles to follow “Dad’s” standards.

    Note how Herbie had to be cautioned and put on the mat (quite rightly) by Habby, for infringing Craig’s direct advice.

    Ironic though how you and Herbie are the first one’s to go with your-thinly-veiled-sucking-up appearance to Jon to show Jon support, and the next second, this is what you resort to.

    Herbie, starts addressing Habby as Sir Humphreys or whatever. Next, someone might be tempted to call him Herbie**ore — how helpful would that be?

    Please decide whether you really support moderation here or not. As for Sophia it was ok while it lasted, but she’s way past her sell-by date, i would suggest. As Obama said ‘you never step into the same river twice’. Its a great pity that his deeper side has been a-wasted. Just a sign of the times. And because of those signs i’m interested in the primacy of how the mind impacts politics/society and less so of how politics impacts the mind which is secondary. So at the secondary level we see all this frustration and bitterness. And acting from that frustration only arises more frustration. That is why the world is confused, lost.

    If you want to see change, please change.

    As for Herbie, he seems to be here only in a vain attempt to score points. I have read with interest his exchange with Habby who is chasing him all over the board — he’s on the ropes with no specifics. Note seriously how Habby brings rigour to the debate.
    ——
    Btw some good points made by Habby and Suhayl, inspired by Dreoilin, earlier re potential education dollars being lost in military machines of so-called developing countries.

  174. Expat apply for a moderator’s role — see what happens. Proof of the pudding is in the eating. Objectivity is in my training as is freedom to observe. Poodles and herd mentality was part of the problem how Blair managed to shaft the whole of the British parliament. Come out of the shadows.

    And by all means contribute to the debate instead of just sitting there saying i don’t like him, block. Bumchums etc, grow up if you’re serious at all about the world, its sorry state and humanity.

  175. I’ve had a load of jet fighters flying around in circles over me all day, costs £30,000 and hour to keep one of those things in the air.

    I’m no fan of the Royal Family, can’t stand them myself, loathe them actually but I know a lot of people do like them. I know see how immensely popular they are with the masses, they sell an awful lot of news papers.

    So I reckon they don’t cost that much compared to fighter planes and giving arms to Al Qaeda and such`so I’m quite prepared to tolerate them considering they give so much pleasure to all those people standing hours in the rain to wave flags as they drive past.

    That’s what a free society is all about isn’t it? Tolerating the things you don’t like much for the sake of those that do. If we start demanding everything is just how we want it be then a lot of society isn’t going to be free.

  176. Habby

    There are two answers to Britain’s recurrent problem in having a constitutional setup that almost always produces an elective dictatorship.

    1. Abolish the monarchy and elect an executive president with real power.

    2. Strengthen parliament and make the electoral system more representative of the people.

    2. is what’s normally proposed these days, but they don’t ever seem to get around to it.

    1. is easier. You just need media to work their Diana magic again.

  177. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    16 Jul, 2013 - 11:32 pm

    @ Villager

    “As for Herbie, he seems to be here only in a vain attempt to score points. I have read with interest his exchange with Habby who is chasing him all over the board — he’s on the ropes with no specifics.”
    _________

    You cheeky so-and-so! What do you mean, “on the ropes”? – Herbie was down on the canvas, out for the count.

    But then his twin brother stepped into the ring with a new theme. Owing to his present silence, only time can tell how many rounds he’ll go before the ref counts him out.

    When Habbabkuk’s in the ring, you get two for the price of one, and that is not to be sneezed at in these austere times.

  178. Excellent Big Picture comment by Fred.

    Profound in terms of relevance of comparison to fighter jets and the broader point about, as i read it, live and let live — based on the reality of “what is’, Not some ideology.
    —–
    Whats your verdict Expat?

  179. Sofia Kibo Noh

    17 Jul, 2013 - 12:00 am

    @Villager. 11 11pm

    “That doesn’t sound like a very sincere apology when in the same breath you accuse Habbabkuk of sock-puppeting.”

    I can see how you might have though that I was accusing there. In fact I was simply apollogising for a post that was 100% ad hominen. I take the piss, I know, but I try to keep it relevant and I dashed that one out in haste and later regretted it. Hence the apology.

    I don’t really care whether Dad is singular or plural. What matters to me is that, whatever the topic he/she/they can be counted on to defend the indefensible. Always promoting narratives in which humanity loses out to power.

    Re monarchy, I just can’t for the life of me see how one UK monarach could be considered to be worth 9560 nurses or 112 Irish presidents. That’s it.

  180. Okay Habby so it must be in the genes — Sofia Kibo also tried to give us a two-for-one :-) I get it ;-)

    Anyway I’m reminded of one of my favourite Beatles songs for its melody of the Beatles well before Sir Paul

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXdKlpBOvs0

    All hypocrites, though!

    What did the Flower-children bring us other than a popularisation of drugs?

    We need another way to live but i remain deeply sceptical of the armchair activists like Flaming June, Herbie and our failed petty-politician Nevermind and such likes.

  181. Sorry if i misunderstood you but the Eminences including ‘Herbie’ have been going on neurotically — minus the forensics i applied in your determination — about Anon being Habbabkuk.

    Take your point re equivalence but the Irish e.g. perhaps is a better apples-for-apples comparison. One will get a closer look in the morning.

  182. Villager
    17 Jul, 2013 – 12:06 am

    intended for Kibo, if not obvious

  183. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    17 Jul, 2013 - 12:10 am

    Villager; I respect your protectiveness wrt to free speech, but I question the limits. Do you really think the unmentionable one is serious and not disruptive in intent? I have been meaning to ask you that question.

  184. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    17 Jul, 2013 - 12:18 am

    I guess i’m using the US definition of ‘free speech’. In our democracy, you can’t yell fire in a crowded theater when no fire exists. There are limits.

  185. Ben, i think he is. He doesn’t rush to declare or box himself as a ‘liberal’ wearing it as on a uniformed sleeve as many do here, but i think he’s on the ‘right side’ of many key issues (or at least he wants to understand if one is taking a holistic view in a very imperfect world. Syria is an example)– my interpretation, i don’t want to be speaking for him. He’s far more subtle than some of the gushing sycophants, a trait i despise in the spirit of poodles etc — see my earlier point re Blair shafting the whole of Parliament and then people reelecting him for more. A rigourous debate to come to ‘conclusions’ or synthesis of thinking is more scientific and rational.

  186. Ben, but you can chase a black unarmed young black boy, start an intimidating altercation and then take out a licenced gun and shoot him dead with candy in his pocket.

  187. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    17 Jul, 2013 - 12:27 am

    Then why does ‘he who must be obeyed’ harass those who wish not to engage. That feature, to me is a bug. It identifies one who uses that approach as a troll. Is it ‘borderline personality disorder’, or am I seeing this through a prism?

  188. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    17 Jul, 2013 - 12:29 am

    “but you can chase a black unarmed young black boy, start an intimidating altercation and then take out a licenced gun and shoot him dead with candy in his pocket”

    And..get away with it. That’s my point.

  189. Might i also add that we are far more downstream in the evolution of dialogue from even a month ago. I think people need to move on and be agile and live a new day fresh rather than lapsing back. Life is a living thing!

  190. Sofia Kibo Noh

    17 Jul, 2013 - 12:46 am

    “I Hereby Resign in Protest Effective Immediately”

    “The narrative, professed by the state, and echoed by the mainstream press, has proven false and criminal. We have become what I thought we were fighting against.”Brandon Troy (Former US soldier)

    Full letter: https://www.commondreams.org/view/2013/07/16-5

    How many wearing those uniforms must be having similar realisations?

    It must be getting harder by the day to really believe all the crap.

  191. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    17 Jul, 2013 - 12:55 am

    I would rather think the progression is ‘upstream’. Salmon prefer it.

  192. “At £30 million minimum per mile, that means that every year 6,5 miles of motorway don’t get built because of Her Majesty.

    Appalling!”

    Another way of looking at would be grateful for the environmental damage thus prevented.

  193. Flaming June

    17 Jul, 2013 - 4:50 am

    Ten Years Ago: The Political Assassination of Dr. David Kelly

    The Dr Kelly Inquest Campaign demands due process of law – the re-opening of Dr Kelly’s inquest – and transparency, to achieve truth and justice.

    TENTH ANNIVERSARY SILENT PROTEST

    ROYAL COURTS OF JUSTICE,
    THURSDAY 18th JULY 2013
    2pm PHOTOCALL

    The campaign to re-open the inquest into the death of Dr David Kelly is holding a silent, gagged, protest outside the Royal Courts of Justice, London, on Thursday 18th July 2pm, to mark the tenth anniversary of Dr Kelly’s death and to demand the re-opening of his inquest.

    Campaigners demand Dr Kelly’s inquest, as his right under British law, to examine all the evidence, including the fresh evidence. The coroner ‘speaks for the dead to protect the living.’ Campaigners demand due process of British law and transparency, for the clear establishment of truth and justice.

    All single, unexplained deaths require an inquest under British law. Dr Kelly’s unexplained death, according to many centuries of British law, should have been examined in a proper coronial inquest, with the option of a jury, the power to subpoena witnesses, testimony given under oath, with cross-examination and the requirement to establish suicide beyond reasonable doubt.

    Instead, Section 17A of the Coroners Act 1988 was quickly invoked – which is used to cover multiple deaths, as with train disasters – probably uniquely, for Dr Kelly’s single, unexplained death. The result was the Hutton Inquiry, engaged only to look into ‘the circumstances surrounding Dr Kelly’s death’, neither overseen by a coroner, nor with the proper powers of an inquest.

    There is fresh evidence which requires the scrutiny of a proper coronial inquest. Thames Valley Police FoI responses reveal that there were no fingerprints on six items found with Dr Kelly’s body, including the knife with which he is said to have cut his ulnar artery, blister packs of Co-proxamol tablets, which he is said to have swallowed, an opened water bottle, a watch, spectacles and mobile phone. No gloves were found at the scene.

    Lord Hutton requested the records provided to the Hutton Inquiry, not produced in evidence, be closed for 30 years, and that medical reports and photographs be closed for 70 years. The Ministry of Justice was unable to explain the legal basis for Lord Hutton’s order.

    The Dr Kelly Inquest Campaign demands due process of law – the re-opening of Dr Kelly’s inquest – and transparency, to achieve truth and justice.

    http://www.globalresearch.ca/ten-years-ago-the-political-assasination-of-dr-david-kelly/5342952

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