It is the bankers who pay the rat Lawson who want London as an offshore money-laundering centre outside the EU. This is what Lawson said about the EU today:
“Economic disadvantages are much greater than the advantages. In particular – it is not the only thing, but in particular – the attempt to overregulate and to cut down to size the financial services sector, banking and financial services including insurance which we need in this country, this is already causing great concern to people in the Bank of England, it is extremely damaging to one of our biggest industries so the economic minus is a very big one.”
BBC News Channel today 12.43PM.
It was of course Lawson who was Thatcher’s accomplice in destroying most of our real industries, the ones which actually made something visible. It was replaced by the crazed idea of elevating the financial services sector, from providers of middlemen services for a small percentage, into the greatest net recipients of income in the economy, through creation of price gambling instruments and South Sea Bubble schemes. The result has on average cost everybody in the UK and US the equivalent of their housing cost again in extra tax, plus plunged the entire world into recession.
All that tax, plus the 225 billion sterling extra money from QE in the UK alone, has just been given to the bankers so they can have no interruption in their gambling or lifestyles.
Let us not exaggerate the marginal changes the EU has been seeking to make. Instead of banning whole classes of derivative trading, they are merely looking to institute a transaction tax (entirely sensible in itself) and put some limit to the financial rewards of bankers – who will still get massively better paid than equivalent workers elsewhere. But even that is too much moderation for the insatiable greed of Lawson and his ilk, and they would rather destroy the EU than have any bounds placed on their wealth.
In a recent posting, I pointed out that, precisely opposite to the way it had been reported in the mainstream media, the recent Eurobarometer poll showed that voters, specifically including UK voters, had more trust in the EU than in national government. They also wanted the EU to control the likes of Lawson and his chums in the City:
Here are some more details of the Eurobarometer poll the Guardian omitted in its total misrepresentation. 70% wish to see a stronger EU role in regulating the financial services industry (p.28) and on the same page, 76% want to see stronger EU coordination of economic policy.
Large majorities across Europe support:
the introduction of a tax on financial transactions (71%)
tighter rules for credit rating agencies (79%)
a tax on profits made by banks (83%)
tighter rules on tax avoidance and tax havens (61%)These are all areas where the Tory government has been among those blocking effective EU action, against the will of the people of the EU.
That is why the bankers are against the EU.
Derek @6:56pm: One way I’m aware this is done is to transfer intellectual property, brand names and trademarks, to a shell company in the lower-tax regime; surplus profit which would be subject to corporation and other taxes where they actually operate the business, is swallowed up in payments for the right to use the trademarks, made to the holding company, enabling them to convert profits to apparent losses after these deductions, which they can set at whatever level suits them to ensure they pay the least possible tax.
The Corporations are bigger than any nation state.
The argument that the EU is more trustworthy than our own government and that that justifies surrendering powers to it is one of those typically weak arguments frequently trotted out by Europhiles. We need to work to change our own system rather than allow an external one in which our democracy is diluted by a factor of 27 to dictate policy to us. It is also evident that the EU is not in the least bit trustworthy – that is why it is seldom able to pass its accounts. Unaccountable, undemocratic, and demonstrably fraudulent is what the EU is, with a contempt for Britain matched only by some here (which, let’s face it, is why you support it).
“I’ll just say it again. We might delude ourselves about our capacity for independence, but the alternative to political union with the EU is political union with the US.”
A further of example of aforementioned weak capitulation.
Quick show of hands, rather than the bent “Eurobarometer” poll referred to above by Craig, who is in favour of an In/Out referendum?
@ Craig :
You say in your lead-in that :
“Large majorities across Europe support:
the introduction of a tax on financial transactions (71%)
tighter rules for credit rating agencies (79%)
a tax on profits made by banks (83%)
tighter rules on tax avoidance and tax havens (61%)
These are all areas where the Tory government has been among those blocking effective EU action,..”
———–
The above statements, together with the criticism of the UK, would be entirely correct provided that
1/. these actions – assuming that they are all within Community competence – require unanimity and not just a qualified majority; if the latter, then UK opposition alone would be insufficient to block progress, it would need allies with which to form a blocking minority;
2/. so-called “enhanced cooperation” was not applicable; if it is , however, then UK opposition would not be sufficient to stop like-minded Member States from going ahead as far as they were concerned (I think this is the case with the financial transactions tax….to which it should be noted only just over a third of the 27 Member States – ie, not only not the UK – have signed up).
@ Craig :
WHOOPS, sorry, I’ve just noticed you wrote :
“….where the Tory government has been AMONG those blocking effective EU action,..”
……so I needn’t have bothered to write my comment.
Whence my oversight? Is it possible that when you first presented those percentages and commented about the UK position you omitted the word “AMOUNG”?
“” The bankers being against the EU is no reason for those disged by bankers to embrace the EU”
Spot on, Cryptomyn. To use an emotive subject like “The Bankers” in order to get a fixed result as in the poll above is a typically desperate measure. Fact is, most people want out of the EU, which is why those who support it don’t want a referendum.
Craig, you’re all for a referendum on Scottish independence. Just out of interest, are you for a referendum on EU membership?
@ Craig :
Just checked and you did in fact use the word “AMOUNG” in your post entitled “Guardian Channel Thatcher on Europe” on 26 April.
I think though that my point about the use of enhanced cooperation was useful; enhanced cooperation is an admittedly imperfect (because less encompassing and also subject to conditions) way forward when one or several Member States are agaionst the idea of EU action as such.
One further question, would you prefer to pay your taxes to the EU or Fred West?
a) Would rather pay taxes to anyone but Fred West.
b) Strongly support Fred West.
Please tick as appropriate.
Cryptonym,should have been “against the affects” it’s from the survey that Craig says The Guardian deliberately misinterpreted,see for youself.
Habbakuk,as you say the above not possible without political union.
Nigel Lawson said in 1989 that European monetary union would not work without fiscal union which is not possible without political union.
Giles, the survey shows that in the UK (presumably including Scotland)only 10% believe that the EU is best placed to deal with the economic crisis,whilst 37% believe that the UK government is best placed to deal with it.
Even if you take the while of the EU ,including the basket cases, still only 23% of respondants think EU best placed versus 20% who think their own governments are best placed.
@ Jives – 7 May, 2013 – 6:05 pm – Re your comment “That a 12 year old … can explain the scam better than any banker, economist or politician”. I think the answer is that the 12 year old is trying to get at the truth, whereas the politicians, etc. are trying to obscure the truth.
.
Being able to hide Canada’s bank bailouts is not that remarkable when one considers the massive conspiracy and cover up of the huge LIBOR scam in London, or Madoff’s fraud or ENRON in the USA. That’s why I wrote an article on Sir Jimmy Savile: my contention being that if the establishment can protect a pedophile from justice for 50 years they can cover-up anything. The article URL’s are on this site:
.
http://ca.linkedin.com/pub/roderick-russell/13/278/943
.
And then there is my own case of intimidation, harassment and threats by power-elites, that I call Zersetzen. The cover-up to pervert justice goes to amazing levels (but not that amazing if one considers the Savile case). Canada’s Prime Minister is aware of my story; yet nothing happens to investigate. Indeed all Prime Minister Harper would have to do to validate my story is lean over his garden fence, since my wife and I have known his next door neighbours at his private house in Calgary for over 35 years – they know our story, and have seen independent evidence that corroborates some of it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2nA2szz8dY
Giles,
I think it would be entirely sensible for WENI to have a referendum on EU membership, once Scotland has left. I do not think it sensible for Scotland to have a referendum on EU membership, as there is no demand for it.
@Craig – Excellent recently, especially your take on the Eurobarometer poll, many thanks.
‘We might delude ourselves about our capacity for independence, but the alternative to political union with the EU is political union with the US.’
Komodo-a completely false dichotomy:tiny Iceland has resisted the embrace both of the EU and the US (they were ejected from their Keflavik base years ago). And as for the idea that the nations of Europe have a common culture, which we also share, and that the EU has in some way bought this about…
Would you care if being a slave to the capitalist ‘free’ market money system meant world wide distribution of benefitial welfare for pride, plants and prairies
Presently the intoxicating ‘poison’ money produces,
Porsches, paunches and prattle.
The less we require money, the better
I voted against staying in the EU last time, or the Common Market as it was called, been a bit of mission creep since then.
I would vote against leaving now.
This talk of leaving Europe has nothing to do with bankers and a lot to do with the extreme right taking votes from the Conservatives. Nothing to do with bank regulation or tax havens and everything to do with stopping Eastern Europeans coming here to work.
There are lots of ways the people let themselves get manipulated and nationalism is one of the ugliest.
“I do not think it sensible for Scotland to have a referendum on EU membership, as there is no demand for it.”
“Scots want referendum on Europe…”
http://www.ipsos-mori.com/researchpublications/researcharchive/3131/Scots-want-EU-referendum-but-would-vote-to-stay-in.aspx
When the usual error margin is taken into consideration there really isn’t much to choose between the Scottish position on EU membership and that of the UK as a whole.
I agree with all Craig says about bankers but I think putting faith in The EU to fix those problems is quite naive.
The EU is just another bunch of gravy train riders, supporting vested interests in return for a slice of the action and not caring about the effects of their actions on the lives of the populations that they supposedly represent. What about the huge government money flows that are taking place to battle the Euro crisis that these idiots created in the first place? It seems similar to QE to me in that mind bogglingly large sums of money are created and moved around for the benefit of the financial markets and big business, while ordinary people get “austerity” and any savings, pension or benefit rights they might have are de-valued. It’s one of Craig’s most consistent themes – the systematic transfer of anything of value from ordinary people to the elite few. And the EU seems totally complicit in that, not an institution to be relied on to fix the problem.
No, the answer is for people to wake up to their own national government and stop voting for sweet-talking criminals and thieves and there’s no reason that should happen better at the Euro level than the national. We still have a thing called democracy, though it’s being eroded very quickly by lack of decent candidates to vote for and a media that refuse to ask important questions. If people don’t use what democracy and freedom they have left then they will lose even that and really only have themselves to blame. Again, Europe is not the place to look for stronger democracy and protection for the ordinary people.
Can a Scottish Chartered Accountant/Economist add up the following numbers please, with regard to the only 5.5m population.
Annual excise revenues on North Sea oil/gas on correct N Sea sovereignty
North Sea clean up cost still due
Scots share of UK national debt and unfunded civil service pension
Annual remittances that will arise from Scot expatriates worlwide
Extra revenue re £2 TRILLION existing “depleted” oil reserves-new tech
Share of taxes/penalty on £15 Trillion KNOWN UK deposits held abroad
Annual VAT/Paye/CT v Scots civil service/govt/health/pension bill
Etc
Its a no brainer. The only questions that remain are what are the practical requirements/loopholes for the 800k Scots south of the border to qualify as being resident for voting purposes, and will Salmond pay for their overnight bus ticket north on the 17th September 2014?!!
The thick pile carpets have been vacuumed, the thrones dusted, Black Rod prepares to put on his tights and pick up his stick and the flunkeys are at the ready. Even the police outside are wearing white gloves we hear.
The pantomime is coming to the HoL. Mrs Windsor and her eldest son and daughter in law will attend.
The speech as usual will be the usual anti climax and the UKIP brigade will be mollified.
‘Queen’s Speech: Immigration rules ‘to be tougher
The State Opening is the grandest occasion in the parliamentary calendar
The government is expected to announce tougher rules on immigration when it outlines its programme for the next year on Wednesday.
The Queen’s Speech will include a parliamentary bill aimed at making it easier to deport foreign criminals and those who enter the UK illegally.’
@April Showers..I never listen to the German lady anyway..all she does is spout a lot of bunkum, and, of course, has a chance to show off a few million quids worth of flashy diamonds…Call Me Dave et al will be sneering and peacocking in the background in their Eton Sunday Best and will no doubt retire to the bar afterwards to arse lick each other on how Er Maj just got the point accross to the plebs. Charlie boy will no doubt be dolled up in his faux uniform with unearned medals as well.
Fred.
Nationalism is not Ugly just pointless; there are further reaches of containment required
Worldism is ugly; Hate the destruction of our planet,
Hate the bad.
.
If we had a principal of goodness and a order of sensibility and guidance this Liberal society would not survive
The Liberal attitude is what is destoying the world, You see good and bad, right and wrong, fact and fiction, will always be seperated.
Justin King has just announced that Sainsbury’s Bank have completed a deal to acquire the half share from Lloyds Bank.
Everything is up for Sainsbury’s and so are the prices for the customers.
http://www.stockmarketwire.com/article/4590271/Sainsbury-lifts-final-dividend-as-underlying-profits-increase.html
The rise of the supermarket banks. Tesco did the same with RBS in 2008.
Tesco pays £950m to buy out RBS stake in bankhttp://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2008/jul/29/tesco.royalbankofscotlandgroup
“Its a no brainer. The only questions that remain are what are the practical requirements/loopholes for the 800k Scots south of the border to qualify as being resident for voting purposes, and will Salmond pay for their overnight bus ticket north on the 17th September 2014?!!”
Salmond has decided to let children vote in the referendum in the hope they are too naïve to see through him.
That in itself should be setting the alarm bells ringing.
Ref Sainsbury’s profits. Sky News say otherwise.
Sainsbury’s Annual Profits Fall 1.4% To £788m
Profits dip but Sainsbury’s boss Justin King confirms he has no plans to leave the supermarket chain.http://news.sky.com/story/1088140/sainsburys-annual-profits-fall-1-4-percent-to-788m
Quel dommage! Mr King’s (pay) package fell last year.
Sainsbury’s Justin King sees total pay fall to £3m http://www.standard.co.uk/business/business-news/sainsburys-justin-king-sees-total-pay-fall-to-3m-7827157.html
@Fred..Why not ? Our children are far better educated than those south of the border. And I am quite sure we will all pay our own bus tickets thank you very much.
Komodo-a completely false dichotomy:tiny Iceland has resisted the embrace both of the EU and the US (they were ejected from their Keflavik base years ago).
1. We don’t have geothermal power, and consequently a cheap power-intensive manufacturing base. (although North Sea oil could have delivered this, Thatcher decided not to bother, but to enter the petrodollar world oil market). Our tangible exports are lower per capita, and we are heavily reliant on financial scams (see posts above). Without being submerged in a larger market of some description, we can’t conceal our basic bankruptcy.
2. The point you are really missing is that the anti-Europeans in positions of influence here are headed by pro-American, pro-neocon politicians and their commercial friends. Therefore while it would be rational to say a plague on all your houses – and I would support this, in theory – that option is not open to us, due to our political structure.
3. Closing Keflavik was the US’s decision. With the end of the Cold War it was redundant.
And as for the idea that the nations of Europe have a common culture, which we also share, and that the EU has in some way bought this about…
…yes? I am expected to fill in the void in your thinking represented by the dots and agree with your implied conclusion? No can do. Read Gibbon’s ‘Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire’ and fill in the dots for yourself, at least for the first 1500 years or so.
But I didn’t suggest that the EU supplied the common culture. Though it is an attempt to embody it.