Covid: pick a side


Home Forums Discussion Forum Covid: pick a side

Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 116 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #72683 Reply
    J

    There are a number of well meaning contributors to this forum and blog who remain firmly on the side of all the evil in world.

    One or two of them already know who they are and some of you know exactly who they are. Others will probably never know what they themselves are. The fault isn’t necessarily theirs, as I said, they are well meaning individuals. The fault is their expertise, their education, the cradle to grave propaganda and in some cases their own sense of self esteem, often derived from their adherence to the rules they believe are constituted in good faith for the benefit of all. Despite their genuine good intent, they now represent the problem, but because they work so strenuously to deny the reality rapidly unfolding upon all of us, they can’t help it. They’ve been trained from birth and selected through education and occupation to do exactly what they are now doing. In other circumstances some of them would be right now be denouncing Craig but for the grace of God or accident.

    In the spirit of empiricism (etymology: ‘from experience’) I submit a number of videos which exemplify empiricism, or understanding and learning from experience. Please accept the possibility that others who disagree with you, do so from a position of knowledge and experience and do so in good will but during a climate of propaganda, deliberate polarisation and cultivated intolerance of other views through the wilful misrepresentation of those views. Craig’s followers are no exception. It is the air we breathe and the water we swim in.

    Press conference called by Independent Canadian MP Derek Sloan with Dr. Byram W. Bridle, viral immunologist and University of Guelph associate professor, Dr. Patrick Phillips of Englehart and District Hospital, and Dr. Donald Welsh, Western University physiology and pharmacology professor.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUrp5PlnBwQ

    Dr. Robert Malone is the inventor of mRNA Vaccine technology.

    https://brandnewtube.com/watch/spike-protein-is-very-dangerous-it-039-s-cytotoxic-robert-malone-steve-kirsch-bret-weinstein_uldEFtcMC4tJjvM.html

    Pierre Cory is an American critical care physician talking about his experience with Ivermectin. Ivermectin has more than ten years of safe use behind it unlike mRNA ‘vaccines’ and with many trials including gold standard double blind trials, has proved it’s efficacy against Covid19. It is an anti-biotic derived from Streptomyces bacteria which also has effective anti-viral properties. It is cheap, safe and if used early after onset of symptoms, effective against Covid19, yet there is a massively funded campaign against its use.

    Honest question: why?

    https://www.bitchute.com/video/qHjNQIynVb5O/

    Jazz musician, former IDF soldier and outspoken Palestinian rights activist Gilad Atzmon.

    https://www.bitchute.com/video/g4RTLmWjV8vw/

    Much, much more to follow.

    #72718 Reply
    Clark

    Do we really need the first three paragraphs about what sheeple or evil agents everyone else are? It’ll make whatever follows look like conspiracy theory, as does the aggressive forum title.

    Without following your links, it looks like you’re highlighting two separate issues: (1) mRNA vaccines are very dangerous and (2) there’s a campaign against the use of ivermectin. Are you suggesting “let the virus run wild but treat everyone with ivermectin”?

    #72719 Reply
    Clark

    I read it again just to check. What incredibly pompous shite!

    #72751 Reply
    J

    Clarke, over time I have satisfied myself that your opinions are not only negligible, but harmful. Those seeking truth might at least explore serious evidence based arguments contrary to their own position. You will not. I’ve proved that a number of times.

    #72754 Reply
    SA

    J
    Thanks for the carefully worded preamble and your interest in educating us who have a led a life of being indocrinated. But before I invest time in looking at your rather long references, can you please describe to me why you think your choice of links to educate is is the gold standard, and why for example should we listen to 38 minutes of a right wing nationalist Canadian MP talking? I tend to try and get my scientific and factual information from scientific publications. As you very well know, politicians are intrinsically trying to persuade us to their way of thinking, their interest in science, is usually limited to how much money and influence can be obtained from their speeches.

    #72760 Reply
    ET

    So what explicitly are you accusing some commentators of doing that constitutes evil?

    If ivermectin or any other treatment, for that matter, is proven to be beneficial I doubt anyone here would be against their use. I am always a little sceptical when it comes to anti-viral drugs simply because we haven’t got any good anti-virals apart perhaps from HIV treatments, despite years of research. We have many anti-biotics that are effective versus bacteria but not viruses. However that doesn’t mean I won’t be convinced by evidence that it works.

    The references are actually worth looking at. It is concerning that there seems to be such censorship. I agree with you relating to judgement from experience. We are at a time of medicine by protocol which has been relentlessly pursued at the cost of experience.

    #72768 Reply
    J

    “can you please describe to me why you think your choice of links to educate is is the gold standard”

    I haven’t said anything of the sort. If you’d encountered the arguments proffered, you’d already be reviewing the studies referred to by them, which themselves are ‘gold standard’ and you’d be availing yourself of the data.

    If you and Clarke can explain why you must attempt every rhetorical device to avoid actually refuting what you perceive as an invalid argument before hearing it, while taking the trouble to misrepresent and attack the character of those you haven’t bothered to hear but also those who put such arguments before you, why then I’d be most happy to oblige.

    #72773 Reply
    SA

    The device you use of asking us for the sake of openness and balance to start reading and watching lots of long videos and then asking for comments on them is deceptive. Why not ask in your own words the questions you wish us to answer. The thing is, I have seen this device used so often so often and know that it is a gambit to engage in these traps leading to a wild goose chase. Seen it all before.

    #72775 Reply
    Dredd

    J, let’s consider your introductory waffle for a moment. It’s a crude exercise in sophistry: the same spin could be applied to any domain to defend or attack any position. (“Do you believe in fairies? Don’t listen to the indoctrinated fools who’ve never even seen them; listen to the people with more open minds.”) You’re trying to stack the deck before you deal the cards, but your sleight of hand is a bit too obvious, I’m afraid.

    Your first trick is evident in the title Covid: pick a side. You’re setting up a false dichotomy: ‘them’ vs ‘us’; the ‘dumbfucks’ (including people who believe the media plus most scientific experts) vs the ‘enlightened free thinkers’ (who actually get most of their ‘knowledge’ from radical websites). But who says there are only two sides? The scientific field is rife with active debate (which is an essential element of scientific method). The various protest camps are far from unified: some think there’s no virus, some think there is a virus but it’s relatively harmless, some think the vaccines are designed to kill or sterilise, others that masks are useless, and so on; they have as many disagreements with each other as they do with the people they’re attacking. But you ignore all those divisions and serve up a simple ‘good vs evil’ plot that would be considered too primitive for a Hollywood flick.

    Once you’ve set up your simplistic dichotomy, you then allocate different groups via the black-and-white fallacy. You put the experts on the evil side with the dumbfucks, because they’re they’ve been trained in scientific method and therefore (according to you) have been taught to deny reality(?), which makes them evil (though they don’t know it). It’s a safe guess you’re not too familiar with postgraduate seminars. New scientific proposals are scrutinised in meticulous detail to find methodological weaknesses or a lack of fit to the available data. PhD candidates have to prove that they can examine and challenge existing ideas, and proceed to defend their alternative. That’s how they become experts – not by, as you seem to think, regurgitating information from a textbook. Moreover, any decent textbook clearly flags the issues of ongoing controversy, noting the areas that require further research. Your characterisation of evil experts, I’m afraid, doesn’t pay sufficient attention to real world science.

    If you smear scientific experts as incapable of critical thinking, you run into a slight problem (or should that be a “sleight” problem?): you need to put some scientific experts on your ‘good’ side to support your argument. You solve this with a sleight-of-hand move: “these experts aren’t like those other experts because … because they disagree with the majority consensus and are prepared to speak out about it. That’s what makes them ‘good experts’, so they can go in this good pile”. Err … nope, that’s what makes them mavericks – who aren’t automatically “good” or “evil”.

    Having stacked the deck you can deal out your cards into the good and evil piles: “Majority consensus? Evil.”, “Maverick view? Good.” Well, thanks, that’s quite entertaining, and it gives us useful information about how you think, but it doesn’t tell us much about things in the real world.

    Your good-vs-evil dichotomy is a crude attempt to skew the debate before you’ve even mentioned the medical issues. I hope we can sweep that sophistry away first.

    “Clarke, over time I have satisfied myself that your opinions are not only negligible, but harmful.”

    Thank you for telling us how satisfied you are, but I dare say your level of personal satisfaction is not a reliable arbiter of truth. I think you’re unlikely to be much of an expert in Clark’s opinions if you can’t even spell his name right.

    #72781 Reply
    J

    Dredd,

    If I have any point to make, I believe it will emerged organically from the responses to this thread, rather than being explicitly stated at the outset.

    “But who says there are only two sides?”

    Very good point. Who has said there are only two sides?

    One of my ambitions for this, erm, discussion, is to illustrate how atomised and divided we are by encouraging people who think they agree with each other to ‘react’ together, united by preconceptions against something which they refuse to encounter. Quite successful so far.

    #72785 Reply
    Dredd

    “encouraging people who think they agree with each other to ‘react’ together, united by preconceptions against something which they refuse to encounter. Quite successful so far.”

    Oh, was it? Sounds intriguing. Who are those “people who think they agree with each other”, anyway?

    I criticised your introductory guff because it was pure sophistry – which isn’t a good start in a discussion about medical science. You can attribute whatever alternative motives your imagination can conjure up and ramble on about those if you like – but it was still sophistry.

    #72809 Reply
    SA

    In your opening gambit you promise

    “Much, much more to follow.”

    As two of your links are from Bitchute, the well known extreme right wing alternative to youtube, forgive me for being cynical and not listen and watch this deranged propaganda. If you wish us to engage please can we avoid these sorts of links. I am sure you are well meaning but my opinion would have to change if you try to convince me that Bitchute is not the go-to channel for conspiracy and hate-filled right wing views.

    #72831 Reply
    Clark

    J, June 19 at 20:08, para. 3:

    “Please accept the possibility that others who disagree with you, do so from a position of knowledge and experience”

    J, June 20, 2021 at 18:44, para. 1:

    “Clarke, over time I have satisfied myself that your opinions are not only negligible, but harmful. Those seeking truth might at least explore serious evidence based arguments contrary to their own position. You will not. I’ve proved that a number of times.”

    Time to start following your own advice maybe, J?

    J, I asked you a question, ie. an invitation to discussion. I see that you had already set up your excuse for not engaging in such discussion. I expect that discussion is exactly what you are trying to avoid. “Over time…” etc… Do please remind me what you were pushing last time; “COVID’s all a hoax”, wasn’t it? So who would care whether ivermectin were an effective treatment for a hoax anyway? Only someone with an ulterior motive.

    Do please prove me wrong. I’ll give you another chance by repeating my question, ie. my invitation to further discussion – where are you heading with this? Let everyone catch covid but treat us all with ivermectin?

    #72832 Reply
    Clark

    And J, did I get your two assertions right? Come on, this isn’t exactly complicated.

    #72842 Reply
    SA

    “Dr. Robert Malone is the inventor of mRNA Vaccine technology.”

    To give J the benefit of the doubt I clicked on his link.
    Spike protein is very dangerous, it’s cytotoxic (Robert Malone, Steve Kirsch, Bret Weinstein)

    This was a discussion between Dr. Robert Malone, an acknowledged scientist who contributed some seminal work on RNA transfection into cells in 1989 as part of a group in The Salk Institute and has been active in research, and Steve Kirsch, an entrepreneur engineer who dabbles in medical science and in so doing displays a lot of ignorance

    “We are told that the vaccine stays in the arm and does not move around the body, but now we know that it does”

    Surprise surprise, it is well known that vaccines and antigens are distributed through the lymphatic system to major sites containing antigen processing cells in regional lymph nodes, spleen, bone marrow and so on. Then he goes on to describe anecdotally the number of people who have been afflicted with rare side effects from the Pfizer vaccine, his carpet cleaner(!) had a heart attack after the vaccine, but seems to be still cleaning carpets, and his previously healthy wife has severe attack of the shakes, whereas horrific abortions with bloody faces in a 25 week pregnant woman is graphically described. But all these cases are not reported because the victims have no voices and the groupthink of all doctors dictate that silence is maintained because they must reiterate “the vaccine is safe”.

    Bret Weinstein, the moderator/presenter is also full of anecdotes, everyone except his parents, reacted to the vaccine including his doctor and dentist and anyone he met. Although Dr Malone spoke with some authority, he was not convincing unfortunately in this rather anecdotal concept. Dr. Malone can be excused for feeling a bit left out of the glory surrounding the RNA vaccines as he does not seem that he has a Wikipedia page (yet) but his wife does explain his grievance in a Linked-in article.

    • This reply was modified 5 months, 1 week ago by modbot.
    • This reply was modified 5 months, 1 week ago by modbot.
    • This reply was modified 5 months, 1 week ago by modbot.
    #72873 Reply
    J

    Clarke (I prefer the extraneous e):

    COVID’s all a hoax”, wasn’t it? So who would care whether ivermectin were an effective treatment for a hoax anyway? Only someone with an ulterior motive.

    Do tell. Let us recall how you more or less accused me of being an anti-Semite with no basis whatsoever. Surely, being as evidence based as you claim, you can provide some documentary evidence to to back up this smear “J says Covid is all a hoax”.

    #72875 Reply
    J

    SA,

    We know that bullies everywhere are fond of denying the experience of their victims. Do you disagree? And here you are insisting that everyone is lying apart from you and let me add that I do accept take your point, these people could be lying, although you don’t attempt to prove it, you merely assume. (This is a value judgement, is it not?)

    From my own experience (and empiricism, let us remind ourselves, is the product of experience is it not?) the stepfather of my daughter (my ex-wife remarried) was on the operating table having stents inserted into his arteries three days after having received his first ‘jab’ due to heart attack caused by blood clots throughout his body. I’ve actually worked with him in the past and despite his advanced years on me, he actually did outstrip me. Fit as the proverbial fiddle.

    I’ve heard many similar stories in recent months despite also knowing plenty of people who’ve had Covid vaccines and merely felt very unwell for weeks or months and others who were more or less fine beyond localised discomfort. Only a zealot would claim this is not data, but if it is never recorded in the context of vaccines, then it actually never becomes data. Much as the MoD is still able to claim that less than five hundred thousand people were killed by the Iraq war through the simple expedient of not recording the 2.4 million deaths. I’m happy for you that you are able to trust our institutions to work freely on your behalf without interference. You must be a very happy man.

    #72877 Reply
    J

    “In your opening gambit you promise

    ‘Much, much more to follow.’

    As two of your links are from Bitchute, the well known extreme right wing alternative to youtube, forgive me for being cynical and not listen and watch this deranged propaganda. If you wish us to engage please can we avoid these sorts of links. I am sure you are well meaning but my opinion would have to change if you try to convince me that Bitchute is not the go-to channel for conspiracy and hate-filled right wing views.”

    All of these videos were formerly available on most video hosting websites, including youtube until they were banned from all those sites. Do you think it proves your case that they are now only available on Bitchute, and if so, can you re-affirm exactly what it is that you are arguing?

    #72884 Reply
    SA

    “From my own experience (and empiricism, let us remind ourselves, is the product of experience is it not?) the stepfather of my daughter (my ex-wife remarried) was on the operating table having stents inserted into his arteries three days after having received his first ‘jab’ due to heart attack caused by blood clots throughout his body…”

    This does not make any medical sense I am afraid and also I am afraid is neither empiricism nor data.

    Let me tell you I know 25 people at least who had vaccines, including myself that have just had the usual reactions associated with vaccines. Also I know many people personally who had covid 19 and have been hospitalised and one who died in respiratory failure. So what does all this mean? My empiricism and my data are better than yours?

    No. Data has to be verified to be meaningful, and all of what either of us is doing is recounting, anecdotally, what we have experienced. It is true that initial anecdotal findings are then properly collated and when this happens, meaningful results are generated as happened with the now well-documented relationship between a particular type of blood clots and the AZ and Johnson vaccines. It all ties in and a mechanism is described and findings corroborated.

    But to go back to your daughter’s stepfather, we need more information to make sense of what you say in lay terms. How old is he, what underlying medical conditions did he have? What are the blood findings at the time and so on. Your anecdote remains just that, and a coinciding with b does not mean that a caused b.

    The current problem of some people doubting science and suddenly finding themselves enabled to interpret complex data and also to trust their own data and their own go to websites creates a self-fulfilling bubble and a feeling of power that you are onto something, those others have not got onto. Most of those analyses are made by disgruntled scientists and backed by right wing individuals and organisations to cloud the issues and politicise what is essentially a public health emergency. I freely admit that governments also do the same and this is shown by the totally different approach in say China RSK, NZ and others, as opposed to the neoliberal pseudo democracies and the results show.

    Well I am afraid I will have to disagree with you on Bitchute and we probably have to leave it there as we both know our own ‘truths’. I am sure you can enjoy P**ndemic on Bitchute.

    #72915 Reply
    Clark

    J, please try to read a bit more coherently rather than leaping into rhetorical combat; I asked questions. I don’t remember what your previous stance was and I don’t remember where it was posted, so I asked you to clarify. I don’t know where you’re trying to get with your two initial assertions (around which which you claimed to classify everyone into absolute good and absolute evil, but then mysteriously lost interest in), so I asked.

    On the covid-related points you’ve actually made, you seem keen to leap to rhetoric rather than rational discussion, and are degenerating alarmingly towards anti-vaxx conspiracy theory; “if it is never recorded in the context of vaccines, then it actually never becomes data. Much as the MoD is still able to claim that less than five hundred thousand people were killed by the Iraq war through the simple expedient of not recording the 2.4 million deaths” – maybe I need to remind you that it was the Lancet that published the challenge to the military’s mortality figures in Iraq? You have some actual evidence that the vaccines are far more dangerous than covid itself, do you? That tens of thousands of ordinary medical and local authority staff, people who live down your own street, are taking a break from their normal, chosen duties of care and community service, and instead covering up mass murder on behalf of Bill Gates or someone?

    Come on Mr Conspiracy Theorist; stop thrashing around and tell us where you hope to get via your rhetoric.

    #72919 Reply
    SA

    J

    “We know that bullies everywhere are fond of denying the experience of their victims. Do you disagree? And here you are insisting that everyone is lying apart from you and let me add that I do accept take your point, these people could be lying, although you don’t attempt to prove it, you merely assume. (This is a value judgement, is it not?)”

    Amazing allegations J. I accused no one of lying, just that they have not produced any coherent evidence, first of the occurrence of what they describe and the relative numbers involved, and secondly of the causal link between what they have supposedly sand vaccinations. Their story, is just a series of anecdotes. Anyone can make these allegations and sometimes perceptions can lead to distortions and misconceptions. Interestingly this is a very well known device used by conspiracy theorists, stress actors, Sandy Hook etc…, you know what I mean. Also interestingly the same people go on about died with rather than died of when it comes to the virus, but anybody who has been run over by a bus, died of the vaccine (reductio ad absurdum I know – I hope you have some sense of humour!)

    J seriously though, what exactly are you trying to prove? The simplistic title of your post is rather naïve. What side is there to pick? I hope we all want to pick the side of humanity, saving lives and conquering disease. Some of us have the knowledge and the experience of this first hand and others are so far removed that they do not recognise how difficult and absurd it is to make some of these allegations that are floated. The PCR is a useless test, the virus does not exist, the virus is no worse than the flu, ivermectin and chloroquine are so good but the evil doctors are suppressing the evidence, and many more absurdities. There is no one side and there is no one solid group of deniers, there are just so much irritating background noise that actually detracts from the real mismanagements and mistakes and manipulations by politicians and others. What you are doing is detracting from serious issues by accusing us of either being evil or misguided. You are the bully.

    #72920 Reply
    SA

    Perhaps I should have toned down my last sentence and not accuse you of being a bully, as long as you also recognise the absurdity of your insinuations that I am one.

    #72931 Reply
    Clark

    “if it is never recorded in the context of vaccines, then it actually never becomes data”

    The vaccination programmes are now well advanced; tens of millions of people in the UK have been vaccinated, and well over half of the population in some countries, much higher proportions than actually got infected. If the vaccines were causing death at a fraction of the rate covid itself does, pronounced humps would be showing in those countries’ general mortality curves, and they’d track the vaccination rate.

    Are they? You’ve checked this data have you J? Multiple, diverse governments all over the world are not merely coordinating to fraudulently attribute vaccine deaths to other causes on behalf of Bill Gates’s vaccine foundation, they’re also actually falsifying the standard local government Births, Deaths and Marriages registers that had been going for centuries before this pandemic even showed up, right?

    Please ignore these questions, since you have already proven that my motivations are evil 😀

    #72998 Reply
    J

    https://taibbi.substack.com/p/why-has-ivermectin-become-a-dirty-7bd

    — SNIP —

    [ Mod: Pasted 3,000 word article removed.

    Kindly refrain from quoting long articles that can be read via a link. Also, you should offer some commentary on the contents. From the moderation rules for commenters:

    Contribute
    Contributions which are primarily just a link to somewhere else will be deleted. You can post links, but give us the benefit of your thoughts upon them.

    Regards. ]

    #73001 Reply
    J

    We’re now very deep into serious accusations from the bullies on Craig’s blog, none whom seem to refer to what I’ve actually written, all of whom seem keen to tell me what it is I’m saying, have said, stand for, believe in and what I think. Keep it coming.

    #73004 Reply
    J

    I note that Mods are now censoring articles here too. Is Matt Taibi a slavering anti-vaxxer? Is the Mod responsible willing to come out and accuse him?


    [ Mod: No, the mod noticed that you had reproduced a 3,000 word article in blockquote formatting without including any commentary of your own, and so the message was suspended for a few minutes so that it could be trimmed and an annotation added to that effect. Such a long quotation would have been removed no matter who posted it.

    Kindly refrain from impugning the integrity of moderators. ]

    #73005 Reply
    J

    The link is here for the few with enough intellectual curiosity: https://taibbi.substack.com/p/why-has-ivermectin-become-a-dirty-7bd


    [ Mod: The link wasn’t removed from your earlier comment. Please offer some commentary on its contents if you would like it to remain. ]

    #73020 Reply
    J

    Total nonsense from the Mods. You’ve used the same logic to censor my own lenghty posts on the main blog, advising me instead to post lengthy items here, but lo and behold, can’t do it here either. Will we run out pixels? Admit it, you know full well that nobody here will click on links to information they do not want to read.


    [ Mod: The point is that they have to be your own words – as clearly stated in Craig’s moderation guidelines.

    As you seem determined to have a running battle with moderators, you’re now on pre-mod. ]

    #73031 Reply
    Clark

    J, 19:06:

    “…none whom seem to refer to what I’ve actually written…”

    J, I keep asking you about your opinions, but you ignore it.

    I’ve just had a general look at the ivermectin situation. There seems to be various research in progress, and calls for more research, specific types of research and in particular better quality research. There seems to be a general problem that many of the claims that ivermectin treats covid are based on administering doses ten times or more greater than the established dose.

    Is antiviral pharmacology something you have been interested in for a long time? Or are you more intrigued by the possibility of international science conspiracies?

    #73036 Reply
    Clark

    J, I have now read Matt Taibbi’s article at your substack.com link. It’s a fairly good article, and highly relevant to a paragraph of Craig’s post Assange Is Still in Jail. But it is not about ivermectin; it is about moderation policy tending towards censorship at Facebook and YouTube (Google), with a passing mention of Twitter.

    Now there’s a lot I would write about that, having done some moderation myself and knowing some of the problems and what a nightmare it can be. But rather than risk you replying as if I were dirt again, I’ll just ask up front; would you rather I just shut up?

    #73037 Reply
    Clark

    – “What I have to say is so dangerous to the elite that they’ll censor it, and I’ll prove it. I’ll start a forum with a highly divisive title, launch three preemptive paragraphs of serious moral denigration of other commenters, break a longstanding moderation policy and pick a fight with the mods, who’ll censor it for the links I’ll put in; just watch.”

    #73044 Reply
    SA

    J
    You threw a whole lot of different examples of dissent against the prevailing ‘narrative’ about covid and suggested a binary choice, mixing videos from Bitchute and some more serious articles. I welcome the latter including the article by Matt Taibbi and the ivermectin controversy. These are genuine dilemmas and mixing them up with all sort of other denialists nonsense is supposed to catch us out?
    As to the latter, yes ivermectin seems to have some action but a panel from the WHO has reviewed the evidence and decided that the existing data is not sufficient to include ivermectin in its recommendation for treatment and that carefully conducted RCTs are needed to do so. https://www.who.int/news-room/feature-stories/detail/who-advises-that-ivermectin-only-be-used-to-treat-covid-19-within-clinical-trials
    That was a debate amongst scientists. It may still be the case that ivermectin works unlike chloroquine, it is not potentially dangerous at least if people do not start taking the veterinary preparations.

    Yes we need serious discussions but we have to select our sources. I am still not sure what you believe in, in the side you have picked, and it is important for us to know. Do you believe that the virus exists and is a serious threat? Do you believe that the PCR is a reliable test or as some websites proclaim ignorantly that it has a 90% false positive rate?
    Clark and I have disagreed in the past in other threads especially about whether the virus was a lab escape. We have exchanged opposite views but without accusing each other of ulterior motives. In fact as new evidence comes Clark may be right but who knows. Do not be like George Bush please and translate everything into “you are either for us or against us”.

    #73053 Reply
    josh R

    SA,

    “…Bitchute, the well known extreme right wing alternative to youtube”

    hilarious :-))))

    #73063 Reply
    Dawg

    Well, SA isn’t alone in that assessment. There’s a page for Bitchute on the Media Bias Fact Check site: https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/bitchute/

    “Detailed Report
    Reasoning: Poor Sourcing, Conspiracy, Propaganda, Lack of Transparency, Fake News, Hate Speech
    Bias Rating: EXTREME RIGHT
    Factual Reporting: VERY LOW
    Country: United Kingdom (33/180 Press Freedom)
    Media Type: Website
    Traffic/Popularity: High Traffic
    MBFC Credibility Rating: LOW CREDIBILITY”

    It seems you’ve just betrayed your own political locus, Josh R. If Bitchute doesn’t count as right wing by your standards, then you’re clearly off the chart. Useful to know.

    #73096 Reply
    SA
    #73097 Reply
    SA

    And just to be clear:

    “This report shows:

    1. That absence of moderation and willingness to host hateful content is the unique selling point of the platform
    2. That the platform is dominated by content and producers that have been, or would be, removed from other platforms
    3. That BitChute is knowingly playing host to terrorist propaganda and incitement to violence. Our research has identified 114 videos in support of proscribed terrorist groups on BitChute, including 23 videos in support of National Action and 86 videos promoting the Islamic State group.
    4. That BitChute actively promotes conspiracy theories and misinformation.”
    #73109 Reply
    Dawg

    Here’s a couple of fact checker refutations of the dodgy speculations about vaccine cytotoxicity in that video featuring Weinstein, Malone and Kirsch:

    REUTERS FACT CHECK

    “Fact Check-COVID-19 vaccines are not ‘cytotoxic’

    Posts are sharing the false statement that the spike protein in COVID-19 vaccines is cytotoxic, suggesting that it kills or damages cells. There is no evidence to support this.

    [ … ] VERDICT
    False. There is no evidence that COVID-19 vaccines are cytotoxic (toxic to cells).”

    POLITIFACT

    “No sign that the COVID-19 vaccines’ spike protein is toxic or ‘cytotoxic’
    [ … ] Bret Weinstein, who is identified in the video as an evolutionary biologist, is the one who says the spike protein in the vaccines “is very dangerous, it’s cytotoxic.”

    Dr. Robert Malone, identified in the video as the inventor of mRNA vaccine technology, said he sent “manuscripts” months ago to the U.S. Food and Drug Administration claiming the spike protein posed a health risk. “And their determination was that they didn’t think that that was sufficient documentation of the risk that the spike was biologically active,” he said.

    The third person in the video is identified as “serial entrepreneur” Steve Kirsch, who said he is an engineer. He cited a claim by Canadian viral immunologist Byram Bridle that the vaccine doesn’t stay in the shoulder, where it’s injected, but “goes throughout your entire body, it goes to your brain to your heart.”

    Bridle’s claim: False
    We rated False Bridle’s claim that the COVID-19 vaccines’ spike protein means people are being inoculated “with a toxin.”

    Experts told PolitiFact there is no evidence to back his allegation that the spike protein produces a toxin that could cause serious health problems.”

    Of course a diehard conspiracy theorist won’t take any heed of fact checker sites – “facts? who needs ’em?” – but the scientific sources for their verdicts are fully declared, so you can take it up with the scientists.

    #73131 Reply
    ET

    After a little more digging about I found this site, primarily undermining Bridle’s claims with cited references to the relevant papers. This piece gives an explanation of the difference between virus produced spike protein and vaccine produced spke protien.

    The evidence for the widespread distribution of “spike protein” comes from this leaked confidential Pfizer biodistribution study.
    It should be noted that they infer from the distribution of the lipid nano particles where the vaccine mRNA contained within them may reach. The mRNA thus distributed is NOT, I repeat, NOT spike protein. It is mRNA that codes for the modified spike protein used in the vaccine and won’t become translated into the modified spike protein until it enters a cell. The modified spike protein coded for in the vaccine mRNA is modified such that it does not escape the cell in the way the virus does but is instead anchored to the cell membrane and is thus presented to the immune system.

    J, perhaps you could state your opinion, why you hold that opinion and cite the relevant literature you base that opinion on. Rather than have me listen to 4 or 5 hours of video you could summarise and link to the relevant ivermectin studies that you find most convincing.

    #73135 Reply
    ET

    Here is another link addressing some of the referred to studies used to infer vaccines are dangerous, Specifically, I’d draw your attention the the last part addressing the study that found 11 of 13 people vaccinated had spike protein detected in their blood after vaccination despite the vaccine manufacturers claiming the spike protein doesn’t enter the blood and is modified as explained above to stay anchored to the cell wall.

    Spoiler, the amount is minuscule (picograms) and transient and may be related to protease enzymatic events or leakage from the immune cells lysing the cell exposing the spike protein. Plus, it’s only part of the spike protein.

    #73154 Reply
    josh R

    Dawg

    brilliant!
    another day, another rib tickler :-))

    Bitchute is a ‘platform’, I don’t think you need a political affiliation card to use it.
    Can’t say I’ve navigated the actual site, just see anti imperialists, Palestinian justice advocates, un-doctors, un-scientists, etc. providing links to their content stored on Bitchute.

    Voices who are deemed “Poor Sourcing, Conspiracy, Propaganda, Lack of Transparency, Fake News, Hate Speech” by whichever particular, self appointed Ministry of Truth you favour.

    Some I find useful, some I don’t.

    I just ‘right click’, ‘save as’ & Bob’s your uncle. No funny handshakes or political conformity assessments :-))

    I’ve never really been inclined to rely on a third party to tell me what to read, watch or think. Nor have I ever been inclined to think that I’m uniquely placed to discern the validity of opinions whilst everyone else is too daft to do likewise & therefore needs ‘Nanny’ to do it for them.

    As to having “betrayed (my) political locus”, I wish there was an emoji I could post showing me bawling my little heart out, but I guess “Boo Hoo” will have to suffice.

    Does that mean I’m now “the wrong kind of Lefty”? or maybe a “self hating socialist”?
    :-)))
    Labels, gotta luv ’em.

    And regarding being “…clearly off the chart. Useful to know”, I think I’m probably quite happy not being on whatever chart you’re referring to & I trust that that is also “useful to know”.

Viewing 40 posts - 1 through 40 (of 116 total)
Reply To: Reply #72875 in Covid: pick a side
Your information: