Solar Subsidy – Government That Works

by craig on October 27, 2011 4:04 pm in Uncategorized

One of the ways I stop myself getting over-depressed in periods whent I am skint is to make plans for what I will do with money when I have some. At the moment I am looking at mounting solar panels on my roof.

I intend to put up 12 panels producing 3000 kWh per year, at an initial cost of about £7,000. This will produce an income based on the feed-in tariff of about £750, index linked, on official statistics, and probably a little more as Ramsgate is one of the sunniest part of England, and my roof faces perfectly South with a 32 degree pitch. This works well for me as a personal investment – hard to get an index-linked and safe return over 10% nowadays.

This is of course because the feed-in tariff, at over 40p per kw/h is far greater than the current economic cost of generation (the gas turbine power station we have just built in Ghana, for example, produces at a full cost of about 10p per kw/h).

BUT we are going to produce ourselves over half the electricity we use. What is more a whole new industry has been kick-started. In getting quotes I have been besieged by local firms, all based within a few miles from here. That is an awful lot of people employed, paying tax and not claiming benefits. With this artificial stimulation of demand, the price of solar panel installations has plummeted as production savings kick in. In three years the cost per kw/h has halved. I will not be surprised if it halves again. As fossil fuel costs continue to rise, this will become a fully economic way to produce electricity. The kick-starting of that process by the feed-in tariff is a rare example of the government creatively stimulating the economy to promote economic growth and employment.

The government has put countless billions in bailouts and guarantees into propping up rich bankers and protecting them from the consequences of their uselessness at their job. Quantitive easing has given them a further £225 billion. Think of this. That £225 billion has been used to subsidise useless bankers by giving them good money in return for junk assets they had invested in. Not a single penny has found its way to anybody else but a banker, as increased bank lending has not happened.

Quantitive Easing has been described by paid apologists of the 1% as neo-Keynesianism, reflating the economy. Utter bollocks. It is a transfer of wealth to rich bankers, paid for by everybody else as high inflation. But what if the £225 billion created by quantitive easing had really been used in a Keynesian way, for public works?

What if it had been used to insulate everybody’s home, to give everybody solar panels, micro wind turbines, and heat pumps? What employment and growth would have been created then? What if we had built high speed railways and the Severn barrage?

No – they just gave the cash to the fatcat bankers. The solar feed-in tariff is the only measure of government economic stimulation I can think of. The Conservatives wish now to abandon it, on ideological grounds.

58 Comments

  1. nuid

    27 Oct, 2011 - 4:20 pm

    You’re making me so angry. No, I don’t mean you, yourself. I mean what you’re writing about.

  2. enki

    27 Oct, 2011 - 4:21 pm

    Unfortunately, this scheme probably just shifts money from poor households (who don’t have capital to invest in solar panels and will pay increased fuel bills to subsidise the feed in tariff) to middle class households (who do have capital and whose energy costs will be reduced) without making a substantial contribution to reducing carbon emissions.

    http://www.monbiot.com/2010/03/01/a-great-green-rip-off/

  3. gyges

    27 Oct, 2011 - 4:37 pm

    Craig

    You’re participating in the transfer of wealth from poor to rich.

    You should be ashamed of yourself.

    Shame on you.

  4. Clare

    27 Oct, 2011 - 4:42 pm

    The energy companies are offering the same service to the poor by amortizing the capital costs onto their future energy bills. I don’t know whether the effective rate of interest outweighs the return on the feed in tarriff or not. Either way, Craig’s point is still good as extra work is generated by supply and installation although in these cases the profit is taken by the energy co.s rather than independent contractors. It’s still real product and service though and better than QE.

  5. Michael Culver

    27 Oct, 2011 - 4:49 pm

    Ki££ the Bankers.

  6. Stephen

    27 Oct, 2011 - 5:00 pm

    Craig

    I daresay you will call me a paid apologist or a neo Keynesian – but QE does not work as you say – nearly all the assets purchased to date have been UK Government gilts together with a small amount of highly rated corporate paper – this is not junk by the normal definition of the term. Go and research it on the B of E website if you don’t believe me.

    The idea of QE is not to make a transfer of wealth to the bankers (that has been achieved by other means i.e propping up the entire banking sector by supporting the banks that would have otehrwise have gone broke) – but to encourage the banks to lend more by making their balance sheets more liquid. If there had been a massive growth in lending (or money supply) without any increase in output – then you might have had an argument that QE had led to inflation – but it hasn’t.

    The inflation we are experiencing now is largley imported – and is no doubt being exarcabated by all the speculative activity being undertaken by hedge funds and price fixing/market manipulation by some multinationals – but it really isn’t due to QE.

    You clearly draw much of your economics from the old Milton Friedman monetarist school – but I think you will find that most monetarist economists were and are in favour of a relaxtion of monetary policy in the current economic climate. Keynes himself also favoured a relaxtion of monetary policy in a recession as well as a loosening of fiscal policy.

    Of course as an old fashioned Keynesian, I don’t think now is the time for a tightening of fiscal policy and it cwertainly shouldn’t have started until the economy was growing. This of course was the expressed view of the LibDems during the electtion – but unfortunately they were led by a charlatan who kept his true views quiet until after the election – perhaps we should blame the members of that Party for not holding its MPs to their electoral commitments?

    I of course share the view that there are many things wrong with present day capitalism – what I don’t share is the nihilism in which many on this website rejoice. The reality is that we need to get markets/capitalism working and regulated properly in everyones’ interests – the barter/central planning models have even greater weaknesses and all else sounds like incoherent gobbledegook. There is plenty of serious thinking around about how capitalism should be regulated managed if anyone cares to look – Ha Chung’s latest book is a pretty accessible starting point.

    Re solar power – I cannot help thinking that putting c20m2 slabs of panels on the roofs of private houses is a pretty inefficient way of going around developing alternative energy.

  7. Ed Davies

    27 Oct, 2011 - 5:25 pm

    Right first time, it’s “kWh”. Subsequent “kw/h”s would be very unusual units and are not what you mean.

    Note, though, that there’s quite a high probability that the FITs rates will drop substantially in the near future. How much of the reductions will apply to installations which have already been commissioned will be interesting to see. Primarily this is because the scheme has been so successful: the prices of PV have dropped a lot and the uptake has meant that most of the money committed has already been taken.

  8. craig

    27 Oct, 2011 - 5:26 pm

    Stephen,

    I don’t see how that works. Assuming you mean British government bonds, as opposed to Greek or Spanish or Italian, what incentive would the bankers have to sell gilts to the Bank of England for cash? Unless they were offered a heavy premium, in which case that is indeed just a way of giving more money to the bankers.

    I disagee that QE is not connected to our increased inflation, or that the current inflation rise is due to rising costs of imports. Mind you, we are about to see an end to the largely Chinese produced continuous fall in prices of basic consumer goods, which has been holding back inflation.

  9. evgueni

    27 Oct, 2011 - 5:45 pm

    “.. every encouragement to labour, every reward bestowed upon industry, beyond the natural price of its product, is a gratuitous gift, a bribe taken out of the consumer and offered in his name to a favourite of power, in exchange for zero, for nothing. To encourage industry, then, is synonymous at bottom with encouraging idleness: it is one of the forms of swindling.” Proudhon, 19th century.
    .
    I would like a demonstration of the benefits to ME of subsidising YOUR energy consumption, Craig.

  10. Stephen

    27 Oct, 2011 - 6:00 pm

    Craig

    The gilts are not necessarily purchased from the banks but also from pension funds etc. who then place the funds into the banking system. The premium didn’t have to be too high to get them to hand over long gilts (yes they are UK gilts) and it also has the benefit of pushing longer term interest rates down. You will also find that the BofE gets a nice turn in its QE operations.

    You may disagree that QE is not connected to increased inflation – but if it is could you please explain the mechanism by which this occurs. You may wish to look at the overall money supply figures first however. You may remember the old Cambridge research (letter to the Times) that gave a better correlation between bubonic plague (with an arbitrary lag) and inflation than Friedman’s theory (based on an 18-24 month lag) – which demonstrated the need for some understanding of how the inflation was caused rather than just saying A happened before B, therefore A caused B.

    I think that you may find that it is Chinese demand that is usually given as the root cause for much of the commodity price inflation that we are suffering – although the speculators and hedge funds may be using this argument to their advantage.

  11. mary

    27 Oct, 2011 - 6:03 pm

    Those who really need it won’t get it.
    .
    21 October 2011 Last updated at 16:53

    Social tenants to miss £120 solar savings
    By Simon Gompertz
    Personal finance correspondent, BBC News
    .
    Workmen installing solar panels on to the roofs of homes in Delabole near Bodmin (photo)
    .
    Related Stories
    Solar panels for council houses
    UK solar panel subsidies slashed
    Renewable heating scheme unveiled
    .
    A pioneering project to provide 22,000 tenants of social housing schemes with solar panels generating free electricity is in jeopardy.
    .
    Fears the government will cut subsidies for solar installations has led to financial support being put on hold.
    .
    The project had been planned by Empower Community, a social enterprise.
    .
    Empower says families would have saved an average of £120 from their electricity bills by using free solar power during daylight hours.
    .
    Empower’s project was supported by eight local authorities and housing associations, along with charities and a major pension fund.
    .
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15402997

  12. ingo

    27 Oct, 2011 - 6:09 pm

    Good idea for those who can afford it, like you say. £ 7000 is still a tidy sum. My advice is shop around and do not forget that continental firms have already done this sort of work for decades, they might be cheaper. I
    In Norfolk we can see the semi public contratcors and housing association benefit most. Saffron is installing solar panels on most of the roofs it now owns, tennants get cheaper bills allright, but Saffron is getting the feed in tarif, it owns the roof, not the tennats.

    Some schemes purport to ‘rent’ your roof and they want it for 25 years in return for cheaper bills. This has the complicated extra that, should one want to sell, the new tennat would have to agree to the contract and use of his roof which is owned by the company who leased it for the time agreed.

    The level of feed in tarifs are subject to respective Governments, but EU FIT regs., you know, by the hated Brussels controllers, blah blah, bent bananas blah blah, has been enshrined in EUI legislation and agreed by industry, so it cannot be removed alltogether.

    If the Government thinks it can give lucrative FITs to the Crown estate wind turbines reaching beyond territorial waters into the North Sea, whilst giving puny returns to householders, then they are mistaken. There is one FIT for all and if it decreases with decreasing demand and whole sale prices then that is acceptable.
    Energy prices are going up, despite the flatlining economies, higher demand during winter should also mean higher FITs, if FITs are not related to market pricing and are kept low arbitrarily, then the Government is stalling its own green energy drive and CO2 reduction targets, such equation would be just another robbery.

  13. Stephen

    27 Oct, 2011 - 6:10 pm

    Craig

    I don’t disagree with your view that the Govt is being soft with the banks/financial sector – its just that it is in areas other than QE.

    Banks also have a legitimate function in recycling savings into investment, rather than the more casino like activities of recent years, if you stop or don’t encourage the legitimate function happening when there is a recession then I’m afraid it will be ordinary people not the bankers who will suffer the most.

  14. mary

    27 Oct, 2011 - 6:12 pm

    46 mins in on You and Yours this morning on Radio 4 on generating electricity from photo voltaic panels, the economics thereof and the way the government funding has been rapidly taken up.
    .
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0169257

  15. Richard

    27 Oct, 2011 - 6:14 pm

    Unfortunately, the subsidies for wind and solar are, an environmental red-herring, and simply increase the cost of energy for everyone. We have 10% of people in fuel poverty, and this won’t stop rising till we stop *wasting* money on feel-good eco projects.

    What we should do is:
    1. Stop ALL the subsidies for inefficient power production.
    2. Build new nuclear plants. These are still the safest form of energy out there. This is worth saying twice: Nuclear isn’t the “least worst” option; it’s the absolute best one.
    3. Move the tax system so that VAT becomes a CO2 tax instead. Same total tax-take, but charged on CO2 emissions (including imported ones).
    4. Invest some more money in R&D to produce practical renewable power, rather than politically-viable power. The current generation of renewables aren’t good enough – we shouldn’t be deploying them.

  16. JimmyGiro

    27 Oct, 2011 - 6:37 pm

    I agree with Richard; and I would add, a better use for solar power generation is to deploy giant ‘solar farms’ in places that can best utilize them, such as the Sahara desert, which is fit for bugger-all else really.
    .
    The North Africans can earn by working these giant installations, plus rent charges, and Europe can buy the surplus electricity, transported via high-tension power lines through Sicily-Italy, and through Morocco-Spain.
    .
    But repeating Richard, Nuclear is the best option; artificially expensive due to bureaucratic hyper-administrative health and safety demands, so potentially much cheaper if the political will was there.

  17. mark_golding

    27 Oct, 2011 - 6:42 pm

    Stephen,
    .
    I agree with Craig, QE is bollocks in our times, yes it appeared to work in the 1930′s great depression, but consumer demand was different, the government then like Bush encouraged spend, spent spent – Hey here’s $500 – take it – Ah! pay it back at a few dollars a week – that’s OK we can trust you – here’s a card.
    .
    Like Craig has told us Chinese imports of cheap basic consumer goods is drying up, wages are stagnant, benefits are being slashed, pensions are frozen and joe public is very cautious and looking for ways to reduce outgoings; so, we have less money to spend – hey many people are struggling to pay their energy and water bills – and even Sky is witnessing a decline in entertainment packages; restaurants are closing, replaced by take-away treats on pay-days and high days and allotments now have long waiting lists. Today the staples of fuel, food and manufactured goods are mainly imports and are rapidly rising in price. This reduces demand for consumer goods and services which then negatively impacts the economy- QE’d low interest or not.
    .
    All this is really common sense – the politicians have been screwed and they will now screw us and laugh because three political parties are really one – sorted!

  18. ingo

    27 Oct, 2011 - 6:52 pm

    Whilst it is easy to agree with CSP plants in the Mahgreb as envisaged by DESERTEC, the idea of being wiped around the mush with a wet fish, twice and once again agree with more of the same connventional nuclear fusion, only choosen to create plutionium and arm rogue states with nuclear arms, is alien to me.

    I have some time for Thorium reactors but I’m afraid that I do not entertain being dependent on french nuclear power and Russian Oligarch controlled gas.
    Fact is that some 30.000 pensioners are freezing to death each winter due to high prices and dependencies on ripp off merchants, whilst the proponents of poetic notion for one’s unspoiled views of the landscape, our Engeland of rolling hills, are walking all over their dead bodies. This is not acceptable anymore.

  19. craig

    27 Oct, 2011 - 7:43 pm

    Mary -

    Ingo is right. The Empower housing association scheme and similar schemes are a scam. The tenant gets about 10% of the benefit, from slightly reduced electricity bills. 90% of the benefit – the feed-in tariff, goes to Empower, a bit of it shared with the Housing Association to help it keep up its colossal executive slaries, company cars, free executive housing etc.

    Interesting this is “housing associations, local authorities and pension funds”. There is a Blair spinoff vehicle called Empower which gets, or tries to, aid funded payment for very expensive temporary energy solutions in Africa. Completely New Labour, headed by “Lord” Cohen if memory serves. If “Empower community” is linked to that New Labour cream-off-public-money Blair croney vehicle, the Housing Association link makes perfect sense and I can guess which kind of local authorities and pension funds are involved.

  20. anno

    27 Oct, 2011 - 8:08 pm

    Again 100% spot on, Craig. Don’t do it again, please. I’ll have nothing to complain about. The government has borrowed lots of money to fund this scheme, so it isn’t entirely clean. What they should have done is what Gordon Brown would have done if the Banks
    hadn’t forced a change, give grants for all houses’ outside walls to be insulated in the UK. That would have kept the entire construction industry, electricians, deocrators, decorators, joiners etc busy for 3 decades. Not enough brainpower in government to do the obvious, necessary thing. Ever, I’m afraid.

  21. craig

    27 Oct, 2011 - 8:08 pm

    If, for example, Ingo were God’s only son, and had never ever mentioned the fact to other commenters on the blog, I should consider that remiss of him. Oops wrong thread. Enjoyable theology on last one.

  22. evgueni

    27 Oct, 2011 - 8:18 pm

    Energy consumption for my 3-bed semi is ~18kWh/annum (combined gas & electricity). 3kWh is but a 6th of that total, woo-hoo. Worth £7k?
    .
    Here’s another fly in the ointment – I cannot guarantee I will stay in my house for 5 years, yet alone 25 years. Can anyone?
    .
    I smell ideology. Has greenflation been mentioned already? :-)
    .
    The above notwithstanding, I anticipate a “revolution” of sorts when the means becomes available to individuals not only of generating energy economically, but also of storing it. Safe, low-cost, high energy and power density Li-Ion batteries are currently the best contender, e.g. those based on lithium sulphur chemistry (Oxis Energy, Sion Power). Once this is in place, the energy monopoly will have real and unstoppable competition. Or am I being too optimistic?

  23. mary

    27 Oct, 2011 - 9:22 pm

    I wish you had not told us about Blair and Africa! His megalomania is rampant. I had no knowledge of this outfit he started but I knew about his ‘Faith Foundation’ stuff. Does anyone know about Kate Gross who he has just made the AGI CEO?
    .
    http://www.africagovernance.org/africa/index/
    .
    I cannot see a link there to ‘empower’ on that site although I found one elsewhere where Cherie is helping the women of Lebanon to achieve empowerment. She was there last week launching it. What a truly dreadful pair they are.
    .
    The solar power company etc Empower Community Association LLP mentioned in that BBC article is registered to a private house (called Chequers!) in Dunmow, Essex and to the name Alex Grayson, Managing Partner. ?? http://empowercommunity.co.uk/

  24. mary

    27 Oct, 2011 - 9:30 pm

    As you read this, you will feel a cold anger.
    27 October 2011
    .
    Margaret Thatcher claims £535,000 for ex-PM duties
    Margaret Thatcher was the longest serving prime minister of the 20th Century
    .
    Former Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher has claimed £535,000 of taxpayers’ money over the last five years, government records have shown.
    .
    Baroness Thatcher, 86, who makes rare public appearances and suffers poor health, was paid from the public duties cost allowance available to ex-PMs.
    .
    Others to benefit have been her successor John Major, paid £490,000 in the last five years, and Tony Blair.
    .
    In 2008-9, Mr Blair claimed £169,076 – more than his Downing Street salary.
    .
    Since leaving office, Mr Blair, who ran the country for a decade from 1997, has claimed just under £273,000.
    .
    The system was set up by John Major in 1991, after one year in office, to reward former prime ministers for work including answering letters and attending public events.
    .
    In the past five years, the three former number 10 incumbents have cost the taxpayer in total more than £1.7m in public duty allowances.
    .
    The figures were revealed by Cabinet Office minister Francis Maude following a written Parliamentary question from Tory MP Philip Hollobone.
    .
    Mr Maude said: “The public duties cost allowance is kept under review.”
    .
    In 2005, doctors advised Lady Thatcher, who served three consecutive terms in office, that she should not make public speeches in the wake of some minor strokes.
    .
    But she still attends some public functions, including an address by the Pope during his state visit to the UK last year.
    .
    In September, she attended a party to mark former Defence Secretary Liam Fox’s 50th birthday at his London apartment.

    .
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-15486792

  25. mary

    27 Oct, 2011 - 9:45 pm

    http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/alex-grayson/5/a8a/8b9 Empower Community Management.
    .
    OMNI Group quoted here. The Gold Rush seems an apposite name.
    {http://www.insidehousing.co.uk/analysis/in-depth/the-gold-rush/6511767.article}

  26. writerman

    27 Oct, 2011 - 9:52 pm

    Good luck with the solar project Craig. I’m considering doing the same thing, though mostly to stop my two daughters telling me to put my money where my mouth is… they can be so… cruel!

    Why don’t we use our resources more sensibly and efficiently? It’s because the ‘transfer of wealth’ this would lead to is an anathema to the 1%, they want it All!

    It’s tragic. So much, could so easily be done, by so many, to reverse the ghastly course the ‘Titanic’ is on, it’s rendezvous with the iceberg of environmental disaster, and all with existing technology. But what we lack is the political will and leaders is sadly lacking. Isn’t this the worst Parliament ever? Who are they supposed to represent exactly? It’s certainly not the 99% of the population, rather the 1%.

  27. Komodo

    27 Oct, 2011 - 10:20 pm

    Hate to say this, but if you’ve got seven big ones to decorate your roof with, you ain’t skint…but good luck to you. However, I can’t shake the idea that the expected lifetime energy production from a solar array is generally overestimated by the manufacturers, and that there is no guarantee that the feed-in tariff you agreed to will be applicable five years down the line, let alone twenty. (Look what happened to company pensions). It’s a loss-leader. Sorry to be so negative, but I am more skint than you are….

  28. Matt

    27 Oct, 2011 - 10:35 pm

    Craig,
    it’s a nice idea, putting government funds to practical use with insulation etc., rather than bailing out/lining the pockets of the corporatocracy. Unfortunately, it probably wouldn’t work…they tried something similar (government funds for roofing insulation) here in Australia and it was so badly handled that people died (from improper installation of the insulation by inadequately trained workers).

  29. craig

    27 Oct, 2011 - 11:08 pm

    komodo

    you seem not to have read the first sentence

  30. Fork it

    27 Oct, 2011 - 11:12 pm

    I understand that the technology to create ‘free energy’ has existed on this planet for a long time and that despite efforts to deliberately keep the human race in a state of dependancy on the oil cartels etc, a guy in Australia has come up with a small generator that creates energy. It has been looked at by a number of independant scientist who although at first refused to believe it, have verified that the generator creates five times more energy than it uses. It uses magnets to create perpetual movement from which energy is derived. More information on this story is on youtube FREE ENERGY GENERATOR AUSTRALIA. Another example involves a guy in the states who found a way to make his car run on water instead of petrol! See WATER RUNNING CAR GETS 100 MILES TO THE OUNCE on youtube. Self sufficiancy for the masses frightens the 1%.

  31. craig

    27 Oct, 2011 - 11:30 pm

    Fork It,

    I am afraid I don’t believe in either of those.

  32. Strategist

    27 Oct, 2011 - 11:36 pm

    >>>”But what if the £225 billion created by quantitive easing had really been used in a Keynesian way, for public works? What if it had been used to insulate everybody’s home, to give everybody solar panels, micro wind turbines, and heat pumps? What employment and growth would have been created then? What if we had built high speed railways and the Severn barrage?”

    Craig, you have just perfectly described the Green New Deal http://www.greennewdealgroup.org/

    I particularly agree about the Severn Barrage. There’s even a way of getting tidal power from the Severn that doesn’t even upset the RSPB!

  33. evgueni

    27 Oct, 2011 - 11:46 pm

    Oops missed out a couple of Ks earlier: 18kkWhs/annum for my house versus 3kkWhs from Craig’s £7k investment, in case some numerate soul was perturbed. Anyway, question to Craig still stands – why should some (majority) subsidise through their higher energy bills the energy consumption of others who happen to have £7k lying around? Arguments along the lines of “we all benefit in the end” clearly won’t do, what else is there?
    .
    Greenflation is a reality for everyone, but most keenly felt by the poorest – pensioners etc. If they knew how this swindle works, and had a say in the matter, they would not be in favour of the subsidy. Would you care to comment?

  34. angrysoba

    28 Oct, 2011 - 12:09 am

    Fork It,
    .
    Great! Where can I buy my free energy generator? It would only take an enterprising entepreneur with a bit of spare capital to get those things on the market straight away. I hope they aren’t sitting around waiting for “The 1%” to start bankrolling it.

  35. OffTopic

    28 Oct, 2011 - 12:56 am

    Why is the excellent Voltairenet down?

    Been a few days. Tech probs or something more serious. The quality of their output on Libya and the outflow from that has been phenomenal, so I cynically assume they have found a spanner or two in the works. But people are posting links to articles on Twitter? Just overwhelmed by traffic perhaps?

  36. Fedup

    28 Oct, 2011 - 2:51 am

    Sorry to piss on your parade, but considering the battery technology, and the shortcomings thereof. Solar, power production really makes piddly swat difference to the overall cost of power consumption at the current extortionate rates (I should know I have 2 useless degrees and even a more useless masters degree, and still cannot earn me a living, after 38 years of study, and learning. I now firmly believe, there is no money in engineering and sciences. Hence, I have been advising anyone, whom would listen; to go learn signing, and kicking a ball, turning up in Xfactor and buying a lottery ticket. There is no money in being a smart Alec, moreover, thinking is a dangerous pastime these days).
    ,
    The inane babbling of the paid and bribed stooges posing as politicians, is based on the premise that, if there is an alternative, then the great unwashed would not take up their shovels, and pitchfork and get on with upsetting the apple cart. The thinking behind urging the unemployed to take jobs, is designed to hide the fact that there are no jobs. The notion of changing energy suppliers, hides the fact that the bastards running the oligopolistic energy market have sewn up the market, and the fact that the current supply contracts are based on the annual energy use, and the umpteen tariffs on offer, with even a greater permutations of the schemes, to bamboozle the punters suffering from a sever case of dyscalculia. These are designed to hide the almost feudal structure of the available energy supply arrangement. Simply put, did you ever go to a supermarket to buy a bag of sugar, only to find yourself being questioned by the cashier; how many bags of sugar do you use per annum? When do you use your sugar most, have you ever used brown sugar? Although we ought to take solace in the knowledge that, we are enslaved and not bombed and shredded to pieces as is the case for those former residents of lands with oil fields, as in Iraq, Libya, Sudan, etc.
    ,
    The notion of alternative energy supply is to obfuscate the inordinate cost of energy which evidently is taken by force, and at very little price at source, and then mercilessly hiked up to the prices we are subjected to. The symbiosis of the robber energy barons, and greedy politicians’ taxes are then sought to be addressed through almost infantile solutions; alternative energy.
    ,
    The Ponzi scheme of “buy back” further sweetens the deal, for those daring to take the plunge, whilst leaving others to blame themselves; they are not trying hard enough to find a job, they are not clever enough to find better prospects, and they are not affluent enough to take advantage of the alternative energy, or they are too lazy not to find a cheaper energy supply!!!!!
    ,
    Finally the pusillanimous characters whom ought to be avoiding the applications of any probable enema treatment with utmost due care and deliggence (for there shall only remain a piece of flaccid skin post any such event) pontificate about QE, and other matters of importance, with no understanding of the biggest robbery (reverse Robin Hood) in the history of mankind, that is currently under way.
    ,
    Take your seven grand (if you had it mate) and spend it on something more fun, you will spare yourself a lot of disappointment, science somehow never follows fashion, that is true science, not the pseudo science pushed as the real McCoy.

  37. Michael

    28 Oct, 2011 - 3:32 am

    Craig,
    I bought all the components necessary to build a solar installation mounted on a satellite actuator that would track the sun from dawn to dusk and would power to charge a deep cycle battery that would power a 12 vdc to 220 vac sine wave inverter. After a few trials the inverter failed and as the inverter cost €340 from China and the the courier wanted €200 to ship it back I am now left with a pile of junk. I advise anyone on ebay to keep away from Power Jack 5000 watt pure sine wave inverter. I,m living in Ireland and their is no payment for electricity sent back to the grid. When the madmen in the US and Israel attack Iran you will appreciate your solar panels. There was a good video on ebay where two guys were attempting to fix the same type of inverter with a sledge hammer and a chisel.

    For anyone interested in solar tracking visit redrok.com

  38. Cucumber Type

    28 Oct, 2011 - 3:43 am

    This to me is like a discussion of whether Jack the Ripper has fried eggs or scrambled eggs for breakfast. The whole country can sink and the world would be a better place. If the wave caused by its sinking demolishes Washington and the Hague, so much the better.

  39. SBD Articles

    28 Oct, 2011 - 7:18 am

    I understand that the technology to create ‘free energy’ has existed on this planet for a long time and that despite efforts to deliberately keep the human race in a state of dependancy on the oil cartels etc, a guy in Australia has come up with a small generator that creates energy. It has been looked at by a number of independant scientist who although at first refused to believe it, have verified that the generator creates five times more energy than it uses. It uses magnets to create perpetual movement from which energy is derived. More information on this story is on youtube FREE ENERGY GENERATOR AUSTRALIA. Another example involves a guy in the states who found a way to make his car run on water instead of petrol! See WATER RUNNING CAR GETS 100 MILES TO THE OUNCE on youtube. Self sufficiancy for the masses frightens the 1%. SBD Articles

  40. Japanese Actuary

    28 Oct, 2011 - 8:26 am

    Not quite on topic

    Land of the cowardly and home of the slaves

    http://www.klfy.com/story/15717759/second-hand-dealer-law

  41. Komodo

    28 Oct, 2011 - 8:30 am

    Craig:

    Apologies. It had been a long day.

  42. Richard88

    28 Oct, 2011 - 9:54 am

    Is it really acceptable to create an eyesore on your roof just to milk taxpayers?
    No generator which takes more energy to manufacture, install and maintain than it will ever produce is good for the planet. Money should be going into thorium-based nuclear generators and insulation, not this kind of nonsense.

  43. craig

    28 Oct, 2011 - 10:06 am

    I am not deleting the SBD articles comment above in order to demonstrate that one of the surest proofs that the Australian magic technology is an attempted scam is its use of automated spam.

  44. Guest

    28 Oct, 2011 - 10:15 am

    Lets face the truth, it is not in the interests of capitalism to ever allow any system that is not in the interests of the few to make huge sums of money ever come into being. Decades ago Scotland could have been a power house of renewable energy and even exporting it, even England could be potentially great in this field, it has not happened, it will not happen for a very long time (if ever).

  45. mary

    28 Oct, 2011 - 10:32 am

    Aussie Spammer doesn’t seem to know about split infinitives and also is not much good at spelling – e.g. independant
    .
    In Oz Gillard (who looks and walks like one of my hens who is called Beakie) has been busy crawling round HM Queen throughout the tour.
    .
    Just like a competitor in a reality show or the old format Miss World, Cameron was announced and came on stage, looking rather embarrassed, to join the others in CHOGM for a group photo. What a farce. Male primogeniture is the main topic as the world economy is going belly up.
    .
    Cameron has just announced a new trust to commemorate the Diamond Jubilee next year. In the usual manner, there is a job for one of the boys to head it, Sir John Major.

  46. mary

    28 Oct, 2011 - 10:37 am

    Wow and this too
    BREAKING NEWS:Commonwealth heads of government also agree to remove the ban on a spouse of a Roman Catholic taking the throne.

  47. anno

    28 Oct, 2011 - 10:45 am

  48. Rob King

    28 Oct, 2011 - 11:17 am

    @Fork it and others. Hilarious. I laughed until the tears ran down my legs.
    Is April 1st upside-down in Australia or something? Entropy–not just a fun idea–it’s the law.
    This machine is just as likely: http://tiny.cc/myp7s

  49. Stephen

    28 Oct, 2011 - 12:15 pm

    Given the estimated costs of producing energy given here

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cost_of_electricity_by_source

    I would have thought that the argument for not paying a 20-25p subsidy to predominantly middle class householders in order for them to produce their own solar energy would be pretty overpowering. Given the level of subsidy is so high, the actual return to the investor is in fact pretty paltry which points to this being a pretty inefficient way of generating alternative energy.

    There of course remains the question of how the saved subsidy is otherwise used.

  50. wendy

    28 Oct, 2011 - 1:48 pm

    don worry folks the energy companies dont cut you off , theyr not allowed to .. they just give you a pre payment meter .. what could be better ?
    .
    .
    anyway where are the fat cat celebrities .. why arent they @ St Pauls etc ?

  51. ingo

    28 Oct, 2011 - 3:04 pm

    Bang on Wendy, where are the champagne socialists?, the Unionists and workers. I hear Dan Hoare is speaking up for the protesters to leave, thats two political parties who can’t see the soci political importance of that encampment.

    It will not be easy to remove the protesters, maybe the courts will get it done by Jan, but it seems as if the love of the church has been exhausted.

    When will they see and start acting?

  52. mary

    28 Oct, 2011 - 7:47 pm

    Seeing your mention of the name Hoare Ingo, did we ever hear the outcome of his inquest? (the News Int’l man Sean Hoare found dead in July)

  53. sjb

    28 Oct, 2011 - 9:38 pm

    @Stephen (27 October)
    “The idea of QE is [...] to encourage the banks to lend more [...]”

    Yes, but isn’t it true that (in the round) UK banks are not lending to UK businesses but are instead investing more the Far East where their return on investment is greater? Isn’t that why Osborne is now trying to get the BoE to push money direct to businesses?

  54. evgueni

    28 Oct, 2011 - 10:43 pm

    The question was politely ignored, again – duly noted. This is where all kinds of ideologues, well-intentioned of course, come unstuck always. They have trouble explaining why undemocratic means are required to achieve “the common good”.
    .
    Perhaps they think that the average person, with their average IQ, just doesn’t know what’s good for them ;-)

  55. anno

    28 Oct, 2011 - 11:30 pm

    Entropy

    In refrigeration, different gases gain heat during compression at different rates. That’s entropy, the accumulation rate of heat. Then you blow away the heat from the compression and get coolth.

    In economics, pumping money into the economy has different effects depending where you put it. Obama tried giving money to people. Some give it as reduction in VAT, others give it in tax breaks to the rich. QE gives it to the banks.
    In economics you are trying to get cheapness, not coolth.

    What do governments want to keep cheap? The cost of borrowing to fight illegal wars against oil-rich Muslim countries in order to deprive Islam of a power base. Otherwise it would be a very inefficient way of obtaining natural resources.

    The government isn’t interested in helping the economy, as they claim. They are only interested at the moment in wrecking the chances of their ideological enemies. If they were interested in helping the economy, they would be putting the money into the economy, not the banks.

    Will they succeed in their ideological struggle against Islam?
    The economic squeeze has done two things, incapacitated protest in the West, and precipitated protest in Muslim countries.
    If a person has an external wound, you sort that out, but if they are haemorraging inside, how do you sort that out?
    They are counting on being able to sort out the economic problems of the West and destroying Islam with pent-up distress.
    Unfortunately it is in the West that stress is increasing, and eating up people’s ability to function, while in Islam people have become much more focussed. That is because there is only one source of stress, the fear of failure on the Day of Judgement. They forgot about that.

  56. Bob

    29 Oct, 2011 - 3:04 am

    They’re about to reduce the FIT for the solar scam to 20p from 43p so I wouldn’t bother with this particular global warming scam.

  57. Craig W

    29 Oct, 2011 - 8:30 am

    A cheaper use of solar energy is solar water heating. The concept and the technology are pretty simple: pipes coming off your water supply snake through a glass box on your roof, the pipes are clad in black to absorb heat. The pipes then exit into your boiler or storage tank. On a hot day this will heat your water a great deal and cut back the amount of energy required to reach boiling point for showers etc. It is probably also a more efficient use of solar energy than incurring the losses in converting to electricity.

    The down side of course is that the days when you really need hot water, the cold dark days of winter, a solar water heater will be little more than an ornament.

  58. Komodo

    1 Nov, 2011 - 11:23 am

    Even in winter, you should be able to raise the temperature of your fossil-fuel or electric boiler’s feed water enough to have some impact on the cost. Given an efficiently designed collector. Take it a stage further, and you might use the tepid water from the solar heater as the source for a heat pump.

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