The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
Tim V – don’t hold my little leave-of-absence against me – sometimes I get snowed under and must go on a diet from anything truly important and interesting. Especially from the brilliant minds and brave hearts of them who try to unravel convoluted tales of mayhem, rattling sharp little swords against the powerful and mighty who egg on lone wolves as they pretend to stand guard upon the sleeping masses of peons.
You said nothing of my humble little ‘theory” (May 7:58PM) of the double sting-within-a-sting for the Boston events, with the Russian side clearly having the upper hand (is that my punishment?). Anyways, according to this theory – the Russians knew of the American sting and just let it happen, even as they covered their backs with some pro-forma notifications to FBI/CIA (knowing full well they wouldn’t do a thing about those warnings – after all – nothing should get in the way of a good sting, right?). The Russians even going as far as to follow Tamerlan’s movements within Dagestan/Chechnia/Georgia – offing a few “bad guys’ along the way – as a way of hinting to Tamerlan that it’s time to high tail it back to the good old USA. Surely, they could have stopped him leaving from Moscow airport any time, but chose not to – perhaps so as to better facilitate his move home, where new-found talents can be better put to use?
Assuming there was a CIA/FBI sting going down – and just about everything points to the fact that was the case – then we should expect increasingly messy jumbles of “facts’ to trickle out, as our hard working agencies desperately try to cover their tracks. Which indeed seems to be the case, with daily revelations that only add to the suspicions, clarifying nothing. That’s where Chinese Danny as your May 3, 4:30PM(?) lays out the facts-that-just-don’t-fit comes in. The story that is indeed way too detailed and way too nonsensical to carry water. Especially the part about the gas station that won’t take debit cards but will take the $50. cash, so conveniently forked over by Tamerlan who gets it apparently out of thin air.not to mention those convenient “confessions’ to both the bombing and the MIT cop killing (and so far that ‘confession” is all there is to tie the brothers to that. No wonder it wasn’t on the rap sheet. they are probably hard at work trying to find a connection – any at all).
Tim V, sorry I got the time stamp wrong for your comment – it was 4:07PM.
BTW, why do some people have to retire just as things are heating up? of course, it helps that some get to slither between several time zones….
Another aside; Debka is not considered to be very reliable – it’s a strange mix of hype, some truth, some leaks, some foaming at the mouth. They were the ones keen on peddling the Fordo incident that wasn’t for example.
Now that i cast aspersions on debka, here’s an interesting article from Debka on the tsarnaevs.
http://www.debka.com/article/22914/
This one is kind of close to my theory on the nature of the American “sting’ operation. The older brother was supposedly recruited to penetrate Wahabist cells in the caucasus and among students in the US as a joint project between the saudis and the Americans. but then tamerlan turn against his handler and Bit them in the back with the (pre-mature?) marathon bombing. now there’s a scramble to hide the traces of the operation, which is where the mysterious saudi student comes in.
I think something like this is possible. however, there’s definitely the possibility that the brothers did not actually carry out the bombings – or at least not knowingly – which this debka article does not address (and they wouldn’t given their mission). The brothers may well have thought they were participating in a drill, except someone somewhere thought it should be the real thing. In wonder whether we might see some mysterious inexplicable suicides sometime soon?
Also, the Debka article dismisses the Russian role too easily. That’s where my theory comes in, according to which the Russian part of the ‘sting” was to know and to “let it happen” (no doubt after careful analysis about any possible blowback. Which is why that additional warning t – to the CIA this time – was issued. It’s called “cover your flanks”, I believe). In any case, i think there’s reason to believe the American agencies kind of lost their cold war mojo. May be too much political influence peddling sidelined the best agents. May be the FBI is too penetrated, as are parts of the CIA.
@ Tim V 4 May, 2013 – 3:09 am
“According to Debka Iranian and Israeli troops are massing at the SYRIAN border! Light the blue touch paper and stand clear.”
Have you considered it is we at CM and MZT who control the New World Order or Disorder? Only hours after I joke the Boston bombings are an excuse to invade Syria, Israel is firing rockets into Syria ostensibly to prevent the transfer of chemical weapons or other game-changing weaponry to terrorists, specifically to Hezbollah in Lebanon.
And only yesterday, the MZT group proposed a credible scenario connecting Hezbollah to Swiss banking and the events at Chevaline.
Am I suffering from cartoonal delusions of grandeur?
Pinky: Gee, Brain, what do you want to do tonight?
Brain: The same thing we do every night, Pinky – try to take over the world!
Or not. “THE MOUSE WHO WOULD RULE THE WORLD! HOW AMERICAN CRIMINAL JUSTICE REFLECTS THE THEMES OF DISNEYIZATION”
http://academic.research.microsoft.com/Paper/4925700.aspx
@ Marlin 4 May, 2013 – 5:18 am
“The brothers may well have thought they were participating in a drill, except someone somewhere thought it should be the real thing. In wonder whether we might see some mysterious inexplicable suicides sometime soon?”
Others suggest Tamerlan was “sheep-dipped” by US agencies. Sent on the trip to Dagestan to smear him with with terrorist associations, and set him up as a patsy. Possibly they approached him and offered to fix his problem with citizenship if he did them a favor, or he might have asked them for help doing same.
NR, 6:34AM yes, I saw the hezbollah connection. I thought it’s interesting they’d bring that up, though frankly, Tim V beat them to it a while back when he suggested Suheila al Saffar could have been a key target in the whole affair. It is through the al Saffars that a connection to lebanon can be made at all, isn’t it? and certainly the bluebird has uncovered quite a few possible familial connections there that covered that angle or direction (including the money stuff) pretty thoroughly.
The problem with the Hezbollah agent(s) as perpetrator is the usual – it’s the cover-up, stupid! French bumbling investigation would not be so bumbling had they thought – for one moment – that any hezbollah agent – Swiss money or not – could actually be the culprit. That only works if one assumes french investigators are truly incompetent beyond all measure, which one might, perhaps, doubt. Any agency has their competencies yet we have seen nothing at all from the french – no one can be that incompetent unless it’s deliberate. Much more likely in this case is that there would be a double cross, with some other agency (guess the most likely one!) stepping in for the kill. But I guess that for whatever reason the people at MZT will not go anywhere near the Mossad angle – chances are they’ll try every other angle first, maybe until they’ll run out of angles?
Frankly, the only alternative to bad CIA/Mossad (these two will work in cahoots) is something with a Russians party (mafia as one possibility has indeed been suggested), though again, the across-the-board cover-up is what gives me a pause here – again. motivations i can think of – no problem even without so much imagination – but ultimately, every suggestion and every potential perpetrator or motive – be it an “ordinary” local crime, or extra-ordinary agency – criminals, mr X included, must contend with the conundrum we have faced all along – namely, the piles of evidence that there has been – from the very start – an all out cover-up, primarily by the French, but with the brits somehow beholden enough (to the same perpetrator party?) that they can’t make much of a move on their own – at least not outright. It is the out-in-the-open broad, cross channel cover-up, extending to Sweden. Germany and Switzerland – that led us here, on this flourishing little CM forum, to consider Mossad (with or without outsourcing the actual crime act) as a principal candidate for the agency that carried out the murder (not that I totally gave up on the extraction scenario but for argument’s sake, I’ll maintain that people were indeed killed – all or some). The cover-up AND the competence with which the crime was executed (forget the amateur suggestion or the “lone tourist-intolerant psychopath”by our EM – they got away with it, didn’t they? and it seems by design, no?). There are simply not that many agencies out there, no matter how many potential motives we can ascribe to each party (which is not so hard), that have that kind of a pull over at least three major European countries that we know of.
So that’s my main argument counter to what people on MZT suggest (however creative and even logically plausible they are) – one cannot just ignore the geopolitical realities, no matter how much one would like Chevaline to unfold like a “proper’ crime drama. Now, I wouldn’t put these comments on their board, because I think it’s useful to have two apparently disparate groups going at this from different directions. It’s more fruitful this way, and gets away from too many tangents due to silly, muscle flexing, teeth baring arguments (which I personally don’t care for. Wastes too much time).
Interesting that MTZ now finally start to chk for Hezbollah connections. As a disappointed member said, it´s now looks like the Craig Murray blog…
———————-
I don´t know if the info from Saads friend “Fat Bastard” who is posting on MTZ is known here, otherwise worth to follow up by Bluebird & others
“@lynda
dont know of any twitter accunt for Saad
i talked to Saad on MSN messenger
Skype (text only)
facebook (minimaly)
email
and freegle (freecycle as was)
sontheweb cammeljockey bignose were his names …if the boss doesnt mind me posting them”
This is a post regarding Skyrock account, http://sa3d07.skyrock.com. Don´t know if it´s confirmed to belong to Saad:
“@lynda
the name is the right spelling sa3d07
truth is very important”
“FYI
Kadhem was not born in Iraq …..”
It was the bit brought in by those who have expertise in Swiss banking that banks wouldn’t allow a mere one-million Euros sitting in a dormant account, but there must be a much larger sum attached to it in another account. Saad meeting with “someone” to transfer control to “someone” who would be the new nominee for Hezbollah could trigger intervention by Mossad or others.
MZT never outright forbid speculation re Mossad or anyone else. It was the repeated assertion by some posters that it must be Mossad, without any evidence or credible theory, and claims everyone that didn’t see that is an apologist for Jews, with added foul insults, that was forbidden.
I followed only parts of the excellent research by Bluebird and others on the al Saffar connection, but the Hezbollah interest didn’t stand out until those at MZT brought up the banking mechanics, and that’s why I mentioned it here.
Sorry, my comment above was in reply to Marlin 4 May, 2013 – 8:43 am +all
@ Tim V 4 May, 2013 – 3:03 am
“This is an interesting one. “DT will die, either from his wounds or by execution”! Well I never! Three Jewish friends murdered on tenth anniversary of 9/11”
Here’s a long one: Pieced togeter from the main article plus talk page [wiki edit discussion page] My remarks in [ ]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Waltham_murders
A triple homicide was committed in Waltham, Massachusetts, on the evening of September 11, 2011. Brendan Mess, Erik Weissman, and Raphael Teken were murdered in Mess’s apartment. All three victims were Jewish according to a number of sources, but the Jewish Telegraphic Agency reported that only two, Weissman and Teken, were Jewish.
Mess was a well-known mixed martial arts fighter, and is listed as a martial arts instructor on his death certificate. Teken is listed as a personal trainer on his death certificate. Weissman was a bodybuilder. The three men, who were described as being physically strong, were dragged to or killed in three different rooms.
A police investigator said the murders were the worst bloodbath… There was no forced entry, it was clear that the victims had let the killer in. And their throats were slashed right out of an al Qaeda training video. [So, we learn O.J. Simpson was AQ!]
Autopsies revealed that the men had been brutally murdered. Their heads had been pulled back, and their throats had been slit from ear-to-ear with either an ice pick or knife with such great force that their heads were nearly decapitated. Their mutilated bodies had been left covered with thousands of dollars worth of marijuana (in what investigators described as a symbolic gesture) and thousands of dollars of money, in three different rooms. Police said $5,000 was left at the scene, which suggested that robbery was not the motive.
[@ Bluebird: In US usage ice-pick is awl like tool used to chip or break ice, like in bar accessories. Ones I’ve seen have sharp point and round or square shank, not cutting edge. Do you know if Mafia ground theirs to sharp edges for cutting. Why would police say “knife or ice-pick”?]
Tamerlan Tsarnaev had been a regular visitor at Mess’s apartment where the murders took place, and authorities believe that at times Mess crashed at Tsarnaev’s apartment; at one point, they lived together as roommates. Mess also brought Tamerlan with him to social events and fight events. Investigators believe Tsarnaev was one of the last people to see Mess alive. Tamerlan… was an athlete, but also played in the jazz ensemble, a smiling, benign presence out of the boxing ring.” [Other places say he played violin and piano. Not remarked upon in MSM. Messes with image of terrorist monster.]
Questioning the date reported by officials, the relative said: “The three of them were definitely killed on Sept. 11…. They all stopped using their cellphones at about eight o’clock that night.” One vic’s death cert says 11th and 2 say 12th for date of death according to sources. The relative actually said that he confirmed with other people who knew them and everyone states an 8 p.m. or so end to cell phone use.
The last time anyone is known to have heard from the three victims was at 8:54 p.m. on September 11, 2011, when a call was placed by someone using Weissman’s cell phone to Gerry’s Italian Kitchen, a Watertown restaurant, for delivery of three dinner entrees. When a delivery woman arrived at 9:14 p.m., there was no answer and no one answered when the restaurant called Weissman’s cell phone. [Damn! Exactly 20 minutes max for a brutal triple murder of 3 fit dudes in separate rooms, plus scattering pot and cash. Tight like Chevaline.]
After the Marathon bombing, a Planet Aid driver found discarded fireworks in the Planet Aid donation bin in the parking lot of a restaurant, Gerry’s Italian Kitchen. Police investigators told ABC News that “the gunpowder had been emptied from the fireworks and the shells discarded in a shopping bag inside the bin.”
First of all: I’m not usually a conspiracy loony. That said, I find it very hard to believe that the police really thought the murders were commited on the 12th. That when all telephone and other communication of the trio stopped in the evening of the 11th. Food were ordered on that evening, but not delived because no one opened the door. Another creepy detail. Why the police initally believed it was taking place on the 12th, is beyond me. That all victims were jews butchered in al-queda style, should also make some alarm bells ring. It seems that this is a cover up from the police to me, to hide the fact the muslim terror did occur on the 10th anniversary of the 9/11-attacks to aviod public panic or something. One policeman is quoted in the article saying that the trio was butchered in al-queda style. Did he say that to the press in 2011 or is this something he has said in 2013 in heinzeit? [End of Wikipedia stuff.]
Tsarnaev visited Dagestan and neighboring Chechnya for six months following the date of the Waltham murders. Citing security concerns, the Saudi government also allegedly denied an entry visa to the elder Tsarnaev brother in December 2011, when he hoped to make a pilgrimage to Mecca. He arrived in Russia in January 2012. Tsarnaev left Dagestan two days after William Plotnikov’s body was prepared for burial.
He was looking for speedy exit from US either ’cause he did murders or saw them as a warning he’d be next. Likely took months to get visa for Russia.
Options are 1 — He did it ’cause they crossed him in drug deal. 2 — He had attachment to Mess, strong bromance, not a down-low romance, or maybe that too. Supposedly they’d had a falling out. 3 — It was an anti-semitic, symbolic murder on 9/11. He cleverly masked it as a mafia drug murder — unlikely if murder was symbolic. Somebody else did it and he fled in fear or was devastated at the loss of Mess, can’t attend funeral, too emotional.
@ Q: Plotnikov did not train with Fitness Trainer Ajax Ontario where red dude’s bf worked. Plotnikov was at Europa gym or fitness, but if he did MMA all paths might cross. To add to fun, derogatory refs to Fitness Trainer Ajax Ontario, on ripoffreport, originally and allegedly posted right during murder, have been edited by person of trans-genderedness who ménage à trois-ed with the two dudes. Not Plotnikov, that I know of.
Things odd in account of “3 Dead Jews, 9/11 2011” above.
“were dragged to or killed in three different rooms”
If they were practically beheaded in one room and dragged to another, you’d think cops would see blood trail.
“After the Marathon bombing, a Planet Aid driver found discarded fireworks in the Planet Aid donation bin in the parking lot of a restaurant, Gerry’s Italian Kitchen”
Why would driver bother reporting this to police. They find all types of junk and trash disposed of in donation boxes? Unless driver read AQ instructions and knew fireworks were a source of powder.
“Their heads had been pulled back, and their throats had been slit from ear-to-ear” without severing spine.
That’s part of the old time Masonic ritual for one of the degrees. Masons admit this was done way back in more brutal times [like we’re in now?], but today it’s only a symbolic part of the initiate’s oath.
Marlin
4 May, 2013 – 4:44 am I have trouble getting my head around straight plots let alone concentric one! Maybe we could christen yours “The Russian Doll Theory” although I fear Smiley (or the BBC) might have got there first. Anyway more seriously I’m sure there is more than a glimmer of truth in it. I have been struck (sorry to repeat) the parallels with “I’m a Patsie” Lee Harvey Oswald. He of course was run by CIA/FBI as they were with the assassination itself. He, like TT, was allowed to visit Russia and allowed back in without difficulty and set up to appear pro Cuba (or was it anti I forget?) pro commy or anti – I forget. In any event “a very iffy character”. Then there’s the immediate identification, the shooting of a policeman, the high profile chase and arrest, the protestations of being uninvolved, death whilst under police “protection”. It is notable that both his named contacts whilst back in Chechnia, one holding dual Canadian nationality (yes that again) ended up dead, killed by Russian forces. Of course the Russian/US understanding goes back a long way. “You keep out of criticising us there and we’ll stay out of criticising you in Iraq”. So competitors (late enemies) can be friends when opposing the new Muslim terror. So we have not one but TWO governments following and facilitating TT’s movements. America lets him out, Russia lets him in, Russia lets him out, America lets him back in, neither in any doubt as to his family and Muslim contacts, at least two of which are dead within weeks. That’s more than co-incidence. Russia is two-fold clever: it tried to help the US (PR and “you owe us one) whilst at the same time making FBI look stupid. I think this is what you are suggesting and I think it’s quite likely. A further possibility is that TT was working for CIA on that Russian trip to identify and locate the Chechen activists for intelligence purposes, shadowed by agreement by the FSB.
More on TT at http://www.aol.co.uk/video/boston-bomb-suspect-died-of-gunshot-wounds/517767765/
Amazingly it is Funeral Directors who now determine cause of death apparently. The Worcester, Massachusetts Funeral Director states TT died from “gunshot wounds and blunt trauma to head and body”! And silly old me thought Funeral Directors were only qualified and responsible for the efficient and sensitive disposal of the deceased. The time if death is given as 1.35 on the 19th April, 2013. The AP commentator NOW states that Tsarnaev’s younger brother Dzhokhar “dragged his body under a vehicle whilst fleeing” not as previously “running over” you notice. Either this is very sloppy journalese or yet another story-line twist. No one has yet explained how an apparently fit naked man in hand cuffs physically held by police, could be run over without injuring his handlers. It is quite inexplicable. In fact it shouts LIE. Will the American systems demand explanation or are they now so cowed and terrorised to accept the unacceptable?
More precisely (apologies) “A suspect in the Boston Marathon bombings died from gunshot wounds and blunt trauma to his head and torso, a funeral director said Friday. (May 4) (0:58)” He may have just been repeating the “Medical Examiner’s Certificate”. So no information on the nature, location and cause of the bullet wounds or those huge gashes either side of his body or the striking feature of the red face and neck. Where the evidence of “blunt trauma to head and torso”?
Blackwater (now helpfully re-tagged “Academi” – much better vibe, almost intellectual) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Academi is the biggest of three security contractors for the state. A good way of sending tax receipts to private individuals I suppose and as if the state law enforcement resources were not already sufficient. The thought did occur to me that that the road from Chevaline leads to “la montagne du Charbon” or Mountain of Coal and you know the colour of the water that flowed down the Combe d’Ire a long ago don’t you?
@ Tim V 4 May, 2013 – 1:34 pm
The very same CNN reporter I praised for questioning the unlikelihood of bros changing plans 1-2 days before Marathon, was also trying to determine cause of death. Said med examiner promised to release autopsy results with body, but has not. (An uh, oh, when they learned Tsarnaev family planned independent autopsy?) But she goes on with, “We know he was run over by his brother” and later “We know they shot the MIT policeman” when we don’t “know” either except some or many sources reported that. She also is back to exculpating the widow — now styled Katherine Russell — “she worked 70-80 hours plus took care of baby. She might well not have noticed bomb bits lying around”. I thought it was papa who took care of baby while she worked double full-time. Who took care of baby during bombing run? Of course the reporter didn’t question reliability of “new” evidence found in flat declared clear and opened to public.
Some sympathy for on-air “reporters” who aren’t really reporting but in part repeating what their news people are telling them in earpiece (mixed in with breaking news are voices of director and assistants giving times/cues). The studio anchors are reading Tele-Prompters whose script is changing in real-time to the last second, cut and pastes from AP and others by newsroom staff. They don’t even have luxury of scanning the old tear-off Telex sheets for pronunciation and a feel for the story.
On the death pic taken in hospital corridor, I’m not sure, but I think there is only one of TT’s left-side and some pages flip that to make it appear there are L and R. Upper torso sure doesn’t look run-over or dragged by either evil bro or police. Running over legs wouldn’t cause death, don’t know if crushed pelvis would.
On the symbolism of touching nose: “25 Examples of Body Language” “Gesture: Touching, slightly rubbing nose
Meaning: Rejection, doubt, lying” and from a page on urban gang signs, “#5 = I know. Briefly tapping or squeezing the nose, indicates that you understand. You will see this quite often and it’s their way of indicating that they know, or that they understand.” Didn’t find specific Masonic gang sign that fits here. There are some gestures involving noses in initiation.
Some cops would know both street-gang and Masonic-gang signs.
Remember problem in UK with cops being Masonically mobbed-up?
Still no word on how authorities connected pics to names. One thought is if bros were patsies for agencies, they’d already know who they are. The rest, Heroes Jeff and Danny and reddit citizen/vigilantes was all show, to allow public to get in on urgent, patriotic hunt. Or they weren’t patsies, but facial recognition system and print matching worked and they had names, but they went with call for public help for reason above.
“The document, viewed by the Globe on Friday, shows that Tsarnaev was pronounced dead at 1:35 a.m. April 19. The death certificate also states that Tsarnaev was shot by police, and run over and dragged by a vehicle.”
“As 26-year-old Tamerlan Tsarnaev lay wounded on the ground, his younger brother, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, got behind the wheel of a Mercedes SUV the siblings are accused of taking in a carjacking. In the ensuing frenzy, police said, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev hurtled toward his brother, ran over him, and dragged his body.”
WTF?? Death certificate is a legal document, not a place for speculation. How would a medical examiner know he was “shot by police” as opposed to someone else, or even self-inflicted, without forensics on the bullets. Tread marks on the body might be an indication he was run over by some vehicle, but how could the examiner legally conclude he was dragged by a vehicle?
“… police said, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev hurtled toward his brother, ran over him, and dragged his body.” Allegedly contradicted by some eyewitnesses, who presumably in this case have no anti-police bias, as happens on other occasions.
@Q 4 May, 2013 – 12:51 am
“All of a sudden I’m noticing every BMW X5 and Mercedes on the roads. They’re more common than I thought. Mundane observation, nothing more”
Like when you drive with expired plates and note if other vehicles’ plates are expired too.
You all think that with old-friends or frenemies returning here to CM and MZT suddenly attracting new commenters (two know the SAHs) we are nearing a denouement, the last reel is running (ancient tech ref), and it’s time to summon all to the drawing room?
Well I never Marlin
4 May, 2013 – 5:18 am. talk about “slivering between time zones” having been out and back again have just got to this one and see it contains a suggestion I made earlier. (The possibility the TT’s Russian trip was a CIA under-cover operation) The deaths of his contacts whilst he returned unscathed might be considered suggestive of that. I know you’ll think I picked up the idea from your post but I have only just got to it and hadn’t seen the suggestion elsewhere as far as I can recall. As they say in higher education – “To quote once without ascribing: plagiarism; to refer to lots without ascribing: academic rigour”. I’ll go back to reading your post now.
You could be in charge NR
4 May, 2013 – 6:34 am. Sorry I missed your prediction. There is little doubt that planners of these things in the higher echelons of state departments, and terrorist organisations DO consider the symbolism of time, place and method, the significance of past events, the value of distraction for cover, the need to provide powerful excuse and/or explanation for evil acts. In superpower dynamics there is almost gentlemen’s agreement on reciprocity demonstrated in 1956 with Suez/Hungary and 1968 with Czechoslovakia/Vietnam. Recently in 2001 over Iraq/Chechnya. Events are planned as much for their psychological effect on the population as tactical although strategic intentions are also important. Generally populations do not want war. You have to manipulate their assent/support. This seems to be the only possible explanation for the events of 9/11. It could quite easily be the reason for the Boston bombings.
Time zones !
Take off late after a day awake…drive several hours….and arrive in the morning for breakfast, just as you want to go to sleep.
Sometimes you can’t even fart in the direction !
And while I’m at it this “Or not. “THE MOUSE WHO WOULD RULE THE WORLD! HOW AMERICAN CRIMINAL JUSTICE REFLECTS THE THEMES OF DISNEYIZATION”
http://academic.research.microsoft.com/Paper/4925700.aspx” reminds me of the joke about the mouse making love to the elephant saying “Suffer baby, Suffer”!
I doubt we have much impact on world events but conversely I do believe the web is an important bastion against what has emerged post 9/11 – a serious breakdown in trust between government and governed, and high crimes and misdemeanour’s committed by the very state organs that are intended to protect us from them.
Thanks for Pinky and the Brain, NR. I’m a big fan of the show. There’s no CT around those two yet, unlike other, unmentionable mouse.
We now know that Syria was being hit right around the time, or soon after your post. Maybe Israel is reading here, and stole your idea. As we know, every script needs a writer.
I think we are getting away from things here chaps.
We need to focus back.
A BMW 4×4 with UK plates is now spooted on the D’Ire route.
Approx time 14.28
Seen (but not released) by Martin.
Why is this important ?
The info released is the info that they want to be released.
So…QUESTION.
Did Martin smash the window of the BMW owned by Al Hilli ?
Facts…previously told.
The girl is out of the car. The car is locked. The window had to be smashed.
Is this true ? Is this possible ?
So “go back”.
The vehicle of Al Hilli may have been smashed by the killer or killers. Why ?
Marlin
4 May, 2013 – 8:43 am YOU WILL NOT BE SURPRISED I completely agree with your anlysis. I have argued the same in the past. I agree the compelling aspect is the Frenchy’s approach. The only explanation is cock-up or conspiracy. I don’t believe even the French could be that incompetent. Once we conclude conspiracy, only a few countries qualify. As you say it is inconceivable that either the French or British would have reacted in the same way had the action originated in the far east, from the erstwhile eastern block, Mafia type crime or Muslim terrorist organisations. It’s worth comparing their bumbling, mistake laden approach that from the beginning admitted defeat, with the purposeful and deadly pursuit of Mohammed Merah. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toulouse_and_Montauban_shootings
We do have to have some focus here !
And Boston ! Forget it.
Who was that guy in the 1960’s. The Rev jum Jones.
Well Jim had the blind see and the wheelchair bound walk.
Trouble was, these people could already see and already walk.
That’s America. 40 or 50 years ago, they were pulling “stunts”.
It’s in the culture.
I say, yep a bomb went off there. A nice smokey bomb. Lovely.
But did what happen, happen ?
No.
I had friends in the RUC who attended the Omagh bombing.
I guess that was like the “Boston Bomb” ? Was it ! Compare.
And I had friends in hotels when in far off places, bombs went off.
Sure (I was told) the girls at reception looked unharmed, but were dead. But thoses bombs were BIG.
Boston wasn’t real. Like 9/11. No one believes it. Unless you’re American…then it’s a “debate” !
Debate what ? Do cats love other cats ? do bears poo in the woods.
So that is Boston covered. (It’s a lie. No one belives it that needs to. America is mad. Lets move on).
Back to Sa’ad Al Hilli please. That interests me more.
Thanks for that NR
4 May, 2013 – 10:40 am. Fascinating stuff. Three jews killed on tenth anniversary of 9/11 eh? Slaughter in very characteristic Muslim manner. BUT WHY THEM? WHY THERE? WHY NO HUGE ISRAEL OR AMERICAN GOVERNMENT REACTION AS ONE MIGHT EXPECT. That I think gives the lie. Unless one or all three can be shown to have something that might have provoked same. Would Muslim killers of that ilk thrown cannabis about the place – left money? Remember there were THREE very fit guys. Could one person do it without an element of surprise? I doubt it. No noise? Done in that time window between ordering food and it arriving? More likely held at gun point first by more than one. Maybe killed later. Was it intended as another shock horror anti muslim event which for some reason was abandoned? If TT did do it he was indeed a highly dangerous person capable of anything. But why not more seriously pursued by police as a prime suspect? Would have been easy to FRAME him for it. Was that the deal? (I’ve suggested similar with SAH – its the way SIS work) Work for us or we’ll set you up for that (last to see, Muslim, family crime connections, fingerprints, anti jewish etc)? The fact that his unmolested Russian trip follows with a short break. Where was he then? CIA briefing/training?
Tim !
“I’ve suggested similar with SAH – its the way SIS work”
Come on ! It doesn’t say anything.
The 9/11 thing, It was for cash. I doubt there was a classic “New World Order” that people speak of.
The problem I find is. There is a cult of “pariots” and cult of “conspiracy dude”. But no one talks of the “cult of self interest and getting cash”
The InfoWars guy. Nutter.
Icke. Nutter.
Bus. Nutter
Blair. Nutter
Jim Jones. Nutter
can we PLEASE get back to Al Hilli ????
NR
4 May, 2013 – 3:10 pm you are quite right about those anti-mortem photos. They are the same shot but reversed making it appear to be from opposite sides. It is quite disturbing. It means that on one picture the severe wounds are on his left hand side and in the other on the right. If the pictures were used as evidence of what happened this could lead to fundamentally different interpretations. Who has done that and why no pic from the other side? The picture had to be subject to graphical manipulation or was it to give the impression of two perspectives without revealing one of them? Most strange. Is it an official picture and (illegally) shared or one taken by an intruder or passer by? The casual treatment and subsequent reporting of the body is notable. After all this was a high profile case. In Britain only a Home Office Pathologist would have had jurisdiction under the control of the Coroner and the body not released until a full examination and report had been completed. If subject to dispute by the family it would be kept refrigerated until everyone was satisfied. Those massive incisions, wounds, traces of bleeding to body and head need to be explained. Bleeding stops effectively when the heart stops so this is crucial evidence of point of death in relation to the post mortem signs. Clearly there is no obvious evidence of resusitation technique being applied and only limited post mortem of internal organs, if at all. Sloppy in any normal incident let alone one carrying a criminal charge of “mass destruction”!
SOFEX 2013.
Nice stop over. Find a nice place in Jordan to eat. Take my beers from the aircraft. Top up my tan.
One thing ith SOFEX is. Where do these guys shoot their “guns” ?
Ah ! At their own people. Biggest threat see !
Now Tim. Write in paragraphys, smell the coffee. Stay on topic !
Boston ? Twas a training thing, Move on !