"Under international law, “questionable legitimacy” does not exist. An attack on a sovereign state is a crime."...

http://www.johnpilger.com/page.asp?partid=559

well done of course Craig. Right about war, right about Straw, right about Wood.

This link might be of interest to anyone who wants to see Tony Blair brought to justice:

http://www.arrestblair.org/

(I posted this in the discussion thread for Craig's previous post but it was way down the bottom so I thought I'd post it again.)

Leon's latest...

http://tinyurl.com/ybn74e5

chemical ali is hanged when will war criminal tony blair will be put to gallows? include among those to eb doomed-after goign through abu gharibi style treatment-those companison of crime like bBc journalists, sky journalists and rupert murdocjh and ofocurse this criminal jack ripper straw. and let thse be judged not by kangaroo british court but by the iraqis and afgans who suffrerd fromt these animals.

some one wrote this about americans-this applies more to the british because atleast americans did nto really vote for fraudulent bush but the british did vote thrice for the war criminal tony blair harami-knwing fully well his crimes.

"And Americans are definitely at fault. Who do you think elects these people, the French?? Just how many French voted for Bush in 2000?? How about 2004??? Did the Swiss vote put Bush over the top then??? You guys are blind if you can't see how the American people have gleefully baaaed their way into this morass happy to drive their wasteful Hummers and remain completely ignorant about the rest of the world.

When the world was saying that Saddam might not have WMDs, it was the US AND ONLY THE US (well, with the UK, Spain and Israel) that insisted on starting an illegal war. Americans were all for it. They were screaming in the streets for it. The rest of the world protested louder than ever before in 2003 AGAINST THE WAR and the US decided to go in anyway. If Americans weren't behind Bush, there's no way he would have been able to go against the entire world.

Americans are some of the most ignorant, stupid people on the planet. They have one of the most corrupt medias anyway, know very little about what really goes on in the world, love to flaunt their ignorance as some sort of richer-than-thou trophy that they don't need to know what's going on, and then spout idiotic crackpot theories as if they were facts even in the face of reality.

"The Jews are the only ones to blame" is pure racism. It would be a lot closer to the truth to say that "Americans are the only ones to blame," but even that is far from the truth. Morons vote for morons and then, morons become elected. The easier to control the herd with."

Well, my doubts about whether or not Blair actually broke international law in launching an unprovoked attack on Iraq to disarm it, (but of course it was no longer really armed at all, but a country on its knees, both militarily and economically), seem to have been swept aside by Michael Wood and his expert opinion, baked up by years of experience in this area of law.

Wood's opinion is, of course, backed by what most of the world's experts in international law have also concluded. One only has to think of the recent Dutch enquiry dealing with the question of the wars legality, which came to the same conclusion as Wood. The attack on Iraq was illegal, a grave international crime, one, if not the worst imaginable.
And Kofi Annan, remember him? Also stated, that from the perspective of the UN the war was also deemed illegal.

So who is left defending the "rightness" or "goodness" of attacking Iraq? Probably only those nations that actively took part in the attack themselves! The arch-criminals exonerate themselves, how convenient!

It's also interesting that Blair himself has talked about the "right thing to do" in relation to Iraq and Saddam's regime, but he seems to have moved away from using the word "legal."

Here's something about the concept of self-deception in nature, which I believe relates to my opinion that Blair has psychopathic traits; in the sense of being "amoral", a born conman, and serial liar. It's about the characteristics of deception, and how useful they are.

Deception is an important aspect of communication in nature, both in, and between species. Thos able to master deception are likely to survive. Yet, self-deception is even better, because one has successfully hidden most if not all, the outward signs that one is deceiving, which over time have become recognizable to other species, and therefore lose their effectiveness and strength, in the battle for survival between species, especially if one is a predator.

Wilmshurst admitted that she DID authorise force in the 1998 bombings. She is a hypocrite.

She makes me ashamed to be British. She was a civil servant whose only job was to give advice and then obey the attorney general’s final decision. She has disgraced the civil service.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036677/vp/35069473#35069223

But Sir Michael said he had always made it clear that it was ultimately up to Lord Goldsmith to advise ministers on whether war was lawful.

So you answer to you question as to why Goldsmith could overrule the advice of Michael Woods is that the the FCO's legal adviser said that Goldsmith's advice takes precedence. So Straw may not have been lying?

I predict Goldsmith will use the "Blackadder" defence tomorrow, "Opinion on Resolution 1441 was divided. Everyone else said war would be illegal, I said it wouldn't."

Feb 23, 2005

"A familiar tale"...

http://tinyurl.com/yex38x7

21 December 2007

Lord Goldsmith...

tinyurl.com/y9fsgvt

writerman - "Deception is an important aspect of communication in nature, both in, and between species. Thos able to master deception are likely to survive. Yet, self-deception is even better, because one has successfully hidden most if not all, the outward signs that one is deceiving, which over time have become recognizable to other species, and therefore lose their effectiveness and strength, in the battle for survival between species, especially if one is a predator."

Is there a typo in the last sentence ? It seems to say that self-deception is even better, and then go on to argue the case why it's dangerous.

Consider George Orwell's "2+2=5". There may perhaps be value in persuading some set of competitors that you believe this, but if you actually do believe it, your engineering projects are going to run into difficulties.

"Reality is that which bites you on the arse when you turn your back on it".

Stephen,

Are you a complete fool? Of course they system is that the Attorney General can overrule the Legal Adviser, even though the Legal Adviser is much more expert on international law.

Nobody is saying that is not the system. We are saying it allows the PM's croney to overrule the best expert advice available to the government, and it should NOT be the syatem.

"Blair has psychopathic traits"

IMO narcissistic personality disorder is closer - which itself may be a weak form of psychopathy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder

Cut and paste of the NPD criteria (sounds like most politicians to me):

1 has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)
2 is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
3 believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions)
4 requires excessive admiration
5 has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations
6 is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends
7 lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others
8 is often envious of others or believes others are envious of him or her
9 shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes

Interesting that Straw thought "International Law was pretty vague..."

Wasn't aware he was an expert in that field...

@Mike - you've duplicated that comment onto the "Politians Should Not Rule On The Legality Of War" post, where a few people have responded to you.

I'm not sure what any of this means. If it was legal it would have still been as wrong, even though it was illegal and they knew it, they still did it, and are still doing it.

The only issue that matters was Iraq didn't have the weapons. That is why the invasion happened. What every country should learn is they must obtain every weapon they need to defend themselves against America and the UK. That is the only way to stop invasions.
The pen is not mightier than the sword.

Eddie's dear leader:

http://www.sauer-thompson.com/archives/opinion/2009/12/16/BellSBlairIraqlies.jpg

http://qunfuz.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/steve-bell-tony-blair.jpg

The main thing that tells us Straw knew it was illegal is the fact that he had many Uzbeck farmers boiled alive to try and get the Uzbeck farmers to admit that they were Iraq terrorists so he could use their confessions as a means to get a second resolution.

If he didn't know that the war was illegal without it, he wouldn't have had to have any farmers boiled alive.

Here is a picture of someone Straw had boiled alive:
http://www.prisonplanet.com/images/september2006/140906boiled.jpg
to try and make the war legal.
So lets just remember, these lies for these wars are not the little white lies they said to steal expenses.

Just finished reading the book of this:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1139328/

Given the weird authoritarian and repressive excess that has characterized the Blair regime, even this "fictional" account sits easy with the record.

In other words, you couldn't make it up!

Craig

What should and should have been is not really the issue when you accuse Straw of lying. To paraphrase, you said that Straw was lying when he said his advice was that the war was legal without a second resolution - he may or may not have been wise on relying Goldman as his ultimate source of legal advice - but as Woods has made clear his ultimate adviser was Goldman. Given that you were not privy to the legal advice provided by Goldman to Straw, I'm afraid you are not in a position to say whether Straw lied or not.

As to whether the senior legal adviser to the Government should be a member of the Government - and hence accountable to Parliment - I can see counter arguments as to why that should be the case. Believe it or not there are areas where expert advisers can disagree - and then some judgement is required in order to chose between those different positions. I for one would prefer the person making the judgement to be accountable for the decision - ministers decide, advisers advise is an entirely stupid maxim.

@avatar_singh - blaming the electorate for 'moronic' behaviour is the same as blaming them for being human. It is true that most people are 'sheep-like', but if this is a regrettable feature of the human mind, then surely we should blame the creators of the culture which fosters and encourages it? Perhaps you and I, and Craig and technicolor, and glenn and MJ, and dreoilin and amk et al are unusually lucky to be given the cognitive ability to withstand being in oppositional minority, or sufficient empathy to cut through the propaganda of ones own side, even if it is uncomfortable to do so.

And as for the culture, what drives it? Is it in the nature of capitalism to make people greedy and self-serving, or are people greedy anyway (I tend to argue the former, and disagree with the latter). You touch on this: to what degree should we focus our ire on the media? I think the media institutions sometimes contain some extremely selfish people, and some of them perhaps exhibit the high-functioning personality disorders that @writerman refers to.

Accordingly whilst it is true that US culture is much more inward looking than other nations - few Americans own a passport, and awareness of foreign affairs is extremely low on average - shouting at people for their 'stupidity' is not going to win your position any converts.

To get an extremely intelligent but sympathetic view of working-class American values, amongst the military in particular, I would strongly recommend you read "Enemy Combatant" by Moazzam Begg (a Birmingham, UK man who spent several years in Guantanamo Bay without charge). Given his treatment, I think his assessments are extraordinarily charitable, and insightful.

There's no one who thinks the war was legal apart from the criminals involved and their acolytes.

The Attorney General didn't even think it was legal until he was leant on by Falconer, Sally Morgan and a gang of hoods in the US.

Only then did he change his mind.

Oh good. The film about Blairio will be released next month, just when it's all still lovely and topical.

The film, retitled The Ghost Writer (2010 film), was shot in early 2009 in Berlin and on the island of Sylt in the North Sea, which stood in for London and Martha's Vineyard due to Polanski's inability to legally travel to those places.

In spite of his recent incarceration, he has continued working on post-production, and the film is scheduled to premiere at the Berlin Film Festival in February 2010.
TV appearances

"Americans are some of the most ignorant, stupid people on the planet. They have one of the most corrupt medias anyway, know very little about what really goes on in the world, love to flaunt their ignorance as some sort of richer-than-thou trophy that they don't need to know what's going on, and then spout idiotic crackpot theories as if they were facts even in the face of reality."

How quickly this website enters into that familiar territory of anti-Americanism.

How's your media working out for you?

And what's this about idiotic crackpot theories? Do you mean the people on this blog who, with a lack of evidence, insist that 911 was an inside job?

The Dr Kelly piece is so far back now excuse me for putting this on. This news came through while the doctors were having a conference. The dam is being breached I should say.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8481791.stm

Page last updated at 18:18 GMT, Tuesday, 26 January 2010


Doctors may see Kelly post-mortem report, says Hutton

David Kelly's body was found near his Oxfordshire home in 2003

Details of the post-mortem examination of government weapons inspector David Kelly should be seen by doctors seeking an inquest, Lord Hutton has said.

The peer confirmed he had requested a 70-year gagging order on the material at the conclusion of his inquiry into Dr Kelly's 2003 death.

But he said on Tuesday the purpose of the secrecy order had been to avoid causing distress to Dr Kelly's family.

He has written to ministers saying the report may be seen by the doctors.

Dr Kelly's body was found in woods close to his Oxfordshire home in 2003, shortly after it was revealed that he was the source of a BBC report casting doubt on the government's claim that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction capable of being fired within 45 minutes.

Challenge

An inquest was suspended by then Lord Chancellor Lord Falconer, who ruled that Lord Hutton's inquiry could take its place.

Lord Hutton's report in 2004 concluded that Dr Kelly had killed himself by cutting an artery in his wrist.

But the finding has been challenged by doctors who claim that the weapons inspector's stated injuries were not serious enough.

It's astonishing and unheard-of for material of this nature to be hidden away for any length of time, let alone 70 years

Morman Baker, Lib Dem MP

One of them, former assistant coroner Michael Powers, raised concerns over the secrecy order after seeing a letter from the legal team of Oxfordshire County Council explaining the unusual restrictions placed by Lord Hutton on material relating to his inquiry.

The letter stated: "Lord Hutton made a request for the records provided to the inquiry, not produced in evidence, to be closed for 30 years, and that medical (including post-mortem) reports and photographs be closed for 70 years."

On Tuesday, Lord Hutton released a statement explaining his decision and revealing that he had written to the Ministry of Justice.

In it, he said: "At the conclusion of my inquiry into the death of Dr David Kelly, I requested that the post-mortem report relating to his death should not be disclosed for 70 years as I was concerned that the publication of that report in newspapers, books and magazines would cause his daughters and his wife further and unnecessary distress.

"Much of the material in the post-mortem report had been given in oral evidence in public at the inquiry and substantial parts of that evidence had been set out in my report.

"However, I consider that the disclosure of the report to doctors and their legal advisers for the purposes of legal proceedings would not undermine the protection which I wished to give to Dr Kelly's family, provided that conditions were imposed restricting the use and publication of the report to such proceedings, and I have written to the Ministry of Justice to this effect."

Liberal Democrat MP Norman Baker, who has conducted his own inquiries into Dr Kelly's death, said: "It's astonishing and unheard-of for material of this nature to be hidden away for any length of time, let alone 70 years.

"Coroners' inquests are held in public. Lord Hutton's inquiry was unique in its format and unique in requesting restrictions of this nature.

"His statement today undermines the validity of his own inquiry and gives further justification to the case being made by many for a proper inquest to be held into this most public of deaths."

Arsalan,

I, for one, wish the pen to me mightier than the sword, for the devistation of Iraq to be proven illegal, and for those guilty to be tried and punished.

EFFECTIVE law is, as your comment makes clear, the only alternative to a devistating arms race, perpetual war, and all the human suffering that would cause.

hey Clark, you're back.

Except you don't sound like yourself.

Ed Teague,one of the finest bloggers on the block until is untimely death from cancer last year,always prefaced his references to Straw with the phrase:WAR CRIMINAL.

If there is a God,Teague will be bathing in the holy waters of sweet vindication today.How right he was.

Teague's blog,Postman Patel,took its name from Straw's tendency to rely on an electoral machine run by a man called Patel.Said Patel had the uncanny knack of getting muslim heads of household in Blackburn to make sure that every(I mean-every)all their families voted for Straw.

Said fixer,Patel was knighted for his services to Jack Straw....sorry,I mean to fair elections!

Those on this blog with unrealistic expectations about British "democracy" and politicians of Straw's ilk need to wake up.Even mainstream political commentators like Peter Oborn,before he did the programme on the British Israeli Lobby,had fingered Straw,Mandelson,and Denis(ADL)MacShane as being some of the biggest liars in politics.

The power of the Israeli Lobby in British and American politics is conveniently for its practitioners and beneficiaries completely underestimated.When commentary on issues of war and foreign policy fail to factor in the role of the Lobby they have usually caved as the left is especially prone to do to Lobby pressure proscriptions against "anti-semitism".

Let's de-Zionize the "gamer" schmucks on this site-Larry,angri,technicoler et al- while we're about it!

It has become plain for some weeks that there is a concerted effort to by angrysoba, larryfromstlouis and others to divert every thread into a discussion of 9/11. I am deleting any comment about 9/11 by anyone, unless on a post about 9/11 - and I have no plans for one of those.

Hi Technicolour,

yes, I had a little difficulty wording the comment above, but it was definately me! Actually, I haven't been gone; I've been reading all the posts and comments, but felt had nothing to add.

I hope you're feeling better.

Where are those Hasbara divvies tonight?

Great post,Apostate.

Just cringe at the list of hacks who will probably be justifying Straw's deceptions in the media tomorrow.

Melanie (Very Loony Zio Party)Phillips

David (Agressive Zio-War Party)Aaronobitch

John (Lobby brown-noser)Rentool

It's pretty obvious to anyone familiar with the Protocols that this is the script Straw,Mandelson,Goldsmith and MacShane(aka.Cohen)are following.

1:8 Politics have nothing in common with morals...He who wants to rule must have recourse to cunning and hypocrisy(in spades preferably).The great human qualities of sincerity and honesty become vices in politics.

This is the Straw/Mandelson understanding of the vocation of politics.Truth is an impostor to such people-wherever it raises its head it must be denied and extinguished.

Those still in the vice-like grip of Frankfurt School conditioning will insist that the Protocols are an "anti-semitic forgery" from which we should all shrink in terror!

Bollocks!The Protocols explain the game-plan of former communists and trots like Straw and Mandelson to the letter.

If you can't stomach the Protocols,Sir Arthur Ponsonby's recipe for WW1 propaganda might be included in your further research.

"Facts must be distorted,relevant circumstances concealed,and a picture painted which by its crude colouring will persuade the ignorant people(he means angri,Larry et al) that their government is blameless and that the indisputable wickedness of the enemy has been proven beyond question."

Straw and the war mongers seem to have supplemented their Protocol game-plan with Ponsonby's WW1 prescriptions above.

The "indisputable wickedness" of our "enemies" has been less proven in the latest take-down of Iraq than that of our leaders and their Lobby puppeteers in Whitehall.

And now the Met Police have stopped Stop the War from exercising their democratic right to peacefully protest outside the QEII conference centre in London whenMr Blair gives his evidence to the Chilcot Inquiry.

The Met told STW that they had been 'trying' to facilitate the protest. Reading between the web of entangled lines, the police (ever ready to do the gvt's bidding) have fallen to their political masters.Yet again.

You just wonder when the police are actually ever again going to uphold the laws of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

Here's more from STW: http://bit.ly/8mKM0T & http://stopwar.org.uk

And, on a tangent though part of a piece, just one word for St Louis Larry (who appears to believe that ad hominem attacks somehow prove his opinions right) ...'Northwoods'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods

What protocols?

@Craig: better make sure you delete Steelback while you're at it.

Craig, so I see that you've passed on the merits of Apostate's statements about the Protocols.

I would have thought you would have deleted such vile references at least for the sake of appearances, but you're not even concerned with that.

It's going to be interesting to see what you choose to delete and what you choose to keep.

Craig, so AngryLArry can claim a victory by removing one of the topics from your board that they are here to remove?

You do know they/he is only here to cause problems don't you?

Clark what I meant was the law is just some words on some bits of paper. People who are above the law have nothing to fear by going against it. The only reason Iraq and Afghanistan were invaded were they didn't have the power to resist the invasion. having the power to fight back does not mean constant war. It would mean a constant peace because no one will gain from war.

just delete all of angrylarry's post. they never say anothing of use here anyway.
Larry can go to Angry's blog and there they can slag us all as much as they like.

Larry,

I don't read all this stuff! Just did a search on 9/11 and 911.

You know very well you have been deliberately derailing all the threads onto 9/11. You then pot that this is a site for "truthers" so nobody should take the main posts seriously.

It would in a sense be more honest if you yourself believed in some weird theory and were expounding it, rather than attempting to goad a fringe into postulating such theories so you can mock them.

I would much rather people did not post nonsense about the Protocols of Zion, Jewish plots in the Federal Bank, Freemasons and the Templars. You would much rather they did, so you can mock. You are the weird one, not me.

i don't get this, arsalan. why are you calling for people to be deleted?

?

how did your salmon go?

Sorry, missed reading Craig's comment before posting.

@merkin. I guess that would be anticant - if so, tell him his input is missed. It's still a madhouse in here, but the fringe is easily ignored ;-)

Still waiting on Craig to delete references to the Protocols ...

There appears to be some confusion about the Protocols.

It has been suggested that they are in fact the minutes of a B'nai B'rith meeting.

It seems highly likely therefore that they are a reflection of the modus operandi of the early Israeli Lobby.

Who are B'nai B'rith?

An exclusively Jewish fringe freemasonic group intimately connected to ADL.B'nai is big in Chicago along with the Moshepoche network responsible for putting Barack (from Hebrew,Baruch meaning "blessed")Obama where he is today.

Who are the moshepoche?

Ask Hilary Clinton or Rahm Emanuel or go to fourwinds10.com.

No vile conspiracy there then!

tungsten

oh for goodness sake, enough of the bollocks

I miss anticant too.

Here is the Key Point:

"THE CHAIRMAN: You mentioned earlier that there is no

18 comprehensive system of courts to determine issues of

19 legality in international law terms, and we heard just

20 a bit this morning regarding the crime of aggression,

21 not, we were told, I think by Michael Wood, deemed to be

22 part of English law following a House of Lords', as it

23 then was, judgment but there are courts with some

24 jurisdiction, clearly the ICC.

25 Can you say how far the ICC may come into relevance





15



1 in the context of a crime of aggression?

2 MS ELIZABETH WILMSHURST: Yes. The ICC does have

3 jurisdiction over the crime of aggression, but it can't

4 exercise that jurisdiction until the states' parties to

5 the ICC statute have agreed on a definition of the crime

6 and the conditions for its exercise. They have been

7 negotiating for years and they are going to have

8 a review conference in May and June at which they will

9 either decide on this or not.

10 THE CHAIRMAN: If they were to decide, is it possible to

11 speculate whether it would have retrospective

12 application?

13 MS ELIZABETH WILMSHURST: It wouldn't have retrospective

14 application.

15 THE CHAIRMAN: It would not?

16 MS ELIZABETH WILMSHURST: No.

Arsalan,

Wrong, because 9/11 is not a subject on the board. I do in fact get very frustrated by people posting off-topic stuff about 9/11, Jews and Freemasons - and the nutty argument that it is not off-topic because Jews and Freemasons and 9/11 explain everything.

I just don't need arses like Larry deliberately provoking more of it.

What happens at the Chilcott inquiry doesn't matter a damn...it's a PR damage limitation exercise.

What is key as that an international 'crime of aggression' has not been defined or agreed upon and won't be until May or June if at all according to Ms.Wilmshurst testimony.

Even when a definition is agreed upon...it won't be retroactively applied.

This means Blair and his cronies will walk away from all of this free men as no crime has been committed.

Sickening as it is...that's game set and match!

Oliver,

You fall back on the Blairite doctrine that as a court has not yet been constituted to try the crime of aggression, it is not illegal. That is not true as any international lawyer will tell you, and Wilmshurst and Wood just did.

12 May 2009

"Suspicious death of torture victim whose “information” led to the Iraq war"...

http://tinyurl.com/ydzbtwp

@Craig

I'm not falling back on anything here....what I see happening is a catastrophic injustice...guilty, murdering, lying scumbags in suits walking free.

What truly disgusts me is that people like Ms Wilmshurst and Woods...deeply impressive, intelligent individuals who seem to embody integrity...had rings run around them by the likes of Bliar and his political toads, at the moment when their views needed to be heard most.

Where do you think these people are going to stand trial?

What court is going to punish them?

I hope so desperately that these people get what they deserve.

Craig

It seems to me by issuing a blanket ban on 9/11 comments you are handing a victory to the troublemakers like Larry because clearly he thus achieves his intention of disrupting the blog. Surely it makes more sense to block the troublemaker?

This feels like we're all being gagged.

"This feels like we're all being gagged."

Personally, I felt that it was a non-conversation, with no effects except to make it harder for those that wanted to speak with each other. So I welcome Craig's blowing his top for once. I've been thinking for a while that his patience is positively superhuman.

Oliver,

Where there's a will there's a way. The logic of your argument doesn't stand up, or all of the war criminals who have been prosecuted since WWII wouldn't have been.

Of course the real problem here, is that there isn't the political will for prosecution - in the UK, US or EU, but that really is because the political class has been hijacked at the highest levels, and the lower levels such as MP's just do as they are told and are kept in ignorance.

In the UK, the old establishment, where there at least was a degree of honour and integrity amongst some of its members of the political elite has long since gone.

It does however still exist, in other powerful areas, but it remains to be seen if the courage exists for that power to be used to clean up what has now become a horrendously corrupt and evil system.

A google search of the UK Press reveals demands from extremely senior figures across the spectrum of the justice system, royalty and the military demanding that Blair stands trial for war crimes

There are literally hundreds of articles, and the screaming for justice is growing much more intense

I've actually found this quite surprising and encouraging

It may take time, but the issue is not going away, because it is so vitally important.

The rule of law has already been lost in the US.

It is the duty of a large number of Senior, Influential People to demand that the rule of law is upheld in the UK. If we lose the Law, then we have lost our children's future and the entire world is likely to descend into total chaos.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article24444.htm

Tony

Oliver,

Sorry if I misunderstood your motive on your first post - but I agree with Tony

KingofWelshNoir,

Let me say again with respect, I frequented David Cameron's board WebCameron from it's inception to it's death. It was killed by the 'Larry's' of this world - killed dead - forgotten, even after attempts to save it with another similar board. Therefore I respect Craig's call and refuse now to discuss 9/11 simply for that reason. In private and with other investigators I do provide input - but not here.

'killed - dead' sorry tired.

"I have come to realise that caring in politics isn't really about caring"

Tony Blair Labour conference Sept 2006...

http://tinyurl.com/dahdrp

Thanks for Blair quote...

tinyurl.com/yblrwod

Craig - I regret responding to the troll Larry's insults to those holding contrary views about 9/11 to his own, you consider it an abuse of your 'open house' policy here, and I will not respond to any thread which raises the subject from this one forward. Please accept my apologies if my contributions to such debates have ticked you off.

@Opmoc

I too would like to think it's the duty of a large number of senior, influential people to demand that the rule of law is upheld.

I too would like to think that honour, integrity and the courage to act still exists "in [the] other powerful areas" you allude too.

Whatever happens now will not change the fact that these crimes could have been prevented had enough 'good' and 'influential' people stood up at the right time.

Katharine Gun and Elizabeth Wilmshurst were the finest public examples of an attempt to. They inspire hope for the future.

"On Crime and Punishment-Kalil Gibran

...As a single leaf turns not yellow but with the silent knowledge of the whole tree,
So the wrong-doer cannot do wrong without the hidden will of you all."

1441 was a compromise between automacicity and need for a 2nd resolution.
It allowed for the possibility of military action without a 2nd UNSCR --satisfying USA/UK-- while stopping short of authorising it --satisfying France/Germany (that was the best they'd ever get from USA, who's trump card was "sod you, we're gonna invade whatever the UN says).
Hence the maleable term "serious consequences".
At the last, it boiled down to who had the big guns, the troops, the missiles, ships, planes.. poised to strike.
International law was for winners to inflict extra-punishment on losers.

Evidently the moderators have moved in on this blog.

If you are unwilling to allow legitimate commentary on Jewish Freemasons or 9/11 then you are clearly caving to the "gamers".

These are the team intent on re-channelling all criticism of Israel and the involvement of its intelligence and Lobby operations worldwide.

As a victim of the Lobby's machinations yourself one would have thought you would by now have done some research on the phenomenon.

tungsten's references to Obama's links to B'nai B'rith were clearly documented by Christopher Bollyn in a recent piece on his blog and elsewhere.

If you are unwilling to publish this on the message board then I suggest you announce unequivocally that Larry and the gamers have scored total victory and this topic like the 9/11 one is off limits.

Naturally the blog will be of no further interest to those of us who are less research-averse than youself and your "gaming" friends.

http://www.bollyn.com/index.php#article_11522

tech
I didn't eat it on the day, I just had the Garlic Mushrooms.

My wife did the salmon the next day with some dil, she lightly fried them in a pan with EX V Olive Oil.

Craig it is true people are getting baited by AngryLarry, and that is why Angrylarry are here.
I just don't want to see them/him win.
I try to avoid responding to them other than to mock them.

And Larry, the reason why Craig has not deleted what you ordered him to delete is because he is not your bitch.

Too all, the only reason I made that(unite) forum was for people to talk about stuff angryLarry try to stop them talking about. That includes the stuff Angry Larry want banned and deleted here. So Click on my link to post stuff you think will upset AngryLarry.

well done craig ...don't give up...my site has long since gone...but it needs to be said...remember the e-mails from the hutton report....? the e-mails exposing the sept dossier? the way they pitched back and forth to each other?

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