The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
@Bluebird:
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/entertainment/Argo+director+Affleck+says+Canadian+diplomat+Taylor+hero/7375980/story.html
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/canadas-man-in-tehran-was-a-cia-spy/article4311038/
Cycling is the new “tennis”?
Back to flight logs…I went to a forum on pilot flight log books to look for information on whether or not these must be carried with the pilot, or kept elsewhere. There was contradictory information about certain conditions. That was, if a pilot had been trained in the U.S., but was flying in Europe, it seems that he might have had to carry this information with him. As we know, Peter Barnes had done some of his training in Florida. Florida.
Flight log information can be entered in a book or a computer. Has anyone found Captain Peter Barnes’ flight log data? Did it go down with him, or was it held elsewhere? Why haven’t we heard anything about this?
For the record, I did some research on satellite image cueing and found information from a 2008 publication. This stated that SSTL’s latest satellites were able to cue images in 14 minutes. It took another 15 minutes to process the image, but this time would improve moving forward, as better computers were available. This is a significant improvement from the three to four-day cue time in the past. That’s what near-real time means.
http://www.milsatmagazine.com/cgi-bin/display_article.cgi?number=2009162825
http://www.milsatmagazine.com/cgi-bin/display_article.cgi?number=2009162825
Cue time for SSTL satellite: 14 minutes. Processing time: 15 minutes, but will shorten with computer advancements. That was in 2008. No more waiting three or four days for a satellite image.
@Tim V: Remember how the fire brigade was on the scene at Chevaline almost immediately? Were these fire brigade people testing their drones as part of wildfire surveillance? Video posted yesterday showed that the fire drones are tested in conjunction with a helicopter in the air.
We know that Peter Barnes was well familiar with the Alps. We know that he had worked with police and rescue services in the U.K. in his work. Was he at Chevaline? His company had infrared cameras.
Tim V- that was a very nice 4-post summary of caveats. You once prepared a good summary that was available as a PDF. How about collating all these points in an updated summary, that will include the speculations about the agencies involved and the horse symboloism? plus everything else that came to light since? If you choose to do that, feel free to use anything from anything I have posted (which for the most part tracks with your views of the events, mostly taking cues from yours – and a few other people’s postings) and combine to a lovely whole.
For my part, I started working on a timeline of MSM accounts of the incidents – again in an attempt to summarize in one place the “evolving” official story line – that thanks to the many good links to all the old stories provided by pink, Q NR and others. That “evolution” BTW, just based on my cursory start along those lines points not only to a cover-up – as we all now – but to a very sloppy one. Underpinning the sloppiness of the cover-up (where no one could get their stories straight and conform to one another) is, IMO, both an extreme arrogance, one that allows the agencies to believe they can get away with any idiocy they peddle, and serious dysfunction in inter=agency communications. These point both to great confidence in being able to fool a gullible and distracted public – which we already know about – but also a very disturbing double or even triple cross of one or two agencies by a third, or even a fourth. What I will try to do – as time permits – is to lay this out through the “changing facts” and “dancing time-lines”. I hope it may also point in some new directions though, since clearly there are aspects of the “Chevaline Incident” where they don’t want us to look.
Also, I really liked your idea of assembling a list of questions as suggestions for reporters – who may be willing to ask a few things (there’s always one somewhere, I believe). The problem is that there are too many questions so it might be good to narrow down to the 5-6 most critical ones. My own recommendation is to avoid the more “conspiratorial” questions that bring in other events, such as the helicopter crash, and just concentrate on Chevalin. My three contributions are below:
1. Regarding the 4×4 and motorcycle – has Martin confirmed that they passed him both on his way up AND coming down from the crime scene? and if the builders saw them BEFORE they saw the BMW (which they put originally at a time between 2:30 and 3PM) where could these vehicles be for 20-30 minutes so that Martin could see them going up – AGAIN – sometime after 3:15PM?
2. Why was Martin – from the onset – his hands covered in blood – according to Phillipe D – not considered a suspect? why was he not at least held as a “material witness”?
3. What reason is there that no photos – or any other information – are available on three of the victims? is that not counter-productive for generating information leads from the public and/or generating sympathy for presumably “innocent’ victims of a psycho killer as Eric Maillaud has maintained? why the unusual blanket of secrecy if all we are dealing with a “lone killer” with a pathological dislike of tourists and/or cyclists?
@NR: Thank you for the Science Fiction Land information. I see Buckminster Fuller was mentioned. Naturally, I had noticed that the helicopter rotors at Vauxhall were made of carbon fiber.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buckminsterfullerene
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_%28fiber%29
Q
Thats quick. Should we assume that the ‘meet’ at Martinet was watched live on Satellite and that the 3.48 call is almost the time of the shootings then?
Log books !
Without going massively into it, basically, you log all your flights in the compliant and legal way. You’ll need it. Keep it with you and keep it up to date.
There’s an app for it !
Although I have mine on a data stick.
Blue.
Flights in London (over the city areas). You can’t.
Military and emergency can.
Helicpters use an air corridor (basically the path of The Thames).
Fixed wing commercial you come in over that route also (buy not following The Thames !). You’ll be around 4,000 feet on the approach….and decending into Heathrow (look right you’ll get a good view of London as you’ll be just South or the river).
Hence a helicopter on the route (East to West) cannot climb out of local weather conditions. You would fine yourself in greater danger ! And Heathrow ATC will kindly remind you that they bite !!!!
I almost forgot that Peter Barnes’ Helivision had worked in missile retrieval.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/london-2012-missile-sites-surface-to-air-1131134
At the time of that daring rescue of a motorist from a flooded river ford, the media noted that Captain Barnes did not have a winch. He must have acquired a helicopter with one at some point, in order to work in missile retrieval.
@Straw44berry: Live on satellite? I think the chance of that greatly increases if the whole thing was planned in advance and timed precisely, which leads to Tim V’s questions.
@Straw: The cue and processing time was 29 minutes total in 2008.
Has anyone seen photos of helicopters lowering missiles into place atop buildings before the 2012 London Olympics? I assume they didn’t use the buildings’ elevators or stairs. I’m curious to know if anyone has seen photos of same being removed. Was any of this work contracted out?
@ Q 21 Jan, 2013 – 6:03 pm
“Bizarre comment from one witness to the helicopter crash, that it sounded like a gas explosion. How many people are familiar with gas explosions, other than in movies? And how many people are always worried about 9/11?”
There was a time when people said any loud noise from an explosion to an earthquake was, “Just like an atomic bomb going off!” Like they’d ever heard an atomic bomb going off.
Now disasters are, “It was just like a war zone,” or “It was just like a movie.”
@Straw44berry: Also important to note that the cue time was 14 minutes, as of 2008. I am wondering how the different times would figure into this: 14 minutes to cue, 15 minutes to process the image. If the scenarios are shaped around that, is that why we’ve been presented a story with flaws in the time and sequence of events? Did the official story get messed up by the times printed on the images?
Just dropping some links
Drones
http://www.visiofly-store.com/en/applications.html
Radioactive leak
http://www.ledauphine.com/isere-nord/2013/01/21/centrale-nucleaire-du-bugey-polemique-autour-d-une-fuite-radioactive-dans-les-eaux-souterraines
06/01/2013
http://www.ledauphine.com/isere-sud/2013/01/05/retour-sur-le-crash-qui-a-fait-5-morts-pres-de-l-aeroport-de-grenoble-saint-geoirs
A simple observation: Sylvie Lecoeur is wearing a South Beach, Florida tank top in one of her Sky News interviews. I observed a souvenir ball cap from the French Alps on a certain female book author who came up in this thread at the time of the Florida goings-on. People do get around. It’s a small world.
@Pink: That led to this:
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/military/read.main/148187/
http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/0/Sylvie
How ironic. Sylvain has the same meaning.
@Tim V: Salt, Farnborough:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2001/aug/30/sillyseason.physicalsciences
Salt, sinkholes, satellites:
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/161005#.UP3IWXdsKdk
James
21 Jan, 2013 – 12:30 am As I see it the winscreen shots (there are three or four) can be explained in two ways – that no doubt close examination by the ballistics experts has already revealed – either they were made by the gun man approaching head on and aiming at the driver, or they were the result of someone standing on the LHS of the car, aiming again at the driver as he attempted to get back in the car. I tend to go for the latter because the blood marks on the ground are a sure indicator where Mollier fell and lay. Then we know from the blood contamination that the Al Hillis were standing with him when shot, so after those first shots we know that SAH managed to get back to the driver’s side and into the car so it is reasonable to believe shots were fired at him, in an attempt to prevent his escape. The windscreen is in a direct line and we also have the report that he had a traverse wound to his body, probably as he did so. Then we have the evidence of the ten used bullets under or inside the car which must have fired when the car was in the forward position, i.e. before SAH managed to get in the car and reverse. So even without the detailed specialist information, we can deduce quite a lot.
@Q We covered those two plane crashes a while ago I was checking the papers and was not sure if that was a different one so I just dropped the link in with the other two so I could close the window because the comp was hanging.
Marlin
21 Jan, 2013 – 1:15 am Spot-on analysis I would say Marlin. Now how do we flush them out? If they are brave enough to shoot unarmed women and children, I’m sure they are brave enough to admit to the crime and try to justify it before the court of public opinion?
Now then !
Talking of “aircrafts”….and “it looked with a fim set”.
Has anyone “reversed searched” AMS1087 ???
You should try it. “Wiltshire” and “Aerial photography” and hit search.
AMS 1095
AMS 1087
AMS 1097
They like taking aerial pictures up in Wiltshire !
Take AMS 1097 for instance.
Mr Nigel Patrick Johnson. Aircraft Engineer.
And he’s involved in “Mossglen”.
What do they do, I hear you cry…..
“Live Theatrical Presentations & Other Artistic & Literary Works”
(cough, cough !).
NR
21 Jan, 2013 – 1:57 am Interestingly if you search personalised number plates with MI5 you get the following response.
“Number Plate Search
There was a problem with your search:
Sorry – no results for your search could be found
Please try another search. Enter your name or your initials, or anything!”
Such a corny device to allow those who need to know the ownership of the car is quite possible. I am sure if we researched the subject we could find other examples.
Think now we’re getting somewhere Bluebird
21 Jan, 2013 – 10:30 am. Little “in-joke” between agencies. Chevaline -> slaughter of horses -> horses MI6 agents. This might be as much to do with inter-agency competition/one upmanship as it is to do with the nature of the plot. Teach the other side who’s boss, territorial hegemony, spheres of influence. I can’t see a direct heroin connection but we know Afgahnistan shares border with Iran. Iran using it as currency in exchange for technical information? Unlike Iranian currency its not devalued.
I am off to bed now I thought I would post this again I wondered what new people might make of it as far as I know there is not any cctv at the lay-by.
It doesn’t show anything only a picture of the car but its been on yotube since the early days .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VxhC0CBuOuc
Bluebird
21 Jan, 2013 – 11:58 am We all know that the international drugs trade is a huge huge business of illegal money. We only hear of governments fighting the drugs trade but never about it profiting from it. Just as slaves built Bristol and Liverpool so drugs have built London (and a lot of other places). As films have depicted, the American military was up to its neck in the import of the stuff from indo china from the 60’s onwards etc etc It is steeped in corruption and death. It is a commodity just like gold and the banks have made a healthy profit out of laundering it. Whether or not this links to Chevaline I have no idea. Maybe someone here might like to speculate how it could?
It would be a strange development Q
21 Jan, 2013 – 6:47 pm if a SSTL satellite was being used to monitor Al Hilli’s movements across Europe wouldn’t it?
I suppose its possible Q
21 Jan, 2013 – 6:53 pm but you will recall the Fire’Rescue service which arrived first at the scene didn’t claim to be officially called out. It was almost as if they “overheard” it by accident. “they picked it up on the radio” or some such.(Strangely the police arrive last) They seem almost to be acting on their own initiative and irrespective of potential danger if it was a lone mad gunman. Either that or those in charge knew it was safe for them to go in unprotected because someone KNEW the killers were out of there.