The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
Another kazakhstan air crash! http://news.sky.com/story/1044361/kazakhstan-21-dead-after-jet-crashes-in-fog
meanwhile it’s state oil company has bought Conoco’s 24.5% share of a big reserve.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/01/30/us-oil-kazmunaigas-conocophillips-idUSBRE90T0P920130130
Anyone make sense of this? Looks very Mayan to me! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:ConocoPhilHQAerial2002.png
Good observations Lizzie007
30 Jan, 2013 – 10:52 pm. If you were to ask me to respond to your suggestions I would reply “Probably” “Probably” “probably”!
Only small problem remaining is proving all or any. lol
Pop in more often, sometime its some crazy suggestion that provides the crucial piece of the jigsaw. At least thats my theory (and I’m sticking to it)
@Tim V: Crazy ideas? How about that small white car parked on the property at Chevaline? I can’t tell if it’s a Peugeot.
There’s also a custom-painted van with a roof rack and some kind of orange hoist behind it. The van has something white in the windows, almost like an airbag that went off. A small guest house is on one edge of the property.
It’s the small white car that got my attention.
Any ideas about the make and model of this small white car?
http://maps.google.ca/maps?q=mairie+chevaline&hl=en&ll=45.762409,6.219935&spn=0.001173,0.00327&sll=51.013117,-114.088499&sspn=0.541724,1.674042&hq=mairie+chevaline&radius=15000&t=h&layer=c&cbll=45.76236,6.220109&panoid=H69YU559Mkq_hYVk3aZKFA&cbp=12,324.72,,2,3.64&z=19
How about this orange unit at the back of the van?
http://maps.google.ca/maps?q=mairie+chevaline&hl=en&ll=45.762409,6.219935&spn=0.001173,0.00327&sll=51.013117,-114.088499&sspn=0.541724,1.674042&hq=mairie+chevaline&radius=15000&t=h&layer=c&cbll=45.762518,6.219812&panoid=xPV3RvljX1lClZtaQm7avQ&cbp=12,94.42,,0,1.74&z=19
A cursory comment from France – (is this just vacuous or an official leak?) – see comment below – “lol!!”
Two features – link to MP for Yvelines is dubious & Mollier is no longer investigated, (these being linked via the Schutz’s). Enquiring minds may find this interesting. It appears that drug related activity is ruled out?
{http://www.leparisien.fr/faits-divers/tuerie-de-chevaline-la-piste-du-cycliste-ecartee-26-01-2013-2514809.php} 26th Jan 2013
Tuerie de Chevaline : la piste du cycliste écartée The cyclist inquiry line rejected
The inquiry into the slaughter at Chevaline (Haute-Savoie) in which four people died and a young girl was wounded, progresses in spite of the pious silence of the investigators. While the cyclist line of investigation has been discarded, two other lines of investigation are preferred: the family line and that of a crazed killer [contrast: here that the crazed killer is a piste “priviligee” or preferred line of enquiry, but only “holds the rope” ie just hangs on, in the last para!!]
The police have now completed their sorting and prioritizing of which enquiry lines to follow. They have definitely “eliminated”, or almost so, the line of enquiry around the family of cyclist Sylvain Mollier designated at one time as the initial target of the killings through him belonging to the nuclear industry Areva Group. The British press had made a dubious connection between Pierre Morange, MP for Yvelines, uncle of Claire Schutz, the companion of the cyclist, a pharmacist, and the unsolved crime concerning Christian Marshall who was killed in March 2007, former head of the municipal police in the town of Chambourcy, whose elected representative is also the mayor. A line of enquiry which from now on is swept away. Sylvain Mollier worker in a subsidiary of Areva, had no special clearance and his work harbored no secret.
However, the hypothesis over the sorting out of a family account in connection with an inheritance over which Saad Al Hilli and his brother Ziad were in dispute is still active. The two brothers were at loggerheads since the death of their father Khadim and had their eye on the hidden bank account in Switzerland containing a sum of € 960,000. The hypothesis of a sponsored (ie criminal) action remains current.
With respect to the international letters rogatory which were to be sent to Iraq to investigate the claims of the Al Hilli family property having been looted by the Saddam Hussein regime, this is a dead letter, in the absence of reliable interlocutors it is still not a part of this.
The other line of enquiry that still hangs on (holds the rope) is the lurking killer, a gunman, a lover of antique weapons. The police quietly continue their tour of gunsmiths and sports clubs. In vain.
Redhouse 26/01/2013 – 7:48 p.m. Investigating cyclist-Savoie is rejected by the investigation, except that we should know why he had decided that day to cross the border exceptionally between the two departments (usually in effect, he made his daily walks- bike without exceeding the limits of his department)
gogo 27/01/2013 – 0:12 Pkoi (pourquoi) Why can’t a man decide to go biking outside his department, in particular being at a place adjacent to where the drama is??? You stop the commentary and respect the guy!
5104fdbbdcaaf 27/01/2013 – 11:13 6 months to arrive at this conclusion? Lol / laugh out loud
The Peugeot 206 has hood vents:
http://encarsglobe.com/peugeot-206.html
I’m wondering if there is a code of silence in Chevaline. Talk about crazy ideas, Tim V. I got this one here:
http://www.thenational.ae/news/world/europe/after-strauss-kahn-code-of-silence-may-no-longer-protect-french-politicians
By nature, I’m not a conspiracy theorist but this case just wreaks of it. I think they’re downplaying SM’s involvement purposely. It’s also bizarre that the French said it’ll take 10 years to solve this case? Maybe they think people will lose interest? My guess is this will never be solved. It’s sad for the children who will never know what happened. I can’t understand why the family isn’t screaming bloody murder about the custody of those girls? If those were my nieces, I would be banging on doors, and shouting from rooftops, every single day until they were back with family members instead of with strangers…
Wouldn’t Sylvie Lecoeur recognize a white Peugeot 206 that was parked on her own driveway? Had she ever looked at that house on Google Streets, or was she a recent arrival?
Lizzie007 – 10:52 PM – as you can see both Tim V and I – and a few others here – have been raising these very questions for some time. I tend to consider an Iran angle as the most likely one, which then, almost automatically brings in the questions of “trojan Horses” and Mossad as the agency carrying out the “slaughter of horses”. If so, we will obviously never get confirmation of how, why and what exactly happened at the martinet, but I think we are zeroing in on the most likely culprits and the inter-agency ploys that got these individuals to their rendez-vous with fate.
I doubt we’ll need to wait 10 years either. Things will come to light little by little though I think some odf us may be getting restive – because it is kind of frustrating to be lied to so obviously.
If you look you’ll also see that I keep raising the two key questions, which to me, are the ones that really cast doubt on the forever changing official story lines. One is, as your point notes is the complete absence of photos of 4 of the victims AND the children. That’s too crazy in this day and age to be a coincidence, no matter how conservative or private individuals’ families are. The second biggest question mark has to do with the children (my post from a few days ago reiterated the questions – yet again) – almost everything to do with them is not on the up and up.
And I do especially agree with you on the “foster care” situation – unbelievable that there’s so little racket being made about that by their family. It is completely out of keeping especially for traditionally close Arabic families. Someone, somewhere made it clear to them – especially iqbal’s sister – that they better keep things cool if they know what’s good for them.
All in all, this whole Chevalin case is a true blight on Western systems of “policing” and “justice”. Which is one reason I am still around. Some of us just have to keep calling these things out for what they are – travesties.
What was the name of that french pamphlet that energized the Occupy movement? Indignes Vous?
@ Lizzie007 31 Jan, 2013 – 12:48 am
“By nature, I’m not a conspiracy theorist but this case just wreaks of it… It’s sad for the children who will never know what happened. I can’t understand why the family isn’t screaming bloody murder about the custody of those girls?”
Yes, it’s a conspiracy of some sort. The family did make a statement asking why the girls weren’t returned to them. The UK Sun made one attempt with a “Help Us Catch the Balkan Man” following stories of a lurker at the campground. The tabloids can’t go further without a pleading family and pics of cute kids.
I suspect one or more of SAH’s and SM’s families was briefed on the need for secrecy – national security and/or safety of survivors. Perhaps some of them – even overseas relatives were themselves involved in “whatever” it was and would be in danger.
It doesn’t fit with the lone nutter theory.
@ Q 30 Jan, 2013 – 2:21 pm
“@Bluebird 10:57 a.m.: I guess would should wait for Snopes to debunk any and all of the conflicting official versions of what happened at Chevaline. That would make it all better, then. Because Snopes is the final authority on everything.”
Anyone wanting to waste time can do so in trying to determine who “owns” and how income is generated for:
Snopes.com, supposedly privately owned by two individuals and supported by ads, no mention of outside support. One owner is a Canadian so they couldn’t possibly be biased regarding US politics. Or so they claim.
Factcheck.org is run by the Annenberg Public Policy Center of the University of Pennsylvania. Because Walter Annenberg was originally a friend of Reagan’s, liberals claim it can’t lean right, but the other side claims Soros provides current funding.
Polifact.com is a consortium of newspaper fact checkers organized by the Tampa Bay Times a newspaper operated as a non-profit out of the Univ. of S. Florida, and described as liberal or progressive, by The Wikipedia.
In checking their facts, they all refer to each other as authorities, and to The Wikipedia. The Ministers of Truth.
What some private pilots do: “Phil Marshall flew Barry Seal’s Lear jet… he’d been kept in the dark about the nature of his boss’s business. Still, he concluded that his job had something to do with selling guns and drugs. It also involved a moderate amount of heavy lifting: carrying suitcases bulging with money and drugs up and down the steps of the plane. “I decided that Barry must have been a gunrunner, a drug smuggler, or a suitcase salesman.””
http://www.american-buddha.com/911.welcometoterrorlandhop13.htm
Totally agree the relatives of the children must have been told to keep quiet for their safety/national security which really is proof of some cover-up and State involvement. Otherwise, any family, no matter how private, would go to the media pleading for the return of the children. And the poorly executed disinformation campaign has further demonstrated these points. we’be heard everything from family feuds to Saadam’s money in Switzerland to lone nutters–all designed to confuse people so much they have no idea where the truth lies… One thing I’m sure of, this cover-up has taken a lot of effort and resources so it must be quite important the to many different governments that the truth be kept from the public. SM and SAH were involved in something big. That much we have to all agree…
Someone here commented, a while back, evidence of a conspiracy comes not from the crime itself but from the ensuing cover-up. Or something to that effect. I couldn’t agree
Oops, last line of last post should’ve read ‘I couldn’t agree more’. Typing in the little box, using an iPhone, isn’t the easiest thing. 🙂
Another name coincidence. Where the uber-elite keep their loot.
“The Princes Gate Group is a privately held single manager specialised in bespoke investment solutions.”
8, rue Bovy Lysberg, Geneva, 1204 , Switzerland
http://www.linkedin.com/company/the-princes-gate-group_4
“….held senior positions at Morgan Stanley including Deputy Head of Worldwide Investment Banking, Head of Worldwide Corporate Finance and founder of Princes Gate Investors, a $1.4 billion private equity investment vehicle funded by a group of prominent private families from around the globe… received a Bachelor of Science in Physiology from Montreal’s McGill University.
http://www.arabbankers.org/shared/custompage/custompage.jsp?_event=view&_id=445505_U127360__163140
Marlin, your points about the Trojan horse seem to be right on given recent news. Though I doubt the story of major explosion in Iran, a smaller explosive device (big enough to halt the operation but small enough it wouldn’t cause a major disaster, seems more than possible. Something tiny enough that it could be imbedded into something (maybe metal?) and go undetected?
From Q’s link on Dominique Strauss-Kahn and Journalism:
http://www.thenational.ae/news/world/europe/after-strauss-kahn-code-of-silence-may-no-longer-protect-french-politicians
“Jean Quatremer said, “The so-called respect of private life is a figleaf for journalistic cowardice. We are scared of falling out with politicians as they are our sources, but they need us … Dominique Strauss-Kahn wouldn’t have lasted five minutes in Britain, America or Sweden.””
“… the adage that while an American investigative journalist dreams of bringing down a politician, the French journalists prefers to be invited to his table”.
In America the former applies only if the politician is Republican and the latter applies if he or she is a Democrat.
Related to nothing, from a debate between US Supreme Court justices: “France is a country with 300 cheeses and two religions. The United States is a country with two cheeses and 300 religions.”
Lizzie007 – the credit for Torojan horses connection belongs with Tim V I believe – but I it’s been a big hit with me (he is the resident expert on all horse symbolism!). Anyways, it jlike something suddenly clicked (soory, Tim V – the 4 horses of the apocalypse didn’t quite have the same effect).
I brought up earlier the incident reported by Iran of a discovery in late August of a seemingly innocuous “rock” that was used as a “communication device” but was rigged with tiny explosives. The story (a link from early September was provided by someone here – couple of days ago, I think – sorry, forgot by who now) did not get all that much attention at the time, possibly because it originated from Iran and it was hard to verify exactly what happened. My own question was simple – if it was so innocuous how did it come to be discovered? did someone provide Iran with a tip?
Also, the technology for embedding nano-bomblets in a variety of materials is already here, I’m afraid. Whether and how these can be detected when in transit or following inspection is anyone’s guess. I reckon it might be difficult using conventional techniques which lack the sensitivity, unless one knows what to look for.
As an aside, we hear a lot about the great new things that will become possible through nanotechnology. Unfortunately, there’s very little being heard about the bad things, including the unexpected consequences that no one can guess yet. Naturally, the military-industrial complex is all-over these types of technologies and that much is almost never for the greater good. I expect that sometime over the next five years we’ll be start hearing quite a bit about unexpected consequences. For now, I stay away from anything that has the prefix “smart” in front of it, as in smart phone, smart material, smart watch, smart washing machine etc. Give me dumb any day…
3 weeks
07 September 2012 07:35
http://news.uk.msn.com/world/french-alps-shooting-timeline/
Surrey neighbour Lorna Davey says her daughter attended Claygate Primary School with Zainab, while Zeena was due to start at the school this year.
The family would often go on holiday in their caravan and had been away on their latest trip for at least three weeks, Ms Davey says.
07 September 2012
http://news.uk.msn.com/world/saad-al-hilli-was-most-generous-man-you-could-meet
11:26, 8 December 2012
http://news.uk.msn.com/world/saad-al-hilli-was-most-generous-man-you-could-meet
‘That is why this is such an extraordinarily complex case and why it could take years of careful police work to solve it.’
An earlier theory maintained that the cyclist Mr Mollier, 45, was in fact the intended target due to his job at a metal plant supplying materials to the nuclear fuel industry
There had been some speculation that the Israeli secret service Mossad believed Mr Mollier could have been selling nuclear secrets and was monitoring his emails.
@ Lizzie007 31 Jan, 2013 – 8:02 am
“Though I doubt the story of major explosion in Iran, a smaller explosive device (big enough to halt the operation but small enough it wouldn’t cause a major disaster, seems more than possible. Something tiny enough that it could be imbedded into something (maybe metal?) and go undetected?”
There is finally a satellite image from 22 Jan 13.
http://isis-online.org/isis-reports/detail/day-after-alleged-sabotage-at-fordow-hardly-the-expected-emergency-response/
These two sentences are from secondary reports that said there was a small explosion, exits blocked and 170 or 190 trapped. Don’t have the links at hand.
“… explosives may have been placed in ceiling lamps with some kind of trigger mechanism controlled by a power voltage frequency.”
“At the time of the explosions, a very bright red and purple light distorted the image and an extremely loud noise could be heard. Before the explosions knocked out the cameras, interior walls could be seen coming down within the centrifuge chambers. All the explosions seemed to have been initiated from the ceilings.”
If there was no explosion the original reports are strange. If no explosion, the two sentences above read like a coded message to somebody? A warning to Iran about what might happen, or what sabotage was already in place? But that would hardly be planted in a pro-Israeli WND web page.
Unless Israel/US managed to sneak in even one such device and detonate it on the 21st. The Iranians are puzzled. The story is then planted hinting at what’s to come if they don’t stop (even if there are no more devices). Iran would be forced to shut down and inspect everything.
@ Pink 31 Jan, 2013 – 8:56 am
“The family would often go on holiday in their caravan and had been away on their latest trip for at least three weeks, Ms Davey says.”
So the SAHs had been wandering about, and presumably camping, in England/France/Italy/Switzerland/Sweden/Spain/? for a considerable time before arriving at Annecy. Yet not one person claims to have met them along the way. Not a fellow camper or shopkeeper has come forward with a story or with pics they might have taken, even though they could do so for profit from the French or British tabloids, or just posted on their social media.
[Belgian] PARLIAMENT IS TOLD THE TRUTH ABOUT AL QAEDA; AND MALI
much mention of Areva and uranium, gold, phosphate:
http://aangirfan.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/parliament-is-told-truth-about-al-qaeda.html?m=1
Sylvie lecoeur
Somebody posted this link and said that she is Sylvie Lecoeur.
I don’t believe that, simply because the face is totally different.
http://copainsdavant.com/p/sylvie-lecoeur-mata-16808486
Here is a video of her standing in front of her house:
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/video/news/sky-news/4526709/Alps-shootings-Brother-denies-conflict.html#ooid=ZjOXR0NTqkNhYIOIXfvcTOnSci5JEiar
Compare the two faces! Is there a significance? To me she looks like a totally different person. Also being 49 would not make her a “young woman” as stated in the media.
From the Annecy Sylvie Lecoeur (whom I believe is a wrong one) there is only known that she sold her dogs in November 2012
http://www.vente-animaux.com/annonce-chien/13456/vends-chiots-chihuahua-femelle-males-petits-gabarits-puces-vaccines-fermifugesce.htm
And it is known that an Arab hacker group got access to her email address when you search for her email address on google.
Q
30 Jan, 2013 – 11:58 pm Rather co-incidentally the little white car next to motorhome is a Peugeot 206 – i.e. the same colour and model SL says she swerved to avoid on the corner! The other looked like a little Peugeot van. Now just a little aside – I seem to have a dim memory that one early report suggested SL was nearly knocked off her “bike” which rather conflicts with car collison. Does anyone else have the same recollection?
What is fascinating Q
30 Jan, 2013 – 11:58 pm about that Google view of what I called a motor home (the orange vehicle with a distinctive picture on the side) there is a dark haired man inside wearing what appears as dark glasses! Take a zoom-in look. He’s sitting on the passenger side and appears to be doing paperwork or something? Not a terribly sunny day either.
Lizzie007
31 Jan, 2013 – 12:48 am I agree with your general sentiment both as it relates to SM and the Al Hilli children. A charitable interpretation can be advanced for the latter in relation to their protection from possible harm and obtaining untrammeled, any memories they can give up. But the dangers are obvious and the behaviour of the authorities puzzling if the children’s welfare is truly pre-eminant. How can they justify keeping them away from familiar family members after such a traumatic event which appears on the face of it as being positively cruel? Are we convinced these steps are not to chaperone or influence the children, so that they cannot make known embarrassing facts? We are powerless but how about NSPCC or similar raising appropriate questions of the Surrey Police and Social Services? As to the family making a fuss – we do not know what pressures have been placed on them to comply with the official approach. Whoever murdered SAH and family could of course strike again which no prudent family could ignore.
NR
31 Jan, 2013 – 5:24 am You say: “It doesn’t fit with the lone nutter theory.”
Well said! In fact it completely undermines it. If it was indeed a lone nutter half a continent away, there could hardly be any justification for keeping the children in “protective custody” which is certainly what seems to be the case. The Children’s Act places a STATUTORY DUTY on Local Authorities to put the interests of the children first. How can they justify the line that keeping them in isolation and away from family, is in their best interests? This case is important because it raises fundamental questions about our system of government. Can we trust it or can’t we?
NR
31 Jan, 2013 – 7:52 am Funny how Geneva and Montreal keep cropping up.
almost as often as Martins….