And now what action is the new government you support going to take?

Alan

I don't know yet, but how can it be worse than the collusion of the last government?

Sop this will be a case of same shame, just new excusers?

If a member of the Israeli diaspora, Mossad or not, was to be killed here in this country in retribution, all hell would be let loose to find the assasin.

The new Lib dem Conservative axis of continued support for Israel will make sure that no stone would be left unturned.

Makes you want to weep. What does this say about us?

That would make Miliband an accomplice in murder?. Hard to believe (no,not really).

One of many reasons why I do not trust the Conservatives and David Cameron.

Calls to THE CONSERVATIVES to press the government to again break relations with MOSSAD have fallen on deaf ears even after William Hague said: 'We are agreed that the misuse of British passports is a grave matter that must be prevented.'

He called for 'assurances from Israel as a friendly nation that it will not sanction for whatever reason, including in any intelligence operation, the misuse of British passports'.

Hague then wrote to David Miliband urging him to "establish the facts as rapidly as possible" to "prevent further such abuses from happening."

Hague FINALLY suggested that ministers, civil servants or members of the security services should be called before parliament’s Intelligence and Security Committee to explain what they knew, and when. NOTHING DONE!!

Under pressure again Hague demanded to know when the Foreign Office had first found out that British passport holders were involved in the affair. TOTAL BOLLOCKS

CUT TIES TO MOSSAD - PERIOD

Craig

http://news.antiwar.com/2010/05/12/incoming-british-fm-wont-rule-out-attacking-iran/

"In an interview aimed at cementing his reputation as a “friend of Israel,” incoming British Foreign Secretary William Hague vowed to see British law changed so as to hold Israeli officials immune from war crimes charges, and promised to take a tough line against Iran’s civilian nuclear program, calling it the “most urgent thing” for him to tackle."

(This was apparently based on an interview with the Jewish Chronicle.)

See also:-

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3888870,00.html

In which Hague comments on the recent passports issue.

The whole sordid affair with our government’s collusion has jeopardized thousands of British Citizens working and living in the Gulf who are increasing viewed with suspicion. Qatar has introduced Visa for British Business men. William Haig's sycophancy and subserviences to Israel even exceed that of little Millipede.

Whats the Lib Dem position on collusion with assassins and torture Craig?

subserviences to Israel even exceed that of little Millipede.

Rubbish.
A plague on ALL thoir houses.

They're as bad as each otehr.

lwtc247

Clegg raised complicity with torture in the second leadership debate. The Lib Dem position is explixitly against torture, assassination and other international illegality.

Sorry to disappoint you. You have a warped world view in which only certain people who hold your own precise beliefs have any humanity.

All people appointed to MI5 and MI6 are all carefully chosen to increase ties to Mossad in the assumption that it knows more about USA, Europe and ME.

It is scary when our own intelligence is suffering from such low confidence.

Craig, you misrepresent me, deliberately so. If my uncomprimising anti-war stance upsets you, then I'm not going to apologise.

Part of the reason why i asked is becuase I felt like illustrating the fact that the LD's are going to say one thing and involved in completely the other.

It's my opinion the LD's should NOT have entered a formal coalition, but rather as the minority CON govt Laboured on (yes, Laboured on) then Clegg should say say "If I support you on the next policy issue" you do the referendum on PR. That way the LD's could be clean of the forthcoming killings in Iraq, Afghanistan and keep its pro-Zion element somewhat in check.

As they HAVE decided to dancing with the latest Devil of Downing St, the LD's deserve every criticism for each single illegal and murderous activity they have decided to become part of, which WILL incllude war and tortue and global poverty.

You are very tetchy over criticism realting to your formal decision to support the LDs. I wish you would break off from this foolish exercise and one again support the much adored Craig Murray instead of leaping at hoops to justify whats coming.

Are you at least willing to renounce then some stage in the future or is it till death do you part?

Mr M

I don't believe that is true. I know quite a few people in MI6 who are personally very critical indeed of Israel.

Since the LibDems knew (or should have known) the extent to which the Tories are hirelings of Israeli and US interests and therefore not Britain-firsters, they should never have entered into a coalition with Cameron/Hague any more than Broon/Millipede. Indeed the LibDems have demonstrated their own lack of integrity. The only useful position gained is Vince Cable's. The rest is window dressing. Bollox to it!

lwtc

I don't misrepresent you. On another thread you characterised the Lib Dem position as "War will continue. We will do nothing ot stop it". Now that is a misrepresentation.

I genuinely cannot understand your unremitting hostility to the only major party that opposed the Iraq war.

Lets clarify about "opposing the war"... What the LD's opposed was that bLiar doing it without the UN. If bLiar had got UN authorisation the LD's would have been beating the drum just as loudly.

Is it a misrepresentation to say the LD's will do nothing to stop the war? What will they do then?

I am happy they did put in an anti-war 'guest appearance' if you will, but forgive me for not bowing down before them for letting the UN override common sense, scrutiny, and moral behaviour.

My Goodbye,

This is my formal farewell to Gordon Brown and his family. Gordon has broken out of the political shell. His experiences have been life changing and he knows from those experiences that it is best in this life and at this moment to quietly focus on a background charity to contribute in some small way to humanity.

Thank-you Gordon for personally writing to the families of soldiers passed and going that extra mile to say sorry.

I wish you all the best in your endeavours knowing you are free from the 'sword of Damocles.'

"Judge no one happy until his life is over" - that part of your life is now over - enjoy.

lwtc

now that is a strange argument. There was never any chance the UNSC would support the war as there was no genuine reason for it. No was without UNSCR approval is the standard position of internationalists everywhere, including me, perfectl logical and a simple statement of the international legal position.

The UNSC is the main obstacle to a US/Israeli attack on Iran. Don't knock it in this context.

@lwtc247 - I enjoy your input, but I wonder if you are not being realistic on this one. I am perhaps midway between your position and Craig's, but consider what might be the case if the Tories had formed a minority govt.

They would not have any moderating influence from the LDs, and the leadership cabal in main opposition is generally militarist and prone to flourishes of aggression, in line with their appalling Blairite/New Lab record - and they may be inclined to go along with an attack on Iran. That, potentially, would be a worse situation for human rights and the rule of international law.

Mark -

sorry deleted that as too far off topic. I am going to post something tomorrow about Mordechai Vanunu's new jail sentence - it will be on topic there!

Miliband is one of the leaders of the pro Israel party in the UK. His game is easy to unravel. Any collusion with Israel or Israeli influence in the U.S. is natural between allies. The public are expected to collude in all the UK's collusion with Israel. Exposing the truth about Israel's control over the UK increases the public's guilt, rather than the likes of Miliband.

It is a stand which reminds one of Saddam Hussain. Amongst M.P.s 'You are free to disagree, but then you will be shot, and if you agree, you are guilty anyway of condoning my crimes. For now, these revolting leaders of New Labour have been temporarily disenfranchised. Cameron would be well advised to expose them on the banking and the war-crimes front now, before it is too late. His own Israel lobby will be pressing for an amnesty on the crimes of New Labour, similar to Obama's. Does David Cameron have the balls to prosecute the New Labour criminal class? I predict that he will not survive if he doesn't. He will also not survive if he does. Somebody, sometime, has to tell the Israel lobby where to get off.

“now that is a strange argument."
Absolutely Not! It's factual history the LD's would only support a war if the UN authorized it. It's also fact that they did NOT say "we demand the UN authorises the war because we know they never will". Your missing my point somewhat.

Come on Craig. You are displaying one factor of why I so hate party politics. People become mental contortionists to support 'the party' and it usually eats away at people - good people.

I don't think the UN is why Israel hasn't decided to attack Iran (whence the US will follow after Iran retaliates) Speaking in the conventional sense, Israel isn't doing it because of Iran’s energy connection with China and China is the one holding US by the financial goolies!

Maybe I'm just envious that you have such faith in this govt Craig. My hope ran out a long time ago. To me radical revolutionary change is the only thing that can stop this crazy neoliberal global hegemonic.

Jon
...and I yours, like most of the writers on this blog - even though at times I deeply disagree on the odd topic (AGW for example).

But the problem is with 'consider the alternative' is that is stays firmly within the box. To me total disengagement from the system and formation of an alternative system with REAL legitimacy is my alternative.

I'm still left wondering what the LD's will do to stop a) torture b) intelligence gleaned c) war. I see nothing.

"Robert Fisk's impeccable Arab sources"?

Robert Fisk can't really be trusted - he'll go to any length to blame the world's problems on the West. Not surprisingly, he makes the silliest arguments in favor of U.S. right-wing-sponsored 911 conspiracy theories:

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/fisk/robert-fisk-even-i-question-the-truth-about-911-462904.html

At his most silly: "Why did flight 93's debris spread over miles when it was supposed to have crashed in one piece in a field?"

Any pre-teen with Yahoo Maps can easily refute that.

Larry as larry as ever doesn't know the difference between Robert Fisk and Robert Fisks cources. Oh Larry.

lwtc247, are you dense? I challenge what Robert Fisk regards as good sources. I also challenge his ability to think though issues.

As is typical for a 911 truther, you're really not that smart, are you?

So you now have a new government - when is the truth about 911 or 7/7 going to come out?

lol @ larry. I've actually met and talked to Fisk, you obviously haven't. His ME sources e.g. Israyhelli assassination squads proved to be spot on. Fisk questions some of the anomalies of 911, but entertains the mainstream notion of Al Qaeda, and I don't agree with his opinion on the matter. But you probably knew that. P.S. This isn't the 911 thread so p off over there would ya.

@ltwc. Thanks. I would assert that I don't regard myself as constrained within the box - I am one of the few that make small financial contributions to Media Lens, for example, and they're considered off the scale in the mainstream, probably at the same level as Chomsky.

I agree a radical alternative is necessary ("another world is possible") but I am not inclined towards ignoring the plight of the downtrodden in the meantime, which is in my view one of the legitimate criticisms of some parts of the left.

And I am of the opinion, though not strongly, that the Tories must give some ground to the LDs on foreign policy and HR generally in the new coalition. The alternative is a minority Tory govt opposed by a war criminal Labour executive - which would make the LDs irrelevant on foreign policy and take the militarist wing of the Tory party off the leash.

I might be wrong about that, but I should be interested to read your response to it. The point I am making now is that given the will of the electorate, it is possibly the best outcome we could have hoped for. (I would agree that, given the state of the media, most of the public are ignorant or misinformed about key issues, but that's not within our immediate control.)

(On AGW and 9/11 etc, I confess I have not looked into alternative theories in detail. But when I have asked inquisitive questions on this board on the latter topic, I was accused by some of The Great Converted of wilful denialism, and I quickly lost interest. Given my focus on other activism, I have not had chance to revisit.)

Jon.
Just to be clear about this, I meant defining a new political box {I wasn't being drawing upon any insult by insinuating the idiom: "not being able to /think/ outside the box."}

I think the desired revolutionary change in politics will, in the medium and long term, lead to the betterment the peoples interests to a much greater extent then than what would be the case by trying to do it within the political constraints we have today.

I think many members (past and present) of NeoLabour should be tried for war crimes and the kween for that matter.

I might have said I have no hope, well that's not quite correct. I am utterly pessimistic about what’s happening, bit I do get hope in the belief that I may be wrong. There's much more to life than meets the eye.

I understand about the infusion of LD's in the Tory party and from a conventional p.o.v. it seems (on paper at least) there could be some change, but like other sentiments expressed, I simply cannot trust the Tories. Their Zionist connections are simply far too strong (as were NeoLabours) and they don't give a toss about those who don't fit into their social class. I can't see the LD's restraining the Tory thirst for war. I remember Tony Benn (or was it GG) who was flabbergasted that a Labour government would launch so many horrific wars. {To believe the grass roots labour party was more significant than it's Neocon executive, was a bit strange. One gets the feeling Smith could have offered REAL Labour but at the same time one's cautious that he could have done a __bLiar betrayal__. I remember in 1997 feeling a so positive about the explosion of the Tories. Rapidly afterwards, (Iraq sanctions and illegal RAF ariel bombing in Iraq that I saw a nightmare unfurling}

As for 911 and 77, I've given up hope that the real and serious questions surrounding those events has gone too. It's not in the interests of the establishment to move away from the position it's tried so hard to build up.

He called for 'assurances from Israel as a friendly nation that it will not sanction for whatever reason, including in any intelligence operation, the misuse of British passports'.

Hague then wrote to David Miliband urging him to "establish the facts as rapidly as possible" to "prevent further such abuses from happening."

-------------------------

Any such assurances are meaningless because this isn't the first time Mossad has done this. They gave assurances they wouldn't do it again last time! The passports in the latest case appear to have been genuine rather than forged, thanks to UK government complicity, so noises will be made about it but no real action will be taken. All they are bothered about is the contempt shown by Mossad for the UK in using the passports so blatantly on an operation of this kind.

"The expulsion of an Israeli diplomat from London is the first since 1988, when attache Arie Regev was removed for "activities incompatible with diplomatic duties," a euphemism for espionage. Britain also barred a second Israeli, Jacob Barad, from returning to Britain in 1987. Both men were suspected of coordinating Mossad activity in the U.K. and of involvement in the forgery of British passports.
At the time, Shimon Peres, now Israel's president, promised Britain it would never again forge British documents."

Thanks, Craig. This is very important information indeed.

Of course, it doesn't surprise one, but it is still absolutely crucial that it be revealed and aired widely.

Now, going back to the death of Dr David Kelly...

Oh, I almost forgot, an afterthought: Larry, can you tell the readers, what's the going rate for protecting the hard state?

Owen, you are right what you say about the forgery of British passports in the past. When Peres promised that Israel would not forge British passports again he was right, of course, they don't have to; our security services supply them with real ones.

Yes, notice that Hague is calling for an assurance that British passports will not be "misused" in future, rather than forged.

"Larry, can you tell the readers, what's the going rate for protecting the hard state?"

Ask the local fluffer.

"British intelligence pre-dates the Mossad but shares precisely the same provenance."

According to you that would mean it began as a "Rothchild security apparatus" which is obviously nonsense. It's not even true of Mossad. Learn some history before accusing others of being naive. There's plenty enough wrong with the world and governments' behaviour without muddying the waters and adding to paranoia and confusion.

The craven nature of the British government to israel is pitiful and deeply disturbing. It is appeasement of a country which, if it was any other, we would have nothing to do with - a far right ideology building a racially divided society implementing apartheid. That we allow ourselves to be rolled over by the bunch of gangsters who run it is shameful - a 'friendly country' - don't make me laugh.

The appeasement of Israeli racism and agression really took hold during the Nixon years, under the direction of Henry Kissinger.

Nixon had a criminal mentality in terms of politics, one that still exists today in terms of leaders like Bush Blair etc.

After Nixon was exposed as a criminal, President Carter tried to bring America back to lawfullness.

He was unable to do so. The corporate and political criminals were so entrenched in American daily life that he was defeated.

President Carter is today still trying to bring justice and humanity to Gaza and so many other places on earth.

President Carter is a religious man, a moral man, a man of integrity, and he can't bear the crimes that the US have committed against defenceless people.

And obviously he's regularly attacked by FOX and SKY news, as all decent people are.

I'm asking you, Larry. You. Are you a neoconservative, Larry? Can you define the word, 'neoconservative'? Who feeds you, Larry? Who needs you?

Suhayl, do you believe that 911 was an inside job?

The reference in an earlier post on this thread to the Mossad being the Rothschild security agency and Israel being the Rothschild masonic state has been deleted by the censor yet again.

Same censor has allowed other commenters to attack the idea but it must seem strange when the original idea is no longer there so that contributors can develop theri own ideas.

The phrase "gate-keepers" comes to mind!

Seems our ed.took exception to the comment re-commenters on his blog being utterly ill-read,poorly informed etc.

Since most contributors are either corporate media,gatekeeper website,or plain disinformation junkies,I thought it was fair comment.

LOL!

Craig,

This should be of interest:

http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v06/v06p389_John.html

Larry, this is not the thread that has been assigned to the attacks on the USA which occurred on 11th September 2001. Why, then, do you keep bringing the subject up wherever and whenever you can? I have made my views on that subject very clear several hundred posts ago on the relevant thread. Seek them out, if you wish.

This thread concerns the subject of alleged UK state de facto facilitation - whether or not it might have been knowing or unknowing facilitation - of covert political assassination. A very hot potato, I'd have thought.

So hot, the mainstream media seem quietly to have dropped it. But many among the British public remain extremely uneasy; many do not buy the official persiflage anymore.

And I hear the rustle of leaves in the undergrowth deep in the forest on Harrowdown Hill...

Larry from St. Louis

do you believe that a man in a cave with an ak47 is capable of taking control of an aircraft that would enable him not only to fly the aircraft but direct it with pinpoint accuracy into one of the twin towers.

now if its not the man in the cave, lets take a man off the street, could you in a matter of months of 'training' on a flight simulator actually carry out that deed using the real article.

how credible is the plan.

why havent they been able to duplicate this act.

and if becoming a pilot is so easy, why not just hire a plane pack it with explosives and head to the nearest point of interest?

"Assassination squads are also a fundamental part of the plan for the "Surge" in Afghanistan, aimed to disrupt alleged Taliban networks, and operating on precisely the same plans the CIA death squads used in South and Central America."

well this should be of immediate interest :

"I'll tell you right now, one of the great tragedies of my country is that Mr. Obama is looking the other way, because equally horrible things are happening to prisoners, to those we capture in Afghanistan," Hersh said. "They're being executed on the battlefield. It's unbelievable stuff going on there that doesn't necessarily get reported. Things don't change.:

"What they've done in the field now is, they tell the troops, you have to make a determination within a day or two or so whether or not the prisoners you have, the detainees, are Taliban," Hersh added. "You must extract whatever tactical intelligence you can get, as opposed to strategic, long-range intelligence, immediately. And if you cannot conclude they're Taliban, you must turn them free.
"What it means is, and I've been told this anecdotally by five or six different people, battlefield executions are taking place," he continued. "Well, if they can't prove they're Taliban, bam. If we don't do it ourselves, we turn them over to the nearby Afghan troops and by the time we walk three feet the bullets are flying. And that's going on now."

The video of Hersh was uploaded to Michael Moore's YouTube account Tuesday, May 11, 2010

Wendy, once again I completely agree with you about the assassination squads and all; I'm not surprised, really, as Hersh said.

I'd be a little wary though of posting stuff about Sept 11th, if you don't mind me saying, as there's a thread especially dedicated to it - 1,000-plus posts and mounting; if you do search you'll find it. That's why in my post earlier in this thread I alluded to it. I'm aware that as far as I know you've only recently started posting here. Craig created the thread in January 2010 to avoid having 11th Sept material flooding all the other threads and/or a very small minority of posters trying to induce the same thing. Hope you don't mind me suggesting it!

Terrific work! This is the type of information that should be shared around the web. Shame on the search engines for not positioning this post higher!

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