The Dog That Didn’t Bark

by craig on June 6, 2014 2:59 pm in Uncategorized

There is a mystery about the media coverage of the Newark by-election result.  The most interesting thing about it was the abysmal failure of the official opposition, just one year ahead of a general election.  The New Labour percentage vote actually dropped, and even just taking the New Labour v Tory vote, the New Labour swing from Tory was only 2 per cent.  That is an almost unprecedentedly poor performance by an opposition in a by-election at this stage in a parliament, and a very, very plain indication of what was already obvious – that Miliband is not going to be entering the door of No. 10.

Yet Sky News, the BBC and the Guardian have virtually nothing to say about New Labour’s disastrous result.  Both Sky and the BBC this morning managed to give their analysis on the by-election without even mentioning New Labour at all.  What can be the cause of this reticence?  Is it that they are not anxious to point out to Scots that their choice is independence or more Tory government?

 

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189 Comments

  1. Yes. It’s all D Day and the Derby.

    The only item of interest ref Newark was the higher than normal turnout percentage but Agent Cameron and his followers did make dozens of visits.

    Wonder what Mercer has found to occupy his leisure time? Did he go off with the usual retiring MP’s payoff?

    Newark by-election: result in full
    Robert Jenrick (Con) 17,431 (45.03%, -8.82%)
    Roger Helmer (UKIP) 10,028 (25.91%, +22.09%)
    Michael Payne (Lab) 6,842 (17.68%, -4.65%)
    Paul Baggaley (Ind) 1,891 (4.89%)
    David Kirwan (Green) 1,057 (2.73%)
    David Watts (LD) 1,004 (2.59%, -17.41%)
    Nick The Flying Brick (Loony) 168 (0.43%)
    Andy Hayes (Ind) 117 (0.30%)
    David Bishop (BP Elvis) 87 (0.22%)
    Dick Rodgers (Stop Banks) 64 (0.17%)
    Lee Woods (Pat Soc) 18 (0.05%)
    Con majority 7,403 (19.13%)

    15.46% swing Con to UKIP

    Electorate 73,486; Turnout 38,707 (52.67%, -18.69%)

    What a lot of lost deposits!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27728789

  2. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    6 Jun, 2014 - 3:37 pm

    Mary

    Well done, first one in!

  3. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    6 Jun, 2014 - 3:44 pm

    “The only item of interest ref Newark was the higher than normal turnout percentage”
    ___________________

    What I find interesting, Mary, is the total vote of the parties whose ideas you and your fellow Eminences would probably share (Green/Stop Banks/Pat Soc) and which must surely have been attractive alternatives in these hard and grim times – all of 1139, of which the Greens took 1057.

    Venceremos……but not quite yet, eh :)

  4. Unfortunately it won’t be Left Unity in Number 10. However this by-election result is not likely to have any bearing on the General Election – they rarely do. That is one reason I would not write Miliband off. The other, probably more telling, is if you add the combined UKIP and Tory vote it is less than it was in 2010 when there was a 71% turnout as opposed to 53% at this one. Traditionally Labour supporters do not vote in by-elections whereas Tories always vote in all elections, and presumably UKIP will too if it ever establishes itself in the House of Commons.

  5. On early shift Habba? Is this the only job you have? Why don’t you start your own blog and take all your fans with you ?

  6. Here are the By Election and 2010 G E results from the Guardian.

    Full results of the 2014 Newark byelection

    Robert Jenrick (C) 17,431 (45.03%, -8.82%)
    Roger Helmer (Ukip) 10,028 (25.91%, +22.09%)
    Michael Payne (Lab) 6,842 (17.68%, -4.65%)
    Paul Baggaley (Ind) 1,891 (4.89%)
    David Kirwan (Green) 1,057 (2.73%)
    David Watts (LD) 1,004 (2.59%, -17.41%)
    Nick The Flying Brick (Loony) 168 (0.43%)
    Andy Hayes (Ind) 117 (0.30%)
    David Bishop (BP Elvis) 87 (0.22%)
    Dick Rodgers (Stop Banks) 64 (0.17%)
    Lee Woods (Pat Soc) 18 (0.05%)
    C maj 7,403 (19.13%)
    15.46% swing C to UKIP
    Electorate 73,486; Turnout 38,707 (52.67%, -18.69%)
    Newark results in the 2010 general election

    Con: 27,590
    Lab: 11,438
    Lib Dem: 10,246
    Ukip: 1,954
    Con majority: 16,152
    Turnout: 71.4%

  7. John Goss

    While it is true that by-election results rarely are reflected in the general election, the bias is entirely in one direction – they exaggerate the swing to the opposition and against the government. That is why the result is disastrous for New Labour. If New Labour had taken Newark, it could have been written off as just a by-election swing. The absence of a significant wing to New Labour cannot be written off.

  8. YouKnowMyName

    6 Jun, 2014 - 5:05 pm

    It won’t come as a surprise to many of you professional lurkers & posters on this forum but British telephone company Vodafone today revealed their transparency report on the 20+ countries where they operate.

    The quantity of judicially approved/ministerially approved intercepts was given for most EU nations (e.g. for Italy was over 600,000 intercepts in 2013, New Zealand was 34)

    For the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, according to the world press, the UK government have instead direct – “secret wire” access to the Vodafone (world’s second largest after China Telecom) and other networks.

    This implies, de facto, that it is beyond reasonable doubt that all intra-journalistic communications is/has-been/will-be intercepted in the UK; and similarly de facto, that it is beyond reasonable doubt that all privileged legal communications is/has-been/will-be intercepted in the UK. Someone in the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland has a massive amount of information (along the lines of The Droitwich based Consulting Association ?)

    That the BBC, SKY – UK media in general fail to objectively report ANYTHING ANYMORE could be due to consequential extreme levels of blackmail to individual employees, could be due to hints dropped to the management by the establishment, could be due to malfeasance, could be as simple as self-censorship and pension-watching.

    Nobbled? what are the countermeasures?, the media-canaries?

  9. Well observed until your final sentence, which is a conspiracy too far. The real reason for the biased coverage is, of course, that the BBC, Graun and incresaingly Sky are all Labour, through and through.

    In any case your conspiracy doesn’t work because you’ve previously claimed the BBC gives far too much airtime to Farage, whom you maintain is a poster boy for Scottish independence.

  10. Habbabkuk 3:44 pm

    I should imagine the parties you list are a bit right-wing or “fascisti” for Mary.

    Could you recalculate the total votes for the far-left in these times of austerity?

  11. They ARE all in it together.

    The new MP. A solicitor and a previous director of Christies the auctioneers.

    ‘During the Newark by-election campaign, Jenrick was criticized for being “too rich”, as he and his wife had been reported as owning property worth £6.4 million. Chris Grayling, the Justice Secretary, defended Jenrick, insisting that being successful was nothing to be ashamed of. Jenrick himself commented that he might have three homes, but that “doesn’t mean I don’t know about life on the breadline”.

    The Jenricks bought the Grade I listed Eye Manor in Eye, Herefordshire, for £1.1  million in 2009. They also own a £2.8 million house in Vincent Square, Westminster, and a £2.1 million flat in Marylebone, apart from renting a property in Southwell.’

    Nice.

  12. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    6 Jun, 2014 - 5:48 pm

    “On early shift Habba? Is this the only job you have? Why don’t you start your own blog and take all your fans with you ?”
    ____________________

    What’s it to you, Drago (or whatever your usual handle is..)?

    Use Habbabreak if you don’t like it, chump.

  13. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    6 Jun, 2014 - 5:53 pm

    “I should imagine the parties you list are a bit right-wing or “fascisti” for Mary.

    Could you recalculate the total votes for the far-left in these times of austerity?”
    _____________________

    No, Anon, I shan’t do that because I am a fundamentally kind person and should not wish to cause Mary more pain than she is already experiencing.

    Honestly! :)

  14. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    6 Jun, 2014 - 5:57 pm

    Mary

    I refer to your comment which starts as follows:

    “They ARE all in it together.

    The new MP. A solicitor and a previous director of Christies the auctioneers.”
    ___________________

    I am – as so often – unable to make sense of your comment.

    Please help.

    Who are the “they” and what is the “it” in which “they” are all together?

    Thanks.

    ______________________

    La vita è bella, life is good!

  15. Stephen Morgan

    6 Jun, 2014 - 7:04 pm

    The independent in fourth place, who so nearly kept his deposit, was campaigning on an “I like the local hospital” platform.

  16. Lib Dems: Tactical voting to blame
    Lib Dem Danny Alexander says many people voted for other parties to “keep UKIP out”, explaining their sixth place in the Newark by-election.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27728784

    LOL lots.

  17. Just as in the Norwich North by-election that saw Chloe of Newsnight fame exposed as an inexperienced woman placed into the Conservative party by her ex employers, this election saw hundreds of outside young helpers bussed in, something that Conservatives have to do as they must get their voters out.

    These young things are only there to deliver tons of paper and entice new voters into the fold. They are always prim and properly dressed, told to smile, the young ideologically indoctrinated.

  18. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    6 Jun, 2014 - 8:44 pm

    “These young things are only there to deliver tons of paper and entice new voters into the fold. They are always prim and properly dressed, told to smile, the young ideologically indoctrinated.”
    _________________________

    Dear oh dear, what a grim, sour and joyless outlook on life you have, Nebelmind!

    Of course they’re there to distribute leaflets and so on – they’re junior helpers, not indoctrinators or propagandists.

    As for the “prim and properly dressed” bit, I’m surprised you didn’t add “polite” to the charge sheet. Perhaps you have something against people who smile.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    In conclusion, Nebelmind, I think you should get a life. To help you do so, I'(ll give you a double dose of

    La vita è bella, life is good!
    La vita è bella, life is good!

  19. Love the poppy red, Anon.

    The reason the Tories will be kicked out is Cameron bewailing Miliband’s reply to the Queen’s speech, viz that he has good left wing credentials and the snotty rich’s gravy train will rapidly come under pressure if he comes to power.

    Cameron’s dinosaur mind can only conceive of the billionaire swindlers’ existence. he cannot conceive of being in debt over your heads because the Tories refused to invest in the economy for five years in order to bring the price of labour down to Victorian penury.

    The rebel vote for UKIP will turn into a massive swing against this revolting opiate-cocktail elite which only came to power because equally snotty public school boy Nick Clegg snuffed out the Liberal party in order to shoehorn the Thatcherites into power.

    I never bought into Thatcherism when it was fashionable to do so. We have seen the whole world banking system collapse under her criminal idea. Failed trash, complete, illogical, ideological tripe. The cat is out of the bag. The elite can create a recession while out of office in order to get their opponents out of power, and they can magic a recovery 12 months before an election.

    They really do think we are idiots. And some of us are!

  20. Resident Dissident

    6 Jun, 2014 - 9:05 pm

    Yet another post setting out what the Scottish Nationalist position isn’t an what it is against. I’m afraid this is all too reminiscent of how the Lib Dems campaigned and once we got into power it has become all too evident of the lack of values and principles at the core. How about a few positive arguments for Scottish independence – bit by all means carry on in your current vein it won’t win many votes however.

  21. Quite telling that Peter Hain is getting out.

    Peter Hain to stand down as an MP at next election
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27742136

    Some highs and lows in his political life. Best remembered for his stand against apartheid of course.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Hain

  22. Resident Dissident

    6 Jun, 2014 - 9:28 pm

    “Quite telling that Peter Hain is getting out.”

    Might have something with him being 65 next year and not even being a shadow minister.

  23. Resident Dissident

    6 Jun, 2014 - 9:42 pm

    “These young things are only there to deliver tons of paper and entice new voters into the fold. They are always prim and properly dressed, told to smile, the young ideologically indoctrinated.”

    Of course you could be scruffy and scowl at people and have the electoral success of the far left parties favoured by many here. My Grandfather always insisted that I dressed smartly, not to rattle the letter box, shut gates and always to say good evening to those I met when delivering leaflets for the Party – voters want someone who will represent their better features not their worst.

  24. fair comment indeed Craig.
    One does wonder why events are either omitted or under-reported.
    Looking at the numbers just shows UKIP to be growing and all major parties losing.
    Libdems are becoming irrelevant and Labour seem to be losing it altogether.
    Conservatives and Libdems both have shed 10,000 voters since 2010.
    Wonder when they’ll give us electtronic voting so’s they can improve on proxy voting to get the results they want ?

  25. Mary – looking at that Wikipedia article on Hain.

    “In October 2000 he set up a war avoidance team to carry messages back and forth between himself and the then-Minister of Foreign Affairs in Iraq, Tariq Aziz (a matter then confidential, which has since been put on public record in an interview with Hain by the Today programme)”

    Right… and then he went on to vote for Iraq invasion. Joining the other members of cabinet who decided other people’s lives weren’t as important as their own career crawl.

  26. Je

    I used to like Peter Hain when he was a Liberal, at least he talked the talk. When he joined New Labour he changed as easily as changing your socks. What a nerd.

    Also there’s that gem of a story about him going out to Africa in “The Catholic Orangemen of Togo . . .” purporting to be a vegetarian. All the lovely special food, that can hardly be found anywhere in Africa, or so they say, prepared specially for his quirky diet. He rejects in favour of lion meat, zebra and monkey balls. I’ve used a bit of writers’ licence here. Sorry Craig. You tell it so much better.

  27. A couple of possibilities: a) As Labour were never going to win, the story was always going to be about who came second
    b) Everyone knows Miliband isn’t cutting the mustard, and Tory-supporting newspapers don’t want him kicked out before the election
    One thing is clear – Labour cannot win the election when they start coming third in some constituencies.

  28. Spot on, Je!

    And there was another influential group who was anti-war before and after Iraq war but had a miraculous “about face” immediately before the invasion. They know who they are!

  29. Re. Hain : “Best remembered for his stand against apartheid of course.”

    Nah. Remembered for being Blair’s stooge, putting a “right-on” face to the neo-con wars of aggression, for pretending that an illegal invasion and occupation was somehow a Good Thing. And hey – we’re putting an anti-apartheid frontman out there to sell this bill of goods to you dupes!

    Hain is a worthless sell-out, a stooge, a traitor and a liar. He is the lipstick on the neo-con pig. He undid anything useful in his life, by facilitating a war of choice – in the furtherance of the ultimate crime, in the judgement at Nuremberg. Hain used his once proud reputation, to limit the credibility of the opposition to our wars.

    Were he tomorrow to personally save 1000 kittens/old ladies/babies from a burning building, it would wash very little blood from his hands.

  30. Dramatic weather here this morning. Thunder and forked lightning and a large persisting rainbow overhead with heavy rain.

    ~~

    Saw this. V. droll and not at all amusing knowing their background.

    CIA sends out first tweet – and shows it has a sense of humour
    Agency says ‘we can neither confirm nor deny that this our first tweet’ as it officially joins Twitter and Facebook
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/06/cia-twitter-first-tweet

    .

  31. Hain. I did say ‘best remembered for his stand against apartheid’ which is true, and not ‘most admired’ or ‘greatly commended’. They nearly all followed Blair like sheep with these exceptions.

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/2862397.stm

    The list of UK MPs who voted for the Iraq War refers to Members of Parliament in the United Kingdom House of Commons who voted in favour of Tony Blair’s New Labour regime motion for participating in the Iraq War. The vote took place on the 18 March 2003 and it couched its position as authorising “all means necessary for disarming Saddam Hussein.” Across all members, it passed by a majority of 263, with 421 in favour and 263 against. All Liberal Democrats voted against the war; 244 Labour Party members voted in favour (and tabled the motion), as did 139 Conservative Party members.

  32. http://order-order.com/tag/peter-hain/
    Guido Fawkes has always been on Hain’s case. In all about 70 posts going back to 2004.

  33. The stats on the Iraq invasion votes was roughly this: The general public were split half and half – that’s with nearly all the media backing the war.

    If you were a Tory MP, you were in favour because you were a Friend of Israel (over 80% members at the time).

    If you were a Labour MP you were split like the public. Excepting members of the government and aspiring to be. In which case you were all in favour.

    If you were a Libdem you were against. Though now in government, and their careers become part of the tangle – its all go for bombing Syria.

    What a despicable bunch. They’d climb over the bodies of 188,000 (to date) to keep their own career advancement on track. Plus all the maimed and bereaved. They’d dress it up as loyalty to the government. Or to collective cabinet responsibility. Or kid themselves that they genuinely thought an impoverished country a continent away was really a threat to “world” peace. But lets call it what it was: they voted in alignment with their own career crawls.

  34. Does anyone have a correct figure for the number of Iraqi civilians killed by coalition forces? It would seem that some of the more wild and ever-increasing estimates given (it is not uncommon to see the number 1.5 million today) are for the large part made up of Muslim on Muslim sectarian killings, lynchings, bombings, and so forth, as well as premature deaths brought about by lack of proper medical facilities, still included in the statistics over a decade after the invasion.

    When does this rolling estimate finally end? Will the preventable death of an Iraqi woman due to heart failure in 2030 still be added to it? Are the numbers killed in a bus bomb today still to be blamed on the Americans?

    Was the real crime of the Iraq War not the complete failure to understand that for a large part of the world’s Muslim population, brutal secular dictatorship is the only alternative to fanatical Islamism? And doesn’t that say more about the religion and its adherents than it does about the wrongs of the war itself?

    And yes, I was opposed to the Iraq War and the Libya regime change, and I remain against any involvement in Syria, but not for the skewed “evil west” version peddled by the left on here.

  35. Anon – if you look hard enough you’ll probably find a rough of what you ask for here

    https://www.iraqbodycount.org/

    I gave their front page figure. The toll of human misery unleashed on Iraq in 2003 was enormous. Pontificating about where you draw what lines around it doesn’t interest me.

  36. I know I come up with some beautiful, witty and thought-provoking little phrases but I wished it has been me who said: “He is the lipstick on the neo-con pig.”

    Glenn_UK I take my hat off. Hope the lipstick does not mark the apple when it gets stuffed in the pig’s snout.

  37. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 10:22 am

    Remember all the fuss when the BBC allowed Griffin on Question Time

    Perhaps some of RT’s supporters here might wish to offer their thoughts on their favourite channel giving a platform to this fascist

    http://rt.com/news/164372-marine-le-pen-preview/

  38. Je

    “I gave their front page figure. The toll of human misery unleashed on Iraq in 2003 was enormous. Pontificating about where you draw what lines around it doesn’t interest me.”

    But looking at their fromt page I see this:

    Friday 6 June: 110 killed

    Mosul: 69 in mortar attacks and clashes. 
    Samarra: 7 by government forces. 
    Muwafaqiya: 7 by suicide bombers. 
    Sabaa al Bour: 7 by mortars. 
    Baquba: 4 by shelling and car bomb. 
    Falluja: 3 by shelling. Tikrit: 1 policeman by IED. 
    Ramadi: 2 by bomb at vegetable market. 
    Baghdad: 10 by mortars, gunfire, AED.

    Eleven years after the invasion, that looks like Muslims killing Muslims to me, Je. So where do you draw the line?

  39. Anon – that sectarian violence didn’t exist in Iraq prior to 2003 but I don’t care where you draw the line. Like I said, I’m not interested in pontificating about it. Last post on the subject.

  40. The one dimensional lefty outlook sees it as the evil west versus innocent little brown people. It’s quite patriarchal and patronising really. They come up with over-emotional phrases like “The toll of human misery unleashed in 2003″, but aren’t very good at the facts of who is killing who and why. It’s almost colonial. The little brown person can’t have any agency of his own – everything he does is due to the actions of Amerika. So religious fanatics go around blowing up bus loads of innocent people and still it’s all the fault of the evil west!

  41. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 10:55 am

    Anon – that sectarian violence didn’t exist in Iraq prior to 2003

    Tell that to the Shia Marsh Arabs.

  42. “Anon – that sectarian violence didn’t exist in Iraq prior to 2003″.

    I’ve already dealt with this. Are you saying that without a brutal secular dictatorship, sectarian Islamist violence is the natural state of Iraq. Because that’s what it seems, and you’d be largely right.

    But no, you still view it as harmless little brown people turned into violent islamists by the Americans. They cannot be responsible for anything they do, can they? Do you think your Iraqi religious fanatic was some sort of perfect ignorant savage before he was mobilised by the Americans to blow up his brethren in buses and markets?

  43. Okay Anon. One more post. You are completely ignorant about me apart from the few comments I’ve made here. But you appear to think you know all about me. You decide I’m one of a group of other people you’ve got this attitude towards. You already know my entire political outlook: that I’m a “lefty”.

    I didn’t say anything about the “evil west”. “little brown people” is your phrase. It has no relation to what I think at all. So… if I think the way the Iraqi state was dismantled in 2003 has some culpability for the violence there today then – I have a “little brown people” attutude. And I’m claiming they have no agency. That’s barking. You say using the phrase “human misery” for what has happened in Iraq is “over-emotional”. That is also barking.

    Really my last post. I’ll leave the thread to whatever misrepresentations/slurs you want to chuck at me. You have this incredible ability to know all about how I think after all.

  44. Read about what’s happening in post invasion Iraq, and why, from someone who knows.

    Iraq: Sixty Nine Days In Fallujah General Hospital Emergency Department
    By Felicity Arbuthnot
    Global Research, May 07, 2014http://www.globalresearch.ca/iraq-sixty-nine-days-in-fallujah-general-hospital-emergency-department/5380996

    ~~

    Read about the number of Iraqi people killed on Medialens. There has always been sufficient information for those who are really interested and who care.

    ‘Limited But Persuasive’ Evidence – Syria, Sarin, Libya, Lies (Alerts 2013) By David Edwards Last month, a ComRes poll supported by Media Lens interviewed 2,021 British adults, asking: ‘How many Iraqis, both combatants and civilians, do you think have died as a consequence … Created on 13 June 2013
    http://www.medialens.org/index.php/alerts/alert-archive/alerts-2013/735-limited-but-persuasive-evidence-syria-sarin-libya-lies.html The first part

    Propaganda: ‘The Dominant Grand Narrative Of Our Time’
    ‘A vanishingly rare example of the BBC propaganda system being blasted open was the special edition of the Radio 4 Today programme edited by the English musician PJ Harvey on January 2, 2014. In her opening statement, Harvey explained that she wanted to ‘do something unusual with the format and content of the programme.’ She invited people whom she considers ‘to be highly articulate, stimulating and extremely interesting to listen to – people who challenge us and move us to examine our deepest beliefs and feelings.’

    Harvey’s guests included John Pilger talking about the propaganda role of the corporate media; Denis Halliday, former UN Humanitarian Coordinator in Iraq, on the urgent need to democratise the warmongering UN Security Council (here at around 49 mins); Ian Cobain and Phil Shiner on torture committed by UK forces (here at around 2 hrs : 34 mins); and Mark Curtis on how Britain’s arms trade fuels oppression around the world.’

    http://www.medialens.org/index.php/alerts/alert-archive/2014/753-propaganda-the-dominant-grand-narrative-of-our-time.html

    ~~~~

    I see that it’s Anon’s and Resident Dissident’s turn today on this blog. H having a day off at the Derby?

  45. If you want more lies about Putin, ZBC had Robert Brinkley on this morning ref Ukraine. Chosen for his partisanship presumably.

    Last in Kiev in 2006 as British Ambassador! ie 9 years ago.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b045xnt7 1hr 14mins in

    Preceded by BBC reports from Steve Rosenberg and David Stern from 1hr10mins in

    Here is Brinkley on CNN in February 2014
    Brinkley: Protests echo Orange Revolution
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q35bPY6BS-M

  46. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 12:23 pm

    “I see that it’s Anon’s and Resident Dissident’s turn today on this blog. H having a day off at the Derby?”

    Jealous that your paymaster doesn’t allow you a day off – at least he/she/it no longer appears to require you to post at 4 o clock in the morning UK time.

  47. Je

    You believe the 188,000 figure is the responsibility of the prosecutors of the Iraq War. You have made no such allegation against the Iraqi extremists who kill each other and innocent bystanders on a daily basis, whose actions make up a large proportion of the IBC statistics you blame solely on the invasion. Over 100 killed yesterday alone. Are those deaths the fault of the Americans?

    Because you are unable to see or admit to any agency on the part of Iraqi extremists, but keen to pin all the blame on America, it is fair to say that you have a rather patronising view of the Iraqi people – totally unable to do anything without America causing them to do it. Blowing up a market can’t be seen as evil, it’s just an inevitable consequence of the greater evil which was the Iraq War. All subsequent deaths must be attributed to that one event, the highest number possible for the longest period of time. And using emotive language to boot.

    “So… if I think the way the Iraqi state was dismantled in 2003 has some culpability for the violence there today”

    You’re changing your tune. Nothing you or anyone else has written here has attributed anything other than full culpability to the invading forces for the violence seen in Iraq today.

    “You say using the phrase “human misery” for what has happened in Iraq is “over-emotional”. That is also barking.”

    Your full phrase was:

    “The toll of human misery unleashed in 2003 was enormous”.

    True enough, but you cite the IBC front page, which includes violence to the present day. Furthermore, you previously wrote “They’d climb over the bodies of 188,000 (to date) to keep their own career advancement on track.”, further proving that you hold Western politicians responsible for the total number of deaths in Iraq to the present day. If that isn’t using overly emotional language to make a disingenuous and factually incorrect point then I don’t know what is.

    Again: “You say using the phrase “human misery” for what has happened in Iraq is “over-emotional”. That is also barking.”

    Deliberate misquoting. Note: you now say “what has happened in Iraq”. Your intial use of the phrase was directed at what has been caused by the invasion, as I have shown above.

    All in all a textbook lefty moron who believes the little brown people would all be living in peace and prosperity if it weren’t for the evil west.

  48. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 12:24 pm

    “If you want more lies about Putin,”

    You mean like the one you exposed about his height also posted on RT?

  49. My tip for the Derby:

    An E/W bet on True Story. It’s come down a bit since I put mine on but very much worth a punt.

  50. Mary 11:49 am

    Please come up with some opinions of your own rather than endless copy & paste. Thanks.

  51. Likely just that Newark was a safe tory seat so there was never much chance of Labour taking it. Add the UKIP surge (aided by the BBC) and the question became how well UKIP and the tories would do, not how well Labour would do.

  52. It is not totally impossible Milliband could become PM. LibDems would welcome a coalition with him rather than Cameron if the arithmetic makes it possible. One way to guarantee another Cameron government is to leave Scotland out of the arithmetic.

  53. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 2:04 pm

    “I see that it’s Anon’s and Resident Dissident’s turn today on this blog. H having a day off at the Derby?”
    _______________

    Well, I’d much rather be AT the Derby than IN Derby.

    Better even than leafy, prosperous Surrey!

  54. Je 7 Jun, 2014 – 8:06 am

    “If you were a Tory MP, you were in favour because you were a Friend of Israel (over 80% members at the time).

    If you were a Labour MP you were split like the public. Excepting members of the government and aspiring to be. In which case you were all in favour.

    If you were a Libdem you were against. Though now in government, and their careers become part of the tangle – its all go for bombing Syria”

    …. and if you were an SNP MP, you were against. The SNP is also against bombing Syria.

    If you don’t want foreign countries bombed in your name, vote “YES” in September.

  55. Anon I have plenty of opinions of my own as you have probably noticed over the years much to your discomfort. Never sure which Anon is which though.

    R2D2 I was awoken by the storm. Very dramatic here. What was it like where you live or are in another country?

    Where is Habbakuk/Habbankuk?

    ~~~

    All those hypocritical gangsters who were assembled in Normandy yesterday have returned to their countries. What a terrible waste of fossil fuel carting them around, especially that used for the obscene Air Force 1 and the convoy of armoured Cadillacs brought over for the purpose of conveying the extrajudicial killer-by-drone and his entourage.

  56. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 2:11 pm

    Gentleperson

    “Sorry, but you have been “gate-keepered” by a hackneyed tactic on page 67 of the hasbara handbook!!”
    ____________________

    It’s page 45, you fucking fool.

    **********************

    More seriously, various turns of phrase of yours remind me of that chappie who got banned – “English Knight” or whatever his name was.

    Does it matter if you’re reappeared?

    Probably not, it’s only a matter of degree in the end : the Eminences are barking, you are woofing.

    *********************

    Dump rubles, reals, rupees and renminbis – buy £, $ and shekels!

  57. Duncan, you can be rest assured that the bussed in Tory minions tried their best to scare Lib Dems into voting for them, the result is marred by ‘scary votes’, and, as so many did not bother to vote, represent another win for the non voters and the party political oligarchies they gave a hand up by staying at home.

  58. doug scorgie

    7 Jun, 2014 - 2:14 pm

    No irony…

    Lord Pearson of UKIP:

    “Our democracy requires that we have more than three peers in the House of Lords when we’re getting 27% of the vote in the latest national election.”

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27738940

  59. Putin is a just a few inches shorter than the chocolate billionaire not many as the BBC implied. The chocolate billionaire is twice the width of Putin (too many chocolate bars perhaps). Putin is visibly the fittest by a long chalk.

    http://static01.nyt.com/images/2014/06/07/world/07putin1_now/07putin1_now-articleLarge.jpg

    I would like to see Poreshenko bare chested on a horse, that is if he could actually mount one.

    http://i.huffpost.com/gen/1133558/original.jpg

  60. The dog that did bark:

    Poroshenko’s inauguration speech has sent a message to Novorossiia and Russia:

    No federalization
    No state status for the Russian language
    No recognition of the Novorossian political leadership
    Full and unconditional surrender of the Novorossian Defense Forces
    Crimea will forever belong to the Ukraine.

    He could not have been any clearer: that is basically a declaration of war and an ultimatum. This is also a full endorsement of the “Banderastan project”.’

    Will the Neocons get their new Cold War? Will Ukraine go down in flames, taking the EU with it? Will the Europeans have to pay for their gas in roubles, renmimbi or gold rather than US dollars? Will European leaders show spine and act in their countries’ interest, rather than pander to the global terror state? So many questions.

    Still, it’s not all doom and gloom. Susan Rice has announced that the US will supply lethal aid to the Syrian opposition, but only to the ‘moderate vetted component’ – who will most certainly not pass it over to the extremists that actually do the killing, no siree bob.

  61. Acanchi/Esler was obviously NBG so they have moved on to Saatchis.

    Scottish referendum: M&C Saatchi tackles ‘no’ ad campaign

    The advertising gurus behind the controversial “Labour Isn’t Working” adverts have been recruited to construct a campaign to help keep Scotland in the union.

    M&C Saatchi are expected to unveil a number of new marketing approaches for the no campaign on Monday, one includes the slogan “No thanks”.

    Despite maintaining a lead in the polls, the Better Together group has been under pressure to change the tone of its campaigning as the yes vote has grown in recent months.

    /..
    http://www.channel4.com/news/scottish-referendum-m-c-saatchi-tackles-no-ad-campaign

    HQ New York now. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saatchi_%26_Saatchi

  62. Desperation is really setting in when they steal like this.

    Treasury ‘Buzzfeed’ drops Lego shots
    Toy maker Lego forces the UK government to stop using its characters to illustrate a campaign against Scottish independence.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-27746619

    Was that Danny’s idea? Perhaps he still plays with his Lego.

  63. The west is supporting fascist forces in Ukraine, as for the stacked ballot returns, the election should be invalidated for that reason alone.

    ‘The Crimea will be forever Ukraine’? is a declaration of war and strife, he is there to wind up Putin until he snaps.

  64. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 3:15 pm

    “I would like to see Poreshenko bare chested on a horse, that is if he could actually mount one.”
    _____________________-

    Says Mary, all a-flutter.

    What is it about blokes on hosses, I wonder…..?

  65. Not ‘all a flutter’. Silly man. The t— would have to see it in those terms of course as is his wont.

    Not at the Derby then with all the wide boys and rich Middle Eastern despots?

    I admire Putin for withstanding the demonization that he has been subjected to the West. I heard no mention in the news commentary last night of the millions of Russians who died in WWII. Would the Third Reich have taken Europe over without the Russians’ sacrifice?

  66. Resident Dissident 7 Jun, 2014 – 10:22 am

    “Remember all the fuss when the BBC allowed Griffin on Question Time

    Perhaps some of RT’s supporters here might wish to offer their thoughts on their favourite channel giving a platform to this fascist

    http://rt.com/news/164372-marine-le-pen-preview/

    Delighted to oblige. Bravo, RT for airing these topics which the Western MSM ignores.
    Your link shows M Le Pen make the following points:

    “The EU has lost control of its foreign policy to Washington”

    “When offering a partnership agreement to Ukraine – which would mean breaking off of its allied relations with Russia – the EU has clearly set blackmail in motion. And that can’t help but fuel dissent inside the country,”

    “We’ve made a great deal of foreign policy mistakes under Washington’s influence, but the worst of them is Syria,”

    “There are “no independent states left in Europe” that would call for peaceful solutions to conflicts”

    “We [National Front] have been the only party to stand against the option of intervening in Syria. When the crisis first started, we said France is supplying arms to jihadists, who would spread terror if they win. That’s what already happened in Libya.”

    “We [National Front] oppose the demonisation of Russia”

    I personally agree with every one of those points, and since I rarely hear such opinions expressed in ‘our’ media, I thank you for bringing this RT interview to my attention.

  67. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 4:20 pm

    ” I heard no mention in the news commentary last night of the millions of Russians who died in WWII.”
    ____________________

    Possibly because what was being remembered were the Normandy landings (=Western front)?

    NB – no reference to the Normandy landings during the annual Victory Day commemoration in Moscow either (=Eastern front).

    Silly b—–!

  68. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 4:22 pm

    “Putin is a just a few inches shorter than the chocolate billionaire not many as the BBC implied.”

    As many as RT implied I think you mean – they used the same photo. LOL

  69. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 4:26 pm

    R2D2 I was awoken by the storm. Very dramatic here. What was it like where you live or are in another country?

    No just another county – slept like the innocent I am.

    A node – but you rather forget the rest of the FN agenda – or perhaps you don’t. The televised interview hasn’t happened yet – this is just the build up.

  70. Resident Dissident 7 Jun, 2014 – 4:26 pm

    “A node – but you rather forget the rest of the FN agenda – or perhaps you don’t. The televised interview hasn’t happened yet – this is just the build up.”

    I addressed the points rather than attack the messenger, something you should try yourself.

  71. You can tell that Mary is absolutely desperate to find some way to undermine the D-Day commemorations. She just can’t stand the idea that there might have been something that this country did that was right.

  72. It was a sideshow, sold to the punters as a big deal, after the event. Old wartime propaganda never dies, it just gets embellished and regurgitated. Eventually a feedback loop develops where the masses swallow the propaganda, then become transmitters of those same rumours to others, soon some report invented first hand descriptions of that same propaganda tale, which gets back to the source and serves to reinforce the bigger lies.

    June 1945 only marks the resumption by all of the ongoing long-spun attempt to conquer the heartland, the inner continent. I think the closing paragraph of Mackinder’s ‘Geographical Pivot of History (1904)’ unwittingly gave the far from great game away, which is still in play: “[…] would add an oceanic frontage to the resources of the great continent, an advantage as yet denied to the Russian tenant of the Pivot Region.”

    Whole populations are just tenants to the would be masters of the world, the Iraqis were sitting on ‘our’ oilfields and the Russians are squatting yet on that long coveted ground.

  73. R2D2. No it was not the same photo. Get it right.

    Troll Not leafy prosperous Surrey. Food banks keep opening. Shops closing. Permanent ‘sales’.

    Anon See my post honouring the brave men of D Day @2.33pm yesterday on the Deep State thread.

    ‘Not ‘against their country’ you duplicitous twister. Against the politicians, the gangsters in charge, the war mongers who make their hypocritical gestures of pretending to care for the fallen when they have waged recent wars on Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Yemen, Mali and so on who posed no threat of invading us. Of course I am deeply proud of those brave people and grateful for those who gave their lives for us. Yet we now have secret trials in our ‘freedom’.’

    ~~~

    Any other problems you pathetic little poodles or any other inventions you can devise? You are like children.

  74. Anyway, what was the Kiev coup president doing at the D-Day gig.

    I’m sure the Ukrainians were fighting on the same side as the Nazi fascists, murdering Poles, Jews, Russians etc to an extent shocking to even their SS bosses.

    At least Merkel has apologised.

    As everyone knows the Ukrainians are unapologetic murderous fascists to this very day.

    I didn’t notice anyone asking Poroshenko to reflect on the contribution his countrymen made to the Nazi war effort.

    Seems a bit insulting to the dead being commemorated.

  75. Just out of interest, how do those people who claim that the BBC isn’t a government propaganda machine explain the airtime that they’re giving to the D-Day anniversary? Are we to believe that the majority of licence payers want to watch hours and hours and hours of this stuff?

  76. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 5:56 pm

    R2D2. No it was not the same photo. Get it right.

    The photo you linked to here

    http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/75366000/jpg/_75366182_75366177.jpg

    Is exactly the same as the second one on the RT page I linked to here

    http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/75366000/jpg/_75366182_75366177.jpg

    If you cannot see that this is the case then you really should see an optician – he may be able to fix your eyes but I doubt he can deal with your other failings.

  77. What a pointless post. I agree that the BBC link is the one I posted. ie the two of them facing the camera.

    You seem to have fouled up by duplicating the link!

    Your links were as follows on the other thread

    https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=d+day+poroshenko&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=P8SSU8DQJIjm7AahmIDoCQ&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAQ&biw=1461&bih=765 ((a conglomeration)

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2000/mar/23/20000323-011028-2791r/?page=all
    (an article without a photo)

    http://rt.com/news/164236-putin-poroshenko-ukraine-bloodshed/ (Includes a photo taken from behind Putin and Poreschenko)

    For goodness sake, dry up. I want no more of your rubbish. Off to a concert anyway.

  78. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 6:18 pm

    “I’m sure the Ukrainians were fighting on the same side as the Nazi fascists, murdering Poles, Jews, Russians etc to an extent shocking to even their SS bosses.”

    You really are beneath contempt – just because some Ukrainians fought on the German side, just as some Russians and Belorussians did as well, it doesn’t mean that the whole nation or even a majority of that nation did.

    A greater proportion of Ukrainians died in WW2 than in any of the Soviet Republics apart from Belarus

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties_of_the_Soviet_Union#Estimated_losses_of_each_Soviet_Republic

    4.5m Ukrainians fought in the Red Army far more than who collaborated with the Nazis. Most ordinary Russians are more than aware of this mixed history of both Ukrainians and Russians in WW2 – but it is only scum like yourself and others trying to justify their own unjustifiable actions who seek to make such a cheap propaganda point.

  79. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 6:22 pm

    I want no more of your rubbish.

    Who on earth do you think you are – does your arrogance know no bounds. You cannot even admit that RT used exactly the same photo as the one you criticised the BBC for using. A decent person would apologise.

  80. Also by-elections don’t really show anything about what will happen in General elections. Labour’s poor showing in the council and Euro elections is a bit more worrying for them, but, again, people usually vote differently in General elections than in European and council elections. The latter don’t matter as much so people feel free to vote for whoever either because they’d prefer them or as a protest vote.

    I totally agree that it’s not worth it for Scots to stay in the UK in the hope that there might be a Labour government though. There might be or we might get 5 more years of the Tories – and even if Labour win their leadership have moved right so fast from Kinnock on that they’ll be mostly just like having the Tories in slow motion.

  81. Anon red poppy man/woman

    General MacCrystall was sacked for not playing the Iraq War dirty enough. General Petraus knew how to sort out the what you call dark-skinned people which gaves your game away for a start.

    You get Mossad, only a border away, to plant bombs to blow up Shi’a and blame it onto the Sunni and vice versa. The sectarian divide was created by the coward Petraus, until the UK and US troops were unable to ” buy one sandwich ” downtown in the wreckage of the country he had made.

    US troops in particular suffered irrepairable Vietnam-style psychological damage just witnessing the sectarian violence let alone perpetrating their own General’s violence.

    All of this was predictable because of what had been done previously in Afghanistan. That’s why millions of people protested, because of the facts of US and UK dirty politics and violence, and because of some idealistic dreams.

    There was also a principled Islamic opposition, which is now in Syria as well, whose aim was to prevent neo-colonialism benefiting USUKIS as it had done for centuries before. At the root of this movement is the killing of any Muslims who show the remotest signs of prefering the status quo of the established colonial order, the CIA Saddam or CIA Assad order.

    The principles behind that violence, to root out the gravitational pull towards colonial domination, was not created by itself. It was the product of George Bush and Tony Blair getting together and working out how to get their hands on the resources of the Muslim countries.

    Tough for you that the dark-skinned people didn’t oblige this time round. They didn’t do it because they saw the result of doing it before : centuries of oppression under violent, madmen like Saddam and Assad and Gaddaffi.

    The West’s response to failure has been to pick on softer targets in Africa and Malaysia. We can pluck your aircraft from sight, and reduce your counties to brutal civil war. No matey, The neo-colonial West, the Cameron Thatcher neo-colonial machine, is finding it harder to find low-hanging fruit to steal.

    New Labour is not in problem because of the recession which was created by the Tory Zio-bankers who were more powerful than Gordon Brown. It is in a problem because of the ruthless determination of Islamic jihad which gave the West a bloody nose for the first time.

    Mits off our lands mates from now on.

  82. Res Diss

    I think you’ll find that Ukraine is something of a divided entity. Always has been.

    I think you’ll further find that the Nazi Ukrainians are mostly concentrated in the eastern regions, precisely the rump area that chocolate boy represents.

    Only a buffoon like yourself would deny the truth of that, to hide the fact that someone who represents the Nazi part of Ukraine is not called to reflect upon his area’s history in that war.

    Most sensible people would think it a curious ommission.

    You of course have your own current reasons for wishing to hide the truth, as do your puppet masters who continually inflict violence and unending mayhem upon any who dare to challenge their hegemony.

  83. Without Russias decisive battles around Kursk, defeating the Germans and actually winning WW2, the war would not have turned so fast and D- day, which was a gamble that cost many young lifes, just as Stalingrad, would not have happened as it did.

    So lets be thankfull to all who died, including the Russian allies who pressured Hitler something rotten.

    Whatever history mongers presume here, it will not change the facts as they exist, not that it would necessarrily stop any of the private schools to put their own slant on it. You know those who find nothing wrong to send their children on subsidised lottery funded excursions to the continent keeping the thoughts of evbil Nazi’s alive, but who can’t help themselves suckering on the bottom lip of these royal oafs, Nazi sympathising scum.

    And what a great swanky party they had, I bet Harry would love to be there now wearing his uniform.
    http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=princess+sophie+marries+Nazi&qpvt=princess+sophie+marries+Nazi&FORM=IGRE

  84. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 6:40 pm

    “Are we to believe that the majority of licence payers want to watch hours and hours and hours of this stuff?”

    Since when has the test been that all broadcasting by the BBC has to appeal to a majority of the population?

    Some of us are quite happy to commemorate the brave men and women who helped to liberate Europe from the Nazis – while others who wish to praise the leader of the FN, a party with deep links to the Vichy collaborators do not. Quite frankly there are times when even handedness by the BBC is just not appropriate.

  85. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 6:47 pm

    “Troll Not leafy prosperous Surrey. Food banks keep opening. Shops closing. Permanent ‘sales’.”

    __________________________-

    Bitch Very well-off Surrey compared to lots of other counties. Chelsea tractors all over the places. Expensive gastro-pubs everywhere. Conspicuous consumption.

    Where does the bitch fit in in those two contrasted pictures?

    *************************

    I’d rather live in Surrey than in the Rhondda with a hey nonny-no and a hey nonny-no(refrain)

  86. I guess the media believe that Milliband will be the next PM, and therefore see no point in provoking him to take away freedom of the press further, or reduce what freedom the BBC has.

  87. Guano 6:32 pm

    I don’t think I’ve ever read so much bollocks in my entire life, so thanks for the effort. Your parents must be really proud to have invested so much in your education only for you to turn out as some whacky “revert” conspiraloon talking about “our lands”. Really laughable mate, get your head fixed.

  88. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 6:53 pm

    “Without Russias decisive battles around Kursk, defeating the Germans and actually winning WW2, the war would not have turned so fast and D- day, which was a gamble that cost many young lifes, just as Stalingrad, would not have happened as it did.

    So lets be thankfull to all who died, including the Russian allies who pressured Hitler something rotten.”

    I don’t disagree – and if you bothered to attend the main D Day museum in Caen (hopefully on a Lottery funded excursion) you would see that they give full credit to the role played by the Russian people (and no glorification of the UK monarchy either) – and that is the view of my Russian wife whose own grandfather died in Poland with the tank battalion that he commanded. Only those with limited historical knowledge and poor taste would try and make claims that any one of the allies was solely responsible for winning the War – remember who fought it for nearly two years when the ruling regime were collaborating with Hitler, remember the supplies that came to Russia by the Artic convoys (my father in law certainly does), remember the hundreds of thousands of Indian soldiers, remember those in North Africa who denied the Germans the oil they needed etc.etc.

  89. Res Diss

    “Some of us are quite happy to commemorate the brave men and women who helped to liberate Europe from the Nazis”

    What a dimwit.

    I’ve already pointed out that you don’t do that by inviting a representative of the Nazi part of Ukraine without asking him to reflect upon their part in that war.

    Nor do you do it by inviting Nazis to form the inner core of the Washington killing machine:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Paperclip

    But then, as an avid watcher of and defender of Auntie you’re not exactly best placed to know what’s been going on outside the fairy tales you inhabit.

    You’re no more than a useful idiot.

  90. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 6:56 pm

    Herbie’s “contribution” to the debate

    “As everyone knows the Ukrainians are unapologetic murderous fascists to this very day.”
    _________________

    As ever, thoughtful, well-reasoned, balanced.

    With friends like this, do the Eminences’ favorite causes need enemies? :)

    ***********************

    “Life had become better, life had become merrier!” (J. Stalin, ca. 1934)

  91. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 7:00 pm

    “Guano 6:32 pm

    I don’t think I’ve ever read so much bollocks in my entire life,…”
    ___________________

    Come come, Anon, be fair!

    Bollocks of that order is freely available on this blog almost every day.

    Why, some of it comes from as far away as sunny California, the land of fruits and nuts.

  92. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 7:03 pm

    Herbie

    You wouldn’t recognise the truth if it hit you in the face – there were plenty in all occupied parts of the Ukraine, Poland, Belarus and Russia who bore the full force of the Nazis and can be proud of their role in their own liberation. In all cases their were minorities who collaborated but they were a long way from being a majority – and it is just a heinous slur from a shit wishing to hide the truth for his own political ends to say otherwise.

  93. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 7:06 pm

    @Anon

    “Guano 6:32 pm

    I don’t think I’ve ever read so much bollocks in my entire life,”

    I presume that was before you read Herbie’s recent trails of slime.

  94. Anyone with any memory at all will remember the tortured process over German invitations to D Day commemorations in the past.

    Much public discussion, denunciation the whole shebang. All over media.

    But now that the West is openly allied with fascists across the globe, Islamic, Jewish, Slavic, Germanic etc, the chocolate bloke just danders in, and not a peep from anyone.

    Reverse ferret all over the shop.

    Liars all.

  95. Ben-LA PACQUTE LO ES TODO

    7 Jun, 2014 - 7:21 pm

    “You’re no more than a useful idiot.”

    He’s no idiot, herbie, but he is useful to certain sectors.

  96. Ben-LA PACQUTE LO ES TODO

    7 Jun, 2014 - 7:33 pm

    Thank you Ed Snowden.

    https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2014/06/65-65-things-we-know-about-nsa-surveillance-we-didnt-know-year-ago

    “t’s been one year since the Guardian first published the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court order, leaked by former NSA contractor Edward Snowden, that demonstrated that the NSA was conducting dragnet surveillance on millions of innocent people. Since then, the onslaught of disturbing revelations, from disclosures, admissions from government officials, Freedom of Information Act requests, and lawsuits, has been nonstop. On the anniversary of that first leak, here are 65 things we know about NSA spying that we did not know a year ago:

    7. A leaked internal NSA audit detailed 2,776 violations of rules or court orders in just a one-year period.”

    You see, the Law is only for us peons. “First, let’s kill all the lawyers” Willie Shakespeare.

  97. “He’s no idiot, herbie, but he is useful to certain sectors.”

    Yup.

    Pravy Sektor, for starters.

    The only thing uglier than a fascist are those creeps who egg them on from behind the scenes, hoping to make a buck out of it.

  98. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 7:43 pm

    Resident Dissident

    You were kind enough to furnish a couple of limericks the other day. Here in return is one I hope you’ll savour. Enjoy!

    “There was a young fellow named Menzies,
    Whose kissing sent girls into frenzies,
    But a virgin one night
    Crossed her legs in a fright,
    And fractured his bi-focal lenses.”

    ***********************

    And another one for Nebelmind (aka Nevermind), the master of the misplaced apostrophe and great coprophile:

    “There was a young fellow called Shit,
    A name he disliked quite a bit;
    So he changed it to Shite –
    A step in the right
    Direction, one has to admit.”

  99. And, surprise surprise, just look who was funding and providing logistic support to these Ukrainian Nazis all those years ago.

    The good ole USSA, through the CIA no less. Some things never change.

    Like the friendship of fascists for fascists, for all time.

    “Truman approved the creation of a guerrilla army code-named “Nightingale” in Ukraine. Originally setup by the Nazis in 1941, it was made up of ultra-nationalists. They would, as Stone describes, wreak havoc on the “famine-wrecked region where Soviet control was loose, carrying out the murder of thousands of Jews, Soviets and Pols, who opposed a separate Ukrainian state.” The CIA would parachute “infiltrators” into the country as well to further “dislodge Soviet control.””

    http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/05/america-backed-fascists-ukraine-73-years-ago.html

  100. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 8:00 pm

    “Pravy Sektor, for starters.

    The only thing uglier than a fascist are those creeps who egg them on from behind the scenes,”

    Out of the gutter into the sewers – when have I ever egged on Pravy Sector or any other fascists for that matter – I regard the reduction in the fascist candidates vote in the Ukrainian Presidential Elections as one of the more positive signs in recent times. I hope we see something similar happening to Zhirinovsky and his chums within Russia in due course.

  101. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 8:12 pm

    Resident Dissident

    When one reads Herbie, one doesn’t know whether to feel pity or embarrassment.

    Who was it who said that many bloggers, in pre-internet times, would have been walking round inside supermarkets, mumbling to themselves?

  102. You’re egging on the fascists every time you deride the separatists desire for autonomy or support chocolate boy’s threats against his own people.

    Those gangs who are attacking them are the fascists. They’ve been incorporated into units for that very purpose. The Ukrainian Army itself having more sense.

    Chocolate boy is currently dependent on these fascists because they’re the only muscle he has.

    So, whilst you claim to despise fascists, you support them in this instance.

    I strongly suspect that you’ll support any thug who’s willing to do your dirty work.

    And that’s of course pecisely the Western agenda, across the planet, and has been for quite some time.

  103. Resident Dissident

    7 Jun, 2014 - 8:30 pm

    Herbie

    Yes of course anyone wanting to protect the territorial integrity of Ukraine and seeking to avoid interference in its affairs from the Putin regime would by your definition be a fascist. Just a guess but I suspect the day the Soviet Union broke up was one of the saddest days in your life.

  104. I agree that the Ukrainian Government’s attempts to do what Russia has failed at in the Caucasus seem equally doomed to fail.

    Herbie should check it out – Stalin used paperclips .

  105. It ate my link to Manfred von Ardenne

  106. Guano wrote “General MacCrystall was sacked for not playing the Iraq War dirty enough.” No, Mcchrystal was the head of Task force 121 in Iraq which was notorious for torture at Camp Nama. He told his subordinates there that they could do what they liked and no-one could touch them for it.

    He was sacked by Obama for having publicly dissed the President, which, unlike torturing some foreigners, isn’t done in US politics.

  107. Or certainly not by military officers whose CinC is the President.

  108. I never buy green top milk, nor red nor mauve.

    The un-skimmed blue top has got my attention recently by using completely unacceptable blue language to a lady. The skimmed red top is just a very weak dilution of the blue.

  109. Duncan McFarlane

    Dirty, but not as political devious dirty as Petraus who concentrated on the sectarian division.

    In the freemason NWO dirty deeds are your ticket to promotion.

    He was sacked for adultery. Insulting the president and having an affair are garlands of honour compared with their real crimes.

  110. Ben-LA PACQUTE LO ES TODO

    7 Jun, 2014 - 10:15 pm

    “In spite of how many unanswered questions there are about the video, overall, Morgan said Putin seemed to be more “nervous” than Obama.

    “Of the two of them, Putin is the more agitated,” said Morgan. “He looks nervous, Obama looks cooler.”

    However, Morgan also noted Obama generally seems “cool” in his interactions.

    “Obama is a cool dude. He’s always cool,” Morgan said.

    Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/body-language-expert-putin-agitated-meeting-obama-2014-6#ixzz33zXHeltC

    He’s a cold customer.

  111. “Yes of course anyone wanting to protect the territorial integrity of Ukraine”

    The Ukraine has no territorial integrity. It’s a cobbled together mishmash of peoples who hate eachother, and designed precisely to that purpose.

    It’s a borderlands, primarily between the Germans and the Russians, as of course is Poland, specifically designed not to have any integrity at all.

    It is, I must say, a bit rich for you to be getting so Westphalian about it, especially since you enthusiastically support the dismembering of other cobbled together entities along the Sykes/Picot lines.

    And you support Israel, another cobbled together entity where again the natives were not consulted.

    It surely can’t have escaped the notice of all but the most irredeemably stupid that the West demands territorial integrity only in its own interests. Elsewhere it’s busy dismembering the body, heart and soul of anywhere unfortunate enough to find itself in its path.

  112. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 11:40 pm

    Herbie is really losing touch with reality.

    Examine part of his latest offering:

    “I strongly suspect that you’ll support any thug who’s willing to do your dirty work.”

    Now, since the whole of Herbie’s comment is meant to be an answer to a comment by Resident Dissident, we must assume that the “you’ll” refers to Resident Dissident.

    So the above extract could in fact read :

    “I strongly suspect that Resident Dissident’ll support any thug who’s willing to do his dirty work”

    One must presume that “thug” is a reference to the newly elected President of Ukraine.

    Hence, what Herbie is saying is, in fact :

    I strongly suspect that Resident Dissidentsupports President Poroshenko, who is willing to do his {ie, Resident Dissident’s } dirty work”.

    Herbie must be very, very angry this evening to come out with accusations like that.

  113. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 11:43 pm

    “You’re a VERY SILLY man!” (with thanks to Mary)

  114. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    7 Jun, 2014 - 11:50 pm

    Herbie opines

    “It surely can’t have escaped the notice of all but the most irredeemably stupid that the West demands territorial integrity only in its own interests.”
    __________________

    Now, this is nonsense of course.

    But let us assume for a brief moment and for the sake of argument that it is true: what then would be so surprising that the West should be demanding something in its own interests – would Herbie expect the West to demand something in, say, China’s interests? Or Russia’s? Or Iran’s? And if he would, why would he so expect?

  115. Those jihadists in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Africa, and now Syria, who have killed so many of their fellow Muslims because of their attachment to the stability of CIA dictators and Western colonialism are of course themselves deeply motivated by the alliance they have formed directly with the CIA themselves.

    In other words it is a normal, political, not theological or ideological struggle for power. People are killed for their compromise with yesterday’s CIA dictators and the people who are doing the killing are paid/controlled by the CIA. Colonialism constantly refreshes the pain and deprivations of those who are to be oppressed, by using new slogans with new ambitious Muslims ready to sell their fellows and their religion for short-term advantage/power.

    Thus the colonial system will always tempt the politically aware. The jihadists will execute Syrians for assisting the Assad CIA status quo, but they fail to count their own political alliances with the CIA.

    And they regard their own stupidity in selling their religion and fellow Muslims as the height of piety and excellence.
    Allah knows their hearts, and being exposed for their hypocrisy will not stop them.

  116. Wrong again, habby

    The thugs are the boot boys of fascism, as of course we’ve seen in Ukraine. They have their own idea of what their nation and society ought to look like. Like them obviously, holding defiantly to their tedious creation myths.

    So, the leaders give them a bit of that. Keep them happy. Whack a few molies here and there.

    But they’re merely instruments of elite power.

    Fascism itself is government by corporations. The thugs are just used to quell any outbreaks of democracy that may get in the way of the plan.

    They’re sheepdogs. I’m sure you’ll remember this from Animal Farm.

    Often they get whacked themselves when their job is done and they become embarrassing and demanding.

  117. Habby

    It’s simple enough for even you to understand.

    The West, and Res Diss, pretend to territorial integrity over Ukraine, but are happy to dismember other countries.

    Theirs is not a principled position based on agreement or Law.

    It’s a do as we please, whenever, wherever we want position.

    Obviously a world run in such fashion would only ever be chaos.

  118. Peacewisher

    8 Jun, 2014 - 1:16 am

    Herbie… don’t you mean West, not East? (Ukraine)

    Good arguments have been presented on both sides, by Habby and Herbie, and indeed Ukraine post-ww2 clearly was a very careful balance. Kruschev was no fool, however, and he must have had his reasons for giving it semi-autonomy. And it wasn’t a bad move because it preserved the peace from 1954-2014…

    I’ve studied recent history of Ukraine a little through Internet sources which may not be definitive. It seems to me that the “game changer” was not the Orange Revolution, but the declaration of ww2 Banderites as heroes… part of the fabric of the Ukranian Nation. It was probably that action that infuriated the East, and of course Russia. It should also have infuriated the EU and US.

    This is the real reason why Poroshenko should have been asked to apologise… because as a result of the 2010 idolising, he was effectively representing the Bandera fascists! Yet the western media said nothing. I’m getting fed up with saying this, but it was the act of ignoring the rise of fascism in the 1930s that led to the inevitable conflict that was ww2. US doesn’t care, because it sees its interests as expanding through Ukraine, but what are our EU “leaders” playing at!

  119. Peacewisher

    8 Jun, 2014 - 1:51 am

    Recent article about Bandera:

    http://www.npr.org/blogs/parallels/2014/05/20/312719066/hero-or-villain-historical-ukrainian-figure-symbolizes-todays-feud

    Is this balanced? If so, why are the EU so quiet about what has been happening in recent years in Western Ukraine?

  120. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 7:59 am

    “The Ukraine has no territorial integrity. It’s a cobbled together mishmash of peoples who hate eachother, and designed precisely to that purpose.”

    Every region of which, imcluding Crimea and those in Eastern Ukraine, voted overwhelmingly and freely to separate from the Soviet Union. Of course Herbie is quite happy to ignore such little things where the natives were consulted. The borderland comments about Poland and Ukraine is otiose in the extreme – but it at least shows where his addled thinking is leading.

  121. Herbie won hands down here last night.

    ~~

    For the Nth and last time, my photo link http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/75366000/jpg/_75366182_75366177.jpg

    and

    RD’s photo link http://rt.com/news/164236-putin-poroshenko-ukraine-bloodshed/ (Includes a photo taken from behind Putin and Poreschenko)

    provide completely different photos. They are NOT the same. Is he really that thick?

  122. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 8:20 am

    Mary

    Please look at the second picture on the RT link – the picture is exactly the same – you may then apologise to me and the BBC. On the other hand you could give us all a rest from your infantile trolling.

  123. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 8:25 am

    So Mary you support the view that Ukriane and Poland have no territorial integrity – so perhaps you might wish to suggest who they should belong to – are you with Molotov or Ribbentrop.

  124. There is another attempt to smear Putin, this time by association with the FIFA awarding of the 2022 World Cup to Qatar. So convoluted, a gas deal with Thailand comes into the story. Sunday Times.

    To see the FIFA crooks processing into their Sao Paulo hotel reminded me of scenes from the Godfather films about the Mafia. Capo Blatter was being guarded by a mob of heavies. He was saying nothing. The ‘committee’ is awaiting the NY lawyer Mr Garcia to come to the rescue with his report.

    http://www.dawn.com/news/1111285/blatter-platini-to-come-face-to-face-at-fifa-meeting

    Now the sponsors are kicking in.

    Qatar 2022: Fifa sponsor demands ‘appropriate investigation’

    Fifa is under growing pressure over its controversial decision to award the 2022 World Cup to Qatar.

    One of its main sponsors, Sony, has called on the governing body to carry out an “appropriate investigation” into claims of wrongdoing during the bidding process.

    Meanwhile, the Sunday Times has published new allegations based on a leak of millions of secret documents.

    /..
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/27751265

  125. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 8:32 am

    “especially since you enthusiastically support the dismembering of other cobbled together entities along the Sykes/Picot lines”

    Evidence????

  126. Ref the prosperity or otherwise of Surrey, about which the troll seems to have a fixation and DEEP knowledge. This in spite of his posting from a different time zone to the UK and using the American spelling of favourite – ‘favorite’ – in previous posts.

    If he would like to consult the records, such as the Surrey County Council website, he could find records about the extent of domestic abuse, alcohol related hospital admissions, social care provided to one parent famiilies with one, two or three or more children, etc etc. Churches who have set up food banks would provide more evidence for him that everything is not rosy in the county.

    It might be leafy (what a silly epithet) but he should come here in the Spring and he would see that the pavements and gutters are full of mulch from the Autumn leaf fall because the local councils have given up street cleaning apart from in the town centres. The surface water gullies are mostly blocked and the potholes become most extensive. No repairs will take place until August we are being told?? ie never.

    The pavement and kerbs are growing weeds and the traffic islands containing dirty white plastic bollards (many of which are missing) are surrounded by mulch, weeds and even shrubbery growing there in the mulch. Traffic signs are missing or are on the ground and there are very many signposts without any signs attached at all.

    But the roads which form the route for Boris’s Prudential cycle ride next month are being smartened up, verges mown and hedges and foliage cut back and all the white lines repainted. So funny it can make one cynical.

    PS No abusive riposte required.

    Just some of his comments on this page alone. Vile.

    …It’s page 45, you fucking fool.

    …Silly b—!

    …Where does the bitch fit in in those two contrasted pictures?

    …Bollocks of that order is freely available on this blog almost every day.
    Why, some of it comes from as far away as sunny California, the land of fruits and nuts.

    …When one reads Herbie, one doesn’t know whether to feel pity or embarrassment.

    …Who was it who said that many bloggers, in pre-internet times, would have been walking round inside supermarkets, mumbling to themselves?

    Plus two puerile limericks.

    What wonderful contributions he makes to this blog.

  127. Anti-homeless studs at London residential block prompt uproar
    ‘Critics say spikes treat homeless ‘like pigeons’ as residents fear short ground spikes at doorway are to deter rough sleepers

    Metal studs have been installed outside a block of flats in central London to deter rough sleepers.

    The installation of the studs outside the flats on Southwark Bridge Road provoked widespread condemnation on Twitter with users claiming homeless people were being treated like vermin because similar metal spikes are used to deter pigeons.

    Residents told the Telegraph that the studs were installed outside the flats in the last month to prevent homeless people from sleeping in the doorway.

    /..

    http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/jun/07/anti-homeless-studs-london-block-uproar on residential block prompt uproar

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/homelessness-spikes-outside-london-flats-spark-outrage-on-twitter-9506390.html

    What a vicious cruel country the ConDems have created. But of course they are ALL in it together.

    If the trolls need spikes to place outside their electronically operated gates, I am sure that they could be procured from Amazon the wage slave/zero hours employers.

  128. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 9:11 am

    Still no apology from Lady Dorking who doesn’t have the intelligence, or is it intellectual honesty, to admit that one of the photos on the RT page is exactly the same as the one on the BBC that she criticised – she then starts into a lecture of other’s behaviour.

  129. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 9:31 am

    “If the trolls need spikes to place outside their electronically operated gates,”

    Tut tut don’t you know trolls live under bridges?

    I must say the view from your residence looks rather splendid

    http://www.panoramio.com/photo/85467786

  130. The gangsters-in-charge 1972. One is dead. The other still lurks incredibly aet 91.

    ‘Lest we forget: Our present leaders can derive inspiration from other great American leaders.

    White House tape recordings, April 25, 1972:

    President Nixon: How many did we kill in Laos?

    National Security Adviser Henry Kissinger: In the Laotian thing, we killed about ten, fifteen [thousand] …

    Nixon: See, the attack in the North [Vietnam] that we have in mind … power plants, whatever’s left – POL [petroleum], the docks … And, I still think we ought to take the dikes out now. Will that drown people?

    Kissinger: About two hundred thousand people.

    Nixon: No, no, no … I’d rather use the nuclear bomb. Have you got that, Henry?

    Kissinger: That, I think, would just be too much.

    Nixon: The nuclear bomb, does that bother you? … I just want you to think big, Henry, for Christsakes.

    May 2, 1972:

    Nixon: America is not defeated. We must not lose in Vietnam. … The surgical operation theory is all right, but I want that place bombed to smithereens. If we draw the sword, we’re gonna bomb those bastards all over the place. Let it fly, let it fly.

    “Every ten years or so, the United States needs to pick up some small crappy little country and throw it against the wall, just to show the world we mean business.” – Michael Ledeen, former Defense Department consultant and holder of the Freedom Chair at the American Enterprise Institute.’

    http://williamblum.org/aer/read/129

  131. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    8 Jun, 2014 - 9:44 am

    Herbie

    “Wrong again, habby

    The thugs are the boot boys of fascism, as of course we’ve seen in Ukraine.”
    __________________

    That clarification (at 00h03)does not make your sentence any less ludicrous. That sentence would accordingly now read as follows:

    “I strongly suspect that Resident Dissident supports the boot boys of fascism, who are willing to do his {ie, Resident Dissident’s } dirty work”.

    What is Resident Dissident’s “dirty work”, Herbie (outside your own peculiar, personal nightmares)?

    You really should THINK a little before commenting.

  132. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    8 Jun, 2014 - 9:55 am

    Herbie

    “The thugs are just used to quell any outbreaks of democracy that may get in the way of the plan.

    They’re sheepdogs. I’m sure you’ll remember this from Animal Farm.

    Often they get whacked themselves when their job is done..”
    ______________________

    Thank you for referring to “Animal Farm”; Orwell is not often referred to by the fake-Lefties on this blog, for reasons which are fairly obvious…

    Anyway, to your assertion: yes, in “Animal Farm” the dogs (not sheepdogs, I think) were used to keep the plebs in order (they stand for the Cheka, OGPU, NKVD, etc).

    But I do not recall that the dogs in “Animal Farm” got “whacked” – could you please reference for us?

    Have a great day, Herbie, may the rain fall gently on your thatch.

  133. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:03 am

    Habba

    It should also be remembered that Orwell went out of his way to produce a Ukrainian version of Animal Farm before his death – he clearly didn’t see Ukrainians as “a cobbled together mishmash of people” as his distorter does. Perhaps not so curiously we have yet to receive Herbie’s thoughts on the demise of the Soviet Union.

  134. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:13 am

    Herbie, assuming once again his mantle as this blog’s global startegist, accuses Resident Dissident:

    “It is, I must say, a bit rich for you to be getting so Westphalian about it, especially since you enthusiastically support the dismembering of other cobbled together entities along the Sykes/Picot lines.”

    _____________________

    Now, that sentence criticises Resident Dissident for allegedly supporting the dismemberment of states which have been “cobbled together”.

    We must therefore conclude that you are against the dismemberment of states which have been “cobbled together”.

    Given that you consider that both Ukraine and Israel are states which have been “cobbled together”, does it follow that you are against the dismemberment of Ukraine s attempted by various bands of local fascists working for certain oligarchs in eastern Ukraine, and against those who support the abolition of the State of Israel through the “Isarel has no right to exist” angle?

  135. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:14 am

    Habba

    You are of course absolutely right on your reading of Animal Farm – if Orwell had the chance to right a sequel he might of course had the dogs taking over from the pigs and outdoing man in their rapaciousness and pursuit of self interest.

  136. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:18 am

    “Habba

    It should also be remembered that Orwell went out of his way to produce a Ukrainian version of Animal Farm before his death – he clearly didn’t see Ukrainians as “a cobbled together mishmash of people” as his distorter does. Perhaps not so curiously we have yet to receive Herbie’s thoughts on the demise of the Soviet Union.”
    _______________________

    By God, you’re right, Resident Dissident. I in fact remember seeing an “Introduction to the Ukrainian edition” somewhere – perhaps it’s in the Collected works/essays.

    Re Herbie’s thoughts on the Soviet Union, I think they’re in as little doubt as worth knowing.

  137. Herbie. You have them on the run. Six idiotic comments in a row from the pair of them.

  138. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:24 am

    I in fact remember seeing an “Introduction to the Ukrainian edition” somewhere – perhaps it’s in the Collected works/essays.

    Yes – it is – the introduction, which is one of the last things Orwell wrote, is often quoted as evidence that Orwell never abandoned real socialism, but just the ersatz version so common here.

    http://orwell.ru/library/novels/Animal_Farm/english/epfc_go

  139. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:27 am

    Mary

    I’ve taken careful note of your comments at 08h57. An invigorating read, indeed!

    Re the lamentable state of certain public fixtures in Surrey, I’d merely note that the local council would have more money for such if property values were at last to be uprated and Council tax paid on the basis of those new values. Would you agree with me that it is scandalous that you are still paying local taxes on the basis of the value of your property in 1991, Mary?

    Re your catalogue of my “vilenesses” : just a word of (re)explanation – I’ve told you that every “troll” from you will be met by a “bitch” from me, and every “t___” by a “b___”. I agree it’s puerile, but if you wish to behave like a child then you lust expect to be treated like one.

    ****************

    And now have an excellent day, take care!

  140. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:28 am

    Mary

    I repeat

    “Still no apology from Lady Dorking who doesn’t have the intelligence, or is it intellectual honesty, to admit that one of the photos on the RT page is exactly the same as the one on the BBC that she criticised – she then starts into a lecture of other’s behaviour.”

  141. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:28 am

    “must” not “lust” :)

  142. doug scorgie

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:33 am

    “During a joint press conference in Jerusalem, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu accidentally gave German Chancellor Angela Merkel a Hitler mustache…”

    http://www.mediaite.com/online/netanyahu-accidentally-gives-german-chancellor-merkel-a-hitler-stache/

    Of course it was accidental. Netanyahu would never stoop so low.

    Although, I did find it funny.

  143. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:40 am

    Although, I did find it funny.

    Each to their own – what I found amusing was my picture of Lady Dorking in a ra-ra skirt waving her pom poms in her new role as Herbie’s cheerleader.

  144. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:44 am

    She was of course following a rather dishevelled Herbie around the supermarket isles where he was last seen screaming at a jar of Polish cucumbers while balancing a pack of Westphalian ham on his head.

  145. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 10:49 am

    And in the background the tannoy was playing the Whanganui canoe song by their favourite pop star

    https://soundcloud.com/john_goose

  146. RD… thank you for the link.

    The introduction to the Ukranian edition is a really interesting insight into George Orwell, and how a socialist came to write such a novel. I read Animal Farm at school, and we really took it apart critically, so I think I know it inside out. See various plays and films over the years, including a hilarious BBC radio “Tony’s Farm” in 2003… wish someone still had a transcript of that one.

    You know what I rant about on this blog by now… maybe my political views were moulded at school through the exam board’s daring decision to choose George Orwell as an author for “O” level English Lit. Bloody leftie educationists!

  147. doug scorgie

    8 Jun, 2014 - 11:29 am

    Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !
    8 Jun, 2014 – 9:55 am

    “Thank you for referring to “Animal Farm”; Orwell is not often referred to by the fake-Lefties on this blog, for reasons which are fairly obvious…”

    I know what you mean Habbabkuk but you’re wrong. If you have read Animal Farm (which I presume you have) then you didn’t understand it.

    The same with 1984.

  148. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    8 Jun, 2014 - 11:37 am

    “She was of course following a rather dishevelled Herbie around the supermarket isles where he was last seen screaming at a jar of Polish cucumbers while balancing a pack of Westphalian ham on his head.”
    _______________

    This, I believe, is what’s known as the knock-out in the third round! :)

    Always refreshing to see the Original Trolls routed!

  149. Bugger (the Panda)

    8 Jun, 2014 - 11:38 am

    I was going to post a link to a Youtube video from 2011 of Question Time from Liverpool when Alex Salmond slapped down, much to the audience’s delight, Chris Huhne, Peter Hain and Michael Howard.

    I wanted to but, the video has been pulled from Youtube.
    r
    Hain’s face was a peach and only his Tango pancake makeup prevented his embarrassed red face glowing like Chernobyl.

  150. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 11:38 am

    “maybe my political views were moulded at school through the exam board’s daring decision to choose George Orwell as an author for “O” level English Lit. Bloody leftie educationists!”

    Its just been put back on the list but not by a lefty educationalist

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-27610829

  151. Something else from Animal Farm… Trostsky was clearly identified as the good guy, but a lot of the bad side of trades by unionism in the late 1970s, and militant tendency in the 1980s came from those supposedly following Trotsky. Never quite come to terms with whether Trotsky was a bit like “The Levellers” in the English Civil War, cruelly manipulated by a superior political manipulator who discarded him as soon as he started to get in the way of “the great plan”.

    Yes, Stalin was a b—— to anyone who dared to question him. And so was Hitler. However, we would probably be well into the 1000 year Reich by now if it wasn’t for the Red Army…

  152. @RD: That is good to see… and good to see that teachers and pupils have been listened to by the exam board when making their choices. There are sadly many examples of labour party figures that became like Napoleon and Squealer. Miliband does need to “purge” the opportunists within his party who have used the aspirations of “hard working families” to boost popularly and seize power for themselves. I still find it ironic that Orwell’s real name is Blair.

  153. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 12:10 pm

    Peacewisher

    While what you say about Orwell and Trotsky may be true – to then extend it to Peter Taafe and the Militant Tendency is ridiculous in the extreme. If you think Orwell would for one moment have supported the Militant Tendency and its methods you clearly need to read a lot more Orwell.

    We would also b well into the final year Reich if it wasn’t for Churchill and the British People and others who fought the war for 2 years before the Russians became our allies – by all means give due credit to the Russian people and the Red Army but they are not the same as Stalin and his henchmen.

  154. I don’t believe that for a moment, RD! You could also say that militant tendency did for Trotsky what the Ukrainian purges did for Stalin. It seems that the truth of the matter re Stalin seems to be that he went insane after the death of his wife; wasn’t he the one who had shot anyone who brought him bad news?

    OK. The purges were unforgiveable, and so were the excesses of Hitler, but so have been plenty more unforgiveable actions “in the name of democracy” in the late 20th century.

    Do our politicians want to learn from history?

  155. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 1:13 pm

    “It seems that the truth of the matter re Stalin seems to be that he went insane after the death of his wife;”

    I presume you mean his first wife back before the Russian revolution.

    “You could also say that militant tendency did for Trotsky what the Ukrainian purges did for Stalin.”

    No – Trotsky cannot be held responsible for the Militant Tendency.

  156. RD If you had linked to the actual photo rather than the RT page I would have known what you were on about.

    I think Hasbara should have better training for their operatives. :) Habbabkuk/Habbabkuk came here now knowing how to copy and paste. FYI hover over a photo, click on it and see Properties. Copy and paste the link.

    PS You also caused confusion by linking to my BBC link as if it was yours!

    Therefore you are definitely not getting any apology nor is there need for one.

    PPS There is no such person as Lady Dorking incidentally. There is however this large aluminium statue of a Dorking cockerel on a roundabout in the town. Perhaps your mate H would like it as his avatar.
    http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/582787

  157. Not knowing …rather than now knowing.

  158. More thieving and crookery by the banks.

    June 5 2014

    Deutsche Bank warns of material damage from forex probes

    Deutsche Bank has warned the continuing investigations by global regulators into whether foreign exchange rates were manipulated could have a “material” effect on the lender.

    The Frankfurt-based bank said its financial exposure to the misconduct probes – in which multiple global banks are under investigation by authorities around the world – could be material. It added that its reputation could also suffer as a result.

    Commerzbank suspends 2 currency traders
    Germany finds evidence of forex rate-fixing
    BaFin finds forex manipulation evidence
    Two arrested in Australia forex probe

    IN Banks
    Credit Suisse eyes fixed income spin-off
    Goldman prop traders strike out
    Barclays M&A chief quits
    FCA seeks to fine former Deutsche trader

    Deutsche has suspended five traders located in the Americas as part of an internal investigation into whether foreign exchange markets were manipulated, while other employees have received other disciplinary measures.

    In total, at least 34 staff at 12 banks and the Bank of England have been suspended, placed on leave or fired as part of the global investigations by lenders and regulators into possible rate-rigging in the €5.3tn-a-day currency market, the largest financial market in the world.

    As yet, no regulator has brought any formal charge and no traders at Deutsche or any other bank have been charged with wrongdoing. BaFin, the German regulator, warned last month that it had found “concrete evidence” that attempted manipulation had taken place in the foreign exchange market, without naming specific institutions.

    Deutsche cautioned that many of the investigations were still in their early stages and that it was too soon to estimate how large any fines from governmental bodies or private lawsuits might be.

    The lender also warned that revenues in its investment bank in the second quarter of the year were likely to be lower than the same time last year as the decline in fixed income trading continues to harm the bank.

    Deutsche warned that April and May had seen an “ongoing challenging market environment with low customer volumes and low volatilities in many key areas”. It said investment bank revenue in the second quarter could be lower “by a similar to slightly greater extent” than the first quarter dip of 10 per cent.

    The bank also warned that revenues from its equity arm, which increased in the first quarter of the year, were now trending downward. Global transaction banking, by contrast, had shown an improvement in pre-tax income so far in the second quarter compared with the same time last year, while its non-core unit also lost less before income taxes in April and May compared with the same period in 2013.

    The warnings were made in Deutsche’s prospectus for its €6.75bn rights issue sent out to investors on Thursday. Investors were offered the opportunity to pay €22.50 a share – representing a 24 per cent discount on the bank’s share price at the close of the market on Wednesday – with existing shareholders eligible to purchase 5 new shares for every 18 they currently hold.

    The move is the second step in the €8bn capital raising announced by the bank last month as it seeks to strengthen its balance sheet amid fresh regulation in Europe and the US. Shares worth €1.75bn were placed privately with Paramount Services Holdings, the investment vehicle of the Qatari royal family, last month.

    Deutsche, which has come under criticism from shareholders in the past for its weak capital strength, said the new capital would strengthen its common tier one equity ratio from 9.5 to 12 per cent and its leverage ratio from 2.5 to 3.4 per cent as of the end of March.

    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/8c5832be-ecc1-11e3-a57e-00144feabdc0.html

    Copied to save you registering!

  159. Ben-LA PACQUTE LO ES TODO

    8 Jun, 2014 - 4:20 pm

    Vulture capitalists, or Bankers if you will, are the biggest expense in public projects, Mary.

    http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_24795356/delta-tunnels-plans-true-price-tag-much-67

  160. The lesson from Animal Farm and 1984 is about how people are manipulated, coralled and divided, and it applies as much to the West as it does to the USSR or China.

    For all sorts of historical and economic reasons, the West itself is now the master of Orwellian technique.

    Orwell’s thinking is certainly not statist, and that’s the point. You’ll see that in Homage to Catalonia.

    You see, those like Res Diss and Habby who follow the Western line are themselves victims and/or promoters of Orwellian technique.

    Those who understand what Orwell was on about will not follow so blindly the Western program to dominate the globe. That’s truly an Orwellian nightmare, from which there is no escape.

    The real debate now is between those who are for a multi polar world against those who favor a banker ruled globe.

    I’m quite sure Orwell would not have wanted a banker ruled globe.

  161. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 5:38 pm

    “Those who understand what Orwell was on about will not follow so blindly the Western program to dominate the globe.”

    Nor the KGB program to dominate the Ukraine.

    “I’m quite sure Orwell would not have wanted a banker ruled globe.”

    There we can agree – but I suspect he saw rather more alternatives than Western pigs and KGB pigs (or is it dogs) which you so devoutly favour.

  162. Why don’t you just apologise, Mary? You got it wrong, like you so often do, and you refuse to backdown out of pride — a sin, if I am not mistaken. Of course this will become an item to be recalled in future commentary whenever you call for an apology. See how it works?

  163. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 5:42 pm

    @ Lady Dorking

    “RD If you had linked to the actual photo rather than the RT page I would have known what you were on about.”

    I referred to it being the 2nd photo on the page – and quite clearly your paymasters did not teach you to use the scroll bar – the links were all ok the first time. And yes of course the aristocracy never feel they have to apologise the little people or the BBC.

  164. Res Diss

    You still don’t get it, do you.

    If you support the Western anexation of Ukraine, then you’re supporting the neocon plan for world domination.

    That’s the whole point.

    Are you really so stupid that you don’t see this.

  165. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 5:46 pm

    Jemand

    I’m coming round to Habba’s as you receive so shall you give line – but then perhaps I should remember I have had a better upbringing than much of the aristocracy.

  166. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 5:54 pm

    “If you support the Western anexation of Ukraine, then you’re supporting the neocon plan for world domination.”

    And do the Ukrainians have any say in the matter – or shall we just dismiss them and the Poles as you have done so cheaply. Perhaps I have a rather higher faith in Western democracy to deal with its ills – and certainly a greater faith than I have in the systems you support. Of course you could favour Ukraine becoming a larger version of Moldova with Eastern Ukraine as Transdnistra Mark II.

    BTW you never answered the question about your feelings the day the Soviet Union broke up.

  167. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 5:58 pm

    Mary

    Why are you worrying about the banks manipulating markets? In the regimes you favour such behaviour is pretty much par for the course.

  168. Get lost the pair of you trolls.

  169. Stephen Fry retweeted this.

    A eulogy to the NHS: What happened to the world my generation built?
    In 1926, Harry Leslie Smith’s sister died of TB in a workhouse infirmary, too poor for proper medical care. In 1948, the creation of the NHS put a stop to all that. In an extract from his new book, Harry’s Last Stand, he describes his despair at the coalition’s dismantling of the welfare state
    http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/jun/04/coalition-attacks-nhs-return-britain-age-workhouse

    ~~

    We have no money for the NHS, for social work, for children’s services etc but we do have money for the purposes of WAR.

    £250m military college to be built at Worthy Down
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-27755221

    Apart from anything else, Worthy Down is a beautiful area north of Winchester. An old RAF WW1 airfield originally.

  170. Res Diss

    You really are a muppet.

    You see, if you understand Orwell you don’t support any of the elites.

    You certainly don’t support any of them in their plans for world domination, which is what you are doing.

    Now, habby is an openly declared statist. He supports Western designs and plans.

    You claim to be against these plans.

    But evidently you’re much too stupid to see these designs and plans at work in Ukraine and other places, so you support them.

    It really is as simple as that.

  171. Ben-LA PACQUTE LO ES TODO

    8 Jun, 2014 - 6:18 pm

    “Why are you worrying about the banks manipulating markets?”

    RD; Did you read my link at 4:20.?

    Do you support Bankers who triple the cost of public projects for the sake of Finance (fees and interest)? Do you also applaud the Advance Paycheck usery for the poor schmucks who can’t seem to live on this weeks paycheck?

  172. The trolls might like some reading for a summer evening. Could I suggest this.

    Stories from an occupation: the Israelis who broke silence
    A group called Breaking the Silence has spent 10 years collecting accounts from Israeli soldiers who served in the Palestinian territories. To mark the milestone, 10 hours’ worth of testimony was read to an audience in Tel Aviv. Here we print some extracts

    Children of the occupation: growing up in Palestine

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/08/israel-soldiers-speak-out-brutality-palestine-occupation

  173. Ben-LA PACQUTE LO ES TODO

    8 Jun, 2014 - 6:35 pm

  174. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 6:47 pm

    Do you support Bankers who triple the cost of public projects for the sake of Finance (fees and interest)? Do you also applaud the Advance Paycheck usery for the poor schmucks who can’t seem to live on this weeks paycheck?

    No and No.

    Perhaps before you get too keen on India’s financial system (or Russia’s or China’s for that matter) you perhaps ought to consider the eye watering levels of corruption (esp among government officials) that accompanies it.

  175. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 6:53 pm

    Herbie

    I pick and chose which of the Western designs and plans that I support – as I guess Habba does as well, just that his selection is different from mine. We both believe in the ability of democratic institutions to challenge and change those plans – which they have successfully done over the years. Of course what you and others never do is set out any coherent alternative and then you end up supporting far worse regimes which continually demonstrate contempt for basic human rights.

  176. Ben-LA PACQUTE LO ES TODO

    8 Jun, 2014 - 6:54 pm

    “you perhaps ought to consider the eye watering levels of corruption (esp among government officials) that accompanies it.”

    Granted. But that’s a cultural given and involves petty bribes as opposed to institutional graft and collusion amongst private banks.

    Their form of government is, like ours, in an infancy of socio/political development some 7 decades old. How old is ours?

  177. Res Diss

    Which Western designs and plans do you not support?

    And when you say:

    “We both believe in the ability of democratic institutions to challenge and change those plans – which they have successfully done over the years.”

    What’s the evidence for that.

  178. Resident Dissident

    8 Jun, 2014 - 7:26 pm

    “Which Western designs and plans do you not support?”

    Read what I have said in the past – the answer is many. As a social democrat I have always believed that markets are once of the best mechanisms for resource allocation but they do need effective regulation to prevent their worse excesses. I yet again note the absence of any proposed alternative on your part.

    “We both believe in the ability of democratic institutions to challenge and change those plans – which they have successfully done over the years.” ”What’s the evidence for that.”

    All of the annual Chartist demands bar one have been met, the NHS and many other forms of socialised care, freedom of speech and expression on a degree not seen in many other parts of the world, generally higher living standards than much of the rest of world and less poverty among the worst off etc.

  179. Peacewisher

    8 Jun, 2014 - 7:32 pm

    For RD re Stalin:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nadezhda_Alliluyeva

    I found out about her via the autobiography of her daughter.

    Quote from Stalin himself:

    “This creature softened my heart of stone. She died and with her died my last warm feelings for humanity.”

    http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/519365-this-creature-softened-my-heart-of-stone-she-died-and

  180. Res Diss

    All the things you mention are disappearing.

    Even the most foolish person must now recognize that there’s no effective regulation of financial markets.

    The NHS is being broken up for privatisation.

    Freedom of speech, of expression, of protest is being clamped down upon to a horrifying degree.

    Living standards are plummeting.

    You see, you’re barely aware of what’s happening in the world and that’s why you cling to an analysis which at least seemed superficially appropriate up until the late 1980s.

    You don’t appear to understand that Globalisation changes the game.

    You don’t seem to understand that corporations have taken over government and are now making plans to undermine any govt scrutiny of their activities.

    That’s the end of democracy.

    When the game changes, the rules change, and how you play the game changes as well.

    Your support for the global agenda is in fact voting for your own enslavement.

  181. Peacewisher

    8 Jun, 2014 - 8:18 pm

    To RD. As you appreciated The Red Army, here’s Red Army Choir performing “Skyfall”:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-F832ZZNRV0

  182. The Pope plants an olive tree in the Vatican garden with Peres and Abbas.

    Pope dives into Mideast peace with prayer summit
    https://uk.news.yahoo.com/pope-dives-mideast-peace-prayer-summit-192947176.html

    How about the thousands upon thousands of olive trees that the Israelis have destroyed and are destroying in Palestine?

    Since 1967 Israel has razed over 800,000 Palestinian olive trees, the equivalent to destroying Central Park 33 times over
    http://mondoweiss.net/2013/10/palestinian-equivalent-destroying.html

  183. Ba'al Zevul (Dot Dot Dot)

    9 Jun, 2014 - 9:20 am

    Team 2015’ was launched to some eye rolls in 2013 as a reward-based activist pool designed to target the 40 key seats that the Tories need to hold or gain in order to secure that elusive majority. [Grant] Shapps says he modelled it on his own operation in Welwyn Garden City where he turned a 5,000 majority in 2005 into a ultra-safe 17,000 at the last election. ‘I will regularly get thirty people out on Saturday morning. Am I paying them? No. To professionally deliver the entire constituency would cost £7,000 but you know what I do, I put all the names in the hat at the end of the delivery and there is lunch for two in the best restaurant in the area, which probably costs the association 180 quid.’

    His backyard also notably bucked the Ukip trend in this month’s local elections. Instead of lunch, ‘Team 2015’, which is run centrally by CCHQ staff, dishes out awards and meetings with Cameron and the cabinet. ‘As I joke with the PM, the top platinum, platinum prize is you get to go to Ibiza with Sam and David – it’s for the person who devotes their life to the campaign.’

    ‘In fairness to the PM, he has always loved it,’ Shapps assures me. ‘When I presented ’Team 2015′ to MPs at one of our parliamentary meetings, he stood up afterwards and said “this is the best things I’ve seen from CCHQ in thirty years”. His quote may be a slight exaggeration, but we’ve now built up our network to almost six thousand people.’

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/2014/jun/03/ministers-prepare-for-queens-speech-politics-live-blog

  184. Sofia Kibo Noh

    9 Jun, 2014 - 9:33 am

    I thought I’d just swing by and check on the grownups.

    What a sorry sight to see two grown men making fools of themselves.

    What Dad and his sidekick don’t realise is that in this technological age the evidence doesn’t go away.

    So while international courts will spend the next while sifting through video evidence of the Odsessa Fire, the Artillery bombardment of Eastern Ukraine and assorted antics of the Nuland Junta’s Neanderthal Guard, crack teams of psychiatrists will sift through material like this,

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIPfEBuA7HY

    Will they ever work out just why Dad’s friendship with RD proved such a disaster?

    Must go.

  185. RD:
    “As a social democrat I have always believed that markets are once of the best mechanisms for resource allocation but they do need effective regulation to prevent their worse excesses.”

    Your God ( the Thatcherian Market ) died in 2008. Has it been resurrected to judge over us on the Day of Judgement, who bagged the most tiddlywinks?

    These two trolls are like Laurel and Hardy trying to put up a sign over a Jewish shop.

  186. Ben-LA PACQUTE LO ES TODO

    9 Jun, 2014 - 3:13 pm

    ‘Will they ever work out just why Dad’s friendship with RD proved such a disaster?”

    It’s been a hard slog, sofia. :)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W50L4UPfWsg

  187. Erm, New Labour hasn’t existed for years Craig.

  188. YouKnowMyName

    10 Jun, 2014 - 8:31 am

    Rif: Mary at 3:16pm

    Deutsche Bank worried…

    According to http://euobserver.com/news/124508 “EU ruling could open floodgates on cartel lawsuits”
    Quote: Individuals can claim compensation from cartels even if they did not buy products from one of the companies involved, the EU’s top court has ruled.

    In a verdict on Thursday (5 June), the European Court of Justice stated that companies that participate in cartels are responsible for the losses caused by competitors being forced to raise their prices.

    Thursday’s judgement could open the floodgates for a slew of private damages claims, but has particular implications for the commission’s ongoing cartel investigation into the Libor rate-fixing scandal…

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