The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
tim v
could you please give us a media link for that or else is that kind of conspiracy from another blog? Thanks.
His father has already died. But why would his late father …. ? I mean, Paraguay or Brasil I would understand when there is a good reason because of a perhaps criminal background. However, the UK, that’s just another EU country? What kind of sense would that make for an old guy who is anyway already living in the EU with a French EU Schengen passport?
Question: Were the Molliers actually British assets? Inside the French nuclear industry. Two British assets meet or using Mollier to test SAH? Possibilities.
I agree Bluebird 18 Nov, 2012 – 9:09 pm. Strange ain’t it? This is the particular communication from a chap who seems pretty well informed on weaponry and generally sceptical enough to sound genuine.
“The empty magazines are a slight question – but to fire 25 shots, you need 3 magazines emptied (the last will stay in the pistol) plus one round initially in the chamber (unsafe practice, but-). The way automatics throw spent cartridges about the landscape, finding all those might take hours and would certainly not have been attempted.
Meanwhile, for a coincidence, may I comment that Luger probably means liar – it is not quite the normal German for it but a logical form (as well as an automatic pistol mechanism). While a French correspondent sends me a tale that Mollier’s father had been treating with the enemy – applying for UK citizenship. ”
That’s it!
Do we now need to check whether Roger Mollier’s death in or about June 2011 is suspect?
I did wonder about a week ago why we hadnt ever seen his photo even though he was president of the Rugby Club. I thought that very odd.
If you read EMs info about casings he said 25 were found relating to an antique Luger. How about the bullets removed from bodies, may be a totally different type. The Luger casings just spread around to mislead.
I was searching for some previous killings closely related to the LaRouche movements and then I found that one. I believe that TROW would enjoy to read that. Indeed that story is very similar to what he says about his “Hershkovitz actor”. I hope I am not waking up already dead horses now, however, finally we can only become successful when we accept any of the theories and try to follow them up, as strange as those might read.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Jeremiah_Duggan
+++++
BTW: The NASA Laser science guy (project SQUID) John A. Shirley can’t be my John Andrew Shirley. HE IS NOT THE RIGHT GUY. My error! His age won’t fit. He would have to be at least 5 years older since I don’t trust him to be a member of a scientific study regarding laser spectrometry science at the young age of 19. That other guy must be from CT but not from Indiana and I linked another one in CD who was born in 1943.
Therefore we have to stick with his apparent Airforce background in Battle Creek 172d Airforce Unit. That is confirmed. The airforce and the Navy are completely filled up with members all having the name Shirley and coming from Texas since 1850. His father Robert Louis Shirley (name confirmed!) was apparently working at Travis airforce base. John Andrew Shirley was born in Travis (TX) in 1961.
Sorry for my previous error regarding that NASA Laser guy! Bird-Sh*t happens.
Bluebird…
I remember that death.
His mother started a campaign due to how the Germans run an investigation…and come up with “suicide”.
Even if he was chased, it was his actions…or something like that.
I don’t know German law.
Did I read somewhere that he was “fancying” himself as a journalist….and wanted to investigate the group.
Hence he stayed on with them.
It was unclear why he was running that night, but having been hit once by one vehicle, he was then hit again by another.
Can’t remember why the Germans closed the case.
It was to do with the “verdict” (suicide)…and they don’t reopen those cases (something like that !).
@ Trowbridge H. Ford 18 Nov, 2012 – 11:46 am
“Would hardy trash the Aspen Forum as just another stop on the military-industrial junket circuit, NR, when many of the leading current covert operators were there, especially NSA Director General Keith Alexander, and Admiral Bill McRaven, current Commander of the Special Operations Command, key players in the anticipated showdown with Iran’s mullahs.”
My point was that it’s unlikely there’s any high level nefarious plotting going on. The big names are there as the draw, and I doubt they are whispering behind the potted palms conspiring to bomb Iran on 21 Dec 12 and blame it on the Mayan calendar.
It’s worth a lot to small companies and operators to say, “I lunched with Gen. P.” (along with 1000 others) and maybe a photo op of him giving you the famous hand-clasp – a Masonic grip I’m sure. 🙂 to hang on their office wall.
It’s not even “confidential” level. “Daily video highlights from the Security Forum will be posted at” http://www.aspensecurityforum.org
Information on the 2013 Aspen Security Forum will be available in the fall with passes going on sale to the general public on November 15, 2012.
The Aspen Instutue is a non-profit that runs many forums. Couldn’t find fees for the security one, but here’s another:
Aspen Environment Forum 2012
General Forum Pass: $1,500.00
Society of Fellows Forum Pass: $1,200.00
Patron Pass: $3,000.00
For funny aside, I was at one such affair, seen chatting with someone high-level, and when I left was followed by sales persons I knew begging for an introduction, going so far as to offer bribes, like 2 weeks in Hawaii, which I refused because it was an insultingly low bribe considering the multi millions at stake. You think Mrs. B. & Mrs K. received some nice gifts for access to their generals?
It’s good to know the Terrorist Community is having problems with email just like the Intelligence Community. The Taliban accidentally did a cc: instead of a bcc: on their mailing list to journalists, revealing to all who was on the list, which some preferred to keep private.
NR
On the email CC, was “Ronny” found there !!!!
@Bluebird
thanks for the Indianapolis research.
Jan Able talked to the press. Is 8354 between two destroyed houses? (8349 and 8355) Or across the road?
Able’s daughter and son-in-law live a few streets from Able, so she and her husband are staying with them.
Jan Able says nothing about where she was at the time of the explosion. Strange. You would have thought the Ables would have been top candidates for injury or death. What happened to their house?
More here from Jan:
http://www.indystar.com/article/20121110/NEWS/121110035/2-dead-after-explosion-levels-2-homes-damages-18-others-Indianapolis-Southside
Update: 10:15 a.m.
Dan Able described his family’s home as a “total loss.”
“There was glass all over the floor,” he said. “And structural damage.”
The Ables escaped their home but weren’t able to take any of their belongings.
“I didn’t get anything,” Jan Able said. “It was so terribly frightening.”
But the Ables did manage to rescue one thing: Their 5-year-old miniature poodle mix, Bella
[Lots of good photos and video in the link]
@Bluebird: My bet is 0 and 0. It seems I have to catch up again.
@ straw44berry 18 Nov, 2012 – 2:17 pm
“Do you think its possible that someone was flying a simulator to do it and they were actually without knowing flying the real planes remotely using the simulator?”
That is a fiendishly clever idea. Some agency should put you on their payroll. Hopefully they can find you easily, even though they didn’t know nuttin about the generals’ emails.
Felix
First i thought the same like you. But then i checked google maps.
The Ables’ house was opposite side of that street. Longworth were next to the Shirley house. The house next to Longworth on the same side of that street was 8403.
Longworth lived next to the explosion.
Felix
see Photo 38.
One house was on sale. Whose house was it?
@ James 18 Nov, 2012 – 10:34 pm NR
“On the email CC, was “Ronny” found there !!!!”
I don’t know. I’m ashamed to say I’m not important enough to be on the Talibani mailing list. It’s like what I heard about Nixon in the old days, that people were humiliated to find they were not important enough to be on his enemies list. No more good tables at Sans Souci for them, and no more overheard tidbits of gossip from Henry.
Who is “Ronny”? That’s how far out of the loop I am.
Straw44berry
18 Nov, 2012 – 9:19 pm two things struck me – both SAH and Mollier had lost their fathers recently. Do we know the certified cause of death in both cases? Could foul play been a factor known to SAH that raised his anxiety?
Also the well known psychological impacts on bereavement. To continue the work, to do better, to make good the loss, to right the wrongs.
” Despite cultural disapproval and lack of validation by professionals, survivors find places for the dead in their on-going lives and even in their communities. Such bonds are not denial: the deceased can provide resources for enriched functioning in the present.”
Did they have a history of working together? Did the loss of their fathers create a common bond?
of course we must distinguish between casings and the fatal lead bit Straw44berry
18 Nov, 2012 – 9:22 pm the former ending up wherever the gun mechanism ejects it, the shot remaining wherever it stops embedded in the person or whatever is in its path. the police will have all this from which much can be deduced yet astoundingly they apparently “have no leads”! and not a word about the masses of telecommunication information that they must have.
Felix
Daniel Able is a department supervisor (human resources) for the government of indiana.
Not a really suspicious job. We can forget the Ables.
Do we know the name of Moncy Shirley’s boyfriend?
Katie
17 Nov, 2012 – 9:33 am sorry katie, no i didnt know that
NR
I put “Ronny”…and Ronald Reagan, but my post didn’t seem to carry that.
Ronny was Al Q’s best friend way back back when. But that was when Al Q were called something else..and the Russians were hand in glove with the Afgan Govt. Guess times change.
One of my best pics though is…
( http://whitenoiseinsanity.com/2009/04/20/remember-when-reagan-met-with-taliban-leaders-in-the-white-house/ )
Always worth a giggle.
I may be sounding stupid here…
But which house actually has a gas main ?
Olifant
17 Nov, 2012 – 4:10 pm not sure where u got this but i thought references to ire and tablets interesting –
al Hilli had threatened al-Maliki in an encrypted message that will be announced and published these TABLETS of the means media if not paid Maliki government financial amount of two billion U.S. dollars has been expressed al Hilli before his death to one close to him that he owns the disks and documents no less important than discs that were conceived way demolition and shrine bombing Ali al-Hadi peace be upon him and this is what raised the IRE of the owner and his party and push them to liquidate Iraqi businessman Saad al Hilli in Paris with his family even disappear with him all secrets is expected that there will be a third party entered the line issue a vague personal so far he has not issued any statement or news about these discs so far has been in the accounts of al-Maliki said Do not REMOVE THESE TABLETS at this critical period that Maliki wants to renew for a third term, which can be for these TABLETS THAT BREAK the back of al-Maliki and infuriatingly media
APROPOS combe d’re, moses and smashing the tablets – you’ll remember the point i’m sure. did the killers steal computer discs? don’t i remember some mention by WBM or PD to searching Mollier’s person?
Kathy
17 Nov, 2012 – 10:35 pm Israel must be desperate to improve their reception in Washington now the republicans lost the presidential elections but of course they still control both houses. i always got the impression petraeus was a bit of a pragmatist and increased troop numbers to control violence and get them out of there. we could easily have a repeat of jfk.
Uhhhhh olifant
That is Hot.
The direct ascendants of Ali al Hadi are called Naqvis ( Nackvis). They reside in Pakistan.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ali_al-Hadi
The Nackvis were tge ones standing so close to Dion Longworth. Fawad Nackvi (pakistan) working with him since many years and javed nackvi being the british gov. of defence star .
There we are! This is no coincidence. SAH blackmails maliki because of the shrine bombing and a guy so close to the nackvis gets killed.
This is no coincidence.
Olifant, i believe that you just opened the box of the pandora. What you posted here makes all sense now. SAH gave the documents to LaRouchePAC or else he planned to give them the documents and discs.
And those documents were not only about the false flag shrine bombings …
Never really thought of this before ….
Combe d’Ire is Valley of Wrath ! What the **** !
“…and this is what raised the IRE of the owner and his party and push them to liquidate Iraqi businessman Saad al Hilli in Paris”
Raised the wrath, in the Valley of Wrath !
Olifant
And the bombed mosque where the shrine is, is being called al askari mosque.
An “al askari” is the leader of the swedish larouche group.
Another coincidence?
Hot track …
Killed in Paris ?
Moved to the “valley of Wrath” (Combe d’Ire) ?
Felix
18 Nov, 2012 – 11:44 pm any more thoughts anybody on the very clear lateral force of the explosion? it’s very pronounced. missiles or HE when they go off tend to do 360 destruction unless physical factors intervene. what ever has gone off in the middle has sent the shoch wave sideways with very little dammage to even closest prop across the street it seems