The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
Talking of photo’s look at row six 2nd pair the journalists are pointing at something of interest ,I think its some marks on the ground .
http://www.apimages.com/Search.aspx?st=k&remem=x&entity=&kw=chevaline&intv=None&shgroup=-10&sh=10#d
I am reading back over some old threads ATM its amazing how sharp some of the early posters were when I look back ,if I come up with a nugget I will let you know .
So far I have seen this about the BMW handling it had Dynamic stability control means nothing to me but might be relevant in analysing tyre marks.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=GB&hl=en-GB&v=ncE-Vk7egRo
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/the-massacre-in-the-alps-8120164.html
“There is clear evidence, written into the mountainside by Mr al-Hilli’s car, that he knew he was about to die. The BMW was reversed at speed into the near-vertical bank beside the parking area. Gouge marks, two feet up the embankment, were visible when the site was reopened to the press and public on Friday afternoon.”
Sorry, link above didn’t work:
There is another BMW pic I haven’t seen: passenger side on flatbed lorry square-on view.
http://www.sipa.com/en/asset/content/zoomOnly/1/id/16384789
Morning all.
I’ve had a friend who lives in Switzerland staying for a few days, he travels a great deal & amongst the things we did during his stay was shop for a Thule …believe it or not !
Needless to say I took particular interest in the product.
I can tell you that …in my view…there is not a cat in hells chance of a killer getting away unseen with one.
For a start it would be impossible on a motor bike & very obvious rammed into the back of a Pajero, even the smallest one.
James, bring the link here of when BM ‘said’ he observed something on the roof of the BMW !
I suggest that’s another flight of fancy on your part.
UNBELIEVABLE !
“James, bring the link here of when BM ‘said’ he observed something on the roof of the BMW”
READ THE POST !
I didn’t. I said he “presented” his version of events AND may have been requested that he DOES NOT mention “the box”.
Why is it, I am away you say nothing, I return and you “question” valid points ???
You claim to “look at a roof box” and put forward an “expert view” ?
One, you were wrong on probate.
Two you know nothing of satellite phones.
AND now you’re an expert on roof boxes ????
Yet you cannot explain the marks (consistent with the carriage of a roof box) on the BMW ?
You cannot expalin the broken roof rack (other than saying Al Hilli arrived with it already broken !)
Katie (or is it Kookie) who pays you ????
I have worked you out Kookie.
You forward a view, then change that view whilst claiming you never mentioned it !
Odd behaviour ?
You then “question” relevant points by “misquoting” the actual post !
Yep, you a minor worker for someone. I did think a retired “public worker”. Now I relaise you are still working.
Albeit badly !
@All
My posts…
“I don’t believe that at all (although I don’t know) and I believe that “something” was held ontop of that vehicle”.
AND
“Further, I believe that Mr Martin (a trained airline capt, a trained check capt and former Fast Jet weapons instuctor) did see Al Hilli (ahead or passing him) and that he “observed” a container on that vehicle”.
Kookie’s posted remarks
“James, bring the link here of when BM ‘said’ he observed something on the roof of the BMW” !
Now “all”.
You decide what Kookie’s game is ?????
You’re barking James …. I know more about satellite phones than you will ever know, the said friend actually owns one, oh & his own plane !
NR 7.50 am
Jacintha Saldanha is the suicided nurse who passed the hoax call from the Queen to another nurse who shared personal info about the Duchess of Cambridge.
I agree that the aerial photos there are new but probably from the same helicopter. Difficult to see a great deal of detail even from the larger thumbnail though.
Odd that no papers have thought it worthwhile to pay to use some of these. Even slightly different angles in photos are newsworthy in this case now.
Kookie…
@All will decide if you posts are worthy of note.
Personally, I find a large amount of monies contained in a Swiss Bank account (which WOULD NOT be contained in a Will for obvious and clearly stated reasons) to be relevant.
And a broken roof rack, captured on film (photographic) which has not been commented on by the investigation team, the mainstream media or by witnesses involved in this incident, to be relevant.
With regard you (Kookie), I find you utterly irrelevant.
And am sure many here feel the same way.
Excellent news James, so, as I’m ‘irrelevant’ to you maybe you will stop posting running comments insulting me, four in as many hours is showing me far too much attention. & contrary to what you say…….. but typical of you. lol .
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-20673899
Off topic but link for NR to latest news on Hoax nurse death. Autopsy to take place today.
@James
Honestly, when will you ever learn?
Katie is an expert on everything!!!
😀
Do you remember when I announced I was going to release a bombshell re WBM’s signatures, and she suddenly posted her credentials in graphology, to try and establish her credibility before the announcement?
And then she did her “pouring cold water” technique immediately after the announcement?
Just another example. Glad you’ve worked her out too.
Now her friend’s been off shopping for a Thule and she is suddenly an expert on roofboxes.
And her friend has a satellite phone. And his own plane. Oooer. I suppose that makes her an expert on satellite communication, and on flying!!!
Har har har har har.
😀
Oh, forgot to mention, Katie calls James “barking” but then complains he insults her. What was that about the pot and the kettle?
@Juno
11 Dec, 2012 – 11:49 am
I noticed a number of MSM reports actually put the word ‘suicide’ in inverted commas .. like they don’t necessarily believe it.
A terrible tragedy, nevertheless.
@Ferret
I did ! Honest I did. I learnt.
But then read MORE of “it’s” madness.
And you just find yourself replying !
I was away and just recapped…only to find that Bluebird had a run in with Kookie’s “logic” !
“It” just starts “misquoting quotes” and firing out rubbish !!!
How does “it” manage to do it ?
Tim V
10 Dec, 2012 – 8:06 pm
Agree with all you say Tim. The more I read the more confused I get not less.
Did the decoraters who noted the Al Hilli Car passing note the Didierjohn car passing, or BM. Could they all have been in car park when the Al Hillis arrived.
When the altercation took place (for whatever reason, I dont know), one of the Al Hilli woman put emergency call through on a satellite phone which I am convinced a man like Saad would have working in the industry. Anyone I know working in computer or satellite industry is big on having the latest gagetry, and Saad being a man who travels to France, Spain, Iraq and who knows where else would need to have contact with business, especially being dependent on contract work.
The emergency call having been made the assailants attempting to finish the job heard distant sirens, put through their own emergency call and moved down hill, knowing they could make it no further.
The other cars and bikes may (in my opinion) also have been involved and scattered in different directions, taking gun(s) etc and whatever else they had come for with them.
This is just a view I have looking at the overall picture.
This was one crowded car park.
Were we ever sure that the marks seen were blood stains or marks left by police.
I do not think this was an extraction, too complicated. A boating accident on the lake would have been so easy to stage.
I also do not believe Zainab was as injured as stated, as you say, she was back in England an in foster care very rapidly.
I believe this family knew they were in danger in their day to day lives, not necessarily on that specific day, and had trained the children to run and hide quietly when told, as children are taught during war time. One child hiding under mothers skirts, whilst other hiding in bushes but being heard or seen.
Will we ever really know.
@Ferret.
Back to reality.
Still nada from the mainstream writers on the broken roof rails.
I did think that the “over fly” was a “staged” one, but now thinking it wasn’t.
Haven’t any proof it was/wasn’t staged. Merely the fact that A. The roof of the BMW can be seen clearly and B. Not one word released about it.
Add to that, WBM didn’t mention anything about the Al Hilli’s passing him (or ahead of him) and yet the “timings” would indicate a strong likelyhood WBM would have been insight of that vehicle at some point.
@James
I know, it’s incredible, isn’t it?!
@James
11 Dec, 2012 – 12:33 pm
I sussed ‘Katie’ long ago when it kept on about the colour of Saad’s underwear, or was it WBM’s?
A strange old bird which only manifests itself on this particular thread, as far as I can see!
And it’s not so skillful at dissembling and distracting as it’s MO is obvious for all to see.
How about telling us what your other blogs are, ‘Katie’ as Anders demanded aeons ago? And don’t go giving us that guff about your photo being plastered all over it. Marilyn’s photo is all over her blog at MZT. It couldn’t be ..?
Ferret, mocking Ferret……
I have NEVER & would never say I’m an expert on anything.
You once again insert words. I said graphology had been a hobby for a number of years…you then went off on a tangent demanding my qualifications etc. I let it go because I prefer to talk to adults not some fat bullying type, how is your weight these days old boy or are you still pretending not to know me ?
You & James suffer with the same fault , as does Mochyn at times, you see words which don’t exist & are desperate to make me a fake……….that speaks volumes on why you are here… [especially when you leap into arguments] you live in a fantasy world of conspiracy, trust nothing & no one in reality.
Unlike you I have no need to lie to anyone, I am what I am & as presented here.
If it doesn’t suit ‘you’…. you call it a lie.
Of course I’m so irrelevant neither of you can ignore me. Lol , you are both cranky suspicious jokers.
You & James need to grow up & maybe get off the drugs.
Forgot to mention Katie’s other trait… she goes for the jugular when cornered!
😀
Now apparently she still claims she knows who I am (on an anonymous board, har de har) and that I’m overweight and on drugs!
Har har har har har!!
😀
Thanks for another good one, “Katie”.
And think of the logic gap – if “Katie” really does know who I am from the board that she moderates (remember she claimed to have banned me?) – then I could tell you all what it was, couldn’t I???
Yet she refuses to publicise her web addresses…
WHOOOPS!!!
😀
Phew that felt good.
I am off now to continue chuckling about the chap posting here who called himself a ‘scientist’ on the first Al Hilli blog post.Lol….
I stayed silent but know different, yet look at how he accuses others of lies !!!
I do not believe the tyre marks at the sign end of the lay by can possibly be those of the BMW for reasons already given. As to his reverse manoeuvre it could ONLY be a short distance in a straight line. We are told SAH had Mollier’s blood on him so SAH MUST have been next to him outside with Zainab (similarly splashed) before he dived back in across the car, leaving Zainab and Mollier out side injured, Mollier mortally. So the police version of the tracks at the sign end is ruled out by the forensics in ADDITION to the geometry and vehicle engineering (locked slip diff etc) as already discussed. Now as to hitting the bank at speed and “gouginging into the bank” this must have been caused more by the spinning wheels than by impact. Two reasons for this: there is no apparent significant damage to the rear valence on the flatbed shot and perhaps more significantly the cap is still on the dash. A sudden deacceleration from speed would have surely dislodged it rearwards. So now can we at least agree the the tyre marks at the sign end, that appear to extend in a semi-circular direction towards the blood stains on the ground were NOT those of Al Hilli’s BMW?
Katie
11 Dec, 2012 – 9:04 am I think we can all agree a thule on a bike is out of the question but not at all implausible for a long wheelbase Pajero or simlar with back seats flat. I am still convinced this was a THREE MAN job. Driver and shooter in 4×4. Lookout (suitably tooled up) on bike. It fits modus. WBM worked both into his statement. Suspicious vehicles have both been separately spotted. Tyre marks match both types of vehicle. That builds up to be fairly circumstantially convincing. It also makes police interpretation of tracks and theory of one lone crazed killer very suspicious also. If we can see it I’m damn sure they must be able to. As usual Katie you seem to promote anything that undermines the blatently possible/likely.
Har har and har again!
😀
Your attempted smokescreen doesn’t hide the incongruous fact that if I’m really the person you claim to know, I could reveal the web address of your board which you keep saying is too sensitive to reveal!!
😀
@Ferret, @Mochyn …and indeed @all.
We are pretty rubbish at this investigation lark. Lets face it
Kookie had it cracked months ago. She did indeed tell us so.
Well, she didn’t “actually” tell us so to speak.
But it told us it had “cracked it”.
And with no help from “logic” or indeed “evidence”.
Amazing stuff indeed.
No wonder then it feels the need to post when “we” try to understand the “unknowns” or put together “the puzzle”.
As “we” stumble around in the darkness, Kookie KNOWS the truth.
Kookie HAS the answer.
Logic unapplied !
“I stayed silent but know different”
Like I said, Kookie KNOWS !
Well, knows little about English Law (even posting an article supporting that fact ! She really should read the articles she posts)
Knows little about “satellite phones”, but “knows” Saad had one (not only had one, but his wife could operate it, under fire AND put a call in to “Paris” ! Where or who in paris, she’s keeping to itself !)
Knows little about roof boxes (but her friend wants one, so she’s pretty much an expert…and the friend has a 172 SkyHawk ! Get him !)
Kookie…. you’re in the open as a “kook” !
@ james, ferret, katie
let’s make a summary please: “you agree to disagree”.
I do appreciate all your inout, james, ferret and katie. Not everybody is perfect every day and not everybody is in good mood every day. Please let’s the personal side off that board as it is getting tough to read for other when within 5 minutes there are 20 new posts that contain nothing but personal things that don’t interest me at all. You three are too important for that board as to waste your time in personal issues. I understood that you disagree in certain ways about certain issues. That’s ok and that happenes from time to time. But let’s try to avoid a long theatre about that disagreement. There was already too much Shakespeare and Moliere theatre set up regarding the al Hillis, BM, PD and Mollier.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moli%C3%A8re
Thanks for listening.
There is also the little matter of air bags that would presumably inflate automatically if impact frontwards or backwards was significant.