The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
Q
20 Feb, 2013 – 3:05 pm Point taken Q. When governments take action regarding the death or threat of death of nationals abroad, it is seldom without its inferences. In other words there is not a standard response. It can vary from virtual indifference to high profile intervention on behalf of the individuals concerned depending on all implications and interests. So we might expect a different reaction if for example the scientist was American dying in suspicious circumstances in Iran say, to the Australian dying in Canada an ostensibly friendly fellow Commonwealth nation, where reliance is placed on the probity of public bodies charged with the investigation. However there are always more sinister explanations for disinterest beside inherent apathy as for example it was agreed between secret complicit agencies, that the person killed was in fact an agent for the enemy or a risk when not too much interest or investigation might prove desireable. Heck! We have already seen how it works here in the case of Gareth Williams. As to Coroners, the Private Eye 1333 report into Bradford’s Coroner, Peter Straker, is sufficient cause to doubt the efficacy of the Inquest process to reveal the truth about any suspicious death.
Bluebird
20 Feb, 2013 – 3:10 pm Embalming – to preserve bodies as we all know. One Jewish one Muslim. I am reminded that the Al Hillis killed at Chevaline had to be embalmed as a condition of transfer to the UK (or from one country to another) Were they EXPECTING deaths for which an embalmer may come in handy? Incidentally we still do not know if a British Home Office pathologist was in on the the French autopsy because clearly once that formaldehyde courses through the veins there’s not much use for tissue samples.
Q
20 Feb, 2013 – 3:24 pm I don’t suppose Russell Williams could be implicated in the disappearance/murder? of Lachlan Cranswick?
@Tim V: I don’t suppose he would be implicated.
Q
20 Feb, 2013 – 4:28 pm I have just got to your suggestion which you will see I made above before I saw it. It can’t be ruled out can it and could explain both Zeena’s extrordinary long “sleep” and Zainab falling about and collapsing. If administered they might have a secondary attribute of interfering with memory. Drugged children would be less problematical if the plan was to abduct them. Then the famous ketamin much favoured by the gay community I understand with connections back to notable deaths here and there.
not to mention the drug of choice for HORSES.
We are told Zainab was put to sleep for therapuetic reasons, and it must have helped because in only a week she appears to be totally recovered from “gunshot” and “fractured skull”. What we don’t know is if any tests were done on here before the hospital treatment for tranquillizers in her system or Zeena’s. The pertinent question therefore remains: Were the two girls drugged before being admitted to hospital and were the necessary tests carried out?
@ Q : Other things in link you gave above:
“Details of the defendant: Ramin Pouladian-Kari, DOB 10/07/1966, of 2 Little Warren Close, Guildford, Surrey, GU4 8PW”
“Iran Tablo Co (ITC), based in Tehran.
3, Bradley Court, Epsom Rd, Guildford, Surrey GU1 3PF”
“Dr Pouladian-Kari was director of GTC Associates, a Surrey-based supplier company which was set up to source and supply components for ITC.”
http://www.iranwatch.org/government/UK/uk-hmrc–businessmanjailedforpotential-wmdexports-121211.htm
http://www.iranwatch.org/suppliers/records/gtc-associates.html
“David Levick… Australian national, and his Sydney-based company ICM Components Inc., have been indicted… allegedly arranged for shipment from the United States to Iran, via Australia, of shock mounted light assemblies and precision pressure transducers… Miniature Vertical Gyroscopes (used to control the pitch and roll of missiles and torpedoes), and Servo Actuators (used for aircraft steering).”
“Prospect Telecom in Switzerland”
“Mahmoud Yadegari, an Iranian-born Canadian citizen who ran a business in Toronto, was sentenced to 4 years and 3 months’ imprisonment after being found guilty, in Canada, of attempting to illegally export U.S.-origin pressure transducers to Iran through Dubai in March 2009.”
“Italian police arrested two Iranians and five Italians as part of an operation uncovering a ring supplying weapons to Iran from Italy and via third countries…. police said they foiled plans to export tracer bullets, explosives, German-made optical gear, helicopters… The Milan-based arms ring…”
http://www.iranwatch.org/enforcementnotebook/enforcement-newsummaries.htm
I’d wager these dudes had need of freight forwarding logistics for the complex routing of their deliveries.
@Tim V 21 Feb, 2013 – 2:03 am
“Bluebird 20 Feb, 2013 – 3:10 pm Embalming – to preserve bodies as we all know.”
Embalmers/funeral homes are useful for disposing of bodies. As used by the first Godfather. Or they could supply a substitute corpse where needed, provided the medical examiner didn’t look too closely.
Wonder if this is from where BM’s name is derived: “William Brett, 1st Viscount Esher. In 1885 he was raised to the peerage as Baron Esher, of Esher in the County of Surrey.”
There are William J Brett, Croydon, Surrey, and Richard G Brett Gladys M Brett.
I think James commented this: “William brett Martin listed occupation is architectural engineering and consultancy.” Is BM having fun with “architectural engineering” = rebuilding old homes in France?
@ Bluebird: “Zygier’s wife is Maya Zalewsky. She is polish. She uses her name as Maya Zalewsky-Alin today. There was a facebook page and there still is a google link but it is gone.”
There’s a Facebook-like page in Polish. Doesn’t display properly for me, nor do the two “shlomi” links below .
“BENN ELGIN APOLLOQUEEN BENN ELGIN APOLLOQUEEN BENN ELGIN
“… scurry broyles william ippolito hembree nelson mcghie rosinski fairweather hollis rubino redrick eshelman purdy herren maya zalewski buckwalter hanna weldon … ”
#fb*shlomi sammy* פידיעות אחרונות
http://www.paper.li/shlomisammy#!media
“maya zalewski Shared by … A newspaper by shlomi sammy”
#fb*shlomi sammy* פידיעות אחרונות
http://www.paper.li/shlomisammy#!media
“maya zalewski … blog.peta.org.uk – We’ve teamed up with Jersey Shore‘s Mike “The Situation” Sorrentino to combat a really serious situation”
From blog.peta.org.uk it appears she’s an animal activist, but objects to PETAs tactics.
“Maya, CVT commented: May 13, 2008 2:12 PM”
“Michelle Hey there… I should mention that I am not objecting to the featured KFC ad mostly the other things I mentioned. The sad thing for me is that I DO know how great PETA staffers are and I think that just a few over the top PETA stunts overshadow all of their efforts.”
“Michele commented: May 13, 2008 1:29 PM”
“I just came from a 3day conference at their Norfolk headquarters and it was the most uplifting AMAZING experience! They always have a huge spike in their website traffic whenever they are mentioned regarding one of these “controversial” ads or stories.”
“Ana commented: May 9, 2008 5:36 PM”
“Hi Maya I have no problem with your perceptions but your constant negativity has really gotten old.”
I am still following along I just don’t know anything of the areas you have been covering until you hit on the drugged idea .
Being a farm girl I am familiar with this drug as it used to be used quite a bit on large animals and was dangerous for the vets so they had to carry an antidote .
I don’t know how anyone would administer it to a wriggling victim it can be absorbed if sprayed and I do know of a vet who got a dose from a syringe that pulled out and and sprayed his face and he had to rush off to hospital, it would be risky to the person using it if they got any on them .
The staggering of Zainab would fit as an imperfect dose would mean that it would be slower to act but once it does act they are immobilized and unable to react to anything.
I think it fits well with PD and EM thinking she was dead and then the quick recovery after treatment at hospital as well.
The fact they held on to SM for further tests becomes a bit clearer going down this route.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etorphine
Tim V – I liked your 2:32 PM – I think periodically we need to bring the focus back to Chevaline shenanigans,
Also, I am beginning to think that people may be right – Zeena must have been “tranquilized” to stay so quiet for 8 hours! and Zainab, that’s a possibility. I said before that just about in any scenario – murder of all, murder of some, extraction of some or all, whatever, the children present a problem. To this day. The fact that they cannot be allowed to be raised by their own family is a travesty, which can only be explained by “security” reasons, not theirs necessarily. Something is very wrong.
And the fact that the family is not raising heaven and earth to get more time with the children AND fight for custody is beyond strange. Arabic families are extremely close. The “distancing” we are witnessing is way atypical. I reckon they must be torn up, especially Iqbal’s sister.
Conclusion: same as with Maya Zalewski-Alon – keep quiet for your own good. Don’t rock the boat too much.
That being said, can anyone imagine the difficulties Maya is facing in Israel? she is no doubt partly ostracized and partly over-protected. She can no longer have a facebook or twitter, or a pipl profile or linkedIn, which in Israel is like living in internal exile. Life there is a bit like in a cult – you are either “in” or you are barely existing. There’s talk of millions in compensation, so perhaps that might help.
But there’s a person I really do feel sorry for and that’s Zygier’s sister, who is disabled and bravely trying to live an ordinary life. I won’t give her name here (easy enough to find). Even I have my limits of privacy busting nosiness. I doubt BTW her links will lead us anywhere anyways. I do not extend the same courtesy to Geofffrey Zygier however. He raised his son to be a fervent zionist – that when they lived and were integrated in a perfectly excellent country – Australia – where many people around the world would be lucky to live. Sometimes, there’s a price to pay for dual loyalty (actually, is it dual or is it mostly loyalty for israel – the Likud version?).
I guess i went off on a tangent. Oh well, seems like we all do around here.
Thinking about if you are covered from head to toe in motorcycle gear you would be pretty well protected from accidental spillage
Q 11:42PM – thanks for the tip. Interesting – Al Hilli lines….I do recall the issue of ferries coming up but at the time I didn’t pay too much attention. Got to go back and revisit…..
Bluebird: general question about LinkedIN: whenwe look at the column that says “also viewed by” are we just seeing what others may have been looking for? that ocvcurred to me in relation to Geoffrey Zygier and maya Alon. It seems that others may have gone down the same trail we have and checked all the available/listed Maya Alons.
The particular Geoffrey Zygier you provided has only one word under the profile; “Israel”. Which is perculiar. I think the profile has been scrubbed already.
can you enlighten?
One more comment on agencies in discord: there are efforts apparently underway in israel to rewrite the Ben Zygier tale. Mossad must be going around kicking up dust storms to divert from Milan Italy and to deflect the date of arrest of prisoner X. that pipl listing for benjamin Zygier with residence in Milano, Italy, is claimed to be now for someone els bearing that name. Mossad is also deflecting from the multiple name changes by ben Zygier.
In addition, there are “disclosures” in israel that his prison cell was not ‘suicide proof” and that he got a full trial etc.
The other campaign is to discredit the lawyer Avigdor Feldman who saw him a day or two before his death and said he was in no way suicidal.
Stay tuned for the flak and believe absolutely nothing you hear from israel – they are in full cover-up mode, reinventing and rewriting anything and everything.
Now, that kind of frentic behavior – really does remind me of the messy pathetic cover-up of Chevaline, as well as Gareth Williams before that. perhaps Mossad that’s so good at assassinations has gotten so used to getting away with crap that they didn’t bother hiring good script writers. Honestly, is that the best they can do?
This imobilon idea fits what we have heard very well from what BM observed about Zainab staggering and suddenly collapsing to PD clapping his hands and getting no reaction I can see why he would have done that now ,the fact that SAH was in a normal geared car but his foot stayed on the gas after death ,lack of any fingerprints dna etc as would need to be well protected from the drug ,if SM was the target then all that covering up might have obscured the noise of the car arriving plus the river noise ,at a stretch it might explain letting the clock run for so long before moving the bodies I am not sure how Imobilon would behave in a dead person but you wouldnt be able to give the antidote .
I am not so good at seeing why anyone would bother if they had a gun in the first place.
Many excellent new finds last night. There is a lot of activity now. Great!
Linkedin:
I do not 100% know how it works although i did test this with friends. However, i know for sure that linkedin is financially owned by the same Khazar hedge fund as Allot, Amdocs and Elbit. With other words said: Whitewashing and fake could be easy and usual on linkedin.
I dont think that as a normal registered linkedin user you are getting your name anywhere on linkedin automatically and not without confirmation, otherwise there would be always journalists and investigators listed on top. That makes no sense. I did test it a year before. When you are logged in with your own account and then e.g. Tom Bluebird is visiting a linkedin page, e.g. Ali al Hilli’s, then the owner of the other page, is receiving a message thatTom Bluebird has visited your site. Do you want to link with him? If he says “nay”, then nothing happens. If he says “yes”, user Tom Bluebird receives a message that Ali al Hilli wants to link with him. If Tom Bluebird says “yes” then Tom Bluebird is listed in Ali al Hilli’s page and Ali al Hilli is listed in Tom Bluebird’s page. If Tom Bluebird says “nay”, nothing happens.
I think Gassing or drugging the girls would be the way to go and does fit with the confusing and changed reports, it would explain why the girl would not move or shout out in the car and may explain the coma like symptoms for the girl that was first announced deceased.
That would fit in with the Mossad MO, the gun that had probably been modified to fire a different calibre to match a
weapon that would be accessible in the region (from old WWII collections), the motorbike used has been used in more Mossad operations than I can count.
Really if you put that all together it is a planned and orchestrated murder by a highly organised organisation that
could carry out this operation and get away with it.
Marlin
On linkedin we have several accounts of Ben Zygier aka Ben Alon aka Ben Zigler aka Ben Okada aka Amnon Ben-Alon and probably many more. We have also several linkedin accounts of Maya Zygier aka Maya Zalevsky, Maya Zalevski, Maya Zalevski-Alon, Maya Okada, Maya Alon.
It is useless because we do not know about what is fake and what is real. They both obviously used different names, different personalities, different life histories, different fake education, for whatever job they actually had to do. When I want to spy in an engineering company then i need an education and previous jobs as an engineer. If i want to spy in an aviation company, then i should present education and jobs for aviation. And i should not use the same name and documents for every new job.
We do not even know how Zygier looked like. The photo in the telegraph isnt Zygier’s but David Schwartzmann’s face (who had “worked” with him afor Allot).. Zygier had a different face on previously released photos.
We even find Talia Devanderschueren aka Talia Schwartzmann with totally different background of life and education but same photos.
It isnt unlikely that there was/is a spy group who are/were swapping names in order to do certain jobs. We do not really know about whi was whom, but we know that they did pose as Zygier, Zalewski, Okada, Schwartzmann, Devanderschueren and Alon. Probably more names involved there. I dont care. It’s all a fake world with fake documents like the Dubai assassination group had used fake/stolen documents.
It is quite posdible that Zygier never was in Milano and that e.g. Schwartzmann was using his name there while Zygier did another job somewhere else at the same time with e.g. Schwartzmann’s ID. We simply dont know but we should expect the unusual to happen in covert ops.
I agree with all of you here with the immobilisation spray suggestion. That makes sense for the children as well as for Saad being unable to move once he tried to escape with the car. Of course, when it was used, then Maillaud should have known this within the first 24 hours.
@ Marlin 21 Feb, 2013 – 7:51 am
“Sometimes, there’s a price to pay for dual loyalty (actually, is it dual or is it mostly loyalty for israel – the Likud version?).”
Australian Jews are arguing over your very points:
http://www.jta.org/ news/ article/ 2013/ 02/ 20/ 3120056/ prisoner-x-affair-raises-charges-of-dual-loyalty-for-australian-jews
Other Xs —
http://www.spacewar.com/reports Israels_Prisoner_X_isnt_the_first_999.html
Mailaud just sits in his office banging his head against the wall, you can imagine he the calls DGSE, “hey can I say this?…………No! can I interview him?………No”!
NR
Seems thst Maya Zalewski had a Mossad job to spy into PETA or more likely, to collect some hard core activists for their own purpose and sctivities. Could of course have been another employee of that organisation who used Maya’s name and ID at that time (ID swapping).
Animal rights activists are usually under surveillance of intelligence services as some animal rights organisations are also called to be “terror organisations”. No surprise when Mossad is trying to infiltrate those organisations to collect information. That is routine.
@ Pink 21 Feb, 2013 – 7:38 am
“The fact they held on to SM for further tests becomes a bit clearer going down this route.”
The strange burial of SM. They didn’t hold the body at a morgue and didn’t allow the family to cremate him, but instead “temporarily” buried him.
Makes one think of half-lives.
http://www.iranwatch.org
A case involved smuggling odd isotopes into Iran from Japan, I think.
Another coincidence, in the murder/suicide of the Johnsons up in Cromer, that Felix wrote of, their best friends were the funeral director and his wife. The director was the one Johnson called after killing his wife, but before killing himself.
In Cromer the funeral director, in top hat, walks in the procession of hearse and cars. No jazz band as in New Orleans and some Chinese funerals.
NR
GTC Associates is only 10 minutes from Allot Communications and Surrey Satellites offices in Guildford. You could walk or cycle that distance easily during your lunch break.
They used a Dubai front office to transfer the electronics to Iran? We must know what exactly Saad had worked for or done in Dubai before obviously Hezbollah did pushbeautiful “Iqbal Mata Hari” into his bedroom in Dubai
Actually…..
They say the eldest girl didn’t make it to the car.
Hence she was outside.
But what if she was inside the car.
Would we expect her to make an escape…towards a gunman who’s outside ?
She may try to escape though, if there was a “gas” in the car.
Lets say from a canister fired through a window.
Confused and dazed and in a panic from the immediate “local” situation, you’d try to escape OUTSIDE.
The “beating” and “head injuries” give reason for her “staggering”.
Not that she was shot in the shoulder.
They would have to say that…as a “gas grenade” carrying “lone nut” would simply not fit.
One event has to lead to another and another…for the story to fit.
So start at the end….and work logically backwards until you have to stop.
It would seem that Surrey is indeed a hot bed for trade between Iran and “anywhere” !
What if the reason for holding Zygier incommunicado was the economic damage it would cause if he revealed “something”? Like if he knew where the backdoors and trojans were in the code of the product(s) he was allegedly selling from Milan. Some of his friends said he blabbed too much anyway, and Israel decided it couldn’t trust him.
That would be something that would be quickly verifiable by others and result in a huge stink if it wasn’t only in what was sold to Iran, but to other countries and companies as well.
There was annoyance at the recklessness of “whoever” did Stuxnet because it was found infecting innocent parties’ software worldwide — factories, power plants — though to date it hasn’t caused any problems and allegedly precautions were taken to prevent it doing so.