Operation Flavius and the Killer Cameron 264


Exactly twenty years ago the European Court of Human Rights found that the British Government had acted illegally in shooting dead three IRA members in Gibraltar, even though the court accepted that the government had a genuine belief that they were planning a bombing attack. Indeed the court accepted the victims were terrorists, and refused compensation to their families on those grounds. But the court refused to accept there was no possibility of foiling the plot through methods other than summary execution.

In the light of the decision that Operation Flavius contravened Article 2 of the European Convention on Human Rights, it is difficult to understand how the government can claim its killing of British men in Syria, with no trial, is anything other than murder. I personally find it difficult to imagine technically how men journeying in a car in Syria were imminently able to instantly wreak havoc in the UK so that it was impossible to prevent by any method other than their execution without trial. The level of certainty required for that decision would involve sufficient knowledge of what was to happen in the UK to stop it here. If there was vagueness about what was actually to happen in the UK, there cannot have been the certainty about the threat claimed. It is a logical impasse.

Frankly in twenty years of experience working with British security services their level of accuracy (remember Iraqi WMD) was never that good. And everybody is fortunately now deeply sceptical about the continual claims by the security services that there are thousands of dedicated Islamic terrorists in the UK conducting hundreds of plots every year, and yet miraculously never actually managing to kill anybody.

Just in case anybody had not worked out yet that the Guardian is a disgraceful neo-con rag, it has an article by its “legal correspondent” Joshua Rozenberg, married to the even more rabid Zionist militarist Melanie Phillips (who still believes the Iraqi WMD exist, hidden in the bed of the Euphrates). Rozenberg assures us it is absolutely legal for the British government to kill us without trial if it wants. He even suggests the murdered Mr Khan would not object:

“If he was waging war on British troops and civilians, he can hardly complain the UK’s armed forces were one step ahead of him.”

Astonishingly for a lawyer, the disgraceful Rozenberg does not seem to notice that the opening “if” is rather important. “If Mr Jones was engaged in insurance fraud, he can hardly complain at being banged up for twenty years”, so according to Mr Rozenberg we can dispense with all that nonsense about trials and evidence and just take the government’s word for it. Not to mention that the government has now instituted summary execution without trial in a country that does not even have the death penalty.

As I have argued, it is not unusual for British people to go to fight abroad. There were British citizens in the Israeli Defence Forces participating in the massacre of Palestinian civilians in Gaza last year. Our neo-con governments of both blue and red Tories have positively encouraged the mercenary companies Executive Outcomes/Sandline/Aegis of Tony Buckingham and Tim Spicer. There are Britons fighting now in the Ukraine. We started by positively encouraging factions in the Syrian civil war, with the Saudis and CIA arming and training them and some of those factions helped constitute ISIL. There is no evidence at all that Islamic State had any interest in attacks in the UK until we started to attack it. (That is not to say it is not a very bad organisation and did not commit actions against UK citizens in its “Caliphate area”. But it did not threaten the UK).

For the government to claim the right to kill British people through sci-fi execution, based on highly unreliable secret intelligence and a secret declaration of legality, is so shocking I find it difficult to believe it is happening even as I type the words. Are we so cowed as to accept this?


264 thoughts on “Operation Flavius and the Killer Cameron

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  • Ishmael

    Fuck America, Make sure these fascists never forget who they are, what they have done. I can’t stand the locals who live around me, clearly living in a dream world, shinning there nice fucking cars, permanent grins stuck on their face as they wallow in there credit funded luxury…. Shoving there girlfriends in my face or whatever shit they think makes them stand out. They have no fucking idea we are the bad guys, and could care less anyway.

    We have no fucking future as a result of this blind i’m ok jack mentality. Most labor under the illusion there are acutely responsible parents also…Ha…Someone’s probably going to eat your offspring for dinner… And it won’t be isis.

    Well I tell you this, i’ll not let them forget who the fuck they are. And I tire of helping maintain there quaint little illusions. I feel It’s time artist’s like myself help shatter this fucking bubble. And if without hope there is always vengeance.

    I’m just going though some old sid vicious interviews, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaPjk01vMJQ it’s people who embody this kind of spirit that the so called left should learn from. But just like all the wana be corporate boardroom fucking conservative interviewers, they pick at these curiosity’s who seem to be able to think for themselves and have some motivations other than money and social standing…

    And Yea, Sid, Drake, Barrett, kirt, lots of these actually nice people and up dead, and then there good ‘mates’ milk their spirit while really serving the most conservative corporate agenda, Rotten can kiss my ass the fucking sell out extraordinare…I really don’t get why they do it. Are they so fucking worthless. RHCP is the same. The story just fucking repeats.

    Do you still have a home that’s not bombed? a family without murdered members? Then why serve this fucked up system…? why arn’t people putting a fucking spanner in the works?

    This is not a conservative country, and Yvette cooper can kiss my ass. I don’t know her at all, it’s that’s exactly why….To find out i’d have to go to corporate media, where as Jeremy was made known to me by grass-roots support. Not that our system isn’t totally fucked up but at least some seem not totally empty shells ready to be filled by corporate fascist funding to hoist them upon the masses. .

    If these corporations think the 60s was a time of troubles, they ain’t seen nothing.

    Get some self respect people. No achievement in our system can give you that, and most take it from you. Really what hardship do most face by none compliance? Even buskers act like small business owners nowadays. I tell you the only thing that cheers me up atm is the graphite saying fuck the police in the local underpass. But local councils are filling them in a fast as they can….

    People just stand by like gormless twat’s as the country is sold off, NHS, Post service (advertised in the fucking guardian no less) ….Really, FUCK LIKING PEOPLE, it’s really not helping things.

  • Old Mark

    I don’t think the people posting negative comments on that Facebook page are independence supporters. Anyone can post to it.

    Craig- one of the posters is from UKIP and is open about it; that poster clearly thinks most of the others are SNP voters up for conversion, given that many on the thread are expressing doubts about the SNPs Welcome the World rhetoric

  • Ba'al Zevul

    Asia/Europe…

    Just to add to the pointless bickering which ignores the idea that if I say ‘Europe’ you know what I mean, without bothering with the details, and which requires that we attribute sinister motives to the nomenclature…the region called Asia by the Romans consisted of central and eastern Anatolia. Hence calling anything to the east of the Bosphorus ‘Asia’ would have become fairly explicable as the Roman Empire faded away. We still have European and Asian Turkey, notion*ally divided on that basis.

    *In Asiatic Turkey –

    http://www.kusadasi.net/historical/notion.htm

    Mood music:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AP1sDu65XKI

  • Republicofscotland

    The Mayor of Calais Natacha Bouchart let rip at David Cameron, over the refugee crisis, but here’s the thing, 3500 refugees gather every day to protest outside the mayors office.

    She in turn replies to them if you want to stay in France you must claim asylum, surprisingly less than 10% want to remain in France…..strange.

  • Mark Golding

    Hi mark golding,

    You recently signed a petition on the UK Government and Parliament Petitions website for: Benjamin Netanyahu to be arrested for war crimes when he arrives in London: https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/105446

    The Committee considered this petition, along with the Government’s response, on Tuesday 8 September.

    Because the Government said in its response that the request made by the petition was something that it was not able to do under UK and international law, the Committee agreed that it would not take any further action on the petition.

    It is still open to MPs who want a debate on this issue to find other opportunities, such as an application to the Backbench Business Committee: http://www.parliament.uk/bbcom

    You can use this link to find out who your local MP is and how to contact them: http://www.parliament.uk/mps-lords-and-offices/mps/

    You can see all the decisions the Petitions Committee made at its meeting here: http://www.parliament.uk/business/committees/committees-a-z/commons-select/petitions-committee/news-parliament-2015/8-sept-committee-decisions/

    Click this link to view the petition “Benjamin Netanyahu to be arrested for war crimes when he arrives in London”:

    https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/105446

    Thanks,
    The Petitions team
    UK Government and Parliament

  • Ishmael

    Refugee’s…

    I guess most have had a life front more interesting than sitting in front of the TV, or taking orders all day. Some new blood, other influence. I Could not be happier about this.

    It’s a real opportunity and shows what real people can be about. And that’s not letting the US wrecking ball roll over human life without any regard, something most politicians, corporate media, are LETTING happen or actively complicit in…

    It has to be the most shameless display of greed in history. With vast resources like the mankind has never known. But that’s all theirs you understand, they earned it all by honest hard work. Ps The Refugees are just hear because they are backward, nothing to do with us honest kind thrifty capitalists. opps sorry “Conservatives”…

  • Peter Beswick

    Cameron will shun the law whenever it suits him, Blair proved its easy to do but less easy to get away with in the eyes of the public.

    But caring what the public think is not important to politicians once they have been elected so I was surprised at the PR push to get this story out.

    Justice, long since, became a thing of political expediency but blowing up British citizens and bragging about it is even a “departure” for our PM.

    It was Cameron who announced to parliament that he would not allow an inquest into the death of Dr David Kelly, in the same breath he said the Madeleine McCann investigation was more pressing and important; so much so that more has been spent on that than Chilcot’s inquiry.

    But the thing is that the law demands that an inquest into Dr Kelly’s death is held. The process required by law would take only a few minutes of Coroner’s time. The Coroner would open the inquest take the findings from Hutton, confirm the Cause of Death (CoD), sign a final Death Certificate and formally closes the inquest. Five minutes tops! But Cameron said no.

    As the law stands Kelly has never had his CoD ruled on by a Coroner, Hutton had no legal powers to rule on the CoD only a Coroner or Jury if one sits has that legal power. No final Death Certificate has been issued and the inquest was not Formally closed as required by law, it was instead abandoned.

    If the law doesn’t apply to Kelly, Khan or Cameron who does it apply to? Law is corrupted and harmful to the people when it is applied selectively.

  • Peter Beswick

    Apparently the Law requires more money than Chilcot has spent keeping Julian Assange banged up in the Ecuaodrian Embassy.

    Great thing Cameron’s Law!

  • Ishmael

    “If the law doesn’t apply to Kelly, Khan or Cameron who does it apply to? ”

    It is ‘made’ to apply to whoever have the most influence want it to apply to. It’s a game to them, human life. worthless.

  • Peter Beswick

    1.5 million Magistrate Court cases per year for people who reject government propaganda and don’t pay their TV licence fee.

    The government has always used the Law to harm the people who pay for it but blowing them up when they disagree with government policy is a declaration too far.

  • Anon1

    “The Mayor of Calais Natacha Bouchart let rip at David Cameron, over the refugee crisis, but here’s the thing, 3500 refugees gather every day to protest outside the mayors office.

    She in turn replies to them if you want to stay in France you must claim asylum, surprisingly less than 10% want to remain in France…..strange.”

    ______________________________

    Yes, strange indeed. One could almost be forgiven for thinking these are economic migrants rather than refugees.

    After all, did it not turn out that the father of that poor drowned toddler had been living safely in Turkey for three years, and wanted to travel to Western Europe because he wanted new teeth, amongst other things?

  • twoleftfeet

    It is 38 days since the firebombing (the most lethal) in Duma. There have been no ‘proper’ arrests. A few settlers from the local area were taken in to custody but released the next day. Netanyahu claimed Israel would do everything in its power to bring the culprits to justice. In reality it was forgotten within minutes and the statement was only lip service to the rest of the world.
    Compare this inaction to that of the Israelis directly after three Jewish students were allegedly kidnapped and murdered. Hundreds of Palestinian homes were raided, some 700 arrested, two home demolitions and countless villages on a lockdown (it could be argued that the Gaza attack was a direct result of the missing students as well).
    What does habbabkuk the ‘twerp’ and his ‘chums’ think about this ‘beastly’ indifference to innocent Palestinian lives?

  • Habbabkuk (la vita e' bella)

    ““The Mayor of Calais Natacha Bouchart let rip at David Cameron, over the refugee crisis, but here’s the thing, 3500 refugees gather every day to protest outside the mayors office.

    She in turn replies to them if you want to stay in France you must claim asylum, surprisingly less than 10% want to remain in France…..strange.””
    ______________________

    Practical and positive as always, I think I have a solution to this indeed strange phenomenon.

    RobG, who lives in Poitou-Charentes, has on several occasions told us what a wonderful place France is compared to that shit-hole called the UK. Better infrastructure, better social security, better healthcare, better schools and so on.

    That being the case (or not), the French authorities should get RobG up to Calais to give a series of talks to the people waiting to get over to the UK. After listening to his silvery words they will surely drop their UK ambitions and be persuaded to seek asylum/stay in la belle France.

    Should the French authorities not think of this themselves, perhaps RobG could volonteer his services directly to Mayor Bouchart?

  • John Goss

    I see the racist UKIPper Anon1 is back with his bile! 🙂
    ————————–

    “But caring what the public think is not important to politicians once they have been elected so I was surprised at the PR push to get this story out.”

    I think Peter it is testing the water for more of the same. If the public let him get away with it, he’ll never stop. He may not stop anyway whatever the public thinks. As you say public opinion did not stop Blair.

  • Peter Beswick

    My take John is Cameron was badly advised, he certainly doesn’t care about public opinion but the US are running out of time. Putin is set to make incursions into Syria, once there the US plan (whatever that was) goes down the toilet. As with Bush the US see Britain’s support as key before a major offensive.

    I hate to think what the manufactured trigger will be but my guess is we will not have to wait long to find out.

  • Habbabkuk (la vita e' bella)

    Twoleftfeet

    “What does habbabkuk the ‘twerp’ and his ‘chums’ think about this ‘beastly’ indifference to innocent Palestinian lives?”
    ________________

    Well, firstly, let me say I’m flattered that you should seek my opinion. Your requst will not make you popular with the Original Trolls on here.

    As to your question: if what you write about the lack of zeal the Israeli authorities are showing in investigating this terrorist act of arson is correct, then this is deplorable. Israel, as a free, democratic state acting under the rule of law, must act with equal vigour against all acts of terrorism whether from Palestinians or Jewish settlers.

    I would however add just a small caveat.

    You have, through your posts in the past, shown yourself to be part of the Israel hating-and-baiting brigade.

    Are you sure therefore that you arent’t just making negative assertions about the Israeli authorities’ lack of zeal in this case? Should we simply take your (anti-Israel) word for statements like “In reality it was forgotten within minutes”? Are you yourself privy – or do you have reliable contacts and sources who are privy – to what the Israeli authorities are doing and to the investigations they are carrying out? If not, could you perhaps give us a good reason why we simply take your word for it that there is inaction on their part and that the matter has already been shelved?

    I suggest you calm down and follow developments before foaming at the mouth on here. Otherwise we shall not be able to take you as seriously as you might wish.

  • Habbabkuk (la vita e' bella)

    “Putin is set to make incursions into Syria, once there the US plan (whatever that was) goes down the toilet.”
    ________________

    The above is from relatively new boy Peter Beswick and shows he’s a quick learner.

    He hasn’t the slightest idea what it might be (and couldn’t even be bothered to think about what it might be) but there simply HAS to be an American “plan”.

    Same old, same old….

  • Habbabkuk (la vita e' bella)

    “There is a large protest ongoing in Downing St awaiting the arrival of the war criminal from Israel who is here for two days meeting with our own war criminal.”
    ___________________

    And just think, neither of the PMs is going to be arrested for war crimes! 🙂

  • Habbabkuk (la vita e' bella)

    Anon!

    “After all, did it not turn out that the father of that poor drowned toddler had been living safely in Turkey for three years, and wanted to travel to Western Europe because he wanted new teeth, amongst other things?”
    ____________________

    Can you source that, please?

    ++++++++++++++++++++

    If true, it might tie in with what someone was writing on here recentl (apologies for forgetting his handle), namely that the upsurge of refugees had more to do with something that might be happening in Turkey than in Syria itself.

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