UPDATE: Stupidly I had forgotten this vital confirmation from Channel 4 News (serial rebel Alex Thomson) of the D Notice in place on mention of Pablo Miller.
Back then I did not realise what I now know, that the person being protected was Pablo Miller, colleague in both MI6 then Orbis Intelligence of Christopher Steele, author of the fabrications of the Trump/Russia golden shower dossier. That the government’s very first act on the poisoning was to ban all media mention of Pablo Miller makes it extremely probable that this whole incident is related to the Trump dossier and that Skripal had worked on it, as I immediately suspected. The most probable cause is that Skripal – who you should remember had traded the names of Russian agents to Britain for cash – had worked on the dossier with Miller but was threatening to expose its lies for cash.
ORIGINAL POST: This comment from Clive Ponting, doyen of British whistleblowers, appeared on my website and he has now given me permission to republish it under his full name:
I have been reading the blogs for some time but this is my first post. Like Craig I was a senior civil servant but in the ministry of defence not the fco. I had plenty of dealings with all three intelligence agencies. It seems to me that the reason none of the MSM are doing any investigating/reporting of the Salisbury affair, apart from official handouts, is that the government have slapped a D-Notice over the whole incident and it is not possible to report that a notice has been issued.
Here is another theory as to what happened. The Russians pardoned Skripal and allowed him to leave (spy agencies have an understanding that agents will always be swapped after an interval – it’s the only protection they have and helps recruitment). In the UK Skripal would have been thoroughly debriefed by MI6 and MI5 (his ex-handler lives near Salisbury). If at some point they discovered that Skripal was giving them false information, perhaps he was told to do so by the FSB as a condition of his release, lives may have been endangered/lost. If he also was also involved in the ‘golden showers’ dossier then elements in the US would have a reason to act as well. The whole incident was an inside job not to kill him, hence the use of BZ, but to give him a warning and a punishment. The whole thing is being treated as though the authorities know exactly what went on but have to cover it up.
Addendum
I meant to add that the policeman who ‘just happened’ to be around was almost certainly the special branch ‘minder’ who was keeping Yulia under surveillance. The media are not allowed to mention the existence of a D notice.
Those of us who have been in the belly of the beast and have worked closely with the intelligence services, really do know what they and the British government are capable of. They are not “white knights”.
I would add it has been very plain from day one that there is a D notice on Pablo Miller.
Bang! Amber Rudd is gone
That tweet by Alex Thomson revealing that a D Notice had been issued a week before is pretty amazing in itself. Has any senior journalist at a major British news organisation ever made such a rapid revelation before? What’s the nearest precedent?
From right back when the deal was done with Boris Berezovsky, pal of the royal family, it may have been inevitable that pandemonium, eventually, would break out in British poshboy circles. Fast billions were made, and f*** the consequences, because “in the long run”, as John Maynard Keynes put it, “we are all dead”.
Why is Rudd throwing a cowpat at the police in her resignation letter? Page 1, Page 2. It’s probably just that the kid in the office doesn’t know what “challenge” means, just as he or she wrote the silly sentence that contains the words “meeting some of the families”, not realising that meeting refugee families, which may well have been a good thing, shouldn’t be a cause for pride. The term “going forward” also appears. Sometimes you just have to laugh. Can’t an alumna of Cheltenham Ladies’ College hold a pen any better?
She says she’s going to continue supporting the Home Office team with regard to the Economic Crime Centre. Haha – watch out, Evgeny Lebedev and Roman Abramovich, eh? Fuzz breathing down their necks soon? I think not!
She praises the intelligence services (for which she had no responsibility) but not MI5 (for which she was responsible). Slipped your memory, Amber, or are you trying to tell us something?
If there’s one thing I like, it’s a juicy resignation letter or speech.
“covalently bonded with the serine in AChE”
My arse! They were poisoned!
And within 60 seconds of a concerned member of the public phoning the emergency services …….
The emergency services turn up.
Total bollocks.
>“covalently bonded with the serine in AChE”
Yes that is standard, from everything to over-the-counter insecticides to common lab reagents like diisopropylfluorphospate to sarin to novichok, The exception would be carbamate poisons like bendiocarb that bind non-covalently (tightly but reversibly) — to this same serine active site of acetylcholinesterase.
The thing that strikes me about the choice of a rare novichok-like poison — when so many other equally or more effective anonymous options are readily available — is the word itself points straightaway to Russian state guilt. Might as well have a guy in FSB uniform stick a knife in them while carrying a Russian flag and shouting all praise Putin.
This wasn’t something just lying around, someone went to some planning effort to acquire the most demonizing compound knowing full well that being just down the road, Porton Down had the gear to quickly identify it. And the oddity of having a near-simultaneous chemical warfare drill, was that a coincidence?
That Motorola director running the overall DSTL said “nothing leaves these four walls”. However he is brand new to the job, unacquinted with things that really go on, and his office is distant. The US said the very same thing during the weaponized anthrax attacks on congressional liberals (and before that to a tabloid reporter): our security is so tight.
A different set of Russian defectors from Soviet biological warfare units were trotted out, just as here. It seems weaponized anthrax aerosols were being tested at a Batelle/Columbus (Ohio) facility, not contrary to treaty as it might appear to you and me but strictly for defensive purposes, just like the novichok-like munitions made earlier at Edgewood and open-air tested at Dugway, again strictly defensive research. There was zero interest in pursuing the anthrax perpetrator (just an overzealous fellow neocon who knew too much) so the press briefly tested the waters for blaming Iraqi.
So that is yet another scenario, an overzealous participant in the PD chemical warfare drill with friends on the inside. Rash act to be sure but one that the UK could still run with, via a hastily contrived charade, to meet long-standing policy demonizing goals of the über-poodle across the Pond. That character is no more going to be identified than the anthrax deployer.
“There is no clear delineation between offensive research as opposed to development and offensive and defensive research it really is the intent behind it that determines whether it is offensive or defensive and intent is very difficult to determine.”
David Kelly’s last word in last interview https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hneIATZZAcE
Which is the Party Line but not the reality
I was once travelling on the road that cuts through Porton Down and there was a large area (over 100 meters across) colourless cloud 400ft or so above my head, it was perceptible because it shimmered like the heat haze “mirage” that is seen at a road’s surface on hot sunny days.
I could be wrong but I assumed they were testing a carrier medium for an airborne heavy toxin such as weaponised silica coated anthrax (light toxins can be aerosoled easily).
If I am correct then the defensive aspect would be difficult to quantify.
So the Executive Management of cia.corporate.inc – all flew together on the same Jumbo Jet from the USA to England, to interview the main suspects
They first give Theresa Mary May “a nice friendly interview”…
“It wasn’t you who wrote the Script Was It?”
Theresa looks sheepish, and says, no but I take full responsibilty. I was perfectly happy with my role in the first scene.
cia.corporate.inc then ask
“It wasn’t Amber Rudd was it?”
Theresa smiles at the exeuctives from cia.corporate.inc, and she asks “Amber who? I don’t know anyone called Amber – oh you mean Sally – no don’t be silly, My British Intelligence Services tell me that it was you Americans who wrote the sequel, and I merely acted in it. O.K. I was crap. Can I meet Hillary now?”
“Theresa May and the Holy Grail 2018”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68cI3WXzhh8
Tony
Missiles struck military bases in Syria tonight, probably launched by the Is?aelis. Dozens of people have been killed.
N_ It could be true however – in the press release I just read it included the words “”Reuters could not verify the authenticity of the allegations.”
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-mideast-crisis-syria-bases/syrian-army-says-enemy-rocket-attacks-strike-at-military-bases-idUSKBN1I00WR
. @Tony_Opmoc
The phrasing used by Reuters is rather puzzling. Are they referring to a) the authenticity of the reports of attacks on ammunition depots and other military facilities; b) the presence of of Iranians and Hezbollah personnel on these bases or c the allegations that the attacks were launched from Israel through Lebanese airspace?
Have the Israelis chosen to launch sees attack prior to the supply of S-300’s to Syria or, more worryingly for many Syrians, is it another instance of the alleged understanding between Golda Meier(Mabovitch)and Molotov/Stalin whereby the USSR agreed that they would always supply Israel with weapons/technology one generation ahead of that which they provided to Arab countries.
Kerch’ee Kerch’ee Coup,
I am eating rice pudding at the moment, that I just made myself. Your questions are a little bit deep for me at the moment, though I still hope to get to Cyprus Rocks later this year, assuming neither The Turkish, nor The Russians, nor The Americans, nor The Israelis start lobbing loads of missiles at it.
Put a bit of cinnamon and rosewater on the rice pudding once it cools and you’re halfway to Cyprus already
Amber Rudd will stand up in parliament tomorrow and apologise again for Windrush whilst the PM cowers behind her – nobody will resign
Amber Rudd resigned 30 minutes later. 🙂
Another leadership contender successfully shafted by PM May. Most of this was May’s doing, but down the memory hole it goes.
I have a profound, personal distaste for PM May, which is unrelated to her politics or party. She’s a wrong-un, no mistake.
Five ‘ministers’ down since she ascended to No 10. How many more Treeza? You are a laughing stock. Go now Treeza!
Rent A Tool is SO prescient.
John Rentoul
@JohnRentoul
17h
Amber Rudd is in a surprisingly strong position, because PM can’t afford to lose her: me for @
Independent https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/amber-rudd-leak-windrush-resign-theresa-may-customs-union-a8327056.html
h/t TLN
you know what some people call you?
The Fuckus Did Strike Syria..again.. More War Crimes.
.A Genocide in Full Flow.. The Uk helping it along….GENOCIDE in Yemen..Where is Bob And Fucking Bono…Some sort Live Concert… For The Genocide In Gaza…Yemen…Fakes and Cnts
Another piece of tory vermin bites the dust. Hopefully the good citizens of Hastings and Rye will finish the job at the next GE.
Does Craig really believe the stuff he writes?
Seriously sloppy. He claims previous supposition as fact and uses it to back up a spurious argument. So now it was definitely ‘the west that attacked Skripal to ‘teach him a lesson’, and Craig knows because he has seen examples of similar behaviour by the British state (although he never actually tells us what these examples are…)
It was definitely the West because somebody on the internet says a D notice has been issued (A D notice? On a national security issue? No shit) and Craig, without any evidence whatsoever, claims it is because of the involvement of Pablo Miller, whom he can then link to Steele, and therefore conclude that Skripal was working on Steele’s dossier we voilà! The Trump connection.
And you guys lap it up….
April 29, 2018 at 01:29
No one is lapping anything up.The good people on this forum are piecing things together from what little information there is. Cui Bono and action/reaction are the few tools we have to analyse the events at Salisbury. after the utter failure of the Media to step up to the plate.
Below is a repost from further back in the comments.
The tenuous connection of the Skripal Affair to the Trump Dirty Dossier ,while not discounted ,does not compute.
Too many rules of Spookery have been broken. Unwritten Laws of spooks is that you do not disrupt spook exchanges by atttacking an exchanged spy or his family . It disrupts any future cooperation and it scares existing spy assets or future recruits ,knowing that their families are at risk.
The method used at Salisbury was too elaborate, too public, meant .to achieve maximum exposure and publicity. It was co-ordinated with a Military Chemical weapons attack exercise and elements at Porton Down. The whole town of Salisbury was frightened and panicked.
All this to put the ‘frghteners’ on a washed up ex-British spy.? It does not pass the smell test.
The Salisbury Skripal Affair ws Amateur Night at MI5/6, dreamt up in a hurry by some ex-Public school idiot with contempt for the reasoning powers of the common herd.
There is no understanding displayed of the rules of Project Management or Failure Mode Analysis, to give plasusible deniability.
The Skripal affair was a desperate last minute operation to rescue the failed attempt at regime change in Syria,in which close to £100 million hd been invested by the FCO and was a prelude to it, to prepare the Western public for a reprise at Douma.
It was also a continuation of Operation Beluga, the plot to demonise Russia and Putin..
The rapid advance of Syrian Forces into Douma and their seizure of several Chemical wapon stocks and laboratories had reduced the window of opportunity to stage another chemical weapon. ‘false flag’ to bring the Western forces and the Jihadists Air Force (sic) into the conflict.
The only WMD used at Douma was a wash down water hose,
The disclosure of Operation Beluga gives a credible understanding of the Skripal poisoning.
French Special Ops, Policeman Paul Barrill exposes it here and ties the Litivenko, Beresovsky and Skripal affairs together..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLI-gXJ7T5E
I suspect, rather than know, that Craig and many of the posters here have met and completely grokked our current security state and its methods. They have form.
The Guardian*, today, would seem to agree with us.
*http://guardian.ng/opinion/the-sarin-gas-war-the-west-and-russia-in-syria/
from Lagos
@Mark B 06:40
“et voilà! The Trump connection”
Have you stopped to consider that the purpose of the Steele dossier was to ‘torpedo’ Trump prior to the presidential elections, an exercise in which MI6 might have been complicit? Stop and think for a moment about where that would take us?
Mark B, putting words in Craig’s mouth :
So now it was definitely ‘the west that attacked Skripal ….
and
It was definitely the West because ….
Title of Craig’s post : “Probable Western Responsibility for Skripal Poisoning”
O/T, but isn’t this also outrageous?
Did they never hear of coppicing, pollarding and other traditional techniques of woodland management?
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/apr/29/millions-of-trees-at-risk-in-secretive-network-rail-felling-programme
Yes, it is outrageous. Had you noticed they did the same along motorways and major roads for the past few years?
Outsourced I see. I think there are 3,000 outside contractor firms working on the rail network.
There is also no regard for nesting birds.
‘Over the last fortnight, people around the country have woken to the sound of chainsaws and expressed concern at the lack of consultation and the scale of the destruction. In one incident, police in Bournemouth were called by residents to complain that engineers were operating illegally as the felling is taking place during the nesting season. ‘
‘The timing has caused increased outrage because it is taking place during nesting season – between March and August – despite promises by Network Rail that no felling would take place when birds are nesting.’
Out and out corporate vandalism.
Salaries of the head honchos. Some hacking out and cutting down required here.
http://www.cityam.com/268784/network-rail-chief-executive-track-bumper-pay-package
A review, by Dawn (Karachi), into secret squirrels ‘taking the piss’
https://www.dawn.com/news/1404782/plumbing-the-depths
There is no American translation of the phrase ‘taking the piss’. If an American were to vocalize some of the things an English person feels free to express, we’d call it ‘being an asshole.’ from a random Yank, for clarity.
.
Let’s see who can spin this story? Come on, Novichok Deniers, get your yo yo’s out 😉
Chemical weapons base where ‘Salisbury nerve agent made’ is being demolished:
https://dailym.ai/2HAyYOr
Interviews in Russian with Mayor here:
https://ria.ru/interview/20180427/1519465012.html
Reports here:
https://ria.ru/society/20180427/1519528336.html
https://replyua.net/putin/94798-v-shihanah-snosyat-obekty-gde-izgotavlivalsya-novichok.html …
Don’t expect this post to stay up long, the posters on here believe Murray’s “Probable” rather than the OPCW’s agreement with the UK Govt’s “Highly Probable”
Remember all the posts regarding BZ contamination posted on here? All of that stushi came direct from the Kremlin. They are literally like robots.
@ Bu axmoqlik April 30, 2018 at 08:57
Who planted the bomb/s at Bologna Staion? Who shot up supermarkets in Brabant? Who planted plutonium on an Aeroflot aircraft?
Yes, I’m afraid, the ‘usual suspects’.
Are you saying that the Mayor of Shikhany, Andrei Tatarinov, is a Freemason?
http://russianmasonry.ru/
Which Faction? Which Lodge?
(only 50, I believe, and none in Shikhany http://russianmasonry.ru/?project=612)
“since June of 2006, numerous contradictory communications have been received from Djanguiryan and Gorodnitskiy, both claiming to be the legitimate Grand Master of the Grand Lodge of Russia. This has created much confusion in the Masonic community throughout the world…..The legitimate Grand Lodge of Russia continues to operate in the confusion of having a self-proclaimed group operate under the same name. This group, headed by Roman Gorodnitsky, has sent numerous letters to Grand Lodges around the world claiming legitimacy.
http://www.recognitioncommission.org/2008/06/02/2008-report/
It is still the opinion of the Commission that the Grand Lodge of Russia with Andrei Bogdanov as Grand Master is the only Grand Lodge in Russia that meets the standards for recognition. It has been learned that Grand Master Bogdanov has announced himself as a candidate for the Presidency of Russia.
http://freemasonsfordummies.blogspot.com/2008/02/grand-master-of-russia-running-for.html
In September 2010 Grand Master Andrei Bogdanov was admitted to the Holy Royal Arch in the Royal Somerset House & Inverness Chapter meeting in London, England. He subsequently began establishing Royal Arch Freemasonry in Russia. A number of prominent members of the GLoR have joined the Royal Arch in London, under the auspices of the United Grand Lodge of England (UGLE).”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Lodge_of_Russia
Interesting anecdotal history on the Origins of Russian Freemasonry which claims that the first attempt of revolution (not to be confused with a palace coup) in December 1825 was undertaken by Russian masons whose “Unknown Superior” was actually the Prince of Wales.
https://russia-insider.com/en/history/origins-russian-freemasonry/ri15705
Oh, the asinine logic of those who imagine that it’s easier to bring the poison from the closed facilities 2000 miles away on a plane across the borders and customs rather than from an operating military chem lab just down the road.
And if you think such logic is perverted, you must be a Kremlin robot.
OK, here goes then:
“Our obligation was demonstrate that chemical weapons were no longer produced at Shikhany. We have totally destroyed the site and its buildings. Thus chemical weapons can no longer be produced there. This was all scheduled several years ago”.
Have you actually read the Russian links you posted and compared them with the daily mail spin? It is laughable, but they actually contradict each other.
Learn Russian.
Please enlighten us!
Billy B. That means you confirm you don’t know what is those articles 🙂
Here is what Daily Mail alleges:
“Leading British chemical weapons expert Hamish de Bretton-Gordon told The Mail on Sunday: ‘It is most unfortunate the Russians have decided to flatten the Shikhany labs where they have developed and made Novichok in the last ten years, presumably to prevent the OPCW investigation into the Salisbury nerve agent attack getting evidence of these activities.”
The whole article is about how Novichok was made at Shikhany and now after the incident Putin regime is covering it up by destroying the facilities.
And here is what the Russian link says: https://ria.ru/interview/20180427/1519465012.html
The interview with director of closed area Andrei Tatarinov. “Ever since 1990s after RF signed the convention of prohibition of chemical weapons our institute under the supervision of US representatives stopped all the chemical weapon development works. And from that moment on the only developments were left related only to research of technologies of dismantling of chemical weapons. By now all such work dried up, the institute programs run its course and the research facilities no longer needed.”
Do you understand the difference? Your Russian links do not confirm the Daily Mail BS, but quite on contrary disprove them. Why did you post them? Did you know their content and deliberately tried to fool people here in these threads?
By the way nowhere in those Russian links there is a confirmation of ever working on Novichok.
Furthermore:
1. OPCW reports said Novichok was in its pure form. That means Non-Traceable. Because the only way to trace the substance is by analyzing impurities in it.
If substance is Non-Traceable why would anyone destroy any facilities if one cannot link chemical production to them in any way?
2. The journalist in the interview specifically asked Mr. Tatarinov how can the substance be traced to the facilities in Shikhany – could the British obtain the sample for analysis? To which Mr. Tatarinov replied that in any case nobody from Britain could obtain any samples of any substance nor visit the facilities. The areal is closed to visitors, especially with foreign passports.
I don’t know if the above enlightened you or not, But it is now clear to me that your post where you pasted links under the pretext that the reports from Russia confirm the Daily Mail allegations is the work of a TROLL!
@SK You need to read more before jumping to conclusions:
The Mayor of Shikhany, Andrei Tatarinov, has a very low rating of 2.36%.
Did you wonder why? http://lizagubernii.ru/opros/26/
Do you believe everything the Mayor of Salisbury says?
A Mayor’s job is often to lie, so let’s see what he said:
1. Well, what do you think about the statements of former employees of the Institute and residents of the city who have left for the West?
– All accusations against Russia from Mirzoyanov, Uglev, as far as I learned from the residents of the city, who worked with them, are not serious. They pretend to be experts, for the creators, but in fact they only indirectly worked with the program for the creation of chemical warfare agents.
https://ria.ru/interview/20180427/1519465012.html
2. Are not you afraid to go after mushrooms?”
– All the inhabitants of the city from the very beginning of his existence went and continue to follow the mushrooms. There were no cases of poisoning. Mushrooms are good, they are coming from other regions.
Now let’s look at the reality:
1. The conversation with Eugene Grigorievich
“It’s like a joke.” I worked with it, I know. Without a respirator, without protection, without everything. [Skripal ran into this poison]?
Those like me who worked with Novice- everyone will laugh.
All this is far-fetched and invented. Then a drop on the glove – and then you wash it, launder it … That’s why chemical weapons kill.
And these were poisoned…what a Joke.
That is not “Novice” , – he said.
Evgeny Grigoryevich worked, according to his own application, in GITOS, the director of installations.
2. Galina , a former security engineer of GITOS, mentioned that, according to her observation, in Shihan people over 60 years old often get cancer.
“We gathered berries and mushrooms on the landfill, there were a lot of them, I do not know why … There were hunters … Zaytsev was killed, everyone ate and did not think about anything, that we would get infected.” After 60-70 they started: cancer , strokes, these are still the echoes of those years, “she said.
https://www.svoboda.org/a/29183736.html
Read the comments below the article, especially the following:
Rosa Ivanova’s comment about disease,
Sokolov Alexsey’s comment about Leonard Rink: “Так почему собственно Ринк избежал наказания? Да тут все ясно:понадобился мужичек “заплечных дел” мужичкам. Поскольку лично я с ним познакомился в 1993 году, то могу с уверенностью сказать, что от него можно все ожидать. Да и в Москву он перебрался не просто так. Явно понадобился.”
Grigory Ivanovich Budykin:
Мужик пришел домой, кулечек с исподним и сухарями положил на полку (пока!) и все думает над словами гебнюка. Легли спать, он жене и говорит, слушай, а может у них уже и патронов нет? Вот так и с “Новичком” — ВСЕ украдено да на кивелидиев израсходовано. Бандиты то платят исправно
Oleg Badaev’s comment about Lyudmila Vasilyeva’s husband”
“а вот её муж стал зав. лабораторией и защитил докторскую по бинарным ОВ. К ним в Шиханы мы никогда не ездили, а вот они к нам в Москву наезжали”
And Fedor Petrov’s little rant 😉
If you are seriously interested in learning more about this topic, rather than just trying to prove a point, then I suggest you read the following article by Dmitry BELOVETSKY 1998:
КИЛЛЕР С ПИПЕТКОЙ
https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/2285569
We can discuss further, if you like?
The mayor also questioned the expertise of Vladimir Uglev and Vil Mirzayanov, who both claimed to be the creators of the ‘Novichok’ and made some statements on the issue in the British media. According to Tatarinov, in reality, they were only tangentially involved in the program for the development of military-grade chemical agents.
https://sputniknews.com/russia/201804271063955922-shikhany-novichok-chemicals-trademark/
Again, let’s look at the reality rather than the Mayor’s lies:
«Новичок» уже убивал (“Novice” has already killed)
Публикуем материалы громкого уголовного дела, доказывающие российское происхождение супероружия
We publish materials of an important criminal case proving the Russian origin of the superweapon
https://www.novayagazeta.ru/articles/2018/03/22/75896-rezhim-novichka
18 April 2018 Uglev interview: https://www.currenttime.tv/a/29174413.html
The RIA Novosti interview with Professor Leonid Rink here:
https://ria.ru/world/20180320/1516727641.html
Mote details of the Kiveldi case here:
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9A%D0%B8%D0%B2%D0%B5%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%B4%D0%B8,_%D0%98%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%BD_%D0%A5%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%BF%D0%B8%D0%B5%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87
When in 2007 the investigation reported on the detention of the alleged murderer, the heading “The Banker was killed by the Saratov poison ” was published by the news agency SarInform : Interfax then repeated the version of the governor of the Saratov region, Dmitry Ayatskov, that “a military poisoning agent not in the arsenal of the Russian army, “was manufactured at a military chemical plant in the city of Shihany, Saratov region – military chemists suffering from” chronic lack of money are forced to sell their products secretly. ”
Under the photograph of the funeral of Ivan Kivelidi:
Когда в 2007 году следствие отчиталось о задержании предполагаемого убийцы, в информагентстве «СарИнформ» вышлановость под патриотичным заголовком «Банкира убили саратовским ядом»: источник «Интерфакса» тогда повторил версию губернатора Саратовской области Дмитрия Аяцкова о том, что «боевое отравляющее средство, которого нет на вооружении российской армии», было изготовлено на военно-химическом заводе в городе Шиханы Саратовской области — военные химики в условиях «хронического безденежья вынуждены приторговывать своей продукцией из-под полы».
https://zona.media/article/2018/03/14/kivelidi
Mysteries of the Kivelidi case by Ivan Kudryavtsev
http://old.vesti7.ru/archive/news?id=11594
Саратовские химики заработали на смерти известного банкира
Заявление губернатора Саратовской области Дмитрия Аяцкова о том, что работники секретного химического центра в Шиханах занимаются продажей “из-под полы” отравляющих веществ, вызвало шок у спецслужб. В качестве доказательства губернатор привел результаты экспертизы МВД России: яд, использованный при убийстве известного банкира Ивана Кивелиди, был изготовлен в Шиханах. Оказывается, что теперь любой желающий может купить там суперсовременные виды отравляющих веществ.
На днях МВД установило, что фосфоросодержащий яд, которым в августе 1995 года были отравлены банкир Иван Кивелиди и его секретарша, был произведен в химическом центре Шихан. Губернатор Саратовской области заявил по этому поводу, что “местные химики” в связи с отсутствием госзаказа и “хронического безденежья вынуждены приторговывать своей продукцией из-под полы”.
https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/176495
Банкира убили саратовским ядом
«Интерфаксу» стало известно также, что для убийства Кивелиди было использовано «боевое отравляющее средство, которого нет на вооружении Российской армии». Результаты экспертизы показали, что яд был изготовлен из вещества, произведенного на военно-химическом заводе в городе Шиханы Саратовской области.
https://www.sarinform.ru/news/2007/03/17/5126
A good unbiased introduction to the whole story of “Novichok” can be found ere by Karel Knip:
‘Unknown’ newcomer novichok was long known
https://www.nrc.nl/nieuws/2018/03/21/unknown-newcomer-novichok-was-long-known-a1596490
Not just Uglev and Rink, but also Nikolai Volodin confirms production of Novichok at Shihany, directly contradicting the Mayor:
«Новичок» — это слишком для одного Скрипаля»
Интервью Николая Володина, начальника отдела по режиму секретного НИИ, где разрабатывался летальный яд
INTERVIEW
“Beginner” – this is too much for one Skripal”
Interview with Nikolai Volodin, head of the department of the regime of the secret research institute, where a lethal poison was developed
68-year-old Nikolai Volodin went to the editorial office on his own. A former employee of the secret State Institute of Organic Chemistry and Technology (GNIIOKhT), where powerful poisons were developed in the USSR, reported that the “Novice” was tested under his control, confirming its existence.
https://www.novayagazeta.ru/articles/2018/03/23/75908-demonstrativnoe-ubiystvo-mozhno-bylo-organizovat-prosche
Что такое “Новичок”? Версии трех разработчиков
https://www.bbc.com/russian/features-43476312
Denial of the “Novice”
“Novaya Gazeta” publishes documents of the court and the criminal case, from which it is clear: the secret poisonous substance in the 1990s “was sold and wandered around the world”
https://www.novayagazeta.ru/articles/2018/04/02/76026-otritsanie-novichka
Торговцы смертью. Как из секретного НИИ исчезли ампулы с «Новичком»
В 1990-е годы из института в Саратовской области украли до 14 ампул с отравляющим веществом. Этого количества хватило бы, чтобы убить свыше четырех тысяч человек
In the 1990s, up to 14 ampoules with a poisonous substance were stolen from the institute in the Saratov region. This amount would be enough to kill over four thousand people
https://republic.ru/posts/90241
As you can see the good Mayor is talking out of his backside, and I would kindly ask you not to accuse people on this forum of being Trolls as it reflects badly on you more than anything else. You are entitled to your opinions, as we all are, but I would suggest you do a little more research before criticizing the posts of others.
Billy B, There is no “reply button” on your message, so I’ll replay here to your message from May 1st:
I do not believe any mayor or news article. I simply pointed out that the RIA articles do not support the Daily Mail articles that you posted. They contradict each other. So I asked you: why did you bundle them together?
To your points:
1. Any proof of the contrary? They Mayor maybe a liar and you and I may not believe him. But to quote his so called lies and assume the opposite it true is kind of silly isn’t it?
2. If you get poisoned by organophosphate based nerve agent, you will die on the spot, not get a cancer. How is the mushroom story relevant to Novichok?
3. Klivelidi case: where is relevance to organophosphate or Novichok?
4. Novaya gazeta article: Leonid Rink talks about one tube of organophosphate he had in his garage. The poison was developed prior to 1994 according to this article. This actually confirms the words of Tatarinov, whom you called a liar, that until 1992 Shikhany institute worked with chemical weapons. But this article does not disprove his words that from 1990-s all this work was stopped and under American supervision weapons programs were closed.
To conclude, all your references confirm the following:
1. Nobody called organophosphate based poisons in Russia by the name of “Novichok”
2. Russia inherited chemical weapons programs from the USSR and some weapons were organophosphate based.
3. Your links do not say that ONLY Russia/USSR worked on such substances. In fact I’m surprised that you spent so much energy to find all these articles about Russian developments not Porton Down’s for example. I think after Americans described such poisons in the 1940-es every country in the world worked with those.
or was that your attempt at spin? Not bad, actually!
If that is questionable then what of the bombing and total destruction of the suspected Syrian chemical weapons sites before the OPCW could visit?
not to mention the hamsters, cat, bench and proposed demolition of the Skripal second home.
If they see they’re able to get away with false flags as glaring as Salisbury and Douma – so soon after Iraq WMD and Gaddafi ‘mass slaughter within 48hrs’ – there’ll be absolutely no stopping them from now on.
If Bolton, Pompeo and Nitenyahoo really do want war with Iran they’ll know can contrive any old fictional blx to justify one and the MSM and bewildered herd will just line up behind it.
@ Xavi April 30, 2018 at 08:53
Look how they got away (and are still getting away) with Gladio, despite it being exposed.
My big red fear now that Amber Rudd has gone is that it gives the green light for the sly Liam Fox to step into her shoes. He’s a personal favourite of Theresa May. Don’t think this could not happen. People forget and let these sleazebags back in. If you have a God start praying this does not happen.
Rubbish, they have opposite views on customs union.
Some light relief – Michael Gove’s tweet after Amber Rudd’s resignation. See if you can read it without laughing:
I’m so sad about Amber’s departure from government – she was a huge asset – brave, principled, thoughtful, humane, considerate and always thinking of the impact of policy on the vulnerable – I hope Amber will be back soon – we need her
“Huge Asset” Sticking the knife in there, wasn’t he!
I was expecting Craig to comment on how Theresa May (following on from Cameron) has turned this country into a very nasty place, more like a banana republic than a so called democracy. The lying is more extreme than ever.
Instead we have more on Salisbury.
A week ago today I started the following petition to parliament.
“Let Yulia Skripal explain what happened to her and her father.
The world needs to know that Yulia Skripal, allegedly poisoned by a nerve agent, is getting proper follow-up medical care by hearing her own account of the alleged poisoning. Apart from one telephone call nobody knows where she is or whether she has the choice to speak freely.
There are many media accounts of the alleged poisonings of the Skripals (Yulia and her father Sergei) as conflicting and changeable as the weather. Parliament needs to discuss this whole affair in an adult way so that the public has a plausible explanation of what happened. Yulia Skripal should be given access to the media because otherwise the suspicion falls on the UK for holding her and her father against their wills.”
It used to say petitions could take up to a week before they became active. I have received no confirmation that my petition is active. However I noticed that the site has been updated 26/05/18 and wonder whether it has been deliberately changed to delay this petition.
You know when I raised a petition calling for an inquest into the death of Dr David Kelly it went public on the same day. How things have changed with parliament’s lack of responsibility towards the people who elect its members!
Patience is a virtue and comes to those who can be bothered to wait.
Yulia passed her statement through the Police – http://news.met.police.uk/news/statement-issued-on-behalf-of-yulia-skripal-302508
Whether or not you believe it is up to you however she does say she’s still ill and not strong enough to be interviewed by the media yet.
Expect something soon. You probably don’t understand how things work in a free country, she has the right to her privacy as you do, a right you should probably exercise more often. Are you saying she should be wheeled out to appease you or the Russian government like a Syrian child?
I doubt any interview would convince you that she is speaking freely, there will always be doubt from the doubters and the Russian Govt who ferment doubts within the stupid and those who hang on their every word despite plain logic.
You will always claim duress, bribe or threat to her beloved family in Russia?
Again. Patience is a virtue and comes to those who can be bothered to wait.
Bo
“You probably don’t understand how things work in a free country,”
If you’re the same Bo that ordered the poisonings, haven’t you got more important things to do than lecture civil-rights campaigners on the ethics of media management?
“Whether or not you believe it is up to you however she does say she’s still ill and not strong enough to be interviewed by the media yet.”
No she does not. That is what a police statement made on her behalf says she claims. Anybody who has listened to her conversation with her cousin Viktoria knows that she was articulate and sharp. And that was a week before the Met issued its statement.
OK so the Police say she will be available for media interviews in due course. You seem to be splitting hairs over this, the Police have said it or she has said it through the police are you saying if parliament said it after your petition was discussed, it would be somehow more valid?
@Bu axmoqlik
“You probably don’t understand how things work in a free country”
You obviously do not. The statement of Yulia’s to which you refer was authored by the Met. – the government’s ‘go to’ organisation when obfuscation is called for.
“Are you saying she should be wheeled out to appease you or the Russian government like a Syrian child?”
She should be pictured (not interviewed) accompanying her father as he leaves Salisbury District Hospital by the front door. That way we’ll know they are both safe and well, for that moment in time at least.
“there will always be doubt from the doubters and the Russian Govt. who ferment doubts within the stupid and those who hang on their every word despite plain logic.”
Do not insult the intelligence of others posting here. You do not hold a monopoly on ‘plain logic’. If you’re looking for any government to ferment doubts among the stupid, you need only travel to Westminster, London, capital of this ‘free country’ of ours (well mine at least. I don’t know about you). How free were we to prevent the despicable murder of Iraqi citizens under Tony Blair’s premiership or the very recent, and equally unjustifiable, attack on Syria sanctioned by Treason May?
You have much to learn before you presume to lecture others.
Well put!
You and your ‘free country. Yuliya Skripal is a Russian citizen and has been denied any contact with the outside world. It does not matter what you say her wishes may be because they were expressed through a party with partisan agenda. If all this is true the government should appoint a truly independent legal representations to express her views. As it stands there is good reason to suspect that she is held against her wishes.
This is a copy of part of an email response I wrote on the same day that I started the petition (24/05/18)
“Thanks for signing. 11 have signed up to now which is enough to start it. However there is a message saying it can take up to a week to check if it meets the epetitions standards.”
I also left several comments on Craig’s blog that it could take up to a week. If the amendment to remove “taking up to a week” was made two days after I submitted my petition I think I would be right in thinking that legally this petition is governed by the rules applying at the time.
Received this in my in box just now:
Dear Christine Hudson,
We rejected the petition you supported – “Let Yulia Skripal explain what happened to her and her father.”.
It included confidential, libellous, false or defamatory information, or a reference to a case which is active in the UK courts.
We’ve marked this petition as confidential to avoid causing distress to the Skripal family. In any case, we’re not sure exactly what you’d like the Government or Parliament to do.
We only reject petitions that don’t meet the petition standards:
https://petition.parliament.uk/help#standards
Thanks,
The Petitions team
UK Government and Parliament
Thanks Christine. I wondered on what grounds they would try to reject it. Anyway they are a day late in letting me know. I will write to my MP who I copied into the original email requesting support.
Perhaps rephrase it? “Allow Russian Ambassador to visit Yulia Skripal”.
Just got an email rejecting the petition…
This novichok farce and Windrush farce are obviously smokescreens for something they don’t want us to talk about. Brexit. An incredibly tiny minority of extremely right-wing maniacs, including Mrs May and Boris Johnson but also Liam Fox and that other gawd-bless-us chap with glasses, have prepared a series of fictional practical jokes to distract us from the biggest power grab since 1640. In fact the power they want to grab back is every single human right the English people have won since Magna Carta including Habeas Corpus, freedom of speech and religious belief and rights accrued by the service of millions to the nation during 2 world wars, the NHS and welfare state.
Add to that the distraction of USUKISFR apparently being unable fire missiles as a piss-poor pretext for Mrs May not to deliver Damascus to the Saudi head-choppers as promised. Last year Salman was complaining bitterly that the West was taking Saudi Arabia for a ride and that they’d spent billions on expensive terrorists with nothing to show for it. The said fly-by-night be-knighted criminals have pocketed the Queen’s shillings and are being re-drafted by USUKIS for further colonial projects as we speak.from the conveniently isolated city of Idlib.
Let us assume for one second that our clique of proto-fascist leaders, though malign, posses some intelligence. Their aim is to re-enslave the workers of this country on much less benign terms and conditions that are currently not only in place but also enshrined and protected by the EU courts. Govichok wants to make it simpler to subsidise farmers who are rich and whose businesses are rich and who will have to do nothing and spend nothing to earn UK subsidies, while those whose farms and businesses are already under-funded will incur additional expenses diverted from their real priorities, in order to receive tax-payer grants. This will in due course lead to bankruptcy. The scam of growing cheap food in Poland to put our farmers out of business will be replaced by G234 economic nerve agents.
You can of course fool some of the people some of the time, but you can’t fool even the parasites of the BBC that Amber Rudd resigning is a significant moment for this evil government. Laura Kuensberg said it left Mrs may exposed. No. No,nono Laura. Mrs May went a very long way by pleading in public, in pitiful, mincing tones about her guilt over Windrush, on her watch, on her decision, and then forced Amber Rudd to resign by leaking some mistakes she had made. Wringing their hands and wetting the floor with tears, the BBC said it was nasty Mrs May that forced Ms Rudd to follow the agenda set by her when she was Home Secretary. While loudly snickering up their sleeves that Satan Theresa’s job had been saved by the redemptive sacrifice of sacrificial lamb of Amber Rudd. Nasty nasty piece of work Theresa May. You couldn’t have found a bitchier and more manipulative piece of work in the history of UK pseudo-feminism. She’s still wearing her frock over her trousers to delight the eyes of young Abdullah, to whom she listened while plotting to stitch him up.
Here endeth the Monday rant.
be-nighted changed to be-knighted by spellchecker. Obviously Al Qaida are not going to be added to the honours List, at least one would think….
Then again, Osama bin Laden did bank with Coutts, a City firm that also manages some of the “Queen’s” money.
I really don’t know what is happening. Don’t put down to conspiracy that which can be explained by incompetence.
The first Queen’s speech post referendum was free of all matters other than Brexit. The reasoning being that they would be hard pushed to get the necessary Brexit legislation through in any circumstances. The first wooden clog in the machinery was the Westminster sexual harassment kerfuffle. I put this down to a torpedo from the continuity state at the time and predicted further well timed interventions. The deep state was never sold on Brexit.
This said, I don’t see Salisbury or Syria as being in anyway Brexit related.
Maybe not directly, but think of the distraction factor, the demonisation of Corbyn and the supposed rise in stature of May in world politics, all related to these two pieces of false news.
Vivian, If you look at the timing of Salisbury it was at a time when even the MSM were highly critical of how the Govt were conducting Brexit negotiations – it is the biggest shambles since I don’t know when. They didn’t seem to understand the Treaty, what they were negotiating on, refusing to pay the final bill (which is all in the Treaty). They were hell bent on destructive conduct using the MSM to demonise the EU negotiators. They did not have a clue – Treason May was putting the needs of her party before the needs of the Nation. Hey presto, Salisbury. Although it is a forerunner to the false flag attack in Syria, it clearly also was a diversionary tactic to remove focus from the appalling mess the Govt was making of Brexit. So yes, the two are linked.
Jo. Your analysis works if the false flag operations were initiated by the temporary state (Tory government). The operations were incompetently delivered therefore government control is perfectly feasible.
The permanent state may have gone along to justify their salaries while leaking their discontent (FCO) to sources willing to publicise it (Mr. Murray).
Alternatively, the deep state cooperated with a request from someone in the cabinet to concoct a diversion for a horrible mishandling of Brexit, but only on a “give ’em enough rope ……” basis.
“This novichok farce and Windrush farce are obviously smokescreens for something they don’t want us to talk about. Brexit.”
Don’t think so, the Brexit story is going to run for the next few years. Anyway the proponents of Brexit have pretty much shutdown opposition with cries of democracy and remoaner.
The timing of Windrush was pretty potentially pretty damaging to the Tories, with a council election incoming, in the same way as the “anti-Semitism in Labour” story. The Windrush whistle-blower probably sat on the story and waited to try to do most damage to the government. If we assume that the Novichok narrative is not entirely true, its ramifications suggest that Russia and probably Syria are the target. Or at least the side benefits.
Brexit gives a chance for the current government to reinterpret 1000’s of laws. We can only hope that the opposition parties and The House of Lords make enough fuss about the bad interpretations, that they appear in the media.
@ Paul Damascene April 30, 2018 at 00:37
‘ @ Paul Barbara–and in case you were interested in the legal opinion rebutting the government’s:
https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/campaigncountdown/pages/2243/attachments/original/1523875290/Akande_Opinion_UK_Government's_Legal_Position_on_Syria_Strike_April_2018.pdf?1523875290 ‘
Yes, that’s the type of thing I was thinking of. As it’s already written, Tom Watson and/or Jeremy Corbyn should contact QC’s and other barristers and lawyers to ask them if they would be willing to co-sign the opinion (or to jointly agree another) then for them to network for more signatures among their colleagues, and for a paid full-page add (Labour Party or joint lawyer-funded) to go out in the national press.
If anyone has their ear, please suggest it to them. My attempts to get through to them seem to fall flat, with no response.
In view of the US Navy’s quest for russian DNA, how useful would two generations of good old russian stock be to experiment on ? Gene, crack away !
Echoing the comment of ‘Jones’ (29.4, 11:11)
There is a paradox attaching to the Salisbury incident in the round. If the perpetrator wanted either or both victim(s) dead, would they have laid contingency plans for rescue and recovery? On the other hand, If these aspects are considered part of the plot, then the author(s) would obviously not have sanctioned the use of a potentially fatal substance.
Yes, the Jones comment was instructive: ‘i do wonder why the Skripals are actually still alive …. attack an amateurish botched affair leaving the target alive to spill the beans.’
If that the bystander dr and husband had not come along and put Yulia in ‘response position’, she would have died on the spot. Once into the medical system it’s out of control: much much harder for them not to get the best treatment possible. Still, it was a close call for both. Same thing happened with PD, they refused the attribution to Russia being forced upon them by FO. So yes, it had to be novichok for the notoriety but there was no practical experience with it, resulting in a hit botched in terms of dosage.
Hasty fall-back plan, disappear the three and Official Secrets Act on everyone else in sight, not just the press.
The other loose end concerns involvement of the French. Early on, there was some weird attempt to send samples to them for confirmation. That caught the eye of the Russian Embassy; they pounded away for a couple of days on why does France get poison samples but not us. That put an end to it, other than France wanting part of the Syrian CW caper at Douma.
Why send samples to France, of all the countries in the EU? Notably the Netherlands has the main international CW lab. Here someone high up in the UK’s amateurish planning effort was unfamiliar the role of OPCW in such matters.
http://www.voltairenet.org/article200422.html good summary of Russia’s questions to France.
//=/=/
Looking at google search of ‘DGSE + assassination’, we see tangled accounts of bungled operations on British and other foreign soil, but no previous chemical assassinations:
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/french-spies-plotted-to-assassinate-abu-hamza-on-streets-of-london-8961725.html
1a) “One plot hatched by French intelligence that has, until now, not previously come to light, was the idea of assassinating Abu Hamza in London. The plan was to impersonate the British Nazi group Combat 18 and then allow them to take the blame. In the immediate aftermath of the London nail bombings, the French considered sending death threats in the style of C18 and then killing him with the same type of weaponry that the group was thought to possess.
1b) In a completely separate earlier plot, the French spying network Direction Générale de la Sécurité Extérieure (DGSE) contemplated kidnapping Hamza from his West London home, putting him in a ferry and moving him to France.Those plans came amid fears that Algerian terrorists were going to target the 1998 football World Cup in France.
2) How France strove to eliminate terrorists on its ‘kill list
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/how-france-strove-to-eliminate-terrorists-on-its-kill-list-1.2926978
Jan 6, 2017 – In his book Fatal Errors; How Our Presidents Have Failed in the Face of Terrorism, journalist Vincent Nouzille claims that at least 40 jihadists have been assassinated on Hollande’s orders by the French armed forces, the DGSE or by the US based on intelligence provided by France. Le Monde has devoted substantial coverage to the way France hunts down and kills jihadists in Syria and the Sahel region of Africa.
3) LICENSE TO KILL: FRANCE’S SECRET “ASSASSINATION” SQUAD
http://turcopolier.typepad.com/sic_semper_tyrannis/2015/05/leaked-to-the-press-frances-official-targeted-killing-squad.html
May 18, 2015 – The last time France’s intelligence services used “targeted assassinations” on a large scale was during the Algerian War for Independence (1954-1962). French SDECE (the predecessor to today’s DGSE) hit between 200 and 300 targets during that period, either Algerian activists, arms dealers or even …
4) The Reluctant Gendarme
https://www.theatlantic.com/past/docs/issues/2000/04/sudetic2.htm
Serbian police had arrested five members — one of them Petrusic — of a spy cell, code-named Spider and set up by the DGSE to assassinate Slobodan Milosevic. Matic said that Petrusic had been a member of the French Foreign Legion and was a DGSE agent who had been run by a case officer named Patrick Fort for ten years. Petrusic had participated in spying missions in Bosnia, assassinations in Yugoslavia, a 1994 massacre in Algeria, the 1995 executions in Srebrenica, the 1997 mercenary operation in Zaire, and the killing of Albanians in Kosovo during the NATO bombardment last year. The DGSE’s chief, Jacques Dewatre, lent credibility to these allegations by resigning a few weeks later.
5) Spain shelves charges against French alleged ‘assassin’ spies
https://intelnews.org/2014/05/26/01-1483/
May 26, 2014 – Spanish authorities concluded that the two men, who admitted they were officers of France’s General Directorate for External Security (DGSE), were in Spain to conduct an assassination. In a words of a state prosecutor in Barcelona, the DGSE spies had come to Spain “to kill”. The two men were detained in the Catalonian town of Manresa in April of 2002. In the back of the car, police officers found a large PVC tube that contained a sniper rifle complete with a laser telescopic light and a silencer. DGSE chief Rondot told Spanish officials that the two men were “on a training exercise”.
Rainbow Warrior bombing in New Zealand
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/94208355/Thirty-two-years-after-the-Rainbow-Warrior-bombing-unrepentant-French-spy-Christine-Cabon-is-found
For everyone’s convenience, I will put this very puzzling Salisbury linkage of British to the French connection on record here:
“On March 31, the Embassy of the Russian Federation in Paris delivered to the French Foreign Ministry a note with a list of questions to the French side regarding the Skripal case fabricated against Russia:
1. On what grounds did France become involved in the technical side of the United Kingdom’s investigation of the incident in Salisbury?
2. Has France officially notified the Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) of its involvement in the technical side of the investigation of the incident in Salisbury?
3. What evidence did the United Kingdom hand over to France as part of the technical side of the investigation?
4. Were French specialists present when biological samples were collected from Sergey and Yulia Skripal?
5. Did French specialists conduct their own tests of the biological samples collected from Sergey and Yulia Skripal and, if so, at which specific laboratory?
6. Based on which attributes did the French specialists conclude that the chemical warfare agent of the Novichok type (in accordance to British terminology) or its analogues were used in this case?
7. What expert knowledge does France have in studying chemical warfare agents of this type or its analogues?
8. Based on which attributes (markers) was the alleged “Russian origin” of the substance used in Salisbury established by French specialists?
9. Does France have control samples of the Novichok chemical warfare agent (in accordance to British terminology) or its analogues?
10. Have samples of the chemical warfare agent of this type or its analogues been developed in France and, if so, for what purpose?”
http://www.voltairenet.org/article200422.html
It seems Mossad has some serious competition in the elimination market.
Unlike the criminal lying class of politicians, like Theresa May and Jobsworth, I still struggle with being lied to quite as blatantly and maliciously as our government. It totally messes up my head. I am proud of the fact that even at the age of 63 my default take on life is that people tell the truth and are for the most part decent. To live the political life would be , for me, like losing my eyesight. Some people experience black cobwebs blocking their vision. To live and breathe in that constantly lying world of politics, the choice our Tory politicians have made at an early age, would not be compatible with my religious faith, my sense of humour, or my relatuionship with others. It would be like existing in an ink-pot, breathing and eating ink. So we won’t pre-judge them for their choice, just point out that Allah says in the Qur’an that those who are metaphorically blind in this life will be blind in the next.
I don’t know why I have never developed a logical though channel which tells me that the asphyxiation by lies that I experience through allergy to lying politics, which is the only sort that now exists in USUKIS, is a natural reaction to external malice. Lie-allergy , like pollen allergy, really messes up my mental health, as indeed it is intended to do by the evil liars. So I apologise for the anger in my rants.
@giyane 11:01
You have my every sympathy. Religion aside there are no doubt very many people of a certain age in this country who feel as you do. Strangely, only the other day I personally contemplated the sad reality of having been lied to throughout my life, by adults as a child and peers since. For whatever reason the propensity to lie appears endemic within organisations of every complexion, be they commercial, political, educational – you name it. Politicians have merely perfected the art (or at least behave as though they have).
It may not come as much of a comfort to you but you are not alone.
Thank you for your friendly response. Can one assume that the total silence from Mrs May for the last 2 weeks is because nobody’s believed a word they’ve said? presumably there is some sort of alien creature lying inside the exterminate machine, which is now exhausted by peddling such volumes of trash with its tiny little feet.
I feel the same way, Giyane. What I particularly detest is having to converse with people who I know are lying to me and whom for some reason I have to relate to as if they aren’t. That includes tradesmen such as medics, dentists, builders, car mechanics, sales scum, and other “muggers with attitude” who have learnt one or two tricks about how to influence people, which they apply day in, day out, and who have even more contempt for punters who baulk as for punters who play their role.
And the fact is that most people in the country do NOT feel the same way. The whole ideosphere works against their even developing the concepts they need.
Amen and ditto to everything articulated in the previous 4 posts; all decent people must share these feelings. I take comfort in the conviction that the negative and destructive forces that are on the rampage and appear to have the upper hand at the moment, cannot and will not prevail in the long run. They contain the seeds of their own destruction. Like Giyane I shall try and keep breathing the clean fresh air and making sure to rip the p*** out of the opposition whenever there’s chance – they hate ridicule and derision above all.
N_
Thank you as well. I had fun this week with a builder I was working with. He was annoyed with me spending too much time with the design team, trying to get to the bottom of what they real want. He said I was doing his head in. The atmosphere on site slightly tensed for an hour or so, but later, while I was sitting on the floor terminating floor-sockets, he started putting down floor board with an impact drill.
” You’re going to have to stop that mate, your vibrations are tickling my backside and I don’t like it.
Reply:” Your religion doesn’t allow that kind of thing? Don’t worry your wife’ll tickle your backside for you when you get home. ”
I told him I wasn’t saying whether I liked it or didn’t like it, or whether it was allowed in Islam or not. I was just saying he was the wrong person to do it if I had the choice.
Some in Tory circles are terrified of Jacob Rees-Mogg who wields his own party within a party in parliament, the
Elect Rees-Mogg GroupEuropean Research Group.Everyone hates the Home Secretary and nobody wants the job – except perhaps a relatively small-time provincial criminal such as Esther McVey (although in her case she does know stuff about the Madeleine McCann affair, but she’s hardly alone in that – a crook like her knows how to slurp up and spit downwards). That’s why the Home Office goes to such dickheads as David Waddington and Theresa May – people who couldn’t run a whelk stall. It’s not really one of the “great offices of state”, regardless of what some people say. Its budget and hence the amount received in backhanders is far less than at the Ministry of Defence or the Department for Work and Pensions.
If anybody in the Tory pighouse had the power to stop Rees-Mogg, they’d have got Theresa May to offer him the Home Office yesterday. Or they would have built up “speculation” over a day or two, if they could have managed. Beard him in the street: “Mr Rees-Mogg, is it true that Theresa May offered you the Home Office?” He would have turned it down – the office is far below the level at which he operates – and they could have publicised that fact. “Mogg ran away.” “Mogg couldn’t step up to the mark.” But that didn’t happen. He is in a very strong position.
In previous weeks, they would also have brought Rees-Mogg into the Alfie Evans affair. He would of course have had to take a pro-parent position (which as it happens I agree with, and so do most of the British population), but the point is that he didn’t want to take any position at all and to force him to adopt one would have harmed him. Never mind that most people would actually agree with him. Politics is about emotions, and many would not enjoy watching him intervene, given the flavour of his highly-managed persona and the current positioning of his brand. More watchers would have sussed that he is on his way to Number Ten too, whereas the moment for spreading that realisation is not yet considered ripe.
Anybody who thinks the next PM will be Boris Johnson is a fool. Theresa May is just stopgap. Her stint in the job isn’t to pave the way for that cokehead womanising bozo at the Foreign Office, who isn’t even trusted to run the Brexit negotiations, let alone receive intelligence from MI6, and who could be “scandalled” out of politics within about five minutes flat and probably will be.
Instead, in what is a Tory joke – the culture of the Tory party causes decent human beings to want to vomit, but must be understood regardless – the post was given to Sajid Javid for no other reason than that he is a “darkie”, a “coloured”, a “western oriental gentleman” from what remains the viewpoint of the vast majority of Tories as they laugh into their hampers and their bank statements, unbothered by their offspring who they’ve packed off to live in institutions for most of the year. Betfair have Javid at around 1\19 for not being the next prime minister – well that’s an easy way to make a 5.3% return.
If Jeremy Corbyn doesn’t go in for the kill today against Theresa May, he’ll be a total wimp.
I am very touched by all these commentators great faith in the impartiality of the pronouncements of the OPCW, when even our esteemed Foreign Secretary, and some of our close allies, make no secret of doubting their competence and expertise in declaring Russia and Syria compliant with their treaty obligations.
They could, after all, have saved themselves hundreds of millions of dollars by adjusting their boundaries of suspended disbelief just a little. But it is our place to be expected to perform that manoeuvre, and believe what they say, and not follow the authority of the example set by their actions.
So for myself I can’t rule out BZ, it would explain the presumed lack of a fatal outcome. Though since the Skipals have disappeared as completely as those unfortunates kidnapped by frogmen some years ago, it can only be a circumstantial surmise. I would of thought our beneficent rulers might have been quite keen to avoid even the appearance of following the example of authoritarian excess set by North Korea, but apparently not. Which I think gives some further indication of the depth of the hole they find themselves in.
Scott Humor, in his book “POKÉMON IN UKRAINE” explores the augmented reality created by fake news. I quote most of the meat of the book below, as I am entitled to do in a review (One star, He gets bogged down in detail. Though if you were looking for a compendium of hyperlinks to cell phone footage of events following on from Victoria Nuland and the state departments expenditure of five billion dollars, some of which went on “social media training”, to the stated end of spreading democracy, you might give it more.)
“Not much written or discussed in public about augmented reality war games by their architects and players, due to their biggest weakness: they are successful as long as they can pretend to be something else.”
“There isn’t now, no there never will be a “victory” in any AR war game for nongamers, since playing a war game for anyone, but the Game Masters, means losing it, since the main the objective of any AR war game is to pull into the war non-players. From the moment of it inception, an AR war game must be handled as a malicious software program that requires one or more anti-viruses to disable its functions and to dismantle its blocks of augmented reality erected by its players.”
Humor, Scott. POKÉMON IN UKRAINE: Tactical War Game Introduction MANUAL (War Game Manuals Book 1). Memph Inc.. Kindle Edition.
[ MOD: Caught in spam-filter, timestamp updated ]
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To BBC: Dear BBC News, Yesterday a press conference was held at the OPCW in the Hague. Is was broadcast live, and can be reviewed at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBKX20Xeul8. The conference was regarding the alleged chemical attack in Douma. During the conference the UK, US and French sides of the argument were completely destroyed and blown out of the water. The British government was completely exposed and all of their lies were laid bare for us to see. However I have not seen any coverage on the BBC news website, or any reference on television. This is a huge scandal which has a capacity to cause the end of the current government and potential criminal investigations. Why have you not covered this properly? It is disgusting. It is the public interest. All I have on the BBC news front page today are stories about North Korea (as usual), people having tattoos and other opinion pieces. This press conference is a whopper of a story and yet you seem disinclined to present a balanced view of the story and only string along the Government’s position. I don’t know if you had reporters there, but all of the questions were aggressive and doubted the logical explanation of events. You have a duty to cover this story. (I actually just had a look for the story and it is buried on the website under something called BBC OS. Apart from that, there are no comments or political analysis). Regards,
BBC Reply: I understand you felt there was insufficient coverage of a press conference at the OPCW on 26 April.
We know that not everyone will agree with our choices on which stories to cover, or the order in which they appear. Our news editors make these complex decisions, based on the editorial merit of all the stories at hand. We accept that not everyone will agree with each decision – various factors are at play and there’s often debate in the newsroom too.
A range of factors affect how we put together our news bulletins. Is it breaking news, or a dated story? Does it follow on from a recent event, or change our understanding of things? Is it unusual, or attracting national interest? We consider these things and also put great importance on verifying events and building up a clear picture – before reporting in a reliable and trustworthy way.
Editorial decisions are more of a judgement call, than an exact science – so you’ll even find variety from one BBC programme to the next. Time constraints, the expected audience profile and the style of each bulletin or current affairs programme can all play a part. Nevertheless, we appreciate the feedback that our viewers and listeners give us when they feel a story has been overlooked or marginalised.
All complaints are sent to senior management and programme makers every morning and we have included your points in this overnight report. These reports are among the most widely read sources of feedback in the BBC and ensures that your complaint has been seen by the right people quickly.
Thank you again for taking the time to contact us
@ JT April 30, 2018 at 12:33
Jolly good find and subsequent letter. I suggest you send copies of your complaint and the BBC response to the non-government sites that cover media bias (I can’t think of their names now, but I believe there are at least two in the UK). Also copy to UK Column: [email protected] . I’ll copy your information to Tony Gosling, in Bristol, who I’m sure will be interested.
There was coverage of sorts – and I use the term “coverage” very loosely – on BBC World Service where the press conference was described as a “piece of theatre”. We weren’t permitted to hear the evidence that the Russians were presenting. Instead, the correspondent present was speaking in hushed tones and describing the scene, from her position at the back of the room, to the programme’s studio-based presenter and listeners. Apparently it was “impossible to know who these people are or where they’ve come from” despite them, as I understand it, being the people shown in the hosed kids video. (I’ve not yet watched the YouTube video you linked to.) Obviously if the BBC had covered this on the television instead of solely the radio, the public would have been able to judge for themselves whether the people brought to the press conference were the alleged chemical weapons victims shown in the video, but that wouldn’t have done at all. It was very clear from the way it was presented on BBC World Service that the listener was meant to take away the impression that this was the despicable Russians once again trying to cause confusion and make us doubt reality and that they were sinking too a new low by involving childen. At one point, one of the Syrian children wandered close to the whispering correspondent who, by asking the child repeatedly (in English) “Hello? Hello? Are you ok?”, was somehow able to deduce, and relay back to the presenter in the studio, that the child was looking for her mother and that the woman who she’d been sat with and had been introduced as her mother actually wasn’t!
“impossible to know who these people are or where they’ve come from”
What a disgusting lie. There were TWO people from the video — a boy and a male nurse — right in front of her.
Clive’s comments are convincing, over the reason WHY the attack was carried out, but the problem I still have is the METHOD. I can see that it would throw someone ‘off the sceent’ so to speak. Still though, it creates a LOT of extra work for little gain. Unless you are taking the attitude that it will ‘kill tow birds whith one stone’
However, regardless of who or why, it DOES sufficiently muddy the waters of responsibility. Leaving me with only one form conclusion – that the Russian State was definitely NOT responsible for this particular attack.
If this HAD been down to the Russian State then Putin would have to sack everyone remotely involved with it for being completely incompetent…
@ Bu axmoqlik April 30, 2018 at 08:57
‘Don’t expect this post to stay up long, the posters on here believe Murray’s “Probable” rather than the OPCW’s agreement with the UK Govt’s “Highly Probable”
Remember all the posts regarding BZ contamination posted on here? All of that stushi came direct from the Kremlin. They are literally like robots.’
I replied, asking you a few questions, as you seem so blinkered regarding the Russian Devil:
‘@ Bu axmoqlik April 30, 2018 at 08:57
Who planted the bomb/s at Bologna Staion? Who shot up supermarkets in Brabant? Who planted plutonium on an Aeroflot aircraft?
Yes, I’m afraid, the ‘usual suspects’.’
I know you say ‘patience is a virtue’, but I’m just reminding you in case you missed my reply.
I do find rather odd your apparent conviction that ‘our’ government’s word is beyond reproach, despite the attempts at ‘Regime Change’ going right back to the 1950’s, and the obvious lies of Iraqi WMD. I believe Bliar was going to inform the public, in time, of the ‘slam dunk’ info he had on Iraq – seems to have slipped Bliar’s mind.
For those who wonder why Britain sent samples to the French for testing, I think the answer is obvious – France was already planning to engage with the US and British ‘punishment’ bombardment of the planned White Helmet’ ruse, so could be counted on to go along with and confirm what the Brits said was in the samples.
Also, an aside: wouldn’t it better to have had the incident occur (or be said to have occurred) in Salisbury Cathedral, with CCTV coverage of a furtive, unidentifiable (due to camera angle just catching his back, but clear enough to show the copy of the ‘Morning Star’ under his arm, and another shot of the Skripals just entering the Cathedral on another CCTV camera? Bring a bit of religion and cloak and dagger into it all – much better theatre.
Agreed, the use of such a location would have a powerful effect. An order for the first such “Baedeker raid” would be a big step indeed. Look what has happened with the use of cars as murder weapons against pedestrians.
anyone else finding there’s a lot of ticks this year? Only seen one in my life before now, and that was on a cat. Took 15 off one of my cats yesterday, 3 more off the same one today, my 3 month old daughter had one behind her ear and my 3yr old son had 2 round the back by his hairline. This is after playing on our lawn, little one laying on a blanket.
Reading about ticks it seems a lab has reported a new bacteria in ticks which is resistant to antibiotics. The lab… Porton Down.
I’m not too far gone to be seeing a conspiracy here, but it did make me laugh. Nervously mind you…
Hoping this is the most suitable thread to post this update:
Very Interesting Syrian links/SVR involving our old friend, Professor Leonard Rink:
Rink Ринка
ЦУР проверил ближневосточные связи автора «Новичка»
The LRC checked the Middle East relations of the author of the “Novice”
https://medium.com/@tzurrealism/rink-d47d9e53b16f
Rink has been changing his story from day 1, threatening to sue, then backing down, there is a lot more here than meets the eye. I am trying to get more information from the author and journalists, I will update when I know more, in the meantime:
Rink’s Russian Wikipedia page: https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A0%D0%B8%D0%BD%D0%BA,_%D0%9B%D0%B5%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B4_%D0%98%D0%B3%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%B2%D0%B8%D1%87