The UK and the US are both sending military assistance to Israel to commit a calculated and deliberate act of genocide, which is already underway.
Over 500 children have been killed in Gaza in the last week and over 2,000 maimed, many with life changing injuries. Nobody can claim they do not know what is already happening or what is about to unfold. The cutting off of food and water to Gaza is a major international crime, which the western proponents of the “rules based order” universally refuse to condemn.
In both the UK and the US there can be no more stark illustration of the lack of any kind of meaningful democracy, than the fact that there is no major political party that opposes the genocide – despite massive public opposition.
The bought and paid for media and political class in the west are extremely nervous, throughout the western world. Now they have come to the final genocide for which zionism has always aimed, they face a good deal of popular resistance.
Throughout Europe there is a massive gap between the zionist unanimity of the politicians and the much greater understanding of the Palestinian situation among the general public. Tellingly the response by the zionist political class has been a wave of outright fascist suppression.
In France, Macron has made all pro-Palestinian demonstrations illegal, but as so often the French people are not standing for that kind of authoritarianism.
In the UK, the police have adopted the cowardly tactic of arresting a couple of individuals, one in Brighton and one in Manchester, for pro-Palestinian demonstration. Under Tony Blair’s notorious draconian “anti-terror” legislation, they could face up to 14 years in prison.
The young man in Manchester was arrested on the precise site of the famous “Peterloo massacre”, which generations of British people were taught at school was a terrible crime in breach of the rights to freedom of speech and assembly. Let the irony of that set in.
You can go out in the streets of the UK with an Israeli flag and yell that you want every Palestinian to be cleansed from Gaza. That is not illegal. If you say the Palestinians have a right to resist their genocide, that is illegal.
That appears to be a genuine analysis of the law in the UK, France and many other western countries.
That is intended to terrify all of us. It will not work.
The European Commission has been ferociously zionist and gung-ho for this Palestinian genocide. It displayed the Israeli flag on its Berlaymont headquarters. It has taken a side in the most ferocious way.
It is therefore deeply sinister that the European Commission is actively working to shut down pro-Palestinian information and comment on social media. The European Commission has written to all major social media organisations and is able to threaten them with massive fines if they do not remove information of which the European Union disapproves.
Following the terrorist attacks by Hamas against š®š±, we have indications of X/Twitter being used to disseminate illegal content & disinformation in the EU.
Urgent letter to @elonmusk on #DSA obligations ā¤µļø pic.twitter.com/avMm1LHq54
— Thierry Breton (@ThierryBreton) October 10, 2023
The notion is plainly nonsense that through the fog of war the European Commission – which is 100% parti pris – is qualified to say what information is true and what information is false, and what comment is legitimate.
Thierry Breton, the European Commissioner in charge of this operation, is a former chief executive of electronic companies – and defence contractors – Atos and Thomson. He has no genuine interest in freedom of speech, and is engaged in a process of silencing dissent for military aims, which is quite simply fascist.
We are witnessing almost all western governments deliberately facilitating massacre, ethnic cleansing and genocide. We are witnessing almost all western governments turning on their own people to crush dissent at that complicity in genocide.
This feels not so much like the week that western democracy died, as the week it was impossible any longer to deny that western democracy died some time ago.
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I am baffled how the corporate press, state media and government officials can still pretend there is equivalence in this ‘war’.
One side is carrying on with life as normal, albeit ruffled by the extraordinary incompetence at their government, and grieving for fellow citizens murdered in the prisoner’s savage revolt.
The other is dying in their thousands, sent baffled and panicked in the many hundreds of thousands, picking their way through rubble-strewn roads with what possessions they still have in donkey-carts, bereft of food, electricity, water or medical care, no communications or Internet access, to god only knows what future out in the desert, assuming they make it there, with bombs and white phosphorus raining down and a ground invasion (ie massacre) to arrive at any moment.
Yet the priority is (1) stating and re-stating complete and total support for Israel, and (2) demanding any critic of the Palestinians’ plight condemn Hamas repeatedly (and allowing little else to be said), before accusing the critics of supporting terrorism.
I simply don’t understand how our civilisation can have sunk this low.
I’ve noticed extraordinary contempt towards the Palestinian people, on other (non-political) forums I frequent from British people especially. The kind of forums that have a General branch for chitchat about current events, and is usually pre-occupied with house prices or inflation.
The opinions I’ve observed include ‘mowing the lawn’, and ‘the Israelis need to de-nazify the Gaza strip’, and ‘kill every male over the age of 14, and any women who get in the way’. Basically parroting the Israeli government position.
One person remarked that even though the 40-beheaded-babies story has been debunked, ‘where there is smoke, there is fire’.
You could say, “job done” from an Israeli narrative control perspective.
The ‘gotcha’ response I’ve observed to any comment requesting the minimum level of human decency to be shown to the Palestinians: ‘their own governments steal from them, there is in-fighting between Palestinian factions, their neighbours don’t care for them. So why should we?’
Just be aware, there is an extraordinary level of ignorance and insensitivity out there. It is also impossible to avoid the conclusion that it is rooted in racism.
How people are being doxxed, smeared, and fired by the pro-Zionist media and businesses when they speak out against Israeli atrocities in Gaza.
https://www.nplusonemag.com/online-only/online-only/a-surge-in-suppression/
The plucky French defy President Macron.
“Macron has banned pro-Palestine demonstrations in France. So many people came to demonstrate in Paris tonight that Macronās police were forced to leave.”
https://nitter.net/ashoswai/status/1715077746764788046#m
It is happening again. Israel send warning to al-Quds hospital which have thousands workers/patients at the moment to leave!
Israel warn hospital to evacuate or face consequences
Al Jazeera: Israeli military told director of Al-Quds hospital to evacuate or bear consequences (20 Oct 2023) – YouTube, 10m 28s
Of course Israel is going to keep bombing hospitals after the greenlight and support they got from west from the last time they bombed a hospital.
I cannot realize that I watch a genocide in real time and no power have the willngness let alone courage to step up and stop it.
“Israel warn hospital to evacuate or face consequences”
“If you don’t leave at once, you will be hit by another errant Hamas missile”
“and if you do leave immediately, we will bomb you when you get where we told you to go”
US POTUS Biden seeks almost $11 billion dollars for Israel.
“Biden sent emergency spending package to Congress for $105 billion:
— $61.4 billion for Ukraine
— $10.6 billion for Israel
— $9 billion in humanitarian aid for Ukraine, Gaza, Israel.
— $12 billion for border agents.
— $7.4 billion for Taiwan, other Pacific allies.”
https://nitter.net/ggreenwald/status/1715433097838170275#m
Meanwhile there a vicious crackdown on anyone who speaks out in Israel, against the slaughter of the Palestinians in the Gaza.
https://nitter.net/SystemUpdate_/status/1715394259736580175#m
Mind you the Barrack/Biden admin has form on supporting the Zionist occupying force.
“The Obama/Biden administration, as one the last things they did in office, signed a 10-year deal with Netanyahu to provide Israel with a record-breaking $38 billion aid package.”
https://nitter.net/ggreenwald/status/1715372405902713338#m
This CBS news poll is depressing, maybe its fixed.
“It’s bizarre that 32% believe Biden isn’t showing enough support for Israel. He offered Israel full and unlimited support the way he did for Ukraine: what more could he do besides deploying troops?”
https://nitter.net/ggreenwald/status/1715372405902713338#m
Will these shells be used outside of Gaza as well, the West Bank or Lebanon etc.
“Pentagon to send Israel “tens of thousands” of 155mm artillery shells originally intended for Ukraine. This is, reportedly, to prepare for a ground invasion of Gaza.
In other words, one proxy war is over, and another is beginning..”
https://nitter.net/KitKlarenberg
Channel 4 News this evening: Further evidence that contradicts Israel’s version of events re hospital.
Missile came from north-easterly direction!
“Missile came from north-easterly direction!”
Probably made a U-turn, then. Mustn’t rush to judgement.
Some commenters have expressed confusion about why the US, UK etc. back Israel no matter what, yet seeminlgly get nothing in return.
The reason, says Jonathan Cook, is that
“[Gaza] was turned into a mix of testing ground and shop window, [enabling Israel to] develop all sorts of new technologies and strategies associated with the homeland security industries burgeoning across the West, as officials there grew increasingly worried about domestic unrest.
The siege of Gazaās 2.3 million Palestinians, imposed by Israel in 2007 following the election of Hamas to rule the enclave, allowed for all sorts of experiments.
How could the population best be contained? What restrictions could be placed on their diet and lifestyle? How were networks of informers and collaborators to be recruited from afar? What effect did the populationās entrapment and repeated bombardment have on social and political relations?
And ultimately how were Gazaās inhabitants to be kept subjugated and an uprising prevented?
The answers to those questions were made available to Western allies through Israelās shopping portal. Items available included interception rocket systems, electronic sensors, surveillance systems, drones, facial recognition, automated gun towers, and much more. All tested in real-life situations in Gaza.”
He later concludes: “Western officials are more than happy with the direction of travel. Not just for Israelās sake but for their own too. Because one day in the future, their own populations may be as much trouble to them as Palestinians in Gaza are to Israel right now.”
So, in the event that when we own nothing we don’t end up being happy, our overlords will have all the military-tech-spook knowledge gained from Israel to keep us in our place.
Full article here: https://www.declassifieduk.org/lawless-in-gaza-why-britain-and-the-west-back-israels-crimes/
Israeli ambassador to the UK make the most sickening what-about argument,
She basically say: UK killed 600’000 civilians in WW2 so who are you to question us??
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zphG6Eokke4
Are this woman even human? Who even talk like this unless you are a sociopathic killer? Look at her theatrical expressions too, devoid of any soul, moral nor decency. But statemens like these is laying the groundwork for legitimization of killing civilians. I have heard other israeli reps. using the same type of justification for the western listener.
Of course there have been laws made since the World wars that declare it is unlawful to hurt, harm, kill civilans.
“She basically say: UK killed 600ā000 civilians in WW2 so who are you to question us??”
No-one ever told her that two wrongs don’t equal a right, obviously. In any case, the people who were responsible for the civilian deaths in WWII are not the same people that are questioning Israel’s actions now.
Can’t stand the western news coverage. They keep talking about Gaza as if it’s been struck by a natural disaster, for example, an earthquake or a flood. It’s an ongoing man-made catastrophe, Nobody wants to say the obvious; that if Israel simply stops its ridiculously excessive bombing campaign, plus incursion, the humanitarian crisis is over.
And Sunak is acting more like a roving US/Israeli diplomat, conducting shuttle diplomacy in the region. Popping up alongside ‘bone saw’ Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman in Riyadh. Today it’s de facto western installed dictator, Abdel el-Sisi in Cairo.
UK leaders and citizens seems to have been reduced to 2nd class US citizenship sans the constitutional rights, by the ‘special relationship’ NATO and FVEYs. You can bet Sunak reassured them, that we’d view any Gaza genocide and land grab as unacceptable. And no doubt London would complain… for a few days, before moving on. No sanctions, nothing. His party is even pressing ahead with legislation banning councils boycotting goods from the occupied territories.
” Today itās de facto western installed dictator, Abdel el-Sisi in Cairo.”
Please, he is the elected leader of a democracy. Authoritarian dictators only rule countries of which we disapprove.
Piers Morgan made the same despicable argument with the splendid Egypt comedian/satirist Bassem Youssef,
https://youtu.be/4idQbwsvtUo?t=586
Piers: We killed alot of civilians against ISIS so…what do you expect Israel to do?
Well Piers if Israel could get away with killing civilians, why all this fuss about Hamas doing the same?
Jonathan Freedland repeats the civilian casualty trope of the 7th October incursion, suggesting ‘1400 civilians killed’ (Guardian 21/10). Haaretz Israeli newspaper lists the names of those killed that have been ‘cleared for publication’. The filter provided lists under half (339/683) of those named as ‘civilians’.
So the 1500 Hamas fighters who died weren’t just killing civilians, they bloodied the nose of the IDF, in a proportion yet to be clarified.
As a precursor to bulldozing the fence on October 7th the Gazans marched regularly in great numbers for 20 months in 2018-19, protesting to return to the lands they were displaced from – The Great March of Return. In that time 180 Gazans were killed, shot through the fence by Israeli snipers. One IDF soldier was injured.
1400 Gazans were wounded with three to five bullets.
Yes, the Israelis are very brave soldiers, killing unarmed Palestinian protesters, including women, children and those in wheelchairs.
In Bloomberg:
“Why Gaza Is Home to So Many Palestinian Refugees
by Ethan Bronner,
For Palestinians, the day after Israel declared independence in 1948 is referred to as the āNakba,ā the Arabic word for disaster. It marked the start of a war in which some 700,000 Arabs were expelled from or fled their homes as the new state was established on what had been British-ruled Palestine.” https://archive.ph/6RaG9
When Bronner manages to tell a huge lie in just the two first sentences, I really cannot be bothered with reading the rest
For people who don’t know any of the history: approximately 1/3 of the Palestinian refugees were made before Israel declared its independence 14th May 1948. Before that day, Haganah/Irgun/Lehi were busy clearing the coastal area, and an area leading to Jerusalem for any Palestinians. Eg: the Deir Yassin massacre (just west of Jerusalem) took place on the 9-10th of April -48: Irgun/Lehi killed more than a 100 Palestinian civilians (many children & women), and expelled the rest eastwards.
But Israel wants to paint itself as the totally innocent nation that was brutally assaulted by its neighbouring countries as soon as they declared independence.
Oh, and the author of this BS, Ethan Brenner, is married to an Israeli, and has a son who served in the Israeli army.
No COI at all.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irgun
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lehi_(militant_group)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haganah
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_Yassin_massacre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conflict_of_interest
funny I just read Norman FinkelsteinĀ“s Appendix II from his “Beyond Chutzpah” where he dissects the historic fallacies of Alan DershowitzĀ“ bestselling book “The Case for Israel”.
Even though Finkelstein proved the bestseller to be a second-rate work he was the main casualty of that public affair since the media empire stayed on DershowitzĀ“ side and FinkelsteinĀ“s academic career would end.
In Appendix II Finkelstein makes a few comments on Deir Yassin. He quotes from Benny MorrisĀ“ work who is one of DershowitzĀ“ main references albeit Dershowitz is continuously misrepresenting MorrisĀ“ true statements.
Here the entire tragic Finkelstein-Dershowitz case, which poves again that its meaningless if you are right if you meddle with people more powerful.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dershowitz%E2%80%93Finkelstein_affair
The bad ending in detail: denial of tenure for Finkelstein see below:
my last comment before: This mechanism is the main reason why in Germany e.g. critical scholarship on Israel has its limits. Which in itself is just an outrageous injustice, hampering scholarship and critical thinking and eventually bolsters such genocidal politics as now supported by the Scholz people. This is why scholarship and setting up normative rules based on that scholarship is such a contested realm. It starts with writing books and ends with letting people get killed and hospitals bombed. Aka “intellectual culture”.
“(…)
In September 2006, Alan Dershowitz sent members of DePaul University’s law and political science faculties what he described as “a dossier of Norman Finkelstein’s most egregious academic sins, and especially his outright lies, misquotations, and distortions that… are not incidental to Finkelstein’s purported scholarship; they are Finkelstein’s purported scholarship,” and he lobbied professors, alumni and administrators to deny Finkelstein tenure.[28][29] De Paul’s political science committee investigated the accusations against Finkelstein and concluded that they were not based on legitimate criticism. The department subsequently invited John Mearsheimer and Ian Lustick, two uninvolved academics with expertise on the Israel/Palestine conflict, to evaluate the academic merit of Finkelstein’s work. Mearsheimer and Lustick came to the same conclusion.[29] In April 2007 the De Paul University Liberal Arts and Sciences’ Faculty Governance Council had voted unanimously to send a letter to Harvard University expressing “the council’s dismay at Professor Dershowitz’s interference in Finkelstein’s tenure and promotion case.”[28]
In early 2007, the DePaul University Political Science department voted 9 to 3, and the College of Liberal Arts and Sciences Personnel Committee 5 to 0, in favor of giving Finkelstein tenure. The three opposing faculty members subsequently filed a minority report opposing tenure, supported by the Dean of the College, Chuck Suchar. Suchar stated he opposed tenure because Finkelstein’s “personal and reputation demeaning attacks on Alan Dershowitz, Benny Morris, and the holocaust authors Eli Wiesel and Jerzy Kosinski” were inconsistent with DePaul’s “Vincentian” values.[30] In June 2007 a 4ā3 vote by DePaul University’s Board on Promotion and Tenure (a faculty board), affirmed by the university’s president, the Rev. Dennis Holtschneider, denied Finkelstein tenure.
(…)”
Scholarship is returning to what it was in the C18th, the preserve of those with private incomes and part-time scholars.
Actually that’s quite correct … isn’t Substack doing just that? Sadly so? (Sadly because it’s a reaction to a backlash of the system of privileges.)
And then are we commentators not some minor case of republic of letters???
The Intercept reports that German major SPRINGER PRESS orders the staff of its online news app “Upday” (which I dont know or use) to downplay Palestinian casualties.
From confidential interviews with employees of Upday:
“(…) Leadership at Upday, a subsidiary of the Germany-based publishing giant Axel Springer, gave instructions to prioritize the Israeli perspective and minimize Palestinian civilian deaths in coverage, according to the employees. āWe canāt push anything involving Palestinian death tolls or casualties without information about Israel coming higher up in the story,ā an employee told The Intercept, referring to push notifications, the alerts sent to millions of phones. The employees, who asked for anonymity to protect their livelihoods, said there was widespread discomfort throughout the company over the moves. (…)”
Springer strongly contradicts “āWe strongly contest the indirect allegations you make,ā said Julia Sommerfeld.”
“(…)Top Upday officialsā high regard for Israel was apparent in everyday communications: In the companyās Slack, an Israeli flag appears beside the avatar of Updayās CEO Thomas Hirsch, according to the employees. (Upday did not respond to The Interceptās direct request for comment.)
āThere is a very absurd media push for really dismissing and invisibilizing any Palestinian sympathy,ā said Ahlam Muhtaseb, a professor of media studies at California State University, San Bernardino, when asked about Updayās internal directives. āThe one-sided Israeli victimhood narrative demands buy-in from media institutions and the U.S. government itself.ā(…)”
complete report:
https://theintercept.com/2023/10/19/upday-news-gaza-israel-axel-springer/
” Europeās Largest News Aggregator Orders Editors to Play Down Palestinian Deaths
Upday, an app owned by the German media giants Axel Springer, is instructing journalists to cover the war in Gaza with a pro-Israel bent.”
by Daniel Boguslaw
Oct. 19th 2023
Of course the real issue here is the structural misrepresentation and misinformation offered by most Western papers as “news” which by their very staffs are not even recognized as misinformation. They think its the “truth”.
In the case presented by The Intercept it is an obvious conflict between employers and employees. Latter are aware of something unjust.
In Germany such a push wouldnĀ“t be necessary.
Here many media workers know so little about the realities in the Palestine case that by design anything not supportive of Israel they firstly will always treat with much distrust and most likely as pro-Palestine aka antisemitic PROPAGANDA.
Unlike anything “pro-Israel” which wonĀ“t be scrutinzed by far as much as any criticism.
So there you donĀ“t have to nudge or push anyone anywhere in the first place. They already believe what is convenient to the system.
This naturally is by now – Edward HermanĀ“s & Noam ChomskyĀ“s “Manufacturing Consent” first appeared in 1988 – well known by any serious scholar or adult paper reader.
But to prove THAT is much harder than such blunt manipulation as conceived by SPRINGER.
p.s. you could argue Springer did “good” work by picking the “wrong” people for their writing staff.
Here’s the segment from this evenings Channel 4 News which casts further doubt on Israel’s version of events regards the hospital explosion:
Human rights investigators raise new questions on Gaza hospital explosion
https://www.channel4.com/news/human-rights-investigators-raise-new-questions-on-gaza-hospital-explosion
“Hereās the segment from this evenings Channel 4 News which casts further doubt on Israelās version of events regards the hospital explosion:”
In other words; Israel was lying, and subsequently fabricating evidence to back up their lies.
I can’t say that this comes as any surprise to me; but I wonder what our ‘open minded’ poster Philip Patrick thinks of these reports? especially as they do not seem to have made any headlines in the UK newspaper and other tv media websites, and therefore seem not to be considered as newsworthy for UK consumers.
If our news is being controlled to this extent, there seems little point in believing any of it any more.
āIn other words; Israel was lying, ā
=====
But only latterly.
Initially, the truth was told by Netanyahu appointee, Hananya Naftali, In a tweet subsequently deleted when the truth became an international embarrassment:
āBREAKING: Israeli Air Force struck a Hamas terrorist base inside a hospital in Gaza.
A multiple number of terrorists are dead.ā
The above is my transcription of the screen grab of Naftaliās tweet before he deleted it. It was captured on 17 October by Ika Ferrer GotiÄ.
Yves Smith from Naked Capitalism on occasion of a new huge Michael Hudson interview with this statement on Syria:
“One minor point: Hudson mentions the US thinking it can move against Syria because Russia is tied down in Ukraine. I have not been able to independently verify it, but Alexander Mercouris reported that a key US ally in Syria, the Kurds, are siding with the Muslim world against Israel and its US/EU allies. I welcome reader comment as to how big a setback this represents for the USā burning desire to topple Assad.”
see:
https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2023/10/russia-china-unite-against-us-empire.html
I havenĀ“t checked Mercouris. And one always has to be wary of any short-circuit verdicts of such major geopolitical events.
But itĀ“s probable that these things donĀ“t just happen cause Netanyahu had too many Kentucky Bourbons the night before.
Last week Sir Keir Starmer was asked directly by Nick Ferrari on LBC: “A siege is appropriate? Cutting off power, cutting off water, Sir Keir?”Ā Ā
Millions of people saw with their own eyes Sir Keir respond: “Well I think Israel does have that right.”
Yesterday he told ITV News: “I was saying Israel had the right to self-defence… I was not saying Israel had the right to cut off water, food, fuel or medicines”.
The clarification has been accepted without comment by the entire MSM and his Conservatves opponents.
There is a school of thought promoted even on the left (by Novara Media and friends) that Labour’s pollingĀ success is attributable in good measure to Starmer being “good at politics”.
It’s like saying someone is good at crime because the police keep refusing to catch them.
They should catch him and half of the judiciary for daring to pervert the system they command, keeping Julian Assange in jail.
As for his Zionist wriggling on the Geneva convention and international human rights that apply to Palestinians as well. He is a liar and backstabber who will do anything to big himself up.
He should be arrested like his fraudster pal Netanyahu.
“The clarification has been accepted without comment by the entire MSM and his Conservatves opponents.”
Just goes to show that the Conservatives aren’t his opponents. Who did they round on when Johnson attacked him over Jimmy Savile? Johnson, of course. Starmer’s their man in the Labour Party. It was most likely them who told him he would have to lie about what he said.
They did indeed, well remembered. There is something very unsettling about the collective raising up of this character by the British establishment.
Israel plan expanding war, thus they are calling on israelis to return home from Egypt, Jordan, Turkey etc. Apparently Israel have the right to expand the war, meanwhile if Iran, Syria, Hezbollah warn Israel from continuing the assault they are blamed for trying to expand the war!?
Israel asks citizens to leave Jordan and Egypt immediately
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2023/10/20/israel-gaza-war-live-hamas-releases-two-american-captives-from-gaza
And the diseases are lurking in the background with full acceptance of Israel and the west…..an invasion on top of this=the humantarian crisis would be total.
Gazaās next big threat: Cholera, infectious diseases amid total blockade
Humanitarian organisations warn deadly water-born diseases will spread in the besieged strip if aid is not allowed in.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/21/gazas-next-big-threat-cholera-infectious-diseases-amid-total-blockade
The non western world must step forward and declare this is not ok, someone need to stop this madness.
I do not understand why Hamas release captives, that just proves they can be persuaded to do so without getting anything in return, or actually this is what they get in return, this happend just hours after the relase of the captives:
Israeli Army Says Carried Out Strikes on Hamas Observation Posts in Multistory Buildings
“Overnight, IDF fighter jets continued to strike a large number of Hamas terror targets throughout the Gaza Strip. Among these terror targets were operational command centers, anti-tank missile launchers, and strategic Hamas infrastructure used for terror purposes,” the IDF said.
“Furthermore, the IDF struck Hamas anti-tank missile, sniper, and observation posts located inside multi-story buildings,” it said.
https://sputnikglobe.com/20231021/live-updates-israel-defense-forces-aircraft-striking-hezbollah-targets-1114375845.html
As more captives are released etc, the sooner the total destruction of Gaza would come true.
“I do not understand why Hamas release captives, that just proves they can be persuaded to do so without getting anything in return,”
Actually I don’t agree with that. I think the release is intended to send a message to Israel that the “hostages” (i.e. prisoners) are alive and can be recovered, but if the bombing continues at this rate, they won’t be for long, as they will be killed by the bombing. that is, the aim is to reduce the bombing. Personally I think the aim is mistaken, as the Hannibal doctrine dictates that Israel abandons to death any prisoner taken by its opponents.
I’d likely make a bet that the structure of Israeli society these days is such that many who are liable to call up may well be getting the heck out a Dodge, as opposed to returning ?
The first Israeli’s were committed simply because like the Palestinians today, they, or a large number of them had nowhere else to go. The same level of commitment could have been expected from their children. But the children of the children ? Or what about the explosion of immigration from Russia after 91, of people who had a largely spurious connection to Judaism ?
Hard to see how a generation who may well have morphed into a “SpaĆgesellschaft”, or groups that dont have years of connection to Israel could have a desire to get dead or maimed for some abstract idea dating from the 19th century, invented by people who’d been absent the Holy Land for a couple of thousand years.
Can I recommend, as an example of informed and unpartisan writing on the conflict, Adam Shatzās article āVengeful Pathologiesā in the current edition of LRB. Itās behind the paywall so I canāt post a link which would open it for non-subscribers.
thx I remember Shatz 2 years ago to be one of the few sane voices on Palestine. Then I lost track of him.
Now US editor of LRB.
hm. Sounds surprisingly sound management decision. Considering the times we live in…
for me this link works. Try it.
https://www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v45/n20/adam-shatz/vengeful-pathologies
It’s rather a long piece, so I only post these sentences:
“In the words of Amira Hass, an Israeli journalist who spent many years reporting from Gaza, āGaza embodies the central contradiction of the state of Israel ā democracy for some, dispossession for others; it is our exposed nerve.ā Israelis donāt say āgo to hellā, they say āgo to Gaza.ā The occupation authorities have always treated it as a frontier land, more like southern Lebanon than the West Bank, where different, and much harsher, rules apply. After the conquest of Gaza in 1967, Ariel Sharon, then the general responsible for Israelās southern command, oversaw the execution without trial of dozens of Palestinians suspected of involvement in resistance (itās unclear how many died), and the demolition of thousands of homes: this was called āpacificationā. In 2005, Sharon presided over ādisengagementā: Israel withdrew eight thousand settlers from Gaza, but it remained essentially under Israeli control, and since Hamas was elected in 2006 it has been under blockade, which the Egyptian government helps enforce.”
Shatz is not non-partisan. He decries in that essay a nefarious, academic “left extremism” (‘a cult of force’!) just as students & activists face increasing state repression for expressing solidarity with Palestine. Pretty shameful.
Another, more properly conceptual point is his unelaborated distinction between “legitimate” guerrilla warfare and the “primordial revenge” of the Palestinian resistance, attributing their targeting of civilians to a form of deep-seated psychosis… It’s of a piece with standard western “left” outlets in the last couple of weeks in trying to delegitimize Palestinian armed struggle.
Shatz for context was a big supporter of the invasion & occupation of Afghanistan. Another position considered informed & non-partisan in certain circles.
Jay
thx for that.
I had not yet time to read it. And my knowledge was as said limited.
His decrying of that ācult of forceā is only shameful if you regard people making poster boys of the powered hang glider pilots who slaughtered unarmed civilians as not shameful.
His position on the responsibilities to be held by both sides is very clear. It is a long article – almost 6000 words – but well worth reading.
“people making poster boys of the powered hang glider pilots who slaughtered unarmed civilians as not shameful.”
Who are these people? Do they exist outside your imagination? In any case, it appears, from Israeli witnesses themselves, that many of the unarmed civilians were slaughtered by the IDF, who gunned everyone down without bothering to check who was Hamas and who was a prisoner.
[ MOD: Ian, kindly desist from putting ‘N/A’ as your web page. Just leave it blank – it creates an invalid link which causes browser and caching problems for other users ]
___
Bayard
The protestors in, I think, London who have been photographed with pictures of hang gliders taped to their backpacks. Sorry, canāt remember the source. Could also mention NYU students tearing down posters of Israeli hostages put up in, I think, subway station entrances.
Careful with the heavy outrage and sarcasm when you respond to a post you don’t like. Youāll sound too much like an IDF spokesman.
So no actual connection with “slaughtered civilians” at all, just with hang gliders? You made it sound like there were posters of men hanging from gliders spraying bullets on civilians below. If I wanted to sound like a spokesman for the IDF, I would be pointing out that the hang gliders were in fact harmless and that no-one was hurt by them. It was only after the attackers had finished with the gliders that the shooting started, so showing pictures of hang gliders is perfectly innocent.
” Could also mention NYU students tearing down posters of Israeli hostages put up in, I think, subway station entrances.”
My God, what an atrocity! Call the ICC immediately!
I think you need a night off. My comment was, whether you agree with it or not, perfectly understandable, and the overwrought and tendentious misreading youāve indulged in is unnecessary.
My apologies, then, for misunderstanding your “perfectly understandable” comment.
What un-armed civilians?
The ones the Israeli government has been telling you about for the last week or so, of course. (But not that dead German woman who later called her mother from hospital, you need to forget about her.)
funny enough Moon of Alabama quoting that very Shatz
https://www.moonofalabama.org/2023/10/netanyahoos-strategic-dilema.html#comments
“(…)
As Adam Shatz summarizes in the London Review of Books:
Vengeful Pathologies (archived)
” The inescapable truth is that Israel cannot extinguish Palestinian resistance by violence, any more than the Palestinians can win an Algerian-style liberation war: Israeli Jews and Palestinian Arabs are stuck with each other, unless Israel, the far stronger party, drives the Palestinians into exile for good. The only thing that can save the people of Israel and Palestine, and prevent another Nakba ā a real possibility, while another Holocaust remains a traumatic hallucination ā is a political solution that recognises both as equal citizens, and allows them to live in peace and freedom, whether in a single democratic state, two states, or a federation. So long as this solution is avoided, a continuing degradation, and an even greater catastrophe, are all but guaranteed.
(…)”
From skimming quickly across the 6000 words I share the doubts towards Shatz. Does he ever mention anyone from Hamas or Hezbollah by name?
I think Shatz does what most people do:
Every party in that war has real names, real human identities, except Hamas or Hezbollah. They are, just as any evil, nameless, faceless.
But I believe he has always been a good writer so the length shouldnĀ“t matter.
IĀ“ll see.
There are 2 new books on the israeli influence on the british society in particlar:
Weaponising Anti-Semitism: How the Israel Lobby Brought Down Jeremy Corbyn
https://www.orbooks.com/catalog/weaponising-anti-semitism/
Friends of Israel: The Backlash Against Palestine Solidarity
The book provides a forensically researched account of the activities of Israel’s advocates in Britain, showing how they contribute to maintaining Israeli apartheid.
https://www.versobooks.com/en-gb/products/723-friends-of-israel
Fresh booktalk event about this book with the author could be seen here:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piqbzmm0VUI
Someone that should read them both is Phoney-Bono from U2 instead of keeping mum on israeli warcrimes and apartheid.
U2 Changes āPrideā Lyrics to Honor Hundreds of Music Fans Slaughtered in Israel Festival Massacre
Bono admitted the song’s advocacy of nonviolence felt ‘laughable’ in the moment. His new lyrics described the hundreds who were killed in the music festival attack as ‘stars of David’
https://variety.com/2023/music/news/u2-pride-changes-lyrics-israel-music-festival-massacre-dedication-sphere-1235749241/
Saint Bonio of Davos playing his part for the cabal as usual.
German cultural institutions again prove to be extraordinarily sensitive – Palestinian author Adania ShibliĀ“s award ceremony at the Frankfurt Book Fair (the worldĀ“s biggest) was canceled. Because of the dire situation in Israel the publisher argued – without telling the author!
But: They are experiencing major backlash in form of an open letter, by now already 700 signatures.
among them Nobel laureates Abdulrazak Gurnah, Annie Ernaux, Olga Tokarczuk
Booker Prize winners Anne Enright, Richard Flanagan, Ian McEwan
and people like Pilar Quintana, Pankaj Mishra, William Dalrymple.
Tellingly, hardly any German names among the signatures.
Who would have thought.
Remember when last year Ukrainian super cool poet Serhij Zhadan, who had been ranting Russians being animals, calling for war and weapons, received a major book award and there was frenetic applause…by all of Germany.
Here the story:
News Frankfurt Book Fair
Anger over Silencing of Palestinian Voices Overshadows Day 1 of 2023 Frankfurt Book Fair
October 17, 2023 ”
https://arablit.org/2023/10/17/dismay-over-silencing-of-palestinian-voices-overshadows-day-1-of-2023-frankfurt-book-fair/
US, Israel and even the arab states seems to be set on regime-change and an “Interim” government in Gaza.
https://swentr.site/news/585464-us-israel-mulling-interim-government-gaza/
Oh and I had totally missed this, Israel lobby pushed a UK hospital to take down harmless artwork done by palestinian kids:
“on behalf of some Jewish patients, who said that they felt vulnerable and victimised by this display”.
https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/palestine-gaza-children-artwork-removed-hospital-looks-new-home
it reads like an article from the satirical newspaper the Onion:
Greta Thunberg was accused of antisemitism by Israeli officials for featuring a toy octopus in her pro-Palestinian picture.
They claimed the toy octopus was an “antisemitic trope.”
This is a real story.
https://nitter.net/Lowkey0nline/status/1715663622960034121#m
holy merde. every time i think things cant get more absurd…
Anything can be antisemitic if you make the causal chain long enough. Anti-semitism is the eye of the beholder. It has become a shibboleth.
I think Hajo Meyer, a survivor of Auschwitz, couldn’t have been more right when he said, ” an anti-Semite used to be someone who doesn’t like Jews, now it’s someone who Zionists don’t like”
On this day exactly 50 years ago. Compare to Blinken’s weak efforts.
———————————————————————————
Kissinger goes to persuade Israel
Reuters. TEL AVIV, October 22. The United States Secretary of State (Dr Henry Kissinger) arrived in Tel Aviv today from Moscow.
Dr Kissingerās plane arrived at the tightly guarded Lod Airport just more than six hours after the Israeli Government announced its readiness to accept a United Nations call for a cease-fire on the seventeenth day of the Middle East war.
The formula for stopping the fighting between Israel and its Arab foes on two fronts, Egypt and Syria, had been worked out in Moscow by Dr Kissinger and Soviet leaders including the Communist Party secretary, Mr Leonid Brezhnev.
The Foreign Minister (Mr Abba Eban) was on hand to greet Dr Kissinger.
As he left Moscow Dr Kissinger said he expected the joint United States-Soviet call to end the Middle East war āwill be implemented.ā In an airport statement, Dr Kissinger said his two days of talks with Kremlin leaders āwill contribute to peace in the world in general and to a further improvement of Soviet-American relations.ā Before boarding his special Air Force plane, Dr Kissinger said in a statement: āWe have completed two days of very extensive, very constructive, very fruitful conversations which were conducted in a cordial and warm atmosphere.ā He voiced hope that āwe have made a contribution to ending the hostilities in the Middle Eastā and said āwe expect that the resolution the Security Council passed this morning will be implemented. āBeyond that, we will contribute to a solution of the conditions that brought about the hostilities,ā he said. Asked about joint Soviet American policing of the cease-fire, Dr Kissinger declined to comment, saying: āWe wonāt have anything on that.ā
He was seen off by the Soviet Foreign Minister (Mr Andrei Gromyko), who would not comment on the talks. The Israeli Government said today it would implement the United Nations Security Council resolution on a Middle East cease-fire provided Arab Governments did the same. An Israeli Government spokesman said Israel would insist on an exchange of prisoners and would instruct its representatives at the United Nations to state clearly that the 1967 Resolution 242 was to be interpreted within the framework of Israelās understanding of its meaning. The resolution calls on Israel to withdraw from territories occupied in the 1967war, for a just settlement of the refugee problem, and for the end of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for the sovereignty and political independence of every State in the area. In the past, Israel has said Resolution 242 provided an opportunity for negotiations on adjustment of final boundaries.
Israel has rejected any attempts to set preconditions for talks to reach a settlement with the Arabs. But it has indicated that it is prepared to discuss a partial settlement with Egypt for reopening the Suez canal as a first step towards a wider agreement. Many observers believe the Israeli foothold on the west bank of the canal, established last week, could now assume major political importance.
I posted the above story hopefully for Craig and others to get some idea of how these situations were resolved in the past. i.e. when there were actually adults in the room.
Note the US trip to Moscow. The acknowledgement of UN resolutions. The cordial interaction amongst the diplomats.
Brave egyptian woman confront CNN biased reporting, make sure to check out all three videoclips:
https://nitter.net/sahouraxo/status/1715367443919499539#m
The arab wrath cannot be put down now, it will only grow, especially the more bestial israeli warcrimes get:
because in other news….. IDF engage in torturing, urinating and sodomzing 3 palestinians
https://nitter.net/dimitrilascaris/status/1715449384786133445#m
Nothing but sexual sadism on dispay by Israel. It is like they are still on a biblical, old-age level of human understanding of other ethnic groups.
Zionism is a late C19th proto-fascist, antisemite ideology, it has nothing to do with the bible.
Read the Commissioner for Countering Extremism, Robin Simcox’s recent speech. It’s depressing that someone who holds such blinkered views has been given this role. https://conservativehome.com/2023/10/20/it-is-time-to-confront-reality-robin-simcoxs-address-to-rusi-on-countering-extremism-full-text/ I know Conservative Home??!!! I only visit to try to understand current grassroots Tory thinking. As in, things like whether a leadership challenge to Sunak is imminent.
His speech, besides being wholly biased, contains numerous half-truths and factual inaccuracies. Were 1,400 innocent civilians slaughtered in Israel, as he claims? Reports say an unspecified number of those killed, totalling over 300, were IDF soldiers, whose bases the group targeted. He also quotes Israeli spokespeople verbatim, with regards to the more lurid claims. He then asks, is āfrom the river to the sea, Palestine will be freeā genocidal in nature or not?
He goes on, “If you are chanting āfrom the river to the seaā in the context of the largest slaughter of Jews since the Holocaust, you have forfeited your right to the benefit of the doubt about what your intent is and the message you are trying to convey.” An outrageous thing to say.
“We know one of Hamasās key backers ā financially and militarily ā is Iran.” he says. Do we ? Hamas is a Sunni Muslim offshoot from the Muslim Brotherhood. Shia Iran may offer encouragement and support, but their interests surely sit with Shia group Hezbollah, in Lebanon.
Could go on but I won’t.
“Conservative Home”.
About as conservative as Lenin.
And yes, Iran supports Hamas – quite rightly. And guess who supports Iran? Russia, China, and now – Saudi Arabia.
Bite on that, Netanyahu.
Tom, read his speech, it reads like it could’ve been made by Suella Braverman or the Board of Deputies, that’s the point I’m making. How on earth can the Muslim community trust someone like that in terms of impartiality?
All week, Owen Jones, who, some on the left have unfairly criticised, has been putting the pro-Palestine case against Israel’s aggression. And he’s been subjected to waves of Hasbara trolling, from sketchy, previously dormant Twitter accounts. Why doesn’t the Commissioner for Countering Extremism consider radical Zionist extremists and intimidating Hasbara trolling, a threat to democratic debate?
Goose, you need to keep up with the Newspeak. Just as “anti-semitism” has changed from being hating Jews to criticising Israel, a “democracy” is now a country friendly to the USA and an “autocracy” one that is not, “extremism” now means dissent from the official narrative.
I quite agree with everything you said, Goose. Although I’m afraid I did not, and will not, read that speech. Call me prejudiced, call me a stereotyper, but I have a pretty good idea what it contains and I have had more than my fill of that sort of thing.
I console myself with the thought that – as usual – it really doesn’t matter at all what anyone in the UK says or does. The rest of the world, mostly, ignores us. And quite right too.
As they say in Asia, “the dogs bark, but the caravan moves on”.
Bayard, Noam Chomsky was explaining those definitions in the 1960s. As far as Washington is concerned, a “democracy” is any government that unquestioningly and unhesitatingly obeys all orders from Washington, and thus pursues the interests of US corporations. “When we say ‘jump’, you jump – and on the way up you ask, ‘How high, sir?'”
Whereas any government that rules in the interests of its own country and people is “communist”, a “dictatorship”, or both.
Tom, yes, George Orwell didn’t invent Newspeak from nothing. That sort of thing has been around for a very long time. I expect there was a lot of it about in the religious wars of the C17th.
Tom, Bayard, CM all.
A little more on Simcox here: Robin Simcox worked at the UK’s neo-con Henry Jackson Society before becoming “Margaret Thatcher Fellow” at the Heritage Foundation. He was a controversial Patel appointee. Some would say an extremist tasked with countering extremism.
Israeli leaders have said there are no innocent civilians in Gaza, they have vowed to eliminate Hamas fighters in Northern Gaza by forcing the civilian population into southern Gaza, thereby giving the Israeli forces several options. 1/ carve Gaza in half, either bombarding and levelling it thereby murdering Hamas operatives plus the remaining civilians, in other words ethnically cleanse Northern Gaza [another Nakba] or surrounding that area and wait till Northern Gaza runs out of food and water. In either case the Israelis intend to win regardless of the grave breaches of International Laws and crimes against Humanity inherent in their brutality.
What can stop this since Israel has been given the green light to carry on when the Brazilian resolution calling for a ceasefire was vetoed by the US.
I agree with Professor N Finkelstein when he said Hezbollah must intervene, it is inconceivable for Hezbollah to do nothing more than skirmish on the borders of Israel, it is early days yet, but failure to assist Palestinians in their hour of need would be catastrophic for the āArc of Resistanceā for those components of same would inevitably be next.
In my opinion Hezbollah will and must act, otherwise they will watch as the Palestinians are driven out of Palestine and their own country Lebanon is decimated via the Dahiya doctrine. In Beirut, this is a military strategy of asymmetric warfare, outlined by former Israel Defense Forces (IDF) Chief of General Staff Gadi Eizenkot, which encompasses the destruction of the civilian infrastructure of regimes deemed to be hostile as a measure calculated to deny combatants the use of that infrastructure[2] and endorses the employment of “disproportionate force” to secure that end.
Harry, your posts read like you want Lebanon to be flattened?
You surely understand they’d face a truly horrifying retaliatory response – one aimed not at them but the Lebanese people? I’m not going to accuse you of being a Hasbara troll trying to goad Lebanon to its doom. But anyone who thinks Hezbollah could intervene without ISR the US and UK reducing Lebanon to rubble is naive. It’d be playing straight into Netanyahu’s evil designs, giving him and the US the excuse they need.
It’s not so clear to me, Goose. For a start, a lot of well-meaning people have been pleading for a cease-fire and “the killing to stop”. Well and good, but every time that happens – and it has happened dozens of times since 1948 – the Israelis just go on kicking Palestinians out of their homes, roughing them up or killing them, and building all over Palestinian land.
The only thing that ever gets the world’s attention is violence against Israelis. So, after 75 years, is it surprising that the Palestinians and their friends are turning to it more often?
As for Lebanon getting flattened – maybe, and maybe not. It has already been flattened many times, but the Israelis and the Americans have suffered some bloody noses too.
You mention Israel, the UK, and the USA. Well Israel is such a small target that they can’t afford to risk starting a major war in which Iran, for example, would plaster tham with serious missiles. They actually are the proverbial people living in a – small – glass house. The UK is a pathetic paper tiger. Its armed forces are practically non-existent, and would be extremely ill advised to get involved in fighting against any serious military force unless they were riding on the Americans’ back.
Which brings us to the USA, which has already almost exhausted some of its weapons stocks in supplying Ukraine. Now they say they will forget Ukraine and divert all their shells to Israel. Which is peculiar, as Israel’s only target is a huge built-up area full of civilians – by definition off limits for bombardment. (I know they have been doing it, and in doing so they have been building up an enormous debit account).
How can the USA intervene without risking catastrophic harm to itself and israel? Bombing the defenceless Gaza people even more can only pile disgrace and hatred on their heads. Attacking Syria or even Lebanon risks involving Russia; and fighting the Russians seems to be a red line that not even batty old Biden will approach, let alone cross.
And the US warships are hostages to fortune. They are either within reach of Iran’s multitudinous missiles, or very nearly. And they are right in the sights of Russia’s missiles, which could sink those two carrier groups within half an hour at any time.
They can bluster, but their actual power to accomplish anything is nearly zero. And there was Jordan turning Biden away, and Saudi Arabia keeping Blinken waiting all night for a fruitless interview. If they anger those governments any more, just imagine what might come next.
And there’s a presidential election next year. How would that be affected if the Persian Gulf were to be closed to all tankers, do you think?
[ Mod: Off topic. ]
—
Actually it’s the Russians who have created a situation that the Kiev mob were unable not to react to. Namely squatting on what Kiev considers Ukrainian territory, with a “come and get me if you think you’re hard” expression.
Since June the Ukrainians have lost numbers of soldiers, tanks, and other equipment that remind one of WW1. And they keep on coming. The Russians couldn’t ask for things to go better.
In February last year, Russia was asked by the people in the Donbass for help. The US/UK armed and trained Ukraine for years in preparation for the war they were wanted with Russia.
I think it is relevant to situation in Gaza. As the situation of the population is horrific and Hezbollah is being goaded to help them – as Russia was provoked to go into Ukraine. Israel has long wanted to deal with Iran. US/UK is involved in both.
“Israeli leaders have said there are no innocent civilians in Gaza…”
Foolish. It is much truer to say that there are no innocent Israeli civilians. After all, they were the ones who entered another people’s country and drove them out by force, killing anyone who resisted. And stole their land. They assume that they are perpetually at war with “the Arabs”, but they don’t ask themselves why.
Gazans have nowhere to go except perhaps straight upwards to heaven. Israelis could always go back to the countries they or their parents came from.
“It is much truer to say that there are no innocent Israeli civilians.”
That’s equally nonsensical (and equally inhuman), obviously.
“Israelis could always go back to the countries they or their parents came from.”
Now, where have I heard something like that before?
“Now, where have I heard something like that before?”
I don’t know. Where have you heard it before? Enlighten us, pray.
The sentiment would apply equally to all murderous colonial oppressors.
Your problem is that the Israelis have been creating ‘facts on the ground’ for over 75 years. Several million Israelis are natives now having been born there.
“Several million Israelis are natives now having been born there.”
They are still however colonists or the descendants of colonists, apart from a tiny minority who were there from before the colonists came.
The nastiness goes on unhindered by Israel.
Israel doubles number of Palestinian prisoners to 10,000 in two weeks
Israel has arrested some 4,000 labourers from Gaza who were working in Israel and is holding them in military bases. Separately, it has also arrested 1,070 other Palestinians in overnight army raids in the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem.
Israel bomb Rafah when trucks going in with humantarian aid and consider anyone a terrorist if they do not leave any area Israel demand them to.
Two major air strikes hit Rafah, Gaza City
Israeli army warns anyone refusing to leave Gaza City will be considered a āterroristā
and palestinians children show signs of severe mental trauma
Gazaās children developing āserious trauma symptomsā: Psychiatrists
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/liveblog/2023/10/20/israel-gaza-war-live-hamas-releases-two-american-captives-from-gaza
Fascism in full bloom, police make a visit to a household saturday morning in the UK, wondering why the owner have a palestinian flag up
Video https://nitter.net/Lowkey0nline/status/1715699831308497273#m
It is time civil rights lawyers etc speak out against this suppression, oppression against free speech.
The whole idea of police coming to your door is also having a chilling effect which makes people self-censor their democratic right to speak out.
The real trouble is that the UK government has already presumed to “proscribe” Hamas – the legitimate government of Gaza – as a “terrorist organisation”.
Governments are never described as terrorist organisations, for the simple reason that if they were no other terrorists would even get a look in. The list would read: 1. US government, 2. UK government, 3. Saudi government, etc.
Given that the UK government calls Hamas terrorists, it’s not so surprising that the police get heavy. They feel they have the authority of the government behind them.
It’s the gutless cowards in London who are to blame. I call them gutless cowards, but that is giving them the benefit of the doubt. Perhaps their motives are even worse.
Hamas captured an Israeli Major General when they attacked that military base. Now given that the release not so long ago of an Israeli private soldier hostage required, it is said, 1000 prisoners to be released, it’s clear that Israel needs to stock up on bargaining chips ?
I was just checking out the Jewish Chronicle again – which has been using the ‘war’ to recycle the A/S falsehoods about Jeremy Corbyn – and yet again came across an article that perpetuates the falsehood, albeit Jeremy Corbyn supporters in this instance, and saved for the last paragraph:
There is hope. I have a very good friend, working-class and a natural mid-left Labour voter, who was so appalled by the abuse his own best friend was getting from Corbyn supporters, that he decided to get a large and intricate tattoo of the Star of David on his chest. His reason? Not just to show solidarity, but to remind himself, should he find himself in the kind of situation where oneās life depends on whether one is Jewish or not, where his heart lies, in case his courage fails him.
https://www.thejc.com/lets-talk/all/'i-thought-i-knew-who-my-friends-were-now-i'm-not-so-sure'-1yvWhiC0lcafHReSlLwwdB
And needless to say, the JC completely accepts the IDFs explanation for the hospital explosion and, as such, won’t be informing their readers about any new evidence that casts doubt on it.
Goose, what you appear to be saying is Israel is so much stronger than us [Hezbollah and Hamas] and that Palestine and Lebanon will be flattened by Israeli retaliation. Therefore we must run up the white flag and concede whatever the Israelis dictate. These are the words of a coward and a person with no self respect, yes Palestine and Lebanon have taken serious hits from Israel in the past and no doubt will take a lot more in the future I wish it did not happen, unfortunately Israel is determined to gain the whole of the āLand of Israelā with as few Palestinians in it as possible, using any means necessary. They want the waters of the Litani river in Southern Lebanon, oh and regime change in Syria and Iran, Fortunately Hezbollah and Hamas have no intention of unfurling the white flag
The resistance must be bigger than Hezbollah but as I said earlier, Hezbollah tactic should be very precise and strategic. Use of drones, sabotage against US/UK ships or swarm them over Israel etc should indeed be used, sending over rockets from Lebanon to israeli land wont do anything however. Use of targeted assassinations against occupying forces etc.
Speaking of resistance:
2009: Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi, who has accused Arab leaders of a “cowardly” response to Israeli attacks on the Gaza Strip, urged them to let their citizens join Palestinian fighters as volunteers, state media said today.
https://timesofmalta.com/articles/view/gaddafi-wants-arabs-to-join-in-gaza-war.240096
I wonder how arab leaders deal with the situation today, they sit and see what is unfolding, do they support it or are they living in denial?
A mere officially-declared military mobilization in the part/whole of the arab world would scare the west off and they would call for a ceasefire just like that. But since arab world are not doing anything west/Isarel take it as a greenlight for Israel to do what they want.
Harry
Yes, sometimes discretion really is the better part of valour. However frustrating for Muslims worldwide these tragic unfolding events are.
Israel will do what it wants anyway. Hezbollah would just be providing cover for Netanyahu and his obnoxious genocidal behaviour/ land theft, as world leaders’ reaffirmed their sympathy/support for Israel. This is a marathon not a sprint, and even Russia, China, and least of all, Iran, aren’t ready to make credible threats when Israel is backed by a hegemonic brute who’s itching for a fight.
Harry
A breakdown of the costs of the last major Lebanon/Hezbollah – Israel war here : https://www.reuters.com/article/us-lebanon-war-cost-idUSL0822571220070709
As you can see they fall disproportionately on Lebanon.
Mark Urban reports tonight, that Israel may try to provoke Hezbollah if they don’t respond to a Gaza incursion. Because Israel want a war on their own terms. Urban believes Iran will likely want Hezbollah to hold fire, because they are more useful as a deterrent; making Israel think twice before attacking Iran’s nuclear facilities.
Harry Law and Goose have good points even though contradictory!
My Questions are:
ā¢ Should Palestinians leave their country by crossing South (Egypt border) or North controlled by Israel?
ā¢ Why leaving by North crossing is not mentioned by ĀØhumanitarianĀØ Israel?
ā¢ Why is Sir Starmer never asked what the Zionism he supports means?
BTW in this Video Egyptian comedian uses sarcasm and trolling to de-weaponize Piers Morgan.
PM, something like “I understand Dark Humor but letĀ“s be serious”
Youssef “I am serious, kill the mother fukers”.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4idQbwsvtUo
Jack, āsending over rockets from Lebanon to israeli land wonāt do anythingā, I disagree, as does Israeli missile expert Uri Rubin in the link below.āā Some Israeli officials privately suggest that the āterrorist groupā [Hezbollah] could already have several hundred in its arsenal. Once it acquires 1,000, it could fire 10 precision strikes at each of Israelās 100 most critical pieces of national infrastructure. Even assuming a 90 percent success rate for Israelās Iron Dome missile defence, the math at that point will favour Hezbollah, putting the possible paralysis of Israeli civil society within its reach. Hezbollah have the precision missiles to destroy Israel, and as Rubin said in another speech all that is necessary to construct a precision missile is a smart phone and some winglets, which Hezbollah have in vast quantities. Those aircraft carriers and support vessels are sitting ducks off the coast of Israel see URI Rubin Israeli missile expert https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/10/15/israel-idf-iran-nuclear-arms-weapons/
Professor Theodore Postol of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology says that while he cannot say what the performance of Iron Dome was in Operation Pillar of Defence, “all the available evidence unambiguously indicates a drastically lower level of performance than the 84% claimed by the Israeli Defense Forces (IDF).”
His view is that the successful hit rate on incoming warheads could be as low as 5-10%.
Mr Postol says that if the IDF wants to make such claims, then it should provide the data to back them up. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-21751766
HarryLaw
I dont see a reason for such measures, as I said, Hezbollah should engage but they must use smarter tactics, look at Ukraine war, use sabotage units, use drones etc, they need to strike Israel where it actually hurts, not just hurling out rockets that in majority miss their target.
Lebanon was heavily bombarded by Israel in the 2006 war:
The war lasted 34 days and resulted in the death of more than 1,100 Lebanese nationals and 165 Israelis.
Nobody conclusively won the war, but Lebanese civilians were the clear losers. Israel destroyed or damaged about 30,000 homes, 109 bridges and 78 medical facilities, according to the International Committee for the Red Cross.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/16/can-lebanons-hezbollah-afford-to-go-to-war-with-israel
But I agree with your main argument, they should engage, the question is exactly how.
I am as big a coward as anybody else, but there comes a time when standing up to bullies is the correct and only thing to do regardless of the consequences. Gandhi hated cowards, in fact he said a coward does not deserve to live, here is an example… If a figure of Authority [a Policeman or member of the armed forces] came to your house and threatened and beat your partner with the intention to humiliate you both, and you failed to intervene on the grounds that they may well start on you next. Gandhi would call you a coward, he would be right.
800 EU workers pen criticism of von der Leyen’s support for Israel
Internal EU discontent grows at von der Leyenās neglect of Palestinian statehood
The latest flashpoint was a speech on Thursday at the Hudson Institute, a conservative think-tank in Washington, when she prioritized Israelās right to defend itself after Hamasā brutal assault on October 7 and neglected to mention the two-state solution that is a core part of the position of European countries.
https://www.politico.eu/article/internal-eu-discontent-grows-at-ursula-von-der-leyens-neglect-of-palestinian-statehood/
Irish MEP’s Mick Wallace and Clare Daly seems to be the only 2 politicians in the whole EU parliament with a common human sense and courage to speak out while every other EU MEP deny what is going on or even support the warcrimes openly.
One of the latest statement by Mick here:
EU has been complicit with the war crimes – MEP Mick Wallace- speech from 19 Oct
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMjqNwGB1h0
Talking about cowardly Gobshites: Keir Starmer now says he did not say the words ascribed to him when interviewed by Nick Ferrari on LBC new
https://skwawkbox.org/2023/10/20/video-starmer-caught-in-outright-lie-as-he-tries-to-cover-up-his-support-for-israeli-war-crimes/
All this is well documented and all over YouTube. Effing liar.
Starmzy is an odd one for sure, Harry. There can’t be many people who, in early middle age, have addressed Boycott Israel meetings (at a time when it wasn’t depriving Palestinians of basic necessities) and then, in late middle age, publicly supported Israel’s decision to completely cut off food & water to Gaza – and only changed tack when they’ve seen how unpopular that is with the British public that they’re hoping will elect them to be prime minister.
https://nitter.net/TPointUK/status/1713670640081789040
A man of negotiable principles, obviously.
Larry Johnson, a former CIA analyst, has expressed doubts that the hospital explosion was a Hamas/Palestine Jihad rocket. He makes the argument in an article headlined “I am now ready to offer my opinion. I believe the hospital parking area was struck by an Israeli munition”
Here is his latest article headlined “After weighing the evidence, Israel appears responsible for the bombing of the Al- Ahli Hospital” If that is the case, it is now more imperative than ever that forensic samples are smuggled out of Gaza for international analysis…_
https://sonar21.com/after-weighing-the-evidence-israel-appears-responsible-for-the-bombing-of-the-al-ahli-hospital/
” If that is the case, it is now more imperative than ever that forensic samples are smuggled out of Gaza for international analysis”
Why, so that an “expert” can be paid to say that they are part of a Hamas rocket? All the available evidence points to it being an Israeli attack, the Israelis said they were going to do it, then said they’d done it, what more do you want? Shame about Larry, though, you had high hopes of him.
There is no conclusive evidence one way or the other, strong suspicions are not enough. Forensic examination of evidence which is available to be collected would establish the facts. Those facts are needed now.
That’s the scientific method, belief and faith count for nothing at the end of the day…_
“There is no conclusive evidence one way or the other, strong suspicions are not enough. ”
I find the facts that the Israelis warned the Palestinians that they were going to bomb the hospital, then said that they had bombed it, pretty conclusive evidence. Obviously you don’t, but on the other hand, it looks like there’s very little that you would find conclusive, unless it pointed towards the attack having been made by Hamas, or Russia, or aliens from outer space, or anyone but the people who have admitted doing it.
also I read the Israelis bombed it a few days before. and I don’t think Hamas or any other Palestinian group has missiles that do that much damage.