SARS cov2 and Covid 19


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  • This topic has 1,202 replies, 1 voice, and was last updated 5 months ago by Dave.
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  • #64194
    Dave

    You are clearly very intelligent and I’m sure you are helpful to Craig in many ways, and act as a gatekeeper on subjects Craig doesn’t mind discussing, but can’t really be associated with, for understandable reasons, as he has enough on his plate already.

    I find this blog very informative and you provide a masterclass in slippery, but the Daily Mail is also very informative too, if only because it has a mass middle-class readership, which wouldn’t last if it only carried the inane official narrative.

    #64195
    ET

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/03/it-makes-me-want-to-cry-voices-of-hospital-staff-on-the-covid-frontline

    Another piece from The Guardian with testimony from docs and nurses.

    “Oxygen for patients has already been limited because the hospital’s supply system was approaching the point where it would shut down. “We have the oxygen to give everybody, but we don’t have the delivery system. The system would crash if too many people were sucking in oxygen in a high concentration,”

    That struck me. There is enough oxygen in the storage tanks but with so many needing high concentration oxygen the in-built delivery systems, those outlets above every bed, are insufficient for that many patients. I guess every hospital’s oxygen delivery system has a finite number of patients it can deliver it to before it goes beyond it’s operating parameters. I have never seen that happen nor heard of it happening.

    The nurse in this piece has elsewhere being criticised by paediatric doctors for overstating the paediatric problem so it is hard to be sure of what that situation is, for now.

    #64199
    Clark

    Dave – “I find your explanation of Trump’s treatment far-fetched…”

    https://www.google.com/search?q=trump+treated+with+mouse+antibodies

    “You […] act as a gatekeeper on subjects Craig doesn’t mind discussing, but can’t really be associated with, for understandable reasons”

    That implies that Craig has had communication from the conspiracy you allege exists, that he knows what they insist be censored, and that he complies. It is tantamount to calling Craig a lying coward, and in that sense a member of the conspiracy. I like, respect and have helped Craig precisely because he’s neither blinded by the mainstream, nor a lying coward.

    Craig is wrong about the pandemic, and I expect that he will say so eventually. when he realises just how serious it is.

    #64200
    ET

    I had little to do on this last day of 2020 Christmas period so decided to have a dig around about Dr. Mike Yeadon. He worked for Pfizer for 17 years until they closed their R&D unit in Sandwich. He started a biotech company known as Ziarco. They focused on a drug for the treatment of atopic dermatitis (eczema). The anchor investor was BVF Partners with participation from Pfizer Venture Investments. This drug initially did well in phase 2 trials. Novartis bought it over in 2016 for an undisclosed sum but speculation put it in the order of $1 Billion. He then formed his own consultancy company.

    Here is a forbes piece on this story:

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/johnlamattina/2017/03/15/turning-pfizer-discards-into-novartis-gold-the-story-of-ziarco/#1ab9b3077572

    And another link:

    Ziarco Pharma Acquires Pfizer Drugs, Secures Financing

    ““Ziarco was founded to address the significant need that still exists for new, more effective ways to treat disorders underpinned by inflammatory and allergic pathobiology. Each program in development at Ziarco has the potential to be a first-in-class therapeutic and because they target critical points within inflammatory and allergic pathways, they offer treatment options for diverse and difficult to manage diseases,” said Dr. Mike Yeadon, CEO of Ziarco.”

    In July 2020:

    “Novartis cut an atopic dermatitis drug from the team—and it did it on the down low. Buried in its second-quarter financial report is a line revealing that the Swiss pharma is taking a $485 million impairment charge (PDF) for halting clinical development on an eczema program it picked up in its 2016 Ziarco buyout.”
    https://www.fiercebiotech.com/biotech/novartis-dumps-ziarco-eczema-drug-taking-485m-hit

    #64201
    N_

    It looks like another national lockdown in Britain is imminent – tomorrow or even later tonight. Oh, except for schools, perhaps the main virus spreading places. If “population readjustment” weren’t such a serious matter, the phrase “Keep taking the tablets” would come to mind. In any case, A and not-A cannot both be true at the same time. The best advice is for people to apply that knowledge without allowing “experts” to form their opinions for them.

    By the end of this month, you gotta wonder what those of us who don’t accept the mRNA vaccine – whether it’s administered by Nazional Hygiene Service nurses, or by soldiers from out the back of an army lorry, or whoever – will still be allowed to do.

    The cooperation between the army and school administrators isn’t going to disappear.

    Meanwhile in Wuhan in China people are allowed to socialise now as much as they like. Funny that.

    In Britain, the 2020 legislation that exempts medics, nurses, etc., from liability if they accidentally kill someone when doing something that’s related to SARSCoV2 (which includes filling in for someone who’s on SARSCoV2 duties) is likely to stay active throughout the vaccination period. Huge giveaway if it does. If you accept a jab in the arm from someone who has statutory exemption from liability if the jab kills you, you must be insane.

    Maybe that should be a demand by vaccine resisters – “Ask us again when you accept you’ll be liable for any harm you cause”.

    #64202
    N_

    Deaths “with Covid19” per 1m population so far:

    US, Britain, Italy, Sweden, France: ~1000
    Germany, Russia: ~400
    China: 3
    Taiwan: 0.3

    (Source.)

    #64209
    ET

    Pulmatrix Appoints Respiratory and Allergy Expert,Michael Yeadon, PhD, to Scientific Advisory Board.
    https://www.pulmatrix.com/news/Pulmatrix_100711.pdf

    Pulmatrix Demonstrates Superiority of iSPERSE in Delivering An Effective Multi-Drug Inhaled Dose Compared to Conventional Formulation…..
    https://www.pulmatrix.com/news/Pulmatrix_103111.pdf

    “As a drug discoverer, I am aware of a number of areas of target-rich biological processes for which drugs could be invented, which may not easily fit into the existing inhalation drug-delivery technologies. Rather than discard such candidates, or worse, the targets themselves, I’d recommend innovators take a close look at iSPERSE. If this becomes proven in clinic, it could become the new gold standard”.”

    PULMATRiX is committed to the development and commercialization of novel and transformational medicines for patients all over the world, using our proprietary iSPERSE™ technology to optimally deliver both respiratory and non-respiratory therapies via the respiratory system.

    Covid anti inflammatory drug delivery maybe?

    #64210
    ET

    And a little more:

    https://biopharmajournal.com/2020/11/04/pulmatrix-inc-nasdaqpulm-and-its-partner-sensory-cloud-announce-fends-commercial-rollout/

    “Pulmatrix Inc (NASDAQ:PULM) And Its Partner Sensory Cloud Announce FEND’s Commercial Rollout”

    ” that FEND’s commercial launch is an important milestone for his company because it will help to combat the coronavirus pandemic more effectively.”

    A pandemic their Respiratory and Allergy Expert appointed to their Scientific Advisory Board states isn’t happening….?

    ” They are optimistic that FEND will not only help to reduce the spread of the coronavirus but that it will help to make a notable impact in fighting against the pandemic at a global scale. Pulmatrix also expects to receive royalties from Sensory Cloud as part of their distribution agreement.”

    What’s going on?

    #64211
    N_

    Some will doubtless “think” it’s a case of “They’re only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains.”

    In context:

    I smell something burning. Hope it’s just my brains.
    They’re only dropping peppermints and daisy-chains.

    How important might Pulmatrix be, ET? It’s not hard to imagine a squirt up the schnozzer job getting official backing…

    Sniffing isopropanol after one has washed one’s hands in it is very sensible.
    (The idea is to whack viruses that infect when inhaled – some people need reminding.)
    It sometimes gets me some funny looks in Tesco, though!

    #64212
    N_

    FEND is just calcium chloride plus kitchen salt (sodium chloride), right?
    Then there are neti pots.

    #64219
    ET

    “How important might Pulmatrix be, ET?”

    I dunno N_, they are listed on NASDAQ but their share price has plummeted since their early days. However, a treatment that prevents shedding of virus or a drug delivery system directly to lung cells of an anti-inflammatory agent and a ready market, who knows how that might change.

    #64220
    ET

    FEND not only reduces 99% of the particles passing through the nasal cavity but it also filters 75% of the particles being exhaled. Researchers also believe that FEND might increase the effectiveness of wearing surgical masks, especially in indoor situations.

    From the link to FEND from earlier post.

    #64223
    Clark

    Michael Yeadon, death-dealing, manipulative spiv. Good digging ET.

    Conspiracy theorists, note how you were manipulated: Yeadon:

    – “For reasons I don’t understand, given the significance of what I’m about to tell you, none of the so-called medical correspondents and science journalists on radio and TV have ever (as far as I know) spoken of the four, endemic, common-cold inducing coronaviruses.

    All he had to do was tell you that SAGE are liars whereas he was imparting knowledge the “MSM” were keeping from you, and you fell for it. And he actually encouraged you to spread deadly infection so his company could make more profit.

    I don’t have a word for filth like Yeadon.

    #64224
    Clark

    N_, January 3, 19:23 – “Meanwhile in Wuhan in China people are allowed to socialise now as much as they like”

    Of course, because infection prevalence there is now very low. But they’ll only be able to get a bus to their socialising if their QR code shows them as uninfected; Track and Trace. That’s what it could have been like here by now if we had a half decent government.

    #64225
    Clark

    Manaus, Brazil, had a very hard first wave. Seroprevalence surveys indicated at least 44% had antibodies and extrapolation suggested 76%, which means that Manaus should have achieved herd immunity.

    But Manaus is having a second wave, and it has already made more people seriously ill than the first.

    Node, take good note.

    #64226
    Clark

    Zambia’s second wave looks like another example like Manaus.

    #64227
    Clark

    Dave, January 3, 10:24 –

    “New Zealand […] put in travel restrictions almost before COVID-19 was officially known about, but any delay in the spread of a virus […] ends once the restrictions are lifted, even if they work anyway.”

    See the article SA linked for you; restrictions were mostly lifted on May 14. And they had worked, in New Zealand’s winter; New Zealand had 2,181 cases and 25 deaths. New Zealand has wiped out covid-19 twice.

    #64228
    Clark
    #64230
    ET

    I am going to paint a disturbing picture with my next comment. I have said that where I live what was done was pretty much what New Zealand did and because of that we here are in a good position. No social distancing, everything open, no masks etc etc
    Disturbingly, we have had two people test positive after they had isolated for 14 days.

    “What made these positive results unusual was they came after the two individuals had completed a fourteen day period of isolation…….”

    I don’t want to draw unnecessary attention to us but these two tested positive on day 21. They had diligently followed the rules here having returned from elsewhere. They were officially told to go about their normal business after 14 days of isolation. So, they not unreasonably did so. The authorities did, in my humble opinion, all what they could be expected to do. They traced, contacted any who might have been contacts etc etc

    I cannot fault how they went about dealing with this situation here. What is worrying is that perhaps the 14 day isolation period isn’t now enough.

    “The two individuals who tested positive, arrived here, accompanied by another person, on Thursday the 10 December. All three began the required fourteen day period of self-isolation in shared accommodation. Having displayed no symptoms of the virus, the self-isolation period ended at noon on Wednesday the 23 December and all three individuals were free to go about their business. On Wednesday the 30 December, one of the individuals called the COVID-111 service to report that they had COVID-like symptoms. They were told to self-isolate and were booked in for a test.

    That test result came back the next day – New Year’s Eve – and was found to be positive. The individual was required to self-isolate and the contact tracing process began. Eight close contacts were initially identified.”

    That was 7 days after the end of the self isolation period which is not broken here, unless you have a jet ski.

    This is a worrying development. If this virus remains transmissible beyond the currently advised isolation period, perhaps because of the new variant then we are in for hurt. We don’t know this yet but I’ll keep you posted.

    #64235
    N_

    When you thought Britain couldn’t get any crazier: from the Torygraph: “Exclusive: Sir Geoffrey Boycott voices fears over delays to second dose of Pfizer jab.

    Woman-beater Geoff Boycott is a darling of many right-wing British media consumers, along with Enoch Powell and Vera Lynn.

    The headline obeys the first rule of advertising: show (or in this case, mention) the product. “Pfizer, Pfizer, lovely helpy Pfizer. Naughty ol’ government for not helping Pfizer even more. Pfizer, Pfizer! What’s good for Pfizer is good for all cricket fans, and for all ‘Britons’ generally, especially white ones who own their own properties!”

    Never forget that Big Pharma spends far more on influencing minds than it does on research, development, and production all added together.

    How’s the bank balance, Geoff?

    #64236
    N_

    “Geoff Boycott” is a masterfully managed brand… You can almost hear him say “I speak my mind. Always have done. The government should get a bloody move on!”

    If only “left-wing teachers”, “snowflakes”, “coloured” people, the EU, “trendy journalists and vicars”, “longhaired layabouts”, etc., could be blamed for the government’s hesitation and for politicians’ lack of boldness and poor command skills. Tory scum would be in seventh heaven!

    Maybe Geoff Boycott and Marcus Rashford use the same agent?

    #64237
    ET

    Never forget that N_ spends far more time on distracting than N_ does on developing a debate, and answering any countering argument to what he/she says. You are a wall flower N_ with nothing to say.

    #64238
    ET

    Perhaps I am being a little harsh here, you have nothing pertinent to say is what I mean.

    #64239
    SA

    ET
    Thanks for that piece of information which is indeed disturbing. Do they know whether the virus was the new variant, or even yet another different one, because prolonged incubation period may also be one of the other effects of a mutation. This subtelety would be missed on the mainland where no such vigilance about self isolation and contact tracing is occurring. Also do you know where these people have been before coming to your paradise island?

    #64240
    SA

    Re:N_
    Yes that is his/ her style. I can’t recal getting any answers or engaging in any debates, just musings.

    #64241
    SA

    Another way of course that transmission can occur is through fomites. It is said that this is not a very likely route of transmission but recent cases from China suggest that when contamination of food which is refrigerated or frozen may lead to transmission of virus not only by consumption of food but also by contact and other means. Although this is disputed, the objections seem to come from sources that value trade more than caution on such matters.

    “The U.S. Department of Agriculture said it also prodded China on two occasions to match its trade restrictions with an accurate assessment of risk, adding that Beijing’s most recent COVID-19 trade regulations “are not based on science and threaten to disrupt trade.”

    https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2020/12/16/946737184/china-has-a-theory-about-its-new-covid-cases-many-scientists-are-skeptical

    #64242
    SA

    Et
    This is unusual but not unique as outliers have been described before.

    #64253
    N_

    @Clark – rather than be consumed with hatred when you read words written by Mike Yeadon, or think about those who circulate them, an emotion which is beneficial neither for yourself nor for the world outside of yourself, maybe forget about the finger pointing at the moon and look at the moon instead?

    He’s right, what he says about there being several species of coronavirus, the common cold-causing ones being relatively harmless, and he’s right that this is rarely if ever being mentioned in the MSM.

    It’s interesting that about half the times I have said to people that the bug that’s going around is a strain of SARS, they respond with fear in their eyes, say I’m a “conspiracy theorist”, and act as if I might infect their minds.

    The reason it’s not generally called “SARS” or “the new strain of SARS” is to do with marketing and propaganda. That is an extremely straightforward observation the truth of which should be obvious to every left wing person.

    It is a sad fact that in the reigning culture people have a HUGE ability to make up idiotic reasons to defend whatever crap they’re spewing out that they got from those above them in the opinion chain and which they have never reflected on, because they don’t reflect on shee-yit and because they respect those who stand above them so much. Generally speaking they respect those who stand in front of microphones, and in Britain those who speak with posh accents. In Britain they even sometimes respect opinion channellers who don’t sound as if they went to private school and who present themselves as “grammar school boy” engineer or manager types, especially if they can flash a charming smile or deliver a straightbacked “expert” schtick even in a non-RP accent. That’s the cultural reality we live in. The stupid idiots.

    I haven’t heard the fact that there are other coronaviruses than SARSCov2, ones that cause about ~15% of cases of the common cold and nothing more serious that that, mentioned in the MSM either. (Most cases of the common cold are caused by rhinoviruses, which belong to a different family, for the record.)

    But I have heard large numbers of people refer to “coronavirus” without a preceding article whether definite or indefinite, as if it were an illness. A virus is not an illness. To point that out is not pedantry. Most people who are infected with SARSCoV2 fight it off with their immune system’s first line of defence, which is to say without “specialised” antibodies coming into action and without even getting any symptoms. That is extremely important. It is being totally ignored (and misdirected from) in all the propaganda which encourages moronic punters, as they copy whatever they’ve been told by those above them in the opinion chain, talking as if they understand about the spread and effects of infectious disease. Washing your hands a lot (even if you don’t sing “God Save the Queen” when doing it, which is what Jacob Rees-Mogg advised last year) using proper bug-killing liquid and trying to cut down the amount of surfaces you touch that other people have touched (to prevent infection by “fomites”) is important. Strengthening your immune system is also important, and if you don’t know anything about how to do it then washing your hands all the time may not do much good. Many of those who have strong immune systems have breathed in SARSCov2 probably in quantities that would have caused serious symptoms in some people, and they don’t even know anything about it. It was just one of the many bugs they breathe in all the time without noticing. Anybody who doesn’t try to eat stuff to strengthen their immune system during a pandemic is an idiot, and it is they who should be treated with contempt, not whatever statement you have read on the internet. Such people don’t only endanger and injure themselves; they also spread the virus that everyone is talking about.

    PS Internet “debate” is a morass, ET. Do you think I would waste time “debating” with those who type one-liners such as “you have nothing pertinent to say”? You would probably not be so rude to my face in real life. Nobody forces you to read anything anybody has written on this disgusting medium called “the internet”. Posters here differ in the amount of investment they put into the “scene” here, just as on any other website that allows all-comers to post. There are those who invest less of themselves than you do, and those who invest more. Relax, my friend, and Happy New Year.

    #64255
    Clark

    ET, thanks; it is indeed very disturbing. We need to know which variant.

    SA, yes; one possibility is that infection could have occurred from one of the travellers luggage during their quarantine period. And yes, similar outliers have been seen from early on. Also, persistence of infection beyond nominal recovery has been detected in intestinal cells and neurons.

    We should NOT underestimate this virus. It keeps surprising us and we have no way of knowing what the next surprise may be. We should do our utmost to eradicate it.

    #64256
    ET

    @SA
    To get here they’d have had to transit via the UK and use either ferry or a small number of flights still operating. It isn’t mentioned whether they were anywhere else before that. There hasn’t been any mention of the virus strain as yet but I am sure they are looking into that and we will hear in time. They have done extensive contact tracing and made public any shops, bars and any other locations where the individual had visited. A number of close contacts are in self isolation but the public message is that the risk is low. Those who were visiting or working in the locations during the relevant times are asked to self-isolate and contact 111 if they develop symptoms of Covid-19.

    @N_

    “PS Internet “debate” is a morass, ET. Do you think I would waste time “debating” with those who type one-liners such as “you have nothing pertinent to say”?”

    Then why bother posting at all? But hey, I’m glad to have provoked a response from you albeit not the first time.

    “You would probably not be so rude to my face in real life…”

    If engaged in conversation where one party to said conversation made no relevant replies, I most definitely would.
    I am sure you do have something to say N_ and being “on topic” and making posts relevant to what others have posted would help to elucidate that.

    #64257
    SA

    N-
    Of course Yeadon is right in pointing out that SARS cov2 is of the same family as other corona viruses that are associated with 15% of the common cold, and that is the extent of what he is right about, more or less. But this is like stating that Lions and lynxes are the same family as the domestic cat. At one end of the spectrum is a killer, then an animal that can damage but also kill and then one that purrs. It is well known that Covid-19 is caused by the virus SARS cov2, and yes, it does cause SARS but in a smaller proportion of people, 5% rather than the much higher rate that SARS. Yes 80% of those exposed to the virus do not suffer serious illness or are asymptomatic, but that has nothing to do with healthy eating. The severe illness from the virus is not due to lack of immunity, but the production of an inappropriate immune response. So a lot of what you have written has not advanced the discussion at all.

    #64258
    Clark

    N_:

    1) When you eventually recognise conspiracy theory as a phenomenon, you may come to understand why I am angry at Yeadon; he exploited the human susceptibility to conspiracy theory for his own greed. He encouraged the social behaviours that are causing the second UK wave, because upon that wave his company’s stocks might rise. Despicable. ET’s digging revealed that Yeadon knew all along that there would be a second wave, but he used his technical knowledge to mislead the general public, including the politicians. The right-wing media does this all the time.

    2) It’s not hatred, it’s anger. I do hate the corporate media, but that’s a system, not a class of people. Remember that being a toff is just another accident of birth. My own perspective may be unusual in that I was adopted; I have no idea of my own ancestry.

    3) Look to yourself; your comments are laced with hatred for the “ruling classes”, but they’re entirely scatter-gun.

    4) Yes, maintaining good health and a strong immune system are important, but they’re not a panacea, and they’re important at all times, not just now. And many people can’t, no matter how well they eat. Among the commercial activities you hold suspicion for, beware the dietary fads and supplements industries too. Read Goldacre’s Bad Science; it is the corporate media that has given these “entrepreneurs” false legitimacy, while conditioning their audiences to regard science not as assessment of evidence that anyone can practice, but as impenetrable announcements by “experts”. But the corporate media cannot afford to properly educate their readership, because it is dependent for its income upon the effectiveness of advertising; critical thinking itself is a threat to the corporate media’s income.

    5) Yes, it’s entirely regrettable that use of the term “coronavirus” has caught on, also conflating the new SARS virus with the illness it causes. My heart sank as I saw this happening, for I could see the lack of clarity it would produce, and I expected that confusion to be exploited.

    6) Yes, dominance and subservience are a major problem.

    7) It is not always easy to get decent food. I’m lucky; there’s an old fashioned market in Chelmsford. Kirkcudbright had diverse, thriving independent small shops. A supermarket chain wanted to build a “superstore” there. Local residents campaigned against it; “their” council sided with the superstore. Soon, the supermarket chain encountered economic contraction and closed Kirkcudbright superstore. Most local shops had been put out of business and Kirkcudbright became a “shopping desert”. Happens all the time.

    Happy New Year to you too, N_.

    #64259
    Clark

    Yeadon wasn’t “just wrong”. He knew that what he was telling the public was wrong, by being incomplete. He used cherry-picked truths to mislead.

    And he did it on Delingpole’s blog. Delingpole is a global warming denier, and the global warming deniers use this same technique all the time.

    #64263
    node

    Dredd : “You say the vaccine is “poorly tested” but the MHRA (which is responsible for scrutinising the studies and approving it) politely disagrees. Whom to believe? Hmmm.”

    Me!

    There are no (zero) completed clinical trials for the BNT vaccine. Only Phase 1 of a 3 phase trial has been partially completed (its results were announced before the minimum term for assessing serious adverse events had elapsed). In MHRA’s Public Assessment Report, they state: “At the time of writing, the main clinical study is still on-going….”

    MHRA conclude the vaccine is safe and effective based on data from 195 test subjects from the partially completed phase 1 as supplied by the R&D of the vaccine manufacturer (Pfizer and BioNTech) with no independent scrutiny. “Pfizer was responsible for the trial design; for the collection, analysis, and interpretation of the data; and for the writing of the report.” Only 39 vulnerable aged subjects received the vaccine, and about half reported some adverse reactions.

    I repeat: “the vaccine is poorly tested”

    P.S. Recent tender request : The MHRA urgently seeks an Artificial Intelligence (AI) software tool to process the expected high volume of Covid-19 vaccine Adverse Drug Reaction (ADRs)….it is not possible to retrofit the MHRA’s legacy systems to handle the volume of ADRs that will be generated by a Covid-19 vaccine.

    #64264
    node

    Clark: “… and NHS managers in Northern Ireland were implicitly accused by Node a few days ago.”

    This is a lie.

    #64265
    Clark

    It is entirely understandable that the corporate media would popularise the term “coronavirus” for SARS-CoV-2.

    The split personality disorder of the corporate media is being increasingly exposed by covid-19. On the one hand, it has to sensationalise, in order to sell audiences to advertisers – for this is how it makes profit. On the other hand, it has to oppose government-imposed social restrictions – closing shops and entertainments – for advertising these is, again, how it makes profit.

    Hopelessly hamstrung.

    #64266
    Clark

    Node, if you haven’t noticed that your accusation of “scaremongering” implied that NHS managers were “part of the conspiracy”, you’d best re-read your own comment.

    #64267
    Clark

    Node, you’d best re-read your own comment, and the article your comment referred to, for it was an NHS manager who was reported as claiming to have a crisis to deal with.

    #64268
    Clark

    Node, I agree that the new vaccines have so far been less rigorously tested than is usual. But there isn’t time. There are extremely strong theoretical reasons why adverse vaccine reactions will be far less serious than actual infection; quite simply, the vaccine can’t reproduce within cells ie. within a person, whereas the virus can, and indeed has to in order to proliferate.

    #64269
    ET

    I am inclined to agree with your assessment node. I don’t think they could possibly have a sufficiency of data available to them which under normal circumstances they would use to make such a safety determination. I guess the crux there is whether the current circumstances warrant making do with what they do have. It just can’t be as well tested as other vaccines have been. That said, I will still be having it when it is offered to me.

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