176 thoughts on “Mavi Marmara: Footage Hidden From the Israelis

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  • Suhayl Saadi

    Why the constant attempts to turn all discussions about the murders and kidnappings committed by the Israeli state in international waters to an arcane and useless ramble around textual exegesis of various obscure and largely irrelevant publications?

    It’s fascinating, Michael, that you appear so very learned in such fields.

    Your posts remind me a little of those of a Mediaeval wizard of my acquaintance.

    Perhaps you would do well, instead, to peruse the manifold works of the Great Magus, Michael Scot of Selkirk.

    But, as Lady Macbeth (oddly enough, another figure who comes to mind when I read your posts on the subject) might have intoned on breezy, moonless night in Middle Scotland, ‘murder is murder is murder’.

  • angrysoba

    “The Israelis have admitted that statement was faked.

    “Given that the Marmara signalled to the Israelis: ‘Shut up! Go back to Auschwitz!’ how do you know the Israelis weren’t provoked?” ”

    Errr… I don’t think they did.

  • anon

    And for good measure from the Free Gaza organisation, 22 seconds of the most damming evidence of brutality –

    Video Shows Israeli Commando Executing Turkish-American Aid Student

    The Israeli military attempted to confiscate and erase the photographic

    and video evidence of its brutal asault on the Mavi Marmara …The most

    damaging is a film of an Israeli soldier kicking an American citizen while the latter is on the ground,and then executing him.

    SEE THE VIDEO:

    http://intifada-palestine.com/2010/06/video-shows-israeli-commando-executing-american/

  • Anonymous

    angrysoba

    You don’t but they do.

    That is because they were forced to because they made a very silly mistake.

    They had released the unedited version of the exchange with out the addition of those words. So when those words were added to the next version, it was very easy to spot.

    The reason why the Zionists make such mistakes, is people like you don’t care about the facts. You support them blindly.

    Whether the people on the boat said that or not you will still support them. Whether the Zionists admit to doctoring or not, you will still support them.

    They were throwing their loyal dogs such as you a bone by fabricating it, so you can use it the way you do.

    and you continue using it even after they admit it was fabricated.

  • Arsalan

    Mae

    It doesn’t matter what Israel Admits to.

    Zionist trolls will always support Israel.

    When Israel does something really bad, Zionist trols respond by denying it.

    If Israel admits it, Zionist trols respond by justifying it.

    So what difference does it make if Israel admits something or not?

    They will always support Israel.

    And it makes no difference to us either, we all knew it was economic collective punishment before Israel admitted it. because it is blinding obvious that it is economic collective punishment.

    Israel is above the law, because they own enough politicians in the White House and the UK parliament to stay above the law. Nut cases like Michael Petek are the worse ones, they will support Israels actions even if it means the death of ever last person in Israel. That isn’t just a price those nutters are worth paying, it is their objective!

    That is the rapture that they want to speed up, by supporting Israel.

    Michael Petek and his people are the worst Antisemites of them all.

    Before Palestine can be freed from Zionism, the world needs to be freed from Zionism.

    Every country needs to do their own bit to remove the Zionists from their parliaments.

    And I’m not just talking about the ones who call themselves Jews,

  • Michael Petek

    Anon, I watched the video and couldn’t see anyone on it except Israeli soldiers. And no sign that they were shooting at anyone on the deck.

    Read the testimony of Fayez Alghussein on the website of the Armenian Genocide Museum at http://www.genocide-museum.am/eng/eye_witnesses2.php

    Look at the very end of the document.

    After the gendarmes had killed a number of Armenian men, they put turbans on them and brought Kurdish women to weep and lament over them, saying that Armenians had killed their men. Then they brought photographers to record it all for posterity.

    Recently in Nigeria Islamists massacred Christians, then took their bodies to their mosques and put them on display to pass them off as Muslims killed by Christians.

    As for the ‘Israeli’ soldiers, we know from what Borat says that they can’t really have been Israelis.

    If they had been, you’d have been able to see their horns.

  • Arsalan

    Look at this Nazi!

    Just look at him.

    What would happen if used his method of demonising Islam on Christianity?

    So What religion were the Germans, What religion were the people who sent Jews to the concentration camps?

    What religion were the Spanism and British who exterminated the entire population of North and south America to such an extent that they didn’t leave enough alive to enslave so blacks had to be imported from Africa?

    What religion were the British who repeated it in Australia and New Zealand.

    Michael Petek, people in glass houses shouldn’t through stones.

    Heroshima Nagasaki, Vietnam do you want me to continue?

  • Arsalan

    Oh I forgot, you don’t really consider mainstream Christians as true Christians do you?

    Christianity only consists of you, and other members of your new made in Israel cult?

  • arsalan

    Michael Petek

    I have read your exact argument by a Nazi.

    It said the photos of bodies in concentration camps were really Germans. The Russians, locked up a bunch of Germans in concentration camps, starved them to death and took photos and said they were Jews.

    Michael Petek, you are a Nazi, did you read that article the same place as I did, and swapped a few words around to post

    Posted by: Michael Petek at June 11, 2010 4:27 PM

  • warey

    And just think in a couple of months there will be a vote on who will be the next labour zionist leader, ed or david.

    And then in a years time we can all vote between conservative friends of israel and labour friends of israel

  • Suhayl Saadi

    This thread, and this subject, is not about ‘Muslims vs Christians’. It’s about murder on the high seas and the blockade of Gaza, the illegal occupation of territory and oppression and denial of human rights and justice.

    I do wish, Arsalan, and I mean this well, that you would avoid playing into Michael’s attempt to divert the discussion.

    He has a hobby-horse which points only one way; that’s his prerogative. But his role here seems to be is to divert constantly. We know what your views are. I think it’s important to keep bringing it back to ground-level, to the reality of concrete matters.

  • Michael Petek

    Arsalan, I’d rather you didn’t continue.

    If you keep bouncing off the walls of your padded cell, you might shatter your skull against the hard ceiling.

  • Arsalan

    BP, you are so right:

    Because that was exactly what Hitler wanted. Jews out of Germany.

    Israel achieved more than what he wanted, it also achieved Jews out of the parts of europe he didn’t country, and it also resulted in a lot of Jews leaving white countries outside of Europe such as America.

    It is not only zionists who are Nazis, but Nazis are Zionists.

    That is why you see Nazis and Zionists attending each others demonstartion in the UK now. They all wave Zionist flags and give Nazi solutes. Because they are all the same.

  • MJ

    “If you keep bouncing off the walls of your padded cell, you might shatter your skull against the hard ceiling”.

    Listen to the man Arsalan, he speaks from personal experience.

  • Arsalan

    Michael you in no position to call any body a nutter.

    If you think you are read some of your earlier posts. Even your fellow Zionists on this board consider you to be a Nut Job. Go to any Church, and tell them about your beliefs in the rapture, and they will call you a nutter. Speak to any Jew about your beliefs, and see them say the same thing.

    Michael, you are a silly little man, with silly beliefs who belongs to a silly little cult. No one likes you. Your fellow zionists are embarresed by you, Jews the peoople you love hate you, christians want nothing to do with you. you are no one.

    I’m a Muslim, 1.5 billion people share my beliefs. that is 1/4 of everyone on earth. How many people share your beliefs in christian Zionist? Not Catholics, not the Copts, not C if E. Who?

    Who except for yourself and some silly people in America who give their money to very rich televengalists who spend it on Jews, mansions and prostitutes?

  • Michael Petek

    OK, Suhayl, let’s get to the point.

    If you judge this according to Christian morality and religion, Hamas are in the wrong, because Israel is a state and Hamas isn’t, and because it is wrong to wage war to establish the religion of Islam, or any religion at all. There would be no blockade if only Hamas would lay down their arms and piss off.

    If you judge this according to classical Islamic morality and religion, Hamas are in the right because they are Muslims in jihad to re-establish the rule of the Muslims in a part of Dar ul-Islam which has been wrested away by the sons of apes and pigs, and because the Day of Judgement will not come until the Muslims fight the Jews and kill them, and the Jews will hide behind the rocks and the trees. And the rock or tree will say, ‘O Muslim! O servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him.’

    If you don’t believe me, read the relevant parts of Ummdat as-Salik, which I have right here in front of me.

  • Michael Petek

    Arsalan, 1.5 billion people share your beliefs.

    4.5 billion people don’t

  • arsalan

    “it on Jews, mansions and ” that was meant to be jets. Sorry. It could mean Jews, though if I considered Zionists to be Jews.

    But I don’t.

    I believe the real Jews are Antizionists who believe in God and their scriptures, and not atheists like Theodor Hertzel.

  • Arsalan

    Michael Petek

    You are in no position to use that argument. 4.5 billion have as little to do with you as we do.

    No one has anything to do with you.

    Go to a synagoge, and ask Jews whose beliefs they feel closer to, mine or yours.

    Michael Petek no one wants anything to do with you.

    you are alone!

  • Arsalan

    Michael I really find you Christian Zionists very Funny.

    Do you know why?

    You support Zionist, and ideology founded by an atheist and you claim to do so for religious reasons!

    You support Israel, a nation whose population, mostly consists of atheists, not only against Muslims, but also the native Christians!

    You claim you are siding with the chosen people against the Muslim infidels, when the Jews have made their beliefs clear about who they are closer to.

    What was it

    Maimonides, the greatest Jewish philosipha said about Islam?

    “The Ishmaelites are not at all idolaters; [idolatry] has long been severed from their mouths and hearts; and they attribute to God a proper unity, a unity concerning which there is no doubt.”, and his “, And what is their beliefs on you and whether or not you are an idolater?

    I know, walk in to a synagogue and ask them?

    Do you have the guts to do that, or are you too cowardly?

  • Mae

    It does matter, Arsalan, that they admit it and that there’s a credible source (Gisha) to point to.

    You could put on your extra polite hat and write to the BBC next time they put an article on their website saying “Israel says the blockade is necessary because of security concerns”.

    We have a saying in German “Steter Tropfen hoehlt den Stein”, which roughly translates to “stone is worn down one drop (of water) after the other.” Get the BBC to change their articles and hundreds of thousands will start to see things in a different light. One letter might not do it, but hundreds could.

    And btw I have started scrolling through your replies. When you write on this blog, I see your insults too, and I don’t like the name calling by you or anybody else here. It lowers the tone of what could otherwise be a mature and intelligent debate. Your words, your choice.

  • Michael Petek

    Wrong, Arsalan!

    1.5 million Christians plus one God versus the rest.

    Here’s how it works out.

    (1) Hamas game-plan:

    o9.0 JIHAD: “Jihad means to war against non-Muslims, and is etymologically derived from the word “mujahada, signifying warfare to establish the religion. And it is the less Jihad. As for the great Jihad, it is spiritual warfare against the lower self, (nafs), which is why the Prophet said as he was returning from Jihad.

    “We have returned from the lesser jihad to the greater jihad.”

    The scriptural basis for jihad, prior to scholarly consensus is such Koranic verses as:

    (1) “Fighting is prescribed for you” (2:216)

    (2) “Slay them wherever you find them” (4:89)

    (3) “Fight the idolators utterly” (9:36)

    and such hadiths as the one related by Bukhari and Muslim that the Prophet said:

    Scholarly consensus by all reputable Islamic experts is sourced by scriptural basis for Jihad from such Qur’anic verses as: “Fighting is prescribed for you” (2:216), “Slay them wherever you find them” (4:89), “Fight the idolaters utterly” (9:36), and such Hadiths as the one related by Bukhari and Muslim that the Prophet said:

    “I have been commanded to fight people until they testify that there is no god but Allah and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and perform the prayer, and pay zakat. If they say it, they have saved their blood and possessions from me, except for the rights of Islam over them. And their final reckoning is with Allah.”

    (2) Unfortunately for Hamas,God begs to differ:

    “And I saw the heavens opened; and behold, a white horse, and he that sat thereon called Faithful and True; and in righteous he doth judge and make war. And his eyes are a flame of fire, and upon his head are many diadems; and he hath a name written which no one knoweth but he himself. And he is arrayed in a garment sprinkled with blood: and his name is called The Word of God. And the armies which are in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and pure. And out of his mouth proceedeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness of the wrath of God, the Almighty. And he hath on his garment and on his thigh a name written, KINGS OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.” (Revelation 19:11-16)

    Hamas can lift the blockade by surrendering unconditionally.

  • Arsalan

    I only insult people who insult. I am not like the Zionists. And my insults are not general like theirs.

    They insult all Muslims. I have never insult all christians or all Jews.

    And I will never do that.

    When they insult a whole religion or a whole race. I insult them personally.

    Or I insult idiologies and people who hold them.

    And to the best of my knowledge I have only insulted Zionism and Nazism.

    If you know of where I insulted a whole people, please for what they are, not what they do, please show me.

  • arsalan

    Mae

    See what he just wrote?

    I told you, he has just proved my point about him and his Nazism.

    The German Nazis did the same thing, quoting from the Torah and the Talmud, interpreting it in their own way.

    He is just a Nazi, and nothing more than a Nazi.

    The only way to speak to a Nazi like that is to insult them. I am not going to give him a point by point rebutal. But if a Non-Nazi asked me what he posted in question form I may answer it.

    this guy is not looking for answers , he is not looking for facts. He is just hatemongering, because he is nothing more than a Nazi

  • angrysoba

    “That is because they were forced to because they made a very silly mistake.

    They had released the unedited version of the exchange with out the addition of those words. So when those words were added to the next version, it was very easy to spot.”

    Do you have that recording?

    “The reason why the Zionists make such mistakes, is people like you don’t care about the facts. You support them blindly.

    Whether the people on the boat said that or not you will still support them. Whether the Zionists admit to doctoring or not, you will still support them.”

    As far as I can see there were two groups of people ready to make up their minds before anything happened. You were always destined to fall into one camp whatever happened and Michael Petek was always going to fall into the other.

    Now, could you show me where Israel admitted to faking those statements because as far as I have seen they have stood by their claim that they were authentic.

    “They were throwing their loyal dogs such as you a bone by fabricating it, so you can use it the way you do.

    and you continue using it even after they admit it was fabricated.”

    I haven’t “used” the recordings at all. I am merely asking you where it was admitted that they were fakes or fabrications.

    I contend they never did “admit” they were fabrications.

    I am not sure why it matters to you. If you think the shootings were unacceptable then does it matter to you that they said “Go back to Auschwitz?”

    It seems you are determined to short-circuit the argument by claiming that Israel fabricated a case against the “peace activists” and concocted the voices on the recordings. Strangely, a few people have even claimed that a photograph of a few knives and sticks was also fabricated when such a photograph would have been utterly pointless (we KNOW the peace activists had sticks, chains and knives and used them).

  • Arsalan

    Mae

    Take a look at this,

    Michael Petek did you get those quotes by reading the Quran or are you cut and pasting from a Zionist webpage?

    If you have done some research in to it and know what they mean. Tell me what the Asbabul nazul of the verses are?

    I know you are online now, so if you do not respond now it means you are just a mindless parot cutting and pasting while not knowing what you cut and past.

  • Anonymous

    angrysoba

    before I give you a link to the IDF press release.

    Tell me, will it make a difference to you. If not, go find the link yourself.

    If it will, and you will renounce all your Zionist beliefs as a result and join the correct side. I will give you the link.

    So Angry which is it?

  • Arsalan

    Michael Petek is what I call a cut and past Parrot. He cuts and past articles and quotes from the Quran without any knowldge of what they mean from zionist webpages.

    He has no honour, if he did, he would find out what they mean and what they were refering to by finding out about the ashabul nuzul of the verses(when were they revealed and about what), but he didn’t because the true meaning is not important to him. All that is important to him is being a cut and past parrot, in the way Nazis are when they cut and past quotes other Nazis take from the Talmud.

    I bet the Idiot hasn’t even read the chapter where the verses were taken from to get an idea about the context?

    So have you?

    Have you read the chapters that you are quoting from?

    Have at least got the honour to do that?

    No, you have no honour

    you are nothing.

    You are not a Christian, you are not even one tries to serve God.

    You are Just a Nazi.

    You are not loyal to God, you are loyal to the gang which you have chosen.

    Your religion is not your pathway to serve God as it is for all true Muslims, Christians, Jews, Bodhists Sikhs. For you it is just a label, a us against them label. you have nothing to do with god or serving him in anyway. You are in no way a Christian, and Christianity has nothing to do with you.

    Go to your zionism and your Israel, they are the gods you serve above God. And in the day of judgement see if your zionism and your Israel, your idols can save you from the buring pits of hell.

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