Simple Questions A Real Democracy Would Answer

by craig on November 15, 2011 11:59 am in Uncategorized

The government could clear up the issue of Fox Gould and Werritty if it answered these very simple questions. They are questions to which in any real democracy we would be entitled to expect an answer, concerning officials paid by us. I have put these questions to them. Consider why the government refuses to answer these simple and obvious questions.

But the truly terrifying thing is not just that the government refuses to answer these questions from me, it is that the mainstream media refuses even to ask them:

How many times in total did Gould, Werritty and Fox meet?
How many of these are listed in O’Donnell’s official investigation?
Why the discrepancy?

Did the meeting between Fox, Gould and Werritty while Fox was Shadow Defence Secretary follow official rules concerning briefing of opposition front bench spokesmen by officials?
Where did it take place?

When did Gould first meet Werritty?
How many times did Gould meet Werritty without Fox present?
How many communications of all sorts have there ever been between Gould and Werritty?

Where precisely was the “Pre-posting briefing meeting” for Gould with Werritty and Fox held?
Why was it not held in the Secretary of State’s office?
Why was no MOD official present?

Who paid for the “Private dinner” between Fox, Gould and Werritty and “Senior Israelis” in Tel Aviv in February 2011?
Who was present?
Was any note subsequently made of the discussion?

Who paid for the “social engagement” to which Fox invited Gould and Werritty in summer 2010?
Who was present?

Was the possibility of an attack on Iran discussed in any of the above meetings, events or communications?

These really are very simple questions and I will happily report any answer in full. Every media outlet should be asking these questions. Remember Werritty had no security clearance. It is therefore not possible that the answers to these questions is classified information.

If the explanations are innocent, why should these questions not be answered?

ACTION Please send reasoned communications to mainstream media journalists and editors, asking them if they will put these questions to the government. You may also like to contact your MP or any other politician you find reasonable, to ask them whether they are not interested to know the answers.

The answer to these questions would not be hidden in a democracy.

Please post in comments all responses you get, including from journalists.

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  1. Since Liam Fox is my MP, I am sorely tempted to email him directly on the subject…

  2. This planet is run by persons of pure evil. They have all the guns bombs and jails, do we need any further proof!
    Its about time the useful idiots and stooges took a good look at themselves, they have opted out of humanity and sided with the psychopaths. Hell mend them.

    Good blog by the way Craig!

  3. If plans are so far advanced for an attack on Iran then would this not fall into the remit of a DA notice, Craig?

  4. Just like to say that all the people who have spread this story over the net have done a well good job. Thanks.

  5. I have just emailed my MP (Clive Betts) saying I too want answers and asking him he can help in getting them.

  6. One thing wrong in your title here Craig. Democracy. I ask ‘What Democracy’?

  7. Mary, ‘What Democracy’?


    Exactly,no such thing in this country. We have an elected dictatorship as far as I can see.

  8. I have sent links to Rory Stewart and Kris Hopkins, both Tory MPs (and ex-soldiers) who have expressed thoughtful views on foreign policy in the House.

  9. Michael Stephenson

    15 Nov, 2011 - 1:41 pm

    I have written an email to my MP James Wharton.
    Perhaps we should set up a mailing list so we can cc our emails into. That way we can name and shame those that don’t reply.

  10. Just a thought, but have you thought of amalgamating your website with others like

    Boiling frogs post, George Galloway? Im sure there are many others… that people could suggest.

    It seem to me you voice is somewhat diluted when its a single person brand? i understand your reasons….



  11. Some related questions here – the MP’s who asked them may be worth approaching:
    I have emailed Angus Robertson MP, SNP Foreign Affairs and Defence spokesman.

  12. Supporting Democracy is Anti-Semitism, if the people selected for election are not chosen by Zionists.

    Anti-Semitism is a be all and end all statement. Today it just means, a Zionist disagrees with you.
    When they use it, it just means “Shut up, we Zionists as your superiors order you to shut up”.

  13. Komodo. There is only one name there I would trust. I know for a fact that Murphy is a staunch member of LFoI and Lucas too –
    His entry here
    Overseas visits
    2-8 September 2007, to Israel and Palestine with Labour Friends of Israel (LFI). Travel and hospitality paid for by LFI. Accommodation paid for by LFI at a rate discounted through the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs. Some hospitality provided by the Palestinian Legislative Council/Palestinian Authority. Travel within Israel/Palestine provided by LFI. Some travel within Israel provided by the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs. (Registered 2 November 2007)
    Couldn’t be bothered to check out the rest. Too depressing.

  14. I can’t agree with TFS here – Craig is a unique voice and needs to continue to be heard as one.

  15. Sorry, I’m bringing this onto here because the previous post has so many comments it takes forever to load on my slow connection.
    I put up a WIkipedia page for Gould. I don’t believe there ever was one before. I need a reference for his being at St Paul’s School. Komodo I think came up with that info – do you have a source? If so perhaps you could add it, or post it here and I or someone else can.


  16. I think Mhairi is a gaelic red herring.
    Rather having your blog smell of fish , step Mhairi gaily on her way to her weddin.

    Great article, even managed to find it on google news today. There must be some people in power that can push this back into official discussion.
    It’s unbelievable that Belligerent Britain could be pushed into a war by a foreign power with moles in the key ministries where even their boyfriends have access to money and people.Just how deep is the sewer at Westminster ?

  17. After St Paul’s
    The presence of Old Paulines in public life is very marked: George Osborne MP, Chancellor of the Exchequer; Ed Vaizey MP; Matthew Gould, PPS to David Miliband at the Foreign Office and the first Jewish British ambassador to Israel; Lord Razzall of Mortlake, Liberal Democrat spokesman on Trade and Industry; Lord Baker of Dorking CH PC.


  18. Jane Grey..

    Says on the school website he went there, first page towards the bottom.


    Letter to my MP – Paul Burstow

    Foreign Office Transparency? The Anglo-Israeli Plot to Attack Iran

    You might remember the questions I raised about UK use of DU a while back & the response from the FO you forwarded to me? I was sceptical with that reply then, and this has only been reinforced by today’s news that the minister for armed forces had to apologise over misleading statements he made regarding the legality and dangers of depleted uranium weapons.

    Harvey admitted he “inadvertently misled MPs” about a Ministry of Defence review that he said had concluded the weapons were permissible on humanitarian and environmental grounds under the Geneva conventions. It subsequently emerged that the review had never happened.” It seems reasonable to assume the dangers of DU are not a subject worth him taking time to get his facts straight.

    This request is different question which again goes to the heart of Foreign Office transparency.

    In case you are unaware, you may care to read the following by ex ambassador Craig Murray which was effectively censored by the UK mainstream media …and not because it failed any fact check!

    The Anglo-Israeli Plot to Attack Iran
    The Role of Matthew Gould, British Ambassador to Israel

    The Foreign Office refuse to provide information that should be publicly available. What have they got to hide?

    Craig Murray poses questions below that you will understand if you read his article on the collusion between Gould, Werritty, and Fox in their dealings with Israel. It is worth your time as it involves a potentially disastrous war of aggression against Iran. Note Werritty had no security clearance. It is therefore not possible that the answers to these questions is classified information.
    INSERTED your questions here

    The issues Craig raises are literally life and death ones – both for our armed forces and the people of countries we might choose to invade.
    So please ask the FO to answer these questions, and should they decline explain why – as once again it is not possible that the answers to these questions is “classified information”.

    As with DU, I fear I will be “fobbed off” with the official response you eventually send me. But at least I know that you now know this and will act as a man on conscience. Don’t let them fob you off too.

    I look forward to your reply.

  20. Michael Stephenson

    15 Nov, 2011 - 2:10 pm

    Letter to my MP, I expect I’ll be fobbed off or receive no reply.

    Recently Former British Ambassador to Uzbekistan and whistleblower Craig
    Murray revealed on his blog that Liam Fox and Adam Werritty had been
    conducting secretive meetings with “committed zionist” and ambassador to
    Israel Matthew Gould and the Israeli government.
    Allegedly making plans for a future attack on Iran, and that Fox and
    Werritty was coordinating with Israel while Labour was still in
    Any level of subterfuge and secretive planning for a war will not be
    received well by the majority of the British public.
    I for one do not want a repeat of Iraq where the government conspired to
    fool the public into going to war, and this certainly appears to be what
    is happening in this case.
    The questions posed by Craig Murray here:
    And the full account here:
    Need to be properly addressed and investigated.
    The public deserves a full explanation, not a complete whitewash, as
    your party will doubtless attempt to do.
    I expect that you as my MP will ask these questions in parliament, and
    demand that your party be open and honest about when these meeting were
    conducted and what the purpose was.
    The public do not want to go to war with Iran, we operate in a democracy
    where you serve the interests of citizens of this country, not of
    America and not of Israel.

    Michael Stephenson

  21. unable to connect to murray’s blog
    Posted by jjboulas on November 15, 2011, 2:26 pm

    Hoepfuly just a glitch
    Me also for last ten minutes. Traffic or interference?

  22. of course one could set up an e petition and force a debate in parliament .. you only need 100 000 supporters to get it onto the political agenda ..
    i suspect via twitter/alt media this could be achieved ..

  23. Mary – as Murphy is one of the very few MP’s who has consistently pressed for answers on Foxwerritty, I’d say he’s not to be dismissed lightly. If it embarrasses the Tories, it’s grist to his mill….never mind the central issue. Forget the FoI angle for the moment – half of them are only in it for freebies and privileged access.

  24. Down for me for 15 mins, but probably cock-up rather than conspiracy!
    ** Craig, please check your email. The Morning Star is interested in carrying a shorter version of your piece **

  25. Very important Mike D on the lies/economy with the truth you have informed us with about DU. Thanks.

    PS ‘Authorities’ announce a crack down on St Pauls’ Occupy site in the wake of Bloomberg acting for Brookfield Properties in clearance of Zuccotti Park NY.
    Brookfield Assets $20 billion. Revenue $1.5 billion.

  26. Paul Madden UK High Commissioner to Australia up O’Donnell’s **** here.

    PS ? Why is O’Donnell out there. Why did he have to go to CHOGM? Getting a nice tan?

  27. 1) MattW, good idea! Go for it! You are his constituent; he represents you. If you want, you could even go to meet him at one of his constituency surgeries. Now that he is no longer a member of the cabinet, he is likely to have more time to attend these in person. Be polite, speak quietly, but be doggedly persistent. Remember the iconic TV moment of Mrs Thatcher and the ‘phone-in re. the Belgrano? Good luck! Tell us all what the outcome was.
    2) Craig, re. the MSM organs, that is likely to be because the truth of their relationship with power resides not in the answers, but in the questions.

  28. ‘Britain’s first Jewish ambassador to Israel’

    How many times do we see this? Constantly plugged to get the message home. In your face? Relevance to the announcement of the birth of his first child?

  29. Paul Whitehouse

    15 Nov, 2011 - 3:00 pm

    re No 10 petitions
    The Yanks have a similar system – more than a certain number of signatures and you get, not a debate, but a reply from the White House. They used to ask for 5,000 signatures, but after a few petitions actually got that many they bumped it up to 20,000 (or was it 25,000). There weren’t that many petitions with 5,000 – a few tens – they could easily have fobbed them off but they don’t like the idea of having to engage with real people. If too many of the British ones start getting 100k they’ll start asking for more, probably.

  30. Jonathan Cook has reviewed your article on Medialens. He makes some good points:
    “Regular readers will know well of Jonathan Cook’s insightful journalism on Israel-Palestine. ( )
    He kindly sent us some comments this morning after reading Craig Murray’s piece:
    i thought it was rather disorganised the way he wrote it but easy enough for a paper to tidy up or rewrite entirely – they have lots of people who specialise in doing that. there seems to be both significant information and interesting speculation there that at the very least a paper ought to be following up themselves.
    a) the fact of an additional four meetings between the trio of gould, fox and werritty.
    b) the failure of o’donnell to include this in his report – was this because he was lied to, or because he didn’t make full disclosure? and why?
    c) gould’s extremely undiplomatic behaviour – the media have a good source in murray who is prepared to criticise gould for breaking the rules
    d) the possibility of israeli / mossad involvement in these meetings.
    e) the iranian obsessions of all three.
    i would have thought a paper would at the least run a news story based on the first three points, with a possible related oped by murray based on the last two.
    several papers have already intimated that fox-werritty were running a “parallel” MoD policy – presumably based on their own conversations with insiders. they just haven’t suggested what that alternative policy was. murray has given some vital extra clues. the problem, i fear, is that the papers don’t want to go down this path because a) the parallel policy may have been more official than it looks (plausible deniability?); and b) it implicates israel in meddling in our foreign policy and that’s a no-no still for our media.
    all best, jonathan
    Then a short time later, Jonathan added:
    btw, murray also made a fascinating aside about how, until gould’s appointment, it was always british foreign policy not to appoint a jew to the post of ambassador to israel for fear of creating any impression of a conflict of interest. interesting for two reasons:
    a) the british media has never had such qualms – in fact they treat even mentioning this issue as almost proof of anti-semitism.
    b) the foreign office policy was relaxed / violated presumably for a reason. was gould, with his self-declared zionist sympathies, seen as more amenable to bending the rules and his diplomatic training to become effectively pointman for this parallel policy? that would suggest it was more official than we are being led to believe.”

  31. I agree, Cook’s comments are very sensible. Again he pinpoints that the lack of investigation of this by the mainstream media is really strange.

  32. Letter composed and going off to my MP George Osborne. Thanks MikeD – I have cut & pasted some of the text of your excellent letter!

  33. Craig, re meetings in Washington while Gould was was Foreign and Security Policy Counsellor there 2005 to March 2007. Looking at the old Atlantic Bridge charity accounts, they only acclaim one Liam Fox visit to Washington in that period, so it is pretty likely then. Though there are no public accounts before Feb 2006, so could be earlier. The 2007 accounts say:

    “Dr Liam Fox addressed an audience at The Heritage Foundation in Washington, DC on 16th February 2006. The topics covered included the factors that make the Special Relationship work and an assessment of future challenges from the NATO operation in Afghanistan to the growing threat of international terrorism.”

    Links below about this meeting, including MP3 recording. Hague and Osborne also went on that ‘befriend the Republicans’ 16 February 2006 trip.

    A few months later Nile Gardiner, who hosted the Fox Heritage Foundation meeting, wrote about the Iran-Fox-Straw-Blair situation, confirming the Fox “aggressive line”:

    “Straw’s views are not, however, representative of opinion in Downing Street and reflect a divided state of affairs within the British government. In addition, his outright rejection of the use of force as an option has been sharply criticized by the UK’s Shadow Defense Secretary, Liam Fox, and the Conservative Party, which is pushing an aggressive line on the Iranian issue.”

    The Atlantic Bridge accounts list two further Fox visits to the U.S. in 2006, but not Washington, so less likely to offer an easy Gould-Fox-Herrity meeting venue:

    “Author and political commentator James Hirsen and Dr Liam Fox addressed a gathering of 70 at the Regency Club in Los Angeles, USA. This dinner occurred on the 12th July 2006 with sponsorship from Kirkland & Ellis, LLP (of Chicago, Illinois)

    On the 18th October 2006, Dr Liam Fox met with leaders of the Pittsburgh business community at a reception held at The Duquesne Club in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. Dr Fox discussed the war on terror, energy security, and the Iraq war.”

    Here are the links on Fox’s Heritage Foundation speech:

  34. You are up on Information Clearing House as one of their main items.
    A great coup.
    An excellent site.
    Hope this isn’t already on.

  35. Mary – so it’s an Old Pauline, not a Zionist conspiracy! Now I know what it feels like to be tentacular.

  36. Say what you like about St. Pauls, bearing in mind the libel laws, but antisemitic tropes are pretty thin on the ground there.

  37. I wrote to my M.P. Steve McCabe again yesterday. I think he’s a bit overworked. The last letter I got from him was for somebody else.

    This is so important. It ought to be making waves all through the world media. The internet is a useful tool. Without it this debate might have been squashed. Eventually somebody in the media has to bring things out in the open.
    My faith lies in one of my favourite novels “The Ragged Trousered Philanthropists” by Robert Tressell (real name Robert Noonan). This working class author died young (probably from consumption) and his daughter hawked the novel round till it found a publisher. It never appears (or didn’t) on university curricula, or ‘A’ level reading-lists (or didn’t) never gets publicised, except word of mouth by people like me, yet when the BBC did a poll of the top 100 novels a few years back it was in the top 70. Not bad for a book ignored by the mass media. Keep the faith.

  38. @Komodo – I’d hate for there to be too many antisemitic tropes just lying around at St. Pauls. Couldn’t they be a tripping hazard?

  39. Here’s an antisemitic trope. Now HERE IS an antisemitic trope. I wonder the guy’s still alive:

  40. does anyone have any contact with AVAAZ? They certainly know how to raise 100k plus signatures. They were the main source of objection to the Murdoch take over of BSKYB and currently have over a million signatures re the Palestinian statehood issue. Potential war with Iran surely would interest them?

  41. Done, I’ve emailed my MP. However my MP never replies to emails from this nobody (at least, it hasn’t happened yet), so I wouldn’t hold your breath. :(

  42. I think it’s time we stop using the term mainstream media. And call it what it is, the Robert Maxwell owned media. BEcause near enough everything we see, hear or watch here is owned or at least partially controled by him.
    Even the media that isn’t is forced to submit to his will to some extent, because they are always at risk of lossing their Jobs if he ever buys a controlling stake in their companies.

  43. We had an antisemitic trope but it died.

  44. Robert Maxwell is alive?? Bloody hell, the media he owns are hiding that one pretty well! 😉
    @Nuid, I am sorry to hear about the passing of your trope. Do they make good pets?

  45. Michael Stephenson

    15 Nov, 2011 - 5:23 pm

    Guardian won’t even tolerate mentioning the Gould affair on CiF.
    I wonder where the pressure is coming from?

  46. Hello.
    You have made
    Not on their main page but click on other viewpoints.
    Still in good company.

  47. My first comment on your blog! I want to congratulate you on this story. If more people kept on asking the right questions and showing the lack of proper answers – or sometimes any answers at all – they would expose politicians and senior officials lies and obfuscation and, eventually, utterly destroy their credibility with anybody who does not directly gain or not brainwashed.

    Keep up the good work!

  48. Arsalan

    Given recent events I think it would be a pretty difficult argument to sustain that the Guardian was controlled by Rupert Murdoch let alone the long dead Robert Maxwell – but I suppose you never know with these dead Zionists until you have put a stake through their hearts? Conspiracy theory of the week surely.

  49. Have emailed my MP Richard bacon with the questions, he was out and out against the war in Iraq, but he’s slow to come up with answering when the issue is sticky.

    Welcome here Neill, please do bother your MP with these legitamite questions to the FCO, the more the FCO gets the better.

  50. Stephen, I think we can assume that Arsalan made a typographical error. Which was lucky because it gave us a chance to sample not only your wit but your obstinacy in hewing to right wing talking points.

  51. Good to see that so many commenters have contacted their MPs.

    One easy way to e-mail your MP is via WriteToThem:

    The WriteToThem facility allows pasting of material, so you can append Craig’s entire article of 14.11.11 to the end of your e-mail, making it much easier for your MP to read it.

  52. Alex Grant,

    Avaaz? Are you kidding? They have an anti-Iran anti-Syria agenda. I would like you to try with them to petition against war on Iran and see the results.

    By the way, while you are at it, ask them to save the world!

    Avaaz know how to con people.

  53. There’s no interest in this story so far from the MSM. Craig Murray is being ignored -it’s everyone’s worst nightmare!

    Might that perhaps be because that Murray presents no evidence whatsoever that these meetings had anything to do with ‘a plot to attack Iran’? And when I say ‘no evidence whatsover’ what I actually mean is: ‘NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER’. None.

    It reminds me of dear old Harold (some of you may be old enough to remember him) Wilson, and his briefing of the journalists Penrose and Courtier: “Occasionally when we meet I might tell you to go to the Charing Cross Road and kick a blind man standing on the corner. That blind man may tell you something, lead you somewhere.”

    Wilson had relapsed into some kind of a pre-dementia paranoid state and it was very sad to see a powerful mind collapse. I would suggeat that what is to be seen here is analogous.

    There may well be plans to neutralise Iran’s nuclear warfare capacity. I hope there are. Failure to plan for that would represent an abrogation of responsibility to plan for the security of the entire world, not only the middle east. But Murray has uncovered nothing to suggest their existance. Nothing at all, and he is relying on the suggestibility of his usual followers to gain some kind of traction for this particular ‘plot’.

    But, as an Old Pauline, I would say that wouldn’t I?

  54. Julian
    ‘There may well be plans to neutralise Iran’s nuclear warfare capacity.

    There already is.
    It is some 5 – 10,000 nuclear missiles all pointing in the direction of Teheran should they even accidentally let off a giant fire work.
    They do not need to plot to destroy a nation and murder millions of its citizens in case it manages to get, what? half a dozen nuclear warheads.
    Big deal.
    Known as the insurance policy syndrome invented by North Korea and probably being folowed by more fourth world nations than you have fingers and toes.
    I imagine LIbya was the final straw.
    People like you are suffering from some strange form of political paranoia – either that or the killing of tens of thousands of innocents as we have just witnessed in Libya satifies some primitive blood lust.
    Sad but actually evil.

  55. Arsalan, Jon, is it true then that Robert Maxwell is the only person from MGN getting a pension?

  56. Daisy, thsnkd for the attention, but I can’t follow your reasoning. Are you saying that the deaths in Libya satisfy a primitive blood lust in me, and that I’m sad but actually evil? Is that it?

  57. Julian, hello. Your characterisation of the matters concerning Harold Wilson suggests that your views are as dogmatic as those you seek to criticise. The Wilson Affair(s) are by no means as clear-cut as you make out.
    But really, what on earth does Harold Wilson have to do with Craig Murray? Do you draw the comparison to suggest to readers that Craig Murray is in “some kind of a pre-dementia paranoid state”? If so, what precisely is your clinical evidence?
    Craig Murray’s revelations raise more questions that answers – and he has posted those questions on this thread. He – and we – are simply asking for those questions to be asked. If there is nothing to hide, then the questions ought to be easy to answer. Then, once we have the answers, we can decide whether or not there is any evidence of anything.
    Since we seem to be dwelling in the realms of long-term memory, your post reminded me of the famous phrase: “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”.

  58. going back to the e petition
    it would appear that a short summary of the case (questions needing answers) could be made and posted .. maybe just the fact that there is an e petition could bump up media interest .. more so if there was a large enough response.
    really the article should have been published in conjunction with an e petition .. that would have been the efficient way to highlight the allegations
    really craig should have had some process of working that enables his thinking, commentary to have greater impact if not in the corporate media certainly the independent media.
    think in terms of alex jones who is overlooked by corporate media but effectively has his message reported in that very media because he utilises all the alternative resources that are available to him.

  59. Julian, the plot to attack Iran has existed since 2002. Preventing those most likely to be involved at top level – and such people are not going to inform the likes of you or me about it – is a priority. Setting up a spurious charity (Atlantic Bridge) enabled the laundering of money, because that’s what it appears to have been, largely from very rich Israeli businessmen, to circumvent the money laundering laws applied to ordinary businesses, is the first piece in a frightening jigsaw. The money appears to have been used to fund,among other things, Liam Fox’s overseas visits with his friend Adam Werritty, but may also have been used in weapons’ financing. If you don’t believe it is about attacking Iran you need to catch up with the reading.

    In my opinion to appoint a Jewish ambassador to Israel is like appointing a member of Hamas as British ambassador to Palestine. It is provocative in the extreme and spells out the agenda of certain members of this government, Hague, Osborne et al.

  60. “Suhayl Saadi”: ‘Your characterisation of the matters concerning Harold Wilson suggests that your views are as dogmatic as those you seek to criticise.’ Don’t follow you.

    ‘The Wilson Affair(s) are by no means as clear-cut as you make out.’ Wheels within wheels eh? Gosh.

    ‘He – and we – are simply asking for those questions to be asked. If there is nothing to hide, then the questions ought to be easy to answer.’ No you’re not. Everyone here has already made up their mind. Notice I use the singular. There’s a hive-mind here.

    “The lady doth protest too much, methinks”. Avoid clichés wherever possible is my advice. Unless you’re trying to be rude or something.

    “John Goss”: “Julian, the plot to attack Iran has existed since 2002. Preventing those most likely to be involved at top level – and such people are not going to inform the likes of you or me about it – is a priority.” This sentence does not make actual sense. This does not surprise me.

    “Setting up a spurious charity (Atlantic Bridge) enabled the laundering of money,…” Two baseless statements in one breath. Wonderful.

    “…is the first piece in a frightening jigsaw.” Who is frightened? Not me. You may be, but you’d be frightened if you found a raisin in your muesli.

    “The money appears to have been used to fund,among other things, Liam Fox’s overseas visits with his friend Adam Werritty, but may also have been used in weapons’ financing.” Overseas trips, eh? Gotta be something strange there! And weapons financing? May have been used for? What’s wrong with the mini-bar?

    “In my opinion to appoint a Jewish ambassador to Israel is like appointing a member of Hamas as British ambassador to Palestine. It is provocative in the extreme and spells out the agenda of certain members of this government, Hague, Osborne et al.” That’s just childish. But if the agenda is to support a democracy against the theocratic supremacists of Hamas et al, then that’s an agenda only lunatics would oppose.

  61. John Goss

    If there has been a plot to attack Iran I suspect it has been around since the Iran hostage crisis of 1979-81 if I know US right wing nuts. The fact that it has taken so long to come to fruition might actually suggest that things don’t actaully work in the clockwork fashion that you attribute to the


    While I agree with much of what you say – I do think you are being a little unkind to Craig who has actually dug out a lot about the Fox/Werrity/Gould meetings that raise genuine questions that need to be addressed if only so that the debate about Iran is got out into the open, and so that there can be a sensible and informed discussion about the measures that should be taken over Iran. I am not sure that leaving to the likes of Fox and his ilk and Craig’s fan club is likely to lead to a sensible conclusion.

  62. “But if the agenda is to support a democracy”

    Israel is not a democracy. It treats its Arab citizens as second class people. It is now clamping down on foreign donations to human rights organisations who criticise Israeli human rights abuses,it is not clamping down on rigthwing organisations who support it. It is also now going after the press and trying to cloase down channel 10 who have been responsible for some cutting investigative journalism about the rightwing government. Also in parts of Jerusalem women have to sit on the back of the bus due to nutty religious types. If you think this is a democracy then you are sadly mistaken.

  63. Julian, you and I are on different planets it would appear. You have heard of Atlantic Bridge? You do know that a number of companies were set up through which it appears money was siphoned, companies which never lasted long enough to publish acoounts with the same people at the top. Put two and two together, lad.

  64. “Julian, the plot to attack Iran has existed since 2002. Preventing those most likely to be involved at top level – and such people are not going to inform the likes of you or me about it – is a priority.” You quote two sentences. Which one makes no sense to you? If it’s the second you have to take out the middle clause. What it means is: preventing those most likely to be involved at top level in a plot to attack Iran is a priority, but they are not likely to inform me or you of their intentions.
    Hope it did not cause others the same problems.

  65. Michael Stephenson:
    “Guardian won’t even tolerate mentioning the Gould affair on CiF.
    I wonder where the pressure is coming from?”

    As I’ve posted elsewhere: the Guardian Media Group sold a 49.9% stake in Trader Media (Auto Trader, etc) to Apax, a private equity firm founded and chaired by Sir Ronald Cohen. This was to help finance the Guardian which was and is in the financial crap. In August GMG took a £50M slice (half) of a “special” dividend from Trader Group, also to boost the funds of the Guardian and Observer. It looks as if this dividend was either loan-or equity leveraged. Sir Ronald Cohen has Israeli business interests and was awarded the Jubilee Award for services to Israeli business by Netanyahu himself. Cohen is also an historical donor to Labour Party politicians:

    ,a non-dom, and as far as I can see a fervent Zionist.

    Nice of you to ask the question. This may be the answer.

  66. hmm maybe the “time table” is akin to that of cast lead … thats if they can “do” syria in the next few weeks … a lot of effort in that direction at the moment ..

  67. Stephen the questions that Murray raises are obvious ones, which will no doubt be answered, but the debate about Iranian nuclear weapons is already out in the open, has been for years. Absolutely years. Murray with his ridiculous insinuations of plots hinders that debate by corralling ‘dissenting voices’ into the conspiratorialist camp and making one side therefore appear silly. You could say he was a useful idiot for any pro-war camp (if there was such a thing, and there isn’t). As to the Murray fan club, no amount of answers will suffice. That’s the hive-mind for you.
    Ken ‘Israel is not a democracy’. There are Arab: members of the Knesset, senior officers in the IDF, senior members of the judiciary, Arab citizens have the vote, have access to all public services, hold citizenship on exactly the same basis as everyone else, there is a free press with the widest possible range of opinion. You prefer theocratic supremacist imperialism to this? What exactly is your definition of democracy?
    John Goss, we are indeed on different planets. Yours is the one made of green cheese.

  68. Your planet is out of this world, Julian. But what do you understand by the following: ‘Gould, who was stationed in Tehran in a previous post, said that his government saw preventing Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons as an important priority.

    “My government absolutely agrees with your conception of the Iranian threat and the importance of your determination to battle it.” Dealing with the Iranian threat will be a large part of my work here.” Gould said.’

    Matthew Gould should be called back and replaced with an impartial ambassador, further removed from the disgraced Fox, Werritty, Osborne, Thatcher, Hague clique. Otherwise the war it appears you want, that the rest of us don’t, could very well become a reality.

  69. Only slightly off-thread: It’s Tuesday, 10.32pm, and Newsnight has David Milliband on to speak “on behalf” of 30 young unemployed people.

    Yes, the former leadership contender who scuttled away to neocon outpost Georgia when their misjudged stushie with Russia backfired; the same David Milliband who apologised to Tzipi Livni. You know the guy.

    So why did Newsnight have him on “representing” the young unemployed? Does he speak for the so-called Lost Generation?

    Does he fuck. But the Beeb would love to have him as Labour leader!

  70. I’m pre-empting your answer here, because I know you will claim that Iran is a threat. But like there was no evidence that Saddam Hussein was developing WMDs there is no evidence that Iran is manufacturing nuclear weapons. But those with an agenda will claim that and use it as an excuse for “Dealing with the Iranian threat”. Many of us are much more fearful that Israel, and the USA again, are much more likely to use nuclear weapons than Iran. What do they teach at St Paul’s?

  71. Alright, calm down everyone. It’s interesting to hear directly opposing viewpoints (and there will be plenty of the Israel/Palestine issue) but on both sides nothing is achieved by lobbing insults. It only has the effect of solidifying one’s opponents’ perspectives, and if one is debating in order to persuade the other to moderate/alter their view – which I guess is most of us – that result is counterproductive.
    Julian, what I would give to have my planet made of a good quality blue cheese!

  72. Julian.

    You are trying to post a rosy picture of Israel as a democracy,now maybe this might work for you with someone who knows noting about the country but it will not work with me and asking silly questions tying to insinuate that I support Hamas does your argument no good at all. At this very moment their is a debate in the Knesset to stop the Arabic language from being recognised as an official language of Israel. You can read about that here.

    The Israeli press rate at number 86 on the reporters without borders index 2010. That is not a very free press by any intelligent persons standards.,1034.html

  73. Mike, they’d rather have him than his brother, Ed.

  74. Oh, yes. Israeli Arabs. That’s the lucky ones with full citizenship, isn’t it. Except the right of return, obviously.
    “….the army can do anything in the occupied territories. Millions of people are subject to this regime, and our democracy does not see them. Rather, it lives with the occupation as the exception, not the rule.

    In contrast, Israeli democracy is careful not to talk about the constitutional status of the Arabs within its borders. It has established a devious system of laws and regulations to expropriate from them rights reserved only for Jewish citizens, and even for Jewish non-citizens. The real estate laws are an example of this, as are the actions of the Jewish National Fund and the Jewish Agency, which behave as if the state were only for Jews.

    Public discourse – which perhaps arises because we understand we must seek international legitimacy – was always restrained, not to say duplicitous. The Koenig report, named for the Interior Ministry official who in 1976 recommended ways the government could discriminate against Arabs, caused a storm. However, no one protected Koenig, because official Israel upheld the rules of the game, maintaining a unified liberal tongue. It left non-democratic policy to the “security establishment.”

    (Yitzhak Laor, Ha’aretz, 11 Feb, 2008

    20.4% of the population, just over 10% of the Knesset membership.
    “According to a study commissioned by the Arab Association of Human Rights entitled “Silencing Dissent,” over the past three years, eight of nine of these Arab Knesset members have been beaten by Israeli forces during demonstrations.[114] Most recently according to the report, legislation has been passed, including three election laws [e.g., banning political parties], and two Knesset related laws aimed to “significantly curb the minority [Arab population] right to choose a public representative and for those representatives to develop independent political platforms and carry out their duties”[ ]”

    And not to be confused with anyone in the Occupied Territories.

  75. Jon, it must be this cheap cabernet veneto. It would not go well with your good quality blue cheese. And as my dad used to say, God bless him, I’ll be glad when I’ve had enough.

  76. Indeed they would. It’s all about pointscoring at PMQs. DM presents better, and the Beeb know fine well how important that is.

  77. @John Goss – the elite also have created a bind for themselves here. Whilst you and I are largely coming from the same political position, we are also probably agreed that nuclear non-proliferation is a good thing, and that we’d rather that Iran did not acquire the bomb (if indeed it is trying to do so). Given that Western establishments have lied through the teeth on this issue before, if it transpires that Iran really are trying to acquire nuclear weapons, the left (and centrist/apolitical electorates generally) will not believe them.
    I sense that “Blair lied” over Iraq is now common currency in Britain, even amongst the bulk who don’t vote or who wouldn’t dream of attending a demo. That highly cynical demographic is the target of militarist propaganda (on Libya, Iran, whatever) and the elite really has its work cut out. I mean, even some hardline Tory voters won’t believe the establishment is sincere about “humanitarian intervention”.

  78. @Ken – just spotted a duplicate post from you, deleted the second. Apologies that the anti-spam thing is a bit sensitive – it doesn’t generally like more than one link!

  79. @Jon. Cheers.


    Seems that Israel has dropped down down from 86 in the reporters without borders press freedom index and are now number 93.,154.html

    So much for your claims of freedom of the press. Some interesting stuff in the link about prosecuting journalists,holding them without trial,shooting them etc etc.

  80. Julian, do tell us about the housing policies that guide Arab Israeli citizens and why you are at it, what is going on in the occupied East jerusalem, if its not stealing of land property by other means and more goading?

    Educate us about Israel’s excellent past relationship with its neighbours and what has come of it. Israel has only been successfull in undermining and dividing those who have aright to live in Palestine, they have infiltrated, invaded bombed and murdered thousands, it has undermined the foreing policy decision makers in the US and UK, a non NATO/EU rogue state with the sole intention to usurp the power structure that exist, backed up by a secret nuclear thread iit clandestinly developed for the sole intention of doing to others what was once done to themselves.

    You have been brainwashed Julian.

    I take my hate off from the young jewish generation that opposes the indoctrination and brainwashing from young age on, those who sing out their opposition, who had enough of being hated for their murderous leadership. I find no sympathy with those hotheads who keep lobbing indiscriminate missiles into Israel just as I do not like those who pretend their hard bombing wo0men and children with illegal weapons in amassive overkill.

    Controlling a large concentration camp is one thing, shooting at everything that moves behind the fence, people who can’t get away from it, is beastiality, obscene and perverse, that much you must understand, unless you deny Palestinians their human rights.

    fact is Julian, Dove Weinglass got it right when he said that netanyahu and Barak have failed miserably, for seven years, to negotiate with the most eligible Palestinian Government ever. Bibi is mental, his high IQ puts him over the edge, would not be surprised if he smokes big cigars and talks like Churchill in his free time, ‘We will fight them in the Sinai, we will fight them in Iran and we will never surrender’.

    His obsessions have taken over, he lives in WW2 and some seem to realise it, although the plotters, his men who met with Werrity Gould and Fox, they are acting outside jurisdiction, they are harming Israels future.
    Attacking people here, when you have very little to say on the facts of this story, is quaint.

    Why don’t you tell us who these highranking Israeli’s are then, do you know them? If not, why are you not allowed to know them? Just a little cog in the big blame game aren’t you?

  81. Sorry posted this on the previous blog, by mistake.
    Jon, it’s a problem. I have written to the Iranian embassy in the past, on matters like the hanging of members of the Bahai faith for practising their religion, and the stoning of women for adultery (it’s like taking a step back to Old Testament times). Please understand I have no love for the Iranian regime. However, as Komodo and others have pointed out, the rights of Palestinians and other Arabs, appear to be virtually non-existent in some Israeli camps. Other Israelis are very much like me and you. I would dearly love to see Arabs and Israelis living side by side in perfect harmony in the Middle East. And yes, the proliferation of nuclear weapons is anathema to me. Except, as I mentioned yesterday somewhere, if the USSR had not developed nuclear weapons I think the US would have continued to use such weapons after Hiroshima and Nagasaki, to achieve its ends. Israel, while denying it had a nuclear programme was developing nuclear weapons. Mossad captured and imprisoned for 18 years a journalist who told the truth about this. I find it difficult to support either Iran or Israel when their actions contravene human rights. But to my mind it is quite clear that Zionist/Neocon aims seek some kind of world domination, New World Order, or whatever you want to call it. And that, to my mind, is something we should all try to prevent. Iran does not have the influence on world affairs that Israel has. We have moved from Henry Kissinger’s triangular diplomacy, where country A was played against country B and country B played against country A and country C played against the other two. Today we have a multi-angular, multi-faceted diplomacy where countries throughout the Middle East and Africa are being destabilised by our countries, countries which are supposed to set an example.
    This wine is not the best, but if Julian were here I would offer him a glass. In fact he could have the bottle! Nearly finished now. Waste not, want not.

  82. Makes me sick the apartheid segregationist ziofuckwits suffering from masada complex whining on about dangers from the world over. Whilst busy arresting Palestinian activists who boarded Israeli settler buses Tuesday in an action inspired by the American civil rights movement
    This is the stuff of comedy in a sane world.
    Does anybody know about the general strike in the land of Settlers, occupation and oppression?

  83. I have sent links to Rory Stewart
    Total spook. Crafty, but fully ‘on message’…

  84. Daisy, thsnkd for the attention, but I can’t follow your reasoning. Are you saying that the deaths in Libya satisfy a primitive blood lust in me, and that I’m sad but actually evil? Is that it
    She was trying to say that you are a trolling know-nothing weapons grade tosser, but was too polite to say so.

  85. Guava Anxiety Mist

    16 Nov, 2011 - 3:06 am

    and the stoning of women for adultery (it’s like taking a step back to Old Testament times)
    At least they don’t imprison women who suffer miscarriages, like the USA. The absolute height of barbarity. I doubt even the Taliban would have thought of such a monstrous form of oppression.

  86. Did the meeting between Fox, Gould and Werritty while Fox was Shadow Defence Secretary follow official rules concerning briefing of opposition front bench spokesmen by officials?

    Presumably at the time he was PPS to the Foreign Sec. In what capacity was he meeting Foxity? Had he already been lined up for Tel Aviv, or was the meeting to discuss whether that would be the way to go, if the Conservatives came to power? (presumably the government has some say in ambassadorial appointments? Or would he already have been lined up for the job before May?)

  87. Hello, Julian. Thank you for responding.
    The debate is much appreciated. Are you in a position to venture to answer Craig’s questions? If not, then, instead of attempting to character-assassinate Craig Murray, I suggest that you also may wish to withhold judgement until you have heard the answers – if indeed, any answers are forthcoming, which at present they do not seem to be.
    Incidentally, Stephen, while your typically measured and rational response to Julian was much-welcomed, your characterisation of the many people who comment here as ‘Craig Murray’s fan-club’ minimises the importance of Craig Murray as a key, comprehensive and active whistleblower from within the British establishment. One suspects, from the information he posted on the previous thread, that he gives the hard state considerable cause for concern as a potential, or actual, conduit for other whistleblowers.

  88. Manipulation by Google.
    Google search for ‘matthew gould’ just now 8.30 am produced the following which is unbelievable.

    Matthew Gould | The Jewish Chronicle
    Matthew Gould cautioned that such an image was false and emphasised the importance of not overstating the problem and putting off Israeli students from …
    Matthew Gould cautions on UK campus extremism image | The …
    2 Aug 2011 – The British Ambassador to Israel has questioned the image of …
    Interview: Matthew Gould | The Jewish Chronicle
    2 Jun 2011 – Britain’s ambassador to Israel strolls, unnoticed and …
    Show more results from
    News for matthew gould

    The Anglo-Israeli Plot to Attack Iran
    Center for Research on Globalization – 1 day ago
    by Craig Murray This is Matthew Gould, second from right, British Ambassador to Israel, who was pictured speaking at a meeting of the Leeds Zionist …
    4 related articles
    Change of Her Majesty’s Ambassador to Israel
    8 Dec 2009 – Mr Matthew Gould MBE has been appointed Her Majesty’s Ambassador to the State of Israel in succession to Mr Tom Phillips CMG.


  89. I think you chaps are wasting your time with Julian. He is not about to admit that there is anything wrong with Israel’s programme of land theft and reprisals against civilian populations supposedly under its protection. While the rest of us recognise that it is probably not a good idea for Iran to have nukes, and that despite its protestations, it probably has it in mind to develop them, the idea that unaccountable Israel should have fully-functioning nuclear weapons and the means to deliver them to Tokyo, is, for Julian, a given. Julian has not yet noticed that whenever Israel feels itself threatened, it responds according to Dayan’s “mad dog” dictum. Yet, Julian is incapable of applying the same concept of righteous violence to someone who dares fire a rocket (usually without effect) into Israel from the ghetto-state of Gaza. Which still urgently needs medical supplies and construction materials, and which is not allowed to develop its own economy. By Israel.
    Conclusion: Julian is a hasbara troll. Safely ignore.

  90. I have just looked at one of those links to Gould. Is the cost of this large scale entertaining coming out of our pockets? From the puff piece in the JC.
    ‘At Purim, the Goulds hosted a huge fancy-dress party in their Ramat Gan home, attended by members of Israel’s glitterati. For the Royal Wedding there was an equally ambitious bash which attracted 1,000 guests, from politicians to actors to footballers. Clearly the British ambassador is the diplomat du jour in Israel.
    (The Goulds with Gilad Shalit’s parents, Noam and Aviva) photo
    Yet behind all the glitz there is serious intent. Gould’s latest project, supported by the outgoing Israeli ambassador to the UK, Ron Prosor, has been to raise funds to help poverty-stricken Holocaust survivors in Israel. When we meet, Gould has just got news of the latest donation to add to the £1 million already collected. “It’s the donation I’m happiest with. We’ve just been given £25,000 from the 45 Aid Group, so that’s Holocaust survivors helping Holocaust survivors. It lends the project moral authority as well as money, which is really nice.”‘

  91. There is always hope.

    Something to cheer you all along.
    The funniest piece of political fun you will have watched for a while or two.

    Obi Ron Kenobi.

    Sometimes the good guys do win.

  92. Nobody is safe from Israel’s military assaults.
    AP Video: Aftermath of Gaza air strike

    French Consul and family wounded in Israeli attack on Gaza. IMEMC 14 November / The French Consul in the Gaza Strip, Majdi Jameel Yaseen Shaqqoura, 44, his wife and his two children were wounded in an Israeli attack in Beit Lahia. They were in their home when they were injured by shrapnel. Additionally, as a result of the attack, the Consul’s wife suffered a miscarriage. At approximately 01:55 Israeli war-planes launched four missiles at the beach in front of the al-Nawras Resort, in the Al-Sudaniya area, killing Mohammed Zaher Zaki al-Kilani (22), whose body was torn to pieces. {}

    These were large bombs

  93. Good catch, Mary. It is sometimes difficult to remember that the State religion of the UK is Christianity, and that Purim is not one of the C of E’s feasts. And while I am sure holocaust survivors in Israel need all the help they can get, that is probably someone else’s responsibility, not ours. No doubt some of them live in illegal settlements…still, that’s what ambassadors are for. Isn’t it? Craig? Expert witness needed here.
    Can anyone find details of this year’s Armistice Day ceremony in Israel? Where those who helped end the holocaust as well as those killed by Irgun were remembered? Clue: Don’t google “Remembrance Day”, as, in Israel, that will lead you to the holocaust remembrance again.

  94. Interesting to see “launched at the beach…” from the WaPo. Less partisan sources reported at the time that the attack had been on a Palestinian naval or police building. Had the consul not been involved, it would have passed unnoticed by the MSM…

  95. More attacks on Gaza at dawn this morning.
    Two Injured In Israeli Airstrikes Targeting Gaza
    Wednesday November 16, 2011 11:09 by Saed Bannoura – IMEMC & Agencies
    Palestinian medical sources in the Gaza Strip reported that three Palestinians were injured, on Wednesday at dawn, after the Israeli Air Force carried out a number of airstrikes targeting different areas in the coastal region.


    A woman was wounded when the Israeli air-force fired a missile into an agricultural land in Al Sourani Mountain, in Gaza’s At-Tuffah neighborhood; damage to a number of homes in the area was reported.
    Also, an Israeli war-jet fired a missile at a group of resistance fighters in At-Tuwam area northwest of Gaza Strip; one fighter was mildly wounded while the rest managed to escape the attack unharmed.
    Later on, the army fired a missile into an open area west of Jabalia town, in the northern part of the Gaza Strip but the missile impacted the ground without exploding.
    Eyewitnesses reported that Israeli choppers fired flares over several areas in the coastal region, an issue that caused panic among the civilians who fear further attacks.

  96. You are so right Komodo. And you get electronic musak on this too.

    The other links were to the Holocaust Remembrance Day which is called YomHaShoah but I couldn’t work out the actual date from the Wikipedia page {}
    Yom HaShoah was inaugurated in 1953, anchored in a law signed by the Prime Minister of Israel David Ben-Gurion and the President of Israel Yitzhak Ben-Zvi.

    ‘The original proposal was to hold Yom HaShoah on the 14th of Nisan, the anniversary of the Warsaw ghetto uprising (April 19, 1943), but this was problematic because the 14th of Nisan is the day immediately before Pesach (Passover). The date was moved to the 27th of Nisan, which is eight days before Yom Ha’atzma’ut, or Israeli Independence Day.
    While there are Orthodox Jews who commemorate the Holocaust on Yom HaShoah, others in the Orthodox community—especially Haredim, including Hasidim—remember the victims of the Holocaust on days of mourning declared by the rabbis before the Holocaust, such as Tisha b’Av in the summer.[2] , and the Tenth of Tevet, in the winter, because in the Jewish tradition the month of Nisan is considered a joyous month associated with Passover and messianic redemption. Ismar Schorsch, former Chancellor of Conservative Judaism’s Jewish Theological Seminary of America held that Holocaust commemoration should take place on Tisha b’Av.[3]’
    So many days! So little time to carry out the attacks on Gaza.


  97. Mary: It’s called “schmalz”…

  98. Mary, Komodo,

    There is no doubt that Gould’s aggressive promotion of Zionism and Israeli interests is wrong in a diplomat. But there is nothing especially wrong in the specific activities you pinpoint most recently. Diplomatic enetertaining is an important tool of the job – a bit strange to hold it on a Jewish festival, I think the key question is whether he invited arab and other non-Jewish Israelis. But nothing wrong in itself.

    I see nothing wrong at all with his charity work for Holocaust survivors.

  99. Thanks, Craig. My ignorance of the limits of diplomatic activities is pretty well complete, thank you for your input.

  100. ….but I still think the boundah’s gorn native….

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