The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
Philippe Desmazes on 5th Sept was here looking at a factory making a hybrid utility vehicle…..
http://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/news-photo/employees-check-the-assembling-of-a-citelec-electric-or-news-photo/151274057
98 miles and 1 hour 48 mins off peak travelling time from factory to the road block
http://www.fagorbrandt.com/
Also on 5th September in Eastern France albeit 150 miles to the North at Fessenheim Nuclear power station there was a chemical leak:-
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2198798/Chemical-accident-French-EDF-nuclear-power-plant-leaves-workers-hurt.html
Have just scanned back up and see my “007 Watch” has caused great consternation. Sorry if I allowed a little bit of my “cruel Cockney humour” to creep in there. Katie suggested the satellite watch I believe. I merely atributed “007” to it as I felt she/we were in very speculative and unsupported areas more akin to Ian Fleming. I am not saying it’s totally impossible, just unsupported by what we KNOW. It’s back to the “known knowns”, the “knowns unknowns” and the “unknown unknowns”. Similarly there are dead certainties, likelihoods, unlikelihoods and impossibilities. Dead people can’t make emergency calls by ANY means. That’s both a certainty and an impossibility!
Although there does not seem to be much interest into the Mcafee case, i dont see the timeline as a coincidence. Belize (formerly British Honduras) still has more or less British controlled administration, although they are independent officially.
I checked a little bit Mcafee’s past. We do only know his antivirus software, but there was a much more interesting company he founded in 2000.
Mcafee is born into a Jewish family. He did invest into his new company Zone Labs in 2000. He created the prominent firewall “zone alarm” with that company in Israel. In 2004 zone labs was officially sold to an Israeli company, although the software programming was already done with Mcafee in Israel in 2000.
There are claims on the web that zone alarm is a mossad software as well as VPN-1.
Links below:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZoneAlarm
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Check_Point
http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message236054/pg1
Now mcafee is said having killed another american in belize. He was his neighbour.
I checked that guy. He is a bar owner at the Orlando university campus in Florida and he is trading with security doors. He has got dozens of mugshots with Florida police. He is not the businessman the media want us to believe that he is.
http://mugshots.com/US-Counties/Florida/Seminole-County-FL/Gregory-Faull.2832231/details/
http://fandaily.info/news/antivirus-john-mcafee-wanted-for-the-murder-of-gregory-faull-survived-by-wife-vicky-faull/
Mcafee knows something what he should not know. Longworth knew something what he should not have known and so did Prieto. Plus SAH knew something what he better should not have known.
OK a simple question…..
Who found the 3 dead bodies? Well in daylight on 5th Sept Jean-Pierre Clatot states in connection to his photos:-
Fireman were first to arrive on the scene and found three bodies in the car. The 4th victim, a cyclist was found nearby along with a seriously wounded young girl.
http://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/news-photo/annecy-prosecutor-eric-maillaud-answers-to-journalists-on-news-photo/151278560
He doesnt make it sound as though they were protecting any crime scene.
Nearby doesnt sound as though SMs body was next to the car either.
On the day of the murders Getty Image 151278363
http://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/news-photo/french-gendarme-gives-a-phone-call-while-blocking-the-road-news-photo/151278363
I dont believe that Mr Clatot would have said that if the Gendarme spent time failing to make a call.
Fireman leaving the scene on 5th Sept presumably after a Forensic team had taken over:-
http://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/news-photo/firemen-an-rescue-vehicule-is-driven-on-the-road-leading-to-news-photo/151278106
And that’s me done for the night, I’m knackered!
good one Tim V
2 Dec, 2012 – 11:08 pm. you are all so much better at finding things than me. This is not nec. a problem because the first Demazes photos I can find are the next day (6th) when the bodies are being removed. He’s also in the layby on the 7th. The 5th night time photos are attributed to a different AFP/Getty photographer.
@ James 2 Dec, 2012 – 10:53 pm
“NR. Yep. Totally correct.
Why let “copyright” get in the way of a good picture !
( http://www.techdirt.com/blog/%E2%80%9Dhttp:/?tag=philippe+desmazes ) The link goes in to “the photo grab”.
Great story. I’m sure this goes on more often than we suspect. Noticed that in the recent Times story they got in a dig at the DM for using pic of wrong SM – SM the hunter. That was our fault in these groups for misidentifying him.
The other big mistake we made was jumping on the cropped pic of the Corsican murders and identifying the dead body as SM. Poor SM, in death he’s misidentified. The MSM did not get caught on that one, though the DM incorrectly used one of the Corsican pics – persons in bunny suits, waiting at roadside – as Chevaline. Innocent mistake likely.
Something else in Times story. The friend or family member who was tracking SAH, said after a time – 3 hours? – they were so worried they drove over to Claygate, and arrived only a few minutes before police, who presumably were there to notify next-of-kin.
sorry Straw44berry
2 Dec, 2012 – 11:18 pm my computer seems to be playing up. this was meant for you – you are all so much better at finding things than me. This is not nec. a problem because the first Demazes photos I can find are the next day (6th) when the bodies are being removed. He’s also in the layby on the 7th. The 5th night time photos are attributed to a different AFP/Getty photographer.
time i gave up i think nite all
@ Bluebird
“The judge also mentioned Assange’s tough childhood, one in which he was raised in a religious cult, the Santiniketan Park Association, also known as “The Family” and “The Great White Brotherhood” and led by yoga guru Anne-Hamilton Byrne.”
“WMR has learned that the cult had links to mind control operations run jointly by the CIA and its partner, the Australian Security Intelligence Organization (ASIO).”
A new cult! One I’ve never heard of. Wonder what their weird sex practices are? They are sure to have some. Shopping out kiddies to the elites? Making vids for blackmail?
Never heard Assange was originally a hacker. More of the software, video gaming, espionage bunch. Gareth Williams and the dead dude in Montreal were both involved in video gaming software code. And McConnell Field claimed the Montreal one was working on special software at Concordia to encode kiddy porn and then track back persons who used it, and blackmail them.
Concordia also had good software in 2011 to identify persons on the Internet by forensic linguistics, instead of bothering with ISP and MAC numbers and proc serial numbers and how a particular machine and op system returns packets and so on.
It’s trivial to do, if a writer uses some words repeatedly or misspells. Every writer has a certain style, even punctuation, but Concordia pushed it further to where they hoped it would be accepted in court as evidence.
Belize is a pretty interesting country.
Former prime minister Said Musa is a Palestinian who studied law in the UK.
Current prime minister Dean Barrow is also of Arab descent.
You wouldnt expect that to happen in a Middle American country specialised in bananas, forests and wood production … and drug smuggling. I would not have expected to see two prime ministers of Middle Eastern descent there.
Also interesting to see that both the UK and the USA train special forces (military and intelligence) in Belize.
And then we are having Mcafee in the middle of this country.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Said_Musa
There we are again with deep links to Israel and Palestine in Middle American politics in previous British Honduras. The Queen of Great Britain is the queen of Belize, too.
Dean Barrow, prime minister of Belize is Mizrahi Jew. He is married with an Ethiopean woman who is Jewish Mizrahi. Good to have a son who is an artist (Jamal Barrow) and whose artist name is Levi.
And then we have the other party leader who is of Palestinian descent and whose name MUSA leads into the middle of Iraq and Hilla. Musa was a teacher of Imam al Hili who promised the al Hillis of becoming the MAHDI once upon a time.
Musa was a compagnion of Prophet Muhammed and supporter of Shia prophet Ali.
And now a Musa is the former prime minister of Belize and the counterpart of Barrow.
http://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/news-photo/hearse-drives-past-french-gendarmes-standing-guard-on-the-news-photo/151323917
Look at the number on the hearse.
Peter over at MZT has put up excerpts of Times article. The free link no longer works.
Go to MZT and look for “Peter 12-2-2012 at 17:36:45”
I made a mistake when I said SAH’s concerned friend drove to Claygate and arrived just before police. It was just before SkyTV.
Also, the Times did mention that French police were dubious re BM’s account. Had him back to Martinet twice to re-enact.
There’s more in the excerpts about a very serious Family Feud between Saad & Zaid. Not a minor thing at all.
A quote I found in one of the links someone put here, Bluebird I think.
“GERALD BURKE: Some of the great achievements in modern espionage that resulted from the collation of seemingly innocuous, unclassified data.”
@NR
2 Dec, 2012 – 4:41 pm & Others
Now that’s VERY interesting.
If that’s true, it points to the ‘incident’, (I don’t think I’m prepared to call it a ‘tuerie’ any more) having taken place some while previous to the timeline of the official narrative, which just doesn’t make any sense anyway.
The official narrative has an impossibly tight window, but within minutes, if BM is to believed he came upon a scene of intense horror, with the victims, apart from Zeinab, all very dead.
I asked the question on here before about how long the victims of a shooting could survive, and it seems the answer is it could be for sometime before all vital signs are extinguished. Any forensic scientists out there who can answer this one?
If they were all stone cold dead, the shooting could then have taken place some hours previously.
Where would that scenario take us?
From the Times, article so according to this BM was never overtaken by SM so he may have been following him.
“(William Brett ) Martin thinks the climb from Chevaline had taken about half an hour. It has been reported that he was overtaken by Mollier on the way, but what Martin says is that he saw Mollier ahead of him. Martin was on a mountain bike and Mollier was on an expensive racing model, so his climb would have been much, much quicker, maybe half the time of Martin’s.”
From Times article I wonder if this is hint to keep looking .
“Saad’s brother is a quiet accountant, and not one of Saad’s friends I spoke to thought him capable of anything like this. They must be right — the alternative is unbelievable. Yet I do not accept it was the random act of a madman. It is far more likely that there is a secret somewhere waiting to be found. A clue that will unlock the French cyclist or the Surrey family as the targets.”
These two points are interesting remember when some of the reports alluded to SM’s double life ,it has been mentioned he had several affairs in the past I wonder if that’s what they want them to be discrete about or something else?
Times:
“Certainly, the French cyclist is a no-go area to the media. His family will not speak, nor will they release a photograph of him.”
and
“The family had placed a notice in the local paper, thanking the community for its support and “discretion”. Do they have something to hide, or are they, quite reasonably, asking for privacy in their grief?”
@Mochyn
How could the murders have taken place hours earlier if the builders saw the car go past with the family in are you saying that’s a lie ?
NR (12.00 am)
When the hunter SM was posted on here I said maybe this is him. Mochyn (not sure may have been someone else sorry if I am mistaken) then said maybe not because of the distance to the north.
We had doubts from the start. Peter later on said it definitely isnt him, I said to him how do you know have you phoned him. I think he may well have done. Someone said(maybe not even on Craig) that the ‘wrong’ family were getting annoyed with all these phonecalls from the press.
Sometimes we have to try to get a reaction and more information to help, we can always be ignored but I think we still have a lot of readers here even if the contributor numbers are dwindling. Jennywren was an example of someone reading along from the start, and many others have started contributing that way. Please join us and tell us when we are wrong, a fresh voice and thoughts can often help solve a problem or remember some detail we have forgotten.
Looking thru the whole of Craig’s ‘thread 2 – The Al-Hilli conundrum’ yesterday to try and find Philippe Desmazes earliest photo on 5th September which I am sure I looked at thoroughly when Philippe D (later Didierjean) was created and I suggested they were talking about the photographer. I was surprised how many posters there were in late September whose names I didnt recognize often who I had had conversations with about different aspects.
The lack of photos for almost everyone involved on Day 1 still suggests to me extraction and early on when we said even for SAH there was only 1 decent quality photo + the poor quality ‘tiffany style lamp’ photo. Then Hey Presto the Gary Aked story in the Mirror and the removal van photo. Ye ask and ye shall receive. No later photos for anyone else were released or could be discovered just like they were ‘ghosts’. This does suggest that Philippe D (later Didierjean) was indeed created and that the family will be reunited once again via extraction. (Katie, I know you hate that idea but I would prefer them to be alive than dead on 5th September).
If Zeena and Zainab are now orphans then it is criminal what Social Services are doing to their family, if it is still believed they are in danger then that will never change and on that fateful day they last far more than just their parents, they lost their whole family.
Hopefully they were extracted and soon they will be reunited with their parents and that is the reason they are not with their family right now.
Pink (6.07 am)
The family choosing not to release a photo of SM is their choice. The fact we are also unable to find a photo of SMs late father a prominent person in a rugby club is far more than being discrete -it suggests the cleaners have been at work. This tells us that he was not therefore killed as a case of ‘just passing at the wrong time/wrong place’
I have doubted the builders story from the off – it’s just too cute about them being worried thay have been caught slacking by British owners who also own a maroon BMW. Unless they were watching as they would when standing at a bus stop the owners would just pull up. A poor idea for the ‘fairytale’ and so the early arrival of the Al-Hillis is very possible. The created scene could indeed be far removed from the truth but then why is it such an ambiguous mess? I wish I knew.
I do like Marlin’s early extraction idea -and the possibility of the family leaving campsite 1 and the actors arriving at campsite 2.
Straw
I did post a photo link of mollier’s father about 2 weeks ago.
It was a link from le dauphine. He was honoured together with a Mr.Brun as the last survivors of a special French WW2 army force from Savoie. It looked like a very nationalist ceremony and the photo was taken on a place in Ugine.
It isnt true that there was no photo. He looked as if he were 70 and he looked like the typical defense rugby player. Huge body. His WW2 military buddy Mr. Brun, however, looked like a twig compared to Mr. Mollier.
@Strawberry
If your gut says builders story is dodgy then you may well be right I didn’t really form an opinion about it at the time ,quite a lot was found on the owners of the house they were working on ,it might be worth revisiting that to see how it looks a few months on.
On the disappearing info I think there is still plenty to be found just have to be a bit creative in finding it I am sure you know this anyway .
I am working now so no time until later to play catch up.
Thanks BB
I will see if I bookmarked it instead of reading it.
Here’s a video with the builder on and some details on Saads parking habits.
http://www.itv.com/news/update/2012-09-11/french-police-still-gathering-witness-evidence/
So tell me what happened to Mollier, Straw, is he dead or was he extracted too ?
This cannot be right, would he want to leave a new baby & his children ?
I don’t believe the extraction theory because it would be such an elaborate,expensive, nightmare of a plan involving hundreds .
It simply impossible to get so many ‘reliable’ ducks in a row……….and keep them there & all for what ?
Then there’s the willing & calculated cruelty to Zeena & Zainab,if extraction were true when Zainab came out of hospital she would have been spirited away to join the parents & no one would have known,likewise Zeena, instead of flying to the UK she could have joined her parents. Logically that would make sense.
Tim.
For the third time ,it was NOT ME who mentioned a satellite ‘watch’, do try to be more accurate when quoting people.
Straw
My download of the roger mollier picture is from nov 21st. Therefore my post with the photo of ledauphine roger mollier with his military buddy mr. Brun cannot be posted earlier. Should be from nov 21st or 22nd. on that blog.
Excellent link Pink, one of the best with lots of info.
Most of course we knew but, this parking in different places is new to me.
Was he afraid to have a regular place making it harder for someone to find it ?
It shows a restless nervous man…. the 4/5 trips out everyday, did he do that simply not to have the car static & parked for fear someone was going to tamper with it ?
Did he in fact only play with the tyre to guard the car, making sure no one could plant a device under it ?
Katie
Would you prefer them to be dead or alive?
Perhaps I am more of an optimist than a realist. I am new to this but before the Al-Hillis and Jimmy Saville if BBC reported it I saw no reason not to believe it.
The house has come crumbling down and never again will I be able to take news items as they are fed to us. My innocence has gone and I now think that anyone that believes all of the news is a fool.
Posted by Yass on Icke:-
OMG the State has stolen the Al-Hilli children! It is truly an evil day when the parents and grandmother of two little girls are murdered and they cannot live with their own kin folk! Family!
————–
They arent suffering now?
Maybe there was no extraction but that just means that 2 governments are complicit in the murders and subsequent cover-up and now the mistreatment of 2 young children.