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3,629 thoughts on “Amnesty International Conference on Torture

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  • Mike

    Are there Russians close to the border with Ukraine who cross the border to help their fellow ethnic Russians? Of course. Will there be weapons taken into Eastern Ukraine from Russia by these volunteers? Quite possibly. Are there anti-fascists in Eastern Ukraine who may or may not be ethnic Russians and who do not like the fact that atrocities are being carried out by actual Nazis who also have people in positions of power in Kiev? Of course.

    When a Government starts arresting journalists and threatening them with decades in prison because they say they are sick of pointless war, you know it’s a lost cause. I’m sure the ordinary Ukrainian trenchermen want to go home. Will the Nazi elements let them?

  • lysias

    I assume a lot of the reason for the very poor performance of the Kiev government troops was low morale.

  • Peacewisher

    Lysias: Morale will be even lower now. One brigade wanted to surrender and drive back without their armour. According to twitter they got an order to take their armour with them… and they got destroyed. I do accept that this could be separatist propaganda.

  • Peacewisher

    ITV news showing it as it is. Ukrainian soldiers interviewed in Artemivsk openly critical of their government for “hanging them out to dry”

  • John Goss

    Yes, Peacewisher, I saw that on the 7 o’clock news and thought good for them for speaking the truth. They had been above a week in the cauldren being daily bombed, almost out of food and weapons. Poroshenko told them to stay there and fight.

    Also the US has changed tack and is now trying to cause WW3 through the Baltic states which also have Russian speakers. If I was a resident of Estonia, Latvia or Lithuania I would take one look at what has happened in Ukraine and encourage everybody to vote for the anti-austerity party before they end upliving in a failed state.

  • lysias

    Hitler insisted his Sixth Army trapped in Stalingrad should fight to the last man, and not surrender. He promoted General Paulus to Field Marshall, because, up to that time, no Prussian Field Marshall had surrendered.

    And the German radio told the German people that Hitler’s wishes had been carried out:

    Der Kampf um Stalingrad ist zu Ende. Ihrem Fahneneid bis zum letzten Atemzuge treu, ist die 6. Armee unter der vorbildlichen Fuehrung des Generalfeldmarschalls Paulus der Uebermacht des Feindes and der Ungunst der Verhaeltnisse erlegen. Ihr Schicksal ist von einer Flak-Division der Luftwaffe, zwei rumaenischen Divisionen und einem kroatischen Regiment geteilt, die in treuer Waffenbruederschaft mit den Kameraden des deutschen Heeres ihre Pflicht bis zum Aeussersten getan haben. . .

    Die zweimal vom Gegner verlangte Uebergabe fand stolze Ablehnung. Unter der Hakenkreuzfahne, die auf der hoechsten Ruine von Stalingrad weithin sichtbar gehisst wurder, vollzog sich der letzte Kampf. Generale, Offiziere, Unteroffiziere und Mannschaften fochten Schulter an Schulter bis zur letzten Patrone. Sie starben, damit Deutschland lebe. Ihr Vorbild wird sich auswirken bis in die fernsten Zeiten, aller unwahren bolschewistischen Propaganda zum Trotz. Die Divisionen der 6. Armee aber sind bereits im neuen Entstehen begriffen.

  • Peacewisher

    @Mark: LOL, so much petty chatter! Does no-one think it was taken over remotely by UFO and flown to a Nazi base in Antarctica?

  • Peacewisher

    @John: There is a dreadful anti-Russian sentiment around this country, that was clearly evident in the QT audience. What has Russia ever done to us? BBC/Tory/Labour/Liberal propaganda of course, and, ironically, the only hope for restoring a semblance of democracy is SNP. I just hope they get enough seats and Murphy doesn’t scare the Scots into voting labour to stop the Tories.

  • Peacewisher

    Well, John. We posted more or less the same thing at the same time. Forget xenophobia, or even Islamophobia, it’s Russiophobia we should be concerned about.

  • Mary

    Peacewisher Wasn’t QT tonight dire. Dimblebore and the programme have had it. The pocket pols lack credibility. And some of the females in the audience were supporting nuclear weapons and Trident! Well! The demonization of Putin and Russia was the running theme.

  • John Goss

    It is not just Russophobia but the states from which it is coming that is the problem. Russia and China and the BRICS countries are almost ready to introduce their version of the World Bank. If you were a small country which had been perpetually bombarded or had had sanctions imposed where would you look for money. Would it be money with ties from the IMF (paid in and back in dollars backed by oil) or would it be from a bank that wanted to genuinely invest in your developing country. So Europe has a problem with Greece. The present government did not run up the debt. It was the bankers. Greece will go to Russia or China if Europe does not cough up, thus paving the way for other oppressed countries. This monetarism has gone on too long. Let the bankers pay the debts they ran up out of their bonuses. But you can’t catch the bankers and oligarchs. They do an Ahmed Chalibi on you.

  • Peacewisher

    Of course the real reason for Russiophobia is…

    to make a World Cup in Russia in 2018 untenable

    As Bill Shankly said, “Football isn’t a matter or life and death… its much more important than that.”

  • Peacewisher

    @Mary: my views were best represented by Michael Heseltine… never thought I’d ever say that!

  • Dreoilin

    Israeli foreign minister on Facebook: Palestinian prisoners should be executed

    http://electronicintifada.net/blogs/patrick-strickland/israeli-foreign-minister-facebook-palestinian-prisoners-should-be-executed

    “’The first law that Yisrael Beitenu will propose is a death penalty for terrorists, because otherwise we’re ordering up more terror and yet more terror,” Lieberman continued. At the time of writing, Lieberman’s post had already received more than 1,400 “likes” and had been shared 185 times.”

  • Dreoilin

    “Yes, Dreolin, but there’s still a lot of “coup denial” about.”

    Yes, Peacewisher. I wonder how many Americans for example (or even Brits) have heard the word “coup” in relation to the whole mess. All they’re hearing is Putin-bashing.

  • Habbabkuk (la vita è bella)

    Mr Goss

    “So Europe has a problem with Greece. The present government did not run up the debt. It was the bankers.”
    _______________

    The big self-serving lie is repeated yet again by Big Liar. The above assertion is nonsense: Greek debt was ramped up by the Pasok govt starting 1981 and by subsequent govts of both political colours. They simply spent more money than was coming in and made up the difference by borrowing. So it was only the bankers’ fault in the sense that they should not have lent Greece money. In which case Greece would just have had its financing crisis 15-20 years earlier.

    Main reasons for too little coming in : widespread tax evasion and no serious effort by govts to combat it due to both administrative inefficiency and lack of political will; a plethora of ad-hoc tax laws aimed at giving favorable tax treatment to various categories of tax-payers; corruption (including of tax-inspectors)and the siphoning-off of huge chunks of EU regional aid into a multiplicity of pockets

    Main reasons for over-spending : various govt programmes not viable financially in the long-term (eg, the construction of “medical centres” all over the place) for political reasons: massive over-hiring of state employees both for political reasons and on the “koumbaros” principle – the “koumbaros” being the local politicians*; inflated salaries, pensions and perks for said state employees

    Background to all of the above : a feeble economic basis (this has always been the Greek vase)dependent on shipping, agriculture, tourism and the state sector (both civil service and state-owned companies like Public Power – DEH), the first three being prone to extreme fluctuations); the absence of what one might call “mutual confidence between the state (as such and as represented by the politicians) and the people; the political immaturity of politicians and electors.
    ___________

    * the “koumbaros” (or “godfather”) system is well exemplified by the size of the Greek parliament when set against the size of the population : 300 MPs for a population of 10 million and the resistance against all attempts to reduce the number of MPs. Why? Because voters vote for politicians in return for personal favours – your local MP will fix your child up with a job in the civil service, in return for which he obtains the life-long loyalty of “his” voters…and so on…

    The above are some of the reasons why the country is in the mess it’s in; the “bankers” are only part of the problem and by no means the largest.

  • pie

    Habbakuk, what a lying shmuk. He hopes you forgot that Goldman Sachs concealed Greece’s financial position with swaps based on fabricated exchange rates,creating impossible conditions for EU accession. Absent that, Greek ya-yas would not be eating out of garbage cans or jumping off of roofs.

    Or maybe she doesn’t even know that. She also tells you he’s financially independent, by way of explaining why he seems so emotionally needy. If she’s actually ignorant about the proximate cause of Greek default, her delusion of financial independence is going to go poof pretty quickly.

  • Resident evil

    Thanks to CM we can have an free insight here at this blog into how the devils are thinking, although lately habba is a bit reticent. Its easy to see through them now, Anon needs to take him along for the dershowitzery 101 refresher course at HLS. The way the fallons are after Putin, he must be another Christ but lately the canaries here are not displaying their intentions openly, stern of BBC is very guarded !! But it appears they will get the Romans to kill him too.

  • Resident Dissident

    “Thanks to CM we can have an free insight here at this blog into how the devils are thinking”

    Well at least that part is true – but thinking might be stretching it, more like watching reflex reactions. Maskovska is a well known Russian artform.

  • Resident Dissident

    Come on Vlad how much does a man have to do to get a well deserved subsidised cycling holiday?

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