A Dream of Irony 185

The sectarian nature of the extreme attack by Tory politicians and mainstream media journalists (and it is genuinely difficult to tell which is which) on Jeremy Corbyn over alleged IRA links is extremely troubling. Not one MSM journalist or Tory has even acknowledged the existence of loyalist terrorists or British government atrocities, either by secret agents or in events like Bloody Sunday or the murders of Pat Finucane or Peter McBride. Yes, IRA atrocities were appalling. But they were by no means the only ones, and the Troubles arose from centuries of colonial injustice.

One reason this Tory attack does not have great traction is that everyone under 40 is more likely to have learnt a great deal of truth from the excellent film In the Name of the Father, than to have experienced the violence on both sides. The failure of the media in this election, while constantly raising the Troubles, to mention the Birmingham Six or the Guildford Four – for both of which Corbyn campaigned – does not stop people knowing those terrible abuses of state power happened. I speak as someone whose office windows were shattered by an IRA mortar.

So after all this truly dreadful Tory attempt to slit open old wounds to hold power, would it not be the most delicious irony, in the event of a hung parliament, if Sinn Fein finally took up their Westminster seats, in order to make up the numbers to support Jeremy Corbyn into Number 10?

We could have the most wonderful Labour/Nationalist coalition of the working class and the oppressed peoples of the islands – Labour/SNP/Sinn Fein/Plaid Cymru. And Caroline Lucas.

I do not in the least expect this to happen. But I am rather hopeful this post has severely annoyed some old Tories.

185 thoughts on “A Dream of Irony

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  • nevermind

    Could you exchange Caroline Lucas with the Green party, please, it makes more sense. Its the policies of the Greens, such as the NHS reinstatement bill, that matters, not their personalities, as much as this rocks people’s boat.

    Off to the seaside, its my grandsons birthday…..

  • Ishmael

    Yea, the seemingly perpatual Tory quest to block out history. Book burning next no doubt.

    Makes for good cannon fodder I suppose.

  • Jo

    I’m sure the post will have annoyed a few people in Scotland too Craig. Ruth Davidson will be banking on that as the sectarian card has been prominent here from many in her campaign and in the Council elections. It’s not pretty.

    I doubt Sinn Fein would take their seats now at this late stage.

  • Ba'al Zevul

    Was that the mortar which destroyed No. 10’s roses? About a week before that I’d been talking to an ex-Para friend, and he’s been damning the IRA as amateurs. If they’d any sense, he opined, they’d use mortars…

    Another politician (ramarkably quiet this week) who seems to have escaped criticism for his closeness to the IRA -and Gaddafi, and Assad for that matter – is….well, you know who.

    • Ishmael

      Surly a blessing.

      He’ll be wheeled back in by “leftist” types once it doesn’t disturb the overton …Keyhole …With a key in it.

      Because fact’s are sacred. Don’t ya know.

      • Ba'al Zevul

        To be precise, he’ll be quietish until the election, when he will decide whether his backers have pledged enough cash, and enough Blairites ahve been kicked out, to justify rising like an oil-fired phoenix from the ashes of his integrity, to form a new centre-right party. Or whethe r’tis nobler in the mind to stay in Labour, and stab it in the back, again.

        Whoever does the wheeling (it will be Progress, with the help of Mandelson and possibly Osborne, directed by the man himself, and the man himself’s new institute for making money invisibly. Describing the wheelers as ‘leftists’, even in jest, is laughable. They are selfservatives.

        • Ba'al Zevul

          I’ll try that again. I meant to say-

          Whoever does the wheeling (it will be Progress, with the help of Mandelson and possibly Osborne, directed by the man himself, and the man himself’s new institute for making money invisibly), describing the wheelers as ‘leftists’, even in jest, is laughable. They are selfservatives.

  • Sharp Ears

    She’s frit. Is Ms Rudd the Tory leader in waiting?

    Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn says he will take part in a seven-way BBC general election debate later.
    Lib Dem leader Tim Farron, UKIP’s Paul Nuttall, SNP deputy leader Angus Robertson, Green co-leader Caroline Lucas and Plaid Cymru leader Leanne Wood will participate.

    Theresa May has refused to take part in any debates, so Home Secretary Amber Rudd will be representing the Tories.’

    Top of the BiBiCee website.

    ‘Confirming he would be taking part, Mr Corbyn criticised the Tories for what he called “a stage-managed arms-length campaign”.

    “Refusing to join me in Cambridge tonight would be another sign of Theresa May’s weakness, not strength,” he added.

    Mishal Husain will moderate the debate, which takes place in Cambridge and will be shown on BBC One from 19:30-21:00 BST and livestreamed on Twitter.

    Each panellist will make an opening statement before taking questions from the audience.’

  • reel guid

    An Ipsos Mori poll for STV has the SNP 18% ahead of the Tories and Labour who are both on 25%.

  • Trowbridge H. Ford

    I am really surprised at no mention of governments, particularly Tory ones, killing their own people, starting with the assassination of the 29 soft military and intelligence personnel in the Chinook helicopter crash at the Mull of Kintyre in June 1994 to secure a hardline GFA, and culminating in more recent murders, like the al-Hilli massacre in France and those triggered by killings of GMP Chief Constable Mike Todd, Gareth Williams, Gudrun Loftus and Steve Rawlings, not forgetting what happened to Royal cadet Steve Hillder and weapons expert Dr. David Kelly along the way.

    No wonder others go bananas too, like in London and Manchester just recently.

    Britain is up to its eyeballs in creating terror, and it’s time for a real change

  • Hilary Finch

    Problem is the oath of allegiance to the monarch and her heirs. I wouldn’t take it and I don’t blame Sinn Fein either for that!

  • Anon1

    The polls are manipulated in order to show Labour edging closer and persuade every dithering or complacent Tory voter to get out and vote Tory.

    The reality is a thumping Tory landslide next week.

    • Ba'al Zevul

      The alt-right version of that is ‘The polls are manipulated in order to show Labour edging closer and persuade every demoralised Labour voter that there is indeed hope, to get out this time, and vote Labour.’

      Vote Labour.

    • Trowbridge H. Ford

      Aen’t you being a bit contradictory, Anon 1, saying that both differing and complacent Tories are going to swallow the maniplulated polls, and go to the polls to give them a thumping victory?

      • Shatnersrug

        I don’t get this obsession with the polls in this day and age – you only have to see who commissioned the poll and how the questions are worded and more importantly reworded on the next one to see how the required outcome is reached.

        • Ishmael

          Surely not healthy to focus on, ideally. But also seemingly necessary, tactual etc.

          Im tempted to think same of elections in this day and age. Were they know dam well what large majoraties feel on many issues, nationalisation’s etc.

          • Ishmael

            I guess this is why we can’t have a policy focus, because most people want these policy’s. So it has to be about evil corbyn. . ..Probably the least evil man in England.

            It so bloody low.

    • nevermind

      If you believe that this election is the most important thing and Brexit is the most important issue facing us now, then how can you be sure that Mrs. May will actually turn up to negotiations, after last nights churlish no show
      yesterday was like a much announced love affair and wedding, without the bride turning up.
      Question is what the SNP’s demands, should there be coalition talks between Labour and SNP and maybe the Greens.
      Corbyn will soon realise that he can’t get EEA status without agreeing to free movement of some kind, Norway and Sweden have not managed it, nor will he.
      Given that he will have to accept this, and given that Scotland would have free access to the EU markets, can develop its economy as part of the EU and UK or part of a so called Celtic Alliance, does this not remove half of the arguments for an Indyref 2?
      Moreover in such a case,would voters still support an Independence vote? As part of a coalition, providing they take enough time to go through all portfolios and come to common arrangements and final policies, the SNP would be in a far stronger position than if they set themselves on a trajectory leading away from a coalition, imho. Indyref 2 would not be dead but postponed until further notice.

      I have not read a single poll or red top for years and the advantage of the internet is that people can find more information on the issue at hand, they do not have to read this menu of right wing spats and hacks.
      Complacency is now the greatest threat and going by past experiences, rain alone could sway this election, as sad as that may sound.

  • Michael McNulty

    I used to berate the IRA for what they were doing but as I reached my mid-twenties and became more politically aware I saw them as a resistance movement against British colonialism. I suspect the repeated claims of IRA sympathies against Jeremy Corbyn are largely in hope of turning young voters against him using emotion, especially as many are too young to remember the politics. This too would add to the suspicion over who really did the Manchester bombing. We haven’t had a REAL bombing in this country in years, then we got one, then Jeremy’s a bombers friend? The people running this country are sinister enough to bomb it then link Jeremy to the causes.

    Ireland belongs to the Irish.

    • Shatnersrug

      In 1982 I was trapped in Hyde park after the bombing I was 10 it scared the bejesus out of me.

      In 1991 my uncle – a British Rail worker at Victoria station was injured assisting those that had been caught up in the bombing – he never recovered from the things he saw that day and it probably contributed to his early demise.

      Back then we didn’t even know we were involved in a war let alone the bad guys. The IRA saw themselves as Luke Skywalker we were the evil empire.

      This is the same ignorance I see now regarding Islamic “terrorism” we’re at war – and not some soft war either. We’re all shielded from it until it explodes, then we’re dissed with lies.

      • Trowbridge H. Ford

        Quite right, Shatnersrug.

        The only thing to add is that the 1982 London bombings were triggered by Operation Ranc in Northern Ireland, and they triggered the ‘Shoot to Kill’ campaign in the province, led by Captain Simon Hayward of the 14 Intelligence Company. He apparently got involved in the assignations of SNP leader Willie McRae, and Sweden’s Olof Palme as part of the Iran-Contr plot.

        Then there were the bombings of Gaddafi’s Libya when the Palme murder could not be pinned on the Soviets, and the capture by the French of the cargo ship Eksund, carrying all those weapons intended to the IRA.

        And so the madness continued up to your uncle’s problems.

          • D_Majestic

            Now that’s an interesting one, Trowbridge. And there was I wondering why my typing sometimes seems to be so utterly inaccurate.

  • DtP

    If only the Westminster gang had responded properly and swiftly to the early, non -IRA civil rights marches in Ulster then nobody would ever have heard of the repulsive PIRA; the marchers asking for One Citizen One Vote and the restraint of the B Special Constabulary was hardly revolutionary in the UK and in the States, after all, LBJ had done his best for blacks’ civil rights, the whole horrid mess could so easily have been avoided by shrewder politics. That Stalinist filth like the Provos were able to hijack a legitimate protest movement, making rivers of blood run in British streets is a fact now lost on the BBCs ignorant and historically illiterate commentariat.

    I do wonder how any sane person could support the Shinners unless they treat ideology above decency.

    • K Crosby

      Why would the British state turn on the enforcers of its colonial power? You must be confusing it with a democracy.

      • Muscleguy

        Exactly, and even back then they knew the demographics were against them. It’s no secret Catholics tend to have more children than Protestants. That was the real reason why they had to be denied the vote for so long, because they would use it to increase political pressure on the UK govt to allow reunification.

        Democracy is alright, so long as the right people have the vote and they use it properly. I bet Westminster would LOVE to disenfranchise half of Scotland. Meanwhile the SNP are busy enfranchising people, such as 16 and 17 year olds. Nicola Sturgeon is not afraid of the Scottish public.

        Saw a picture on twitter yesterday, Sturgeon and a local candidate are sitting outside with chips, surrounded by happy teenage schoolkids. Who are taking Sturgeon’s chips. Compare and contrast with Theresa May’s campaign chip eating episode. All alone. Looking uncomfortable.

        May would kill for Sturgeon’s approval ratings and she isn’t worthy to lick Sturgeon’s shoes in debate. She didn’t turn up last night because she knows she would have been eviscerated. Angus Robertson gets only a question or two in PMQ’s. Here he would have ripped her a new one. Pulled out the Blue Steel gaze and oozed gravitas.

  • Dave

    The moral maze posed is in effect, is it ever right to kill a child? Or put another way, just because ‘we’ kill a million of ‘them’, does that give ‘them’ the right to kill one of ‘us’? Or ‘our’ foreign policy kills millions, but that surely can’t excuse a terrorist attack on ‘us’. ‘We’ can understand that it would, but ‘we’ can’t agree that it does, because ‘we’ can only support killing the other side and not ‘them’ killing ‘us’.

    But everyone can see the partisan double standard involved which is why ‘we’ find it so offensive and manipulative for the pro-war lobby to accuse Corbyn of being an apologist for the Manchester event due to his opposition to genocide in the Middle East. And this is why the attacks back-fire and his poll ratings rise.

      • Trowbridge H. Ford

        Pilger is quite good on MI5 and FBI. All I would add is what else the LIFG was able to pull off – e., g. the 1998 attacks on the US embassies in East Africa, the murder of Yale senior Suzanne Jovin who was predicting renewed attacks on the WTC in her senior thesis, the cover up of her murder in the hope that the suicide bombers would prove to be just convenient hijackers to justify the removal of Osama bin Laden in Afghanistan. etc.

    • K Crosby

      No-one has the right to kill anyone and no-one had the right to complain when other people use the same methods. The Manchester bomber was in the same moral gutter any person that causes explosions in public places. If you do it to them, you can’t complain if they do it back. The trouble is that this bloke behaved like the Washington barbarians and their Euro- and Gulf-lickspittles; he should have behaved better BECAUSE his enemies behaved worse.

  • Alex Birnie

    Why would Sinn Fein taking their seats be so unlikely? If they had a specific promise from Jeremy Corbyn to legislate for a border referendum, they would be in exactly the same position as the SNP, who would almost certainly do a similar deal. One full parliament helping Labour to roll back the worst excesses of the Thatcherites, with 2 referenda during those parliaments, then Scotland and Ireland would bound free of the UK in June 2022!!….. I like it!!……What say you, Gerry Adams and Michelle O’Neill?

    • kailyard rules

      The fly in that ointment is that they (Sinn Fein) in order to take their places at Westminster would have to take the oath of allegiance to the Queen/Crown. Would they swallow that pill?

    • sentinel

      The legislation is already in place, Alex. The poll would be held if “it appears likely to” the SoS that the vote would be in favour of reunification: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1998/47/schedule/1

      I don’t think we are there yet; but once it dawns that money flowing into NI will be much reduced because of the post-Brexit environment – not least a shrunken UK economy & loss of EU funding – then the tide may turn.

      Also, I think the Republic would want to be clear about certain matters; e.g. not taking on NI’s ‘share’ of the UK debt. I noticed this concept of a ‘share’ of the UK debt asserted during the Scottish referendum. While there might be a moral obligation, I have yet to read an authority that supports a legal obligation.

      • Alex Birnie

        That’s interesting. I hadn’t noticed that specification. How on earth can that be judged by the SoS? However, now that the Unionists no longer have a veto, I suppose if the Republicans banded together and demanded a referendum, it would be very difficult for the SoS to refuse such a demand. Having said that, I suspect you are right. There is no need for them to hurry this, because even after the UK has left the EU, the EU have indicated that if NI were to unite with Ireland, there would be no problem with them being immediate members of the EU, as happened with East Germany.

        • sentinel

          If opinion polls showed a consistent majority for several months in favour of reunification, then I think it would be difficult for SoS to resist calling a border poll.

          The difficulty is that to make an informed choice voters need additional information; e.g. ‘share’ (if any) of the UK debt, pensions, social security and perhaps for die-hard Unionists resettlement grants if they wanted to leave. However, as things stand, it appears it is up to HMG and the Government of Ireland to agree the details after the vote for reunification: see s1(2) Northern ireland Act 1998 http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1998/47/section/1

  • reel guid

    It could of course be the Liberal Democrats who hold the balance of power. Farron has said no coalition with the Tories or Labour, but that’s surely just campaign rhetoric. They’re not likely to seek a coalition with Corbyn, but probably would tell the Tories that if they replaced May with a less hard brexit leader then a deal would be possible.

    • Xavi

      They’ve never expressed a scintilla of regret about propping up what arguably was / is the most vicious class-warring Tory government in modern history. It’s who the lib Dems really are, sadly.

      • Jo

        A little unfair there. Without the Lib Dems there is no way Personal Tax Allowances would have increased as much during the period. The Tories would never have done that on their own. So I think the LDs deserve credit for taking so many low paid workers out of tax altogether and for reducing the tax take for so many others.

        • frankywiggles

          No, the Institute of Fiscal Studies found that the Lib-Dems’ much-vaunted raising of the tax threshold did little for the low-paid. The main gainers were in the top third of incomes. The bottom third already earned too little to pay tax, and the middle third gained little: the top got most. And that policy cost a monumental £10bn that could have been targeted on benefits, tax credits, housing and childcare to help the struggling 50%. But instead it was they bore the brunt of the great Con-Dem austerity.

          • Jo

            Err, yes! ALL basic rate taxpayers gained from the increase and that is a fact! I know because I saw a significant drop in my tax deductions over the period. Many very low paid stopped paying tax altogether.

    • Republicofscotland

      reel guid.

      In my opinion the Libdems would jump into bed with the devil, if it gave them even a smidgen of power.

      Surely the electorate hasn’t forgotten the role they played in Cameron’s first tenure. On the Libdems, Sky news giving Nick Clegg airtime to shout out that according to him, the Libdems are the only party pointing at the disastrous effects Brexit will have on Britain.

      Something the SNP has pointed out from day one.

  • Flaminius

    Always strikes me that there is an undercurrent of anti-Irish sentiment that “legitimizes” or authorizes the attack on Corbyn. Essentially, the underlying view is that sympathy with Irish republicanism, or willingness to acknowledge that it is a legitimate political position, is equated with support for terrorism. Compare the willingness of MSM — so shockingly illustrated on the Daily Politics today — that any opposition to Zionism = anti-semitism. The exact converse.

    • Shatnersrug

      It’s extremely insulting – the troubles are behind us we’re pleased to have amity, it’s the Tories and the media and perhaps some daft old Tory voters in the southeast that are out of line

  • Xavi

    A lot of them might live just long enough to see an independent Scotland, a united Ireland and a British empire composed of the likes of Pitcairn and South Georgia. Virtually everything else that made them ‘proud to be British’ owned by foreign plutocrats and governments. Age-old supremacist delusions evaporating as they head bitterly for the grave.

  • reel guid

    Theresa May taking questions from employees at a workplace in Bath and one questioner likening her to Churchill. Wasn’t the same guy who gave her the solitary standing ovation on telly?

      • Ba'al Zevul

        PS. It’s ‘strong and prosperous’ now. ‘Stable’ just fell over? Message from Earth – we know who’s going to be prosperous as a result of your uncosted manifesto, and it isn’t us.

        • Republicofscotland

          Ah your prejudice to Bath wouldn’t have anything to do with the truth telling site of Wings Over Scotland, would it?

          Nah..surely not.

          “but I love Scotland too much to ever live there.”

          But not pish stained Scots sleeping rough in London’s doorways, Fred you’re full of it.

          • reel guid

            Since Theresa’s been there maybe Bath is smelling of sulphur even more than usual.

          • Republicofscotland

            reel guid.

            Now that you mention sulphur, I recall Saint Dunstan, the blacksmith, chase the devil off by grabbing his nose with red hot tongs at his forge.

            The devil immediately flew to Turnbridge Wells, to cool down his burning snout in the waters of the wells, it’s said that why the wells, now smell slightly of sulphur, and have a reddish hue to them.

            Of course I’m not intimatiting that the PM is the devil, though, I’m sure Old Nick would probably agree with their neferious policies. ?

      • Shatnersrug

        Pretty lame seeing as Bath is a Tory safe seat, she doesn’t seem to be doing a very good job of encouraging marginals does she?

    • Republicofscotland

      “one questioner likening her to Churchill. ”


      Theresa May will be hoping her campaign fairs better than Churchill’s Dardanelles campaign. ?

  • Made By Dom

    apologies… intended for 24 hours in politics thread. feel free to delete.

  • Manda

    I see Corbyn is left debating stand ins so far tonight… Robertson and Rudd… is that it for this debate?

    • reel guid

      Angus Robertson is not a stand in. Not only is he the SNP depute leader, he’s the party’s Westminster leader. So it’s fitting that he’s representing them in the debate.

      • Republicofscotland

        reel guid.

        Ineed he’s not a stand in, anyone watching Angus on PMQ’s will know he takes no prisoners when aiming questions at the PM.

        • Manda

          He and Sturgeon take no prisoners full stop. Both are good debaters from the fairly limited amount I have seen. This will be Corbyn’s most stretching TV appearance in my opinion.

          • Republicofscotland

            I think Corbyn is far more comfortable in front of the tv camera’s than Theresa May. It’s probably down to policies, in which May appear weak.

            However, Corbyn’s Achilles, could be Brexit, where does he stand on it? And how would he deal with it?

            The PM, only repeats, ad nauseum, no deal is better than a bad deal.

          • reel guid

            Robertson could be a tough opponent to Corbyn on the EU. Angus is not only half-German but worked for some years in Central Europe as a foreign and diplomatic correspondent for the BBC World Service and the Austrian state broadcaster the ORF.

      • Habbabkuk

        Yes, he is a stand-in. He is standing in for the SNP leader, who goes under the name of Nicola Sturgeon.

        The reason for this standing-in is probably that Mr Robertson comes across as a more pleasant figure than Ms Sturgeon. She of the tight little mouth, bitter, false smile and tightly clenched buttocks.

        • fred

          I notice they decided not to use her photo on the cover of the manifesto this time.

        • reel guid

          We’re getting the impression you don’t like her Habba.

          Anyway, she’s done her bit with good performances in several leader debates north and south of the border. Now Angus gets fielded and as Ros says he’s a good debater.

      • Manda

        Ah, Westminster SNP leader, I apologise, I only recalled he is deputy leader of SNP. It was looking more like a deputies debate than a leaders debate.

        • reel guid

          No apology needed Manda.

          Of course a politician who looked less like a leader than Paul Nuttall would be hard to find!

          • Republicofscotland

            Stewart Hosie is a good debater as well, who can forget him taking apart the mighty Lord Roberston in 2013 during the indyref.


            Of course Robertson went on to become Nato’s Secretary General, and immediately declared that a independent Scotland would see the balkanisation of western Europe.

          • Habbabkuk

            Stewart Hosie is a good debater as well, who can forget him taking apart the mighty Lord Roberston in 2013 during the indyref.

            Of course Robertson went on to become Nato’s Secretary General..”


            “Went on” ?

            George Robertson was Secretary General of NATO from 1999 to 2004.

      • Shatnersrug

        There is a huge progressive fault line between progressive over Scotland as we all know, don’t be surprised if tonight turns into an exercise by Rudd and the BBC to promote bickering between Angus and Corbyn.

        The Tories exploited that weakness eminently at the last election and will again

    • Xavi

      He’s challenged Theresa May to join him. Must be the only known democracy where the PM/ President is allowed to dodge directly debating the leader of the opposition during an election campaign. Certainly doesn’t bolster her public image as a strong, courageous figure who’ll boldly take it to the Eurocrats..

      • douglas clark

        To answer your question, kind of ‘yes’.

        On t’other hand you’d have thought that all these people with convictions like the Prime Minister would have been shouting ‘haud me back’ and getting the make-up on. Seems utterly strange that a Prime Minister is that feart.

        • reel guid

          When Theresa May was a guest on Desert Island Discs a few years ago she told the story of how when she was a schoolgirl she froze when she had to make a speech in front of the whole school. We must feel sorry for her younger self of course. But is this the reason for her reluctance to take part in a leader’s debate?

          Doesn’t sound very strong and stable.

        • douglas clark

          Habbabkuk ,

          Why do you think she has been almost invisible? Is it, perhaps because Theresa May is not very good? Could that be the explanation?

          Keeping your major player off the board throughout the election campaign is a tad like the antithesis of what an election is about. In modern times, being able to confront your opponents has been the ‘sine qua non’ of politics. Best wishes to Theresa May in re-writing the hymn book.

      • Anon1

        It would only be a 1.5 hour long ganging-up session on the PM by all the non-entity parties. She is quite right to stay out of it.

        • Xavi

          Nope, it’s because she’s an appalling speaker and coward, unable to defend an appalling record and manifesto.

        • nevermind

          I refer you to Caroline Lucas’ answer. Linto Crosby told her not to debate her speculative vague manifesto, he knew that she would be having to answer as to how much money her dementia tax would add to US health operators profits.

  • Sharp Ears

    It was Plymouth this morning for Theresa where the Derriford Hospital is groaning under the cuts. Beds there have been cut as have ALL the beds in the community hospitals in the adjoining county of Devon (all 9 I believe are being closed down) thus worsening the delayed discharges. I don’t suppose she called in.
    Save Our Hospital Services A group of good people are standing up.

    The CCG is called – North East Western Devon CCG. They have the budgets and the members are appointed.

    Allyson Pollock The Privatisation of the NHS

    • Manda

      To add to the Pollock Ted talk here is the 1 hour Peter Bach documentary tracing covert moves towards NHS privatisation since thatcher. http://www.selloff.org.uk/nhs/default.html
      I highly recommend it to anyone who hasn’t watched it.

      This video about May support for the Naylor report highlighted by Skwawkbox is also of interest. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tx3hrpDCct8

      I forget who made the point above about Greens support for the Reinstate NHS Bill but it is absolutely crucial to saving NHS from the health care industrial complex profiteering and has had shamefully low parliamentary support. http://www.nhsbill2015.org/the-bill/

    • nevermind

      An imminent Harvard professor has shown that privatising health care does not work, that it will lead to revolving doors, escalating costs and preferential treatment.
      A good blog on this issue here.


      Its the’ Health and social care Act stupid’ , an act to privatise the health service that already has caused GP consternations, has been derided as pernicious and a danger to the most efficient health service in the world. it has to be repealed for any claims to keep the NHS safe in our hands becomes reality.

  • Habbabkuk

    Now let’s drop all this tomfoolery (media bias, silly little insults, feeble jokes and so on) and talk policies, shall we?

    Messrs Corbyn and McDonnell are proposing to increase public spending by about £ 60 billion over the life time of the next Parliament. On schools, the NHS, social security, etc.

    And to pay for it by increasing the higher rates of tax, borrowing and, especially a 7 percentage point increase in company tax.

    Habbabkuk is aware that no one minds increased spending on policies that benefit them now or in the future. But Habbabkuk has also noted that people are strangely reluctant to cough up the readies themselves : it is so much more agreeable if someone else (higher earners, companies) pays.

    This raises the following question : would it not be more economically literate – and certainly fairer – to place the main burden of extra spending on “services” on the mass of the main beneficiaries themselves?

    For example : more money for the NHS and state pensions? Then increase substantially National Insurance contributions paid by employees. More money for schools and higher education and nursery schooling? Then increase the basic rate of income tax by a few pennies in the pound and/or increase VAT rates.

    If Messrs Corbyn and McDonnell were honest men, this is what they should be proposing, because that’s where the money is.

    • Loony

      If any of these people were honest then they would be proposing policies that aligns with the fact that the UK is insolvent.

      The UK has a minimum of £1.85 trillion of unfunded liabilities which sits on top of a national debt of around £9 trillion. No-one does any productive work which is why the UK is running a current account deficit of around 6%

      Still who cares about any of this? Much more interesting is whether Jeremy Corbyn sympathizes with terrorists or Theresa May derives pleasure from closing hospitals.

      Good to see so many anti racist people constantly seeking to impute racism in the comments of others, but quite happy to effectively steal and consume the resources of the rest of the world all on some obviously bogus premise that they will pay later.

    • nevermind

      I will happily pay 5p more income tax, if the next Government promises to prioritise claiming back taxes for the leaking billions that are parked in tax havens under British jurisdiction.
      I’m not prepared to pay anything if this Cinderella issue is not tackled and sorted out.
      It is these companies and private individuals that have put UKplc on to the racks.

  • Ishmael

    Man that TM interview was awful. She looks empty. Completely insincere. Totally unnatural. ..And treats it all like a popularity contest it the most base way. Sneering.

    I know individuals don’t really do that much “leader” or not. But come on. I’m going to use a football analogy just for jezza, who would you want on your team?

    Come to think of it wouldn’t it be nice to have someone with some seriousness in politics for a change.

  • Loony

    A Dream of Irony, more like the Dreams of Children

    “I caught a glimpse from the dreams of children , I got a feeling of optimism, but woke up to a grey and lonely picture…someone’s gonna crack on your dreams tonight”

    Say hi to the EU who 10 days before a UK General Election have produced 2 mind numbing documents setting out the terms of the beating it intends administering to the UK. Apparently the UK needs to pay for teachers at elite European schools that specialize in educating the children of EU Civil Servants. The UK also needs to pay to finance “peace in Columbia”

    Man we would probably be engaging in a nuclear war right now if Russia had so egregiously interfered in a UK election. Have you people no shame.

    All you socialists where is your outrage that money needed to help the poorest in the UK is suddenly going to be diverted to educating the children of the EU ruling classes. You surely don’t think that rich people are going subsidize other rich people. So they are coming for you.

    • Stu

      And who decided to call an election less directly after triggering Article 50?

      The EU owes it other the other 27 nations to make their positions clear.

    • Ishmael

      Thanks for the thought, but I’m quite familiar with it hysterical progression, including “whiteness” as a European ideological security blanket/war banner. And how it manifests today particularly as a reflection of modern nation states. Ideas of self “other” etc.

  • Paul Barbara

    Re-posting this from a previous thread, as was too late to get much interest; the article from the Guardian is very enlightening:
    Paxman is a member of the ‘British-American Project’:
    ‘Friends in high places’: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/nov/06/usa.politics1

    I must admit I liked his news programmes, but we get wiser (hopefully) as we get older.
    Humans have to get older or expire, but they may or may not get wiser.
    ‘What doth it profit a man…..’ (Luke lV : 5-8).

      • Paul Barbara

        @ Shatnersrug May 31, 2017 at 18:07

        ‘The British American Project for the Successor Generation, to give it its original, and now quietly forgotten, title, is an elite corporate/political talking and networking organisation. Its aims are to ensure that the left and liberal intelligentsia are not hostile to US foreign policy interests. It was founded in 1985…’

        Founded in 1985, when MSM in Britain was actually still reporting quite a bit of reasonable news and articles on the US-funded-armed-organised atrocities of the Military Juntas in Latin America: the murderous thugs of the ‘Contra’, ‘Death Squad’ regimes of Guatemala, El Salvador, Honduras, Chile and others.
        A continuation of ‘Project Mockingbird’ PLUS to take over British ‘Opinion Formers’. Seems to have worked a treat, like most CIA plots.

    • Ishmael

      Acutely it is a but sad imo. No need to mock a person.

      This is why I quit social media. Id rather not partake in it’s culture, get sucked in now and again. Not the end of the world I guess.

      • Tony_0pmoc


        Whilst I agree with you in principle, very Senior Politicans directly responsible for the most grievous atrocities, are fair game to be mocked, especially with regards to their incompetence, using any technique, that does not involve violence. Violence against the innocent, are their weapons. Using comedy to illustrate how useless they are has historically been a very powerful weapon used by populations to get rid of them. The alternatives are far more messy, and hardly ever work.

        I never really rated The Who until I saw them live in 1979 at Wembley Stadium. Completely Amazing.

        “The Who – Won’t Get Fooled Again”


        Vote Tory if you are a brainwashed moron.

        If you have any idea what is going on, vote Labour,

        They might actually get in.


  • Paul Barbara

    I don’t know why Jeremy doesn’t bring up all the other ‘real’ Terrorists who have not only been ‘spoken with’ by the ‘good’ politicians, but often also welcomed in Buckingham Palace, like Pinochet, Suharto Mobutu, numerous United States Regime ‘Presidents’, Gulf Regimes Sultans and ‘Kings’, Israeli Prime Ministers and Presidents who had ‘morphed’ from ‘Terrorists’ (Stern Gang and Irgun, though I would include many more recent Israeli ‘Leaders’ including Netanyahu) into ‘Statesmen’ and so on, as well as sp-called ‘Terrorists’ who were really Freedom Fighters, like Nelson Mandela, and ask his tormentors if they were aware of them, and why if they are, they don’t ask him if he spoke to them as well, and more to the point, had the Tories?
    Is he the only one to have ‘spoken with’ or ‘supported’ such people?

    • Shatnersrug

      This IRA thing is such a strange line of attack, it’s not like there isn’t pictures of even the queen joking with Martin Mcguiness is it?

      It’s a stupid attack and I can only think they are going after seniors. I just hope the youngsters get their act together this time

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