The Curious Hacking of @craigmurrayorg 108

This post may generate a tweet on @matthuag (which the hacked @craigmurrayorg has been renamed) because the autoposting programme interacts differently with Twitter (called a Twitter API).

When my account was hacked yesterday the hacker changed the password, email address, telephone number and username. They quickly tweeted out a post in praise of Hitler in my original username before changing it, which indicates that the primary motivation was defamation. They then subsequently changed the user id to @MattHuag, apparently to create an account stealing the identity of @MattHuang, which seems like a ruse to disguise the motivation.

But here is the rub. Twitter does not let you change the password, email address, phone number and username of an account all at once, for obvious reasons. The email I received from Twitter that alerted me to the hack makes plain that once you change the password, your ability to make some other changes is suspended.

Three people have now tried to replicate making all these changes on a Twitter account and nobody has succeeded (see for example comments below). So it appears that whoever did this hack was within Twitter or has a backdoor into Twitter to overcome these safeguards. That obviously points towards a security service rather than a random hacker. My twitter following had grown to over 136,000 and some individual tweets on Gaza were gaining 10,000 likes.

It is of course the case that all my electronics were confiscated by the state less than a month ago, and while they cloned and returned my laptop, they still have my phone. I was always confident there is nothing criminal on them, so I wonder whether this is just an attempt to bolster some kind of case with an outrageous tweet.

Subject to an “anti-terrorism investigation”, I do not view it as safe currently to return to the UK. Whether the investigation relates to my support for Wikileaks or to my support for Palestine, or to both, I do not know, as the police have not said why I am being investigated.

I honestly believe I am not fighting for me, but against encroaching fascism in Western societies. It is for freedom from an ever-encroaching police state and from a political class trying to enforce a monopoly of information to the public. The fight can only happen at all with financial support from the amazing readers of this blog. You have seen me through so much, and I am very grateful.

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108 thoughts on “The Curious Hacking of @craigmurrayorg

1 2
      • Goose

        Security key. They could take it off his keyring ‘suppose. But he’d have a duplicate in a safe place.

        Not hard to generate a new key either, if compromised by one key being taken. Then re-authorise that and buy /create another duplicate to store. Decent 2FA seems essential for all dissidents and investigative journos.

  • Duncan Cragg

    Comment from the other article, copied over to here for reference:

    I couldn’t change my phone or email after changing user id, name, location, birth date all at once:

    “Due to new session activity on your account, changes to your phone or email on your account are restricted temporarily. To change your account information, please try again after 48 hours from this same session.”

    I don’t know if changing those two first would work. But then that would require quite special knowledge of how Twitter’s policies work.

    • Drew Anderson

      Its shorthand for “X (formerly Twitter)”.

      If using “Twitter” triggers Musk as much as it triggers your inner pedant, then Twitter it is for me.

  • Dr. William Fusfield

    “Whether the investigation relates to my support for Wikileaks or to my support for Palestine, or to both, I do not know, as the police have not said why I am being investigated.”

    Well, I doubt that the police will inform you of anything, Craig, since I would assume that they are probably not themselves being informed by whomever is doing the hacking. That the police won’t even tell you why you are being investigated is, however, far more troubling, but hardly surprising in this age where public prosecutors, especially in the Anglophone nations, routinely, increasingly, and thoroughly ILL-legally, abuse their far-too-large prosecutorial powers to HARASS, incarcerate, and even torture, those whom they wish to go after for political reasons, but are unable to come up with any legitimate “crime” with which to charge them. (The Assange case is one of the most important and truly appalling examples of such extra-legal intimidation, in his case to a degree amounting to torture.) It could well be your steadfast support for Wikileaks or Palestine that is behind these latest events, of course; or – as I think somewhat more likely – your very high visibility defenses of Julian Assange’s manifest right to be released from solitary confinement and Belmarsh Prison. It could, however, even have something to do with a vendetta apropos your reporting on the Alex Salmond trial, for which you were absurdly imprisoned. But whatever the reason the hacker et al. have for troubling you, it seems to me you have a strong prima facie case that the hacker is a Twitter insider, so why not post a Tweet addressed to Elon Musk asking him to look into the matter himself. He too might not be able to locate the hacker either, but at least he would be apprised that there is a problem with their current security measures. Just a thought.

    Best regards from a slowly-clearing Pittsburgh,
    And with solidarity as always,
    Yours truly,


  • Republicofscotland

    I’m a bit of Luddite when it comes to techy things, all I can add is that it looks to me as though they (probably GCHQ) wants to lower your online profile, or even remove it altogether.

    • Goose

      From 3 years ago: The senior Twitter executive with editorial responsibility for the Middle East is also a part-time officer in the British Army’s psychological warfare unit.

      This takeover of CM’s account, comes after Tommy Robinson and Katie Hopkins’ Twitter accounts were reinstated on Sunday (5 November).

      Two UK far-right supporters of Israel. Go figure.

      • Sloppyjob

        Well I went figure but couldn’t come up with much. Mr Murray is diametrically far from the far right and is a well-known staunch opponent of fascism from a traditional liberal perspective. But hardly a beacon of the left. Some of his views are illiberal, he, peculiarly, is trapped in a blind zeal for “Scottish Indepenence” (what an utter waste of his intellectual and emotionall resources) and is unashamedly ruyssophobic (again, peculialy out of character with a lot of his views. I suppose one has to take cognisance of his provenance and allow for that as one cause of muddled thinking. Additionally, Robinson and Hopkins, on this issue, are surely more likely to oppose state repression (perhaps?) than to go along with it in the name of pro-semitism, one would suppose, they themsleves having been victims of the former too.

        • Lysias

          What was done makes me think of the vindictiveness of Zionist fanatics. Especially when I consider Craig’s recent powerful pieces on Gaza.

        • Jams O'Donnell

          You will have to supply a reasoned description of why support for Scottish Independence is ‘illiberal’. if you want anyone to take your comment seriously. However, I expect no such description as your stance is incoherent and anti-democratic as well as being basically imperialist in nature. So, ‘muddled thinking’? Maybe some self-criticism required.

          • John O'Dowd

            Well said Jams O’Donnell. I detect Brit troll in Sloppyjob given the targets and the nature of his completely incoherent ‘thoughts’.

            National self determination, whether of Scotland, Ireland or Palestine, and their escape from the foul legacy of British imperialism is the sine qua non of any possible progress in these societies.

            Each of those countries still suffers from that perfidious legacy.

            And that need not be a ‘left’ position. It is a perfectly respectable liberal stance – and even one that a centre-right that was not in thrall to so-called ‘Unionism’, could (and in some cases does) adopt.

        • Mr V

          Anyone sane on left wing would be for Scottish Independence too to weaken rabid far right regime (also known as UK) and deny it resources to spread its toxic far right economic (especially this one), ideological, and military poison. The less money and men UK has to terrorize, bribe, occupy, murder, and bomb, the better.

          Also, if you truly want left wing Scotland, instead of colonized annex to far right regime dictating any and all policies they want on Scots, being separate is the only way to go. I have no idea how any of this is up for debate if you aren’t cheerleader of imperialism stuck in early XIX century.

  • Rosemary MacKenzie

    Now I am asked for the name on my “official id” when making a donation – whatever the hell that is. Do any of you have to carry such a thing that is not your driving license?

  • Kuhnberg

    Dirty tricks like this are often the responsibility of a rogue section of the secret services deliberately distanced from any official body but with access to its powers and purloined assets like your phone. Palantir has form in this area; it also has links with Israel & the USA, two hands which wash one another of a great deal of blood. It’s most likely your activities on behalf of Julian that have inspired them to target you on this occasion, but the regional war kicking off in the ME may also be a related issue. I am glad you have been able to check this hack in time to defuse it, but you will have to watch your back now, possibly for years. The people who do thx stuff have more than one trick up their grubby sleeves.

  • portside

    Obviously done now because you oppose the genocide they’re enabling in Gaza. That may be the position of the overwhelming majority of people in the country but there are vanishingly few public figures prepared to speak out. They know you are not a coward who can be chilled by being jailed and arrested so they have resorted to the very crudest of smears to try and discredit your influential opposition to what they’re doing.

      • Goose

        It’ll be related to the dual-national hostages.

        That’s what’s so odd about this. The hostage taking seems like such an insanely stupid thing to do?

        It gives the US and UK special forces a reason to be involved on the ground, and allows Israel cover to commit genocide while figuratively hiding behind the “kidnapped” hostage posters that have popped up everywhere. Western news lead on the hostages, when the focus should be on the slaughter of Gazans.

        • Franc

          Matt Frei, Channel 4’s news correspondent, said last night, after his report from Israel, that he was leaving the war zone.
          Understandably stressful I would assume. What with the numerous cases of slaughter of Palestinians, men, women and children. And, no doubt, having to speak to Israelis to give the impression of “balance”.
          This happened last night on 9th November.

          • Goose

            Matt Frei once mentioned he’s Jewish. So he may be taking criticism from various organisations in the UK over Channel 4’s coverage? Imagine getting hassle from the majority of the following:

            •  Board of Deputies of British Jews
            •  Jewish Leadership Council
            •  Scottish Council of Jewish Communities
            •  Jewish Community Council
            •  Hillel International
            •  World Zionist Organization
            •  Jewish Historical Society of England
            •  Union of Jewish congregations of Latin America and the Caribbean
            •  JewishGen
            •  Anglo-Jewish Association
            •  Union of Jewish Students
            •  Jewish Genealogical Society of Great Britain
            •  JW3
            •  Movement for Reform Judaism
            •  World Jewish Relief
            •  League for Yiddish
            •  Gesher Galicia
            •  Secure Community Network
            •  Coalition on the Environment and Jewish Life
            •  Ashkenaz Foundation
            •  Jewish Peace Fellowship
            •  Community Security Trust
            •  Association of Jewish Refugees
            •  Jewish Music Institute
            •  Israelitische Gemeente Soerabaia
            •  B’nai B’rith Europe
            •  Association for Jewish Outreach Programs
            •  YIVO
            •  Jewish Association for the Protection of Girls and Women
            •  Oxford University L’Chaim Society
            •  London Jewish Forum
            •  Institute for Jewish Policy Research
            •  Council of Christians and Jews
            •  JDC International Centre for Community Development
            •  UJIA
            •  Jewish League for Woman Suffrage
            •  Jewish Voice for Labour
            •  Na’amod
            •  Tzelem
            •  JLGB
            •  Jewish Labour Movement
            •  World Jewish Congress
            •  Keshet
            •  European Jewish Fund
            •  Emanuel School
            •  Moriah War Memorial College
            •  Masada College
            •  Kesser Torah College
            •  די ראָזעווע פּאַווע pink peacock

          • will moon

            Goose how can so few British Jews, say 250,000 plus, warrant the number of organisations you list? It seems like some of these are original “astroturf” operations, long before astroturf was invented!

            As the Jewish population has decreased, I am amazed that the Board of Deputies carries such weight with our government, for such a small, niche religious organisation. Do you know of any sources mapping this morass of NGO’s?

          • Goose

            will moon

            They aren’t inconsequential organisations. Some are taken very seriously, despite being largely self-appointed.

            “Mr Jenrick and Chris Philp, policing minister, have written to all 43 police forces in England and Wales to ask them to report any foreign individuals caught up in any potentially unlawful or extremist activities for their right to stay in the UK to be reviewed.

            He has also asked the Community Security Trust, which provides security to Jewish communities, to pass on names of any foreign nationals they identify for anti-Semitism following the Israel-Hamas conflict.”

            Pass on names? This is a quasi-judicial role being handed to some unaccountable organisation.

          • Lapsed Agnostic

            I can’t find anything on the interwebs about Matt Frei being Jewish, Goose, apart from a ‘Famous Birthdays’ site that seems to think his first name is Matthew – so not a reliable source. According to Wiki, his parents were originally from Silesia* but moved to Essen before it became part of Poland after WWII. If one (or both) of them managed to survive the entire war as a Jew in Germany, I’d imagine he’d have been thinking: I can get a documentary out of this. Of course, it’s possible he may have converted, though his wife doesn’t have a Jewish name – and, let’s face it, that’s the only reason for 90% of conversions to Judaism.

            (Additional note: Unlike Labour Friends of Israel, Jewish Voice for Labour is fairly pro-Palestinian.)

            * ‘If this is Upper Silesia, one dreads to think what Lower Silesia is like.’
            — P.G. Wodehouse

          • douglas leighton

            I saw Matt Frei’s recent report- about the wanton murder of learning disabled and physically disabled wheelchair using teenager who a committed a hopelessly futile act of throwing stones at a group of IDF soldiers who were well beyond any chance of being hit by the stone.
            The report was about the recent upsurge in Israeli settler violence in the West Bank. There was an unmistakable condemnation of the IDF in the report. I was surprised, as it was such a change from the tacit approval of Israeli actions we have become accustomed to. He has said on previous reports that he had previously lived in Gaza for a considerable period of time.

        • John Main

          I think the focus should be on persuading Hamas to down arms and surrender themselves to a neutral third party. The hostages could be freed at the same time.

          Israel could then safely and comprehensively destroy the vast network of Hamas bunkers and tunnels.

          The killing of innocent Palestinians will cease immediately.

          Passing strange that nobody is calling for this obvious solution.

          • Jm

            Because it has no basis in reality that’s why and is false equivalency.

            Why should the killing of innocent Palestinians be occurring at all?

            Between here and Wings Over Scotland you don’t half spout some nonsense.

          • Goose

            But Hamas are a terrorist organisation they keep telling us. Who is and who isn’t a member is deliberately kept opaque. There may not even be a central command structure, or comms in place to order a surrender?

            It’s strange how Hamas are painted as blood-thirsty monsters yet the hostages are apparently still alive?

            No doubt al-Qassam brigades would wish to be a well-equipped regular army going toe to toe with the IDF. But that’s not feasible due to the disparities in force. The only option for resistance is loose militias and these will inevitably be classed as terrorists, because of the opportunistic tactics they use, eg. ambushes etc.

            Forget Hamas, the game is completely rigged against any form of Palestinian armed resistance full stop. Fight back and be classed as terrorists by the US,UK and EU. Or passively yield and get walked all over, as per the West Bank where settlers act like gods stealing land.

          • will moon

            So John Main you support the killing of innocent civilians in hostage situations. as a way to put pressure on the hostage takers? Sick

            If this true I take it you support Israel killing their own people with gunships and tanks as a first response to the Hamas attack? Sick

            If the above is true you are a one-person death cult. Get to it and kill,kill,kill

          • Bayard

            “I think the focus should be on persuading Hamas to down arms and surrender themselves to a neutral third party. ”

            In order to do that, you would have to have something called a “ceasefire”.

            “Passing strange that nobody is calling for this obvious solution.”

            I think you’ll find that lots of people have and the usual suspects rejected it out of hand. Anyway what makes you think that the Israelis are interested in your “solution”?

  • Antiwar7

    They stole my Paypal money (I had a positive balance) right after I doubled my monthly donation to Craig, a year ago. They really are afraid of you, Craig. Kudos!!!

    PS: They refused to say why: the reason was “proprietary”.

    • Townsman

      I cannot understand why people still use Paypal. Google for: paypal sucks
      You’ll get thousands of hits, all describing actual experiences of customers, all of them awful.
      I donate to a few websites and I subscribe to several online services, and I have one iron rule: if the only way to pay them is via Paypal, they don’t get any of my money or any of my business.

  • George Dale

    Today on You Tube I heard Prof Michael Hudson say that European politicians are the most corrupt (sic). They have strong competition.
    We have beem sold down the river and are entirely at the mercy of Uncle Sam for energy,
    Nobody in Europe has raised a finger even after the Septics blew up Nordstream (Just because Biden said they would do it, does not, of course, mean that they did it .. HA HA!)
    No-one will protect us.
    God help Assange.

  • Brianfujisan

    I had just went to Craig’s Twitter X.. Was a bit confused.. WtF..Then I seen Craig’s new post…

    Sick of the way they are treating you…Stay Strong

  • Александр

    Probable it’s time for you to ask for political asylum in Russia or China.
    Do not wait for false criminal charge and forever prison sentence.

    • John Main

      Not Russia.

      Too many high buildings with dodgy window catches.

      I believe Craig to be a man of outspoken integrity. He wouldn’t last long in Russia.

          • Bayard

            Just to remind you of your previous comment “Come on, it was a protest in a railway station – filmed from every conceivable angle. It’s not plausible to make out it’s a lie.”

            You should have said that to Police Scotland, they’ve done just that. “”

          • will moon

            Well go and crawl around the rubble. Just think of all those lovely fresh dead bodies you will find, as you look for window catches

            Russia aint nothing on Israel, you know for killing people. Israel is a death cult. You’d be at home there, judging by the content of your comments

      • David Warriston

        As a Russian resident I have good window catches on my 5th floor Moscow apartment. And since Craig speaks good Russian I am sure he would adjust well to life over here. No surrender to the Yankee dollar would lift his spirits in the short term, for sure.

  • Goose

    Matt Huang Co-Founder @Paradigm . Previously, Partner @Sequoia . Interested in positive feedback loops.

    Sequoia Capital is followed by Paul Mason.

    Small world eh.

  • Mac


    Definitely do not go back to the UK. You are never going to get a fair hearing on anything there just like Assange. Especially in Scotland the absolute Dorrian sinkhole of UK ‘justice’.

    The desperate charges of you being a terrorist which led to you being in Switzerland really are a clear indicator of the intent to persecute you. Assange style, Snowden style… you are on the same lists now man. You a nexus of causes they want stomped out.

  • Casual Observer

    Hmmmmmm, could I suggest that if it were a ‘State Actor’ responsible for the action against CM’s X account, they would have been entirely successful in their efforts? Its more likely that any ‘Official’ meddling with the account would be along the lines of observation, ie, to see who passes through or communicates? For any sphere of activity that the State worries about, the internet has been a terrific boon, its akin to a watering place on the Serengeti, which means surveillance is easily focused. In days of yore things were very much more labour intensive.

    Probably more likely to be some yoof out of the Sam Bankman-Fried mould doing what he sees as ‘His Bit’ for Israel, and working in his parents basement, maybe in Bushey? The moderation of this symposium has, or does seem to have been, remarkably successful at fending off the Hasbara mob, and that in itself will no doubt greatly anger certain groups.

    • craig Post author

      “if it were a ‘State Actor’ responsible for the action against CM’s X account, they would have been entirely successful in their efforts ?”
      leaving aside your touching faith in the efficiency of the security services, in what way were they unsuccessful? My 139,000 twitter account is lost at a crucial time. We also have not yet seen what they intend to do about the pro-Hitler tweet put out by the hacker. I expect that, despite it being evidently entirely contrary to anything I have ever written or said about Hitler and the Holocaust, they will try to use this against me.

      • U Watt

        They will because they have no scruples whatsoever and they know nobody who matters will call foul if they brand you an antisemite. Corbyn and his supporters were blackened with the very thinnest of thin gruel, virtually nothing at all. Once that job was done the same fanatical “protecters” of British Jews moved on to celebrating actual Nazis in eastern Europe. Everybody saw it, but that was irrelevant because nobody who matters in Britain will ever call them out. The past decade suggests you have every reason to be concerned about an obviously bogus tweet being cynically used to destroy you.

      • Casual Observer

        The ‘Pro Hitler’ aspect smells of amateurism ? I would hope that officially backed attempts to denigrate would be somewhat more sophisticated.

        • mark cutts

          Like the Ukraine/Russia war, in the Israeli-Hamas ‘war’ all sorts of nonsense is being passed off as good coin.

          The fact is that the MSM output has been full of ‘defensive’ attacks on the people of Gaza, and it’s there for all to see. If you want to argue about that, you are delusional.

          What the IDF and the Israeli government puts out is questionable, just like the info Hamas puts out, and it should be questioned.

          The MSM go-betweens are in a moral spin across the West and they don’t know any longer how to put an equals sign between the two “warring” factions; instead they counterpose pain and emotion.

          I’m not a heartless person, but a Ceasefire can only come about if the US wants it to happen. Yes – Netanyahu might not want that; but the US appears to want that, despite the public rhetoric.

          The solution is purely political – not emotional. The US (if it insists) will get its way, even if that means removing Netanyahu and his extreme right-wing supporters from office.

          The idea that Israel is the tail that wags the US Dog is not true. Without the financial and political support from the US then the Israeli economy would be (and is getting into) financial trouble.

          Politically this so-called war is a distraction for the US – as is Ukraine – as it is China and Russia who are the dangers: not Zelensky, not Netenyahu and definitely not Hamas.

          The real dangers to US hegemony (or the continuity of it) are vested in the BRICS economies, and by each day many of those who used to rely on Uncle Sam for loans and investment witness how the US treats subordinate countries.

          This month it’s Palestine – next month it could be Venezuela, who knows? – but the wiser smaller countries are joining the BRICS and the Belt-and-Road Initiative, for the simple reason that they think that China and Russia can’t be any worse.

          The US is not Omnipotent, and they are about to find out how Impotent (not Omnipotent) they are becoming. The world has changed, and is changing rapidly, and the West has no idea how to combat that change short of proxy Wars and military means – excluding deaths of US soldiers of course.

          Trump will surely play on the waste of money, in his eyes, and involvement of the US directly in any military clashes to come. When Trump talks of Isolationism he means it. It will play well with the US electorate and he will win based on that policy.

        • Pears Morgaine

          My first thoughts. It sounds more like a prank than a serious attempt to damage Craig’s credibility, I’d have expected something more subtle.

    • Lapsed Agnostic

      I, too, lean to the idea that the hack was carried out by a pro-Israeli individual(s), CO. I’m having difficulty seeing how a TwitterX employee (or someone with Twitter sys admin privileges) could have been behind it, as I would have thought they would be much more likely to target high-profile pro-Palestinian US accounts like Jackson Hinkle’s (which now has over two million followers – gaining over three-quarters of them in the last four weeks, though a lot of those are probably bots/paid-for). After all, it’s the US public that the Israelis are fearful of losing; they’ve already lost most of Europe’s. I also have my doubts that it was the UK security services, since they’ve already got our host over a barrel after his ill-advised ‘Hamas & Hezbollah’ tweet (which wasn’t written by a hacker).* I doubt whether not being able to infiltrate this forum will ‘greatly anger’ the Hasbara, as I’d estimate that the comments section only has a few hundred regular readers, most of whom are incorrigibly set in their views.

      * For an idea of the Draconian penalties for breaching Section 12 of the Terrorism Act 2000, Anjem Choudary, of al-Muhajiroun notoriety, was sentenced to five-and-a-half years under it in 2016 for pledging allegiance to ISIS’s former leader, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, via Skype & text to someone in Indonesia, after coming under sustained pressure to do so from his associates. He didn’t tweet it out to tens of thousands of followers on Twitter and, being a former solicitor, he was also generally careful to stay on the right side of the law and only had one previous minor conviction. At the time, the maximum sentence was 10 years – it’s now 14 years, plus an unlimited fine:,_conviction_and_imprisonment

      • will moon

        You are obsessed with this tweet, you mention it all the time. Why do you keep wacking on about it? What is in this for you? Do you expect to gain financially or emotionally? Or maybe a more esoteric reward? Or is it just to make you seem relevant? Honestly it is very boring.Change the record. I would be less concerned if you posted continously concerning your fascination with the mechanics of the prepuce

        “a few hundred regular readers”

        I discuss the news and views on this forum with a dozen or so people, on a person to person basis, regularly. These are important locals who have the respect of the wider cxommunity. So information from here reaches the people – you know, the ordinary people.

        After the last point in our Savile discussion, I think the KGB not very likely on reflection. I suggest to you that Jimmy Savile was an MI5, CIA or Mossad asset and that explains all those victims, many thousands, with no prosecution. What do you think?

        • Lapsed Agnostic

          Thanks for your reply Will. Since I first read it, I’ve mentioned the tweet a grand total of 6 times in 46 comments on here (only 5 times when you posted this comment). I was slightly shocked upon reading it, as I couldn’t imagine he’d do something so daft – even after a fair few Lagavulins – as it could easily mean years in jail, and I and one or two others had reminded people of the draconian penalties for being seen to support proscribed terrorist organisations in comments on here shortly before he wrote it. If you find my comments boring, you can always, er, not read them. A dozen people here, a dozen there, can add up to a few hundred. Ordinary people tend to have no political power, and generally don’t concern the powers that be, except en masse.

          If I’m obsessed with a tweet, you seem to be obsessed with Savile and the CIA, if I may say so. Anyway, no, I don’t think Savile was an asset of either MI5, the CIA or Mossad. He got away with abusing hundreds (not thousands) of people for similar reasons that the grooming gangs in Rotherham etc (well after Savile’s hey-day) got away with abusing thousands: because few people complained, and the authorities didn’t want to know about those that did.

          P.S. If you want any more titillation from me, you’re going to have to pay for it, I’m afraid. Enjoy your evening.

          • Funn3r

            There is no proof Savile ever did anything. Read that again before angry reply. Nearly all the allegations were after his death when he could not defend himself. Supposedly there were “rumours that he was dodgy” going back to the sixties but clearly nobody thought those rumours worthy of actually convicting him of anything. I am a big fan of the rule of law.

            Wir haben überall geheime Höhlen und Stollen. What exactly is in the tunnels?

          • Lapsed Agnostic

            Thanks for your reply, Funn3r. I don’t need to read anything again: there’s a large amount of evidence that Savile abused hundreds of people, but not thousands – that’s too many even for him. Many of his victims were entitled to compensation out of his substantial estate – that could only happen because the courts have posthumously deemed him guilty at least to the civil standard. For comparison, the former footballer David Goodwillie has been convicted of rape to the civil standard, so I can legitimately call him a rapist without fear of getting sued.

            There’s also some evidence that one or two of Alex Salmond’s accusers committed perjury at his trial, but no one has been convicted of anything and it doesn’t look like anyone will be – ergo, they must be completely innocent, and Salmond must be a sex offender, right? Or maybe not. The rule of law – of which you’re such a fan – is a wonderful thing, but it only works when people aren’t governed by tyrants (including elected ones) who consider themselves to be above the law.

            Sorry, don’t understand German.

            Re: ‘What exactly is in the tunnels?’ A: Hamas & Palestinian Islamic Jihad fighters presumably.

  • Allan Howard

    I just turned on the TV, and it was on Sky News, which I was checking out this morning (re Braverman), and the latest is that the police will be stationed in Jewish areas of London later today, because there ‘are rumours that convoys of protesters are planning to drive around Jewish neighbourhoods intimidating them’. You couldn’t make it up, but these fascist bastards DO!

    Oh, and the police are there guarding the Cenotaph all through the night, thank heavens! There really are no limits to how low these people can go….. and KEEP going! Demonising and smearing, and duping and deceiving and manipulating.

    • Allan Howard

      I’d forgotten about this one, which I heard earlier:

      Meanwhile, veterans were advised by military officials not to wear their medals or berets when they travel to Remembrance services today to honour the 1.3million servicemen and women killed in action since 1914.

      But the Sun doesn’t explain why of course, and neither was there an explanation given earlier. Anyway, the Cenotaph is being guarded from assault in any and every direction:

      ‘HOW HAS IT COME TO THIS? Cenotaph will be kept under 24-hour police guard for first time during Remembrance commemorations as PM appeals for calm’

      How has it come to this? says the Sun, so as to amuse themselves and all their buddies!

  • Blissex

    «against encroaching fascism in Western societies.»

    There is a political problem with that: “encroaching fascism” is quite popular among a large part of voters in western societies, in the UK what is called “Middle England”, that is the “petty bourgeoisie” of affluent owners of small businesses and property including middle class pensioners or almost pensioners, who are the core constituency that all three major parties (New New Labour, Conservatives, LibDems) want to represent.

    The oligarchs of the UK, USA and other “Washington Consensus” states have long realized that as the percentage of older more affluent people has increased (a large expansion of what used to be called the “hang and flog brigade”) that is a great opportunity to realize an “encroaching fascism” programme with the support of a big voter block.

    The political problem is how to persuade at least part of that big voter block that “encroaching fascism” is bad for them too, because revealing how far it has encroached is not going to work, because they like it and want more of it.

    • Allan Howard

      Yet MORE misinformation! And it would appear that Mr Kruger got away with it:

      During an interview on BBC Radio 4’s Today programme on 9 November about the police response to ongoing pro-Palestinian protests, Conservative MP Danny Kruger claimed a poll published that day showed by two to one that the public think the police are “getting this wrong” and being “too soft” on protesters.

      Mr Kruger confirmed to Full Fact that he was referring to a YouGov survey of 2,080 adults conducted between 7-8 November which asked a series of questions about respondents’ attitudes towards protests and marches in London, and the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

      The first question asked: “Generally speaking, do you think the rules on protests and marches in London are…”. Some 41% of respondents responded saying that the rules were “too relaxed, and should be tightened”, while 19% said they were “too strict, and should be relaxed”.

      Mr Kruger did not fully explain on the Today programme the results of this YouGov poll question, however, which also found that a further 21% of respondents felt the balance was “about right”, while 19% answered “don’t know”………

      Needless to say, the reason the vast majority of those who thought the police were getting it wrong and were being too soft on protesters is because they swallowed all the propaganda lies and falsehoods wholesale. it really is astonishing how so many people can be so easily duped. And most of them will go though their lives being duped and deceived time and time again by the state’s propaganda machine, and never-ever know that they were. Millions and millions of people, and hundreds and hundreds of millions world-wide.

      I’m sure if they were alive, practically all of the war-dead would be on the march, or be giving it their full support. And for the obvious reasons.

      • Neil

        Well, I for one will be on the protest march later on today. The good weather forecast means that there should be a large turnout. I hope everyone else reading this within travelling distance of London will be there as well.

        For some extra motivation, here’s a couple of pieces from , of all places, CNN:

        “American nurse who got out of Gaza describes desperation she saw” 8:54 mins

        “Queen Rania: There’s a ‘glaring double standard’ in how world treats Palestinians” 10:59 mins

        I think these two are good ones to show friends or family members who have fallen for the military-Zionist, warmongering propaganda.

        (BTW, will moon: I saw your post in the Forum. I will respond to it, but you might have to wait a few more days.)

    • Allan Howard

      I also came across the following on Vox Political (whilst trying to find an article he posted about four weeks ago) re the 78 year-old poppy seller. It just seemed too good to be true; for the establishment, that is. And it was, but millions who’ve been led to believe it happened will probably never know that it didn’t. Not that there is any satisfactory explanation, which there really, really needs to be:

      ‘Story about poppy seller attacked by peace protesters was a LIE’

  • Sam

    Let’s be honest. Even the thug cops in Uzbekistan would never stoop this low as to steal your phone and then change your username, etc. Or be so devious and underhanded about everything. When they don’t like you in Uzbekistan, they tell you right to your face (as they’re beating the crap out of you).

    No, it takes a “very British gentleman” to act like a devil and then congratulate themself for having done their “bit” to save democracy, etc, etc.

    Whenever I meet someone these days who tells me they’re English or Scottish, I say “cool.” But literally everyone who describes themselves as British is a scumbag.

    • AG

      Outside England however this “scumbagness” still works wonders. “English” might be stuck in the Middle Ages. But “British”, sigh…(got me thinking about “A Family History” by good old Vita S.)

      Prejudice must have been an invention by the tourist industry after all.
      p.s. Wasn´t it the English coining the term “made in Germany” ridiculing German products and warning customers of low quality. And look what that English prejudice has turned into. (Just think of China today).

  • Robert Dyson

    “Curiouser and curiouser!” This is reminiscent of what journalists in Russia report experiencing – odd things happening to remind you that big brother is watching you.

    • nevermind

      It’s all coming out now, the apparent 1400 victims that died on the first day, were downgraded yesterday to 1200, as many of the dead were probably Hamas fighters. Only the future will bring real numbers, whence Palestinian families still alive will miss their sons, now burned to cinders.
      This figure might still be revised down in future.

      Today’s march, if disrupted, will be down to the Suella’s Hooligans. She is the worst Home secretary of the last 40 years, imho.

      As I have written here for a while, I have had my computer interfered with. On switching it on it turned into an alarm system giving off regular beats. Don’t know if this was down to Craig’s phone/computer being hacked, but it happened on the day after his attack. I managed to get it back working, but what and who interfered with the Linux software?
      We shall see what happens in future.

      • Goose

        Israel can rely on the BBC to put their spin on events. The BBC are doing all they can to shield Israel from war crime accusations and the ‘G’ word ‘genocide’ usage is out of the question. The Suella Braverman spat has been a godsend. Blame Zionist BBC editors and producers who’d like to push the whole Gaza story down the news agenda.

        This from the last 24 hours:

        Revealed: BBC failed to declare interviewee’s links to the Israeli army
        Newsnight’s military expert Richard Kemp is head of a charity funded by the Israeli Defence Forces

        • Pears Morgaine

          The most recent death toll from the Israeli military is 318 killed during the attack itself (37 more have been killed since the IDF launched its invasion of Gaza), with a further 59 police killed. The figures include armed fighters but also unarmed service members in non-combat roles who were killed inside their bases, sometimes in their beds.

          The number of Hamas killed on 7th October is counted separately and is reckoned to be about 1,500.

          • Bayard

            “The most recent death toll from the Israeli military is 318 killed during the attack itself”

            That wasn’t what I asked. Are those 318 part of the 1400. sorry 1200 (and falling?)? BTW, nice use of the passive tense. “Were killed in the attack” includes, of course, those killed by the IDF, but let’s keep quiet about that shall we, and pretend the full 1200 were civilians killed by Hamas after they’d been tortured while no-one was looking.

            “The number of Hamas killed on 7th October is counted separately and is reckoned to be about 1,500.”

            Who’s doing the reckoning? I don’t suppose its the UN.

          • Pears Morgaine

            As far as I understand it the 318 military and 59 police are a part of the 1,400/1,200 total, yes.

            Any evidence that a significant proportion, or even any, were killed in ‘blue on blue’ attacks by the IDF?

          • Bayard

            “Any evidence that a significant proportion, or even any, were killed in ‘blue on blue’ attacks by the IDF?”

            Testimonies from survivors any good to you?

          • Pears Morgaine

            If they come from credible sources.

            The reported brutality of the assault on Israel won’t shock or surprise anyone familiar with the way Hamas has treated the population of Gaza.




            This August Gazans took to the streets to protest about living conditions and electricity shortages, Hamas responded violently, several leading Palestinian journalist like Thab Fasfous, Mohammed Abdelrazeq al-Baba, Bashar Ahmed Taleb, were arrested and beaten up, six men were sentenced to hang for ‘collaboration’ as a clear warning to others.

            Gazans have been living under a dictatorship with no right to complain, dissent or (since 2006) vote. Now the actions of Hamas have exposed them to the full fury and brutality of an Israel bent on vengeance.

            It would be easy to believe that Hamas don’t really care that much.

          • Bayard

            “If they come from credible sources.”

            You mean like the ones you give? Sorry, there is nothing coming from those sort of sources.

        • nevermind

          No Bayard there is only one doctor and some researchers determining who is who. Apparently they had a whole pyre of bones to go through and they THINK that these were all Hamas fighters whose dead bodies were burned
          It’s such a gruesome affair and enough to make you wretch.
          Did none of them deserve to be buried with dignity?

  • frankywiggles

    He is one of a tiny number of public figures who has not proven themselves a pitiless monster in the last month. Throughout that period the entire political class of England has proudly supported the mass slaughter of Arab women, children and elderly. They still are today. People can see it very clearly and won’t forget.

  • Goose

    24 hour guard on the Cenotaph… Absurd Met police theatre, isn’t it?

    The protest route doesn’t go there, and no threats to deface monuments have been made. The only people stirring up trouble are Braverman, the hateful RW press, and parts of the far right.

    The underlying establishment anger about these protests reveals their fear of losing the argument. As happened over apartheid, and sanctions on South Africa. Sanctions resisted by Thatcher remember. The UK position on Israel – Palestine is indefensible, and the Balfour Declaration, upon which Israeli claims to statehood are based, is widely viewed as a discredited, illegitimate stitch-up.

    Questions like: Do the Palestinians have a right to armed resistance under int law? What form should that resistance take? Would result in our govt arguing for peaceful resistance, no doubt.

    But they tried that in 2018-2019 with the marches to the Gaza fence – it resulted in 266 being shot dead and the UN condemning Israel for using live fire against unarmed protesters. The peaceful approach in the West Bank hasn’t yielded anything but brutality, misery and stolen land for Palestinians either.

    Ministers would find it hard to defend the UK position against a serious interviewer.

    • Franc

      @ Goose
      ” Ministers would find it hard to defend the UK position against a serious interviewer ”
      Apparently viewing figures, on Newsnight, some years ago, would show a huge increase when Jeremy Paxman was interviewing.
      There was one example in 2009(??) when a Jewish talking head, was defending Israeli bombardment of Gaza and fighting the “Palestinian Terrorists” …
      Paxman’s reply was, “But YOU were terrorists too”, referring to the time when British soldiers were being attacked in Palestine. Completely stumped the talking head.

      • Goose

        Look at the numbers on the street today, looks as big as Iraq c.2003 to me.

        Imagine being in govt, the press/BBC, a govt agency or the MoD. Do they see how dangerously out of touch they are with their pro-Israel stance?

        Meanwhile, the Israel-lobby-backed far-right are fighting the police at the Cenotaph.

        • Bayard

          “Meanwhile, the Israel lobby backed far-right are fighting the police at the Cenotaph.”

          Well, I suppose someone had to, otherwise all that overtime would have been wasted. Protests will soon be like “The Man Who Was Thursday”, with protestors, anti-protestors and police, all provided by the state.

  • Allan Howard

    I assumed that the poppy seller story was widely covered by the MSM, but thought I’d just do a quick check, and it was of course. I haven’t yet checked to determine how many media outlets followed up the story the next day when police and transport police made a statement that there was insufficient evidence that an assault had taken place but, of course, they are not saying explicitly that he – the poppy seller – was lying. The following is from a BBC News article three days ago:

    Police have dropped investigations into an alleged attack on a 78-year-old poppy seller during a pro-Palestinian rally due to “insufficient evidence”.

    British Transport Police said officers had reviewed CCTV footage and spoken to key witnesses.

    They said the investigation would not be taken any further.

    Assistant Chief Constable Sean O’Callaghan said the review of CCTV footage had been “extensive”.

    He added: “We have no reason to believe that poppy sellers are at any risk or being intentionally targeted.”

    I mean if it really happened, then it’s inconceivable that a few people, at the very least, standing close by wouldn’t have seen it, but apparently no-one did. And why on earth would any peace protesters of all people have any reason to think to punch and kick and shove anyone, let alone a poppy seller, and an elderly one at that. I’m pretty sure it was the DM that broke the story, first on their website at 22.22 on the Monday, and then as the main front-page story in their print edition the next day, which just happened to coincide with a number of other things protester/protest related. And bear in mind that the alleged assault happened on the Saturday afternoon.

    The odd thing is that it seems as if the investigation didn’t happen until AFTER the story hit the headlines, because if it had happened beforehand, then surely the DM and the rest of the MSM would have learnt that there was no evidence that an assault took place, and it would then not have been news-worthy.

    Given the coverage it got and how it reflected on protesters in general, we really need to know the full details, and shouldn’t just let it pass.

  • Allan Howard

    I just came across the following, posted six days ago, a day or two after the demo last weekend. Yes, and things are escalating by the week, and this Saturday’s march will be the worst yet and they’ll be mugging pensioners and vandalising lamp-posts……. Yep, the hate-mongers have got their very own TV so-called news stations now (two, in fact), and needless to say, it’s just nasty, vitriolic, rabid right-wing propaganda. And needless to say the shills are straight into the comments section as per usual churning out their malevolence. Here are a few examples:

    It boils down to the BRITISH people, no longer being allowed to be BRITISH. Constantly being called Racist, multiculturalism isn’t working, and sick of it being forced. When one of our most valued Remembrance days is being high jacked for terrorists, it’s disgusting.

    I really don’t know how much more the British public can take. Most of the people I know are sick to their stomachs of watching what is happening to this country. It feels like we are being slapped around the face daily. If a demonstration takes place on Remembrance Sunday I think it will be the final straw for some people. The British people are very tolerant, far too tolerant actually, but how many more insults can we endure. [And a few of the replies to this one]

    Spot on!

    I’m sick to the back teeth of these people disrupting the lives of British Citizens. We don’t want it and we don’t need it. Armistice day is our tradition to remember our veterans. THIS IS BRITAIN, NOT BLOODY PALESTINE.

    Spot on. It’s time to start fighting back and defend this country.

    mmmm the scary thing is that if the police actually let them in, theres going to be every football firm in england around the cenotaphs

    And the next comment, and the first reply:

    Well said Peter. Being a Veteran myself, I can see my Fellow Vet’s turning on these protestors, if they try and disrupt our Ceremonies. And what the Protestors have to remember is, “We have all been Highly Trained to deal with the like of these Yobs”.

    Saying this to my mate earlier, there are more than a few of us lads who are trained to be nasty, who are willing to be nasty.

    If I didn’t know they were shills (there’s more-than-likely several), I would say they’re demented, but just like the Mail, Talk TV has its shills churning out this poison, and keeps the most virulent near the top of the comments by giving them lots of Likes, which also influences the dunderheads that watch Talk TV videos. And like just about ALL black propaganda, it’s directed at the emotional sphere – ie concocted and contrived to evoke this or that emotion/feeling.

    “Disrupt Armistice Day And See The Difference Between Keyboard And Real Warriors”

  • Allan Howard

    Apologies for so many posts clumped together, but I seem to be the only person posting through the night.

    The Sunday Mail……

    ‘Scotland Yard says ‘intense debate’ before Armistice Day protests ‘increased community tensions’ as critics slam Suella Braverman for ‘whipping up division’ – while ex-minister blasts Met for allowing far-right thugs into Whitehall ‘to protect Cenotaph”

    The Metropolitan Police said it made 126 arrests, the ‘vast majority’ far-right football hooligans who pelted officers with bottles, cans and metal fences after gathering to ‘protect the Cenotaph’ in Whitehall. Nine officers were injured.

    The totally confected ‘fear’ of pro-Palestinian supporters vandalising the Cenotaph in Whitehall has been wound up and up and up by the MSM during the past few weeks since a stage/platform mysteriously appeared next to the Cenotaph on Sunday the 15th of October, the day after the first big demo. It was undoubtedly erected by minions of the State so that the MSM – and especially the rabid right-wing media – could then make the ridiculous leap to claiming that they feared protesters were planning to desecrate the monument, and during the five or six days prior to the demo it reached a crescendo. The MSM is totally and solely responsible for the so-called football hooligans turning up on Saturday and the violence that ensued, along with whoever was behind the whole idea of the stage and the ‘fear’ smear, and those who played along with it. All concocted and contrived to demonise the protesters. But there was also another motivation: By inflaming the right-wing thugs to organise to come to London and protect the Cenotaph, and the very good likelyhood of there being violence against the marchers on route or wherever, the PTB were hoping it would put a lot of people off coming to the demo. and it no doubt DID put some people off.

    I would imagine the Sun is the most widely read paper by the right-wing nutters, and in an article a few days ago it was really egging them on to come to London and sort out the peace vandals. I mean REALLY, are they so thick as to swallow all the nonsense, and even thicker to not realise that the police – which was a joke in itself – were there protecting the monument, and would be there to deal with any disturbance, shall we say? I mean have anti-war protesters ever been known to vandalise war memorials?! No, of course they haven’t, and what happened in Manchester was undoubtedly a false flag, and done, amongst other reasons, to inflame and incite the hooligoons even more.

    You were conned lads, big time, by the Establishment and the folks at the Sun. Try the Financial Times for a change.

    Peace (please help us make it happen!).

    • Goose

      Lots of media dirty tricks underway. And I’d wager there were far more people than precisely 300,000, the police and BBC, other media claim attended.

      Media Zionists use fallacies of distraction. These involve the misrepresentation of an opponent’s viewpoint using distortions so that it’s rendered indefensible.

      The current favourite, is claiming that, ‘From the River to the sea, Palestine will be free’ is a call for genocide, therefore deeply anti-Semitic. They use weaselly language such as, ‘many believe it to be… a call to genocide’ and ‘widely understood to be…’, widely understood by whom? They don’t say. Being ‘free’ is the aspirational aim here, nothing more. The slogan is fine.

  • Alex

    Unlikely the police did it. In fact, if they have brains, they should become worried about their equipment. All eg. PEGASUS needs is an iPhone & a compromised server/machine. Who is on the other end of the Israeli-designed & distributed software, is your guess 🙂 . This is an old article, but, it seems, recently there was a surge in the discovered Pegasus penetrations.

    • Alex

      ..or it might not need a software – just one of the people, who handled your iPhone /computer logins, could’ve unexpectedly discovered that his/her/its patriotic duties in defense of Israel and Jewish People completely overrides all their other duties and obligations 🙂

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