MH17 – Curiouser and Curiouser

by craig on July 22, 2014 11:59 am in Uncategorized

Pro-Russian forces have removed large parts of MH17, and then substituted or altered them before returning to the site. This is extraordinarily important.

I know and absolutely trust Natalia Antalaeva of the BBC. About one hour ago she broadcast live on BBC World that OSCE observers had witnessed that sections of fuselage were being removed from the site, taken away and later returned after having been replaced or altered. In particular a large piece of tail section had been taken away and later something had been brought back which, according to the OSCE observers, “looked different” from the original.

Natalia said she had herself witnessed rebel forces cutting up sections of fuselage and removing pieces, and cranes lifting large parts of the wreck.

Extraordinarily, a few minutes after this report, the presenter hurriedly added that the BBC had of course no idea why this activity was taking place, it could be for totally legitimate reasons such as searching for evidence. Then silence – there has been no repeat, it has not appeared on the strapline, it was not in the hourly bulletin, and having just googled it I can find nothing on line.

It seems to me that there is a determination to put the lid back on this one at least until after the EU foreign ministers meeting today. I am drafting a substantial post on MH17, possibly for posting tomorrow. The real story is the collusion of the financial elite in making sure nothing is done about Russia.

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68 Comments

  1. just so I understand correctly – are you implying this is all russia’s doing?

  2. Sounds like typical BBC “Blame Russia” bullshit. If she saw this why didn’t she ask?

  3. Sidney

    Yes. Because it is.

  4. I hope your piece finds space to mention that more civilians have been killed in the last 4 days by Ukrainian shelling of cities than tragically died on MH17.

  5. Derek

    Why would I publish lies? Don’t bother coming here, stick to TASS or Russia Today.

  6. “Natalia said she had herself witnessed rebel forces cutting up sections of fuselage and removing pieces, and cranes lifting large parts of the wreck”

    Did she not think to take photographs? It seems strange that such a major operation could take place without being properly documented and that we are reliant on eyewitness accounts.

  7. Craig
    For a liberal and otherwise a very rational human being, your visceral anti-Russian conviction is amazing. It forces you to do what you rightly criticise main-stream media for: wild assertions with no hard evidence. Even if this means that you have to trust BBC which otherwise you so rightly criticise.

  8. Lots of evidence already from around the net on the holes in the fuselage/other external aluminium skin parts that make it more and more likely it was a ground to air missile strike. Too many holes to cover that up now there’s an existing photographic record for probably all the wreckage (admittedly not all the angles and underneath.)

    Black (= orange) boxes handed over, highly doubtful they could be tampered with without detection.

    Craig, as for fuselage parts “replaced or altered” I would be skeptical that any replacement 777-200 parts would be available at short notice. Altered possibly, but they’d have to be pretty good to fool the metallurgists who might examine anything representing say a strange weld or other giveaway signs of tears and a corresponding differential in corrosion at a microscopic level, (if I can give an example of possibilities) or other tampering.

    Having said that, I look forward to seeing further evidence – it might be (one scenario) that they took parts away for Russian aviation crash investigators to look at (without the prying eyes of official investigators) – that would make sense – and that BTW would be a negation/violation of the UNSC Resolution – if the Russians wanted some clues in advance as to how strong the case is for finger pointing towards them. OTOH planting eg some air to air missile shrapnel from a Sukhoi in the fuselage to muddy the waters? That could be possible?

    It’s still early days but, no smoking gun yet, lets say a whiff of cordite?

  9. Interesting. I can see why Russia is ‘helping’ the ‘rebels’, but I can’t see why they or the rebels would want to shoot down a passenger jet. The thought that Ukraine somehow tricked them into shooting down the jet sounds a bit far fetched as well. Incompetence is the most likely scenario, and it wouldn’t surprise anyone if Russian tried to hide that.

  10. thanks, Craig – looking forward to your post…

  11. I agree ‘B’ – if one is interested, even concerned and exploring the curious it makes sense to consider the motives, the Cui bono behind the assurances, the axiom of statement.

    As an example why at this juncture has the British government announced an inquiry will be held into the death of the Russian dissident Alexander Litvinenko?

    The ‘lid is being put on’ until all the vectors are reconciled and unified to vilify Putin’s Russia.

  12. It would be important if it were definitely true. But I’m not convinced a BBC correspondent has the expertise to know whether aircraft parts are being substituted or merely being moved and returned as part of the investigation process. Also, it would have to be a very elaborate hoax for the Russians to have parts similar enough to substitute – and would they do it in front of a BBC correspondent?

  13. Craig. 22 Jul, 2014 – 12:22 pm

    “Sidney

    Yes. Because it is.”

    Is that just because you say or can you explain why you are so certain?
    Are there any other similar reports or photos?

    On the Air-Disaster thread,

    More from BBC,

    Dreoilin. 22 Jul, 2014 – 11:56 am

    “..The leader of a Dutch forensics team has said he was impressed with the work done at the site of the MH17 airliner crash in Ukraine.
    Forensics expert Peter Van Vliet said: “I think they did a hell of a job in a hell of a place…”

    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-28405448

    Do you think we can trust the international forensic team to notice signs of evidence tampering?

  14. Apologies – misunderstood that Antalaeva had learned of the incident from better qualified observers. Nevertheless there must be doubts about reports like these fed to a correspondent.

  15. What looks like the video report in question has just appeared on the BBC website -

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28415769

  16. As in Alice in Wonderland, you can pretty much see the caricatures.
    Plenty of Queens of Hearts “Off with Putin’s head !”
    And all this skullduggery happening of which we have so little evidence so far.
    Just the word of some politicians and intelligence agencies.
    What’s there not to believe ?

  17. Interesting stuff.

    re ‘the collusion of the financial elite’ isn’t it the case that the interests of the US overclass and Euro overclass diverge when it comes to Russia ?

    The US is now (courtesy of fracking) once again largely self sufficient in hydrocarbons; Russia is not an important trade partner to them and ,in the one manufacturing area where Russia is globally proficient (armaments), a competitor.

    Europe instead trades much more with Russia, and we need the pipelines originating there to keep the gas flowing. A serious rupture in Russian/W European trade (which would be the result of ‘real’ sanctions) would hit city slickers charging fees on Russian IPOs,luxury car dealers and estate agents in London , Marbella, and Monaco, and the French shipbuilding industry, to name but three. The fallout across the pond however would be minimal.

  18. Just saw the clip. I think – with the mphasis that she puts on the word replaced – she means that they have put them back.
    By the look of things they have been searching for bodies.
    They’ve nearly found them all by the last count.
    Having taken care to put them in the refrigerated lorries.

  19. Not before time Craig, that you got into the stinking mess that is the MH17 story.

    But why only this one (possibly) trivial detail? There’s lots more technical stuff of very high quality from

    http://eureferendum.com/

    Read that and then come back and tell us some theory that Russian peasants are contaminating the evidence!

  20. Maybe Putin is trying to gather actual evidence to use against the accusations of the US and the west? He does like to play his cards carefully.

    I don’t know what really happened to the downed plane, but the jump to conclusions by serial liars like the American National Embarrassment John Kerry leaves me hoping that someone somewhere is looking out for reality.

  21. A member of the international monitoring team said pieces of the wreckage had been cut into and changed, possibly to remove bodies. BBC

    Oh! – is empathy and community the main vector?

  22. Ben-American Fascist Flechette

    22 Jul, 2014 - 1:16 pm

    Craig; Is this the same source who claimed MH17 was diverted due to weather?

  23. In case it hasn’t come up in your research, CNBC just yesterday was doing some in depth reporting on Russia oligarchs and their position following MH17 and Ukraine more generally. Here’s a typical piece:

    http://www.cnbc.com/id/101852990?trknav=homestack:topnews:20

    The emphasis is very much that these people are increasingly concerned about a Western backlash. Surely not more concerned by this than crossing Putin, but still worried about the prospect of fresh sanctions. The fact, however, that they expatriated around $75bn in the first half of 2014 gives a pretty good clue about one of the things Western governments will have in mind in terms of how to appear to ramp up the pressure on Putin.

  24. Nice reference Conallboyle. Craig seems only to cite the lying BBC when it suits him in his anti-Putin agenda. Weird, when – as he correctly asserts – the BBC is now totally corrupt government agenda in every other aspect. Why does Craig follow the BBC agenda on this, and only this? Does he too seek a world war with Russia? Quite bizarre.

  25. Ben-American Fascist Flechette

    22 Jul, 2014 - 1:23 pm

    Craig, Obomber and the EU are in sync. http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-28400218

    What other financial elites are colluding?

  26. Indeed yes Mark G, to all you’ve said. Perhaps Craig’s Russophobia is getting the better of him once again !

    At least MH17 distracts from the slaughter in Gaza. How fortunate for the Zionazis that the two stories coincide.

    Agent Cameron is doing his best to stay up with the script. He’s even done a little more than was asked of him by holding the Litvinenko inquiry. It all helps keep the “evil bear” at the forefront of the consumers’ minds.

    Well done Agent Cameron. The Drone King will be very pleased with you.

  27. Encyclopedia Brown, Boy Detective

    22 Jul, 2014 - 1:27 pm

    As long as we’re putting on our deerstalker caps to ferret out skullduggery in a UNSC/ICAO/OSCE investigation, the document below may be helpful as a ready reference to every trick in the book.

    https://twa800project.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/affidavit-of-hank-hughes.pdf

    Now, since we’re bound and determined to catch those dastardly Russians, we ought to remember that (1) the Ukrainian armed forces are clowns and (2) Russians are very good at ECM. Accordingly, your most interesting evidence is apt to be not in the wreckage but in the TARs and CPs, or in the EFF systems of aircraft that were present.

    It would be somewhat embarrassing to go off half-cocked about the gossip of some NATO weasel on the OSCE special monitoring mission hyping agreed actions of the Trilateral Contact Group, or something silly like that.

  28. Well, this is an interesting diversion, but at least Craig is consistent… he’s never liked Russia, or control of a business via the public sector. That was obvious from Murder in Samarkind. Maybe he’ll find a place in the “spirit of 97″ labour party. I like public sector companies so I’m now well and truly without a party to support.

    As I’ve said before, what was very brave of Craig was that he dared to provide evidence linking the Taliban, oil, and Enron. Perhaps this is where the billionaire/global energy cartel have found the need to get involved with MH17. Interesting diversion, but doesn’t take away the facts that MH17 had been asked to fly lower and was being tracked by fighter planes… and that the neocons had a story, complete with fake video, ready to roll remarkably quickly.

  29. “A member of the international monitoring team said pieces of the wreckage had been cut into and changed, possibly to remove bodies”

    Removing the badly decomposing bodies appears to be the first priority so some lifting of debris is to be expected in order to achieve this.

    To suggest that the debris has been “changed” is something quite different, unless they simply mean that the debris has not always been put back in its precise position. If it’s being suggested that duplicate pieces are being brought in to replace the real pieces and that this is all going on under the noses of BBC reporters and OSCE observers then I have to insist: pictures or it didn’t happen.

  30. Ben-American Fascist Flechette

    22 Jul, 2014 - 1:40 pm

    EBBD; I wonder if the FBI evidence tampering on TWA800 was decried on national TeeVee by POTUS, or anyone else.

    I do think KAL007 and TWA 800 have some relevance to MH17.

  31. “Curiouser and curiouser” cried Alice. “Sentence first – verdict afterwards” said Craig Murray.

  32. Ben-American Fascist Flechette

    22 Jul, 2014 - 1:44 pm

    Does anyone remember the Ukraine-based Georesonance and MH370? Putin was behind that attempt to further embarrass the incompetent investigation, and it was time someone issued some PAYBACK !!!

  33. During the 2008 Banking Crisis, when the stupidity of Mrs Thatcher’s idea to trust bankers with money was finally proved, the financial elite were determined that the blame was put firmly on Gordon Brown. He was flying the machine according to the Bilderberg instruction book. It didn’t have a paragraph on what to do when the plane was attacked.

    So they told him to remove the evidence of how the attack had been done which would have easily shown who had stolen all the money, and he dutifully replaced the money with other money to hide the evidence.

    Same here. The West has an agenda to subject the entire world to its NWO control. It ramrodded its agenda into Europe and anywhere controlled by the World Bank. It is currently pursuing its United Capitalist agenda in Muslim countries by proxies of terror. It is also pursuing its agenda against Russia and China.

    The aggressor is the West. The stupid idea they believe in is collossally in debt or bankrupt, while the sensible ideas Russia and China have are either in balance or strongly in credit. The ancient freedoms of the West are rapidly disappearing down the plughole to the level of worse than the post-Communist states.

    The only question here is whether the Ukrainian jets tailing MH17 were giving co-ordinates of the malaysian plane to Ukranian BUK missiles or fishing for Russian BUK missile fire and ghosting their own co-ordinates onto the Malaysian civilian plane’s co-ordinates to draw Russian missiles. Obviously they have the technology to do this because of what they, NATO, did to MH370.

    Anybody who thinks that Russia is the aggressor has either been brainwashed by the FCO, or asleep for the last 20 years of total warfare unleashed on an otherwise booming, peaceful world by the Zionist US.

  34. One reason, Craig, why the BBC have stopped showing it is because their agenda seems to have changed to the great palladium poisoning puzzle, and the public inquiry that is about to start. It is a “human” story, and the mmedia love to pull at our heartstrings. And yes, hats off to the persistence for justice of the wife of the former KGB agent.

  35. ‘Then silence – there has been no repeat, it has not appeared on the strapline, it was not in the hourly bulletin.’

    Natalia’s report headed up the Beeb’s lunchtime bulletin on terrestrial TV, and similar reports of possible interference with the plane debris by the rebels headed up ITN’s bulletin.

    ‘It seems to me that there is a determination to put the lid back on this one at least until after the EU foreign ministers meeting today’

    The tone of the Beeb reporter in Brussels in the same bulletin was that another slab of prime Eurofudge is now being baked.

  36. Encyclopedia Brown, Boy Detective

    22 Jul, 2014 - 1:51 pm

    Hmmm, perhaps, if by decry you mean stuff it up your asshole in a condom and run and hide

    http://www.ntsb.gov/news/2014/140702.html

  37. Only two countries have used SAMS against civilian airlines: In 1988, the US Navy shot down an Iranian Airlines Flight 655 over the Strait of Hormuz. In 2001, the Ukrainian Army downed Siberia Airlines Flight 1812 during live fire exercises.

    (In 1996 the Navy also apparently mistakenly, brought down TWA Flight 800 off the East Coast. The Navy has been reticent about confirming this kill, for some reason).

  38. IF there has been interference with MH17 crash evidence, that would be a breach of yesterday’s UN Security Council Resolution. Why on earth would Russia or the separatists risk jeopardising the Unanimity at the United Nations?

    On Monday 21 July 2014, the United Nations Security Council (UNSC) unanimously adopted a Resolution calling for a full and independent investigation into the crash of Flight MH17 last Thursday in Ukraine.

    The Resolution also demands that international officials are able to access the crash site safely.

    The UNSC’s five permanent members are China, France, the United Kingdom, the United States and Russia. Its ten non-permanent members are Argentina, Australia, Chad, Chile, Jordan, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Nigeria, South Korea and Rwanda.

    It was initially unclear if Russia would support the UNSC Resolution given its support of pro-Russian separatists in Ukraine who were allegedly impeding attempts to begin investigations at the crash site.

    The UN News Centre announced:

    In a unanimously adopted Resolution, the 15-member body condemned “in the strongest terms” the downing of Flight MH17 on 17 July in Donetsk Oblast, Ukraine, which resulted in the tragic loss of 298 lives.

    It supported efforts to establish “a full, thorough and independent international investigation” into the incident in accordance with international civil aviation guidelines.

    Security Council members also insisted on the “dignified, respectful and professional” treatment and recovery of the bodies of the victims.

    Further, the Security Council demanded that the armed groups in control of the crash site and the surrounding area “refrain from any actions that may compromise the integrity of the crash site, including by refraining from destroying, moving or disturbing wreckage, equipment, debris, personal belongings, or remains, and immediately provide safe, secure, full and unrestricted access to the site.”

    It also demanded that all military activities, including by armed groups, be immediately ceased in the immediate area surrounding the crash site to allow for security and safety of the international investigation.

    The UN Security Council also demanded that those responsible for this incident to be held to account and that all States cooperate fully with efforts to establish accountability.

  39. Ben-American Fascist Flechette

    22 Jul, 2014 - 2:01 pm

    Well the NTSB must continue apologizing for having been buggered by FBI. It’s like the guy Cheney shot in the face.

    All those witnesses who saw missile contrails going up to the plane should also apologize.

  40. ‘It seems to me that there is a determination to put the lid back on this one at least until after the EU foreign ministers meeting today’

    It seems to me that there is a determination to discredit the findings of the investigation before it has taken place.

    Flightradar24 is still reporting that MH17 was cancelled and did not fly on the 17th. Note too that MH17 flew as normal on all subsequent days, which is strange.

    http://www.flightradar24.com/flight/mh17

    One of the first things an investigation will be able to do is determine the identity of the plane using serial numbers printed on key components. That wreckage is very important.

  41. Craig. From your loyal readers, 39 comments disputing your BBC-certified assertion and none in support. Plus the citation from Sofia above and the handover of the blackboxes to Malaysian authorities. Makes you seem like a governmental stooge or fool. Please use these responses to re-assess your Putin/Russiano-phobic bias before your next post. Why do you hate Putin and support Cameron?

  42. 40

  43. “sections of fuselage were being removed from the site, taken away and later returned after having been replaced or altered”

    The implication being that they are replacing original parts of the plane with fake ones in order to misdirect the investigators.

    Well, this is RIDICULOUS – they may have been conducting separate checks on a few parts of the wreckage – just to make sure, you know – independent experts today, may not be too independent – but the idea that they would have a complete, dismantled 777 with all the correct part numbers, inner characteristics etc.etc. in place for exchange…well, what do you think?

    Natalia Antalaeva of the BBC may be trustworthy, but her technical knowledge about planes may have fallen far too short in this instance.

  44. CharlieAngel

    22 Jul, 2014 - 2:39 pm

    Oh Craig, you seem to have forgotten the golden rules of the blogosphere and thus are in danger of irritating the sensitive souls who inhabit it. So just to remind you….

    1. Whatever is said on Russia Today is correct, factual and always impartial. It MUST be taken at face value immediately and never questioned.

    2. Whatever is said on the BBC is a lie. It’s a propaganda machine controlled by the elite and all it ever does is report false flags. It cannot be believed.

    3. Accidents never happen. Everything has meaning. Nothing occurs without the NWO elite being behind it. Only a fool would be so naive to believe that a load of young trigger happy battle worn men with big toys would ever fire a missile without doing the correct checks. Only sheeply believe we live in a world so simple…

    4. Following on from Rule 3, we live in a world where said elite (presumably on some secret island HQ) is so powerful and amoral that it is able to set up a civilian aircraft to be shot out of the sky and not only cover it up (easy when the BBC is under your control) but also steer every variable afterwards.

    5. Keep repeating the old mantra – cui bono. And remember, that if a bad guy benefits then he is ALWAYS responsible for it. It stands to reason. Which is why I’m worried as I got my my present job after my colleague got pregnant. I guess I must have missed sorting that one out ;)

    I’m sure there are many more rules but I am already drowning in a sea of credulity I fear….

  45. Antalaeva quotes the OSCE Observers at the beginning of her report, ”parts of the wreckage have been changed from when they first saw them”.

    At the end of her report she says ”what we didn’t know all along is where these parts were being taken now we are hearing from the international observers that these parts of the plane have been replaced”.

    Why didn’t Antalaeva quote the OSCE Observers saying parts have been ”replaced”?

    If the OSCE Observers know parts have been replaced why did they not say so?

    Is there an OSCE report or something in the media reporting parts of the plane have been carried off on trucks?

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28415769

  46. “Why would I publish lies? Don’t bother coming here, stick to TASS or Russia Today.”

    Poor show Craig, even the Kiev friendly Vice News has had to concede the the Ukrainians are killing its own citizens:

    Bombing in Sniznhe (halfway in):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=FRcMD9i8InE

    Aftermath of mh17 on the ground:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Px2rfWBW4wg

  47. English obviously isn’t Antalaeva’s first language so it’s not clear what she means by changed; changed as in altered or changed as in substituted. The implication is that parts of the wreckage that might hold important clues are either being taken away or the relevant sections, showing blast or shrapnel marks, have been cut out and disposed off.

    This post and Craig’s subsequent one were clearly going to upset “the west is always bad, anybody else is good” conspiracy theorists that seem to predominate here. Time they were hit with a bit of reality.

  48. I am definitely surprised by Craig’s sudden change of attitude…. so far he has been very careful and critic of all sources, now all of a sudden he bashes Russia, gives it 100% sure that it’s all Russia’s fault and treats of gullible anybody who still wants to see with his eyes and doesn’t believe in unsubstantiated assertions. I feel that here we have lost a valuable advocate of truth. Too bad, he becomes just one more of the many.

  49. CharlieAngel – While I appreciate your cynicism my urge is to move your eyes across the words of Guano @ 1:45pm where perhaps reason and dialectics may wash your mind clear of the lampoon that distorts your judgement.

  50. @Kempe

    English obviously isn’t Antalaeva’s first language so it’s not clear what she means by changed; changed as in altered or changed as in substituted.

    Antalaeva is quoting the OSCE Observers when she says ”changed’.

    At the end of her report she says ”replaced”.

    She says ”we are hearing from the international observers that these parts of the plane have been replaced”.

    I simply wonder why, with such important news, parts being ”replaced”, the OSCE Observers didn’t make that clear.

    Maybe it’s not important but the media will miss-quote and before you know it’s official the plane parts have been ”replaced” to hid evidence, not simply moved about while people look for bodies, valuables or scrap.

  51. The speed at which the Western media and presstitutes jumped to condemn Russia and demonise Putin because of the MH17 incident is indeed worthy of Edward Louis Bernays, the relative of Sigmund Freud and author of the seminal book ‘Propaganda’. A favourite in Goebbels library.
    We have a tale here of demonization, deceit, distraction. These are all the precursors used against Saddam in Iraq, Assad in Syria, Qaddafi in Libya and against Iran.
    It must be obvious to even the dogs in the street that there is an agenda in place here. It does not take a genius to trace the originators of these dirty trick plays, it has become rather boring to see the sheeple fall in line each time with the ‘.message’. as espoused by the puppetmasters
    If it were a court of Law the lawyers would be disbarred and the judge would have declared a mistrial.
    The proof exists as to the culprits in this sad episode, It can be found in the voice recordings from the air traffic controllers at Kiev, in the Kiev radar tracking records, in the Russian civil and military radar tracking and in Satellite images from an American satellite which was immediately overhead at the time. Including the recordings from the aircrafts black box.
    There has been so much anti-Russian hysteria whipped up by the MSM it is dumbfounding.
    Intelligent people no longer succumb to the politically correct message as issued by the compromised Western media. The BBC obviously stays on message as promulgated from Washington as does their poodle Cameron.
    For a more balanced assessment of what is going on in Ukraine and the MH17 disaster check the attached;
    http://www.vineyardsaker.blogspot.mx/

  52. nevermind, it will happen anyway

    22 Jul, 2014 - 6:10 pm

    41

    Giving the high profile of this downing of an airliner, however it was accomplished, we should expect the same rigmarole that marked the Lockerbie tragedy, i.e full reconstruction.

    If ms Antaleva thinks that one can just interchange certain parts and numbers, she is wholly mistaken, they do not fit together ala Heath- Ronbinson but there are corresponding edges, even if the plabe is ripped apart.

    This speculative BBC report seems designed to prejudge the evidence. what a schock it must have been seeing the untampered flight recorder being handed over without much fuss. Lets assume for now that the Malaysian authorities looking into the evidence don’t get nobbled by one or other diplomatic mission.

  53. @Peacewisher.”One reason, Craig, why the BBC have stopped showing it is because their agenda seems to have changed to the great palladium poisoning puzzle, and the public inquiry that is about to start. It is a “human” story, and the mmedia love to pull at our heartstrings. And yes, hats off to the persistence for justice of the wife of the former KGB agent.”

    You mean Polonium 210 .I remember that incident and the late Boris Berezovsky shouting it was Putin’s man,because the only place Polonium 210 could have come from was a Russian nuclear
    installation.More Bullshit. At the time I felt outraged at the BBC and other people swallowing that. Swallow that story you will swallow anything. For starters Israel use to produce Polonium 210 and many other countries. The US use to experiment with it on human guinea pigs. I will just throw this in, you could buy it off the internet,maybe you still can.

  54. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    22 Jul, 2014 - 8:53 pm

    CharlieAngel

    Welcome to the blog!

    If you’re hungry, be sure that the Eminences and Useful Odiots will continue to provide you with PLENTY of nourishment. :)

  55. So it’s “Russia’s doing” this alleged removal then return of aircraft parts? And your evidence for this is what exactly? The Separatists couldn’t possibly have their own agenda at all? Come on Craig you can do better than this. Whenever the subject of Russia and Putin comes up you seem to lose all your objectivity and logic and don your Cold War hat. It’s a bit embarrassing.

    Even if the Separatists did shoot down the airliner, it beggars belief that they would do it deliberately and if we take their responsibility at face value (I for one don’t) the issue is the propaganda stream and Western exploitation of this tragedy for Geopolitical purposes. All other factors – such as militia moving bits of plane about – are peripheral at best.

  56. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    22 Jul, 2014 - 10:00 pm

    OrwellianUK (NB- very silly moniker!)

    “Whenever the subject of Russia and Putin comes up you seem to lose all your objectivity and logic and don your Cold War hat. It’s a bit embarrassing.”
    __________________

    I don’t find it embarrassing in the least. My word of choice would be “entertaining”: it’s such fun to see Craig giving it to the Putin-worshippers straight between their myopic little eyes.

  57. Swallow that story you will swallow anything. For starters Israel use to produce Polonium 210 and many other countries. The US use to experiment with it on human guinea pigs.

    Is actually epsom salts left in a reactor to be bombarded for its transmutation to Polonium. It is widely used in industry for leaking away the static electricity.

    But bless the public tell them anythingium and they will conjure up images of Hiroshima in their mind.

    I will never forget the interview of a couple of NASA scientists during which one of them referred to “nuclear batteries” on board the satellites, and when the reporter asked; “nuclear batteries in orbit”.

    The second scientist slapped won the first one and said no high capacity batteries!

  58. Habbabkuk, you’re so arch, so knowing and you know heaps about others – their motivations and so on. How did you get this way? Was it some special education? Was your father a diplomat? Did you play chess at master level as a child?

    Keep up your good work. Honestly, yours are the finest comments by a crashing boor I’ve ever had the pleasure to read.

  59. You call yourself Habbabkuk (La Vita È Bella) ! and you say my Monikers silly? I’ve encountered you before and you’re a silly little troll.

    Pointing out Craig’s lack of objectivity and baseless assertions on this issue isn’t the same as being a Putin Worshipper. I know exactly what Putin is as do most posters here. Like me, they mostly are aware that Western leaders are at least as bad as he is.

  60. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !
    22 Jul, 2014 – 8:53 pm

    Is an ‘odiot’ a synonym for ‘troll’? ie an odious idiot.

  61. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    23 Jul, 2014 - 7:44 am

    “Kurringai”

    “Keep up your good work. Honestly, yours are the finest comments by a crashing boor I’ve ever had the pleasure to read.”
    _______________________

    My pleasure, Sir! And don’t worry, there’ll be lots more comments for your delectation.

    PS – are you another recent graduate of the Mary & John University?

  62. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    23 Jul, 2014 - 7:48 am

    OrwellianUK

    “I know exactly what Putin is as do most posters here. Like me, they mostly are aware that Western leaders are at least as bad as he is.”
    ______________________

    Splendid example of moral relativism, thanks!

    The silliness of your moniker has leached through to the “substance” of your comments.

  63. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella) !

    23 Jul, 2014 - 7:49 am

    OrwellianUK

    “I’ve encountered you before”
    __________________

    Did the earth move for you?

  64. nevermind, it will happen anyway

    23 Jul, 2014 - 8:49 am

    ” don’t find it embarrassing in the least. My word of choice would be “entertaining”: it’s such fun to see Craig giving it to the Putin-worshippers straight between their myopic little eyes.”

    So entertainiong to hear the frantic flippers of incognito habbakuk, our schoolmaster and private Strumbandfuehrer who got it wrong, as he back pedals from his ‘entertaining’ swim in the scum of his own making.

    Be careful….. you might drown in it.

    No evidence offered! because there is none, so, quick lets wrap the story up and ensure that the black box takes a while to decipher.

    Why would the rebells hand over the black box so freely? When they know it will hurt their stance and aims?

    Because Putin told them to do it……yalla, yalla.

  65. nevermind, it will happen anyway

    23 Jul, 2014 - 8:52 am

    Thanks for your fresh and exorting comments here on our resident pest,Kuringai and Orwellian UK, don’t expect a ‘I got it wrong’ from this wannabe, he’s a top hat prat.

  66. interesting reading http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2014/07/ukraine-caught-in-third-major-lie-magic.html?_sm_au_=iVVZ1s0PrlktP337 more on the fabricated evidence

    but since Craig Murray is SOOOOO sure that Russia sent the missile, I will stop reading all the conspiracy theories and read only CNN and BBC.

  67. “Why would I publish lies?”

    Do tell us.

    Or at least tell us where this Natalia Antalaeva of the BBC who you so trust got here information. Also, what is supposed to be the point of this unverified removal and replacement of airplane parts. Sounds like a loony conspiracy theory to me.

  68. Antalaeva is quoting the OSCE Observers.

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