The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
@Olifant
10 Nov, 2012 – 3:37 pm
The difference is not so important, but what I mean is that 2 hours drive does not exclude Mollier from being the member of CRIIRAD that is mentioned. It´s just 2 hours.
And the cut of the PDF is odd.
Found a hotel could be this one
http://location-annecy.blogspot.co.uk/2008/09/hotl-beau-rivage.html
yes. Kathy- this will be the correct way to read it.
Pink :
Just for my practice on your language (which I like very much)
Am Nachmittag vor dem Attentat bemerkte ich mit einem mulmigen Gefühl, dass wir von einer Bande Jugendlicher aus zwei Autos, auf der Route de la Chapelle,(Annecy) bzw auf dem Parkplatz beobachtet wurden. Glücklicherweise war es uns möglich, eine zweite Ausfahrt aus dem Parkplatz zu benützen. Wir bemerkten ebenso eine auffallende Gruppe sehr reicher Araber, Frauen mit goldgefassten Burkas, auf dem Parkplatz des Beau Rivages. Die Wahrheit über den Mord herauszufinden ist bestimmt schwierig.
On the afternoon before the massare I realized with a queasy feeling, that we were being watched by a band of young people in two cars. That was on the Route de la Chapelle, Annecy, or rather on the parking lot. Fortunately, we were able to took an other exit to leave the parking lot. Beside, we noticed as well a striking group of very rich arabs, women with gold boredened burqas on the parking lot of the Bau Rivage. I assume, finding out the very truth about this murderer might be rather difficult.
To me that sounds rather strange. I wouldn’t give too much on that.
I mean, I could post anything I want on this or other pages… who can proove it??
HANE!
Hmmm it would help if I was looking for the right name and not the translated name its lisbeth steinegger sorry .
Oui over at MZT posted a link to an ingénieure (sic) named Frédéric Brun who works for Areva NC.
http://reseau.journaldunet.com/membre/411689/6492120624/frederic_brun/
Lo and behold his professional career:
‘Depuis 2008 AREVA NC
Ingénieur Santé / Environnement (Direction générale)
Chargé de l’évaluation des impacts santé et environnement
Chargé de la mise en place de REACH
2001 à 2008 AREVA – COMURHEX
Cadre (Autre)
Ingenieur Environnement’
Areva NC of course is in Ugine and Areva – Comurhex is of course COMURHEX Malvési.
Now what do we know about COMURHEX Malvési? Does this put a Sylvain MOLLIER and a Frédéric BRUN together in the same company, in the same area, in the same field at the same time???
Incidentally, the operations at COMURHEX Malvési include the first steps in the production of uranium concentrate taken from mining sites into uranium tetrafluoride (UF4) for electricity companies across the globe. This transformation is carried out at the COMURHEX Pierrelatte industrial site (in France’s Drôme region), which converts the uranium tetrafluoride into uranium hexafluoride (UF6), the final step before enrichment.
I need to go back and inwardly digest that CRIIRAD information.
Anybody?
Thanks Shelock H for the translation I did find one person with the name lisbeth steinegger linked to a medical facility, as I was searching for the translated name lisbeth egger stone in the first link that is a complete red herring and should be ignored my bad 🙂
I know it may not be important but it is little more info of things seen around annecy at the time.
OMG, yes it does!
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:uR88suEmT44J:www.criirad.org/actualites/dossiers%25202007/MALVESI-justice/ca-17nov06.pdf+sylvain+mollier&hl=en&gl=uk
Ten casings under the car !
But how, if indeed true.
The car is positioned (I think previously by SAH) to see “someone” coming up the hill….not as it “appears” to be, driven in reverse, in a semi circle to escape (got the old trig out, and it can’t be achieved).
The angle of the reverse has nothing to do with the tyre marks on the opporite side of the carpark.
A. They look like a vehicle that has it’s self locking engaged and
B. The are the wrong angle.
So if there are casing under the car, where was the car at that time ? Forward of it’s resting postion most likely, with it’s nose on or nearer to the road…and in a postion to leave.
There’s more !
@Mochyn69
Regard your post acouple above…
“carried out at the COMURHEX Pierrelatte industrial site”
Now isn’t that the site that the Germans named and got really p*ssed off about as it was “suspected” of helping the Iran enrichment program ! (2007 I think).
Now there’s a thing !
“Pierrelatte” that’s the thing that made me remember that.
Posted something yesterday…or yesternight about it.
Ten casings under the car…and Mollier found infront of the car !
How ?
Easy !
The car is parked almost in the position it is found !
It is nose out, nearer the road.
There is another vehicle parked in the opporsite side of the carpark, the 4×4 (and he has arrived through the barrier, which isn’t there).
The shooter comes from the opporsite side of the road to SAH (and Mollier) closes in and fires.
See the windscreen hits.
Mollier is shot and falls…as Al Hilli sets the car to reverse.
The getaway can not be towards the shooter, but is in the direction of the “barrier” (that isn’t there).
To do this, and not to hit Mollier or importantly not in the direction of the shooter, he reverses the car “quickly” and aims to exit by the barrier (which isn’t there !) and “hopefully” get his eldest daughter, who I imagine is over to that side of the carpark.
This of course fails.
The car (after it has been stopped ny Martin) cover the casing which are near Mollier yet covered by the BMW.
Mollier’s bike is indeed in the road (as seen and stated by BM) and Mollier is in front of the reversing BMW !
The 4×4 is then either driven out from it’s position (I suspect by Brun) and followed by the motorbike (the shooter or shooter’s rider !)
The shooting of the eldest daugher is the last shooting that takes place. There is either less time to reload…or he must follow the 4×4 (as I doubt the shooter knows the area).
Comments anyone ?
@James
10 Nov, 2012 – 5:53 pm
Now ain’t it just!?!?!
So what have we got here?
2006 Sylvain MOLLIER connected to Frédéric BRUN via Areva COMURHEX Malvési and CRIIRAD
2008 Sylvain MOLLIER connected to Frédérique BRUN via Solidarité & Progrès Ugine
2012 Chevaline SAH, SM and FB all dead. Reportedly.
Are we getting closer now?
Brun would have been nice to speak with….but he’s brown bread !
The shooter would be nice to find. Yet I suspect he’s also dead.
Or sat in Marbella with a G&T awaiting a next “mission” !
Mochyn69.458 !
I think so. I do think so indeed.
Pierrelatte…is amazingly leaky. No who would use guys from there ?
Remember also, nuke smugglers get arrested, not shot !
Moch69
My last bit of the puzzle….
I think that Mollier with the help of Brun were to supply information to SAH that would possibly “delay” an attack on Iran.
I believe that this was to take place (and don’t forget, the “8th fleet” or whatever they call it, was sailing around the Gulf at that time !)
This information would counter other information produced to allow a “first strike”.
But (read Mark Golding, he’s been on the other thread but then went) the “war” was off. No need for “counter” info to be released, infact it would probably be the worst thing that could be released as it my have put pressure on ending sanctions.
So that mission was closed.
Of course it could be the opporsite away around…but nuke smugglers tend not to get shot !
I found this
http://archasse.com/forum/index.php?/topic/17-clan-du-forum/
(just look for the name SM)
I think, at least Kenneth put an end to the story! It’s def not OUR Mr. Mollier
———————
@ Mochyn: great find- but I still can’t see how you connected Mrs. Brun y Mollier.
I’ll go for a 2nd read…..
Well done Shelock.
I like “gniole” !
Is that “shots” as in “short powerful drinks” ???
The guys a catch, for sure !
The other way of looking at this is Mr “Claire” didn’t like the idea of his daugher taking up with Mr Hickville !
And the guy he hired…was rather good at his job !
But I think Mr Hickville bit off more than he could chew.
A bit of an adventure. Some cash.
And as the powers that be, like to operate at “arms length”, his contract ended.
@James
10 Nov, 2012 – 6:29 pm
Yes, I do think it could be something as big as that, not forgetting the timing of Bibi’s visit to the UN, etc., etc.,
This M. Brun is 37, so born 1975
He went to school from 1981 à 1986 ECOLE VAL FLEURI, which is in Chatou, Il-de-France, 10km west of Paris
Are we sure Mr. Brun is NOT a local from Ugine??
James, need help:
What is ginole
Who is Mr. Claire
and who the daughter of Mr. Claire
Mr. Hickville
Please translate!
😉
@Shelock H.
10 Nov, 2012 – 6:48 pm
Whatever, this Frédéric BRUN was the new kid in town in 2008. Where did he live? Who were his friends?? Who were his associates??
He is an environmentalist, so that could be a reason for him to link up with Solidarité & Progrès in Ugine at that time.
Shelock…
“gniole” roughly translated from French is a shot
A small drink
Hicksville…is like the back country of America
In German, people from the DDR way back when !
Mr Claire is Mollier’s partners father.
But !
A killing like this is something special. Hitmen kill what they get paid to kill. If Mollier, then they kill him (they may kill ohters, but why !) They have exits.
So I believe it was Al Hilli and Mollier they were to kill.
Mochyn – look at this:
http://www.ladrome.fr/uploads/media/cr_cigeet_20071219.pdf
(almost biting my nails…)
for Mochyn
http://copainsdavant.linternaute.com/membre/411689/6492120624/frederic_brun/
(this is the one they found at MZT you mentioned before and the same in my last post- I guess at least)
Pink
Lisbeth steinegger left a comment in a german blog. No proof possible whether or not this was a joke. There is one lisbeth steininger working for church and realestate in switzerland (52 years old) and another one (a young sportsgirl) in vienna, austria.
http://almabu.wordpress.com/2012/10/28/neues-zum-lac-dannecy-massaker-al-hilli-uberfuhr-mollier-mit-dem-bmw/
Mochyn.
I strongly believe that we had already deleted the areva frederic brun in the first days. This is not the ugine brun and it is not brindille. That Brun does not fit at all.
@Shelock H.
10 Nov, 2012 – 7:23 pm
Different guys then, I think. Conclusively!
Classy work Mochyn69 10 Nov, 2012 – 5:32 pm. Amazing after all this time interesting connections may still be emerging.
Of course the other frederic brun would fit better (living in front of tricastine) working for areva plus he is a keen cyclist and he has 2 children and there are 2 brun children on mathis’ facebook page. But he does not live in ugine and he hasnt got any ugine links. Perhaps somebody could link the 2 brun children on mathis fb page to “st paul trois de chateaux” ? If you succed doing that then i would say bingo. I have no time this weekend for research. Must care for my nest …
James
10 Nov, 2012 – 5:48 pm I will repeat my earlier observation: the tyre marks at the sign end of the lay-by indicate a 4 wheel drive facing OUT. If this had been Al Hilli’s which it clearly isn’t, but which the French want us to believe it is, had done a 180 degree sweep as the tyre trace suggests, it would have ended up with its FRONT into the bank. The only way it would have ended up tail in on this manoeuvre, is if at the sign end it was facing IN. This is clearly not the case. Why? Because first you can see the two rear wheels are spinning, which as you suggest indicates a locked or limited slip differential. Second the front off side wheel appears to slip as well , indicating 4 wheel drive. I am assuming the near side front doesn’t slip similarly owing to centrifugal force making that one grip more. Finally it is clear the wheel nearest the road is turning. This means it must be 1. facing out 2. accelerating fast under power (it is also possible to see what I assume is carbon contamination from the exhaust that you get on a diesel on full throttle) 3. It can be traced doing a semi circle turn that does not in any way approximate to the position of the BMW but instead appears to stop just short of the blood stains on the ground 4, the vehicle that made the tracks is NOT Al Hilli’s 5. the vehicle that made the tracks was very likely the killer’s.
Tim
Yep. I agree. That’s the 4×4 leaving, with self locking on, so still in 4×4 mode (as it would otherwise appear a two wheel drive).
Al Hilli’s car (as I stated) is indeed in reverse and has reversed, from it’s parked position, which was a few metres ahead of where it is finally pictured.
The BMW never performed a reverse semi circle. Just a revrse.
The question is why ? And I have answered that in my previous post.
ALL the French “recons” are wrong. Worringly knowingly ! That’s the problem.