The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.
Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:
the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?
The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.
Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:
Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.
There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.
But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.
The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?
@Ferret:
Also of note, Canada’s Defence Minister is married to a woman who was born in Iran and has worked as an activist on Iranian issues. Not a problem.
Ferret says:
This claim is patently false, as SAH’s wife Iqbal was Iranian, and he had visited the Iranian city of Qom as recently as late 2011.
Neither of these seemingly innocuous facts has been reported by the mainstream media.
That can’t be so. I distinctly remember tweeting about *both* of those facts in the very early days of this story, when the only sources I HAD were the MSM.
I also disctinctly remember SAH being described as an “Iraqi ‘ex nuclear scientist'” – wherever the heck that came from. But again, it had to be MSM.
I’ll try and find time to scroll back to my tweets from that time (and see what sources I gave) but that can be very time consuming, especially if/when Twitter decides to slow down.
Ferret, at 2:53pm on 2.10.12:
Well, Zalmay Khalilzad was born and brought up in Afghanistan and went to University in the USA and then moved there permanently, and he was the US Ambassador in Afghanistan for some years in the early-mid-2000s, so probably would’ve had the highest possible security clearance (though of course he was a well-known Neocon). The USA is different from the UK, of course.
The nuclear industry will have its own stringent vetting procedures. So I think – I don’t know for sure – that you’re probably right in that it is likely to depend on the individual wrt security vetting. I think if one is of foreign origin, esp. these days, of Muslim origin, one would be more thoroughly vetted than average. But you know, we are told that since ‘9/11’ and even more so since ‘7/7’, the SS and SIS have been looking to recruit (as officers and agents) people from variegated backgrounds. During the Cold War, it was obviously East Europeans and Russians, not just as agents but also sometimes as officers of esp. the SIS (eg. White Russians). The big spies were of course, public school, Oxbridge Englishmen – Philby et al! So, if there are Armed Forces and SS, GCHQ and SIS officers of Muslim origin who presumably have very high levels of security clearance, why would an individual who had been vetted and cleared not be allowed to work on defence projects? Does anyone know – I doubt there’ll be a blanket policy, certainly not officially, as that would contravene various forms of legislation. Unofficially, who knows? Maybe Aked knew stuff like this. BAE, Thales, EADS or subcontractors – there must be people reading this blog who work with these organisations and who know about these procedures.
Dopey and Ferret.
Was there any specualtion (or mention) of any of the items in the alleged DA notice BEFORE it was said to have been issued? I don’t recall any but stand to be corrected.
I could put up a claim that a DA Notice had banned any specualation over involvement of the IRA or that barmy Baptist Church in the US. I bet somebody would bite and you make a case for either being involved with a little imagination.
, Canada’s Defence Minister is married to a woman who was born in Iran and has worked as an activist on Iranian issues. Not a problem.
Yes I think it is a problem the way Canada ministers cosy up to Israel, this tiny tiny country the size of delaware PLUS the adjacent Cecil county of Maryland.
Yeah I know you lot out there! You thought Israel was trhe size of Delaware, right? No its BIG!!!
You have to include the adjacent Cecil county in Maryland to truely appreciate the size of it..
@ Suhayl
I posted a link to the MoD vetting procedures a while ago. Essentially, contractors are subject to the least stringent vetting procedures, because they must be “sponsored” by the company that they do contracting work for (and they don’t get to see the big picture anyway, just the little part for which they are responsible). In essence, it boils down to the sponsoring company saying “We have known this guy for years and he is reliable,” plus the contractor filling in a self-completion form (“Are you, or have you ever been, a member of a terrorist or criminal organization?”), plus the contractor’s name being run through the usual databases – previous criminal convictions, history of mental illness, ever been to the wrong kind of demonstration?
For full-time staff, the procedures are far stricter and involve one-on-one interviews, plus discreet questioning of the neighbours (and the postie), a full financial background check etc.
@KS
The relative size of Israel compared to certain US States and counties is off-topic. In my view, irrational references to Israel, however reprehensible that country’s actions may be from time to time, tend to derail otherwise rational discussions.
And yet it is the case that Canada’s ministers are some of the most pro-Israel that is. It is close to being a reflex. And it is in this context that you shall view this particular Iranian ex-pat, who of course is not “a problem2 because in all likelyhood she support a regime change in Iran – which of course is just nuts, because she can “support” whatever she likes, [but she shall be exposed while doing so by I, amongst others] , but it will have no bearing whatsover.
CD
2 Oct, 2012 – 3:39 pm
BTW where are the Al-Hilli bodies? Not forgetting granny – has the last name been repatriated to Sweden?
Interesting questions. Grandmother has nephews in Sweden (Yassar and Hasan al-Saffar) but surviving son (with severe mental health issues) and daughter (Pharmacy Phd, Reading) are believed to be in the UK.
***************
CD, Yasser/Yassar al Saffar is living in the UK and he is an “Executive Senior member in the Bank of England”.
Daughter Fadwa al Saffar (Iqbal’s sister) lives and studies in Reading.
****************
++++++++++++++++
@Ferret says:
This claim is patently false, as SAH’s wife Iqbal was Iranian, and he had visited the Iranian city of Qom as recently as late 2011.
Neither of these seemingly innocuous facts has been reported by the mainstream media.
+++++++++++++++
We know that they are Shias. All Shia have been Iran once upon a time. Could be one of their grandfathers of course. However, it looks like as if the Al-Saffar family is concentrated in the Arab peninsula. Most of their family members are living in Bahrein. There is a strong Shia community reigned and controlled by the Al Saffars in Qatif, Saudi Arabai. Then there is a family line in Southern Iraq, Dubai and Kuweit as well. There might be another line of the Al Saffars in Iran as well, however, it must be quite small compared to the other family branches. The centre of Al-Saffar’s family interest in the Middle East must be Bahrein.
Regarding Al Saffar central family clan in Bahrein:
Returning to the fold
Like Bonnier, Tariq Al Saffar did not assume that he would follow his father into the family business – he became a director when his uncle and company CEO passed away five years ago. However, the 43-year-old did follow a more traditional path into the business world, graduating with a BA in business marketing and communication from Perth University in Australia. He then went onto become a partner in media and communications company Fortune Promoseven when he got the call from the family.
“Generally it is a tradition all over the world that family members will become involved within the business, but for us it is who is best suited for that purpose,” he explains. “You can inherit shares but you can’t inherit a position.
“It wasn’t planned for me to become part of the family business, but when my uncle passed away I was asked to get involved. Now I have two jobs as I still work for the other company doing my old job.”
Al Saffar is one of only four family members within Mohamed Ebraham Al-Saffar, Bahrain’s top company in the consumer business. The firm distributes Proctor & Gamble products and is responsible for the day-to-day supply and sales of over 200 P&G products to stores ranging from the smallest local grocery stores to the largest hypermarkets. In fact, Al Saffar says it would be difficult to go into a family house in Bahrain which did not contain a product with the name of his family on it.
His father, Jassim Mohammed is now CEO and two uncles are directors. “They are thinking of retirement,” says Al Saffar. “Like most people, they want to enjoy the fruits of their success.” Although he is the only family member of his generation he is not assuming he will take overall control when the present incumbents stand down.
Al Saffar thinks that the regeneration of family businesses from within can be a positive thing, as long as the fresh energy is directed properly. “It’s always good to bring in new ideas, passion and excitement into a business as long as you have a clear structure in place,” he says. “The youth are eager to make changes, you just have to harness that enthusiasm in the right way. “We are now looking at the next phase,” he adds. “Do we need people in to take it forward?”
And in a business that Al Saffar himself acknowledges to be conservative, the advice he was given when he was younger was: “Tread carefully.” However, the message he would like his two children to take on would be quite different: “Make sure you enjoy what you are doing.
“It’s very important that you are getting enjoyment from whatever you are doing, then you will put your heart into it,” he explains. “That advice is not just for my children, I would say that to anyone coming into the business.”
Al Saffar also shares with Bonnier the twin goals of personal and professional success, when he looks to the future of the company. “My contribution to this business is how we can grow it, while continuing with the same name based on the same values,” he says. “However, I also want to enjoy the fruits of the business as I believe we don’t live simply to work.”
Looking to the French news now !
…and look at this. A. Have the wheels been cleaned ?
And B. Is that rear right tyre actually flat ? (0.40 / 0.41)
http://lci.tf1.fr/france/faits-divers/tuerie-en-haute-savoie-la-chronologie-des-evenements-7508217.html?xtmc=tuerie-en-haute-savoie&xtcr=10
Some more from the Al Saffar family UAE branch:
http://saffarholdings.com/
http://saffarholdings.com/en/Selected_Saffar_Investments.aspx
http://saffarholdings.com/en/About_Saffar.aspx
@Dave Brooker re: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2006/jan/08/iran.observerpolitics
The zirconium shipment did reach its destination. The article states that the zirconium was allowed to continue on its way because it didn’t need an export licence. So, this shipment was a success, not a failure.
See discussion of same in previous thread.
@Bluebird: Bahrain. Thought so.
@ peter
2 Oct, 2012 – 4:29 pm
Peter that’s not correct. To get access to the likes of Sellafield for example, you need high level security clearance. You need to be sponsored in the first place yes, but the application process DOES include one to one interviews (with a psychologist or a shrink involved) and full background checking as to your leanings, habits, finances etc.
From what I can recall (going back to ten years ago) there were three levels of security clearance. Sellafield/nuclear sites required the top level. This wasn’t just for contractors- it was for anyone who wished to visit the site for business reasons unescorted.
Being the kind and gentle person that I am, I don’t like the idea of “blaming the victim” any more than you do. However, the more I think about it, the better I like the hypothesis that an angry, possibly violent confrontation took place just before the murders.
Consider this: 1. We are told that SAH had lately feared for his life. A man in that situation would be tempted, perhaps not to obtain a gun, but at least to carry a kitchen knife or something like that for self-defence. 2. He took his entire family along on that outing. It is not the way that I would think, but perhaps he may have believed that there was safety in numbers, that whoever he planned to meet there wouldn’t dare to hurt him in front of his entire family. 3. We can tell from the crime-scene photos that the attack did not come entirely unexpected, that SAH tried to reverse away from his assailant(s). 4. There is that smudged stain on the BMW’s bonnet, which, at least to me, looks like a bloodstain and which is really difficult to account for. 5. More than everything else, there is the ferocious rage of the attack, the element of overkill, which doesn’t look like the doing of cool, clinical, state-sponsored killers at all to me. Previously, I attributed that apparent rage to the putative motive, some long-simmering family feud that finally boiled over in those moments, but that explanation is weak – why would one or more hired killer(s) become emotionally involved?
Conversely, if one assumes that some sort of fracas took place before the murders, IMHO many pieces fall into place more easily: SM didn’t die because he tried to stop a professional gunman from executing an entire family, he was shot because he tried to break up a fight. SAH didn’t reverse because he saw somebody *looking like a murderer* approaching his car, he reversed because he had just hit/cut somebody who thereafter ran back to his car to fetch his gun, whilst shouting “I’m going to f*cking kill you!” (remember the shouting that the daughters mentioned?). The blood on the bonnet is the killer’s, after SAH or SM hit/cut him. The killer(s) peppered that car with bullets because their blood was up, not because they had instructions from the *Centre* to waste an entire family.
Anyway, that’s just my two shekels’ worth 😉
@Nuid: It was reported in MSM that Saad al-Hilli’s wife was born in Iran. It was also reported that SAH went on a pilgrimage to Qom.
Apparently some of this information has now been removed from MSM reports.
If there is some sort of international D notice in place its not difficult to see how one could be put in place – look to the guys at the very top of the tree. Editors won’t be approached – the word will come from those running the companies at the top and will be filtered down.
Take News Corp as one example – it is this guy who is said to pull the strings at News Corp, not Murdoch. With a $3 billion stake in the company and his voting leverage he has a lot of swing. Nobody knows how the guy gathered his fortune. He’s admitted he’s a front man – a front man for who, God knows
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Waleed_bin_Talal
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/one-gun-used-in-alps-shooting/story-e6frg6so-1226471424824
“Mrs al-Hilli was an Iranian-born dentist who was brought up in Sweden. It emerged yesterday that her sister and another relative who arrived in France to help look after the daughters had asked for police protection.
Zeena, who was unhurt in the attack after lying undiscovered under her mother’s corpse for eight hours, has spoken to police and confirmed that two of the victims were her parents, but said she did not know her grandmother – who had joint Swedish and Iraqi nationality – very well.”
@ Dopey
I was referring to contractors, who usually do not have (or need) on-site access. In that sense, we are both right.
@Nuid: It was reported in MSM that Saad al-Hilli’s wife was born in Iran. It was also reported that SAH went on a pilgrimage to Qom …
Thanks Q. You’ve saved me time and bother. Twitter is refusing to search my tweet-stream prior to 26 Sept.
@Dopey: The Qom reference has completely disappeared from all news sources I have searched. I’ve only found one reference remaining to Mrs. al-Hilli’s Iranian birth. that might be gone by the time you back to the link. Who knows, it could all reappear again some day, like magic.
From earlier this year, possibly relevant to this story:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/09/us-iran-nuclear-salehi-idUSBRE83808A20120409
@ Q
Q, I haven’t posted anything about Qom. Till these threads I’m sorry to admit that I’d never even heard of Qom.
@ Peter
There’s obviously a big difference between a contractor in the sense of someone on site to lay cables/work on phone masts etc, to one who will be inside offices, have access or possible access to any sort of sensitive information.
Sellafield has a variety of “standard” companies on site as well as the nuclear side. The likes of Alderbaston I would imagine would be even more strict than Sellafield, even for contractors, and certainly for the likes of Al Hilli and his field of work.
Incidentally, at Mendip Hill (the spying site near Harrogate) local football teams from outside of Mendip who visit Mendip to play against the Mendip team need DV clearance.
* Menwith Hill DOH
“In early October, Iran seemed ready to send most of its enriched uranium stockpile abroad to be turned into metal fuel for its small research reactor. Since then, however, Iranian officials have unofficially rejected the offer.”
From: http://int.icej.org/news/headlines/qom-site-only-suited-weapons-grade-enrichment
The article is not dated, but it seems to be referring to October 2011, which was when Saad al-Hilli was reported in MSM to have gone on a pilgrimage to Qom. I’m not sure why MSM would remove references to his pilgrimage, seeing as this would be a critical time in the story of Iran’s nuclear development.
Q
SILEX then, would be what they needed….or got.
@Felix re “incroyable hasard” from 10-09-2012, 09:28 Icke’s Official Forums: “British tourists gunned down in France”
Eux, ce sont deux ouvriers maçons. Le jour du drame, mercredi, ils travaillaient dans une maison proche de l’endroit où la BMW a été retrouvée. Le dernier chalet avant le lieu du crime, face à une ferme. Et ce chalet, incroyable hasard, appartiendrait à un Anglais, un ancien de la RAF. Comme le témoin clé, ce cycliste qui a découvert la BMW avec ses occupants morts.
“And this chalet, by unbelievable coincidence, belonged to an Englishman, ex RAF.
Like the key witness, the cyclist who discovered the BMW with its dead occupants.”
Two stories that could connect some dots:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-01-02/iran-makes-first-nuclear-fuel-rod-as-it-offers-to-restart-talks.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2080968/Iran-test-fires-long-range-missile-hit-Israel-U-S-bases-military-power.html
Who could have known something about tracking ships via satellite, and who has now been connected to a manufacturer of nuclear fuel rods? None other than Saad al-Hilli, who worked for SSTL (think EV-1 and its ship-tracking capabilities in near real-time), and who met a Cezus employee in a parking lot in the mountains by pure coincidence and bad luck.