Feile An Phobail Belfast

by craig on July 30, 2013 2:05 pm in Uncategorized

The Respectability of Torture

St Mary’s University College, Thurs 1st August, 7.30pm


Craig Murray, former British ambassador to Uzbekistan, was a whistleblower who was removed from his ambassadorial post by Tony Blair for exposing the Tashkent regime‟s use of rape and systematic torture, including the boiling to death of political opponents. He has also spoken out against Central Asia‟s appalling dictatorships, regimes which are allies of the West, involved in torture and rendition, and was accused of threatening MI6‟s relationship with the CIA. Now a human rights activist, author and broadcaster, he outlines the dynamics of torture and the hypocrisy of incriminated Western governments.


My first public appearance for a while will be in Belfast on 1 August where I shall be giving a talk.  Long term readers of this blog will recall that, while my focus is largely on international affairs, the domestic political achievements I most hope to see are a united Ireland and an independent Scotland.

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  1. “Craig was allowed to speak freely and unchallenged, and the interviewer even assisted Craig in elaborating some of his points.”

    That’s not how it’s supposed to work! If some neo-con zionist were interviewed like that then there would be howls of outrage around here, and rightly so.

  2. lets wait and see before passing judgement on Craig’s performance Anon, no animals were hurt in the debate I trust. Lets wait if we can get a video or verbatim.

    What we can judge is Bradley Manning’s performance and we can compare it to other judgements. Just to remind us why he broke his contract and oath.

    This incident, as far as we can assume one of many others yet to be exposed, gave him the courage for the psychological revenge torture that followed during his three years in prison.


  3. “Ok let me try again. Yes, you are correct, competition exists. However, there is a shed load of cooperation that goes unrecognised because of the ideologic promotion of unforgiving competition. This ideology misrepresents reality to covince you to accept greed and war as ‘natural’.”

    Yes, I was agreeing with you, so was Murphy.

    The ideology through the latter part of the 20th century has been based on game theory but the rules of the game did not accurately represent nature. Thus in the Prisoner’s Dilemma the rules are set so the prisoners are kept in separate cells and can’t communicate and studies showed that it was to a prisoner’s advantage to rat on his fellow prisoner. However in the real world people can communicate in which case it is very much to the prisoners’ advantage to cooperate with each other.

    It’s all a ploy by the psychopath minority to make their methods acceptable.

  4. Anon, on Craig’s easy interview:

    “That’s not how it’s supposed to work! If some neo-con zionist were interviewed like that then there would be howls of outrage around here, and rightly so.”

    Neo-con zionists are always interviewed like that, across the whole of the BBC network.

    What’s unusual is that Craig, as a dissident, was treated to similar terms in NI. This wouldn’t have happened were Craig to have been interviewed by the BBC in Britain.

    That’s why I suggested media watchers ask themselves why it seems to be different in BBC NI.

  5. I’m beginning to understand why Murrayistas are so harshly critical of the BBC. What they want is a BBC that is well to the left, that is staffed by leftists, mostly interviews left-wing guests, and then gives them an easy ride. Only then would the BBC be considered ‘fair’.

  6. Anon – rewind. Why wonder?

  7. Phil, cooperation overarches competition between competing beings. And it’s easy to see how that is. The relationship between the two might be described as two distinct shapes within a Mandelbrot pattern – for example, siblings compete within a cooperating family; families compete within a cooperating community; communities compete within a cooperating society; and societies compete within a belatedly cooperating human civilisation.

    Whether the value of one is understated while the other is over “sold” probably depends on what your chosen political readings are.

    But convincing people of the value of cooperation in a world full of liars and cheats, with a very long history of dispossessing people of the products of their labours, is a harder “sell” than convincing them of the value of competitive self-interest which is one of our first experiences in life.

    That’s because cooperative self-interest requires some surrender of competitive self-interest, so there must be sufficient trust that one’s self-interest is best served in the exchange. That’s not an easy sell when nobody owes you, me or anyone else their ‘trust’.

  8. Anon, the BBC has been aiding an abetting a ring of of paedophiles for years, including some who they have yet to discover.

    A monolith full of itself, it is akin to our local councils, indeed they are chiming in unison on many issues these days, using each other as crutches for their wretched arguments.

    Defending them, when the time is overripe with need for reform, is futile, only a vested interest could assume such ludicrous stance, or someone who is blind, deaf and mute.

  9. Thank you FJ (& Co) for outing all these devils like jake wallis,robin lustig,etc all masquerading under prim accents and faked sincerity, but all classic robert maxwell types nonetheless. The muzzies I know tell me one day even the stones and trees will inform when such devils are “masquerading” behind them !!

  10. Thanks for posting the Collateral Damage video again, Nevermind. I’m sure we can all agree that it shows evidence of a heinous war-crime.

    But I am wondering what, other than the events shown in the video (which were already public knowledge) Bradley Manning and Wikileaks have actually achieved other than to dump a load of classified material online, the overwhelming majority of which is mundane and of little interest or consequence.

    I really struggle to find anything patriotic or heroic about what Manning did – though the release of the video by itself might have led me to think that way. I find Edward Snowden’s revelations about spying on the communications of ordinary citizenry to be of far greater importance, though, as I noted in a previous post, he made a major mistake in leaking details of US spying on foreign governments, which is to be expected from any intelligence service, and which has allowed him to be cast as a traitor

  11. Jon

    I think it’s probably much more straightforward. NI really is different. Govt dirty tricks are the day and daily norm in NI, and yet more and more emerges through official investigations all the time.

    People are well used to it, and expect nothing less.

    There’s nothing to gain by attacking Craig. On the contrary it would be counter productive.

    Best BBC strategy in the circumstances is to be nice to Craig and pretend the BBC are good guys too.

    Had the BBC wanted to do a hatchet job, Noel would have done the interview. He was plucked from relative obscurity in the back rooms for, shall we say, the more challenging interviews…

  12. Hi Mark.

    RE your SAS contact operating out of Dubai.

    I was wondering if you could answer a question about your contact. Obviously, not wishing to put him in any danger, I wouldn’t want you to give a name or any personal details, so feel free to use a pseudonym such as “BravoTwoZero” and redact any details that might implicate or expose other operatives.

    My question is, are you talking out of your arse?

  13. Jon

    I should have said that I certainly take your points more generally.

    The other thing about NI is that because it’s a divided society there’s a kind of internal balance of power effect at work. It’s difficult for BBC NI to construct an overall narrative as they do in Britain, since so much is contested and contested quite vigorously and vocally.

    This is similar to the situation that existed in Britain up until the late 1980s, and I think media did a much better job in representing difference in those days.

  14. Anon, alright, if your 1:03pm post is genuine (I’m afraid I really can’t decide):

    My above assessment of the BBC (or any media outlet) was not that it should all be “leftist” – I think it should express all shades of popular, well-informed opinion. I would have thought that you would be in favour of my casting doubt on conspiracy analyses of media output, in any case?

    How the media should work is complicated, and given the economics, the ideal system is hard to achieve. Over-reliance on advertisers slides towards treating the audience as consumers, and risks treating global corporations with excessive deference; public funding has the same effect but with the government being given an easy ride instead. It is possible that a better solution would be micro-financed and operate like Wikileaks, but I don’t know whether that model is sustainable.

    I think the work of Herman and Chomsky, Media Lens and the Glasgow Media Group are well worth consideration in understanding the dynamics of disseminating “acceptable” ideas as well as thinking about how culture is shaped. I recommend “Will the revolution be televised?” by John Molyneux – a Marxist analysis that should be of interest for socialists and non-socialists alike.

    There’s a lot of propagandist components of the BBC, but I take the view that most of it is a feedback loop from existing culture, rather than a specifically state-engineered system of thought control. The hype around the royal baby and the Queen’s Jubilee are psychologically reassuring expressions of tribal belonging and subconscious cultural superiority, despite the trail of murder and pillage that such a system represents. I’m firmly anti-monarchy, but I’m in agreement with Craig that the Queen is probably quite a decent person given her upbringing.

    The royal baby stories I think could have been reasonably balanced with discussion shows and documentaries critical of the monarchy, reflecting the 20% of Britons who would like to see the back of it. But part of the problem in commissioning such a piece is that, rather like criticising “our boys in battle”, it does not do so well for editors’ careers, or that it feels too anti-establishment in a polite, refined, middle-class environment like the Beeb. If we could redress this sort of imbalance I wonder if some people would lend their political support to war, poverty, capitalism, monarchy etc much more critically, rather than in the ways they do now.

  15. The BBC is institutionally infested with an alliance of cohens and boadens, each side plugging the others agenda. Its that simple, rantzen scratching saviles back and savile in turn advising the israeli cabinet!

  16. Anon – No.

  17. Herbie claims:

    “Neo-con zionists are always interviewed like that, across the whole of the BBC network.”

    I’m afraid I don’t see it like that. What you want is for neo-con zionists to be torn to shreds and “dissidents” to be given an easy ride. Anything else is evidence of bias in your warped view. The right accuses the BBC of left-wing bias and the left accuses it of right-wing bias, so it must be doing something right. On Israel/Palestine, you lot call it the ‘ZBC’ and on right-wing sites they call it ‘Al-Beebera’.

  18. Anon

    The evidence of BBC bias in favour of Israeli policy is clear for all to see. There was a time up until Mark Thompson took over when even the BBC could not fail to highlight the occasional injustice against the Palestinians, but that all changed after Mr Thompson’s visit to Tel Aviv.

    Only a fool or liar or both would claim that the BBC is left wing or pro Palestinian today. It hasn’t been anything like that since 1987, and up until then only by way of balance.

  19. Anon – if you can extricate yourself from your left-right bubble you may gain some insight in geo-politics esp. as regards to proxy warfare and combat.

  20. Thanks for quoting Molineux Jon, and for advancing the arguments for reform.
    Understanding the BBC has taken many of us decades, its not about that anymore.

    In an age of dubious information gains a truly public broadcaster should be seen to be above board, just as a tax inspector asked for a paper trail, the BBC should be accountable for each and every penny of their expenses, without prompting, in within the latter two words hinges the crux of the affair, TRUST, it has bee eroded exponentially and criminal activities have become part of it., so time for reform is overdue, imho.

    In the age of managing consent, an institution as the BBC, exposed to various propaganda channels for years and integrated with this Countries secret services, has become remote from its public broadcasting brief. I dispute that it is in the public interest to ‘slew and spew’, to say it mildly, whatever is presented by the western media barons and lobby groups. After decades of ‘not much change at all’ the BBC has become nepotistic in its staffing and in its allegiances, not at all independent or pro public interest, unless we meant to understand the establishment view being presented as public interest.

    I’m not surprised that you don’t think it being patriotic to expose one’s own countries atrocities to those who regularly fed BS by eyewasher’s, apologists and proponents for any type of heinous crime.

    You will just have to live with your own views Anon, and for the sake of your mental senity, I very much that you are still able to change your mind when you see that facts overwhelming, relevant and appropriately addressed.

    Why live like a turnip?

  21. ‘ meant to say ‘sanity’.

  22. Hi Jon!

    I had difficulty making sense of the excessive royal baby coverage on the Beeb. Given that the Beeb’s staff are overwhelmingly of a soft-left persuasion, and probably republican, I would have thought, like you, that a lot of airtime could’ve been given to anti-monarchy campaigners.

    My suspicion is that, given the duties of a public broadcaster, the only way the Beeb could get its message across was to saturate us with so much nauseating hype that we all felt thoroughly sick by the end of it. If you think about it, they had the whole country, monarchists and republicans alike, yelling at their TV sets, “Who the hell bloody well cares?!”

    Now if that isn’t a broadcasting conspiracy, I don’t know what is.

  23. “The evidence of BBC bias in favour of Israeli policy is clear for all to see.”

    That’s a bit like saying “Everyone knows…”.

    “Only a fool or liar or both would claim…”


  24. Mark Golding says:

    may gain some insight in geo-politics esp. as regards to proxy warfare and combat.

    Come on the weltanschauung of an asinine product of dis-education cannot flex that far, you are living in the hopes of miracles.

    Also Mark what is happening with Erik Prince these days, any news on him?

  25. Mark asks:

     “if you can extricate yourself from your left-right bubble”

    Don’t pretend to be above it, Mark. You are a left-winger, espousing left-wing views on a left-wing blog.

  26. Nevermind laments

    “You will just have to live with your own views Anon”

    Is this the best you can do in response to the points I addressed to you in my post of 1:18 pm.?

  27. Anon, if I agreed with:

    ‘That’s a bit like saying “Everyone knows…”.

    “Only a fool or liar or both would claim…”


    that would make two of us wrong. Quite clearly the BBC is owned by the Neocon/Zionists or it would give balanced reports rather than portraying Palestinians, Iraqis, or other predominantly Muslim people as aggressors and the real aggressors Israel and the US as goodies. When I was young at the matinee cinema cowboys were portrayed as goodies while indians (native Americans were portrayed as baddies. When the cavalry came an appreciative roar went up in the cinema. You need to grow up to learn that the indians were the goodies and the cowboys were stealing their land. The cowboys are still stealing the land of other countries with more powerful weapons. You are clearly on the cowboys side, and therefore need to grow up!

  28. “Quite clearly…”


  29. Don’t come that Anon. Quote the sentence.

  30. Sorry you must know where Anon (aka Giles)is coming from, before engaging, otherwise you will end up talking yiddish too !

  31. I don’t believe the sentence is correct. Anyone with half a brain can see its nonsense!

  32. Anon. You accuse people of making wishy washy statements and make them yourself.

    “Anyone with half a brain can see its nonsense!”

  33. By the way not only is the sentence “correct” but the comment too!

  34. Er, yes John. Well spotted.

  35. doug scorgie

    3 Aug, 2013 - 3:18 pm

    Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)
    2 Aug, 2013 – 10:26 pm

    To Doug Scorgie:


    What current legislation is that Habbabkuk? You don’t say for some reason.

    Stop and question: police powers
    A police officer has powers to stop you at any time and ask you:
    • what you’re doing
    • why you’re in an area and/or where you’re going
    However, you don’t have to answer any questions the police officer asks you.


    Habbabkuk, the border agency officers have no more powers than the police.


    What you say there is racial profiling on the bases of random checks not on reasonable suspicion of wrong-doing. That is what makes it illegal.

    The police and the Border Agents do not have the right to demand identification unless they suspect that someone is committing an offence or they believe they have committed an offence.




    What would make the police believe that the people being asked to identify themselves had committed an offence? Being black? Is that what you call reasonable suspicion?


    Yes but that does not include having to identify yourself to the police if they have no reasonable grounds to demand you do so.


    So do I Habbabkuk, but you fail to answer what I said. Would it be the anti-immigrant propaganda by the government aided by the right-wing MSM that is making it a matter of public concern?

    The Daily Mail: Propagating misinformation about immigrants.
    On Monday 14 Feb, the front page of the Daily Mail pronounced: ‘Thousands of illegal workers claiming benefits: Loophole in the law costs taxpayers millions’. But by Thursday it became clear that this wasn´t a real expose of ‘welfare abuse’ rather another cynical attempt to propagate misinformation about immigrants.


    Don’t be stupid Habbabkuk. The above is merely one example of many that you can find regarding the negative attitude towards migrants in the MSM.


    Another scare headline for you Habbabkuk:

    “350,000 Bulgarians and Romanians ‘looking for work in the UK”


    Even if they all turned up they would be legal immigrants obeying “the law of the land.”


    Yes I have: Electioneering ploys are by nature lies whether it be on the NHS or Trident or immigration. However there is deep seated racism among many white Brits and it is an emotive subject (like sectarianism) that can be manipulated by the state to divide and rule.


    Why do you ask a question, the answer to which you must already know. In case you don’t know the answer:

    divide and conquer/rule:

    a way of keeping yourself in a position of power by making the people under you disagree with each other so that they are unable to join together and remove you from your position


    Prevention is better than cure is it not. But job cuts to Customs, Coast Guards and the Border Agency have led to an increase in smuggling, whether of drugs or people. The gates have been left unattended to save money.


    What do you not believe to be true? Prevention is better than cure or job cuts have had an adverse effect?


    Yes, and the less staff to police the situation and the removal of funding has had a detrimental effect on border control.


    The gates have been left unattended was not meant to be taken literally as I’m sure you know.


    I don’t hold that position and I didn’t imply that in my post. Please don’t misrepresent me.


    I only speak for myself Habbabkuk.

  36. Anon

    Were there any examples of BBC bias in favour of Palestinians, that you’d like to share?

    Or is it difficult to find such examples?

  37. John, if you like I’ll find you an equally dotty site, though of a right-wing persuasion, where you will find lines like:

    “Clearly the BBC is owned by the Leftists/Muslims or it would give balanced reports rather than portraying Americans, British or other predominantly Western people as aggressors.”

    In fact, I am going to post that and let you know how many recommends it scores!

  38. Herbie, the idea that the BBC is pro-Israel is a smoke-screen put about to cloud the reality – that the Beeb is not especially biased one way or the other, though individual journalists may slip up from time to time and reveal support for one side or the other. My contention is that the BBC is neither pro-Palestinian or pro-Israel, but don’t let that stop you making assumptions! And I use as evidence for my contention the fact that both sides accuse it of bias towards the other.

  39. Anon, what you use as evidence is not evidence. Just because somebody says something does not make it right. Take a look at your butchering of a sentence of mine at 3.26 pm.

  40. Stuck in a bog out East Passerby writing a memoir trying to change history. – dickhead!

  41. Exactly, John. Claims that the BBC is pro-Israel or pro-Palestinian are just hot air. Loons on both sides just can’t tolerate the BBC not conforming with their view, hence ZBC / Al-Beebera.

  42. Flaming June

    3 Aug, 2013 - 4:01 pm

    For rent.

    Driveway to accommodate two cars Monday to Friday when occupier is at work in Westminster. Near Brentwood town centre.
    Not available August/September.

    Rent negotiable.

    Cash payment only.

    Signed E.Pickles


    Second Home
    ‘On 26 March 2009, Pickles appeared on the political debate programme Question Time in Newcastle upon Tyne. While discussing the controversy over Tony McNulty (who had recently admitted claiming expenses on a second home, occupied by his parents, only 8 miles away from his primary residence), Pickles admitted he claimed a second home allowance because he lived 37 miles from Westminster and needed to leave his constituency house in Brentwood at 5.30 am in order to get to Westminster for 9.30 am, given that he tended to get home at midnight or 1 am, although the standard time for commuters from this region is usually ninety minutes. He went on to say that it was “no fun” commuting into London from where he lived. In response to Pickles’s comments that he “had to be there [the House of Commons] on time”, Question Time host David Dimbleby, replied “Like a job, in other words?” prompting amusement amongst the audience.

    There were also remarks from the audience about nurses and firemen etc. having to commute across London and get to their jobs on time and having to do without a second home.

    Pickles was asked to pay back £300 following the MP’s expenses scandal, which he had claimed for cleaning.’

    More laughter is heard from the back row.

  43. This is an urgent message for Mark Golding.

    Mark, my sources have confirmed that 100, 000 British troops are on the Israeli border with Syria, preparing for a full-scale land invasion. As they used to say when I was at Hereford, ‘Who Dares, Wins’, and it seems like the boys are up for it. I can confirm that this information is from a top-level source here in Dubai with whom I have established channels of communication by posing as a barman at the ******* Hotel (sorry for the redaction, Mark, but I can’t risk losing my sources). I will keep you updated as events proceed.

    Repeat: 150, 000 American troops on Iraqi border with Syria.

    Stay safe.


  44. 100,000 British troops, 150,000 American troops… ermm… which one is it?

  45. Flaming June

    3 Aug, 2013 - 4:21 pm

    Pickles used to claim £18k-£19k for ‘staying away from London costs’ 11-12 years ago. Now £4k+.

    Interesting. Reined in. Perhaps he had abandoned the second home unless he is camping out on College Green.


  46. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    3 Aug, 2013 - 4:42 pm

    Too many players makes for a complicated game.


    “The American leaks have raised concerns among some observers in Israel that Syrian President Bashar Assad would be unable to refrain from responding to the attacks due to the embarrassment he would incur.

    “The mere fact that such leaks happen often indicates that the Pentagon leadership does not have Israel’s interests at heart,” Prof. Efraim Inbar, director of the Begin-Sadat Center for Strategic Studies at Bar-Ilan University, told The Jerusalem Post. “It is difficult to assess the motivation of such leaks.”

    Inbar listed several possible motives, including the wish to prevent future Israeli action.

    Other possibilities include an attempt by Pentagon sources to embarrass US President Barack Obama, by pointing out the “ease” with which Israel allegedly operates in Syria at a time that the White House says US intervention is too complex and risky.”

  47. Anon “Claims that the BBC is pro-Israel or pro-Palestinian are just hot air.”

    You live in another world from me. When Billy 16 pints called Israel’s response in killing something in the region of 1,000 Yemeni civilians as revenge for the killing of some 6 Israeli soldiers “disproportionate” Israeli sponsors withdrew donations to the Tory party to bring them, and their main propaganda station (the BBC), back into line. It’s been like that ever since.


  48. 1, 000 Yemeni soldiers?

    William Hague isn’t the BBC, John.

  49. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    3 Aug, 2013 - 4:55 pm

    There is almost no mainstream outlets discussing Takfiri, other than Press TV. Google takfiri.


    “The Saudi-backed Takfiri ideology is designed to safeguard the interests of the United States and Israel by causing division in the Muslim world, a political analyst tells Press TV.

    Massoud Shadjareh said on Tuesday that the Takfiri ideology is designed to “get Muslims” to fight and kill Muslims.

    He pointed to bloodletting in Iraq since the US occupation in 2003, saying that the Takfiri ideology “was actually a deliberate policy to create this conflict, so the United States, as the occupier, will actually not be the main target and you will get this sort of internal fighting within Iraq.”

    “Many think tanks in the United States … including the RAND (Research and Development) Corporation have been arguing that one of the ways to deal with the rise of political Islam is to, actually, have these different aspects of political Islam [to] fight one another,” Shadjareh pointed out.

  50. B2Z civilians or soldiers – makes no difference to Israeli’s and Yanks. Yep, the government media outlet is the BBC. Don’t you guys ever watch it?

  51. Anything that’s amassing is on the other side of the country, rather than the south. Turkish and Syrian troop movements nearer to their respective borders, the siting of Patriots on the behest of NATO, all points to a northern flagration.
    troops amasing in Syria


    This will be additional to a southern attack/false flag, provocation of sorts by our Muslim brotherhood and Al Nusra friends and then some, as some troops seemingly have become ‘free’ as MNF-1, the remnants of NATO’s multinational force has to leave Iraq by 31.July 2013.

    And just to ensure that we know who is putting pressure on for radical action in the middle east and the biggest bully of all, this from Derfner


  52. Flaming June

    3 Aug, 2013 - 5:39 pm

    Twitter’s UK Manager Tony Wang responds on the abusive messaging.




    Stella Creasey MP is not very impressed with the response.

  53. “Yep, the government media outlet is the BBC. Don’t you guys ever watch it?”

    I don’t have a TV myself.

    I saw their Power of Nightmares documentaries on the net.

  54. Flaming June

    3 Aug, 2013 - 5:48 pm

    An excellent essay on the duplicity of B.Liar.

    Tony Blair: Libya, Lockerbie, Arms and Betrayals

  55. well, except, and I hereby correct myself, the 180.000 still left in Iraq, have been reprieved by the devil Bolton himself, for another year.


  56. Congratulations to President Rouhani of Iran, starting in his job today, his first few words setting out a more transparent and trusting agenda.


    The response is crucial, because Iran wants to see sanctions dismantled one by one. They are also adamant that they will not stop their research and enrichment. Now contrast this with the rabid responses of nuking desert locations, just that little bit away from inhabited area’s in Iran, with a cynical inevitability thrown in for good measure. Hard liner’s in Israel are calling the shots and it is inevitable that for change to happen these attitudes have to be tackled head on.

    Their views are not acceptable! And the shady ‘Macher’ fanatics, who are always there to fan the paranoia, spread some fear and loathing in this rogue country, to manage and direct its electorate, have done this for decades, an escalating fact, not something anybody has control over, not the US, NATO or the UN.

    So what is to be done? follow thy mad psychopath into global Armageddon? or set out condition on the back of the current peace talks between Palestinians and a belligerent Israeli Government which can not be broken.

  57. BrianFujisan

    3 Aug, 2013 - 6:29 pm

    Aye Fedup

    just a couple of years ago i caught up on the horrific u.s. uk war crimes in Dresden

    “You guys burnt the place down, turned it into a single column of flame. More people died there in the firestorm, in that one big flame, than died in Hiroshima and Nagasaki combined.” –Kurt Vonnegut, J

    On the evening of February 13, 1945, an orgy of genocide and barbarism began against a defenseless German city, one of the greatest cultural centers of northern Europe. Within less than 14 hours not only was it reduced to flaming ruins, but an estimated one-third of its inhabitants, possibly as many as a half a million, had perished in what was the worst single event massacre of all time.

    The death toll was staggering. The full extent of the Dresden Holocaust can be more readily grasped if one considers that well over 250,000 — possibly as many as a half a million — persons died within a 14-hour period, whereas estimates of those who died at Hiroshima range from 90,000 to 140,000

    If ever there was a war crime, then certainly the Dresden Holocaust ranks as the most sordid one of all time.

    AND THE Hamburg Fireboming

    On July 24, 9PM the allies bombed Hamburg with high explosive, incendiary, phosphorous and napalm bombs. The resulting firestorm was so powerful that buildings would have flames reaching over 20 feet high.
    ‘With hurricane force, 150 mile per-hour winds were sucked into the oxygen vacuum created by the fire, ripping trees out by their roots, collapsing buildings, pulling children out of their mothers’ arms. Twenty square miles of the city centre burned in an inferno that would rage for nine full days. … The temperature in the firestorm reached 1,400 degrees Fahrenheit. There was no oxygen to breathe; whatever was flammable burst spontaneously into flame.’

    Air Vice Marshall Harris stated, “In spite of all that happened at Hamburg, bombing proved a relatively humane method … there is no proof that most casualties were women and children.” German records indicate, however, that 29,000 of those killed were women (21k) and children (8k), the other 13,000 were men.

  58. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    3 Aug, 2013 - 6:47 pm

    Yeah, Brian. Dresden was a war crime. It was pure revenge. General Curtis LeMay get credit for that and complicity in the murder of JFK along with Dulles et al.

  59. “The full extent of the Dresden Holocaust can be more readily grasped if one considers that well over 250,000 — possibly as many as a half a million — persons died within a 14-hour period”

    According to Wiki:

    “In March 1945, the Nazi regime ordered its press to publish a falsified casualty figure of 200,000 for the Dresden raids, and death toll estimates as high as 500,000 have been given. However the city authorities at the time estimated no more than 25,000 victims, a figure which subsequent investigations, including one commissioned by the city council in 2010, support.”


    [Mod/Jon: Anon, please stick to one handle]

  60. BrianFujisan

    3 Aug, 2013 - 7:09 pm

    Evil Bastards were at it in North Korea too

    Besides rape, the Pentagon was firebombing North Korean cities more intensively than any of those it firebombed during World War II. Where it was typical for U.S. bombing to destroy between 40 and 50 percent of a city in that war, the destruction rate in North Korea was much higher: Shin Eui Ju, on the Chinese border, 95 percent destroyed; Pyongyang, 85 percent; and Hamhung, an industrial city, 80 percent.”By the end of 1951, there weren’t many bombing targets left in North Korea.”


  61. “Yeah, Brian. Dresden was a war crime. It was pure revenge.”

    It was seen as a crime by the people of Britain at the time, airmen who served in Bomber Command were not given campaign medals.

    It wasn’t pure revenge, we were fighting a war, it’s just that by this time it wasn’t Germany we were fighting it was Russia.

  62. Thank you Brian Fujisan for reminding people of the madness of Bomber Harris and the futility of mass bombing as a political tool.
    My home city of Hamburg was turned to rubble, providing young nevermind with bricks to clean by the thousands, it was a far better option than to play amongst the rats a foot long. That he lost thousands of his airmen because of his policy did never enter his mind, nor did the fire bombing of Hamburg or Dresden. My granddad wept when he was shooting at the aircraft, he told me so, his words were ‘like shooting at chickens in a cage’.
    When he saw the aircraft flying overhead and made visible by powerful lights and their own ‘christmas trees’ phosphorous bombs falling on the City.

    Hamburg has had some targets, U boat bunkers at Blohm and Voss and Howald, but they were mostly located around the harbour, why Barmbek, a part of Hamburg was bombed, when there was sweet FA, a purely civilian area is inexplicable and callous.

    The Madness that is war

  63. Flaming June

    3 Aug, 2013 - 7:16 pm

    Peres’ 90th Birthday ZBC tribute.

    I did not see it. Switched off guessing what it would be like. John Hilley on Medialens links it here.

    Newsnight on Peres ‘the dove’
    Posted by John Hilley on August 3, 2013, 11:11 am

    A truly grovelling piece from the appalling Lyse Doucet, celebrating the Zionist veteran and indulging the ‘Peres peace persona’.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b037yp9q/Newsnight_02_08_2013/ (20.25 in)

    Classic BBC hagiography.

  64. Anon, you’re welcome to give a serious answer to my post, addressing the points I raised, if you wish to join in.

  65. Flaming June

    3 Aug, 2013 - 7:32 pm

    16 arrests by Sussex Police at Balcombe. Egan of Cuadrilla is allowed to give out the propaganda.

    Balcombe oil drill protesters arrested

    Cuadrilla is not some one bit oil drilling company. It is part of a global conglomeration of AJ Lucas a giant Australian company involved in pipelines, drilling and engineering construction.
    and Riverstone LLC a private equity outfit involved in power and energy supply.

  66. “Chevron wins access to some Americans’ email data”


  67. Flaming June

    3 Aug, 2013 - 8:38 pm

    Pickles was once a director of the Conservative Party Foundation Ltd. – Functionaries, chairman, treasurers, donors etc.


    See Mark Bamford there, brother of the recently ennobled Sir Anthony Bamford, donor.

    The list of new Tory peers which takes the total number of peers to over 800 is below.

    •Richard Balfe – former MEP and Conservative Party Envoy to the Trade Unions and Cooperative movement
    •Sir Anthony Bamford DL – Chairman and Managing Director of JCB
    •Nicholas Bourne – former Leader of the Conservative Group in the National Assembly for Wales
    •Matthew Carrington – former Conservative MP
    •Daniel Finkelstein OBE – Associate Editor of The Times and former Head of Policy for the Conservative party
    •Annabel Goldie DL MSP – Conservative Member of the Scottish Parliament; former Leader of the Scottish Conservatives
    •Lady (Fiona) Hodgson CBE – campaigner on women’s issues; senior member of the Conservative voluntary Party; former Chairman of the Conservative Women’s Organisation
    •Christopher (Chris) Holmes MBE – former Paralympic swimmer; Director of Paralympic Integration at London 2012; Non-Executive Director of the Equality and Human Rights Commission; and a former Non-Executive Director of the Disability Rights Commission
    •John Horam – former MP; Conservative representative on the Electoral Commission
    •Howard Leigh – senior corporate finance professional; Conservative Party Treasurer; former Chairman and current President of Westminster Synagogue; former Trustee of Jewish Care and current Chairman of Jewish Care’s Business Group; Trustee of the Jerusalem Foundation in the UK
    •Dame Lucy Neville-Rolfe CMG – former senior civil servant, including Number 10 Policy Unit; former leading Executive at Tesco Plc
    •Sir Stephen Sherbourne – longstanding political career in Westminster and public affairs, including former Political Secretary to the then Prime Minister (Margaret Thatcher), and former Chief of Staff to the then Leader of the Opposition (Michael Howard)
    •Michael (Mike) Whitby – Conservative Councillor in Birmingham; former Leader of Birmingham City Council
    •Susan Williams – former Councillor and Leader of Trafford Council

  68. Brian, DPRK people suffered a great deal, during the MacArthur onslaught on the “commies”. There are too many mass graves of the prisoners of war who were shot dead and buried in the roadside graves the numbers of which to date are not known. Too often the blood thirsty bastards glorify the filthy business of murder and destruction, as some kin of a fucking achievement.

    Nevermind, having seen the Trümmerfrau statue in the mid town square in Dresden and having heard the fact that men were all killed, and the city had to be built by the women whom were left. The horror stories of rapes, hunger, and desolate hopelessness, which were the currency in Dresden of 1945, were all too much for my companion whom had to stop and walk away and compose herself, for her to come back and guide me to Frauenkirche. During that visit Frauenkirche was still left as it was a bombed out shell, although these days the church is rebuilt.

  69. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    3 Aug, 2013 - 9:14 pm

    @ Fedup

    “The horror stories of rapes, hunger, and desolate hopelessness, which were the currency in Dresden of 1945,..”

    Shhhhh! The rapes were carried out by Russian, not American soldiers. Don’t spoil the narrative, there’s a good Eminence!

  70. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    3 Aug, 2013 - 9:17 pm

    re new peers :

    could the frequent poster (20h38) please let us have a list of the new Labour and LibDem peers as well, please?

    thank you!

  71. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    3 Aug, 2013 - 9:24 pm

    @ Someone

    Seeing your post just now reminded me : have to taken any steps (as suggested by me) to follow up on the case of Mr Alex Cline?

    You know, the university lecturer who has apparently been charged with insulting behaviour for shouting “coward” at the local Tory MP?

    You posted on this affair a few days ago and seemed very indignant.

    Any developments? Have the magistrates pronounced?

  72. There was a discussion earlier about competition and/or cooperation and their relative merits.

    There’s quite a good presentation here of how these things work in practise:


  73. 59 Stat. 1544-1589 bloopers

    4 Aug, 2013 - 1:00 am

    Remember back when CIA sprung the honey trap on Petraeus, and everybody was fixated on the slapstick image of the little shrimp stubbing his diminutive John Thomas on the steely, hirsute loins of Zionazi warrior princess Paula Broadwell?

    One tidbit of Broadwell’s pillow talk was pretty great, but it sank without a ripple in all the clownish lust. Broadwell let drop that Bengazi was a covert detention site. Given that disappearance is a per se breach of the Convention Against Torture, Obama’s enemy-of-all-mankind rap sheet now includes, not just acquiescence to torture, in breach of Article 1; not mere refusal to investigate, in Breach of Article 12; we now have President Obama implicated, as head of the US civilian-military command structure, in perpetuating the crime against humanity of the US government torture gulag.

    The petty criminals are ratting out the big fish, and CIA is panicking. Just in time for review by the Committee Against Torture.

    Craig’s talk might turn out to be quite timely.

  74. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    4 Aug, 2013 - 1:45 am

    Fred; I really don’t have a dog in this hunt.

    My impression wrt WWII History was that Dresden was payback to the German public for the opinion of the bloodiest and most psychopathic military minds, was that they were largely supportive of the policies, or at least enabled. Those flinty foreheads won the debate on whether to destroy a non-military target. It was in fact, a symbol of pride to Germany for it’s architecture and artful culture.

    They unleashed an an ungodly tonnage of incendiary creating firestorms within the city which were the match of Hiroshima in fury and atavistic pride.

  75. @ Flaming June.

    Excellent Blair article there, worth reading. Truly the man is a case study, he never ceases to amaze. I wish I were alive in 100 years (if humanity still exists) to see the release of classified material relating to one Tony B. Liar. I’m sure it’s fascinating. I wonder how many British PM’s in history have had a classifiable mental illness? I’ve no idea what Blair’s problems are, though it’s clear they are very serious indeed, but I suspect our beloved securitat (who protect us, thanks) have covered up for more than one PM. In the national interest old boy, of course.

    And the not-invasion of LIbya remains one of the most bizarre episodes in UK history; I still don’t understand why we did it. Capitalist Deals, most likely. The editors of Pravda probably now think they didn’t go far enough …

  76. @Brendan

    the truth will out sooner than you think – a Charles Lynton aka Miranda was found importuning in a Bow Street public toilet and easily recruited by the CIA, they even paid for his college banger. Whilst wishing not to enter the cause n effect, I can foresee a new phenomenon, akin to a citizens arrest. a citizens enhanced interrogation video of kidnapped 911 and like suspects, for the whole world to plainly see the truth on YouTube. And there are many suspects who may be easily apprehended, from Sundar to Silverstein.

  77. “an alliance of cohens”, Hasbarista.

    What? Men in tall hats? Or do you have something against people with that surname?

    I always thought BBC staff overwhelmingly have been accused by the Right of being metropolitan closet lefties. An ‘alliance of luvvies’, perhaps? There was a time – the Cold War – when MI5 used to vet all job applicants for the BBC and people would be refused posts on the basis that they knew someone who knew someone who knew an ex-communist. There are structural biases and the Iraq/David Kelly/Greg Dyke de facto sacking by the intelligence services’ placewoman on the Board of Governors farrago destroyed what was left of the BBC’s independence. The Glasgow Media Group also demonstrated widespread media bias in the UK – not just in the BBC – wrt reportage of the Palestine-Israel situation. There are serious points to be made here and references to “an alliance of Cohens” are at best, distracting and at worst, racist.

    I agree with Jon’s analysis.

  78. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 8:16 am

    More on fracking and the hidden connections. We live in a system that is corrupt.

    Lord Browne of Madingley is an Agent Cameron adviser. He is also a director of Riverstone LLC, who are behind Cuadrilla with A J Lucas.

    ‘A clear conflict of interest? Cuadrilla chairman, Riverstone’s managing partner and senior government advisor are one and the same person
    August 3rd, 2013 by PCU

    Baron Browne of Madingley, chairman of Cuadrilla & managing partner at Riverstone Holdings, the venture capital firm that backs Cuadrilla, is also acting as a senior government advisor.

    The government has now issued 176 exploratory drilling licences nationwide and Michael Fallon, the energy minister, has hailed shale gas as “an exciting new potential energy resource”.’

    Nick Griffiths who is a Guildford borough councillor does the PR for Cuadrilla. On his register of interests, we merely says he is a ‘Self employed public relations consultant’. He does not give details of his clients of course. http://www.guildford.gov.uk/index.aspx?articleid=9975&lnk=45

    He used to be the lead member for the environment on the council!!

    Read here about the thousands of gallons of hydrochloric acid that will be used if fracking takes place in Balcombe. Would Agent Cameron like this happening in his Oxfordshire home or even Mr Griffiths in his home in Guildford borough? Definitely not.

  79. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 8:28 am

    The remainder of the list of new peers. You can see another connection to Israel. Mendelson* was chair of Labour Friends of Israel. Do not look for any peers with Palestinian connections though.

    Green party
    •Jenny Jones AM – member of the London Assembly; former Chair of the Green party of England and Wales and former Deputy Mayor of London

    Labour party
    •Sir Charles Allen CBE – Non-Executive Director of the London Organising Committee of the Olympic and Paralympic Games; Chairman of Global Radio Group
    •Sir William Haughey OBE – prominent Scottish businessman and CEO of City Refrigeration Holdings
    •Alicia Kennedy – former Deputy General Secretary of the Labour party
    •Doreen Lawrence OBE – campaigner for justice, race equality and better policing
    •Jonathan (Jon) Mendelsohn – business advisor and co-founder of LLM Communications

    Liberal Democrat party
    •Catherine (Cathy) Mary Bakewell MBE – former leader of Somerset County Council
    •Rosalind (Olly) Grender MBE – former Director of Communications for Shelter; former Director of Communications for the Liberal Democrats
    •Christine Mary Humphreys – President of the Welsh Liberal Democrats; former Member of the National Assembly for Wales
    •Zahida Manzoor CBE – former Legal Services Ombudsman; former Deputy Chair of the Commission for Racial Equality
    •Brian Paddick – former Deputy Assistant Commissioner in the Metropolitan Police Service
    •James Palumbo – co-founder and chairman of Ministry of Sound Group, the international music and entertainment business
    •Jeremy Purvis – former Member of the Scottish Parliament for Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale
    •Alison Suttie – former Press Secretary to the President of the European Parliament; former Deputy Chief of Staff to Nick Clegg and Election Manager for the 2010 General Election
    •Rumi Verjee CBE – entrepreneur and philanthropist
    •Sir Ian Wrigglesworth – Liberal Democrat Treasurer; former MP for Teesside Thornaby and for Stockton South

    *More on Mendelson. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Mendelsohn
    Remember Draper/Abrahams? Friend of Lord Levy. HET. New Israel Fund etc etc. I see his wife heads up Facebook’s European operations.

  80. And Jenny Jones (Green Party), and Doreen Lawrence…? I don’t agree with the British aristocratic system in the first place and the honours system is deeply corrupt – everyone, it seems, is to become a baron and to be co-opted – but Baroness Lawrence might be able to do some good now? Tokenistic? Yes, of course. And yet… Generally, people with “Palestinian connections” (by which I assume you mean those who actively support the Palestinian cause) would tend not to want to become lords and ladies of the realm. ‘Lord George Galloway’? ‘Lord Dennis Canavan’? I think not. The Israel lobby has power and inside connections, most definitely, but if out of this long list, one can find only one with strong connections to that lobby, might it not suggest that it is simply one interest among many?

  81. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 8:41 am

    Brendan I appreciate your comments but in B.Liar’s case, I do not think that psychopathy is a treatable mental illness.

  82. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 8:50 am

    Is the ‘voice of the Tory party’ and the latterly appointed energy minister off his trolley?

    Michael Fallon defends fracking comments
    Mr Fallon has described fracking as an “exciting new energy resource”

    Energy minister Michael Fallon has defended comments about fracking, in which he suggested drilling could disrupt the home lives of media commentators in southern England.

    Mr Fallon told a private meeting it would test “how thick their rectory walls are” and “whether they like the flaring at the end of the drive”.

    Visits – UAE, Bahrain, Ukraine, Cayman Islands, S Korea, Hong Kong, Syria. Egypt, etc etc.

  83. Wrt energy supplies in the real world, short of global de-industrialisation (which broadly is what India and China, Brazil et al accuse the West or promoting in their cases) what would your preferred solution be? Nuclear? Fossil? Maximising renewables? Fusion is not at the stage of being useful. All three, so the proverbial eggs are not all in one basket? All are driven by the energy industry, obviously, all have political and military implications and all except renewables have potential risks. But renewables on their own, even if maximised, could never be sufficient or sufficiently reliable for an advanced economy/society. Climate change is happening, the icebergs are metling and we all are on board a global Titanic. Is there a solution, in the real world? Or are we merely fiddling while the ship begins to plummet into the depths?

  84. Racism is the single most important issue facing UK residents because it is inscribed at the highest level. The recent Home Office stop and search measures where non-whites have been targeted is appalling. People who have been watching this creeping evil will be aware of Theresa May’s hatred of Islam. I keep banging on about this because it is coming directly from government which in the past has paid lip-service at least to anti-racist, anti religionist targeting which is supposed to be enshrined in our law. It is akin to the Nazi targeting of Jews so I ask Jewish people of moderation to stand with me on this issue. I have never witnessed anything as blatantly racist like this before and urge decent people to sign and spread this petition.


  85. “Dame Lucy Neville-Rolfe”.

    Brilliant name!

  86. Suhayl Saadi

    4 Aug, 2013 – 9:02 am

    Excellent post.

    “Or are we merely fiddling while the ship begins to plummet into the depths?”

    The ship is already plummeting into the abyss. The powers that be are just positioning themselves to make sure that they have a seat on the lifeboat.

  87. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 9:53 am

    Another Guildford Borough councillor gives this info in his register of interests

    ‘Section A: Disclosable Pecuniary Interests

    1. Details of any employment, office, trade, profession or vocation carried on for profit or gain.

    HM Diplomatic Service (part-time)’


    On Linked In he says he works P/T for Prosper HR at the FCO. It finds jobs for the old boys and girls. Not one for Craig presumably!


  88. Thanks, Someone, at 9:42am today.

  89. doug scorgie

    4 Aug, 2013 - 10:12 am

    News from USA:

    Today, Congress is considering passing bills that would not only codify discrimination against U.S. citizens, but also reward it.

    Both versions of the United States-Israel Strategic Partner Act of 2013 (S. 462, H.R. 938) include a provision for a visa waiver agreement with Israel.

    If the Senate version of this bill passes, it would give Israel the right to do what no other country in the world, that is a part of the visa waiver program, is given permission to do – allow it to continue to deny entry to any U.S. citizen, while allowing Israelis to enter the United States without a visa.

    It is outrageous that the Department of State should feel comfortable declaring publicly on their website that “U.S. citizens are advised that all persons applying for entry to Israel, the West Bank, or Gaza…may be denied entry or exit without explanation” and specifically notes that “U.S. citizens whom Israeli authorities suspect of being Arab, Middle Eastern, or Muslim origin may face additional, often time-consuming, and probing questioning by immigration and border authorities, or may be denied entry,” while Congress considers rewarding Israel for this discrimination.


  90. doug scorgie

    4 Aug, 2013 - 10:25 am

    War and Whistleblowers – Why Bradley Manning Should be Free
    Friday 9 August 7pm
    Hilda Porter Room, TheWesley
    81-103 Euston Street London NW1 2EZ
    (2 minute walk from Euston Station)
    For updates see: http://bit.ly/19ztF9N

    Tariq Ali writer and activist, Peter Tatchell human rights campaigner
    Norman Solomon US author and activist, Kate Hudson CND
    Chris Nineham Stop the War Coalition

    Norman Solomon, will speak at the meeting on his way from the USA to present to the Nobel committee in Oslo a petition with over 100,000 names calling for Bradley Manning to be awarded this year’s Nobel Peace Prize.

    Read more:
    • Norman Solomon: Why Bradley Manning deserves the Nobel Peace Prize http://bit.ly/13vmjNi

    • Owen Jones: What would be the ultimate show of gratitude to Bradley Manning? http://bit.ly/15uKa2U

    • John Pilger: We have all been made witnesses to crimes against humanity http://bit.ly/12Xs5gn

    • Gary Younge: If Bradley Manning is an enemy of the state then so too is truth http://bit.ly/15wKpKr

  91. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 10:25 am

    Hakluyt is also mentioned on that FCO Association link.

    Hakluyt avoids publicity, but is regarded as having a reputation for discretion and effectiveness among its client base. Hakluyt was founded by former officials of the British Secret Intelligence Service (MI6).


    What a stinking rotten country I was born into. No wonder I hate it now.

  92. “What a stinking rotten country I was born into. No wonder I hate it now.” Flaming June.

    The UK is certainly a deeply imperialist entity and so entities like Hakluyt are nothing new. I think you’ll find, however, that most countries engage in such covert arms-dealing operations; we are simply one of the biggest arms-manufacturers/dealers in the world. There’s no point hating the place you live in. To feel down about, and to oppose, certain aspects/power-structures/policies is one thing. But to hate the country in its entirety suggests something different.

    Wrt Britain, I like, eg. Tom Paine and Barbara Castle, Wat Tyler and the Diggers/Levellers, Aneurin Bevan, and the unnamed millions who gave their bodies and minds in the protracted struggles that allowed us to at least be able to conceive of such things. The tide will turn. Meanwhile, keep the midnight lamp burning.

  93. Survey reveals poor WWI knowledge

    Get ready for it folks. We are being set up, as any three card trick con artist sets up his mark.

    (19%) thinking Britain declared war in August 1914 because Germany invaded Poland – as was the case in 1939 – than Belgium, chosen by 13%.

    The same number (9%) thought that Winston Churchill was prime minister at the start of the 1914-18 conflict as correctly chose Herbert Asquith. Fully 1% of the 1,955 adults quizzed by YouGov for thinktank British Future – and 7% of those aged under 24 – even told the pollsters that Margaret Thatcher was PM in 1918.

    Shocking isn’t it? Oh yes it is!!

    But fear not, the cure is at hand. The upcoming four years of celebrations of the gigantic fuck up murder fest will sort out the “knowledge” deficit. Never mind more that half of the population are living on the edge of poverty and homelessness, but hey there is enough in the budget to set aside for the up coming four years of celebrations, and sending every school kid on the battle field tours.

    Do they fucking take the population for chumps? Of course they fucking do.

    Lessons for the carpetbaggers buy bus companies.

  94. Thanks for the that advert Dougie, shall give it a miss, just not sustainable to cart myself to London for a bit of hot wind that is a foregone conclusion to me in any case.

    Bradley Manning should be freed, that he is not an officer should not make any difference.

    The US justice system and its military aberrition is now on trial, if he gets more for his petulance than someone who ordered mass murder, then US justice is going backwards in the 21st. century, however much they claim to be libertarian and progressive with regards to equal rights bills and the decriminalisation of pot in some states.

    If Bradley Manning gets more than seven years, and is not freed soon, then the US does not deserve ICC justice, never mind their childish rejection of it.

    Who would want to dally with a regressive regime that is sliding into Dredd land, as in judge. I listened to the feeble excuses and weak condemnations from the west regards Mugabe’s wholesale election rigging, that’s how much we value their bloddy bling democracy, diamonds ‘ueber alles’ says uncle Barclay, nothing will stop us trading with tyrants if they have diamonds….

    How can a country that is in shackles to its military industrial owl worshippers survive with society falling apart under their plate sized eyes?

    Thanks for the Haklyt link FJ, another outfit that will take a vital part in Orwell’s 1984 scenario.

  95. @Ben

    No, it wasn’t revenge on the Germans it was a warning to the Russians, as was Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

    Germany was already beaten, they were beaten by the Russians at Stalingrad. Russia was ready to take all of Europe into the Soviet Union then Japan as well, coming into the war at the end to take the spoils. Japan was already beaten when they dropped the bombs, they didn’t have enough fuel to put a plane in the air. The bombings in Japan and Germany had nothing to do with the ending of WWII, they were intended to start the Cold War.

  96. I see that Sunday Times has an interesting story on Gulnara Karimova aka Googoosha today.

  97. So Flaming Mary hates her own country and its people – Good for her!

  98. As someone who has worked with Jenny Jones LAM, and her daughter, slept on her Camberwell pad’s floor, I’m somewhat surprised what the power structure has done to her.

    Not only did she agree to the BBC bias against an Independent candidate for mayor, despite having been at the receiving end of same bias for two decades against the Green Party at every election, she now appears to have been subsumed by the trappings of power, perks and London waging.

    I’m aghast that she should even contemplate accepting a peerage, on the other hand it is merely another manifestation that the Green Party politicians are no different, their on organically sourced carpets are flying on hot air and I have yet to see Norwich or Brighton’s Greens implement their own policies, not even pilot projects.

    gaining electoral office is their highest goal and its supporters are rightly demanding more of them than just recycling, Norfolk is under performing on this issue, they want to see their transport and housing policies implemented. What is becoming more apparent with every new candidate is, that their moral high horse is a Shetland pony for real, they have lost their radical roots and are more likely to follow career political aims, than base democratic issues that serve their electorate and or sustainable living.

  99. @Jemand,

    I should think “hating one’s country”, if this dynamic can be reduced to that, is a common enough dilemma amongst leftists. We should not trivialise it, and we should instead strive to understand it, and be understanding of the people who it affects – as Suhayl does above.

    @Flaming June, @Jemand,

    In my twenties I would remark that the Union Jack ought to be burnt wherever it stood, as for me then it was an unrecoverable symbol of the far right and imperial conquest. But now, despite my persistent suspicion of flag wavers, I see that it holds many meanings for many people, and we should not assume that hijackers like Blair and Griffin have successfully “taken” it.

    This phenomenon has common cause with distaste for aggressive/racist nationalism, which is the other side of the same coin. Some people are afflicted with the sense of cultural or racial superiority I mentioned in an earlier comment, and the Left’s decent distaste for that can sometimes be expressed as the notion that one’s people and country can do no right.

    Orwell explored these themes in The Lion and The Unicorn – despite his failings, I rather warmed to his championing a gentle British patriotism, which celebrated a country of “coupon snippers” and people following their “quiet pursuits”. It was a plea not to throw the pride baby out with the nationalist bathwater, and I recommend it to anyone who’s not read it.

    On the same theme, I quite like thinking that, despite their power, it is the violent imperialists who ought to feel alien in the countries they occupy. That psychological process offers some healing for ordinary people who are angry about what is done in their name.

  100. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 1:54 pm

    I did not say I hate the people Jemand. I just hate the rotten secretive system that controls our lives.

    My name is Mary btw but I wish to be known as Flaming June. You know that very well and the reason for changing my ‘handle’ so please stop your nonsense.

    Thanks for your comments Jon and Nevermind. Appreciated.

  101. Hasbarista,

    The muzzies I know tell me one day even the stones and trees will inform when such devils are “masquerading” behind them

    Ah, I think I’ve encountered this oblique reference before. It is from the Koran, I think, where it says that even the stones and the trees will cry out “Oh Muslim, servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him”.

    I have two problems with this. Firstly, in taking an ancient text literally and out of context, you believe you have found support for anti-Jewish narrative where none exists. As I’ve said to fundamentalist readers of Islamic holy texts, the context of the time (perhaps during war?) is being ignored here.

    Secondly, if Judaism is so abominable to you, why do you quote the Koran? Is one religion better than the other? If so, why? I would have thought both should be treated with caution, especially where Israel/Palestine is concerned.

    Whilst on the topic, are you yourself religious? I think we might achieve more if you were to come and discuss things, rather than making vague, racially charged allusions – I think your comment above had absolutely zero effect here. So, tell us about yourself. And do you hold out hope that, in the context of US/Israel power structures, peace in the ME can be achieved? What do you make of Jewish people who are sympathetic to the plight of the Palestinians?

  102. “I’m aghast that she (Jenny Jones) should even contemplate accepting a peerage”

    She’s following the logic of the elite political system. I’d imagine she simply thinks, better to have a Green voice, than not.

    Like many others, she’s been captured and shall be ritually exhibited as testament to our most wondrous diversity.

    The Greens may have decided that grassroots activity will not produce the electoral advancement necessary for a movement to emerge, preferring instead an occasional siren voice in media.

    Perhaps they were purely a media creature.

    Anyway, worth catching Ed Herman on “Manufacturing Consent” 25 Years Later:


  103. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 2:57 pm


    Homeless: More Young People Sleeping Rough

    Statistics show more young people are being forced onto the streets as a new theatre play shines the spotlight on the crisis.

    Sunday 04 August 2013

    Video: Homeless Crisis Under The Spotlight

    As statistics show more young people are becoming homeless in the UK, a new play questions why more is not being done to help those forced onto the streets.

    Government figures show the number of people sleeping rough in England has increased by a third since 2010.

    In London alone, 6,437 people slept rough during 2012-13, a 62% rise in two years.


    And yes, before you ask again Jemand, I have shared my home with strangers and in the past have worked in London for Crisis. My late husband was a Samaritan and at one time was a trustee of SHAC, a housing charity connected with Shelter. I cannot remember what the acronym stands for.

  104. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 3:08 pm

    Deaths by the hundred in Gaza because of fuel shortages.

    Gaza hospitals face fuel shortage: Health Ministry

    Yet British Gas colluded with Israel to steal the gas that lies offshore to Gaza.

    The salaries of just two of directors of British Gas –

    Finlayson CEO £1,110,000pa
    As of Fiscal Year 2012

    Houston COO £3,268,000pa
    As of Fiscal Year 2012

    ex http://investing.businessweek.com/research/stocks/people/board.asp?ticker=BG/:LN

    and so on. Obscene is it not?

  105. Look at this drone, what a useful tool and so unregulated. Every investigative blog should have one….

    I’m sure I could enthuse Mark G and Komodo, but seriously consider the use during demonstrations with a direct link to a website, unfiltered redacted or manipulated.

    Call it ‘As it happens’. I think for London and its various demo’s this could be a good investment. So why are NGO’s not using them? Have these all turned into GO’s now, or are they too hierarchical to be able to contemplate their own coverage? They manage to hold camera’s and make fine fund raising video’s, how about investing in your own fact finding and truth reporting?

    Or is that just for Paparazzi’s?

    wonder how much such a thing costs or whether you put it together yourself. This one has a steady bar for better pictures attached, but how small can a tv camera be these days?


  106. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    4 Aug, 2013 - 4:06 pm

    Memebers of Congress can’t get info from their won security apparatus, so they have to go to Greenwald. Heh.


  107. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 4:22 pm

    Where is Sabretache these days? Used to see his name in these columns.

    I was reading the profile on Sabretache’s blog and concur.


  108. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 4:33 pm

    More on Balcombe from Medialens

    Bianca Jagger speaks with Balcombe protesters
    Posted by fredjc on August 4, 2013, 3:14 pm

    BJ speaks at about 14 mins in, but worth watching the rest, although I must admit I did skip over the musical bits – it’s reminiscent of the 60’s hippy-style of protest, although I think by now most Balcombe residents are waking-up to exactly what they’re up against. Video…


    The first person to be interviewed is Lech Kawolski who is currently showing his film ‘Drill Baby Drill’ in the States. His website is here…


    And a radio interview with him here…

  109. Flaming June

    4 Aug, 2013 - 4:45 pm

    Balcombe lies in Francis Maude’s constituency.

    Maude appointed Lord Browne to a cabinet post.


  110. Thanks Phil, that’s more than pocket money then. Mind you, NGO’s such as Greenpeace make millions, its peanuts to them.

    I think the one that is required has six to eight rotors, takes the weight of a Hollywood spec. camera, up to 5 kilos load so I believe.

    Enough to have it carry some confetti, so every time someone gets manhandled, bashed or pushed over, collateral damage, shot on the tube, one could release some red confetti in appreciation of our civil servants….

    These things can fly anywhere and quiet high, like take a cage shot of the London Eye visitors from close up. Or join someone close by on his walk over the foot bridge, so many possibilities…

    ‘As it happens TV’ could have an extra live page here, were news is made. It would preclude to having a more business like blog/site that pays a wage or two, maybe take some NGO’ ads, nothing too corporate, so one could allow the drone and its operator to travel.

  111. @Nevermind

    Drones dropping confetti on out of control coppers is a genius idea full of symbolism.

    Occupy discussed using drones but I have not seen that they did. I suspect the actual value is limited and any attempt would be quickly jammed by the rozzers.

    There has been a clip of a drone filming police movements from poland online for a while. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KOxh9dbkNT4

  112. Jon, some reasonable points but hating a country and, by implication, its people is not reasonable. It suggests a domination of emotion over reason. We see enough of that in the world and on this blog.

    Mary, you can wish upon a star for any name you like. I wish to be addressed as Prince Gerhardt IV.

  113. Don’t be surprised to see private drones banned outside of designated areas for hobbyists in the next ten years.

  114. Aug 5: Seal Team 76, led by Kathryn Bigelow and camera crew, burst into Yemeni conference room at enemy hovel, where lecturer is translating Snowden’s filched 2007/2009 Power Point presentations into Arabic.

    One member is taking notes. 54 are snoring, as is customary at any Power Point presentation. One dastard is discovered in mens room, writing his last testament/manifesto on wall with ballpoint pen.

    Aug 6: With a fiendish worldwide plot foiled, just before The Enemy learned how NSA really worked and ceased their endless chatter about this, that, and the other thing, President Obama triumphantly appears on NBC-TV’s Jay Leno comedy show, greeted with thunderous applause and 17 minutes of chanting, “USA, USA, USA!”

    Aug 7: Congress votes unanimously to quadruple funding of spy machinery.

  115. But worth a try Phil, worth a try, jamming the frequency would be an own goal and endangering the public, the police could not be seen jamming a 20 kg device and sending it trundling down in to a mass of people, they could not defend such action in court when they knew it carries a camera and confetti.

    ‘We are very sorry, your honour, we did see the live pictures on their website, but we did not like the poppy red colour of the confetti and so we jammed it and it fell from great hight on to that pushchair with a two year old, unfortunate collateral damage, sir , as I’ve said, we are so very sorry….

    sounds of slapping wrists…

  116. Jemand, how can you ban something that is unregulated by law? Are you drafting it?

  117. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    4 Aug, 2013 - 7:51 pm

    @ Jemand :

    “I wish to be addressed as Prince Gerhardt IV.”

    Your wish is my command, Sir (sorry : Sire!)!

    I’ve tried to find you in the Almanach de Gotha but without success; could you give some geographical indications which will help me trace your lineage, pls?

    My guess at this stage would be the House of Groessenwahn-Nix-Bessereszutun… :)

  118. “Uzbekistan’s cotton is the subject of an international boycott over alleged child labour.”


    “High street banks have lent to payday loan companies.”


  119. doug scorgie

    4 Aug, 2013 - 9:33 pm

    The honours system is, as most people here would agree I’m sure, a corrupt elitist abomination where decent hard working people get a few scraps (CBEs, OBEs, MBEs, BEMs, etc.) and the elite get the far more “influential” honours of Knighthoods/Dames and Peerages for services to “the state”.

    Peerage being the honour that allows a person to sit in the House of Lords in a political capacity without being elected.

    There are some decent people “elevated” to the Lords on a token basis to make the system look fair in some way; Doreen Lawrence being a good example.

    People get honours for achievements like:

    “…improving life for people less able to help themselves.”

    So no honours for Ian Duncan Smith or George Osborne then?

  120. Here is an accurate reflection on what has happened, and is happening, in the Middle East and North Africa, from Russian Prime Minister Medvedov.


  121. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    4 Aug, 2013 - 9:59 pm

    ““If we’re being completely honest, what good did the Arab Spring bring to the Arab world? Did it bring freedom? A little, at best. In most countries it led to endless bloodshed, regime change, and continuous unrest.”

    This seems to be directed at Wikileaks, as well John. Tunisia’s awakening was a direct result. I hope this is not a harbinger of things to come for Snowden.

    The Arab Spring is not Irish Spring with a 4-leaf clover scent. Any People struggling with oppression, revolution revert to political and social evolution. It may be glacial in it’s progress, but instant transformation should not be a required hurdle in order to qualify.

  122. Suhayl

    “What a stinking rotten country I was born into. No wonder I hate it now.” Flaming June.

    The UK is certainly a deeply imperialist entity and so entities like Hakluyt are nothing new. I think you’ll find, however, that most countries engage in such covert arms-dealing operations; we are simply one of the biggest arms-manufacturers/dealers in the world.To feel down about, and to oppose, certain aspects/power-structures/policies is one thing. But to hate the country in its entirety suggests something different.”

    Jon adds:

    ” @Jemand,

    I should think “hating one’s country”, if this dynamic can be reduced to that, is a common enough dilemma amongst leftists. We should not trivialise it, and we should instead strive to understand it, and be understanding of the people who it affects – as Suhayl does above.”

    First Jon, ” if this dynamic can be reduced to that, is a common enough dilemma amongst leftists.”

    True, IF it can be reduced to that…well, Mary in her original comment was quite emphatic and so did with full intention reduce it to that. It follows i disagree that it “is a common enough dilemma amongst leftists.” Are you sure about that Jon? I mean there could be some strong dislikes, even abhorrence of certain policies or the way of politics, but “hate” is surely another phenomenon isn’t it? Btw to say “we should instead strive to understand it, and be understanding of the people who it affects – as Suhayl does above.”, is a stretch too far. Suhayl was saying nothing to that effect. What he was saying is “To feel down about, and to oppose, certain aspects/power-structures/policies is one thing. But to hate the country in its entirety suggests something different.”

    Yes to “hate the country in its entirety suggests something different.” Lets be clear this is what the original post by Mary said and it is an entirely different suggestion.

    Why do people here feel the need to whitewash Mary’s feelings of hate? Why is it minimised and sugar coated by others with intellectual dishonesty. Mary intrigues me no end when she paints all S Koreans with the same brush of (unproven alleged) incompetence of their Boeing 777 pilots or petitions God on this website to Damn (yes again, the whole of Amerika). Even suggesting that there’s something fraudulent happening at the humble Krishnamurti Foundation — cheap pathetic plain envious/jealous shot like there’s “gold in them thar Krishnamurti hills”. How uninformed and sick is that?

    Why doesn’t Mary come forward with explanations of and on her own. Take time our from her sellf-centred news service activity and take responsibility and retract or apologise — use the magic word ‘sorry’ if necessary? Until she moves away from her glossing over sweeping generalisations and stubbornness, i will see her fragmented posts for what they are — just another escape artist and fragmented lefty riding her one-trick pony of charging towards the windmills of Palestine who is not going to make one gitmo of a difference to the true injustices and conflict in this world. I invite Mary to respond directly.

    Reflection of the day: Living in an Insane World


  123. Here’s a good article on browser support for Perfect Forward Secrecy/Diffie-Hellman key exchange and PRISM/Xkeyscore/Whateverleaksnext


    Note that Internet Exploder virtually never uses PFS even when connecting to a website which supports a compatible variant. The article doesn’t mention this but it is possible to force Exploder to use diffie-hellman more often but the information on how to do so is buried in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying ‘Beware of the Leopard’.” **

    ** Well really an obscure hard to use mis-feature buried way down in gpedit.msc

    Firefox 23 Out this week beefs up security even further by finally supporting TLS 1.1
    Firefox 24 adds TLS 1.2

    The Snowden leaks seem to be accelerating PFS and TLS security upgrades on both the server and client ends. Notably not from some such as Microsoft though.

  124. ‘momentum that even critics say may be unstoppable’?

    400 people protesting NSA domestic spying – out of a population of over 300 million – is rather depressing


  125. Jemand – Censorship Improves History 4 Aug, 2013 – 7:20 pm

    “Don’t be surprised to see private drones banned outside of designated areas for hobbyists in the next ten years.”

    2 years, tops.

  126. BrianFujisan

    5 Aug, 2013 - 12:34 am

    With Regards the Propaganda Criminals of the bbc Here’s a Youtube video

    Syrian man confronts BBC reporter for Lying

    Lyse Doucet. She is a major player in Chatham House which is a British NGO that is a propaganda tool of the British Establishment. Chatham House is also known as the “Tavistock Institute”, the UK branch of the CFR. She has been behind directing most of the ‘Arab spring’ coverage from Libya to Egypt. When she claims to know nothing about the lies told previously she is dishonest. She is not only a purveyor of the lies but she is an architect of the entire edifice of lies.


  127. Honeyclap

    For once you come in second-annoying with ‘Muzzies’. The ‘most offensive’ prize goes to the BBC’s references to ‘Moslems’, a colonial pejorative pronunciation. Please try harder to be more annoying next time. It’s nearly Eid.

  128. BrianFujisan. 100 % agreed:
    “She is not only a purveyor of the lies but she is an architect of the entire edifice of lies.”

  129. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    5 Aug, 2013 - 1:23 am

    How about ‘Mohametans’ Guano? Does that send your guano batty?

  130. “Syrian man confronts BBC reporter for Lying”

    What’s he saying? “Everyone supports the president” and you accuse the BBC of lying?

    Chatham House and the Tavistock Institute are not one and the same.

  131. Jemand,

    Your contributions here over a certain time remind me of a sad plastic piece of plastic who really ought know better,but is prepared to pimp their limited skills out to the highest agendised plastic bidder.

    Go away you shallow bought and paid for confused AND pretentious semi-literate droid until you’ve got something really truthful to speak of.

    Taking your shill buddy-boy gang stalkers would be a bonus too.

    But i shan’t hold my breath.

    The rest of us don’t get paid to be here.

  132. Habbabkuk, “Sire” is an acceptable alternative, thank you for acknowledging my right to be addressed in my preferred way. Of course, being of royal blood, it it my prerogative to not acknowledge the rights of anyone else who wishes to be addressed in any way other than that which I prefer. Hence Flaming Mary et al., will be addressed accordingly.

    As to my royal lineage and tragic heritage that saw my family dispossessed of its perfectly legitimate and legally obtained wealth and provincial property during the Crimean War in the 19th century, I am surprised that you have not yet discovered on the many, many, many hundreds of websites that comprise the internet, that my story is not told there, but rather on about a half dozen websites that discuss free energy appliances and cancer industry conspiracies. Please click past the first two levels of UFO revelations to find my family history.

    Briefly, my family had a province around the area now known as Hutt River, in Australia’s equivalent of Switzerland. During the Crimean War, forces loyal to the bad side in that war took unlawful possession of our territories for reasons that are too painful for me to recall and I never studied European history because it was boring so I don’t know in any case.

    Anyway, the province was never returned to our rightful possession but now resides in the hands of a pretender to the throne, a “Prince” Leonard, fraud and knave.


    [Dedicated to “sad plastic piece of plastic” and paragon of British intellect, Jives]

  133. Re Drones

    As brilliant as these flying devices are, they represent a key piece of technology that logically advances the implementation of the Machine State, which extends the reach of totalitarian and authoritarian government. It should be again emphasised that the rise of a totalitarian Machine State does not need to be planned in an “intentionalist” process, but will form as a “functionalist” product of independent government efforts to reduce costs and improve management of various ‘problems’. When key pieces of infrastructure are in place, it requires very little effort to connect them all and, in doing so, realise a massive performance gain in surveillance and control of people. All you then need is for good people to do nothing.

  134. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    5 Aug, 2013 - 6:51 am

    From Jives, in the wee hours :


    Your contributions here over a certain time remind me of a sad plastic piece of plastic who (SIC) really ought know better,but is prepared to pimp their (SIC)limited skills out to the highest agendised (SIC) plastic bidder.

    Go away you shallow (SIC – comma needed)bought and paid for (SIC – comma needed) confused AND pretentious semi-literate droid until you’ve got something really truthful to speak of.

    Taking your shill buddy-boy gang stalkers would be a bonus too.

    But i shan’t hold my breath. (PLEASE DO – PREFERABLY FOR 10 MINUTES..)

    The rest of us don’t get paid to be here (SIC – missing full stop).

    Keep up the good work, Jivesy

  135. Habbabkuk (La vita è bella!)

    5 Aug, 2013 - 7:12 am

    @ Jemand

    Sire, thank you for your fascinating response!

    By a remarkable coincidence, I read just a couple of days ago of the demise of “Princess” Shirley Casey (Obituaries section of the London “Times” dated 1 August 2013).

    That obituary started with “In 1970 Shirley Casey, a West Australian farmer’s wife, was transformed into Her Royal Highness Princess Shirley Casey of Hutt when her husband Leonard declared that their vast wheat farm 600 km north of Perth had become a principality and he its prince”, and ended with “She is survived by her husband and their children: Crown Prince Ian; Wayne, Duke of Nain; Richard, Duke of Carmel; Graeme, Duke of Galboa; and Duchesses Kay, Diane and Sherryl.”.

    There was, however, no mention of your good self (Prince Gerhardt IV.

    Is this yet another example of how the MSM habitually suppress historical fact in the interests of large corporations, the wicked Con-LibDem govt, thus serving, albeit indirectly, the interests of the Zionist master plan?

    I think we should be told.

  136. Am I alone in detecting an increasing “chosen” hubris emanating from habba & co towards us goyim – punctuation mark deficiencies n all? Must be a harbinger of an upcoming usual millennial slimming course,proven time and again to clear out the effects of the expired kedem causing such delusion, gotta catch up on some “prepping” reading then !

  137. Flaming June

    5 Aug, 2013 - 7:58 am

    It’s rather amusing to observe the international trade in election gurus. Rudd, with an election in a month’s time, has called on the services of an Obama campaign expert called Tom McMahon. He has also procured a Matthew McGregor from the UK who is a social media expert and a Joon Kim from a US consulting firm New Partners.

    Rudd flies in Team Obama

    Cameron already has signed the Australian Lynton Crosby and last week we heard he had employed a Jim Messina from the US to advise on ‘strategic communications’.


    Whether in Australia or the UK be prepared for an onslaught of TV ads, poster campaigns and spin.

  138. Flaming June

    5 Aug, 2013 - 8:05 am

    Meanwhile Rudd has moved on from Manus Island, Papua New Guinea to plans for the island of Nauru, pop 9,000, to accommodate the ‘refugees’. Note the use of the acronym RPC – ‘regional processing centre’. No not a bacon factory, a compound to sort homeless humans.

    Aussie Imperialism: Kevin Rudd and Dumping on the Pacific
    August 4th, 2013

    Nauru itself does not agree with Rudd that the refugees will be resettled there.

    Let’s hope that Mrs May doesn’t get any similar ideas about islands.

  139. Hababbkuk, yes it’s MSM revisionism. I don’t know if any Zionists are involved but since you mention it, I now imagine that they are, so yeah! Burn your MSM newspapers, and other revisionist sources of Hutt-River propaganda.

    Flaming Mary, we’ve always had “onslaughts” of political advertising, even outside of coming elections. So I don’t know how a “Team Obama” guru will change that. But the American influence on Oz political campaigning and sloganeering has a 10 year delay before arriving here. Personally, I prefer the British style of campaign where candidates casually mingle amongst the madding crowd, throwing random punches at their constituents.

    I also notice, Flaming Mary, that you like to try and bait me with your anti-Australian propaganda. I guess you also hate us as you hate your own country. All this hate gets us nowhere, can we all get along??

  140. Flaming June

    5 Aug, 2013 - 8:57 am

    ‘Peace’ talks? What ‘peace’ talks would those be?

    Israeli Decree on West Bank Settlements Will Harm Peace Talks, Palestinians Say

    August 4, 2013

    JERUSALEM — With peace talks scheduled to begin next week, an Israeli cabinet decision involving West Bank settlements on Sunday drew condemnation from the Palestinian leadership, highlighting the fragility of the Washington-brokered effort to resume long-stalled negotiations.


  141. Flaming June

    5 Aug, 2013 - 9:06 am

    Under the pretext of addressing Suhayl, there is yet another dose of psychoanalysis concerning me from the Krisnamurti Preacherman.

    He obviously does not have sufficient of other activity to occupy him and I suggest he should apply himself to some useful physical activity.

    As he has been told by the moderator, he should not be commenting on the posters here just the topics.


    Not ‘baiting’ you at all Jemand. I seem to have touched a nerve! You probably dread September 2013 just as much as we dread Spring 2015 (or earlier if and when it all goes pear shaped for this flaky coalition).

  142. Krishnamurski Villager should be more concerned about the disharmony in the minds of all the mad jews encouraged from all over the world to come and occupy the West Bank with free housing and guaranteed monthly wages to foment Islamophobia and shill “narrative” on the net. All financed from tax free “charitable” contributions in the Western world of course.

  143. Mary, since you talk about your personal hates, and betray your personal jealousy and bigotry in the context of world events, i address those subjects of the mind. It is not analysis, it is empirical observation of life itself as it flows from thought-feeling-action. Speaking expansively, and given all the mischief and conflicts going on around the world, our mind — the way we think and live — is the source of all conflict, is it not?

    So when Suhayl says “But to hate the country in its entirety suggests something different.”, what do you think he’s saying?

    Btw, did you read the piece of K that i linked above? Here is the prelude:

    “Last Sunday I was trying to explain what is right thinking and how to set about it. I said that unless there is self-awareness, self-knowledge of all the motives, intentions, and instincts, thought-feeling has no true foundation, and that without this foundation there is no right thinking. Self-knowledge is the beginning of understanding. And as we are – the world is. That is, if we are greedy, envious, competitive, our society will be competitive, envious, greedy, which brings misery and war. The state is what we are. To bring about order and peace, we must begin with ourselves and not with society, not with the state, for the world is ourselves. And it is not selfish to think that each one must first understand and change himself to help the world. You cannot help another unless you know yourself. Through self-awareness one will find that in oneself is the whole.”

    and the link again: http://www.jkrishnamurti.org/krishnamurti-teachings/view-text.php?tid=170&chid=4526&w=hate

    Never mind the messenger, but please address the message. What is being said is fact, not some psychoanalysis theories.
    Enjoy your swim as i will mine.

  144. @ Jemand – Censorship Improves History 5 Aug, 2013 – 5:29 am
    “Re Drones. It should be again emphasised that the rise of a totalitarian Machine State does not need to be planned in an “intentionalist” process, but will form as a “functionalist” product of independent government efforts to reduce costs and improve management of various ‘problems’. When key pieces of infrastructure are in place, it requires very little effort to connect them all and, in doing so, realise a massive performance gain in surveillance and control of people. All you then need is for good people to do nothing.”

    Problem is, many of the people in favour of uber-surveillance consider themselves the “Good People”, the ones with nothing to hide, but determined to pry into others’ lives and not limited to protecting the Homeland/Fatherland/Motherland from threats real or fake.

    Already, divorce lawyers are demanding access to the vast NSA database to catch out their client’s spouse and the entertainment industry wants to use it to track pirate downloads.

    Other government bodies are likewise clamouring for data. There will be the usual cries, “If only one child is saved!” (From a predator, a glimpse of porn, bullying, a sugary drink or salty snack — whatever.)

    Cities will tap in to bring fiends with unpaid parking tickets to justice. Not much technical effort needed to find who has been texting or sexting while driving. with the gubmint auto-deducting an appropriate fine from the violator’s account.

    At best, we’re doomed to a Stasi of do-gooders.

  145. “Mohamed Morsi’s allies admit defeat and plot (sic) to fly him into exile”

    ‘Deposed President could resign via a televised address and hand powers to interim Prime Minister’


    I find it frustrating reading about Egypt at the moment. I’m not sure that we know the full truth of what happened there, or that we ever will.

  146. Dreoilin:

    “I find it frustrating reading about Egypt at the moment. I’m not sure that we know the full truth of what happened there, or that we ever will.”

    Yes Dreoilin very uncomfortable but in the bigger picture, Egypt would do well to emulate Turkey and separate religion from politics as far as possible. It doesn’t by any means imply that all will be ok from hereon.

  147. “I seem to have touched a nerve!”

    No Mary, it’s the other way around. While you are reporting on the asylum seeker issue in Australia, you might want to also report on a recent incident in which some asylum seekers who got rejected subsequently burnt down a building during a riot in which 60 million dollars (£40million) of damage was caused. Imagine how many people in troubled areas of the world could have been helped with that money. It’s enough to make you cry.

  148. NR, very scary stuff how technology can, is and continues to be misused. Sometimes one feels that we will need visitors from another planet to help get our house in order. We seem to be standing at the precipice but unable to pull back. The only way humanity can find a new way of living is for each of us to be a light unto ourselves. That means one lamp being lit at a time — sounds like an awfully slow-boat but i don’t know if there is another one to catch.

    More of the same, protests and campaigns, doesn’t seem to be working. Maybe we do all need to slow down in order to change the dynamics. The only saving grace is that the internet is such a nascent tool — properly used it could prove to be a great asset in transformation, both personal and global.

  149. Ben
    Moslem is a kind of affected Cambridge don pronunciation used by orientalists, who know everything about Islam except the taste of iman/faith. Also used by some well-respected Muslims who mix with them.

    I like ‘Mohametans’.

  150. Jemand – Censorship Improves History 5 Aug, 2013 – 11:04 am
    “…asylum seekers who got rejected subsequently burnt down a building during a riot in which 60 million dollars (£40million) of damage was caused. Imagine how many people in troubled areas of the world could have been helped with that money.”

    Wow, those stupid, ungrateful darkies. Same as those bloody abos. Pass me another xxxx.

  151. Simple exercise, vaguely relevant to some of the above, re. BBC coverage. I realise that some will start spitting here…but…

    On Radio 4, compare the number of programmes by, for and about Jewish people with those by, for, and about Muslims (UK population ~6 times the Jewish population), Hindus (double) and, especially, Sikhs* (~1.3 times). When was the last time a Sikh appeared on The Moral Maze, for instance? Instead, of a regular like arch-zionist Mel Phillips?

    I’d be interested to know what you come up with.

    *Jokes about skullcaps, suicide bombs, sacred cows and turbans on comedy programmes excluded, that is.

  152. @nevermind:


    I see Phil beat me to it, but more ideas here.

    You can get something which flies, with an onboard camera, for less than £50. And without knowing an arms dealer, you can do a good bit better than that if you spend more.

  153. Moving forward, as they say in corporate-speak, now that we know we are definitely being spied on by our governments in our private bedrooms through whatever means, does nobody think that we are affected by that knowledge?

    Animals will cut short starting to mate if they notice that they are being observed by humans. Does our government not recognise that spying on private acts is both illegal and humiliating.

    One of the Muslims whose work with the intelligence agencies includes spying on me with information supplied by government systems told me that what I did or said would affect how he would behave. Yes, they use spying to threaten us while we are trying to live our ordinary lives as Muslims. That’s why Mursi was kicked out, because he started his spying campaign against the military.

    But do they not understand that knowing you are being observed can change what people do, making them refrain from doing in public what they do naturally in private, and maybe doing other things instead which are unnatural like looking at porn. Spying is extremely intrusive and haram. We have to establish our human right not to be spied upon, because it can make us do things which are sinful, trying to avoid the shame of being exposed in privacy with our wives.

    I could argue that illegal interference in my private life justified my breaking the state law, paying my council tax etc.
    Instead of just accepting that government spying is not illegal from members of the Privy Council, who also stated that the invasion of Iraq was not illegal, maybe we should point out that legality is not an issue, actions have consequences. Invade and terror will prevail, spy and public protest will prevail.

    Only those who do not believe in human justice or the Divine laws which forbid spying, are content to earn their living by this dirty and haram activity. Political minds like Mursi who spy on individuals are much dirtier than the sexual acts they are spying on. Human sexuality is not in itself dirty, but spying is kufr/disbelief, because it is repeatedly and strongly forbidden in Islam. Mursi’s USUKIS experiment with universal spying has disgraced the Masonic Muslim Brotherhood for all time.

    It is the habit of political Muslims to see the faults of others while ignoring the planks in their own eyes. That’s why the USUKIS are promoting plank Islam with all their might and resources. Praise be to God commonsense in Egypt prevailed.

  154. NR, so long as there are complex social and consumer distractions that feed a sort of false conciousness of the people, we cannot rely on the majority of good people to be so well informed, intellectually disposed and emotionally prepared to have the wherewithal to resist the transformation of our society into a dystopian Machine State.

    Organisations like Wikileaks try to shine a light on real power dynamics within a culture that is entertained by fictitious stories about state conspiracies. It’s like being in a room full of mirrors.

  155. doug scorgie

    5 Aug, 2013 - 11:50 am

    Just as the “peace talks” take off:

    “Israel has agreed to subsidise several Jewish settlements that were regarded as illegal until recently.” [legalised by a process only recognised by Israel]

    Palestinian official Hanan Ashrawi said the move would have a “destructive impact” on peace talks, which resumed last week after a three-year hiatus.

    “This is exactly what Israel wants, have a [peace] process for its own sake, and at the same time have a free hand to destroy the objective of the [peace] process,”

    “On Sunday, the cabinet published a list of more than 600 towns and settlements to be regarded as priority areas for development.”

    The latest list included a total of 91 [illegal] settlements, up from 85 in last December’s list.


  156. Phil, what’s with your stupid racist comment? Or are you one of those people who believes when someone claims asylum, they should be taken at their word only? Like in court?

  157. Guano 5 Aug, 2013 – 11:42 am
    “now that we know we are definitely being spied on by our governments in our private bedrooms through whatever means, does nobody think that we are affected by that knowledge?”

    That’s a very interesting question.

    In science, the term observer effect refers to changes that the act of observation will make on a phenomenon being observed. A commonplace example is checking the pressure in an automobile tire; this is difficult to do without letting out some of the air, thus changing the pressure.


  158. Komodo

    The behaviour of Jews has many hundreds of years of observation in our European society and most of what has been observed has been respectable and beneficial to society.

    Compare that with the steady flow of bad news about our Muslim friends. In this clip it comes to my mind that the police authority knew very well what their Muslim bobby was up to and gave him enough rope to hang himself, Daniel Pelka , and the rest of us believing Muslims.


  159. Flaming June

    5 Aug, 2013 - 11:55 am

    ‘Btw, did you read the piece of K that i linked above?’

    Definitely not. Neither did I read your piece. I skimmed it.

    btw Swimming is on a Tuesday. Planting vegetables this morning, mowing the grass and cutting some hedges. Lovely work.

    How are enrolments going for the £19,000pa K school in Alresford? Filling up nicely?

    Who can afford those fees? Pop stars, multinational CEOs, FCO diplomats? Definitely not any of the 1m plus British on zero hours working.

    This morning on Sky News there was this dreadful Katie Hopkins person shouting down a kid who had been through the Sports Direct mill. Hopkins was extolling the benefits of the zero hours construct for employers. She is a Alan Sugar ‘Apprentice’ afficionado and has been in trouble for making offensive statements on the social media.


    Not so much ‘You’re fired’ because you were never given an employment contract in the first place.

    Hopkins -http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/lostinshowbiz/2013/jul/18/katie-hopkins-queen-of-conflict

  160. Flaming June

    5 Aug, 2013 - 12:00 pm

    Finally there is some sort of justice for Ian Tomlinson’s widow and children, if only monetary plus an apology from the high ups in the Met.

    Ian Tomlinson’s Family Welcome Police Apology
    Scotland Yard pays tribute to the newspaper seller’s widow as they reach a settlement four years after his death at a G20 protest.

    The words.

  161. Flamy

    I was recently offered a ‘position’, instead of a ‘contract’. Anyone can buy work if they have a credit card to pay for the transport/tools.

  162. Flaming June

    I was recently offered a ‘position’, instead of a ‘contract’. Anyone can buy work if they have a credit card to pay for the transport/tools.

  163. So Guano, was that Muslim bobby a legitimate suspect or not? What do you think the police should have done when they suspected that one of their own was corrupt? Nothing? Something? What?

  164. Flaming Mary:

    “Who can afford those fees? Pop stars, multinational CEOs, FCO diplomats?”

    Poor Mary, you really are caught in a web of jealousy and envy. What a shock it would come as to your system if ever a Palestinian child had enrolled in that School. Btw that is only one of many schools that K helped found — most of them are in perhaps more affordable India. Do you begrudge the children who can afford to go to high-quality schools?

    What if Craig sends his children there, would that be the end of it then?

    The weirdness of your narrow little compassion. I’ll let you carry on with your quixotic tilting at the windmills in Palestine born out of the same bigoted petition for God to damn America.

    Btw are you side-stepping Suhayl’s profound observation and my related question:

    “So when Suhayl says “But to hate the country in its entirety suggests something different.”, what do you think he’s saying?”

    You are something different alright :-)

  165. Flaming June

    5 Aug, 2013 - 12:18 pm

    Jemand You just don’t get it.

    ‘“I seem to have touched a nerve!”

    No Mary, it’s the other way around. While you are reporting on the asylum seeker issue in Australia, you might want to also report on a recent incident in which some asylum seekers who got rejected subsequently burnt down a building during a riot in which 60 million dollars (£40million) of damage was caused. Imagine how many people in troubled areas of the world could have been helped with that money. It’s enough to make you cry.’

    It is not about money.

    Did the burnt out building resemble this one in Afghanistan at all?


    Or this?


    Or were any injured like Ali Abbas who was gravely injured and ten members of his family killed in Iraq in 2003?



  166. technicolour

    5 Aug, 2013 - 12:21 pm

    What people need to know about the situation of asylum seekers in Australia. In the first video a man, having stitched his lips together, throws himself onto razor wire. A lawyer explains that 90 percent of asylum seekers are found to be bona fide. In the second, made almost ten years ago, activists pull the fences down around Woomera, a prison in the middle of the desert where asylum seekers have been held indefinitely. Children have been born inside.



  167. The UKUSIS strategy in Syria was to invite political Islam, including US-controlled Saudi and Qatar, and Syrian exiles and Al Qaida to make war on Assad, while at the same time draw on the Zionist control of Russia and Iran to send heavy weapons and Shi’a troops in order to repel Sunni progress.

    The full responsibility for what has ensued is entirely on the shoulders once again of a UK prime Minister and his senior cabinet members. We sent snipers to start the war, and we allowed our backside to be shafted by the world’s media by supporting the Zionist plan to wreck Syria with opposing forces in order for Israel to take control its water resources for the benefit of Israel’s expansion.

    Political Islam is fully aware of the plan, but is counting on Obama being shamed by it into a full-scale assault on Assad, clearing the way for stooges to re-build Syria with pipes to Israel included in the plan. Once again political Islam has been fooled by Zionist lies.

    The intervention of Shi’a forces on Israel’s side has changed the relationship between Sunni and Shi’a forever. It had always been a saving grace for the Shi’a that Hizbullah gave Israel a hard time. Now that we know that Shi’a and Israel are best bosom friends, and Iran has been rewarded for services rendered by a new smiley Rouhani regime, all trace of respect for the Shi’a leadership has now gone.

    You make your choices and live with the consequences. Shi’a have lost all credibilty for a generation. The UK P.M likes being shafted by the world’s media. A public school wet dream.

  168. Ahhh, hello Technicolour. It didn’t take long for you to weigh into the asylum seeker ‘debate’, did it?

    Your claim that 90% of people are found to be “bona fide” asylum seekers is false. The truth is that 90% are successful in their applications because the immigration authorities give the benefit of the doubt to people who are NOT proved to be NOT genuine asylum seekers and NOT proved to be NOT of good character. You see, in applications for asylum, two negatives equate to a positive. And all you need is a good story and a reasonably clean criminal record – not that any records can be accessed by Australian Immigration officials – to successfully claim asylum.

    But let me ask this – if Australia is such a shitty, racist country, why do so many people make the journey past their neighbours to come here? 

  169. Jemand
    You’re so naive. The police placed the brother into the brothel/hard drugs territory temptation in order to creat another media scandal against Islam.

    A policeman is zimmidari/responsible. His/her job is to assess the risks of violence arising from a criminal activity. A bent policeman, instead of alerting the authorities of the presence of a vulnerable child inside the brothel, reassured the perpetrators that they were immune from suspicion by getting involved in the crime.

    It is inconceivable with modern police methods of communications interceptions that the police authorities were unaware of the bobby’s involvement in the criminal activity or of the abuse of the child. This is just another case where the police have a sense of omnipotence because they are recording stuff sitting on their bottoms, and they ball forget that it isn’t a soap about good guys and bad guys.

    The police are 100% responsible for the consequences of sailing too close to the wind.

  170. Far from preventing crime, the police spying capability is now the biggest initiators and sponsors of crime. That’s why they put in political managers to produce spin to cover up the slime.

  171. Jemand – Censorship Improves History 5 Aug, 2013 – 11:50 am
    “Phil, what’s with your stupid racist comment?”

    Australia is embracing a punitive, racist immigration policy while still persecuting the people who europeans stole the country from. But all you can do is complain about rioting immigrants. So I was thinking you might have had one too many amber nectar because you failed to mention that the building destroyed was a detention centre.

    Just think of all the ‘good’ that you could do with the $25 billion annually frittered away on fags and food waste. Or how many much ‘good’ could be done with the $7.5m spent on one beer ad.

  172. technicolour

    5 Aug, 2013 - 12:49 pm

    Seen the man with the stitched up mouth throwing himself on the razor wire, Jemand? Anything to say yourself about the conditions which lead to that? Seen the desperation on the faces of the prisoners, held without charge or limitations, the hopelessness on the face of the child born inside? Australia is not alone, of course. But I like the idea that ‘my’ claim (it’s a lawyer speaking) is wrong because it’s – er – right.

  173. Bah!Humbug

    Not on shift yet? Or run out replies?

  174. Australia is playboy land for Zionist mafia to relax from sparring with triads. It is also the home of a very special race of human beings.

    Over the boulders and
    Under the stones
    The bushman wanders
    Always alone.

    And know my love
    And know always know
    There’ll be soft landings
    Where you go.

  175. And know and always know. Sorry

  176. Jemand – Censorship Improves History 5 Aug, 2013 – 12:38 pm
    “if Australia is such a shitty, racist country…”

    Don’t put yourself down so mate. I have met australians who are very cool people. It’s just that australia has a shitty racist establishment that is supported by shitty racists, in the closet and out.

  177. Jives, please accept Jemand in good faith – I don’t know where the animosity comes from. Did I miss some history here?

    Villager, ditto with Flaming June. FJ has made some casual asides which I think you’ve magnified in significance too greatly.

    Jemand, ditto with Technicolour.

    As far as I can see, all of you are here in good faith. But, where a discussion is started with an attack, a fight will ensue rather than an exchange of views. Let’s keep it constructive!

  178. Doug Scorgie, 11.50

    It’s been obvious for years now that the “facts on the ground” on the West Bank completely contradict any pretensions Israel has to permitting any kind of autonomous Palestinian state. It’s been so obvious,indeed, that the ‘peacemakers’ must have spotted this. What I don’t understand is how Obama/Kerry think they can salvage anything redounding to America’s credit from this or any other charade conducted by the Zionist, ex-AIPAC, ex-WINEP Martin Indyk on behalf of Netanyahu. These talks have been set up to fail. The Palestinians will get the blame, for their intransigence over settlements and East Jerusalem (or, as they persist in calling them, their property). The international community will do fuck-all. Again.

    Still, let’s be charitable. Israel left Gaza in 2005. What can the Palestinian West Bank expect to look like in the unlikely event of Israel handing it back? Or, rather, “handing it back”. Facts on the ground in Gaza, eight years later:

    In August 2005, the last Israeli settlers left Gaza, followed by the last Israeli soldiers in September, as Israel pulled out of the Palestinian territory it had occupied since 1967. The Israeli withdrawal from Gaza gave the general impression, at least in the Western press, that Israel was effectively turning over Gaza to the Palestinian Authority. That was not, and still is not, the case. As B’Tselem, the Israeli information and human rights organization, documents:

    Israel continues to maintain complete control over the air and sea space of the Gaza Strip. No Palestinian may operate a seaport or an airport without Israeli approval, which limits Palestinians’ freedom of trade and travel.

    Israel continues to control the joint Gaza Strip-West Bank population registry, which means Israel gets to decide who is a “Palestinian resident” and who is a “foreigner.” Palestinians must seek Israeli approval for every individual who wants to move to the West Bank.

    The Rafah border crossing between the Gaza Strip and Egypt was supposedly turned over to the Palestinian Authority. In fact, Israel continues to control the crossing to the extent that it may bar entry to “foreigners”—that is, Palestinians who are not residents of the Occupied Territories—or anyone it deems a security risk.

    Israel continues to maintain complete control of the movement of people and goods between the Gaza Strip and the West Bank, which Israel considers a “closed military area” off limits to anyone without a permit. West Bank residents are also forbidden from traveling aborad, including to the Gaza Striop, without a difficult-to-obtain Israeli permit.

    As far as trade is concerned, Israel controls the three crossing points in and out of Gaza (Karni, Sufa, and Kerem Shalom). Israel routinely closes the crossings to any exchange of goods, causing severe food and other shortages in Gaza.

    Israel still controls taxation and other levies in Gaza.

    Source, B’Tselem.

  179. Guano, I think the reference to “Muzzies” earlier was sardonically mimicking MSM and soft-racist views against Muslims. I don’t think it was clear or helpful, but it wasn’t intended to be Islamophobic.

    It is unfortunate that the commenter in question appears to habour unpleasant views against a different group instead, though I am more than happy to be corrected on that point!

  180. Jon, thanks for the conciliatory effort but let me have one parting shot for the evening ..

    Phil, don’t kid yourself. If I had a choice between a bunch of uneducated, white-skinned churls from the UK, of which there are clearly sooooo many, or educated brown-skinned people with no particular interest in religion and are of good character from anywhere else, I’d take my brown-skinned brothers ANY day of the week, EVERY time.

  181. Jemand – Censorship Improves History 5 Aug, 2013 – 1:42 pm
    “I’d take my brown-skinned brothers ANY day of the week, EVERY time.”

    So presumably you are disappointed with your government’s racist immigration policy. Please try to be clear because your prevoius comments today give quite a different impression.

  182. Phil, I’m very disappointed with my government’s non-racist immigration policy. And the previous government’s policy. And I’m disappointed that people lie, exaggerate, misconstrue, politicise and grandstand on this issue.

    The basic problem with unauthorised leaking-boat migration is –

    1. People die at sea, including children who have no say in the matter, and

    2. Fake asylum seekers insert themselves amongst real asylum seekers making the potential for fraudulent migration extremely problematic if the problem is not arrested.

    But yeah, I know you’re not interested in studying the facts so hey, just cry “RACISM”. It works everwhere ele.

    And, no, I never gave any impression of anything, you merely made assumptions that suited your political disposition. But, whatever.

  183. “I’m very disappointed with my government’s non-racist immigration policy…just cry “RACISM”…And, no, I never gave any impression of anything…”

    Not only did you give the impression earlie,r you even give the impression a couple of sentences before you deny giving an impression. Hilarious. You don’t seem to consider that denying racism is itself a racist act. On that we disagree.

    “People die at sea, including children who have no say in the matter,”

    You are the man. Everyone else here hates children.

  184. technicolour

    5 Aug, 2013 - 2:51 pm

    “People die at sea, including children who have no say in the matter” – those irresponsible parents, dragging their children away from torture and war. Still, nice to think you see this as a problem – perhaps you’re in favour of publicly funded lifeboats?

    “Fake asylum seekers insert themselves amongst real asylum seekers making the potential for fraudulent migration extremely problematic if the problem is not arrested.” – the ‘fakes’ would be the ones with millionaire bungalows back home who just embark on a, as you rightly remarked, dangerous and potentially lethal voyage for fun, right?

    And in any case the solution is to increase these disgusting levels of incarceration and de facto torture but preferably so far away that people won’t be able to find out what goes on in there, never mind make a fuss about it.

    ‘Racism’ is a small sad word by comparison.

  185. Jemand,

    Ok let’s try to play the ball.

    Our disagreement is about the australian immigration policy. I believe it is racist. You believe it is not.

    Do you agree that describes the nub of our argument?

  186. I’m so glad that I can be of use here on this blog as the proxy object of scorn and whipping boy for sexually frustrated, lonely people who are angry at the world’s injustice.

    Phil, Technicolour, Flaming Mary and Jives – try to get laid once in a while.

  187. Flaming June

    5 Aug, 2013 - 3:20 pm

    Christian Zionism: The Heresy that Undermines Middle East Peace

    Christian Zionism is the largest, most controversial and most destructive lobby within Christianity. It bears primary responsibility for perpetuating tensions in the Middle East, justifying Israel’s apartheid colonialist agenda and for undermining the peace process between Israel and the Palestinians.

    By Rev Dr Stephen Sizer


    Read Craig here.

  188. WTF has anyone’s bedroom activities got to do with any of this? Jemand, that was a blatantly antiparthenogenicist remark.

  189. Ben Franklin -Machine Gun Preacher (unleaded version)

    5 Aug, 2013 - 3:31 pm

    I had to look that up Komo. Getting laid means sleeping with your own self?

  190. You can even sleep somewhere else, Ben. Or something. No rumpy need occur.


  191. Well, not you, obviously. You’d have to be female.

  192. Jemand – Censorship Improves History 5 Aug, 2013 – 3:14 pm

    “I’m so glad that I can be of use here on this blog as the proxy object of scorn and whipping boy”

    Poor you. So wise but misunderstood. Perhaps you might incorporate this latest terrible injustice heaped upon you into a clever new extended name tag. Go on express yourself my friend. Don’t get me wrong, your current one, born from your own struggles, still strikes me as profound.

    “Phil, Technicolour, Flaming Mary and Jives – try to get laid once in a while.”

    Mmmm. People often reveal their own perceived inadequacies in their taunts of others.

  193. technicolour

    5 Aug, 2013 - 3:51 pm

    Well, that certainly startled that passer-by – thanks, Jemand! Perhaps I shouldn’t take your advice quite so literally, on reflection…

  194. Bradley Manning will be sentenced today, having been found guilty of 20 counts on Tuesday, including espionage (despite the lack of evidence for intent to spy and the lack of evidence that his leaking ever did any real harm). Whatever one thinks of Manning’s actions, that we deserved to know some of what he revealed and that his revelations changed the world are undeniable.

    Manning revealed the Collateral Murder video of a helicopter attack in Iraq on civilians including children and two Reuters journalists, whose cameras were taken for weapons.

    Manning revealed the full extent of the corruption of Tunisian dictator Zine El Abidin Ben Ali.

    Manning revealed to the US and Yemeni public the secret drone war that Washington was waging in that country.

    He revealed that then Secretary of State Hillary Clinton ordered US diplomats to spy on their United Nations counterparts.

    His leaks show that then Senator John Kerry pressed Israel to be open to returning the Golan Heights to Syria as part of a peace negotiation.

    Revealed that Afghanistan government corruption is “overwhelming”.

    Manning revealed the degree of authoritarianism and corruption of the Egyptian government of Hosni Mubarak, which was subsequently swept away.

    Manning revealed that hard-nosed realist, former Secretary of Defence Robert Gates, was against striking Iran’s nuclear enrichment facilities because it would only slow their program down slightly, but would inevitably cause Iranians to be angry and mobilized in the aftermath.

    Manning revealed that the Israeli authorities had a secret plan to keep the Palestinian population of Gaza on the brink of food insecurity and poor health, in among the creepiest military operations in history.

  195. technicolour

    5 Aug, 2013 - 3:57 pm

    Still, important research: was I subsequently

    a) slightly less concerned about the treatment of asylum seekers, and specifically treatment which, for example, results in a man stitching up his own mouth and throwing himself onto razor wire, or children being born inside desert prisons, or people being locked up for years without charge or limit

    b) about as concerned as before

    c) not one bit concerned – too occupied with the court case

    d) not one bit concerned – personal pleasure trumps concern for others any day


  196. A friend of mine – an Australian – dedicated his blog to the victims of the SIEV X disaster. Unfortunately my friend is offline this long time and his blog is too. But you can read about the SIEV X at Wikipedia.


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