Iran Breakthrough 117

I am really very pleased at the agreement reached with Iran. Coming as it does against a background of widespread and Western exacerbated Sunni/Shia conflict, it is one of very few hopeful recent international developments.

Liberalisation of Iranian society continues to go forward at an achingly slow pace. The human rights situation, role of the military and theological power structure remain, frankly, appalling. But insofar as there is movement, it is for improvement. Normalisation of its international situation will certainly help.
Taking the long view, Iran is the classical case of a great culture perverted to destruction by western power interference and the reaction to it. But I believe the enormous potential of the Iranian people will now start to reassert itself.

The danger of course is the Zionist militarists in Congress and the US media who will do all in their power to scupper any peaceful move. But for once, Bush’s extension of executive power might do some actual good. There is a parallel danger in Iran. The Iraq War was totally unjustified and illegal, but Saddam Hussein might nonetheless have evaded it had he boxed a bit more cleverly and allowed some foolish inspectors to wander around his palaces prodding at the teaspoons. Yes the inspections regimes will be galling, even humiliating. But patience will have its rewards. There is real danger though that the hardliners on the Iranian side will be able to muster sufficient local points of power to hamper inspections, thus giving the US and Israeli hardliners an opportunity.

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117 thoughts on “Iran Breakthrough

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  • Robert Crawford

    A dollar down and a dollar a week, you can have all the things you seek.

    It did not last long did it?

  • nevermind

    Iran has never been a threat to Europe or anyone else for the last 250 years Robert, so speculating about future oil flows, a habit which we should try to get away from, is only adding to the wholly negative reporting about Iran.

    What is important for them to realise that they do not have to sell their oil to generate energy, that it is much better to keep it under ground and develop Concentrated solar power stations backed up by hydro power.

    Preserving oil for future generations who might want to use it more carefully and for completely different reasons is wise, but it also attracts the usual multinational thief’s who find all sorts of reasons to interfere with your life, economy and your Government, so I understand why Iran needs a strong military.

  • Robert Crawford

    I know that most countries are not a threat to us Nevermind.

    However, they are either perceived to be a threat or, have assets that we want (not me of course).

    Greed, greed and more greed.

    So far they have got away with it. That may not always be the case! They all lose eventually.

    Anyway, how’s your garden after all xxxx you put on it?

  • Ba'al Zevul

    Kempe is right to put the matter in perspective. Though the private individual (given an income) has a choice between whether he wants a Lamborghini or enough to eat. No such choice exists with national finances. The cost of servicing UK public debt is 3% of GDP alone and rising, before a single creditor is repaid. Osborne hasn’t even considered paying back the principal, and has so far failed to slow the deficit increase. And interest rates are much lower for the government (which clandestinely sets the UK base rate in any case – see the connection?) than it is for an individual.

    Also worth considering is the mortgage market, which accounts for a large slice of private debt. So keenly was it falling over itself to write new debt into its ledgers that it was taking on mortgagers who hadn’t a hope of repaying the principal. The mortgages were – to hammer it home – sold on, packaged as unscrutinised derivatives, to other financiers. It was less a case of pass-the-parcel than pass-the-time-bomb. Cue Lehmann Brothers and the domino effect of 2007-2008. And are we “fine” now? We are not, and we are still paying the people who fucked up. The same old bubble’s been patched and pumped up by the same old marketeers. Who continue to persuade our Oxford PPE’s that Keynes was wrong, and propping their directors up is the only way forward.

  • giyane

    Yes Saddam was a man, and the characters that have replaced him bent not just as hair pins but as mattress springs

  • Ba'al Zevul

    No such choice exists with national finances.

    This, I realise belatedly,is total bollocks. What I meant to say was that the individual has no choice as to what the government spends his money on. He is dependent on (a) a consensus of his peers, before an election, and (b) whatever the election winners decide can be chopped from the (manifesto) bribes or added to the (unstated) punishments afterwards.

  • Robert Crawford

    To make money one has to get the overalls off your own back and onto someone else’s back.

    It is the same with money, it has to be made to work for you. I.E. it has to be loaned out before it starts to work.

    If I invest £1,000.00 with a bank, that bank has to find a borrower to be able to pay me the agreed interest, which is usually a fraction of what the borrower has to pay, and there is no Apr: for me only the borrower gets mugged.

    If the bank creates money that does not exist and lends this fictitious money, then the bankers should be prosecuted. This does not happen. We allow it, we get to pay for it, fools.

    The cheapest goods are bought for cash.

    The money lenders don’t like that.

  • fedup

    Nevermind, your last few posts have been particularly informed and I have enjoyed reading them and must point out; Agree with your propositions.


    If the bank creates money that does not exist and lends this fictitious money, then the bankers should be prosecuted. This does not happen. We allow it, we get to pay for it, fools.

    Even more peculiar is the government that goes “cap in hand” and borrows the same fictitious money from the “financiers” and then starts paying real interest and the principle on top. However adding insult to injury the money is not borrowed to make a difference to our quality of life, no Siry Bob! The current selected political charge hands/ministers et al, are borrowing the fictitious money, so that they can make good the loss of governmental taxation revenues, by writing off (legislating for) of the rich taxpayers tax burden; these would rather hang on to their money because they never use any of the services offered, do they?

    So the scam is doubled, first the banksters pockets are lined, then the banksters mates/neighbors/friends of neighbors/ etc. their pockets are lined. Of course the rest of us work at minimum wage jobs, and we are told we are not productive, lazy lay abouts, who are lucky to even have a job and hang on to our jobs.

    Look at the whole infrastructure of the country, the roads are on par with third world standard, the shops are empty and selling the bare essentials, people are miserable, and one in three families are in need of food bank assistance, that is of course after the “poor inspectors” (it used to be called social services a long time ago), have approved the relevant hungry and destitute family are poor enough! Mind this will happen only three times, after that the poor and hungry family can go suck eggs, that is if they can afford to get any, after they have paid for the gas, electric, and council tax. As you know we don’t want to dint any supermarket business, heavens forbid, in case of the moral hazard becoming irrelevant (although bankster bail outs are an exception, because those bastards are immoral anyway).

    Although, the same selected political charge hands still are looking to spend on the military and contemplating and talking of bombing this one and liberating the other!

    Democracy dunchyoluv its smell in the morning?

  • Ba'al Zevul

    RC – How simplistic would a cap on bank margins be as a partial solution to what ails us? A few weeks ago some banks were flying a kite about negative deposit interest rates. Not only would they get to use your credit as (fractional)collateral for their own borrowing but they can invest it at rates unavailable to the individual, and pocket the proceeds while they’re at it. Oh, I forgot. Their wealth will trickle down to you eventually by some unspecified and demonstrably false process. Big of them. Hang the bankers.

  • Ba'al Zevul

    -sorry, brain appears to be flatulent today.

    Read instead “Not only would they get to use your credit as (fractional)collateral for their own borrowing but they can invest it at rates unavailable to the individual, and pocket the proceeds while they’re at it. And, on top of that, charge you for the privilege”

  • John Goss

    There is a big difference between the national debt of Greece and that of the US and UK but similarities too. What unites these debts, if honest trading was a principle, is that they all need to be paid. None of them can be paid, ever. If I heard correctly the IMF said that Greece should be given thirty years of grace before having to pay off its debt and should be forgiven some of it. So even the IMF is under no illusion. Ukraine’s debt is different.

    Ukraine in two days sees the anniversary of a passenger plane shot out of the sky killing almost 300 people including children. This is going to be another Lockerbie. The truth will have to be fought for by people like Patrick Haseldine who recently made available the news that the break-in at Heathrow was reported in our media. The reports appeared on 11 September 2001 when an event so devastating blew all other news stories out of existence for the next month and longer. The story disappeared for more than a decade. Such things do not happen by coincidence. But it enabled the conviction of an innocent man to get the Yanks off the hook.

    Ukraine has not made available its flight recording data and transcripts.
    The US has not made available its satellite or radar images.
    Data from the black boxes inspected in the UK has not been made available.

    There is talk of postponing the results of the inquiry which was due to report within 12 months of the tragedy.

    Unrest is building up between Poroshenko’s right-wing government and all the various nationalist regiments comprising the Kiev army.

    The country has been torn apart in a civil war.

    It looks likely to get worse with growing ponerization. This is not confined to the border with Eastern Ukraine but appears to be spreading west to the Transcarpathian region of Ukraine bordering with Poland, Romania, Slovakia, Hungary and other areas where smuggling has long been a problem.

  • Daniel

    May rejects the use of water cannon in England and Wales. However, their is a price to be paid for those who had the temerity to vote for the SNP who are now to be confronted with rubber bullets.

  • technicolour

    O/T – Breaking News – have been asked to share:

    ********Majority of the Central Committee of Syriza reject the deal *******
    Some *109 out of 201 members of the ruling body of the party have come out against the deal.
    The anti-deal majority comprises the Left Platform and the “group of 53” from the left of the old majority.
    Of course, the Tsipras leadership has concentrated executive and day to day power into its own hands. But this is a very big development. He does not have a majority in the constitutional leading body elected by the Congress.
    He will have to appeal for authority in the party to his own direct election at the Congress and to the populist appeal he has developed outside of the party’s structures.
    This is a statement by CC members. Not a vote at a meeting. The last CC meeting, I believe, was in May. (But other comrades can correct me on that.) The statement signed up to rejecting the deal also calls for a CC meeting to be convened immediately.
    There are more powerful things than Troikas, and prime ministers.
    (*) The figure is rising as more add their names to the statement.

  • Habbabkuk (la vita e' bella)

    Robert Crawford

    “If my debt was 89% of my GDP (income), I would be in deep financial crisis.”

    Not if you had a money printing press in your garden shed, Robert.

  • Habbabkuk (la vita e' bella)

    “It looks likely to get worse with growing ponerization. This is not confined to the border with Eastern Ukraine but appears to be spreading west to the Transcarpathian region of Ukraine bordering with Poland, Romania, Slovakia, Hungary …”


    Mr Goss appears rather happy at the prospect, doesn’t he.

  • lysias

    The debt owed to the U.S. by foreigners, which there is no realistic prospect of ever being paid off, is disguised tribute. It is paid for protection either through or from the armed might of the U.S. A protection racket, in other words. Something that helps to explain heavy U.S. military expenditures, and the political power of the military-industrial complex.

  • giyane

    Habbabkuk : “Conclusion : post only relevant material”

    means : only post material that I like.

    Turkey has been the loser in the 4 year old war against Syria. it urgently needs new regional allies. Construction in kurdistan has in effect come to a halt with hundreds of half-constructed projects by Turkish companies shot in the foot by Erdogan’s policies of sponsoring violent jihad.

    in view of the new determination of the Greek government not to be bullied by federalist German banks, and the relative safety of Europe over the mess Turkey has created in its own back yard, it is highly likely that the Turkish construction industry, which is at the heart of Erdogan’s political power, will invest in their European neighbour.

    Thierry Meyssan in the Voltaire platform ( again very much to the distaste of know-all twat Habbabkuk ) has described the reasons for the new shift in power in the Middle East.
    Russia has long realised that USUKIS jihad in all its mercenary manifestations in Syria Libya, etc is destined in the near future to be directed at them, after being used to force change in Iraq. Therefore Russia intends now to destroy Islamic State in Iraq before it arrives at their own doorstep.

    The lessons of the destruction of USUKIS Islamism in Grozny are that fighting USUKIS on your own doorstep is very bad publicity. Why else would USUKIS choose to launch a war on her doorstep in the Ukraine? a saviour war against Daesh in the Middle East would raise Russia’s standing in all of the region, owing to the fact that the Israeli project of Islamic State threatens Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia Yemen the Gulf States, North Africa etc

    With idiots in power in US UK and Israel of the monumental stupidity of David Cameron , Netanyahu and General petraus/ Hillary Clinton, is it surprising that USUKIS has been so cleverly outflanked by Putin?

    Please only post information that pleases the troll. His masters are shortly going to dumped in the bin Laden dust bin of history. international Socialism is raising its game, you Tory trash.

  • Republicofscotland

    Although I’m pleasently surprised that a deal was reached regarding Iran’s nuclear power programme, there are knock on consequences for other nations, specifically oil producing nations.

    Oil prices fell immediately as a result of the agreement to lift economic sanctions which will see a surge in Iran’s oil output of up to 60 per cent over the next 12 months.

    Brent crude prices dropped by $1.15 to $56.70 a barrel with US crude dropping by $1.05 to $51.15.

    While years of sanctions have caused underinvestment in Iranian oil even a modest increase in exports will bring oil prices further down.

    Given how oversupplied the market is with Saudi output at record highs, the mere prospect of new oil will only cause consternation in the industry, a significant reductio in cost to the consumer, will unlikely to be passed on.

  • Dave Hansell

    Robert Crawford,

    I believe hearty congratulations are in order as you appear to have been promoted from an individual to a Central Bank.

    Would it be too much trouble to share the knowledge and secret of your apparrant success?

    I could do with a few quid to get by, and no doubt others here are in the same position.

    Thanks in advance.

  • Tony_0pmoc

    The Iranians I have met, both through work and socially have been some of the most highly educated, nicest people I have ever met. I have not however been to Iran, but have a reasonable understanding of what all this nonsense is about.

    Meanwhile…I know its off topic…but what the hell..The moderator can delete it if he actually allows me to post it..

    If Jeremy Corbyn becomes leader of the Labour Party, I might not only vote again, I might vote Labour ( I am not completely convinced I have ever done that before (my Family were all Conservatives)) – but I might have done once…If Jeremy Corbyn becomes leader of the Labour Party..I might even apply to become a Member of The Labour Party…

    I am a Left Wing Capitalist.

    I have checked his voting record in Parliament – and he ticks most (but not all) of my boxes.

    No one is perfect..But Jeremy Corbyn is by Far the Best They Have got…The rest are all Neocon Blairite [email protected] more Right Wing than the Bloody Tories.

    There is supposed to be some kind of “Compassionate” Opposition Here
    that will get Everyone Back to Work and Doing Something Useful…Earning Money and Creating something instead of sitting on the dole being Terrorised by Anthony Charles Lynton Blair and His Neocon Fans currently in Government.

    We need an Opposition. At the moment we haven’t got one.


  • Robert Crawford

    Dave Hansell.

    Oh, if what you say is true. I would be living in Switzerland.

    If you ask your bank for an overdraft of say, £500-00 to £1,000-00 they will charge you £1-00 per day interest, not much you might say until you do the sums.

    On £1,000-00 that equals 36-5%. Say the bank loans two people £500-00 the same interest will apply, that equals 73%. Loan shark rates is it not?.

    If is was my £1,000-00 that the bank had loaned out, I would receive 3% = £30.00 p.a. The bank rakes in £365.00 or £730.00 p.a..

    Nice work if you can get it. Without any interference from H M’s Government.

  • glenn

    Robert: My bank will charge me £1.00/day in fees, interest comes on top of that. Naturally if I went over the o/d limit, there would be a substantial fee on top of the regular fee, plus interest.

    But I disagree about your “deep financial trouble” diagnosis if you had debt representing 89% of your annual income. Most people have far more than that outstanding on their mortgages, but even if you exclude that, people routinely buy new cars (at something like £99/week with £5K down), and end up owing sums far beyond the average salary.


    You say in another post the following:

    If the bank creates money that does not exist and lends this fictitious money, then the bankers should be prosecuted. This does not happen. We allow it, we get to pay for it, fools.

    But this is the only way it could possibly happen – to create money – or we would be subject to constant deflation. The population rises, inflation rises, people do have more money over time (on aggregate, anyway). Where is this money going to come from, if the banks don’t create it?

    If a certain number of pounds was called into existence say 500 years ago, and no more created since, there would only be that same amount allowed to circulate – that and that only, nothing else.

    Consider the US – the population has gone up 10-fold in the last 150 years (roughly). Should each individual have – on average – only a 1/10th today, that his counterpart held 150 years ago?

    We can talk some more about the fractional reserve banking system sometime if you like, but printing money all the time is the only way to make the current system work.

  • Republicofscotland

    Tim Farron looks likely to be elected to leader of the LibDem party tomorrow, Mr Farron’s rival Norman Lamb, could still pip him at the post.

    The Libdems who had a dismal showing at the General Election with around just 8% of the vote and eight seats, are likely to tack left, to steal some support from a ponderous and unsure Labour party.

    Both Farron and Lamb look set to attack Labour over their weak left approach, hoping to out score them on issues like welfare and housing.

    According to some reports the LibDems have already held talks with the Greens Caroline Lucas, on how they can form a progressive alliance.

    In my opinion the LibDems are still toxic, and it will take much more than a swing to the left for them to regain the publics trust, however the usual suspects have gone (hopefully Carmichael will follow soon) and as they say, tomorrow is a new day.

  • RobG

    14 Jul, 2015 – 11:30 pm

    15 Jul, 2015 – 2:31 am

    Craig you are entirely correct; and in a way, Fred is also correct.

    I read so many different figures bandied around about how much in debt various countries are. Here’s some from the Economist…

    I suppose my contention is that Greece is portrayed by the media as some kind of basketcase, with the Greeks lounging around in the sun drinking ouzo, having only themselves to blame. Whereas the reality is that countries like the UK are also up a certain creek without a paddle, and we don’t even have sunshine to lounge around in.

    Anyhows, as I type this it looks like the Greek parliament is going to reject the latest package…

    I could also add that if the same crisis were happening in the UK there would be absolute mayhem on the streets. The Greeks, to their great credit, have thus far resisted mass civil unrest; although that might change this evening.

    I’ll also repeat what I think I said earlier in this thread: Finland, another European country with a small population, is presently going through mega economic problems, almost on a par with Greece, yet we never hear about Finland.

    I wonder why that is? It might be because Finland is governed by a center-right party, whereas we all know who Greece is governed by.

    The way the Greek debt crisis is being handled is almost entirely political. There’s no way that ‘they’ would allow a left wing anti-austerity party to triumph.

    Imagine the precedent it would set?!

    SNP beware…

  • Robert Crawford


    Do you know that if the U.K. and the U.S.A. were to pay off all their debt to-morrow there would not be a single pound or dollar in circulation?.

    Do you also know that it is with inflation that governments pay their debts?.

    I think that most of the population suffer from, Stockholm Syndrome.

  • glenn

    Robert: Yes, but actually there’d be less than no money left, if all debts were paid. Because the debts include interest accrued on the money banks created and loaned out – which is now more than the total amount available.

    Banks create money, loan it, eventually it is all given back – but the interest remains. The only way to repay the interest is with further loans (i.e. money created by the bank), and round and round we go.

    Have you read “The New Golden Age”, by professor of economics Ravi Battra? Interesting stuff:

  • Robert Crawford


    I think you need to change your bank.

    The public think they cannot switch banks when they owe money to their bank,WRONG.
    Other banks will pay off your debt to get your business if they see you as a good customer potentially.

  • doug scorgie

    14 Jul, 2015 – 4:47 pm

    “Tensions in the South American country have been high since the government of Rafael Correa introduced two bills aimed at redistributing wealth and improving inequality in the country. Political opposition factions have largely rejected the president’s calls for dialogue, choosing to engage instead in street protests…”

    Yes RobG

    The above paragraph could equally be about Venezuela; same US tactics.
    Democracy is only tolerated by western powers if it delivers the ‘right’ result.

    Redistributing wealth and improving on inequality is a capital (ist) crime.

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