UPDATE
I am prepared to acknowledge that, given the gate design, they could have passed through different gates in exact synchronicity and this may be a red herring. I am leaving this post up here as it is good to acknowledge mistakes. Please read my updated post Skripals – The Mystery Deepens
Russia has developed an astonishing new technology enabling its secret agents to occupy precisely the same space at precisely the same time.
These CCTV images released by Scotland yard today allegedly show Alexander Petrov and Ruslan Boshirov both occupying exactly the same space at Gatwick airport at precisely the same second. 16.22.43 on 2 March 2018. Note neither photo shows the other following less than a second behind.
There is no physically possible explanation for this. You can see ten yards behind each of them, and neither has anybody behind for at least ten yards. Yet they were both photographed in the same spot at the same second.
The only possible explanations are:
1) One of the two is travelling faster than Usain Bolt can sprint
2) Scotland Yard has issued doctored CCTV images/timeline.
I am going with the Met issuing doctored images.
UPDATE
A number of people have pointed out a third logical possibility, that the photographs are not of the same place and they are coming through different though completely identical entry channels. The problem with that is the extreme synchronicity. You can see from the photos that the channel(s) are enclosed and quite long, and they would have had to enter different entrances to the channels. So it is remarkable they were at exactly the same point at the same time. Especially as one of them appears to be holding (wheeled?) luggage and one has only a shoulder bag.
I have traveled through Gatwick many times but cannot call to mind precisely where they are. Can anybody pinpoint the precise place in the airport? Before or after passport control? Before or after baggage collection? Before or after customs? The only part of the airport this looks like to me is shortly after leaving the plane after the bridge, and before joining the main gangway to passport control – in which case passengers are not split into separated channels at the stage this was taken. I can’t recall any close corridors as long as this after passport control. But I am open to correction.
Please read my updated post Skripals – The Mystery Deepens
So the paranoid conspiracy theorists POV is these people do not exist, have never been anywhere of interest and just popped in for a wee trip as you do. That must be true then? Perhaps there are no such alias’s on the manifests supplied to UK immigration too and the hotel they stayed at in London is an MI6 safe house? LOL you lot need to get out and live in the real world like the sane.
I don´t know if this is in the comments already (no time to read 800 or so entries)..
https://imgur.com/a/PV7Bhi9
I have always believed that British police or other security, were told by British government who were told by the EU to make up these and other lies to put the British people against Russia, the EU have been trying to provoke Russia for years now and their control of the British government in this matter is disturbing, this picture proves some serious lies exist.
Roflmfao
What a crackpot you are.
It’s odd that Novichok was found in their hotel room given that they allegedly deployed it after they checked out of the room. This suggests that the Novichok was not in a properly sealed container but was leaking. Can’t think of any reason they’d want to unseal it in their hotel room.
I truly believe that this is all made up by the Tory party to take the spotlight off them while they do something sinister to us the public, they think they are good at covering things up but they keep slipping up.
The images released by the met police show a different time! On 43 and the othe 48 seconds!
So what is the problem?
The problem is that they both show 43.
Find your specs, both 43, but I thought the same as you at first!
I believe that they have both arrived together at the security gates that lead into the arrivals hall at North Terminal at Gatwick – there are 4 separate gates that lead into the hall all looking the same but could be the reason there is slightly different angles on the cameras. It would not be out of the realm of possibility that they walked through each corridor at exactly at the same time if they were walking together before reaching the security gates. I am a chauffeur driver and spend a lot of my time at Gatwick doing meet and greets, so that’s the reason for my sad and possible observation ?
Why did you aver that there were only TWO possible explanations. THis is what gives Conspretards a bad name.
Conspretards?
Has anyone else noticed that really thick people have started to post on here in the last few days?
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.1611377,-0.1773794,2a,75y,171.63h,90.02t/data=!3m10!1e1!3m8!1sVwMbNKWSg8PjuWKakaOeaA!2e0!5s20170901T000000!7i13312!8i6656!9m2!1b1!2i38?hl=en
These look like different gates. Notice the position of the cameras. These are static cameras so why is one at a slightly different angle than the other?
Because one of the images has been reversed. See the link in wimsie52’s post above.
Those images are superimposed not reversed and are at a different angle
Have you ever fitted a camera and had to align it exactly? (both the camera within the housing and the housing to the support bar)
The time (expense) to have both perfectly aligned would put you out of business. Both are perfectly fit for purpose albeit slightly misaligned. The clear geometric features of the walkways and the wide angle lens exaggerate the error and appear to narrow the walkway.
THE UK GOVERNMENT ARE LYING TRASH AND HAVE BEEN RESPONSIBLE FOR THE MURDER OF MANY PEOPLE IN THIS COUNTRY WHO WERE ABOUT TO EXPOSE THEM FOR WHAT THEY ARE EVIL DEGENERATE VERMIN.
No need for caps…
Beautifully expressed, mate. My sentiments precisely!
It has now been shown that there are five identical lanes at the exit point from Gatwick. It is most likely that the two individuals reached the lanes at the same time and split to go into adjacent lanes and could very easily therefore have been caught on camera at exactly the same time.
I agree it did look very suspect as you mentioned but now with more information on the physical layout at the exit from Gatwick I believe there is an innocent expanation for the simultaneous timestamps.
However I still see no evidence that links these two individuals to the Skripal incident. We are told the security forces don’t know their real names (assumed to have false ones on the passports) so in which case how do they even know they are Russian?
Also if you check the images… The ANGLE of the images are different, implying that a CCTV fixed camera was moved in between times … Not seen that before. A narrow corridor like this would not require a variable angled or movable camera…
Perhaps it was decided that by using a pan, tilt and zoom camera in the design it would allow them to play a bit with the angles, zoom and focus to see what worked best in real life conditions. Or else they decided that a dome camera was more aesthetically pleasing or more tamper/vandal resistant than a fixed housing. Having done the adjustments after a few test passengers, they would probably never be altered again, but it could also explain why they are at slightly different angles. One operators idea of what’s best would differ marginally from another’s. Even the same person adjusting the same camera twice running would almost certainly hit on slightly different angles.
Camera’s are at different angles, so has to be two corridors maybe. Or can anyone prove the pic has been cut down to allow new time stamps to be added. Does one of them have a case, it just looks like a blurry arm movement to me. Unsure, who knows!
The camera angles are slightly different , and you would expect them to go through seperate channels. If they walked at exactly the same speed the photos would be taken at the same time. Not impossible at all.
Chaz? Are you serious??? or do you have a vested interest in fooling Jo Public?
“The camera angles are slightly different , and you would expect them to go through separate channels. If they walked at exactly the same speed the photos would be taken at the same time. Not impossible at all.”
Not impossible but extremely unlikely!
More unlikely than the Police producing more convincing fakes? Howler!
I estimate the camera angles differ by 11 degrees of rotation. A difference in tilt and azimuth is plausible for a tilt pan camera, but not a difference due to rotation. An 11 degree rotation on a 10 cm camera base plate would be an offset of 2cm, nobody is that sloppy in fitting. Meta data makes it clear that the files have in fact been edited. This does not mean nobody went through the gates, but it may mean that the data has been prettified before release to the press and in the process of doing this, the last editor just overlaid the same time stencil on the images.
The time stencils are pixel identical in shape, but differ in brightness values of corresponding pixels between the two images with corresponding grey pixels on CCTV2 being 10% darker. One can accept that the overall colour balance and brightness of the background image could be different in two pictures from different cameras, but if a time stencil is digitally overlaid as the image is captured, then the interior of the characters will
a) be pixel identical in shape
b) be pixel by identical in brightness
If the shape is exactly retained whilst brightnesses of corresponding pixels are significantly different, then the most plausible reason is that someone has tweaked the gamma values after superimposing the stencil. There is unequivocal evidence of tampering in the metadata, there are artefacts consistent with mirror imaging and rotation, and there are alterations to the grey levels of the stencil. So there was certainly a substantial amount of editing.
As I say this does not prove that the people questioned did not fly in via Gatwick and take a train to Salisbury. It does mean that we can not place great reliance on the timestamps in the pictures which may have been added for artistic/presentational effect.
“It does mean that we can not place great reliance on the timestamps in the pictures which may have been added for artistic/presentational effect.”
.
“…….added for artistic/presentational effect”
Is that a euphemism for ‘faked’?
Logically thinking, these security snaps are complete lies.
The government and Scotland Yard need to come up with there excuse immediately, before they are accuse and exposed as fraudulently trying to lie to the whole country!
So, to all the doubters…..
What would convince you that Russia was involved. Be careful what you post as I too will claim it could be fabricated.
Why are the SNP supporting the UK Security Services?
They’re clearly different gates. Look at the perspective angles of the gates at in the distance, the verticals and the black border at the top left of the first image. The photos are quite obviously taken by two different CCTV cameras mounted at slightly different heights in different entry gates. Case closed.
https://postimg.cc/image/x1ixk7r4x/
No. This link to a graphic proves the image is flipped and rotated roughly 20%. It proves its the same corridor. It proves fabrication thus exposes the whole skripal affair.
If you look at the design of the gates, the lighting and the camera mounts – all gates are nominally identical and symmetrical. I would not be surprised that you could do minor rotations and flips and get a very similar overlay. The quality and lack of unique features are not sufficient to say it is proof of being the same gate.
I accept that for example the walls show differences but they are semi-transparent. The clincher for me is the way the moveable gates next to their associated railings (appearing adjacent to their hands) have different gaps, yet that is corrected once flipped.
This looks like the last gate before you enter the public area, after customs, passports and baggage collection!.
These images are taken at different angles . If you were to put one top of the other they would not line up . These are two different images . They are obviously cropped , but the time date recorded I cannot explain .
If the two images were taken from the same static securiity camera, all non-moving visible objects (e.g. the borders of the wall panels) should superimpose perfectly between the two images. However, this is not the case, indicating that the camera position/angle was slightly different between the two photos. This is consistent with the photos being taken in two near-identical (perhaps adjoining) security channels in which the camera alignments were not perfectly identical. I totally disagree that you can see 10 yards behind each man (as claimed in the article)…. more like three yards, max. These images are consistent with two people walking side by side down an airport corridor, with nobody very close behind them, and then walking separately thorough parallel security channels of 2-3 yards in length, thereby being photographed at the security gate within 1 second of each other. Ergo, there is nothing fishy here at all, as far as I can see.
The truth is the majority of idiots here don’t think logically and cannot accept any theory other than their own.
To test this just ask any of them what would convince them, and you’ll get a confession from Putin himself (which of course could be a sarcastic one or obtained under duress or meant as a joke).
Here we go again,
What would convince the doubters that Russia was involved.
Of course, there will be no worthwhile reply as ultimately they support Russia.
This is what my mate had to say when I suggested it was two cameras ~ You do the maths on the likelihood of both suspects emerging at precisely the same moment, in the same place in the tunnel on the same day from the same plane, even at different ends of the plane. I have never emerged from a plane without someone immediately before or after me and I have been on a lot of planes. I have also worked with photoshop and can tell you that the ray-tracing and feathering are wrong. THERE should be a dark shadow on the floor In Both cases if they are the same height. Their shadows are incongruous. The man who taught me photoshop worked on the Titanic movie amongst others and this is an example of sloppy production. Professional but sloppy. Trace the rays from the near overhead lights, it doesn’t work. Zoom in on the hair (soft surface) and the hard surfaces. The spray painting of light haze goes from upper left to lower right and is practically a signature of the technician. This has come at far to convenient a time too.
Maybe your mate hasn’t entered the UK at an airport as a Non-EU citizen?
“You do the maths on the likelihood of both suspects emerging at precisely the same moment, in the same place in the tunnel on the same day from the same plane, even at different ends of the plane.”
Why? Can’t you?
“I have never emerged from a plane without someone immediately before or after me and I have been on a lot of planes.
You don’t need to be Mr Frequent Flyer to know that usually people emerge from planes individually.
The problem is that emergence from planes has absolutely nothing to do with the question here. Do you recall anything about baggage collection, immigration, and customs, or do you always lose contact with whoever you’re travelling with until you’ve got to the arrivals hall? What a load of crap!
“The man who taught me photoshop worked on the Titanic movie.
My father knew Lloyd George.
I’m wondering whether the now debunked “single channel” rubbish is going to become an agreed point of reference among “truthers”. That’d be quite good in a way, because it would be a good indicator for sensible critics of state shenanigans of who to keep away from. I really hope Craig withdraws it fast.
Please! They’re two different channels, and it’s not suspicious that two people travelling together were at similar positions in them at the same moment in time. Russian Foreign Ministry spokesperson Maria Zakharova and former British ambassador Craig Murray are both mistaken about this.
I’ve already told Maria to pay a forfeit. Craig?
For something more interesting, take a look at my work on the City Stay Hotel in Bow where Boshirov and Petrov allegedly stayed.
Probably they stayed there because it’s close to Bow Road tube station. But who knows what some shitty landlords, one of whom is married to a Labour councillor who fell into disgrace around the time the City Stay Hotel got searched, may have been up to?
They walked through different channels at the same time! Enough of the conspiracy theories, they are not helpful!
Unless the CCTV camera moved at the exact same time then these are not the same entrance . In the top picture the angle is different and the timestamp is mostly inside the rail , the bottom one has the timestamp partially obscured by the rail , they cant be from the same camera or logically at the same precise moment . So my guess the timestamps are altered and whoever altered them was too lazy to have altered to slightly different times .
You’re trying to prove a point that even the author has now given up on.
Why would you have to alter them at all?
It is fascinating, trying to work out who is dishonestly trying to promote the Kremlin-Murray “same channel” line (that hopefully Craig will soon drop) and who is in possession of a mind that is thinking up reasons to believe it. Someone at a Brit cyberwar facility must be laughing in to their Earl Grey!
Ah @Bu axmoqlik – Glad to hear that Craig has given up on this. It was a good idea and worth posting. It has been debunked. Let’s move on.
I’m assuming you mean Craig when you say “the author” and not Maria Zakharova.
That gives a shift it does not give a rotational transform which the pictures have.
According to http://www.airportia.com/flights/su2588/moscow/london/, SU2588 from Moscow landed in Gatwick at 15.58 on 2 March. That means in just 24 minutes, the plane was parked at the gate, the passengers disembarked and these two made it through passport control (the slow queue for non EU), and then onto customs and final exit where this photo was taken. They must have been in business class (front of the plane), hand luggage only, ran like hell, and no queues at passport control to have made it to this point in 24 minutes.
No bags, no queue.
You’re trying to prove a point that even the author has now given up on.
It does not seem impossible for it to be 24 minutes. They clearly have next to no luggage. Suspiciously little for one or two nights stay, and especially because they potentially are carrying super, super dangerous nerve agent.
The only issue is was there a delay at passport control. Particularly if they had travelled on the same visa before, they would be subject to one or two token questions and be on their way. The photos do not appear to show that the area was busy – but you do get mid afternoon lulls at airports.
Your poor observational skills and lack of knowledge in this particular matter have caused me to doubt your abilities in any of your self appointed offices.
He’s admitted this is bullshit now. Yet his drones keep on commenting lol.
At the press conference given yesterday by Assistant Commissioner, Neil Basu and the Chief Medical Officer, Dame Sally Davies yesterday (5.9.2018) when these photographs were issued of Petrov and Boshirov, a third person was present. This was Ruth Shulver who apparently is “Acting Head of Media for the Metropolitan Police” formerly Head of Communication for Surrey Police. She joined the Met Police and interestingly was the Press Officer for the July 7th 2005 London bombings. On Linked-In she is still listed as being at Surrey, so it appears she moved immediately prior to the press conference. https://www.facebook.com/RTUKnews/videos/1149304318563052/?comment_id=1149321511894666&reply_comment_id=1149323075227843¬if_id=1536145303497080¬if_t=video_reply
Is this the Ruth Shulver who is a director of the property scumbag outfit Ventura 28 Estate Management Limited alongside Zahoor Niazi, the long-time editor of the Daily Jang (perhaps he still is?) who was accused of racism when he allegedly called at a Friends of the Conservatives meeting for audience members to “pledge” to back Pakistani Muslim candidates whichever party they were standing for?
Today’s theme is the business arrangements that connect clean-as-a-whistle public servants with local landlords in parts of London such as Bow and Dulwich.
The same timestamps is no mystery. This photograph at Gatwick shows there are several lanes at the arrival gates. The two guys simply took different lanes. Perfectly normal. That also explains the slightly different camera angle.
http://www.moonofalabama.org/2018/09/a-curious-timestamp-in-the-new-novichok-evidence.html#more
It is the same bloke, taken from just one frame, then made into two completely new pictures.
I doubt these blokes even exist at all, outside of a hard drive.