E-liar Manningham Buller 56

Eliza Manningham-Buller, former head of MI5, is engaged in an outrageous attempt to rewrite history, by claiming we were unaware that the CIA was getting intelligence from torture.


The government knew the CIA was sending us intelligence from torture from at least November 2002, when I sent a diplomatic telegram to Jack Straw and others – including MI5 – informing them so. I repeated it in February 2003, and was called back to a meeting on March 7 2003 where I was told that, as a matter of policy in the War on Terror, we were using intelligence from torture. Sir Michael Wood said at the meeting that in his opinion this policy was not contrary to international law.

I have made available indisputable documentary evidence of this, and that the policy of using intelligence from torture was sanctioned by Jack Straw:

Download file“>Download file

Download file“>Download file

Download file“>Download file

The redactions were made by the government.

I am astounded that, having obtained the first two documents under the Freedom of Information Act last November, no mainstream media outlet will mention them and refer to them, despite acres of reporting on whether Ministers had an intelligence from torture policy.

Plainly these documents disprove entirely the Eliza Mannigham Buller claims that we did not know. But don’t expect to see them referred to in the media.

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56 thoughts on “E-liar Manningham Buller

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  • John


    “I am astounded that, having obtained the first two documents under the Freedom of Information Act last November, no mainstream media outlet will mention them and refer to them, despite acres of reporting on whether Ministers had an intelligence from torture policy”.

    Is this not good reason for starting your own TV forum–a programme of current political events?

    The present mafia crowd are not serving democracy, or human rights–and are getting away with cover-ups, due to a complicit media.

    You may need some donations to start–if you do seriously start–include me for a donation. I’m sure shareholders will follow the success of such an obviously needed venture.

  • anno

    Dame Edna Everidge stated last night that she was astonished to find, AFTER all this time, that she was a man!

    Reverse all the other statements by this shameless UK establishment, and you are somewhere in line with reality.

  • dizzy


    It occurs to me that you are covered by a DA-notice. It would explain many failures by corporate media to mention you.

  • Ingo

    I was as flabbergasted hearing this barefaced announcements by her than you are.

    Why is the establishment keeping this issue in the news, are they really that guilty that they have ignored their own methods?

    Fact seems to be that everything you have achieved and nailed on to the mast is frozen out.

    The media is playing their electioneering games and on the issue of torture there is even less than a fagpaper of difference between all of them so it looks like.

    John’s idea is not bad and with digital technology this could be done, no doubt somebody on here would be able to give a ball point figure of costs.

    What would be the biggest hurdle is that every last fibre left in this rotten system would oppose the idea and start throwing all sorts of hurdles in the way.

    How about using a more liberal country such as Holland to set it up?, getting a company like ENDEMOl interested in producing a pilot, but have the studio here and do the programme here, studio’s are struggling, at least here in Norwich.

  • writerman

    The mainstream, corporate, media, are not “free” to just report anything they like for whatever reason. What is left out is often more interesting than what’s left in, for example Craig’s torture evidence.

    It doesn’t take much effort to “kill” unfortunate information, that undermines the government’s carefully constructed facade, just a few phone calls pointing out the national security implications of publication of “secret” information.

    Of course the system doesn’t even need direct intervention, the elaborate filtering processes involved in selecting leading journalists and editors, exclude those individuals who don’t exhibit due respect for our core democratic values, and respect for vested interests and power. People learn what’s expected of them, if they seriously wish to succeed in their careers. Access to success can be removed just as quickly as it can be taken away. The “is he one of us” rule.

  • mary

    Your piece has been linked on Medialens Craig. The facts are both shocking and outrageous. The barbarians are certainly in power.

    I read this yesterday on Medialens and I found that I was barely able to read the details of waterboarding.

    We don’t torture we’re a civilised nation

    Posted by Hidari on March 10, 2010, 7:57 am

    ‘Recently released internal documents reveal the controversial “enhanced interrogation” practice… was administered with meticulous cruelty.

    Interrogators pumped detainees full of so much water that the CIA turned to a special saline solution to minimize the risk of death, the documents show. The agency used a gurney “specially designed” to tilt backwards at a perfect angle to maximize the water entering the prisoner’s nose and mouth, intensifying the sense of choking ?” and to be lifted upright quickly in the event that a prisoner stopped breathing.

    The documents also lay out, in chilling detail, exactly what should occur in each two-hour waterboarding “session.” Interrogators were instructed to start pouring water right after a detainee exhaled, to ensure he inhaled water, not air, in his next breath. They could use their hands to “dam the runoff” and prevent water from spilling out of a detainee’s mouth. They were allowed six separate 40-second “applications” of liquid in each two-hour session ?” and could dump water over a detainee’s nose and mouth for a total of 12 minutes a day. Finally, to keep detainees alive even if they inhaled their own vomit during a session ?” a not-uncommon side effect of waterboarding ?” the prisoners were kept on a liquid diet. The agency recommended Ensure Plus.’


    (Headline, of course, a reference to this :


  • anno

    We all know we are censored, but it is still amusing to read Larry from US, peeing himself because stuff that has been censored is seeing the light of day.

    writerman, please don’t tell us we have been misinformed. It’s like asking someone who’s been electric shock therapied if they thought the treatment had worked.

  • Strategist

    Once again, the scandal for me isn’t only that the Dame should emerge from retirement to spin the lie that knowledge of the torture policy (& hence the responsibility for collusion) didn’t go to the very top, it’s that there should be so little challenge to her obvious lies by the media.

    BBC Radio 4’s “security correspondent” Gordon Carrera cannot have a defence that he is ignorant of the documents you have obtained & publicised; if he is then he shouldn’t be holding that job. Therefore we must surmise that he is deliberately not broadcasting what he knows as part of a joined up attempt to get the Dame Elizas and Jack Straws of the world off the hook for what they know could be an arrest warrant & indictment awaiting them on any trip abroad to a country signed up to the Intermational War Crimes tribunal.

  • dreoilin

    I looked at her on the screen and (not recognising her immediately) thought, “Who is this idiot?”

    Clear as day now.

    I look back at my teens and twenties and remember how I took everything I heard on the News as truthful and accurate. Have things got vastly worse, or were they always like this?

  • dreoilin

    No, my bad, I saw her reported.

    The one I didn’t recognise when I saw her speaking was Baroness Butler-Sloss. Not Baroness Manningham Buller. They all look the same to me (j/k!).

  • Strategist

    I hadn’t noticed that Dame E-liar has now been ennobled by Labour to become Baroness Porkypie.

    So she gets a seat for life in the House of Lords. No wonder she’s anxious to spin a tale to explain away the bloodstains all over her ermine.

    Craig’s previous post was “the election: what’s the point?”. After all the fun & games, on 7 May, Lady Porky will still have a seat for life in our legislature, unembarrassed by any action by the media or Amnesty International.

    A democracy with a free media? My fucking arse.

  • MJ

    “it is still amusing to read Larry from US, peeing himself because stuff that has been censored is seeing the light of day”

    Was that on this thread? Can’t find it. Has Craig censored it?

  • ingo

    mary, are you sure it was not an expression of disgust at the stench that eminates through the House, maybe you misheard him saying ‘odour,odour’?

  • mary

    Quite Ingo. Augean stables. A shovel and wheelbarrow is urgently needed.

    As a woman I never understand how other women like these monsters E M-B and Pauline Neville-Jones, and others, make this dirty business their life’s work. A woman naturally creates life and nurtures the children. These women are involved in doing the very opposite.

    I see that E M-B (do they all have double barrelled names?) had a strange father, nicknamed Bullying-Manners by Bernard Levin. All chips off the old block and products of our rotten class system.


  • MI5

    someone should give her a taste of some torture then she might start tellling the truth or waking up

  • Jives

    Well indeed.

    The plot is thickening and the guilty are panicking to cover their guilt.

    Most interesting.

  • anno

    O dear, O dear

    Every time chemical Ali was accused of something he said ‘Alhamdulillah’ i.e. yes, thank God, I did it.

    If this lot were brought to trial, they would say the same because they really believe that working for the narrow interests of the UK, and ignoring the sufferings of all others, is a worthy cause.

    This level of lying, self-justification and lack of remorse proves that they are the same as the dictator they deposed in Iraq. No they have not murdered thousands of their critics, but they will go on to murder thousands of others in the future because the UK public still take their word on trust.

    Same as chemical Ali’s conscience was clean about murdering Shi’a and Kurds, these establishment bastards’ consciences are clean about the murder and torture of foreigners.

    Was it the same jinns that told Blair and Bush to invade Iraq, as told the Yorkshire Ripper to murder prostitutes?

    They have been subjected to the same de-humanising processes in their training as the worst regimes. Indeed OUR trainers taught the dictators’ training staff.

    When we put Doom Eliza on the scaffold, she has the excuse that her humanity was destroyed in her training. Comfort for her before her head is cut off.

  • dreoilin

    Reginald Edward Manningham-Buller, Viscount Dilhorne, Lord High Chancellor. Gilbert and Sullivan would have had a field day. All that’s needed is a Lord High Executioner.

    I am the very model of a modern Major-General

    I’ve information vegetable, animal, and mineral …

  • tony_opmoc

    Most people believe what they read in the newspapers, just as much as they believe what they see in the news on TV. Anyone who proposes an alternative analysis of some real event, is dismissed as a nutter or a wild conspiracy theorist, to be mentally bracketed within the cult of David Icke.

    The Independent piece is a very heavy piece of propaganda. The strong message is not about “US hid torture tactics from UK”, but is subtley contained within, and mentally consumed without any critical reasoning, passing the neural taste buds without question.

    “Guantanamo Bay”, “9/11 attacks”, “provided his captors with useful intelligence”, “She was surprised at the extent of the information coming”…

    The message is basically, that he did 9/11 and he was held in Guantanamo Bay because he was an evil terrorist, and the security services were completely justified in the action they took, because of all the information it revealed, to save us from even more dastardly attacks from these incredibly evil people.

    So “Carry on Torturing. You Know it Makes Sense”.

    Whilst most of the audience just want the torture to be followed by execution, and think the authorities are soft for releasing him. It never occurs to them that they have probably tortured someone who is completely innocent.

    The Politicians are thus condemned for being too soft. The Audience wants More Torture, More Executions, More Blood.

    Check out the film 1984.

    The Independent is Disgraceful in its Complicity.


  • dreoilin

    “The plot is thickening and the guilty are panicking to cover their guilt.”

    Craig will be vindicated. Watch things roll.

  • dreoilin

    “She was surprised at the extent of the information coming from Mr Mohamed as Britain’s previous experience of questioning terrorism suspects during the Troubles in Northern Ireland was that they remained silent.”

    Bullshit. Is that to cover the use of water-torture there too? Because I have no doubt that they spoke, and told many things. Nobody’s superhuman. Nobody’s immune to torture. The IRA were just men and women, not super-demons.

    “British Army officers subjected prisoners in Northern Ireland to controversial “waterboarding” interrogation techniques during the 1970s, it has been reported.”


  • Kite

    Funnily enough, the university which gave birth and is home to The Mile End Group is Harold Pinter’s old college, Queen Mary University.

    It’s come a long way since then, loads of government funding its development.

    Not too many pintoresque characters as speakers. They seem mostly to come from the opposite end of the political spectrum.

  • anno

    What is achieved by these evil acts? Is it the adrenolin of lying, like my ex-wife?

    Is it revenge for a damaged childhood? Is it the thrill of legal criminality? Is it camouflage for the rest of the FCO Chilcot liars? To let us quickly lose focus on the load of lying tripe ALL the other diplomats and politicians at Chilcot have said?

    Yes, all of these things, but worst of all they drag the good name of the UK and ourselves through their own disgrace.

  • Richard Robinson

    Several reports have noted that the British Army (in Iraq. I haven’t noticed them re: Afghanistan yet) are still doing the things they promised the ?European Court of Human Rights? they’d never do again, back in the ’70s. (I think that’s who it went to, can’t remember exactly). I haven’t noticed any reports that the court plans to follow it up.

  • Charles Crawford


    You keep serving up these documents as if they prove your case. Read them. They don’t.

    Where in those records or otherwise are the statements supporting your claim that “…I was told that, as a matter of policy in the War on Terror, we were using intelligence from torture. Sir Michael Wood said at the meeting that in his opinion this policy was not contrary to international law”?

    I can’t see them. Can anyone else?

    And (to repeat) when the specific issue you raised (namely that HMG’s possession of material known or suspected to have come from torture ipso facto amounted to ‘complicity’ in torture under the Convention) went to the House of Lords, the Law Lords flatly rejected your view.

    Time to move on?


  • Vivian

    @ Charles Crawford

    The complicity arises in MI5 officers being present at and providing questions in the knowledge that answers will be extracted under torture.

    Neither the Law Lords nor the Supreme Court have looked at this new evidence, but it’s clear that three very senior judges have done so.

    Do you remember what they said?

    No wonder you want to move on.

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