Not Forgetting the al-Hillis 22281

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The mainstream media for the most part has moved on. But there are a few more gleanings to be had, of perhaps the most interesting comes from the Daily Mirror, which labels al-Hilli an extremist on the grounds that he was against the war in Iraq, disapproved of the behaviour of Israel and had doubts over 9/11 – which makes a great deal of the population “extremist”. But the Mirror has the only mainstream mention I can find of the possibility that Mossad carried out the killings. Given Mr al-Hilli’s profession, the fact he is a Shia, the fact he had visited Iran, and the fact that Israel heas been assassinating scientists connected to Iran’s nuclear programme, this has to be a possibility. There are of course other possibilities, but to ignore that one is ludicrous.

Which leads me to the argument of Daily Mail crime reporter, Stephen Wright, that the French police should concentrate on the idea that this was a killing by a random Alpine madman or racist bigot. Perfectly possible, of course, and the anti-Muslim killings in Marseille might be as much a precedent as Mossad killings of scientists. But why the lone madman idea should be the preferred investigation, Mr Wright does not explain. What I did find interesting from a man who has visited many crime scenes are his repeated insinuations that the French authorities are not really trying very hard to find who the killers were, for example:

the crime scene would have been sealed off for a minimum of seven to ten days, to allow detailed forensic searches for DNA, fibres, tyre marks and shoe prints to take place.
Nearby bushes and vegetation would have been searched for any discarded food and cigarette butts left by the killer, not to mention the murder weapon.
But from what I saw at the end of last week, no such searches had taken place and potentially vital evidence could have been missed. House to house inquiries in the local area had yet to be completed and police had not made specific public appeals for information about the crime. No reward had been put up for information about the shootings.
Behind the scenes, what other short cuts have been taken? Have police seized data identifying all mobile phones being used in the vicinity of the murders that day?

The idea that the French authorities – who are quite as capable as any other of solving cases – are not really trying very hard is an interesting one.

Which leads me to this part of a remarkable article from the Daily Telegraph, which if true points us back towards a hit squad and discounts the ides that there was only one gun:

Claims that only one gun was used to kill everybody is likely to be disproved by full ballistics test results which are out in October.
While the 25 spent bullet cartridges found at the scene are all of the same kind, they could in fact have come from a number of weapons of the same make.
This throws up the possibility of a well-equipped, highly-trained gang circling the car and then opening fire.
Both children were left alive by the killers, who had clinically pumped bullets into everybody else, including five into Mr Mollier.
Zainab was found staggering around outside the car by Brett Martin, a British former RAF serviceman who cycled by moments after the attack, but he saw nobody except the schoolgirl.
Her sister, Zeena, was found unscathed and hiding in the car eight hours later.
Both sisters are now back in Britain, and are believed to have been reunited at a secret location near London.

There are of course a number of hit squad options, both governmental and private, which might well involve iraqi or Iranian interests – on both of which the mainstream media have been very happy to speculate while almost unanimously ignoring Israel.

But what interests me is why the Daily Telegraph choose, in the face of all the evidence, to minimise the horrific nature of the attack by stating that “Both children were left alive by the killers”? Zainab was not left alive by design, she was shot in the chest and her skull was stove in, which presumably was a pretty serious attempt to kill a seven year-old child. The other girl might very well have succeeded in hiding from the killers under her mother’s skirts, as she hid from the first rescuers, and then for eight hours from the police.

The Telegraph article claims to be informed by sources close to the investigation. So they believe it was a group of people, and feel motivated to absolve those people from child-killing. Now what could the Daily Telegraph be thinking?

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22,281 thoughts on “Not Forgetting the al-Hillis”

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  • straw44berry

    If there are any fragments of truth in what BM said. Some things dont make sense at all. BM thought there had been a car accident. The BMW is parked albeit with a flat tyre/or sunken in soft gravel.
    Perhaps after BM left the scene the BMW was repositioned into its final position. Perhaps when he left it was still plunged into the damaged shrubbery and actually looking like an accident.

    We are assuming the photo of the BMW position when they have already started moving it ready to put onto the transporter. Though there are few other marks on the scene apart from the semi-circular skid marks.

    [Maybe these are just my crazy thoughts, I was in 2 minds whether to post this or delete it]

  • James

    Straw…

    Maybe, maybe not ! The car could have been moved.
    We “assume” it was there…only because the site got buzzed.
    Was that by chance ?

    Billy’s story is full of holes. But it was he who said the car was in reverse…and he alone that stopped it (if true).

    If it is true (and there are reverse splash marks on the rear body work) then would an arc make those marks in the carpark (to the right) ?

    OR (and this is my Brun was there theory) a 4×4 ?
    As a rear wheel BMW would spin only the rear wheels (and the with DSC, would not leave equal marks, as it is turning).

    Only a 4×4 (with the self locking device installed) would do that.
    That is the point of a 4×4 after all.

  • James

    Straw….

    Further to that. The barrier was not down on that road.
    Check all the pics. None have it down or even there.

    So the 4×4 could have come up the other way.
    If that is so, then the 4×4 self locker would be “on”.
    Hence the marks.

    BUT… if the 4×4 is parked at the “top” of the carpark, where was Al Hilli ?

    AND why was more casing found under his car ? (suggesting it ended, but did not start there).

    That is of course, if we are told what we are told, is true !
    Which I very much doubt.

  • olifant

    some residual confusion seems to persist re Sylvain the Archery Instructor who lives at Mandeure 177 mi, 3 hours 53 mins from Ugine. Not be confused with SM, deceased, formerly of Ugine

    MANDEURE COMMUNE DEC 2007 4-3 SUBVENTION pour les particuliers propriétaires et locataires, 3.05 euros par mètre carré ravalé, peint ou nettoyé, La subvention ci-dessous est proposée au Conseil Municipal : TRAVAUX RÉALISÉS PAR LE PÉTITIONNAIRE : Monsieur Sylvain MOLLIER : 3, rue des Essarts Balangiers 25350 MANDEURE 372.16€ UNANIMITÉ

    LE COLLECTIF DE PARENTS D’ELEVES DE LYCEE AU MINISTRE … (petition re new syllabus) Nos enfants sont actuellement scolarisés en 1ère et donc soumis à la réforme……
    Sylvain MOLLIER , Technician, Mandeure , March 21, 2012 at 10:54 Myriam Rottner, Housewife, Audincourt, March 18, 2012

  • Mochyn69

    @James
    9 Nov, 2012 – 4:35 pm

    And Brun was there .. in Cathy’s 4×4 Pajero

    and being into gun clubs and that kinda stuff was the actual gunman!

    Hence Eric Maillaud’s original claim they were looking for a Pajero .. which was light .. or was it dark?

    But on further enquiry that could turn out to be an inconvenient truth, so FB was offed in another fake road accident ..

    Or all of it could simply be a FAIRYTALE.

    I feel like Homer!

  • Shelock H.

    @ Felix et al:

    Mathis Mollier is born on 26.11.96
    but says about himself as looking younger- 12

  • James

    @Mochyn

    Or Moe !

    But yes. As in the 4×4 was there. And yes I believe FB was “off’d”.
    And that’s the thing (to catch the king…as Hamlet once said).
    They released too much, by accident.

    Still, it could be “the willage” covering itself (I mean who would by a place in Midsomer Springfield now !!!) OR it is totally political. (AREVA are totally straight with things !).

    Ferret said it was a “removal”. I looked at that and thought could it have been. But I doubt it.

    I think it was a cock up…and may never had made the news…if the whole family weren’t involved.

    BUT as I say, is it “Midsomer Springfield”….
    OR “Dr Kelly marque II (but this time to avoid a war !).

  • James

    @Mochyn96/69.678

    I still can’t discount “Midsomer Ville” though.
    It’s a strange place.

    Maybe one Mollier too many !
    Mr Policeman says it’ll take ten years to solve this !!!!

    Plus he’s got an old chap shot in his garden, bodies popping up in the lake…and that diamond heist that went belly up !

    They should twin town with Chicago !!!

  • Q

    There is some irony to this talk of movies and twin peaks:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deep_River,_Ontario

    Twin Peaks and Mulholland Drive both link to David Lynch.

    As for the other movie, it involves zombies. Deep River is where scientist Lachlan Cranswick vanished. Cranswick worked for the National Research Council of Canada at the AECL Chalk River nuclear facility. It was part of the Manhattan Project. You won’t find his name on the town’s wiki entry. The townsfolk seemed to close ranks around that matter. Maybe it’s because disappearing/dead scientists don’t do much for tourism.

  • Tim V

    get your point Mochyn69 9 Nov, 2012 – 3:04 pm but why I would ask, are actors called “stars” if not for their heavenly precursors? The obituary is certainly unusual and may be enigmatic. There is the superficial meaning and possibly a hidden meaning for those in the “know”. My reading of it at the superficial level this is just a goodbye to a loved one, repeating favourite phrases that he used to suggest that “little people” could also be “stars” in their way, and that although “Indians” i.e. the native French might be under pressure their culture/efforts would bear fruit/survive.

    Now on a deeper level to whom might a coded message be addressed. Well it would appear very likely that both Mollier and Brun were members of a fraternity of hunters and rather like the backwoods of America this is often accompanied by a shared world view that looks back to a supposed halcyon age, suspicion of newcomers, foreigners and government. It may also be affiliated to political groupings such as LaRoache. To these it might be asserting that his death would not prevent them from continuing any activities they may be engaged in perhaps. Is there covert anti-semitic or racialist opinion prevalent in the group that might result in specific action for example?

  • Tim V

    I Am Your Spy

    by Mordechai Vanunu

    I am the clerk, the technician, the mechanic, the driver.
    They said, Do this, do that, don’t look left or right,
    don’t read the text. Don’t look at the whole machine. You
    are only responsible for this one bolt. For this one rubber-stamp.
    This is your only concern. Don’t bother with what is above you.
    Don’t try to think for us. Go on, drive. Keep going. On, on.

    So they thought, the big ones, the smart ones, the futurologists.
    There is nothing to fear. Not to worry.
    Everything’s ticking just fine.
    Our little clerk is a diligent worker. He’s a simple mechanic.
    He’s a little man.
    Little men’s ears don’t hear, their eyes don’t see.
    We have heads, they don’t.

    Answer them, said he to himself, said the little man,
    the man with a head of his own. Who is in charge? Who knows
    where this train is going?
    Where is their head? I too have a head.
    Why do I see the whole engine,
    Why do I see the precipice–
    is there a driver on this train?

    The clerk driver technician mechanic looked up.
    He stepped back and saw — what a monster.
    Can’t believe it. Rubbed his eyes and — yes,
    it’s there all right. I’m all right. I do see
    the monster. I’m part of the system.
    I signed this form. Only now I am reading the rest of it.

    This bolt is part of a bomb. This bolt is me. How
    did I fail to see, and how do the others go on
    fitting bolts. Who else knows?
    Who has seen? Who has heard? — The emperor really is naked.
    I see him. Why me? It’s not for me. It’s too big.

    Rise and cry out. Rise and tell the people. You can.
    I, the bolt, the technician, mechanic? — Yes, you.
    You are the secret agent of the people. You are the eyes of the nation.
    Agent-spy, tell us what you’ve seen. Tell us what the insiders, the clever ones, have hidden from us.
    Without you, there is only the precipice. Only catastrophe.

    I have no choice. I’m a little man, a citizen, one of the people,
    but I’ll do what I have to. I’ve heard the voice of my conscience
    and there’s nowhere to hide.
    The world is small, small for Big Brother.
    I’m on your mission. I’m doing my duty. Take it from me.

    Come and see for yourselves. Lighten my burden. Stop the train.
    Get off the train. The next stop — nuclear disaster. The next book,
    the next machine. No. There is no such thing.

    -1987, Ashkelon Prison

  • Tim V

    In the war, famous poems were used to encrypt messages. This was, however, found to be insecure because enemy cryptanalysts were able to locate the original from published sources. Marks countered this by using his own written creations. The Life That I Have was an original poem composed on Christmas Eve 1943 and was originally written by Marks in memory of his girlfriend Ruth, who had just died in a plane crash in Canada.[1] On 24 March 1944, the poem was issued by Marks to Violette Szabo, a French agent of Special Operations Executive who was eventually captured, tortured and killed by the Nazis.

    The life that I have
    Is all that I have
    And the life that I have
    Is yours.

    The love that I have
    Of the life that I have
    Is yours and yours and yours.

    A sleep I shall have
    A rest I shall have
    Yet death will be but a pause.

    For the peace of my years
    In the long green grass
    Will be yours and yours and yours.

  • Tim V

    Yes James 9 Nov, 2012 – 3:11 pm Sorry I think I might have confused you with my turn of phrase there. I knew about the tempory burial bit rather than cremation. I was trying to suggest that this was unusual, even unique! In the past I hve drawn attention to its weirdness. I posed the question why if it was being kept to preserve evidence was it not kept in a refrigerated morgue? It will undoubtedly deteriorate kept any other way. Could it be that “temporary burial” does in fact mean this? And what on the British side? Have the Al Hilli’s been buried/cremated or are the bodies being stored? Has a Coroner’s Inquest been opened and adjourned yet as is normal practice in such cases?

  • James

    Tim V

    Yes, totally “not normal”.
    Well I have never heard of it. But they may feel, there in for the long game…so they have to “say it in deed and gesture”.

    It’s very odd.

    Caught a UK newspaper whilst away at work and there ws a pic of a coffin (Sa’ad’s) and he has (they say) been buried !

    Odd again…as I recall, although need to see the online version, that he was buried along with the wife…and grandmother.

    So the grandmother didn’t go to Sweden !

    So the Sa’ad’s and Mollier have had “odd” funerals in one way or another.

  • straw44berry

    What madness that picture alone shows why it will take many years to solve. I posted that picture myself when I first used Getty images.

  • James

    Nope, its not a rear whell drive.
    It’s a “self locker” (diff) that is on.

    So where’s Wally !
    Where was Al Hilli parked ?

  • Tim V

    James
    9 Nov, 2012 – 4:41 pm It’s simply explained I think!!!! Hilli attempted a reverse manuevre but straight back by only about two or three metres before being shot in the head with car in reverse gear and spasm right leg/foot on accelerator. This explains used cartridges in off-side rear . I suggest the 10 apparently found under car came from shots fired on the near side when car in forward position.

    So as I see it 4×4 parked up at sign end of lay by. Waits until Mollier arrives, dismounts and joins SAH and Zainab outside BMW next to passenger door. The order is now given in 4×4. Driver spins wheels and takes a semi circle arc stopping just short of BMW possibly even striking Zainab in the process. Passenger jumps out firing shooting Mollier first (because he is main target?)

    This gives SAH chance to escape actually throwing himself over bonnet and receiving bullet wound in the process. Several shots then directed towards him that strike the windscreen in at least 3 places and the open drivers door on the leading edge as SAH dives in. He manages to slam and lock doors and engage reverse by which time gunman gets to driver’s side shooting through the glass and killing him. Car continues until it lodges on bank.

    Killer then shoots rear passenger that side, returns to near side and does the same to rear passenger there. Returns to Mollier lying semi conscious from initial non fatal wounds, almost where he fell shooting him twice in head, causing biggest blood stain on ground which marks the spot. Zainab caught by stray bullet and still prostrate on ground who he leaves.

    Gunman gets back into 4×4 and driver drives off. Probably another person/gunman on motor bike plays a role somewhere, maybe advancing to the front of the with hand gun forcing SAH to reverse? That’s my take on it anyways. Maybe a witness following this will correct me if I am wrong?

  • Tim V

    this getty image gives the lie to WBM’s statement that he first saw Mollier lying on the ground “resting”. Clearly if Mollier lay over the blood stain on the far side if the BMW backed into the lay-by he would not be seen until WBM was actually level with him. If Zainab ran into the road before collapsing again as he described he would have undoubtedly seen her first.

    http://www.gettyimages.co.uk/detail/news-photo/journalists-walk-toward-the-place-where-four-people-were-news-photo/151424676

  • James

    Billy’s story has more holes in it than my undercrackers had after I used that fourth hand washing machine I aquired back in 1993.

    All I can see is, there was a 4×4 in the “north” of the carpark that set off in a hurry….

    …and a BMW that managed to spray mud up its rear bodywork, in a forwards direction.

    I do think there is an “elephant” in the room though.
    Brett said that a motorbike passed him going “down” the hill.
    Yet the police said that they are looking for a motorbike….on the opporsite exit route !

    So two motorbikes…or someones story hasn’t been remembered properly.

    Pinky isn’t tallying up with Perky !

  • James

    …and forget D Notices ! This is national security, until they workout what actually happened.

    Not one newspaper has asked, where is the roofrack from the pax side….

    …or why did Billy use an accountant at 55 A Team Gate !
    Was there better parking there than in Brighton ???

  • bluebird

    Straw and pink

    Thank you for the mollier archery link.

    Mochyn
    Thanks for the Schutz link. I will try to find out something about the family. Mr. Schutz likes “velo” sports, too.

    Regarding cathy ouvrier buffet bianco.
    You are right, but we need a link to her other than the tv team apperently filming the wrong hair dresser. Molliers boys do not link her.

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