Moderation Rules for Commenters 391

I am reposting the rules for commenting, as they were last set out exactly a year ago. I have been most disappointed by the degree of personal insult flying around the comments thread in recent weeks. In general, there is no need at all to address other commenters in your remarks. You can address their arguments, but that is different. Avoid referring to the person of other commenters, whether by name or by any other means of identification.

Address the argument, not the person. To do otherwise will be an immediate warning flag for deletion. Any reference to any commenter which is not courteous will lead to the comment being immediately deleted. This is an expansion of the way we will enforce the “fair play” rule below.

Here are the rules:

This is essentially a free speech forum… There is an important distinction between my writing, and the comments section. The proportion of readers who leave comments is well under 1%. I cannot know what percentage of the readers read comments, but I suspect it is not terribly high.

In social media I find establishment hacks – particularly journalists and Labour Party functionaries – dismiss my thoughts by referring to the comments section. “Craig Murray – have you seen the tinfoil hats comments on his blog!” being a genuine and very typical example. Well, if people wish to damn me by association with the views of other people, that is sadly an example of the low intellectual standards of the British nomenklatura of our time. The only views on here which are mine are those which I write.

I cherish the diversity of the comment threads and am fond of our little community, most of whom I have never met. I do not value people by the standard of how close their views are to my own. I am sometimes saddened by the personal animosities which arise between people.

We state some rules from time to time. This is the current set, which I just made up:

No racism. Any comment which is racist will simply be deleted immediately. The biggest problem we face is anti-Jewish comment, which I will not tolerate. We are not in the business of stigmatising anti-Zionism as anti-Jewish, but there are quite frequently distinctly anti-Jewish comments. I deleted one just an hour ago.

Similarly, no holocaust denial. I do not believe it should be illegal (I am against thought crime) but I do not wish to have it on my blog as those associated with it often have very unpleasant sympathies. That is not to say the subject of the holocaust can never be mentioned – it will never be possible to ascertain the precise number who were killed, and it is important we remember not only the Jews but the Poles, gypsies, gays, freemasons and numerous others who suffered. But the basic facts are not in doubt. It is surprising how often people attempt to insinuate holocaust denial.


It is in practice impossible to outlaw sockpuppetry without a formal registration system, which I do not want. But the adoption of multiple identities within the same thread is not to be allowed, nor the creation of identities of which the purpose is to ridicule, attack or insult another contributor.

Fair Play. Play the ball, not the man. Address arguments, not people. Do not impugn the motives of others, including me. No taunting.


Attempts to keep people on topic are hopeless, but do try.


We don’t discuss 9/11. There are plenty of places on the web where you can do that. It tends to take over threads.


Contributions which are primarily just a link to somewhere else will be deleted. You can post links, but give us the benefit of your thoughts upon them.

No explanation.

Enforcing these rules is necessarily arbitrary and needs judgement calls. Moderators are precluded from explaining decisions online. If you want to complain use the contact button.


We have, and have had, excellent moderators over many years. But almost all have found it not only time consuming but also surprisingly emotionally draining. If you are interested in volunteering and are willing for me to know both your real and online identity, please get in touch using the contact button.

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391 thoughts on “Moderation Rules for Commenters

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  • Tony_0pmoc

    This audio interview – really is very interesting – and it is nice to see John Ward mentioning Craig Murray on his blog The Slog…even if he disagrees with some of his views…

    “End the EU, a CIA Covert Operation”

    By Paul Craig Roberts

    June 13, 2016 “Information Clearing House” – “Remain” or “Leave”? What does the UK’s EU Referendum—scheduled 23rd June—really amount to? Is it simply the opportunity for UK citizens to decide if Britain should stay in the European Union? Or is it something of greater significance, with broader and more serious implications? And just what is this thing called the EU anyway?

    Joining us, once again, to discuss these questions is Dr. Paul Craig Roberts, former US Assistant Secretary to the Treasury for Ecomonic Policy, who explains the EU’s beginnings as a project of the CIA, and assesses its current role as as an anti-democratic tool of corporate control. Whether or not a majority “leave” vote will actually lead to Brexit, Dr. Roberts argues that a decisive rejection of EU membership by UK citizens could embolden other EU member states to follow suit, thus precipitating the break-up of NATO, and in turn, bringing an end to Washington’s crazy designs for a New World Order. ”


  • Reider O'Doom

    Hi Craig,
    Long time reader, first time commenter. Don’t be so sure that the percentage of those who read the comments is as low as you think. I very rarely read an article without reading at least some of the comments – usually the first 20-30. I suspect this pattern is fairly common
    Many of your commenters are intelligent, thoughtful people who add to the article, and you have a very low troll ratio – though I am occasion surprised by your relatively high ratio of 9/11 obsessives and tin-foil hat wearers. All in all, though, please don’t change how you do things. Your blog is one of the high points of my day (along with Wings, wee ginger dug and munguin) as I’m sure it is for many.

    • Richard Blee

      Your impersonal observation on 9/11 obsessives and their tin-foil hats raises the question: Which of the peer-reviewed documented facts below are not commonly accepted by the non-obsessive bareheaded 8% in the UK who believe what the US government tells them?

  • Republicofscotland

    The US navy has moved two of its aircraft carriers into the Western Pacific, along with accompanying support ships 12,000 sailors and 140 aircraft.

    It billed as a training exercise, but in my opinion the US forces are positioned there awaiting the the outcome of the :

    “UN arbitral tribunal in The Hague is expected to soon issue its verdict on a territorial dispute between China and the Philippines in the South China Sea.

    “The decision is largely expected to favor the Philippines, which filed the case in 2013, and could have wide-ranging implications for China’s claims in one of the world’s most contested strategic ”

    How will China react if the verdict goes against them, will they disregard the decision and impinge on the waters of the Philippines ? Which could lead to counter measures from the US, and its allies, or will they abide by the decision, for now? At least.

    • Richard

      Ah, but on the other hand, old Saida ‘I didn’t know she was for independence in the first place’ Warsi has changed her mind – yes, changed her mind!, the B.B.C. told me this morning – and come out for the Fourth Reich. Well, that’s my vote gone from ‘Leave’ to ‘Remain’.

    • Mark Golding

      Dr Roberts appears to have found information that supports my premise that Britain in Europe is America in Europe influencing supranational and intergovernmental decision-making by the European Commission, the European Parliament, the European Council and the Court of Justice in favor of American interventionism or preemptive war; or in my terms a pragmatic US cyborg entity designed to see the world in binary good/evil terms, a low tolerance for diplomacy, a readiness to use military force, an emphasis on US unilateral action, a disdain for multilateral organizations (such as the EU) and a focus on disintegrating the Middle East into a major consolidated ISIS threat that will prevent Britain from developing a more constructive relationship with Iran(in the late 70’s I trained Iranian naval officers) and the worst refugee crisis in the recent history of man-kind that will further destabilise a rotting EU too boot.

      Use your intelligence & VOTE week.

    • Scott

      Hi Tony,

      This is a nice link, and Dr. Roberts is an interesting guy. However, I cannot find any links anywhere to the primary source material (declassified US government documents) that supports the argument that the CIA was a significant driving force in the original formation of the EU. Ambrose Pritchard (Telegraph) also fails to provide any citations, although on the surface the claims seems substantiated: “The documents were found by Joshua Paul, a researcher at Georgetown University in Washington. They include files released by the US National Archives. Washington’s main tool for shaping the European agenda was the American Committee for a United Europe, created in 1948.”

      Since the Telegraph article in 2000, other search results (e.g. voltairenet) merely return citations to the Telegraph article, but again without any supporting evidence.

      If anyone can find links to the primary Georgetown material, or other articles that quote more heavily from the declassified documents, I would be very interested.

      Kind regards,

    • Richard

      Here is what someone wrote on another blog and I copy and paste it without permission. Nevertheless, I doubt that the author will mind.

      “I am voting to make myself poorer, and to make my fellow citizens of the UK wealthier.

      I run a substantial manufacturing business and at the moment I have access to an endless supply of skilled people. I pay fairly and competitively – well, even – but be in no doubt that if I did not have access to those EU people competition would drive the price of people up. I would cope for sure, and in any case am driving headcount down and productivity relentlessly up, but the easiest route for me is if we remain.

      It’s easy for me; I don’t suffer from the effects of the EU. The business is easily big enough to swallow all the regulatory burden; indeed, it’s a barrier to other competition. I get all the benefits and none of the downside, because I don’t struggle for medical attention (private), get my kids into great schools (private), and don’t have to worry about affording a nice place to live.

      I’m voting Leave partly because of the huge democratic fail that the EU is, and partly because I think the ordinary person is already screwed by the Corporatist system we operate, and setting them in competition against the whole of the European population is just a massive scam by the corporate interests. People are kept down, they have no chance and it amazes me that there isn’t more social unrest already – after all, if you can’t get a home and can’t assert any sort of reasonable price for your labour why not?

      I’m not Socialist, but I am an egalitarian who believes in a fair chance for all. Corporatism is the worst system of all, and that’s what the EU is all about.

      As for Cameron, I’d vote for Corbyn before him. And I’ve never voted Labour in my life.”

      And here’s my tuppence worth:

      As things stand at the moment, there is no way the British electorate can hire and fire – via the ballot box – the people who make their laws and create the macro-economic framework in which they all must operate. In fact, the E.U. system is designed specifically so they can’t. This fact alone requires ‘Brexit’.

      If you factor in the real possibility that war with Russia is in danger of becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy, then we need to exclude ourselves from both the E.U. and N.A.T.O. and elect peace-loving, non-interventionist rulers who are prepared to look after Britain and let Britain’s “influence” take care of itself.

      (The above makes me a racist and a xenophobe, apparently.)

      Furthermore, the shameless exploitation of a mother’s murder by the troughers tells you all you need to know about them. I once heard it reported that Abba Eban had said “There’s no business like Shoa business”, and, despite the fact that I like a good pun I was shocked. At a time when I fondly imagined that I was no longer naive about politicians the penny dropped that I would always be naive about politicians.

      So I hope that the people, despite all the bollocks, all the nastiness, all the threats of economic warfare from foreigners, the tales of doom and gloom vote for ‘Leave’ in this referendum. The larger the vote, the harder it will be for those whose contempt for working plebs drips from them like poison to ignore it – and I’m sure they’ll try.

      Best wishes all, and I hope that we wake up in a free country on Friday.

  • Nuada

    I dunno. As I get older, I get less and less enamoured of “codes of conduct” on forums like this one, especially where there are “moderators” involved. It usually means a bunch of right-on Rita types with all the approved opinions worm their way in as gatekeepers and immediately begin removing posts which don’t advance the party line, regardless of relevance or tone. Just let everyone have at it.

    • Macky

      I agree with that except for that there still needs to be a banning rule for trolling; Craig has said the purpose of allowing comments is to simulate debate, which is the antithesis of trolling, so why tolerate a self-defeating problem, the toleration of which is also disrespectful to all the other commentators who post in good faith, and a discouragement to potential new contributors, and also to readers who get put-off by the resulting troll generated bickering.

      Also the ridiculous & double-standards hypersensitivity on anything to do with Jews/Israel has caused many good commentators to leave, just like trolling is obvious when you see it, so is genuine antisemitism, yet not seeing trolling when it’s obvious & seeing antisemitism where there isn’t any, is the defining feature of the moderation here.

      • Macky

        LOL ! Perfect illustration of what I’ve just attempted to post, but went straight into “Your comment is awaiting moderation.”

        Here it is, and guess the missing words !

        “I agree with that except for that there still needs to be a banning rule for trolling; Craig has said the purpose of allowing comments is to simulate debate, which is the antithesis of trolling, so why tolerate a self-defeating problem, the toleration of which is also disrespectful to all the other commentators who post in good faith, and a discouragement to potential new contributors, and also to readers who get put-off by the resulting troll generated bickering.

        Also the ridiculous & double-standards hypersensitivity on anything to do with J—s/Is—l has caused many good commentators to leave, just like trolling is obvious when you see it, so is genuine antisemitism, yet not seeing trolling when it’s obvious & seeing antisemitism where there isn’t any, is the defining feature of the moderation here.”

      • Habbabkuk (la vita e' bella)

        Surely the answer to the perceived (by some) unsatisfactory state of moderation on Craig’s blog is for those who feel aggrieved to leave for another blog with more agreeable moderation?

        Should not the example set by Mary inspire others?

        • glenn_uk

          Beats me why some hang around here for years, and complain bitterly the whole while how terribly unfair it all is. Perhaps they’re masochists?

          • Macky

            See my previous comment @7.20

            As to masochists, strange that you don’t count yourself as one, as on the one hand you advocate that people should leave if they think that there is a problem with the rules here, and on the other hand you say that you are “sorry” when they do leave, as you said to Node earlier on this thread (Node being the second Commentator in the last few days to leave, and exactly because of one of the problems that I’ve highlighted).

          • glenn_uk

            I’ve never advocated people leave, Macky. Just expressed surprise that some hang around denouncing the host, other posters, the mods etc. yet remain for so long.

        • Macky

          So the answer to those who suggest how the running of anything could be improved by pointing out possible current flaws, is not for the suggestions themselves to be examined & considered, but for those who make such improvement suggestions, to be expected to leave !

          Sounds like a very illogical & reflex authoritarian blinker approached that leaves no room for any improvement or beneficial fine tuning !

    • bevin

      “Just let everyone have at it.”
      That has been tried but “everyone” includes enough trolls whose only interest is in ending or discrediting discussion to ruin the place.
      Last week, amazed at the troll infestation on one board here, I worked out that two posters, working together more or less monopolised the site for more than three hours in the early evening, during which period they ensured that little more than juvenile abuse and playground insults appeared under a post of which the troills obviously disapproved.
      I am not the moderating type, myself, and don’t much sympathise with those who are but anything is better than allowing the Establishment to shut down one of very few forums for sensible discussion by using hasbara tactics.
      As to those with genuine ‘right wing’ views, they are very valuable and their comments should be treated with proper respect- the real enemies are the nihilists who worship power and regard democracy as a plague to be eradicated, one debate at a time until they can shut them up in the way that fascists do.

    • Macky

      LOL ! Perfect illustration of what I’ve just attempted to post, but went straight into “Your comment is awaiting moderation.”

      Here it is, and guess the missing words !

      “I agree with that except for that there still needs to be a banning rule for trolling; Craig has said the purpose of allowing comments is to simulate debate, which is the antithesis of trolling, so why tolerate a self-defeating problem, the toleration of which is also disrespectful to all the other commentators who post in good faith, and a discouragement to potential new contributors, and also to readers who get put-off by the resulting troll generated bickering.

      Also the ridiculous & double-standards hypersensitivity on anything to do with J—s/Is—l has caused many good commentators to leave, just like trolling is obvious when you see it, so is genuine antisemitism, yet not seeing trolling when it’s obvious & seeing antisemitism where there isn’t any, is the defining feature of the moderation here.”

      • Habbabkuk (la vita e' bella)

        But your posts appeared, with the time stamp 19h25.

        Sometimes one just has to be a little patient. After all, it’s the British way!

        • Macky

          Yes my posts eventually appeared after being delayed by one of the very problems that I was highlighting; the trouble with that (in addition to the problem itself), is that Posters have normally no idea a) why their comment are being subjected to moderation, and b) no idea if their comment will ever be eventually allowed to appear, therefore in the heat of the debate the point is diluted if it appears hours later, and in the heat of the moment the affected Poster will be outraged at what in they eyes is inexplicable censorship, and this happening enough times to somebody, is exactly the straw that breaks the camel’s back for that person, and is exactly the reason for why quite a few Posters have recently left.

          “the British way”

          Exactly, kicking things into the long grass, a la Chilcot Enquiry !

  • Silvio

    In the USA terrorists “caught in the act” before they can carry out their nefarious plans have usually turned out to be mentally unstable or unbalanced individuals nurtured, trained and shepherded into committing terrorist acts by FBI informants posing as terrorists themselves. The pseudo-terrorists/FBI operatives help the suspect with planning his terrorist act while also providing him with the necessary means to do so. What could possibly go wrong?

    FBI Entrapment Fuels Terror, Not Stops It

    FBI Director Comey never elaborated on just how those informants interacted with Mateen. However, examining publicly available FBI affidavits from other investigations that resulted in arrests and prosecutions, it is almost certain the informants posed as terrorists with ties to Al Qaeda or the self-proclaimed “Islamic State” (ISIS).

    In two cases that unfolded just last years, FBI informants would be revealed to have helped plan attacks with suspects, suggest to suspects that they credit ISIS for the attacks (as reported by the Intercept), and even helped them in procuring weapons and explosives before finally arresting them.

    The results of such investigations are often high-profile counterterrorism news stories portraying the investigations as having stopped real attacks. Headlines like the Washington Post’s “Mass. man accused of plotting to hit Pentagon and Capitol with drone aircraft,” or the FBI’s own press release, “Oregon Resident Convicted in Plot to Bomb Christmas Tree Lighting Ceremony,” betray the fact the virtually every aspect of these supposed plots from A-Z were scripted by the FBI’s informants themselves with the suspects often being mentally unstable and technically/financially incapable of carrying out the attacks on their own – as evident in the FBI’s own affidavits.


    And then there is this:

    This is a flashback interview on the Keiser Report from March 2015 with whistleblower David Steele. Steele is a 20-year Marine Corps intelligence officer and the second-highest-ranking civilian in the U.S. Marine Corps Intelligence, on top of being a former CIA clandestine services case officer.

    According to Steele:

    “Most terrorists are false flag terrorists, or are created by our own security services. In the United States, every single terrorist incident we have had has been a false flag, or has been an informant pushed on by the FBI. In fact, we now have citizens taking out restraining orders against FBI informants that are trying to incite terrorism. We’ve become a lunatic asylum.”

    Steele’s comments about the false flag terrorism comes after the 15:08 mark in the video posted at:

  • bevin

    ““Was the Orlando shooting any inside job too?”

    In a sense it most certainly was: (From the Emptywheel blog)
    “Monday, Orlando Police Chief John Mina and other law enforcement officers offered new details about the shooting, including the possibility that some victims may have been killed by officers trying to save them.
    “I will say this, that’s all part of the investigation,” Mina said. “But I will say when our SWAT officers, about eight or nine officers, opened fire, the backdrop was a concrete wall, and they were being fired upon.”
    A law enforcement source close to the investigation who asked not to be named said a crowd of up to 300 people and the complex layout of the dance club may have resulted in some patrons being struck by gunfire from officers.
    Mina said his decision to enter the club with such violence was tough. “It was a hard decision to make, but it was the right decision,” he said. “Our No. 1 priority is on saving lives, and it was the right decision to make.”
    “An off-duty police officer working at the club Sunday night was investigating an underage drinker outside when he heard gunshots inside, according to the law enforcement source. The off-duty officer ran inside the club and traded gunfire with Mateen, backed up soon by three other police officers, the source said.
    “The officers fired at Mateen, who retreated into a bathroom toward the rear of the club.
    “Those additional officers made entry while the suspect was shooting,” Mina said. “They forced him to stop shooting and retreat to the bathroom where we believe he had several hostages.”

    Then there is the fact that the FBI, learning of the subject’s erratic behaviour over the past year or so appears to have seen him as a prime candidate for their “create a jihadist” programme.
    It may very well be that Mateen was a monster created by the FBI’s Frankenstein laboratory.

    • Silvio

      All sorts of questions about the Orlando shooting don’t get examined at all on the mainstream media newscasts. Typical mainstream media attitude is if a (US) government spokesperson says it is so, then it must be so. Who are we to suggest otherwise? Goodness gracious that would make us into conspiracy theorists, and aside from the terrorist themselves, there ain’t nothing worse in this world than those hell-bound conspiracy theorists.

      Orlando suspicions: Multiple shooters, multiple ‘motives’ and a siege that just doesn’t add up
      by Craig McKee

      The June 12 shooting at the Pulse night club in Orlando, Florida that apparently left 49 dead and 53 injured is full of oddities, anomalies, and elements that are disturbingly reminiscent of past false flag deceptions. Did the suspect do what he is accused of doing? If he did, did he have accomplices? Did others know this was going to happen and even encourage it to happen? Why did there seem to be no ambulances at the scene or even arriving with injured people at the hospital (a nurse interviewed in one report said injured people were brought in private vehicles)? Why were injured club patrons being carried by other club-goers past cameras towards the club rather than away from it? And why did they set that person down and stop walking as soon as they appeared to be out of camera range?

      Important aspects of the story as we have it now don’t make sense, and people connected to the event have some very intriguing associations.


      As with so many of these “terror” events, the scene just looks odd. Where is all the video one would expect from an event like this? We’ve been shown one piece of phone video that offers the sound of gunshots but not much else. (Maybe it’s just my journalism background, but I’d have been shooting video the whole time.) We’ve also heard nothing about video from surveillance cameras. But that’s not unusual either (see Sandy Hook, Aurora, 9/11). And there is little or no video that shows any kind of rescuing of victims, including transporting them in ambulances. The parading of victims past cameras reminds me of Boston bombing “victims” like Jeff Bauman being whisked down the street in wheelchairs while ambulances sat parked a couple of blocks away. It is also reminiscent of the widely circulated photo of a teacher supposedly leading children away from Sandy Hook Elementary.


      • glenn_uk

        Conspiracies most surely do take place. To do a knee-jerk “False Flag!” every single time just makes one look silly. Particularly when such supposed doubts are in the service of the NRA (National Rifle Association), a deeply unpleasant group of gun proponents run on behalf of the manufacturers of the killing devices.

        The fact is that guns are freely available to any nut who wants them, including battle-field combat weapons to citizens who have been flagged as having mental health problems, and even those on the terrorist watchlist.

        The fact that massacres frequently occur as a result of such policies should not be a surprise. Nevertheless, useful idiots will parrot the line that it’s a “False Flag” whenever they do – to their deep discredit.

        • Silvio

          I guess some people feel it’s less of a stigma to be considered a coincidence theorists rather than being labeled a conspiracy theorist. To each his own.

          Jeff Schechtman: What should we make of the fact that the FBI was so aware and had had contact with him? (i.e. Omar Mateen)

          Russ Baker (investigative journalist): Well, this really bothers me, because as you know, in the case of the Boston Marathon bombing, we had the exact same instance. We had the older of the two brothers, Tamerlan Tsarnaev, who was on the FBI’s radar. They investigated him, and not only did they investigate him, but they visited with him on a number of occasions. They were fully aware of him, and I would urge everybody to go back to our extensive investigation of the Boston Marathon bombing to look at parallels. This was a fellow who, they knew that he was traveling, that he had connections to Chechnya and other parts of the former Soviet Union with terrorist links and they knew that he was traveling there. He was on a watch list. I mean both of these guys, Mateen and Tsarnaev were on watch lists. And by the way, there’s an Orlando connection with Tamerlan Tsarnaev. His good friend lived in Orlando, and that fellow, Todashev is his name, and that fellow was brought in by the FBI a number of times. And I don’t know if you recall this, Jeff, but they ended up executing him. They shot him to death in his own apartment when they were purportedly interviewing him. They claimed that he rushed them. It’s a very odd story, most people find it very dubious, even most people in law enforcement I’ve talked to. What did he know? And why was he killed? And what about him being in Orlando too? I mean it’s been an amazing week for Orlando certainly, but we got to look at all of these links.

          No, no Mr. Baker. It’s all just a big coincidence. Don’t waste your time. No links at all for you to look at. If there were links to look at, rest assured the mainstream media’s tenacious, bull dog reporters would leave no stone unturned to investigate any behind the scenes law enforcement or intelligence agency skullduggery and wrongdoing in order to keep the public fully informed. Just move along now – nothing to see here.

        • John

          >> … the NRA (National Rifle Association), a deeply unpleasant group of gun proponents …

          Most 2nd Amendment supporters I’ve encountered are extremely pleasant people.

          > The fact is that guns are freely available

          well, fairly expensive.

          > to any nut who wants them,

          and non ‘nuts’ too, let us not forget.

          > including battle-field combat weapons …

          Everyday life is the battlefield against the bad guys, Glenn.

          > The fact that massacres frequently occur as a result of such policies should not be a surprise.

          Opinion masquerading as fact.

          > Nevertheless, useful idiots will parrot

          I suspect we differing views on who the useful idiots are here.

          • glenn_uk

            John, I said the NRA – not gun owners, not 2nd Amendment supporters. Please don’t be disingenuous.

            Other than that, you’ve sliced, diced and nit-picked my post beyond any reasonable point of discussion.

            Given your death count just from toddlers using guns is higher this year already, than our TOTAL deaths from guns in this country for years, I’ll leave you with your curious satisfaction at the status quo with guns in the USA.

  • Tony M

    If the EU was something worth staying in, it would have kicked the UK out long ago.

    As for the moderation, it’s shocking, just shocking, we’re all deeply shocked.

    • Resident Dissident

      “As for the moderation, it’s shocking, just shocking, we’re all deeply shocked.”

      No we are not

  • Habbabkuk (la vita e' bella)

    Craig and Moderators

    Could I make two suggestions very much in the spirit of the modernised moderation guidelines?

    1/. Delete in its entirety any post in which the word “troll” appears (or any silly=clever variant thereon, eg “tr**l”, etc;

    2/. Establish a “standing thread” entitled “Conspiracies, false flags, etc”, to which all such comments would be summarily transferred.


    I have seen Craig’s call for volonteers for Moderators and shall give it serious consideration for after the summer.

      • bevin

        It is a measure of their delusions that the truly insane regard themselves as qualified and desirable.

    • glenn_uk

      I’d note that the request for volunteers was part of the post, quoted, that went out a year ago. Not sure if that still counts as a current request.

      I’m also rather confident that you’d be wasting your time by giving it any consideration whatsoever, less still “serious” thought! 🙂

      Just saying….

    • nevermind

      why do you think you would be a good moderator for those many commenter’s here when your first response to new posters is derogative? sniping?
      How would you cope with not commenting as a moderator?
      Lastly, what Kind of encouragement can you offer those thousand’s of people who never dared to take part, who just read this excellent blog ?

    • Alan

      I have seen Craig’s call for volonteers for Moderators and shall give it serious consideration for after the summer.

      How did I know you were going to say that? LOL

      • glenn_uk

        How did I know you were going to say that? LOL

        Because it’s an obvious exercise in trolling for a response, perhaps?

  • RobG

    Whatever way the referendum goes this coming week, one good thing is that it seems certain that the most corrupt and immoral prime minister the UK has ever had will not survive it.

    For those who may have missed it, here’s Cameron on this weekend’s Question Time special. Notice how haggard he looks. I almost feel sorry for him, although I still wouldn’t buy a secondhand car from Dave-boy…

    • Shatnersrug

      Yes it’s time for him to make way for the next most corrupt and immoral prime minister the UK has ever had.

  • bevin

    In this article the American journalist Robert Parry puts the recent ‘dissent’ by 50 State Department employees into perspective.
    He explains how neo-cons have come to dominate US foreign policy in the years since Reagan’s election. And points out the imminent danger of a Hillary Clinton Presidency.
    Nobody knows what Trump would do, but, Parry suggests, Hillary would mean another war, much like the disaster in Libya only worse, with the chance of thermonuclear war- a subject of particular concern to Europeans- thrown in.
    “The State Department now seems to be a combination of true-believing neocons along with their liberal-interventionist followers and some careerists who realize that the smart play is to behave toward the world as global proconsuls dictating solutions or seeking “regime change” rather than as diplomats engaging foreigners respectfully and seeking genuine compromise.

    “Even some State Department officials, whom I personally know and who are not neocons/liberal-hawks per se, act as if they have fully swallowed the Kool-Aid. They talk tough and behave arrogantly toward inhabitants of countries under their supervision. Foreigners are treated as mindless objects to be coerced or bribed.

    “So, it’s not entirely surprising that several dozen U.S. “diplomats” would attack President Barack Obama’s more temperate position on Syria while positioning themselves favorably in anticipation of a Hillary Clinton administration, which is expected to authorize an illegal invasion of Syria — under the guise of establishing “no-fly zones” and “safe zones” — which will mean the slaughter of young Syrian soldiers. The “diplomats” urge the use of “stand-off and air weapons.”

    “These hawks are so eager for more war that they don’t mind risking a direct conflict with Russia, breezily dismissing the possibility of a clash with the nuclear power by saying they are not “advocating for a slippery slope that ends in a military confrontation with Russia.” That’s reassuring to hear.

    “Risking a Jihadist Victory

    “There’s also the danger that a direct U.S. military intervention could collapse the Syrian army and clear the way for victory by Al Qaeda’s Nusra Front or the Islamic State. The memo did not make clear how the delicate calibration of doing just enough damage to Syria’s military while avoiding an outright jihadist victory and averting a clash with Russia would be accomplished.

    “Presumably, whatever messes are created, the U.S. military would be left to clean up, assuming that shooting down some Russian warplanes and killing Russian military personnel wouldn’t escalate into a full-scale thermonuclear conflagration….”
    The full article is at:

    • Wrong Way Parry

      Parry has had a single shtik ever since the ’80s. Back then he blamed Iran-Contra on that nasty Republican administration, though Reagan was a vegetable. Now he blames Syrian aggression on ‘Neocons.’ Fue la CIA, then and now, but Parry would blame everybody but the CIA. Parry also has Graham Fuller, the Man from Gladio, impresario of the Boston Marathon burlesque, pontificating on his site.

    • nevermind

      “, but, Parry suggests, Hillary would mean another war, much like the disaster in Libya only worse, with the chance of thermonuclear war- a subject of particular concern to Europeans- thrown in.”

      You see this is what I do not understand, why should the amassing hardware in Europe and the constant sniping by NATO and its neocon infested bodies within it cause a War in Europe without us and the rest of the EU taking part.

      We know that the rightwingers in Poland and elsewhere are sabre rattling against their Russian neighbours, with Ukraine smouldering away in a self destructive circle fanned by arms from western powers, but it is our Governments who collude with these warmongers and Putin will not have Russia taken away or usurped by western style chaotics.
      If US/Israeli forces attacking Assads central Government, then that has nothing to do with the EU, but if we arm the terrorists fighting Assad we deserve to be part of the mele in Russian eyes. No Brexit will protect us from nuclear war and if it goes nuclear we all can kiss our a… good bye.

      So European Governments should instantly announce an arms embargo on all middle eastern countries, withdraw military help for the likes of Saudi in Yemen. Our arms exports, as much as they keep our economy afloat in hard times, are the fuel of this war in Syria, whilst those who fuel it sit safe in Washington London and elsewhere.

      Lest face it, NATO is a liability to world peace, not a guarantor for it, its has been usurped by neocons who are smarting at world domination, not knowing what they would unleash and or believing that they could escape such a nightmare and live happily ever after.

      every child in Britain has read ‘when the wind blows’ by Raymond Briggs, this is the video, not the comic, and it should be played before every NATO meeting.

      • Ba'al Zevul

        ER, just to pick on one point, do you honestly think that if we stop selling arms to Saudi Arabia, they won’t buy them from somewhere else? The US, France, China, even Germany, and (through a third party to avoid too public a revelation of its utter cynicism w.r.t. foreign exchange deals) Russia?

        • nevermind

          My point was that all NATO countries should stop selling arms, this infested trade, totally uncontrolled is fuelling the 65 million refugees now criss crossing the globe for a safer life elsewhere. Arms trade and who can carry it out is as unregulated as drone warfare.

          But hey, as long as we don’t let them come on to this island…..
          The control over Saudi interests start in the City of London and their banking interests, we have far more power of their affairs than is let on, if they were unable to pay their terror groups in Syria via our financial services their house of cards would rapidly fall.

          • Ba'al Zevul

            Suggest you read GB Shaw’s ‘Major Barbara’ for an insight into the mind of the arms salesman, and his influence on government. Even more true today in a globalised context.

            Sure, they ‘should’. But they won’t. Inalienable evolutionary FACT.

          • Ba'al Zevul

            Oh, and…Russia will sell arms to anyone at all. Just as good as the US stuff, and designed to be serviced by a chimpanzee with a hammer, without breaking.

          • Macky

            “Russia will sell arms to anyone at all”

            What a nonsense argument to deflect the fact that many Western Countries, especially OURS & the US, making & selling weapons is really the one industry that we have left ourselves, one that makes a few people very, very rich, but promotes wars, refugee crisis,environment & a host of other problems.

            So will it be ok if somebody started fracking and affecting your water & quality of life, just because others might/can do the same ?!

          • nevermind

            what, like the Suchoi S30? I could not agree more, it can run rings around the F35B, no contest.

            we are just primitive oiks and could learn a lot from chimpanzees, I agree.

          • Ba'al Zevul

            to deflect the fact that many Western Countries, especially OURS & the US, making & selling weapons is really the one industry that we have left …

            WTF? Why would I want to deflect from that? It’s what I’m saying – if we don’t sell arms (and there is not the remotest possibility of us ceasing to do so – the Russians , or Chinese, or anyone capable of knocking a shotgun together from gas pipe in Kandahar, will.

            Yup, love that new Sukhoi, Nevermind. And you don’t have to send the native help onto the runway with a broom before it can take off…retractable intake screens…so simple.

    • Macky

      Oh dear Loony ! Is that why this also doesn’t happen in Norway, Iceland, Switzerland, etc ?!

      What other lunatic arguments will be put forward for Remain ?!

      • nevermind

        Macky, as a Scottish person you are in a minority, most of your compatriots, whether you like it or not, want to remain.
        Why should a rich Norway have any needs for such behaviour, their personal wealth is considerable, they are not as indebted as China.

        Iceland has had its campaign against filthy financial practises, still they need to sell their cod and much of it ends up in Spain Portugal and elsewhere in the EU.
        Switzerland can hardly choose anything else, they are surrounded by EU countries, much orientated to their French and Italian neighbours and reliant on Gastarbeiter for their service industry.
        The only ones they beat up is protesters against Bilderberg or some other banker huddling they might organise.

        • Macky

          Err, missing the point Nevermind, does Canada, New Zealand, etc any other country, indulge in this ?!!

          I cam only assume Loony was being sarcastic.

  • mog

    ‘We don’t discuss 9/11. There are plenty of places on the web where you can do that. It tends to take over threads.’

    What if, for example, the nascent prosecutions against members of the Saudi state ended up bringing convictions, would we be allowed to discuss that?

    What if someone like Bandhar bin Sultan were implicated, would we be allowed to point out any connections to other events or other agents of other states? And so on….Are we even allowed to mention the events of 911?

    To ban a subject wholesale from discussion is not my idea of a ‘free speech zone’.

    • nevermind

      good point mog, its exactly those who think too much about conspiracies and tend to make up the odd ‘fact’ which have banned this subject from this blog, whatever we think.
      Moderation is a control mechanism, full stop.

      • Macky

        The irony is that discussion about 911 was banned on the grounds that it distracts & derails others subjects, yet people who continually have engaged in the most blatant trolling, ie distracting & derailing most subjects, have been more than tolerated.

        • fedup

          Macky the resident cybersettler in the tradition of the settlers in lands of Palestine is confident enough to come out with;
          Surely the answer to the perceived (by some) unsatisfactory state of moderation on Craig’s blog is for those who feel aggrieved to leave for another blog with more agreeable moderation?

          Then proceeding to pat itself on the back by reliving its moment of glory and success the said cybersettler recalls its’ success in driving out through harassments; a little old lady suffering from cancer, running her out of this log;

          Should not the example set by Mary inspire others?

          That is the same old lady, whom after years of contributing to this blog, was driven away in a concerted and orchestrated campaign of bullying and persecution that went unabated until she left.

          Then Glenn_uk chimes in;

          Beats me why some hang around here for years, and complain bitterly the whole while how terribly unfair it all is. Perhaps they’re masochists?

          Conveniently overlooking that other masochists such as; chartists, diggers, and levellers, Suffragettes by the same token ought to have left and let the rotten bastards whom were lording it over the great unwashed to get on with the life style they were accustomed to.

          This is the direct result of the climate of fear and coercion that has been brought on by those antisemi…. merchants seeking and finding antisemi… in every corner, nook and cranny of real and virtual world. Hence the almost surrender of the rules of the blog that deems disruption of all kind unacceptable, however then is impotent and almost helpless under the onslaught of the trolls whose only mission is to derail, disrupt and make difficult any kind of interaction that is outside the prescribed references of the oligarch owners, and plutocrat charge hands.

          As the blog owner laments;“Craig Murray – have you seen the tinfoil hats comments on his blog!”

          Ironically this after posting about the lady who was the first soul to come and to blow the whistle on the extent of the evil conduct of Clement Freud as Sofitel did back in April 26, 2009 at 12:27. Clearly a mixed up conspiracy loon/nut with a designer tinfoil hat as every indication of that time was contrary to Sofitel’s contentions.

          In conclusion, the shears of antisemi… are sharp and wide enough, that can even castrate ballsy characters who stood up to the bLiar’s government. Such is the infamy of our times!

          • Macky

            @Fedup, in the fight for all that’s good & right there’s has never been a level playing field, the dice has always been loaded, and hands tied behind back; if it was easy, then we would all be living in a fair & just world.

            I know it’s hard, but the struggle has it’s own rewards, mostly to be found within oneself.

    • Loony

      Everyone knows the facts regarding 9/11. Alternative explanations rely on a proliferation of conspiracy theories. Only extremely foolish people pay attention to conspiracy theories. One of the greatest fools to have ever lived, Adam Smith, was the creator of conspiracy theories, when he opined:

      “People of the same trade seldom meet together, even for merriment and diversion, but the conversation ends in a conspiracy against the public, or in some contrivance to raise prices.”

      It is a measure of how far we have fallen that a lunatic like Smith, obsessed as he was, with conspiracy theories can still be described as “…the father of modern economics and is still among the most influential thinkers in the field of economics today.”

  • Loony

    There is a developing problem within the EU/NATO.

    Frank-Walter Steinmeier, the German Foreign Minister, has described NATO as being engaged in warmongering with regard to its policy toward Russia.

    Bolko Borisov, the Bulgarian Prime Minister, has refused to commit Bulgarian naval assets to the Black Sea. The foolishly idealistic Borisov believes the Black Sea should be a place for holidays and tourism, and not a place of war.

    Such recalcitrant ideas are dangerous and need stamping out.

    Remember, as British citizens, you have an absolute right to thermo-nuclear war – do not let Germans and Bulgarians erode this right. If Britain votes to leave the EU most likely other European countries will start to express reservations about all out war.

    Vote Remain and protect your rights to war!!

    • nevermind

      ‘what we should not do right now is to heat up the situation some more by loud sabre rattling and howls for war’ were his comments to the new tit for tat moves in the Baltic states.

      For example, NATO’s latest manoeuvres with 10.000 soldiers from 10 different countries commences less than 100 miles off the Russian border.

      This preceded by a Polish manoeuvre, Anaconda’ simulating a Russian attack on Poland, using 31.000 soldiers. Almost all of NATO’s member states took part, incl. the German army. Even NATO HQ had reservations about the plump Russian context and focus of the actions.

      Steinmeier is only supported by the greens in his words, his very own coalition partners are livid of his wise words.

  • Loony

    Do you want to machine gun Syrian refugees, but find yourself a bit too busy to shoot them yourself.

    Fear not, for the EU will pay Turkey $6 billion to shoot them on your behalf.

    The EU squares the circle – you get dead Syrians, but can deny that it has anything to do with you.

    Salve your conscience – Vote Remain, You know it makes sense.

  • Ben Monad

    “9)Russian soccer hooligans/Olympic track and field team- What kind of asshole travels thousands of miles, spending tons of money in the process, just to be a dick? Russian ones apparently. This week thousands of Russians attacked others at a Euro Cup tournament when they lost the match and decided to take it out on innocent people. Several were arrested and the governing body fined Russia $240,000 and threatened them with expulsion is it continued. England has had similar problems in the past but took steps to fix it. Russia turned a blind eye like always. However, when the World Cup was also brought up and the possibility of that being taken away, which will be in Russia in 2018, things changed and the government started calling these idiots out. Then it came out that because of wide spread doping, their track and field team was banned from the 2016 Olympics. Even their trainers have acknowledged the huge problem they are having, something their superiors were less than happy with. Anyway you look at it, Russia is not doing well with sporting events this week.”

    Russians think they’re ‘Mericans…

    • Loony

      The Russians are probably just pissed that they cannot compete with Sebastian Coe.

      Apparently Coe has been cheating in the world speed reading competition – he just doesn’t read things at all.

    • nevermind

      Russia managed to score in the last minute against the UK and it was 150 hardline ultras who caused the trouble. There is also a large contingents of UK hooligans which have been arrested, be fair all they want is recognition, to be seen to be violent, that is their kick.
      But I agree, the s..t that sticks to sepp Coe should not detract from the ghastly doping scandal, and it means more medals for us….

    • Ben Monad

      Hmm. I wonder, facetiously, why Craig seems to have deliberately omitted Orlando.

      • Jim

        I thought the rules were that you’re not supposed to refer to names anymore, or impugn motives. Impugning actions should be within bounds though, including actions such as attempted smears of the day old widower of a murdered MP.

        • Ben Monad

          I thought this was ‘ ‘essentially, a free speech blog’. Just not for Ugly Americans or Gay victims?

          • Jim

            Why are you replying to me at all? Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the issues I was addressing. Which were firstly the charging of Mair using terrorism protocols. And secondly the disgraceful attempted smear a mere day after Jo Cox’s murder.

          • Jim

            In what way is the charging of Mair within terrorism protocols a ‘backstory I think everyone will appreciate’? I thought trolling had been banished several days ago. What’s going on?

      • nevermind

        Maybe, its due to the reality that this was a homophobic hate crime and had nothing to do with any other connotation they’d tried to make up, but I could be wrong.
        Sometimes one will find that posing questions to the ‘author’ here is as satisfying as pulling teeth, you do not expect an answer.

        • Ben Monad

          I find it hypocritical and rather passive-aggressive; qualities unflattering.

  • Loony

    Are you interested in the urination habits of men? Do you think laws should be passed to make it illegal for men to urinate whilst standing?

    Sweden is leading the way in tackling this vital problem

    Only by remaining in the EU and standing (sorry sitting) shoulder to shoulder with our EU partners can the British ensure that a common European wide urination policy is agreed, adopted and, most importantly, enforced.

    Outside of the EU hard working British people will be excluded from the exciting new opportunities available as “Public Urination Inspectors”

    • Jim

      No, not interested at all. However I am interested in the protocols within which Mair has been charged, namely terrorism protocols. Which subject should be of some interest to the blog host, who has been quite vociferous on this issue. Here is the relevant link from the Guardian, for those not fascinated with micturition difficulties.

  • Macky

    It would be nice & helpful if Craig could tell us what he thinks this “terrorism protocols” is all about; does it mean that the case will now be heard in closed rather than open court ? The actual charges are still not terrorism charges – “murder, grievous bodily harm, possession of a firearm with intent to commit an indictable offence, and possession of an offensive weapon£

  • Republicofscotland

    According to this report the Orlando shootings were part of a concerted attack on America’s gay community, which had been orchestrated by the CIA.

    “Howell stated that he was suppose to “hook up” late Saturday night with his contact in LA who was suppose to have more weapons and chemicals to mix with the Tannerite he was in possession of.”

    “When I got here, Dan was gone. I went to his apartment and he had cleared out….I tried calling him but he never answered me,” said Howell.”

    “When questioned about the other four people involved in the plot, Howell was only familiar with the first names of three of the alleged suspects, naming his contact in LA – Dan and two of the three contacts in Florida, Omar and Brandy”

    “Speaking of the suspect killed in the Pulse Bar massacre in Florida, Howell stated, “Omar was not suppose to be killed. They lied to us – Omar and Brandy were suppose to get away.”

    “When Howell was questioned about how he and his conspirators knew each other, he said that,”

    “We were all familiar with each other through an online fundamental Islamic knowledge seminary course[1] – we were recruited through the course and trained together at a camp in Virginia – we were taught how to shoot and make bombs – everyone knew their part – something went wrong….”

    “Before the officers could further question Howell, agents working for the Los Angeles office of the FBI quickly swept in and took over the case. Santa Monica detectives were never allowed to talk with Howell.”

    “Finding his contact missing when he got to LA and having heard that Omar Matteen had been killed by a FBI SWAT teem in Orlando, Howell determined he had been double crossed by the CIA and feared for his own life.”

    • lysias

      There is evidence that, in the weeks before JFK was killed in Dallas, two similar assassination plans existed for JFK visits to Chicago and Miami in those preceding weeks. Those two plans ended up being aborted.

      Maybe, after the atrocity in Orlando occurred, there was no reason for the plan in LA to go forward. It was a fallback option.

      • Republicofscotland


        Indeed, several things struck me over the JFK’s untimely demise, the change of route for the cavalcade, the magic bullet, and the enclosing by a glass case of the window of the book repository that LHO supposedly shot JFK from.

        The third point can be easily addressed, the window is closed off, because anyone actually stood at that window and looking out, would think to themselves No F*cking way!!!! ?

  • Loony

    Do you have an obsessive interest in the murder of one individual?

    Can you explain why about 30,000 deaths per year in Chinese industrial facilities are seemingly of no interest whatsoever? I know that China is a long way away, but after all we have transferred substantially all of our industrial base to China. The only reason we did this is because it is cheaper. It is in part cheaper because the Chinese bear very low overheads with regard to health and safety (i.e. they don’t have any).

  • Anon1


    The state of Israel is hoping that Britain will Remain in the EU. The thinking is that a strongly pro-Israel voice such as Britain’s has more influence within the EU and can balance out some of the hostility towards Israel expressed by other members states.

    I therefore urge you all to vote Remain on Thursday, to help our friends in Israel.

    • Republicofscotland


      I will add a bit of balance to your comment, by addressing the flip side of the EU coin.

      Here prominent Greeks write a open letter to the people of the UK, in the week we decide to stay or go. In a thoughtful but condemning letter on blunt and forceful EU actions against Greece, they warn us that the EU works for the interest of the few and not the many.

      The European Union has proven to act on behalf of the interest of banks, multi-national enterprises and groups in the shadow, as advised by professional think-tanks and lobbyists.

      It makes for a interesting read.

      • glenn_uk

        I was surprised at Yanis Varoufakis calling for the UK to REMAIN.

        I imagine he thinks we act as a brake on the excesses of the Euro project, and would far rather have us on the inside fighting them, than being on the outside and more likely to be dismissed.

        After all, whatever one might think of the us, who wouldn’t want the UK fighting on their side?

    • nevermind

      Nice try Anon1, the one seems to be important to you, what you mean to say is that after the 11.11. 2015, how fitting, the EU stated clearly that it does not recognise Israels…. oh read it for yourself…

      Interpretative Notice on indication of origin of goods from the territories occupied by Israel since June 1967
      The European union, in line with international law,does not recognise Israel’s sovereignty over the territories occupied by Israel since June 1967, namely
      the Golan Heights, the Gaza Strip and the West Bank, including East Jerusalem,
      and does not consider them to be part of Israel’s territory 1, irrespective of their legal status under domestic Israeli law
      2. The Union has made it clear that it will not recognise any changes to pre-
      1967 borders, other than those agreed by the parties to the Middle East Peace process (MEPP).

      a pdf file I can’t copy the link to.

  • Republicofscotland

    Zionist Union leader Isaac Herzog’s spokesman says Israeli settlers built swimming pools on stolen lands saturated by the blood of murdered children.

    Zionist union spokesman Ofer Newman, was quick to apologise and recant his remarks, after he infuriated Herzog.

    ” Newman’s censure nearly coincided with similar comments by an Israeli celebrity anchorwoman, deriding a settler during a game show late on Friday.”

    “After an Israeli settler participating in the show finished singing, Israeli Channel 10 anchorwoman Oshrat Kotler (pictured above) said, “There is no doubt that he is a sane settler. It seems that those types do exist, even from Yitzhar (a settlement in the northern West Bank).”

    “Over half a million Israelis live in more than 230 illegal settlements built since the 1967 Israeli occupation of the Palestinian territories of the West Bank, including East al-Quds (Jerusalem).”

  • Anon1


    Let us show our solidarity with Tony Blair, Jack Straw, David Cameron and George Osborne by voting Remain on Thursday 23rd.

    • Republicofscotland

      Or we could just order a large delicious plate of Fukushima rice, which is heading to London in several weeks time, handy if you want to glow in the dark.

      “Fukushima-harvested rice will hit the stores in Britain in July, which might make it the first member of the EU to import the grain, following a sustained effort by a group of Fukushima natives in London fighting rumors about the safety of the crop.”

      Who in there right mind would buy this rice, without first buying a Geiger counter? And what next Chernobyl cherries? They make you feel warm all over hmmmm…. delicious.

      • Republicofscotland

        Former Mossad director joins anti-Iran board, a kind of BDS for Iran if you like.

        Along with Tamir Pardo :

        “UANI’s membership also includes former US senator Joe Lieberman, former American special Middle East government coordinator Dennis Ross, former Spanish foreign minister Ana de Palacio, former heads of the CIA, and former Australian defense minister Robert Hill. UANI also works to convince international corporations not to do business with Iran.”,7340,L-4817195,00.html

  • Anon1


    Let us show our solidarity with Tony Blair, Jack Straw, David Cameron and George Osborne by voting Remain on Thursday 23rd.

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