78 people died at Glencoe and we still sing about it over three hundred years later. Over 700 have been massacred so far in Gaza, 80% of them innocent civilians. The UN Human Rights Commissioner has made the very obvious, the unarguable, point that there is prima facie evidence of war crimes by Israel. These include the killing of four young boys playing football on the beach at Gaza, and the use of industrial nail bombs in civilian areas.
Yet the UK refused to support even having an investigation. Please note this was not a vote to condemn Israel, or to declare war crimes. It was a vote to have an investigation.
I am ashamed to belong to the UK. Just as having served the UK for twenty years and having worked my way up to be a proud British Ambassador, I became so ashamed at our complicity in torture and extraordinary rendition, I had to resign.
I want to be part of a country of which I am not ashamed
Now imagine that board with Scotland on it and a green light next to it.
This is the British Foreign Secretary. He declares that Israel “has a right to defend itself” and that for the UN to investigate Israeli war crimes is “unhelpful”.
This man does not represent me, or anything about me. Nor, emphatically, does that flag behind him.
Craig
I found the list of countries voting for an investigation into the Israeli killings interesting too but for a very different reason than you.
Looking at the list you dream of a Scotland yes. Whereas I notice a very real truth:
Austria Abst
France Abst
Germany Abst
Ireland Abst
Italy Abst
Romania Abst
United Kingdom Abst
That’s every EU state on the list against an investigation.
Coincidence? Unrelated to EU membership? A sure sign that the EU states will be better together?
Or an indicator of something else?
Down with the EU!
The trope that Israel is ‘defending itself’ seems to be getting swallowed whole, even by those who dimly sense that deploying the entire modern armoury against a captive civilian population maybe isn’t quite right. It needs challenging every time it is trotted out by the Israelis and their apologists. TFS posted this link yesterday – for those who missed it:
http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/palestinians.php
Behind the bland self-justification, that’s the reality. The longterm aim, faithfully pursued by successive Israeli governments, is ethnic cleansing, by any means available, without recognition of ethics, morals or anyone else’s opinion. To call this ‘defence’ is simply laughable. If Israel were interested in defending itself against attack by its historic victims, it would genuinely seek an accommodation. It would negotiate in good faith. It would open the crossings, permit trade, and permit free travel for the inhabitants of the ghetto. It would release prisoners held without charge after having been arrested as an act of revenge. And it would stop building settlements on Palestinian land.
It doesn’t, and it won’t. Therefore it is not defending itself, but creating the conditions which guarantee it will always be under threat from people who are defending themselves, by the only means left to them by Israel.
I’m not ashamed of being British – that’s something which has always meant a bit more than the venal tools we elect to govern us – and have little choice as to which tools we elect. Instead I’m deeply disgusted that the tools can’t scrape together enough principle to vote for the UN resolution (while noting that we didn’t actually vote No, like Israel’s big friend).
And it’s increasingly obvious that what’s really responsible for our pusillanimity isn’t anything to do with rights, wrongs, morality or humanitarian concerns. It’s about money. About who pays our parties’ election bills. About who we sell arms to. About who might be willing, subject to not rocking the boat (sign here please), to create employment opportunities ,,,as our mutual friend Moishe is thinking of investing in a factory in his constituency.
Or an indicator of something else?
Such as : EU complicity in murder
(just in case this wasn’t clear)
Agree, Phil…but basically, it’s follow-the-money time again.
While I think this is peripheral, it’s still an important aspect of what’s going on:
http://www.theecologist.org/News/news_analysis/2489992/armed_robbery_in_gaza_israel_us_uk_carve_up_the_spoils_of_palestines_stolen_gas.html
Not sure what all hassle is about? It seems like IDF is just doing its job. What war crimes investigation? They need more time. they said it clearly.
“The discoveries bring the number of tunnels intended for terrorist activity that the IDF has uncovered to 31. As the tunnels are dangerous and difficult to destroy, IDF forces have only destroyed nine of the tunnels thus far. The IDF stated that more time will be needed to uncover and destroy the terror tunnels in Gaza, which the army has stated is its primary goal in its Gaza operations.”
http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Protective-Edge/IAF-hits-35-targets-overnight-ground-forces-kill-several-Hamas-operatives-take-prisoners-368709
Yes
“chip-shouldered anti-English xenophobia” is incorrect and insulting.
I see that disinformation promoted regularly by London based Journalists.
The Yes campaign is more about democracy.
Personalising the Yes movement to Alicsammin and the SNP dilutes your credibility.
I’m sure you’re not a DailyMail reader and enthusiastic window licker but saying stuff like that does paint a picture.
Palestinian children deserve better.
Jim
Since most people here trust RT on Russia’s war in Ukraine, I just thought why not trust Jpost on IDF operation in Gaza. Why would JPost be biased and twist information? Fair square?
Craig
“The balance is finer than you might think.”
Is it really? Do tell. Or are you a dreamer?
Apart from the dreamy hopes the harsh truth is Every EU state on the list is against an investigation!
Down with the EU super government!
Baal
Yes I saw this gas thing come up on another site a few days ago but it got shot down as all the reports coming from one unsubstantiated source. I have no idea how true this is.
Sorry to rush I have to go out.
Looks like you’ve got yourself a wriggler there, Phil. Don’t let him go!
Regarding the refusal of Abbas to insist on an investigation by the ICC, there has of course been pressure on him by the US Congress that they will withdraw US funding from Palestine if he does so. Also Israeli General Mandelblic asked for US assistance in dissuading Abbas from this course. He commented that Israel’s relations with the PA had been on a positive track, but described the
PA,s actions as “war to take us to the ICC” and hoped the
U.S. would help the PA understand the gravity of its actions.
The Ambassador affirmed that the U.S. had consistently
pressed the PA to cease such actions and had received
assurances before Goldstone that the PA would freeze such
attempts. http://wikileaks.org/cable/2010/02/10TELAVIV417.html
Well said !!!
Nothing will change until the US goes into meltdown.
It’s a mistake to think of Israel as a country in the usual sense.
Israel is a western project, and that’s why you’ll hear little in the way of condemnation from western leaders.
Israel is primarily a western colony whose aim is to ensure that Arabs don’t unite, and particularly any unification between ME Arabs and North African Arabs.
It’s rather like Poland in that regard, whose prime function is to ensure there is no unity between Russia and Europe.
Phil –
If you have time to read the Ecologist article I linked to, in full, you’ll see that it’s supported by numerous references, and that its major critic is closely connected with the Israeli project.
A central question, from this:
Why was Netanyahu simultaneously pushing forward negotiations over Gaza’s gas, while also blocking and excluding any deal that would grant any Palestinian entity inclusion in the deal?
“Nothing will change until the US goes into meltdown.”
And what will change then? Will we all live happily ever after? The same was sad many centuries ago about Romans, then about Ottomans, about French, British, Russians? This is cycle of history. Empires crumble only to give way to another empire.
And you sit there wearing your pink glasses.
Uzbek in the UK
24 Jul, 2014 – 11:09 am
—————————–
Uzbek, are you Special Branch or MI5 ?
It’s a nice thought Craig,Scotland the Brave standing up for the Palestinians!
In reality,it would be a small indebted country and it would do what the money tells it to do.
Labour,Conservative,Lib/Dem and EU all support Israel…………..I thought there was another party which is very unlikely to be so supportive,but for obvious reasons has to keep it’s mouth shut?
@Harry Bannerman
Quite a racist mate, are you not? There was no unity between Arabs since end of 9th century (under Arabs leadership) and there was no unity between Muslims, never. Poor knowledge of history, plus anti-Semitic shit gives way to the stupid conclusions.
And thinking that Poland is on the way of Russian-European unification is … well I have no words for it. There was time (300 years) when Poland did not exist and that time (accidentally) coincided with perpetual war between Russia and Europe.
Get real.
Should the Western empire collapse, then we’ll all have a bit of breathing space until another gets up and running.
There’s no one else currently who can do the damage the US is doing on a global scale.
The hypocrisy of the “civilised” debating society in UN the whole board is either green or white (the subservient coattail hangers), and the motion is defeated.
That is the motion, to “investigate”, nothing other than fact finding and recording, yet this too was defeated. Making a mockery of historical “facts” and “accuracies”, for if it is not recorded, then it dose not exist! Note the millions of Iraqi dead, that is passed as 120,000! Thus the genocide and war crimes of the zionist supremacists shall be disputed.
This is further compounded by foreign secretary Hammond appearing next to not so amused Nat-an-yahoo delivering platitudes as to “right to defend” only for zionists scum, and more platitudes with an added caveat; “grave concerns for civilian casualties” note the gutless, ball-less half hearted protest without daring to mention that these civilians referred to are Palestinians, mainly the women, children and old and infirm Palestinians.
There is no record so there can be no future war crimes commission investigating any of these war crimes, and crimes against peace, and crimes against humanity committed by a rabidly racist Jewish supremacists.
Now back to the grind, where did I put that file about this chap who looks like that Nazi guard in some place in Germany during WWII, damn war criminal ought to be tried for his war crimes.
Phil
OK, I will tell, as you asked.
The EU states voted together. They nearly but not always do. They have a treaty obligation to “strive to reach a common position.”
But in reaching that common position, the balance was finer than you might think. The UK is the leader of the pro-Zionist and pro-US position in the EU. Start to break up the UK, and add another country to the pro-human rights side, and you start to affect the balance.
In fact breaking up the UK, which acts as the US proxy in internal EU debates, is a good thing not just on Palestine.
Hope that helps 🙂
@doug scorgie
“Uzbek, are you Special Branch or MI5 ?”
Is this your smoking gun against me, mad western leftie creature?
Mr Murray,
And what insurances you have that Independent Scotland will be anti-US? Last time I looked there were more people of Scottish origin in the US (many of whom done well) than in Scotland. Is not this Anglo-Saxon unity not that US/UK unity?
“Not sure what all hassle is about? It seems like IDF is just doing its job”
Ты козел, там детей убивают, людей калечат просто за то что они хотят чтобы вернули им свои земли, родину. А ты сука про хасл масл, чекнутый чмо еврейское.
@Harry Bannerman
“There’s no one else currently who can do the damage the US is doing on a global scale.”
I say give them a chance. It is estimated that more than 30 million died in decades of conflicts during Cold War (and it was not just US, there were two major participants in this conflict). It is estimated that Nazis killed more than 40 million during WWII. It is estimated that Stalin’s purges killed at least 8 million. It is estimated that Mao’s Great Leap Forward killed at least 60 million.
But you did not know about this, did you? Or do not give a shit about it, do you?
Agree Harry Bannerman. I have some understanding of Poland sandwiched between Germany and three former Soviet republics, including Ukraine that was ruled by a communist puppet government until 1989.
Poland has worthless paper guarantees of safety while Israel has US muscle and US Dollars.
Y’know, I’m beginning to favour UKIP. If Craig’s right, and the balance in the EU is a fine one, then a serious threat from UKIP, whether or not we leave the EU, will inspire Cameron to alienate the EU still further. To the point where reaction sets in, and the rest of the members wonder whether they really want to be seen as supporting ethnic cleansing. (Discuss!)
Whereas, if Scotland secedes, and economic imperatives force it to lend an ear to its indigenous friends of Israel…not so certain, I think.
It’s official. Protesting against Israel is anti-Semitic!
“European Union foreign ministers condemned anti-Semitic incidents at Gaza protests across the EU when they met on Tuesday.”
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28439988
Свердлов
The same could be said about murderers in Ukraine operating with Krelmin’s blessing and supplied by Russian guns. People are dying in Ukraine too, in case you have not noticed.
But your small Butthole brain cells are not capable of thinking, are they? You write what you were told to write. You think what you were told to think. I know your kind. The worst kind of human beings on the planet.
Uzbek.
When the US goes into meltdown, the bully loses its big brother with the never ending wallet and stores of bombs and bullets.Without US support the Zionastys will hopefully fade away.
You meant rose tinted didnT’ you ? Empires come and empires go and the sooner American century ends the better for peace everywhere.
I don’t think there is anything wrong with a happy ending for the Palestinians if possible.Do you ?
There are no assurances that a Scottish Govt would be anti American.. Scotland depends on the US for tourism and Whisky sales.Their approach will be a friendly one I’m sure,while at the same time telling the US navy to take their nukes out of Scotland.
The US has proven time and again that economic sanctions are more effective than Nukes… and environmentally friendly.