The EU Sails Serenely Past the Wreck of the United Kingdom 278

The disgraced former Defence Secretary Liam Fox has accused the EU of “blackmail” in the Brexit talks. This puzzles me. The disgraced former Defence Secretary has repeatedly asserted that the EU is desperate for a trade deal with the UK, and that German manufacturers of Mercedes and BMWs will insist that the UK leaving the EU brings no interruption in free trade, with no concomitant requirements for the UK to comply with EU practice.

But if the UK’s hand is so strong, and the EU’s hand is so weak, then the EU surely is in no position to “blackmail” the UK?

The disgraced former Defence Secretary has never struck me as a man of great intellect. It is perhaps unsurprising that it has not occurred to him, that to accuse your negotiating partner, in the most public manner possible, of blackmail, is not a tactic designed to inculcate the cooperative spirit necessary in any complex negotiation. Worse than that, “Blackmail” is a cry of “please don’t hurt me, I am weak on this one”. Fox contrives to be both insulting and inept all at the same time. It really is quite astonishing that a man who is both entirely incompetent, and has the corruption and inanity of the Werritty affair permanently inscribed on his record, is in office.

But the most incredible thing of all is that, standing in Japan next to Theresa May, the disgraced former Defence Secretary looks competent and assured by comparison. The collapse of the UK is not a pretty sight.

Meanwhile, Brexit has one positive side – for the EU. Just as national parliaments have done through history, the EU Parliament has been increasing its power incrementally over decades, thus eating away at the EU’s democratic deficit. Officially, on Brexit the Commission negotiates, and the Council (of national governments) decides, while the Parliament is only consulted. But plainly the role played by Guy Verhofstadt, the Parliament’s Brexit rapporteur, is more substantive than that and in the real world the EU Parliament will need to be carried along in agreement. That is a good thing for EU democracy.

Secondly, allow me to crow yet again at the detractors of the Euro. The Euro is arguably the most astonishing economic project in the history of the world, a currency union replacing dozens of existing currencies in the world’s largest and most mature economic bloc. Its success is, on any rational analysis, far more notable than the inevitable teething troubles, pretty well all of which can be ascribed to countries joining at too high a rate allowed to their former currency. I have always advocated that the UK join the Euro and that independent Scotland simply adopts it. Commenters invariably rejoin by echoing the ludicrous prognostications by the Mail and the Express of the Euro’s collapse. I look forward before Easter to the Euro decisively overtaking the pound in value.

The EU will go from strength to strength. An independent Scotland will remain within it. The rump UK will subside with alarming speed, comforting itself with its imperial delusions and xenophobic pride at “controlling its borders” and keeping out those pesky foreigners, who kept blackmailing it.

278 thoughts on “The EU Sails Serenely Past the Wreck of the United Kingdom

1 2 3 4
  • Xavi

    Brexit is no secret, and most predictions about its consequences have been stridently negative. Even so, there remains little support in Scotland for another independence referendum. In fact, the SNP lost seats to pro-Brexit parties in June. Please don’t risk your credibility by mistaking what you desperately want to be reality for actual existing reality.

  • Hamish

    I think I will sale serenely past Craig Murreys books next time I’m in the book shop ,im not that rapped up in fiction novels!

    • Node

      Three times you referred to Liam Fox as “disgraced”. Ironic.

      It’s his proper title.

      There’s a late, unlamented Twitter account that died a death some time in 2011. @itsJOSSnotJOSH was either a bot or possibly just someone with far too much time on their hands, but either way, it existed entirely to reply to tweets mentioning the TV and film writer “Josh Whedon” to tell them they’d got his name wrong.

      Were I remotely capable of coding I think I’d set up a similar bot. I’ve been doing this manually, when I have the time, but automation would make my operation so much more efficient. Here’s what my bot would do. Whenever someone mentioned Liam Fox, it would tweet them with a reminder that he should more properly be referred to by his full title of “the disgraced former defence secretary, Dr Liam Fox”

  • What's going on?

    Great post. I pretty much agree with everything here apart from the prediction at the end. Once we leave and become a ‘third country’ as far as EU law is concerned the resulting break up of worldwide supply chains will have to be addressed. If nothing is done then it is inevitable that Scotland will become independent from a fast sinking UK. Which is exactly one of the reasons why something shall be done… Rejoin, including the Euro? Bring on the hardest Brexit possible I say and I’ll be happy to buy every leave voter I know a pint down their local… in Euros. :))

  • reel guid

    Scottish Labour acting branch manager Alex Rowley has claimed a drop in the SNP’s membership revenue for 2016 is an indication that they are in decline. Scrutiny of both parties’ accounts for 2016 shows the reality is that the SNP had about 25 times as much membership revenue in 2016 than Scottish Labour. That SL’s significant drop in membership revenue for 2016 is also a larger proportion of their total.

    Around £2.5 million for the SNP compared to just £109 000 for Labour. Alex should have kept quiet. But then again he knows the media will spin it to make it sound good for unionists.

    • reel guid

      To be more precise, in 2016 it was £2.59 million membership revenue for the SNP and £108 000 for Scot Lab.

      • Republicofscotland

        reel guid.

        Add to that it’s a mystery as to how many people are actually a member of the Labour branch office in Scotland.

        Of course the media protect the branch office by never asking such tricky questions.

        However we gained a insight into the vast Labour hoardes, as presented by the media, when Corbyn’s five day jaunt around Scotlandshire, showed us colonials on social media that hardly anybody attended his speeches.

        Infact according to Mhairi Black in the National newspaper, Corbyn wasn’t even aware that Scotland has its own legal system.

        Nor had Corbyn been aware of the £100 million the SNP government spend to off-set Tory cuts, when he shouted loudly to anyone who’d listen in the Scottish colony that the SNP weren’t trying hard enough to counter Tory cuts.

        • reel guid


          Yes. The SNP Government spends money to try and cushion Scotland from Tory ultra-austerity. But it’s money spent from a block grant to Holyrood that the Tories keep on reducing. And it was Labour who campaigned as good friends with the Tories for indyref1 and told Scots about how we were so better off in the union.

          • Republicofscotland

            That’s right reel guid, not forgetting Anas Sarwar, who loudly chastised the SNP on our colonial masters tv channels, on how they were too slow to mitigate the Bedroom tax.

            Then we find out Sarwar, missed a vote at Westminster to abolish the tax. Sarwar was also comprehensively rejected by the voter, but still managed to squirm his way back in through the secondary list.

            I’m hoping he becomes the next branch manager, he’s already a bit of obnoxious character in Scotlandshire.

          • reel guid

            Yes. Sarwar is a list MSP and so is Dugdale. You could say Scot Lab is listing badly. To starboard of course, given the politics of both the likely new leader and the previous incumbent.

  • J Arther Rank

    Setting aside Brexit and Independence Craig seems to have a rosy view of EU democracy perhaps he should spend some time looking at the following characters.
    Guy Verhofstadt, known in his younger days as baby Thatcher and his interesting and lucrative involvement with the SOFINA investment company.
    Stefan Fule the arrogant former commissioner for enlargement who told the Kiev government prior to the putsch that if they would not sign the EU agreement “another prime minister and another president would”
    Ceceila Malmstrom commissioner for trade,who remarked “I do not take my mandate from the European people.”
    And then there is the sweet smelling Joroen Dijsselbloem who shares responsibility for the Greece disaster “I cannot spend all my money on drinks and women and then hold my hand up”
    What a shower.
    aka Nast

      • J Arther Rank

        Hatred, I think not. I want a democratic EU organized for the benefit of the majority of the people.
        With numerous posts on different sites you defend the status quo. Why?
        I challenge you to give us some critique of the EU.

        Aka Nast

        • john young

          j Arthur what planet do you/have you lived on,whenever has any political party taken on the wishes of those that were daft enough to vote for them.We here in Scotland do not need anymore political wannabees of any colour they are all much of a muchness SNP included,we should adopt the Common Weal approach inmo,electing those of proven ability in their particular field,people of integrity and ethos,we are witnessing the SNP being trampled under by 2 of the worst politicians imaginable and that,s saying something,hardly a peep from them,not one of them a true leader that would show a vision of a future Scotland,happy to sit on their fannies in Holyrood like their cousins in Westminster.

        • Laguerre

          Craig has a principle – I hope I’m citing him correctly – but mine also, that one shouldn’t destroy an institution simply because you don’t like the people in power today. They will be gone soon. Your complaints are about the people.

          I also want reform in the EU, but one that may be executed. It is too big. The expansion to 28 was driven by Britain, Tony Blair, in 2004 to take in eastern Europe. Blair’s motive was that it was what the Americans wanted, in order to do down Russia, but also probably to weaken the EU. There has now to be a two-speed Europe, with a core and an exterior. Before the referendum in 2016, there were quite a number of meetings which were limited to the “core”, suggesting that things would go further that way. Since then, those meetings have stopped. I imagine it is because EU27 unity is required in face of Brexit. Once Brexit is over in 2019, that process could restart. Evidently we don’t know that it will do, but I suspect that it is in the heads of leaders.

  • Woit

    In Greece, the Euro permitted widespread asset-stripping and infliction of conditions of life that threatened the destruction of part of a population. That is not a teething trouble. The Euro was a necessary but not sufficient condition. The proximate cause was bank fraud: the people of Greece were made to pay for Goldman Sachs derivatives that subverted EU rules. The democratic deficit will increase and induce further financial predation in a vicious circle. The Euro would be a nice idea if Europe were not terminally corrupt US satellite states. As it is, the Euro will ensure that European peoples face ruin together for the benefit of bankers.

  • Allan williams

    re Euro – remember John major Tory govt.? When he was Chancellor just before the £ joined the ERM he went around the world “bigging up” the £’s value, so entered ERM at wrong value & we got burnt ( money reserves spent propping it up). Things dont change much do they.

  • Dave

    The UK is a very successful Union which Ireland should be asked to re-join. And a smaller European Union would be very successful too, but size matters. A Britain an Ireland Union and a smaller EU would be the right size to work, but put them all together and add more countries and its becomes too big to work. and de facto becomes an imperial project.

    And if Scotland left the UK but remained in EU it would diminish Scotland by making them a small fish in a big bowl rather than a big fish in a small bowl.

    • SA

      I agree with some of what you say especially about the extended EU becoming an imperial project which it became when it decided to be the political extension of NATO. The incorporation of the former Warsaw Pact members into the EU and NATO has lead to many problems for all. The attempt at forcing Ukraine to prepare the EU and ultimately NATO is also clearly ending in a disaster especially for Ukraine.
      There was nothing wrong with economic harmonisation and common economic and trading policy but the current thrust of the EU is not encouraging.

  • Dave Lawton

    Voters in the the UK were lied to and propagandised by the IRD a department of the foreign office headed by Norman Reddaway who was the worlds biggest lier and propagandist to vote to remain in the EU in 1975.The IRD was set up by the Labour party.The Leave voters had the generosity of spirit to accept the result and went on to support it not like today.

  • Duncan McFarlane

    Can agree on Fox and May, but this seems like a very rose tinted view of the EU and the Euro, especially when you look at the way Greece has been treated, which makes even tory austerity in the UK look mild (and tory austerity is more than bad enough as it cuts benefits and services for the poorest and the disabled most).

    • Laguerre

      The Greek problem was basically due to the follies of successive Greek governments, wasn’t it?

      • Duncan McFarlane

        How’s that different to any other country that had a banking crisis? Including the UK and Germany? Deregulation by successive governments let the banks commit fraud and the big banks, firms and super-rich evade or avoid taxes – and when the fraud by the banks was discovered taxpayers ended up paying the bill. Same in Greece as in the UK. But because Greece didn’t have its own currency – and its banks hadn’t bought up US banks, it couldn’t issue any money itself once it was in serious deficit – and didn’t get a bail out from the US Federal Reserve either, the way British banks did.

      • mog

        I think that Varoufakis agrees. But the question is, now that a country like Greece is in the mess that it is, what is to be done?

        This is the main criticism of the Euro project: that it has divorced fiscal policy institutions from monetary ones, and so cannot deal with a debt crisis such as that which has arisen in the PIGS. The contrast with the US is regularly made in this regard.

        The Eurozone (and everyone else) might well have to deal with another financial crisis very soon, as the housing bubble in Canada/ Australia bursts, that and the predicted spike in oil prices that so many are anticipating in the next two years.

        If/ When that happens, the Euro project will be very lucky to survive.

  • Tony_0pmoc

    “The Wreck of The United Kingdom”

    Well, I suppose its a bit like “The Good Life” where we live, but I’ve got the Lancashire equivalent of Felicity Kendal, and we do grow lots of fruit and veg. Our neighbours are all about the same age – with kids coming on 30 and some with grandkids, but not everyone has paid off their mortgages, and to be honest, things for some are a bit tight…

    However some of our Neighbours do AirBnb, and they grow grape vines (they do like wine)…but what I did not realise until today, is that some of our neighbours are growing hops, and both the hops and the grape vines are spreading into our garden, and climbing up our apple and pear trees.

    So we may all be a bit skint, and we all may get a bit pissed….but we get on reasonably well…We just tend to have fairly different social groups.

    This is England. We give the surplus away.

    Can you grow Grapes in Scotland?

    I assume you can do hops or is it just the hard stuff you are on?

    I do like a wee dram.


    • JOML

      I’m not sure about grapes, Tony, but Brewdog are doing well with the hops up here. Sounds like you live in a good neighbourhood and appreciating it – well done you!.

  • SA

    The disgraced but shameless Fox looked extremely uncomfortable when attacked by Jerry Anne Mendoza of The Canary on question time on 29/06/2017.
    Worth seeing. She dished out the bit about Werrity before Dimbleby could stop her.

    It is one of those strange things in politics that disgraced (but shameless) politicians could just serve a short period in the back benches then just come back as if nothing happened. It is also disgusting to see that the sadly unindicted Blair should still be given so much attention by the media.

  • Loony

    As the nasty insular British observe the EU love fest, some people may come to the conclusion that love aint what it used to be.

    Here are the French and the Poles with one or two very unpleasant things to say about each other.

    Inquiring minds will observe that from the Polish perspective the French do not seem to be viable opponents and so the Poles have widened their scope of operations to consider WW2 reparations from the Germans.

    I do wonder who funds M Macron’s $10,000 monthly make up bill. You really could not make it up – as all the Make Up is on Macron’s face.

  • Loony

    Yet more on the serenity of the EU.

    Austria serenely moves troops and armor to its border with Italy.

    Apparently the Austrians are keen to prevent refugees accessing Austrian territory. This is all very strange really as the EU/IMF are convinced that the economic effect of refugees is positive

    This must make the Austrians stupid for refusing to take as many people as possible from Italy. So, who would want to be in a union with a country that is demonstrably stupid?

  • Loony

    The last time he tried to leave the Euro Berlusconi found himself deposed. However, perhaps boosted by the unstoppable strength of a refugee inspired economic miracle, Berlusconi is back.

    This time around he wants Italy to have 2 currencies – one as imposed by the Germans and another to work for the benefit of the Italian people. Ah the unity. How the British must be regretting their decision to leave the rotting corpse that is the EU.

  • Loony

    …and up next?

    Why, a think tank report that suggests that the economic interests of Ireland would be best served by its leaving the EU

    Maybe some in Ireland remember that they had a vote on aspects of the EU – but that the hegemonic power did not like their vote and so ordered them to vote again. Not normally a good tactic for inculcating long term loyalty.

    • Laguerre

      You are right to call yourself ‘Loony’

      The image of the EU as dictatorial is lunatic, typical of the most extreme ideological Brexiters.

      • Loony

        It seems reasonable to suppose that Brexiteers are confined to the UK.

        The examples I gave concerned Poland, France, Italy, Austria and Ireland – so nothing to do with Brexit at all. Everything to do with the claimed serenity of the EU – a claim that does not withstand the most rudimentary scrutiny.

        No one has claimed that the EU is dictatorial – rather that it is an out of control egotistical and lawless project that has been subverted to do the bidding of German economic power. How else to explain the lawless nature of German car manufacturers who routinely commit crimes for which they are never prosecuted. And so they double down by pretending that manufacturing cars and then destroying them to be replaced by freshly manufactured cars is somehow good for the environment.

        You can believe the EU if you want to – but you will find zero evidence to support your belief.

      • mog

        The image of the EU as dictatorial is lunatic, typical of the most extreme ideological Brexiters.

        What about the image of transnational corporate capitalism as ‘dictatorial’ (and ‘lunatic’) with the EU being a conduit for its machinations ?

    • JOML

      Well, Loony, I hope for the Irish’s sake that Wellington’s ghost isn’t behind this report.

    • Why be ordinary?

      Lots of people in Ireland know how the U.K. behaved in Ireland in the past and don’t want to return to that, whatever their former Ambassador to Canada might think.

      • Dave

        Ireland is a different country now illustrated by the surrender of their independence to EU, legalisation of “Gay marriage” and HM Queen visit to Dublin. And Britain is a greatly changed country too, with growing demands for devolution throughout the UK. So re-joining the UK is not the same as re-joining the old UK. I know some people nurse grievances, but objectively its the British people, rather than the Irish who have suffered most at the hands of the British government.

          • Dave

            If Ireland can be part of a European Union then they can be part of a British Union and with ease because the Irish ethnic heritage and relationships of the British population is very high and a compromise could be associate Irish membership of the British Union within the Commonwealth. Ireland joined the Common Market with UK and now they should leave the EU with the UK. Bearing in mind the troubles in Ireland were due to the Irish civil war, now resolved, rather than due to British interference.

  • Dave

    A single market doesn’t need a single currency to work, indeed a single currency can undermine a single market, because people will want to escape the single market to escape the single currency, because the absence of their own currency removes an economic tool to make fiscal adjustments when problems arise. An elementary point which shows why the EU is a political rather than economic project. And this is recognised by “Left and Right”. For example Bryan Gould stood against John Smith for the Labour leadership on an anti-Euro platform, but alas lost by a wide margin and retired to New Zealand.

  • Nick Rowling

    Excellent article. I hate to crow but I have been arguing more or less the same thing about the Brexit and the euro for years. And, of course, support for the euro in the early years looked pretty crazy and it was laughed out of court by Nobel economists like Krugman and Stiglitz. Well, the steady collapse of the dollar and sterling and the astonishing survival and now obvious success of the euro has proved that we were right and they were wrong. And since ‘the imminent collapse of the euro’ and the consequent collapse of the whole ‘European Project’ were the main arguments for the UK leaving the EU – Brexit is looking even stupider (and more impossible) every day, and when the UK economy collapses – as it certainly will if Brexit uncertainty continues much longer – who else is going to bail the UK out but the European Central Bank? And I am happy to predict that the UK will be allowed to stay in the EU but only on condition that it adopts the euro.

    • Kerch'ee Kerch'ee Coup

      Your happy prediction of the UK’s continued membership(readmission) is in line with my own grim forebodings
      of the mixture of incompetence and bad faith that has characterized the British approach to the Brexit negotiations by the May regime together with the machinations of the Blair /Prince of Darkness set.
      Secondly,the euro was always seen as a political project by monetary economists and Bundesbank traditionalists such as Schlesinger. Eventually, it requires some form of fiscal transfer arrangement and that perhaps was one reason for its adoption without an optimal currency area having formed and without the criteria being transparently and honestly met.

  • John Goss

    I agree that Liam Fox is a liability, grossly incompetent and yet impressive when stood alongside Theresa May. Sky news this morning has been praising May’s rivals for Tory leadership, with Boris Johnson and Jacob Rees-Mogg, two ex-Etonians, (big surprise there) leading the chasing pack. But there are worse prospects for the world even than these buffoons.

    I am seriously expecting Mr Craig Murray, former ambassador to Uzbekistan, to speak out about the US violation of the Vienna Convention and the precedent it is likely to set. I am especially concerned for the safety of Julian Assange if the US is allowed to get away with this, and all other citizens protected by embassies throughout the world. Trump is probably the most dangerous man on the planet.

    • Tony_0pmoc

      John Goss,

      Trump has virtually no power, and does what he is told. That is true of all US Presidents since JFK. Trump could have had some power, if he had used similar techniques to Putin, but he didn’t have the courage , nor intellectual capability to do so and was incredibly naive.

      • John Goss

        He thought he was going to be a wild card until the secret services showed him what they had on him, or who really assassinated President Kennedy. Now he is theirs. 🙂 This probably makes him even more dangerous.

    • Tony_0pmoc

      Alan campbell,

      There is nothing nutty about that. Assange is simply stating the facts. A declining birth rate is highly desirable with regards to long term sustainability and quality of life. An exponentially rising birth rate, as the world has generally experienced, and still is throughout much of it, is disastrous, producing extremely high death rates and human misery. I don’t completely agree with Thomas Malthus, or we wouldn’t have a declining birth rate in The West, but he certainly wasn’t all wrong.


  • Ally

    People like you keep on about ‘xenophobic’ leavers. I voted to leave not because I dislike foreigners, with a German granny, hardly applies to me, but because the EEC, EU and whatever other names it went or goes under…Never did anything for ME. I cannot think of a single thing to thank the EU for. Ergo, years ago I decided if I ever got the chance I’d give the EU a kicking. Last year I got that chance and gave it a kicking…never for one moment believing I’d be on the winning side.
    If another referendum is held (second refs. being the norm in the EU) I will vote the same way.

    • reel guid

      At the end of 2014 the European Union earmarked a billion euros for Scottish infrastructure projects to run until the end of 2020. At which time – providing Scotland remains in the EU – there will undoubtedly be more investment from the same source. That money from 2014 is being used to develop Scotland’s offshore wind, wave and tidal industries. As well as improving rural transport infrastructure which benefits Scottish businesses and the tourist industry.

      Westminster has made it’s disdain for Scotland’s renewables sector very clear. And if Scotland leaves the EU there will be nowhere remotely near the same kind of funding available for these industries, which are so important for Scotland economically and environmentally.

      • reel guid

        There are so many examples of the benefits of the EU to Scotland. This year the European Social Fund gave Moray Council almost half a million pounds to finance traineeships and help with starting up small businesses As well as a Moray Council project to help people manage debt.

        The list could go on. If all that kind of funding goes then Westminster is not going to provide substitute funds considering the block grant to Holyrood keeps getting reduced.

        • Republicofscotland

          Yes well said reel guid, Scotland will miss EU funding in the future.

          That one of the reasons why independence is a must.

          • reel guid

            Absolutely Ros.

            So many examples. The EU funded Roma-Net project gave several cities across the EU funds to help Roma people with their access to education, health and work etc. One of those cities was Glasgow.

            Will Ruth Davidson and Douglas Ross be seeking to find replacement funding from the Tory government? Don’t think so given their attitude.

          • Tony_0pmoc

            The idea that the EU is a benevolent fund for the “poor” Scottish, couldn’t be futher from the truth. If the EU was the slightest bit benevolent, they wouldn’t have impoverished and economically largely destroyed Portugal, Italy, Ireland, Greece and Spain. Compared to most of the rest of Europe, the UK is wealthy, and with the political will, has more than sufficient resources to fund UK infrastructure and other projects completely independently.

            An Independent Scotland, would also have sufficent resources, but only if it was also independent from the EU, and had its own Sovereign currency.

            The idea that Scotland, needs to go out with a begging bowl, is an insult to the people of Scotland.

            The problem we all face in the UK, and much of the rest of the Western World, is that our politicians and their largely American controllers, are both useless, highly corrupt, and determined to spend a vast amount of real resources, on completely unnecessary and futile war. If we can’t get rid of these imbecile warmongers in control, the future is very bleak for everyone.


          • reel guid

            Scotland needs to stay in the EU single market. It would be crazy to be out of it.

            It’ll be chilly for England out of the EU. Don’t forget your thermals glider man.

          • Ba'al Zevul

            Yes well said reel guid, Scotland will miss EU funding in the future.

            That one of the reasons why dependence on the EU is a must.


            Incidentally, I remember from my time in the SNP a particularly trenchant phrase, used of those who felt Scotland was too weak/poor/otherwise inadequate to go it alone. It was “The Scottish Cringe”. This seems to have infected those who fear Brexit too. Ironic that you are among that number.

  • reel guid

    Then there’s nuclear safety. Scotland’s nuclear power stations have their safety regulated by the EU Euratom organisation. When Brexit happens there will be chaos and the safety responsibility will be transferred to the notorious UK Department of Work and Pensions.

  • reel guid

    The ISLES project – the Irish-Scottish Links on Energy Study – develops the integration of grid networks for marine renewable energy between Scotland, Northern Ireland and the Republic. In large part financed by the EU’s European Regional Development Fund.

    • Republicofscotland

      reel guid.

      I doubt Westminster will match EU funding in the agricultural fields, such as farming in Scotland. It makes you wonder why any farmer would vote to leave the EU.

      Indeed I’d go as far as to say, I doubt Westminster will meet EU funding levels, on any areas, if indeed it even continues the funding process at all.

  • reel guid

    A majority vote Remain in all 32 Scottish council areas. All 32! Yet we can be taken out the EU single market – the largest in the world – by Westminster.

    • Republicofscotland

      We are a colony at the whim of Westminster, which has decided that Scotland should leave the EU.

      • reel guid


        We’d be at the whim too of US corporations with their much lower food and environmental safety standards. The EU gave Scotland a fair bit of protection against that. Not if Liam Fox and Ruth Davidson get their way.

        Colonel Davidson’s Chlorine Washed Chicken. It’s Finger Lickin’ Harmful.

  • SA

    You can be a Remainer but be extremely critical of the EU. The EU has somewhat lost its way from being a free trade organisation to attempt at being a superstate aligned militarily with the US through NATO. This has led to the incorporation into the EU of virtually the whole previous Warsaw Pact countries not on economic merit, but just as a carrot so that they can also join NATO. This has resulted into such major incongruities and has swayed the EU’s agenda towards such things as involvement in the US trade wars with Russia and increasing tendencies to drop the guard against corporate power. This is a great pity because the EU could instead be a moderator of US hegemony especially in trade , where there is often a conflict of interests.
    The answer is not Brexit but moderating the EU from within.

      • SA

        But then why have the CIA not informed an ardent Atlanticist like Fox that he is in the wrong camp? And then this article not surprisingly, from the Telegraph.

        • mog

          And then this article not surprisingly, from the Telegraph.

          Here it is in the Huffington Post, if it makes it any more legitimate for you:

          It is documented history no matter who reports it.

          Fox, well he is, as we know, close to the Trump extreme right faction in the US, so not sure what ‘Atlanticist’ really means in this instance.

          The elites are dividing as liberalism falls apart. What is so rarely asked in the Brexit ‘debate’ are questions about our relationship with the United States of Armageddon, which colour all our relations with Europe.

          • SA

            Fox was aligned closely to the right of the Republican party way before Trump ever dreamt of standing for POTUS.
            As to our relationship with the USA it has always been militarily closer than to Europe and will become more so. We have been aligned to the interests of the US whether within or without Europe.

            It may be true that the EU was initially a CIA project but there have been fears of it becoming too independent of the US and that may also be another pull for Brexit from the Right wing Brexiters.

1 2 3 4

Comments are closed.