Keeping Freedom Alive 916


I want to make one or two points for you to ponder while I am in jail. This is the last post until about Christmas; we are not legally able to post anything while I am imprisoned. But the Justice for Craig Murray Campaign website is now up and running and will start to have more content shortly. Fora and comments here are planned to stay open.

I hope that one possible good effect of my imprisonment might be to coalesce opposition to the imminent abolition of jury trials in sexual assault cases by the Scottish Government, a plan for which Lady Dorrian – who wears far too many hats in all this – is front and centre. We will then have a situation where, as established by my imprisonment, no information at all on the defence case may be published in case it contributes to “jigsaw identification”, and where conviction will rest purely on the view of the judge.

That is plainly not “open justice”, it is not justice at all. And it is even worse than that, because the openly stated aim of abolishing juries is to increase conviction rates. So people will have their lives decided not by a jury of their peers, but by a judge who is acting under specific instruction to increase conviction rates.

It is often noted that conviction rates in rape trials are too low, and that is true. But have you ever heard this side of the argument? In Uzbekistan under the Karimov dictatorship, when I served there, conviction rates in rape trials were 100%. In fact very high conviction rates are a standard feature of all highly authoritarian regimes worldwide, because if the state prosecutes you then the state gets what it wants. The wishes of the state in such systems vastly outweigh the liberty of the individual.

My point is simply this. You cannot judge the validity of a system simply by high conviction rates. What we want is a system where the innocent are innocent and the guilty found guilty; not where an arbitrary conviction target is met.

The answer to the low conviction rates in sexual assault trials is not simple. Really serious increases in resources for timely collection of evidence, for police training and specialist units, for medical services, for victim support, all have a part to play. But that needs a lot of money and thought. Just abolishing juries and telling judges you want them to convict is of course free, or even a saving.

The right to have the facts judged in serious crime allegations by a jury of our peers is a glory of our civilisation. It is the product of millennia, not lightly to be thrown away and replaced by a huge increase in arbitrary state power. That movement is of course fueled by current fashionable political dogma which is that the victim must always be believed. That claim has morphed from an initial meaning that police and first responders must take accusations seriously, to a dogma that accusation is proof and it is wrong to even question the evidence, which is of course to deny the very possibility of false accusation.

That is precisely the position which Nicola Sturgeon has taken over the Alex Salmond trial; to be accused is to be guilty, irrespective of the defence evidence. That people are oblivious to the dangers of the dogma that there should be no defence against sexual assault allegations, is to me deeply worrying. Sexual allegation is the most common method that states have used to attack dissidents for centuries, worldwide and again especially in authoritarian regimes. Closer to home, think of history stretching from Roger Casement to Assange and Salmond.

Why would we remove the only barrier – a jury of ordinary citizens – that can stop abuse of state power?

I am worried that this abolition of juries will have been enacted by the Scottish Parliament, even before I am out of jail. I am worried Labour and the Lib Dems will support it out of fashionable political correctness. I am worried an important liberty will disappear.

I want to touch on one other aspect of liberty in my own imprisonment that appears not understood, or perhaps simply neglected, because somehow the very notion of liberty is slipping from our political culture. One point that features plainly in the troll talking points to be used against me, recurring continually on social media, is that I was ordered to take down material from my blog and refused.

There is an extremely important point here. I have always instantly complied with any order of a court to remove material. What I have not done is comply with instructions from the Crown or Procurator Fiscal to remove material. Because it is over 330 years since the Crown had the right of censorship in Scotland without the intervention of a judge.

It sickens me that so many Scottish Government backed trolls are tweeting out that I should have obeyed the instructions of the Crown. That Scotland has a governing party which actively supports the right of the Crown to exercise unrestrained censorship is extremely worrying, and I think a sign both of the lack of respect in modern political culture for liberties which were won by people being tortured to death, and of the sheer intellectual paucity of the current governing class.

But then we now learn that Scotland has a government which was prepared not only to be complicit in exempting the Crown from climate change legislation, but also complicit in hushing up the secret arrangement, so I am not surprised.

What is even more terrifying in my case is that the Court explicitly states that I should have followed the directions of the Crown Office in what I did and did not publish, and my failure to not publish as the Crown ordered is an aggravating factor in my sentencing.

If the Crown thinks something I write is in contempt and I think it is not, the Crown and I should stand as equals in court and argue our cases. There should be no presumption I ought to have obeyed the Crown in the first place. That Scottish “justice” has lost sight of this is disastrous, though perhaps as much from stupidity as malice.

My next thought on my trial is to emphasise again the dreadful doctrine Lady Dorrian has now enshrined in law, that bloggers should be held to a different (by implication higher) standard in law than the mainstream media (the judgement uses exactly those terms), because the mainstream media is self-regulated.

This doctrine is used to justify jailing me when mainstream media journalists have not been jailed for media contempt for over half a century, and also to explain why I have been prosecuted where the mainstream media, who were provably responsible for far more jigsaw identification, were not prosecuted.

This is dreadful law, and my entire legal team are frankly astonished that the Supreme Court refused to hear an appeal on this point. This excellent article by Jonathan Cook explains further the chilling implications.

Those articles which the Court ordered me to take down, have been taken down. But I was not ordered to take down this one, which was found not to be in contempt of court. I was also not ordered to take down my affidavits, which though slightly redacted are still extremely valuable. I swore to the truth of every word and I stick by that. At the time I published these, far less was known about the Salmond affair than is known now, and I believe you will find it well worth reading them again in the light of your current state of wider knowledge – absolutely nothing to do with learning identities, but to do with what really happened on the whole plot to destroy Alex Salmond (something the judgement states I am allowed to say).

Finally I urge you to consider this truly remarkable speech from Kenny MacAskill MP. Scotland’s former Justice Secretary, and consider its quite staggering implications. It tells you everything you want to know about the British Establishment’s capture of the Scottish government, that the mainstream media felt no need to report the main points he was making, which constitute a simply astonishing outline of corrupt abuse of power.

An explanation: this blog is going dark because I cannot by law publish from prison or conduct a business from prison. Access to this blog has always been free and open and subscriptions have always been a voluntary contribution and not a purchase. It is understood that all new and continuing subscriptions from today, until we go live again, are voluntary contributions to the welfare of my family and not in exchange for anything.

I am afraid one off contributions to the defence fund are also still urgently needed. Legal costs so far paid amount to over £200,000 and continue to rise as we head towards the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg, which has to be via another Scottish Court called the nobile officium. Astonishingly, over 13,000 individuals from over 120 countries have contributed to the legal defence fund. People all over the world value freedom and realise the terrible precedents established by this case must be overturned.

We are equally grateful for all donations and all really do help – donations of £5 or less total over £30,000. But I must mention the special generosity of Roger Waters and Vivienne Westwood, and the anonymous individual who gave one bitcoin. 80% of the fund is reserved for legal fees, but up to 20% may be used to fund campaigning to raise public and political awareness of the human rights issues involved.




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916 thoughts on “Keeping Freedom Alive

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  • Ian T-W

    Just signed my new contract. Just upped my subscription. Decent journalism deserves to be funded. A postcard to Craig will soon be going into the mail.

  • Republicofscotland

    The US evacuation force in Afghanistan is no longer evacuating ordinary Afghans, only US personnel, Nato personnel, and those with a Green Card, it didn’t take long for Biden to sell out those who aided and abetted the occupying US forces in the country.

    • michael norton

      Ben Wallace said troops would leave Kabul’s airport when the U.S.A. withdrew, which is due to happen on 31 August.

      Looks like Biden has taken over from Trump as America number one idiot.
      How did they get this nutter in to the White House?

    • mark golding

      Smoke and mirrors are de rigeur in Kabul International airport where billowing smoke surrounds the chaos as US/UK special forces attempt to delay the withdrawal. A fire-fight and then a ‘fire’ at the airport attempts to win over support fo extend the August 31st deadline.

      Any clamp-down by the Taliban has been refuted as ‘Fake News’ and statements by the West that Afghan women will lose rights under the Taliban have hit a brick wall. Smoke even from canisters, fire from petrol and terrorist threats are an obvious way to instill confusion and invoke withdrawal limit U-turns.

        • Fat Jon

          You might want to do that, just as men in the UK might find dressing in a full burka at the Tory party conference could elicit some unfriendly responses from security.

          Presumably, if the Taliban leaders have glimpsed TV programmes such as ‘Love Island’, then that is all the evidence they need to justify their policies towards women.

          And as for refugees, I suggest that Tony Blair invites them all to his gaffe – after all he is not short of a few quid. What can be certain, is that the US will not be taking many, if any at all; which may have been factored into their decision. Europe’s problem was kowtowing to the Americans in the first place.

          Special relationship? My arse – as Jim Royle might have said.

          • Goodwin

            @Fat Jon
            I think the Taliban have a different take on “unfriendly responses” though. Or is that a conspiracy as well?

        • Tatyana

          Here in Russia we are getting controversial news. The Taliban promises to reduce drug traffic, guaranteed women’s rights, including university education. But they demand hijab and they ban music. They guaranteed amnesty for those who collaborated with the previous government and safety for foreign media.
          Looks like they want to be islamic state, but want to make connections to the rest of the world at the same time.
          We will live and see if these plans are made true.

          There’s an interesting opinion by Vladimir Gerasimenko

          “… the main principle of the Afghan government: the center has exactly as much power as it can bargain with the local tribal elites. As long as there were US troops and inexhaustible flows of dollars in the country, the loyalty of the tribal leaders could be ensured with the whip of the American military and the carrot of corrupt proceeds.

          The problem was that while the Afghan authorities held the cities, they were constantly losing the village, the village that was more and more focused on the only force that did care about the troubles of the peasants – the Taliban.

          *Here again a small remark. After the invasion of Afghanistan, the United States launched several programs to help the country’s agriculture. But all of them, besides being plundered, were also wildly naive – we give you chickens, and you raise them, sell them and you will live better. Sure, says the peasant and roasts the chickens, after which he goes to grow the opium poppy.*

          As a result, after a confident victory in 2001, over the next 10 years the situation in the country has passed the stage of permanent guerrilla war, the only way to solve which is to cosplay General Shlopa and to cut out most of the country’s population. Since no one was going to do this, there was no prospect of ending the conflict.”`

          • On the train

            Very interesting comment Tatyana. I agree. Is that your baby niece? … she is beautiful

          • Tatyana

            Thank you! I translated a small piece from the article. Very interesting view on the development of Taliban. I think I’ll translate the whole article later and bring it on this site.

            By the way, the photo was taken in the church, because her mom is religious and we were invited to the ritual, I think it is baptizing in English.
            The godfather, like many of my compatriots, considered himself Orthodox Christian, but unfortunately there was no real knowledge of the religion behind that. The priest talked to the godparents before the ritual and discovered that the godfather didn’t know some absolutely necessary things 🙂 He could not even answer what exactly he believes, so, he made several wrong assumptions and the priest made him repeat for several times Верую в Отца, Сына и Святого духа * believe in father and son and holy spirit *
            Apparently that was not a perfect godfather to the priest’s opinion, but you know, he was the Russian priest! He played a joke on the poor godfather!
            After some prayers, in the middle of the ritual, the priest pulled out huge iron rusty scissors. He said the next step is circumcision, but as we are baptizing a girl, so the godfather undergoes this procedure instead of her!
            Poor godfather said something like ‘but we are no Muslims’ to which the priest exclaimed ‘Aha! at least you know that!’

      • Republicofscotland

        Mark.

        The UK/US doesn’t give a monkeys about women’s rights in Afghanistan, though its the official narrative, of course here in Scotland as elsewhere in the UK Sharia Law exists and is being practiced every day within our ethnic communities, its based on the more brutal hadiths written after the Quran.

        However you don’t hear or see Sturgeon saying that we must do something about it, infact Sturgeon has actively impinged on women’s rights.

        • michael norton

          They should send Sturgeon and her transgender green friends to Kabul, they would frighten the shit out of the Taliban, they frighten the shit out of me.

          • nevermind

            why aĺl the way to Kabul? she is frightening half of the Uk now…grudgingly I agree Michael, but we are talking about two different worlds and perceptions here.

        • mark

          Like all religions such as The Spanish Inquisition and the wiping out of Incas and Aztecs by The Conquistadors or The Crusades any religion can have its particular interpretations as an excuse to X and Y to A and B in order to plunder or gain something for the interpretors.

          Justification from God?

          No (I’m an atheist) – God is the excuse for the allegedly religious leaders to hide behind for their corporeal greedy actions.

          I’ve no doubt that Sharia Law in the UK does not allow for the extremists to act in a way they would act in say Saudi Arabia – the same way that The Spanish Inquisition have dis-appeared elsewhere in the so called civilised world.

          From what I hear The Imams do a lot of good work among the communities so obviously their interpretation of the Koran is nothing like the Waahabist Saudis.

          There are ISIS extremists who are around the Taliban but I’m not convinced that the Taliban can be accurately described as ‘ Jihadists.’

          Incidentally there are around 600k ISIS supporters still holed up in Idlib in Syria but the BBC or others don’t bother with them because they are anti-Russian and anti-Assad. Now they are much more dangerous than the Taliban. The question is – dangerous to whom?

          Not the West at the moment.

  • BrianFujisan

    Well Done The Sam Adams Associates –

    DRONE WARFARE WHISTLEBLOWER DANIEL HALE HONORED WITH SAM ADAMS AWARD FOR INTEGRITY IN INTELLIGENCE

    The Sam Adams Associates are pleased to announce drone warfare whistleblower Daniel Hale as the recipient of the 2021 Sam Adams Award for Integrity in Intelligence. Hale — a former Air Force intelligence analyst in the drone program — was a defense contractor in 2013 when conscience compelled him to release classified documents to the press exposing the criminality of the U.S. targeted assassination program [“We kill people based on metadata” — Michael Hayden, former Director of CIA & NSA]…

    Hale is the 20th awardee of the Sam Adams Award for Integrity in Intelligence. His distinguished colleagues include Julian Assange and Craig Murray, both of whom are also unjustly incarcerated for truth-telling. Other fellow Sam Adams Award alumnae include NSA whistleblower Thomas Drake; FBI 9-11 whistleblower Coleen Rowley; and GCHQ whistleblower Katharine Gun, whose story was recounted in the film Official Secrets. The full roster of Sam Adams awardees is available at samadamsaward.ch.

    Thank you all these Brave whistleblowers..

    Link to story at Consortium News –

    https://consortiumnews.com/2021/08/23/daniel-hale-wins-2021-sam-adams-award/?

  • DunGroanin

    Can anyone help me out with the conundrum that is Jonathan Liew?
    You know the sports writer of the year? At the Guardian? Via the Independent and many years at the Telegraph where he landed immediately after University of Edinburgh and history degree. Born in London but apparently an American citizen! With parentage I can not see biogged anywhere! Chinese? Malaysian? Singaporean? Or HK? Just asking because he has just crowbarred into the opening of his vaxxer-sceptic-athletes-bashing piece this :

       I became aware of the surreal conversation taking place on the other side of the canvas.
       “Have you guys heard of Julian Assange?” one of the England players was asking his teammates. “It’s a mad story. I was up till about 4am reading about it. He’s the Wikileaks hacker who published all these secrets about the US government and all their wars and stuff. And so what the US government did, they basically framed him for rape and tried to get him extradited to Sweden. It’s mad.”
       Of course, there were significant elements to the player’s rambling account that – shall we say – owed rather more to the bizarro-world alternative truths of the internet than the official record.

    So … Mr Liew? who are you? And did you just put some truth into the Guardian about the conspiracy against Assange gleefully carried out daily by your colleagues? Or are you in fact peddling the same conspiracy by slyly packaging it with Covid denialism?

    Curious, no? So before I shoot the messenger I would like more facts about the sports writer of the year with the splendid career trajectory.
    I personally prefer Barney Ronay’s reportage…

      • Stevie Boy

        My simple logic says, if it’s American, if it’s associated with the Guardian or similar rag then it’s almost certainly a CIA asset.
        They truly are everywhere (or am I paranoid?) I suspect that all professionals traveling to Europe are briefed by the CIA beforehand. And let’s not forget the UK government let them kill UK citizens with impunity.

  • Greg Park

    @Michael Norton
    You’ve had more than enough time now to think on it. How many refugees from the Taliban do you want to admit to the UK? Just to make clear what you’re about

    • Stevie Boy

      They never learn …
      It was the government that arranged for terrorists from Libya to be transported to the UK. And that directly led to multiple murders by those same people.
      Now the government is, knowingly, transporting Afghan terrorists to the UK. How long will we wait before we see the results of that idiocy ?

      • nevermind

        Election time was always their preferred period were they can manipulate public consent and pretend to keeping us safe, Stevie.
        They can manipulate the death figures of such an event by stopping emergency services attending, if they wish so.
        But what they are most worried about is our unity, a cause that unites our outrages, and sees these pretenders removed to where they belong.

      • Greg Park

        I’ve no doubt there are a lot of bad dudes among the so called interpreters – informers, murderers, torturers, etc, but I wasn’t referring to them. I’m talking only about innocents. When you care about those people as much as Michael Norton does you would expect him to be demanding a huge gesture in terms of asylum numbers. Strangely though he won’t say how many (if any) Afghans he wants to be given sanctuary in the UK, wonder why.

        • michael norton

          I think some of my ancestors were from Afghanistan, a couple of hundred years ago.
          Personally I live in a very small property, so have no room for anybody else.

          • Squeeth

            That’s because the Grosvenors and Windsors are squatting on the rest of your land. Something like 3% of Britain has buildings on it and another 2% roads. There’ plenty of room, as long as the collaborators/refugees are housed by the criminals that started the war. Hasn’t Bliar got a lot of property now?

          • Tatyana

            That priest in the church, he asked the godparents if they can cite the ‘Symbol of Faith’ prayer as required by the baptizing ritual. The answer was ‘We tried to learn it but had not enough time’
            To that, the priest said ‘Seems you were not motivated enough. If you had been offered a million dollar for learning the prayer, then I bet you’d be rehearsing it all night through’
            I’m not religious at all, just saying it’s good illustration.

          • michael norton

            Following the retaking of Kabul by the Taliban, many Afghan sportswomen went into hiding.
            https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58317373

            Australia has taken the women footballers. Good for Australia.
            https://indianexpress.com/article/explained/bamiyan-buddhas-3d-projection-taliban-7223686/
            I still cannot believe that the U.S.A. under Joe Biden is dealing with the Taliban.
            These same idiots blew up the Buhddas of Bamiyan on the say so of their spiritual leader, they offended Islam because Buhddism predates Islam.

          • Republicofscotland

            Michael @10.37.

            Michael re the exodus from Afghanistan, and especially those men clinging to the C130 cargo plane.

            “They are members of the Khost Protection Force (KPF) and the National Directorate of Security (NDS), counter-insurgency auxiliaries, like the Vietnamese of “Operation Phoenix”. They were responsible for torturing and killing Afghans opposed to the foreign occupation. They committed so many crimes that the Taliban were like choirboys.”

          • Morrow

            This quote from the NY Times: “With outrage still fresh around the world over the destruction of two giant Buddha statues in Afghanistan, a Taliban envoy says the Islamic government made its decision in a rage after a foreign delegation offered money to preserve the ancient works while a million Afghans faced starvation.

            ”When your children are dying in front of you, then you don’t care about a piece of art,” Sayed Rahmatullah Hashimi, the envoy, said in an interview on Friday.

        • mark

          Most of the ” bad dudes ” are the dudes who killed 45k plus Afghanis in 2019 to date.

          I think they are from the US wherever that is?

          They will be coming back – no doubt about that.
          The UK was mentioned – wherever that is as well?

          • michael norton

            At the moment, it is being said that Islamic State is armed to the teeth and waiting in the wings in or near Afghanistan for the Americans to leave.

          • laguerre

            I doubt if Islamic State has enough people to take over. The Taliban have local recruitment. IS don’t.

    • Johny Conspiranoid

      Since the Talibs have given an amnesty to anyone a sensible person might want in their country the quality of those we give refuge to is likely to be low.

      • Bruce H

        If as has happened in the past the taliban go back on this promise (some say they already are executing people) and treat Afghans as they did the last time they were in charge will you come on this forum and apologise for this remark?

        Same question for all the other pro-taliban posters.

        • Squeeth

          Pro-Taliban? Anti-US bloodbath if you please. For the Taliban to be more popular than the US isn’t much of a boast but it’s a start.

    • Tatyana

      Thank you, Brian!
      I adore Mr. Murray, he is so sincere speaker.
      How he says it!

      “I’m not useless, on the contrary, I’m actually quite good at what I do. And if I had intended to identify people you would all know who they are!”

      • BrianFujisan

        Hi Tatyana.. Is that the new Baby..A Bonny wee Soul…If you can, save some money to come to next years Doune The Rabbit Hole Festival.. Meet Craig and some of us here on the Blog

          • DunGroanin

            Tell them you are a pro-Navalny anti-Putin riot gurrl fan and want to meet up with dissidents from your homeland in London and U.K., your favourite politicians Bozo the BrexShit liberator from the EU & Nicola Sturgeon, the greatest woman minister that ever Iived or will live etc. – bet you may even get funding for such a visit! 😂
            Under no circumstances tell them about your social media presence on this site – “Craig who???”
            😂😂

          • Ingwe

            As well as all the good advice Dungroanin gives Tatyana, for entering the UK, tell them you have Pussy Riot on your iPod! 🙂
            Lovely looking bèbè. Hope you achieve your dream of coming over and meeting some of your favourite posters.

      • nevermind

        thanks for sharing the picture of your niece with us Tatyana, she looks radiant and interested.
        Craig will come out of his political prison a stronger more determined man.
        One can almost hear the sound of his pen on paper. I for one am looking forward to his next book.
        As for this SNP/Green coalition, though they don’t like to call it that, they are disingenously ignoring the common weal green plan in front of their noses.
        They’d rather take the stench from Westminster.

    • mark golding

      Thanks Brian – An exceptional, important and compelling speech that awakens the spirit, galvanising emotion, stimulates intention; the intention, the impulsion and the passion to enact fairmess, civility, niceness and respect for Craig Murray.

      And it will be done. It will manifest and present itself within weeks. I promise.

    • pete

      Thank you for the link, I have to admire Craig’s bravery in the face of adversity. His words ring true, nothing that has been put in the case against him for contempt looks like anything other than contemplated malice. Like others I have increased my monthly subscription in the hope that he will continue to persevere in the face of a hostile state, he is a vital voice.

  • Baron

    Any reason why Saudi Arabia cannot take the the bulk of the Afghan refugees? They are both of the Sunni branch of Islam, the climatic conditions of the oil rich country are closer to those in Afghanistan than they are to Europe’s, the Afghans once offered a sanctuary to the (in)famous Saudi national.

    Not one MSM poodle has ever mentioned such a solution to the outflow of the people from Afghanistan desperate to avoid the Taliban.

    • Bruce H

      Do you think that people fleeing islamic conservatives would really want to go to another islamic conservative state? It seems unlikely to me.

      • Pooh

        Bruce H, August 27, 2021 at 13:08

        It seems you have missed Barron’s point: [my emphasis]

        “Not one MSM poodle has ever mentioned such a solution to the outflow of the people from Afghanistan desperate to avoid the Taliban.”

  • Jon Cofy

    Cynicus
    August 19, 2021 at 09:42

    “It seems rather odd but Craig is allowed to publish his views via a letter in the MSM but not here. Can anyone make sense of that for me?”

    Prisons and Young Offenders Institutions (Scotland) Rules 2011

    Prohibition on prisoners carrying on any trade, profession or vocation from prison

    89.—(1) Subject to paragraph (2), no prisoner is permitted to

    (a) carry on any trade, profession or vocation from the prison; or

    (b) retain any monies generated from the sale of any items produced by the prisoner either in the course of the prisoner’s work in the prison or in the prisoner’s spare time.

    (2) Nothing in paragraph (1) is to be construed as preventing a prisoner from

    (a) taking such steps as are necessary to protect the value of any interest the prisoner has in any property or business but any such steps must be compatible with these Rules or any direction made under these Rules and the prison regime in general; or

    (b) writing articles or books in a professional or vocational capacity which are intended for publication but any such activity must be compatible with these Rules or any direction made under these Rules and the prison regime in general.

    Does that answer the question?

    • DunGroanin

      Navalny gets to do interviews from Prison in Russia! NYT and Groaniad happily publish full length. Two in a week already – the nasty nasty putinists letting him say what he likes from the gulags – “they made me watch tv for hours”! Lols.

      Yet not a single letter from Political prisoners Julian Assange and Craig Murray.

      Not a single journalist to give even a fig leaf! While the now witheredboyblunder Owen has a piece drafted for him to already attack the new Union leader Sharon Graham -‘but we should be working from home Shirley he whines! What need is there for lefty unions he implies , even echoing Maggie ! What a complete and utter cunsevative, his script doesn’t even bother to pretend anymore.

      But hey ho there is room for the idiots – Garavelli this morning – ‘a freelancer’ they say – her mission today? Sell the long planned stitch up to dump Indy by the magical marriage with the Greens is sold to the onlookers to shower with rose petals and abandonment of all sense. Sure …the whole plan to have the nuptials with the fake climate change conference is completely coincidental!

      I bet they will fly in their little fairy god daughter to bless them from Sweden to launch the $100trillion industry to grab the remaining resources of the planet under cover of a green new deal XR bacchanalia. Starting with Scottish resources maybe – you know to stop them falling into exploiters hands .. exploiters like the Scottish themselves.
      So here is the hymn sheet anyone caught deviating will be dragged off to the same fate as Craig & co.

      Coalition – huzzah!
      Green coronation – huzzah!
      Indy – never!
      EU – never!
      Free public services – get lost you Scottish scroungers!
      Independent judiciary – off to jail with your trouble making!
      No subjugation to the Crown and full ownership of Scotland’s resources – hah hah ha ha – over your dead bodies!

      ‘Eat your thin green gender gruel and be happy with your new empress in her shiny green clad warriors – and don’t you dare say there aren’t any and you can see her bare arsed lying’
      ‘Dan the GirlMan’

      Is there any other U.K. news or blog site that is actually allowing any comments against the mass propaganda to stand?

  • Ian Smith

    An interesting parallel to Craig’s case is the US DOJ arresting and putting on bail one of Alex Jones’s Infowars reporters for being on scene at the 6th Jan Capitol protests.

    The justification is that he is not considered a journalist being new media, and despite him remaining outside the building when others such as ITN famously went inside with the crowds – he is the one being charged while others who presented the government’s preferred narrative are left alone.

    • Stevie Boy

      Obviously, the ‘free world’ governments are terrified of the internet based (alternative) news sites because they cannot control the narrative. The MSM are comfortably in the pocket of the establishment.

        • Pooh

          Hi, Tatyana, you look well.

          I shouldn’t think there is any reason to be afraid: Google is a technology company, not an MSM outlet, it can’t silence Anatoliy Shari. How do you know the Ukrainian president is going to ask Google to silence Anatoliy?

          What’s the significance of the alleged suicide of a police officer?

          A sweet babe you were holding.

    • Johny Conspiranoid

      “The justification is that he is not considered a journalist”

      Does American or UK law have a written distinction between journalists and non-journalists and between the rights to free speech of each of these groups?

    • Jon Cofy

      “An interesting parallel to Craig’s case”

      Shroyer, who hosts “The War Room With Owen Shroyer” for the website operated by conspiracy theorist Alex Jones, said on air Friday that he had to turn himself in to authorities Monday morning to face misdemeanor charges stemming from Jan. 6.
      Shroyer said he was at the Capitol “as a journalist” and there was “never any intent to disrupt anything.”

      Shroyer is charged with crimes including disorderly conduct and entering a restricted area of Capitol grounds. He was seen on the west side of the Capitol next to the inauguration stage as well as at the top of the stairs on the east side of the Capitol, according to court documents. He is not accused of going into the Capitol building.

      https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/legal-issues/owen-shroyer-media-capitol/2021/08/24/83303cfc-04da-11ec-8c3f-3526f81b233b_story.html
      A federal judge wants prosecutors to explain whether they considered a correspondent for the right-wing website Infowars a member of the media when charging him with participating in the storming of the Capitol on Jan. 6.

      If Owen Shoyer is deemed to be a journalist then Craig Murray is also one.
      Does this apply to Julian Assange?

  • Christo

    There once was a lady called Dorri’an
    To whom justice was a concept quite forei’gn,
    Jailed Craig in an action
    Without legal traction,
    The precedent set is quite horrify’n’.

  • Republicofscotland

    Well it didn’t take long from trying to manufacture consent surrounding Afghanistan from the Western corporate media to do something in Afghanistan, to a timely occurrence (explosion) outside Kabul airport today, reported by the Pentagon, we’ve seen it all before, manufacture consent, produce a trigger event, and the public will consent to just about anything.

    • DunGroanin

      Last of the CIA/SF proxies letting off their fireworks as they run out of there.

      It was well advertised wasn’t it?

      I expect that such daily death in Afghanistan will become as rare as they are in Iran, China, Russia and anywhere else the proxy headchopper orcs are not able to operate under their professional “we do what we like because we stand on the wall” twats.

      • Glasshopper

        You appear to be enjoying people’s suffering.
        Has it ever occurred to you that your moral compass has gone AWOL?
        No doubt there are plenty of fellow travelers on the MOA CCP mouthpiece site who are celebrating too.

        • DunGroanin

          How am I enjoying any of the crap that is going on against innocents?

          I am saying Afghanistan will finally be freer than they have been for a long time to determine it’s own future. Probably since the 70’s when Carter and his Nazgul decided to fuck it up.
          Don’t give me your crocodile tears.

          • Bruce H

            So talibans will bring freedom to Afghanistan? You do know who they are and where they come from, don’t you? And what they did the last time they were in power?

          • DunGroanin

            They are Afghanis.
            You know, people who are actually from there?
            It is their country.
            Not ours.

          • Bruce H

            They came from Pakistan originally, brainwashed in ultra conservative islamic schools there, set up and and groomed by the Pakistani secret service, ISI. Now there are Afghans amongst them, their recruitment methods leave little choice. They have come and gone as components of the civil wars going on for several decades now. You appear to see them as the authentic Afghan liberation movement which is not the case, they are hated by many Afghans, for good reason.

          • DunGroanin

            Bruce I see you are still shilling the lie to equate the Pakistani/and border tribals and imported mercenary ISIS types – all controlled by the CIA/ISI as the same as the Afghani Taliban which is all home grown.

            No one is going to buy that anymore! You need a new patter.

        • Tom Welsh

          I sometimes feel that anyone who talks about “moral compasses” has definitely gone astray in some fashion. There is a big difference between navigation and morality.

          For one thing, North is always North and South is always South. A huge amount of harm is done by people who think morality should be black and white.

  • Peter M

    Had Craig not been in prison, I’m sure he would have written something along these lines, putting USA war of madness on Afghanistan in perspective:
    At a cost of $2 trillion, an Afghan population of 38 million and 20 years of war, the spent per capita amounts to $2630 per year. Compare this to Afghanistan’s GDP of $510 per capita.
    In other words: for twenty years USA spent FIVE times more on Afghanistan ‘nation building’ than the entire Afghanistan population was able to spend on itself during that time.
    Had this spending indeed been for nation building, Afghanistan would have been relatively much better off now. The fact that it is still one of the poorest countries in the world, shows the folly of it all.
    At the same time 800,000 people would also not have died.

    • Reza

      He would also point out that the poverty rate in Afghanistan INCREASED, by 62 percent, during two decades of western occupation. Also that the country remained 2nd bottom globally on measures of female wellbeing. Craig Murray is somebody you can always rely on to highlight the inconvenient truths establishment media tries to suppress and ignore.

      • nevermind

        And with this poverty rate Afghan farmers, now under the protection of NATO forces, were forced back into the production of opium, by 2017/18 84% of the worlds opium production came from that place.

        There are suspicions that the Taliban who under the lead of Mullah Omar, not only destroyed the Buddha’s of Bamiyan, he also stopped all production of opium, had tons of opium, which stores for long without refrigeration, squirreled away in secret hideouts, providing them with funds to fight the allied forces.

        A strict eradication policy during NATO’s mission arguably would have achieved more to weaken the Taliban, than the protection of these crops which virtually guaranteed that they had arms and munitions to fight with.

        Has NATO inadvertently caused its own demise via these means?

          • Tatyana

            Can you believe, for example, that there was an astronaut in Afghanistan who studied in the Soviet Union and flew with the Mir station?
            https://pikabu.ru/story/otvet_na_post_yevolyutsiya_afganistana_8411558

            I’m amazed that the people of Afghanistan didn’t take any opportunity to go the path of civilization, but instead chose to return to the Middle Ages with their Mujahideen, Taliban and Koran.
            In our social networks there was a wave of pictures showing not only Afghanistan, but also Egypt and Iran – a comparison “before and after” the Islamic revolution.

            https://pikabu.ru/story/otvet_na_post_yevolyutsiya_afganistana_8410333

            https://pikabu.ru/story/15_krasnorechivyikh_foto_iz_vostochnyikh_stran_do_i_posle_islamskoy_revolyutsii_4424716

          • Reza

            Those social networks seem like an indispensable source on the modern histories of Afghanistan, Iran and Egypt.

          • laguerre

            Tatyana
            No-one likes living under the guns of foreigners, and especially not the Afghans. That’s why the Taliban success.

          • Tatyana

            Laguerre

            I accept that the desire for freedom from foreign control is above everything else, but I wish the native liberation force was not so retrograde. I would welcome the Taliban if they were willing to be open and respectful of human rights. So far, the ideology on which this movement is based is alien and unpleasant to me, especially in relation to women. I accept the fact that they will establish their own rules in their country, but I am sorry that their ideology will unfortunately be a big obstacle to the possible friendship between our peoples.

            Nothing fatal in this, I will survive it. A cold but peaceful partnership between states is fine too. I only hope that they will not ban those who disagree with their rules from leaving the country.

          • DunGroanin

            Tatyana,

            You say “ chose to return to the Middle Ages with their Mujahideen, Taliban and Koran.”

            No THEY didn’t. It was to lure the USSR into defending the DEMOCRACY that Afghanistan was in the 70’s that these who you describe were CREATED by the US neocons under President Carter.

            You may be interested and informed of the history in this great succinct history by John Pilger if you don’t believe that.

            https://consortiumnews.com/2021/08/24/john-pilger-the-great-game-of-smashing-nations/

          • Tatyana

            Now that you have all looked at my new little jewel and made your kind compliments, and because I am not at all happy to appear on this site in something resembling a hijab, I will change my avatar to a more relevant one, even despite the fact that it reflects all those mom’s pancakes and pies that settled on my sides during my summer vacation 🙂

            DunGroanin
            thanks for the link.

            The Taliban turned the country’s population towards freedom, but at the same time towards the creation of a religious state. And this is supported by the broad masses.

            I regard religious and national states as a relic of the Middle Ages, as the legacy of a primitive clan and tribal system.

            I grew up in the Soviet Union and it seems wild to me that some people in the country might not have equal rights because of their religion or be punished for violating religious rules. In my country, religion is where it should be – in the temple. And not in government agencies. Not in social programs guaranteed to me by my state. Not in the politics of my state. And even less so in the government.

            I don’t understand how a person can feel free in such a country? Could you? If every person with whom you have to interact will evaluate you before deciding whether you are worthy of communication on an equal footing.

          • michael norton

            Some people/groups in or adjacent to Afghanistan have a Medievalist mind-set, but they have mobile phones both to communicate and to set off bombs.

            • They ride motorcycles.
            • They drive pick ups.
            • They fire guns.
            • They use the Internet.

            So, only some of their brain is Medieval-wired.
            So, that could mean that they subconsciously wish to modernise?
            But the relevant point, is these nutters are an absolute minority.
            Most people do not want to revert to the dark ages, not even Afghans.
            This is about fear and control.
            You control your population by using fear.
            This was a tactic much employed in Medieval times.

          • DunGroanin

            Tatyana you are welcome. Please follow it through yourself and find the stories of the Soviet forces who were fashioned their own Vietnam by the proxies created by the Saudis and CIA via Pakistan (which also was subverted by them).
            Read especially about the exploitation of Islam and death of innocents by the Big men and women of the state department who themselves were never elected but made the policy.

            you say, “I regard religious and national states as a relic of the Middle Ages, as the legacy of a primitive clan and tribal system.”

            1. explain the resurrection (:-) of the Russian Christianity – you have already given your anecdote.
            2. Wait until you visit Europe and London (or any major city) and you will be surprised! You will not believe how many laces of worship exist. Or how many people wear cultural dress, including FULL hijab as they carry on their daily lives speaking exactly like their neighbours!

            Everyone gets on well with each other whist not being judgemental.

            You’ll have to see with your own eyes to believe it, as friends of mine who visit from small country towns have done over the years.

            One must distinguish between personal prejudices and public state imposed ones.

          • Stevie Boy

            Michael Norton.

            People in Afghanistan or on its borders no more have a ‘medieval mind-set’ than similar groups throughout the west.

            The problem is also not about religion, it’s about low education, poverty and an insular lifestyle. Similar groups pop up everywhere where these factors occur: USA, UK, ME, Russia … Yes, they are a minority and yes they are used and abused by their power hungry peers – the priests, the politicians, the war lords, the military and even social workers.

            It’s not necessarily their fault, it’s the corrupt system. Bombing and killing these groups doesn’t change the system that creates them. The West is yet to learn that idea – and in the meantime they will keep applying the same faulty logic to the problem expecting a different outcome.

          • Tatyana

            DunGroanin 🙂
            Resurrection of what? Haha, you’re right about the anecdote 🙂 I bet 99,99% of those naming themselves ‘christians’ are primitive magic users. Like: ‘I go there and light a candle and that ritual makes me clear of my sins’. Only those who possess the candle-making factory do benefit from this.
            If only Leskov or Dostoevsky could see these new ‘resurrected russian Christianity followers’ they would feel ashamed!
            These days, the Russian Orthodox Church is given some freedom, they claim back the property taken from them by the Communists. As soon as the Church can show a great number of its supporters, so it’s seen as the will of the people.

            Being trendy is beneficial.
            Not only Christian, I see many young girls from russian Muslim regions, who pose themselves in traditional clothing, hoping to find better marriage 🙂 I really don’t want to offend anyone, just I cannot express it in other words – even an ugly girl can find a good marriage if she introduces herself as a good religious obedient woman. Because many men are looking exactly for this type of a spouse. Kinder, Küche, Kirche.

            Now back to Afghan. My native town is a small rural town. Nonetheless, the Soviet military in Afghan included about 1.5 thousand of my towners, the age of my elder cousin. Perhaps I know smth about that from the first hand. Here is the monument in my Tikhoretsk *the name comes from the Tikhaya river, in English it might be ‘SilentRiverTown’*
            https://www.komandirovka.ru/sights/tichoretsk/pamyatnik-voinam-afgantsam/

          • Stevie Boy

            Yes, and don’t overlook Israel’s mass murder and fundamental illegitimacy in Palestine.
            And, don’t overlook the USA’s mass murder and fundamental illegitimacy in Syria.
            And, don’t overlook Saudi’s mass murder and fundamental illegitimacy in Yemen.
            And the beat goes on …

    • michael norton

      The BBC on five o’clock news are still saying there were two explosions, with the second at the Baron Hotel, which was where the British are processing escapees.
      Either the BBC are liars or the Americans are lying.
      They can not both be telling the truth

      • michael norton

        There have been several versions of the explosions near the airport in Kabul, often the correct story is the first story.
        First explosion was claimed to have been at the Baron Hotel.
        The second explosion was claimed to have been adjacent to the airport.
        First there were more than one bomber, now only one explosion and only one blown up bomber.
        So who did the shooting?
        Did this one bomber shoot people before he blew up, because he could not have shot people, after he was blown up.

        Some clarity is needed.

    • DunGroanin

      Bernard at MoA is the fastest and most upto date on developments.

      There was ONE bomb first apparently in the sewage channel around the perimeter and gates where Afghans looking for a easy ride to the west have been gathering lured by the nato/US/CIA head chopping managing masters. The US casualties were supposedly above that channel and behind wire. Where other Afghans were standing above that channel. There were some other explosions which are reported set off by these mercenaries destroying stuff as they leave. And as bernard says our guess is as good as any about who perpetrated the initial explosion.
      I guess it was these SF/Consultant/CIA managers.

      https://www.moonofalabama.org/2021/08/further-us-hostility-against-the-taliban-is-not-in-its-best-interest

      This is an obvious narrative construct in the MSM the Groaniad has finally reported it was ONE initial attack.

      • Glasshopper

        While I share your scepticism of MSM sources, has it not occurred to you that this Bernard chap at MOA is little more than a propaganda outlet for Russia/China?
        I have dipped into that site for years, but take it with a large pinch of salt. It is a deeply flawed outfit that appeals to none too bright people with an axe to grind against “The West”.

        • Carl

          Where would you recommend readers go for a trustworthy depiction of ‘the West’? (By which I assume you mean policymakers within the national security establishment, representing a particular set of class interests.) What are your trusted sources on these people?

          • Glasshopper

            There are no 100% trustworthy sources. But MOA is a propaganda outfit for the CCP as many readers there have clocked over the years.
            You’ll notice from the comments that it’s the same old duffers who’ve bought into the idea that Bernard is some kind of sage with amazing sources, when he’s more a conduit for Russo/Chinese security services.

    • Fat Jon

      Michael Norton….

      “Now the Americans are trying to adjust the story.”

      Do you mean like the British did with the Skripals?

      “I can confirm for you that we do not believe that there was a second explosion at or near the Baron Hotel, that it was one suicide bomber,”
      https://www.rt.com/news/533281-pentagon-one-suicide-bomber-kabul/

      “Surely you would know, fairly soon if there were one or two explosions?”

      Not necessarily; the JFK assassination was almost 60 years ago, and the number of ‘explosions’ is still contested.

      • Stevie Boy

        Come on guys ! Craig is in prison because of the Pentagon, the BBC, the UK Governments – these people lie as naturally as they breathe – be a bit more choosy with your news sources, please.

        • DunGroanin

          Don’t worry Steve, as you will know, my opinion of the propagandists MSM, I am not bigging them up.
          They are only able to sell fake narratives by tempering it with reality every now and then and they are free! So that more people are able to see their propaganda.
          Hence quoting them so that readers here can access them quickly.

          I have a subgroup here where I occasionally post their dribble. As well as Off-G’s which is the shadow of On-G – tied at their feet.
          Talking of which let me finish with a gem of a quote by someone both of these organs do their DS beavering against daily.

          “ The mass media could just as easily have spent this time framing the Afghanistan withdrawal as a good thing and applauding Biden for doing it, and if they had Biden’s approval would be soaring and everyone would think the withdrawal was great. These people control perception of reality.”

          https://caitlinjohnstone.com/2021/08/28/propaganda-is-the-source-of-all-our-problems-notes-from-the-edge-of-the-narrative-matrix/

      • michael norton

        The Baron Hotel.
        Has anybody tried asking the manager or staff at the Baron Hotel in Afghanistan, that was the processing center used by the British, why their explosion, apparently did not happen?

        It is rather important, to get to the bottom of this.

        People might begin to imagine that explosions were expected to happen and perhaps were made to happen
        with the identification of bombers “misplaced”

    • Squeeth

      “Surely you would know, fairly soon if there were one or two explosions?”

      All you have to do is count the bangs. Simples.

  • SA

    On the question of who rules what countries and how. It is self evident that there are differences in social, religious, political manners of governance that develop in different communities and these differences lead to different cultures traditions and codes of behaviour. It is a reflection of how judgmental we in the West look at those poor primitive medieval people around the world and want to save them from their traditions which do not line up with ours. This crusading mentality is shown by all sides of the argument whether they are condemning the Taliban or defending them or see this an opportunity for empire bashing.
    Unless we develop a system of world governance of respect and understanding of why things are what they are by observation without value judgement, and unless there is a mechanism of change agreed by all to be observed through an international organisation such as the UN, and unless unilateral military actions by the powerful are renounced, all this talk of progress, human rights and women’s rights and so on are distractions from what the real problem is with the world, the gross inequalities perpetrated by the capitalist system that currently rules the world.

  • Fwl

    Just posting my tuppence worth. 15 years since Craig opened many eyes with Murder in Samarkand. 20 years after Blair poodled us into Afghanistan behind Bush. This month’s exit “strategy” made clear that the “nation-building” fig leaf was just that. Who’s in prison now?

    Ultimately many systems fail because after a generation of leaders with integrity (but a negligent failure to expect the same of their successors) the yes men technocrats come along lacking either conscience or the courage of conscience.

    Meanwhile Craig, who has conscience, is banged up. Can’t speak. Well that speaks loudly to me.

    • Fat Jon

      Craig has been banged up deliberately, to keep him quiet while certain events take place.

      It may be the withdrawal from Afghanistan; it may be the possible forthcoming extradition of Julian Assange; it might have been to prevent Craig from testifying in Spain; or it may be all three. It might be something else as well, but we minions are not allowed to know the dark establishment’s secrets.

      I only discovered recently that 22 of the US Navy Seals (who were in the raid which killed the alleged Osama Bin Laden) were themselves killed when their helicopter was shot down in Afghanistan about 10 years ago.

      Nothing to see here… move along now.

  • Republicofscotland

    So it turns out in a report by a war correspondent with thirty-five years of covering wars in Bosnia, Iraq, Iran, Lebanon, Syria, Libya, Sudan, that twenty-eight Taliban guards helping the US soldiers to search those coming to the airport in Kabul also died in the blast from a suicide bombers vest, which was unusually heavy at twenty-five pounds.

    Some of the other Afghans who died after the explosion died from gunfire from US troops says the BBC.

    https://twitter.com/ejmalrai/status/1431121009357242371

    https://twitter.com/SecKermani/status/1431517279859224579

    • michael norton

      RoS
      what is a little strange is that for over twenty four hours it was claimed that there was an explosion at the hotel the British use.
      Then there was another, bigger explosion, adjacent to the airport.

      Why is nobody asking, why the first explosion was invented?

      • mark

        Michael.

        According to Biden and his ‘ Security advisers ‘ it’s War!.

        Reminds me of Brass Eye’s – War!! Never let an outrage go to waste.

        What the ‘ atrocity will be – I don’t know but atrocity it will be. More to the point – IT will require a response.

        We’ve been warned as usual via the usual channels.

        • nevermind

          yes and the result of the bombing and shooting in panic was that the UK stopped moving out eligible Afghans on the 28th. three days early.
          It has become politically risky to talk of settling Afghans as rabid Brexiteers pounce on anything that even sounds like immigration, on both sides of the pond.

          Diplomacy and talking with, not at, the Taliban would have provided more scope to get the country back on to a less chaotic path to something rrsembling normality.
          Yesterdays announcement of an amnesty for those who fought against the Taliban and assisted a poor 20 year NATO show, is an indication that all this rabid talk of Taliban past in our western media, was wholly misplaced and inappropriate.
          We must engage friendly and be prepared that our trust in their future is being scrutinised after what has happened to all Afghans.

          • Stevie Boy

            And if we take your argument to its logical conclusion then the UK and US should be pouring billions into Afghanistan to compensate for the chaos they have caused but instead they steal the country’s money, go figure !

      • Republicofscotland

        Michael.

        I don’t think there was a second explosion, the official narrative from the Pentagon was that ISIS fighters attacked the secure area around the airport and killed the Afghans who didn’t die in the explosion, but no ISIS fighters bodies were found, eye witness accounts say that US and Turkish troops position high up on the compound walls began firing indiscriminately into the crowd killing many of them.

        The dead were found with chest and head wounds consistent with eye witnesses reports that the gunfire came from an elevated position.

        https://caitlinjohnstone.com/2021/08/28/questions-after-new-reports-that-us-forces-gunned-down-civilians-after-kabul-blast/

        https://caitlinjohnstone.com/2021/08/28/questions-after-new-reports-that-us-forces-gunned-down-civilians-after-kabul-blast/

    • Stevie Boy

      It seems obvious that the sooner the US and UK war pigs are out of Afghanistan the sooner the situation for the Afghans will settle down. Just need to ensure that the CIA and MI6 are totally purged from the region to enable the country to move forward.

        • Natasha

          Hello michael norton.

          What gives you the right to urge others here to interfere in Afghanistan? Is it your country? Do you live there? If not, then how do you construct such colonial responsibility to take the negative, deeply patronising parental-ego view that Afghanistan’s people, society and cultures (yes plural) “will be moved backwards into Medieval theocracy”? Here’s some reading to help you get up to speed on Afghanistan.

          https://annebonnypirate.org/2021/08/17/afghanistan-the-end-of-the-occupation/

          Meanwhile, your crocodile tears over the choices of other adults human beings on the other side of the planet makes me puke. Please simply admit the 2001 invasion would never have occurred if there were no oil and mineral resources for the invader coalition to plunder, and just leave Afghanistan and its people to get on with their lives in the ways they choose.

          In particular this link gives background context to the the sickening colonial drive to exploit bully and murder for access to our rapidly diminishing global energy supply i.e. the KEY to understanding Afghanistan and the modern world.

          https://surplusenergyeconomics.wordpress.com/2021/08/10/208-a-path-of-reason-part-one/

          And these links give more context.

          https://thesenecaeffect.blogspot.com/2021/08/lev-tolstoy-about-afghanistan-it.html

          https://caitlinjohnstone.com/2021/08/24/omg-afghanistan-is-invading-afghanistan-notes-from-the-edge-of-the-narrative-matrix/

          https://azvsas.blogspot.com/2021/08/if-plight-ofafghanistans-women-was-of.html

          https://scheerpost.com/2021/08/17/the-u-s-government-lied-for-two-decades-about-afghanistan/

          • michael norton

            Hello Natasha, well I am certainly against Nuclear Power and Nuclear Bombs.
            I was not for NATO invading Libya, Syria, Iraq or Afghanistan.
            However I do think this running away as planned by Trump/Biden is a massive mistake.
            Medieval Theocracy is the horrible plight that will be imposed on all the people of Afghanistan, maybe, especially the Hazaras, who are hated by the Taliban.

          • Natasha

            michael, thanks for your engagement. Re: “Medieval Theocracy … will be imposed …” So what? Foreigners have NO rights whatsoever to interfere and invade etc. Period. Arguing otherwise is imperialism, which is far uglier than the second hand “plight” im-propaganda i.e. fake empathy. Re: Being “against” nuclear power and misinformed conflation with “bombs”. How do you propose to replace fossil fuels, now supplying 85% of global energy – bearing in mind low energy density wind, water and solar electricity can neither build out nor maintain themselves, nor connect nor power the necessary orders of magnitude increase in size of the grid and storage (i.e. copper lithium cobalt sand cement land etc.) bearing in mind in the UK electricity is only c15% of energy consumed, without massive fossil fuel inputs (let alone replace any significant industrial process heat for steel fertilizer etc.)?

          • michael norton

            At a guess, maybe 5% of the population of Afghanistan want to be ruled by the Taliban.
            They are brutalists, mostly people who want to wield power over others, like nazi death camp guards.
            Why should the 95% have to be ruled by these nutters?

        • Stevie Boy

          Who says ? And even so, it’s none of our business, as if we are some sort of beacon of honesty, morality and fairness – wise up right wing guy, not everyone buys into the corrupt society we have.
          And it’s a fact that a lot of the US War Pigs are right wing, evangelical christian types who would love to move the west back to a Medieval theocracy. God bless america, yeah right !

        • SA

          The question MN is how many people support what you call ‘medieval theocracy’ .
          What percentage of afghanis support the Taliban? Do you have any data? Do they support the Taliban more than they did the 20 year occupation with its cosmetic changes? Did they support the rulers groomed and imposed by the occupation? How many more years of occupation are needed for occupiers to improve a country if they were really interested in doing so? Did the occupation really care about afghanis? Lots of questions but you keep on about medieval theocracy.

          • michael norton

            WOW SA, that is a lot of questions, If only I knew what you were really trying to find out?
            No of course I do not possess any data. Although I was in an aircraft overflying Afghanistan when the Soviet Union still existed, I have never set foot in Afghanistan. Medieval Theocracy.
            This means that they will run the place as it would have been run, many centuries ago but under the rule of Mullahs.
            People of little education, people of little or no tolerance of others, people who wish women to be clothed head to foot in black.

          • SA

            You totally miss the point. Bluntly, it is not the west’s place to judge and force change by invading and bombing others. Remember that one of the methods used in war is ‘bombing them back to the stone age’.
            Irrespective of what you think of the Taliban, years of bombing has changed nothing, so a few more years of bombing will make things even worse.

      • Fwl

        Interesting question.

        By the weight of its impact. The weight of the dead bodies. The weight of all the consequences of those deaths.

  • nevermind

    Maybe now is the time to stop arm chair generals such as Lord Dannant being amplified in our MSM. This morning on Radio 4 he was heard to say ‘that it is going to be difficult to have a relationship with the Taliban if there are Human rights violations happening’.

    Well me ol’ Lordy doddery, if you would have said this 20 years ago when you were a export of arms to Saudi Arabia abiding serving soldier of rank, knowing full well that these arms we were peddling to this aweful regime are going to be used against yemeni civilians and or to prop up Bahrains dictators and human rights abusers, then we might have heard you, but now? whilst sitting safe and pretty in north Norfolk.

    Followed by a discussion of the term ‘woke’ and why it engages the media slaves with ample opportunities to snipe at this that and the other.
    Well, if the media would actually sound different, not copy each others stories and headlines for fear of being called behind the times and ‘failing to print’ what others are regurgitating, if the media would reject those who have been groomed by security services to pay homage to this that and the other Government next on the blog, then this debate about woke people would not be necessarry and papers would sound somewhat original running their own stories, regardless of what others print. It would also make for much interest and greater diversity to those who still buy these same sounding rags could see a plethora of different stories.
    Mind, that would mean to re invent investigative journalism and that would mean that they stick their fingers into pie’s that are hot and not yet done, a dangerous thing in the view of a controlling Government,

    You have retired Lord Dannant, relax boar.

  • ET

    Julian Assange 2011:
    https://twitter.com/wikileaks/status/1427929346262642688

    Perhaps they have decided this scam is no longer profitable and want to move on to somewhere else. This video interview with two former US army personnel from the greyzone points out how shambolic the whole 20-year Afghanistan war was and why it perpetuated itself despite never being winnable.

    https://thegrayzone.com/2021/08/22/anti-war-veterans-explain-how-us-lost-afghanistan-while-leaders-lied-profited/

  • michael norton

    The Americans have been deploying Reaper Drones to attack Islamic State in Afghanistan, if they are not taking off from Afghanistan are they taking off from Uzbekistan?

    • michael norton

      Russian President Vladimir Putin, during a June 16 summit meeting with President Biden, objected to any role for American forces in Central Asian countries, senior U.S. and Russian officials said, undercutting the U.S. military’s efforts to act against new terrorist dangers after its Afghanistan withdrawal.

      The previously unreported exchange between the U.S. and Russian leaders has complicated the U.S. military’s options for basing drones and other counterterrorism forces in countries bordering landlocked Afghanistan. That challenge has deepened with the collapse over the weekend of the Afghan government and armed forces.

      https://www.wsj.com/articles/putin-rebuffed-u-s-plans-for-bases-near-afghanistan-at-summit-with-biden-11629398848

      Well, if there are no drone airstrips in ex-soviet central asia, the drones must either be flying from India or Pakistan, or the U.S.A. is keeping an airbase in Afghanistan?

      • nevermind

        I urge you to read the comments of Carl’s link above, especially M. Griewanks comment about US minister Austin visiting Kamp -knarrenbauer in Berlin talking about Russia, China and the past talk about troop withdrawl from Germany, BUT NOT A WORD ABOUT Afghanistan.

        That is NATO today a one nation hegemony drive by the USUK.

      • Johny Conspiranoid

        “undercutting the U.S. military’s efforts to act against new terrorist dangers after its Afghanistan withdrawal.”

        Undercutting the U.S. military’s efforts to create new terrorist dangers, more like.
        Its hard work being less popular than a medieval theocracy but NATO has succeded in Afganistan. Perhaps medieval theocracy isn’t as bad as death from the skies and random killing/torture.

    • Stevie Boy

      https://www.rt.com/news/533394-drone-strike-kabul-taliban/
      The US has struck ‘alleged’ suicide bombers in the Afghan capital, Kabul. The American military had launched a “military strike” on ‘suspected’ militants. The strike was carried out in “self-defense” against an “imminent” threat. The vehicle was ‘reportedly’ carrying “a substantial amount of explosive material”. It is still unclear if the strike was the same one near the airport reportedly killing a child.

      God bless America, bombing the Afghans into peace and democracy.

    • DunGroanin

      Wherever they are taking off from will be targeted – including any launches of missiles. Including Cruise. And Air America and their unmarked aircraft are not going to be squared faster than they can say “is that a hypersonic missile…”

      Only hours away now from when ‘over the horizon’ protection means exactly the opposite of what the CIA head choppers and MSM goons have been buying/selling.

      Pakistan double dealers should beware – Imran can’t carry on bluffing.

      India – is screwed if Modi believes the new Quad / nato alliance gives India any protection let alone influence. They are already headless chickens begging that the special relationship with Russia is active with their ‘red phone’ .

      “yes yes” says Putin “of course you can call anytime you like, I’ll make sure someone is always available to pick up, as soon they can… yes, I remember when we were all BRIC’s together ..yes yes BRI could mean just that without C…. yes Narendra of course we are still best buddies … of course I understand you were just having a bit of fun riding around on their quad bike…..Don’t worry we will make sure there will be NO over the border attacks and ANYONE trying will be instantly dealt with as will their bases WHEREVER they are… bye Narendra, good BYE. BYE BYE”

      Lavrovs and Kremlin read-outs of phone conversations tell you a lot more than anything reported in the west let media.

    • ET

      I have to say, having watched that video, it comes across to me as staged. The guy is too matter of fact. There is no anger or emotion. That’s just my first impression. It’s not that I don’t think the alleged events could have happened it’s just that particular video doesn’t come across as entirely convincing. The first question from the interviewer is a leading question: “Were all these people killed by a suicide bomb or maybe something else?” The guy then asserts his credentials. “No, as I said, I am a military officer. (That’s not an answer to the question, it is asserting your pedigree before you answer.) When I examined all these victims* one by one I uncovered their faces and observed them.” That is prewritten expression. No one speaks like that ad hoc. And docs refer to people as patients, not victims. I remain sceptical about this particular video.
      There is however other corroborating evidence, best summarised by MOA in my reading so far. Everyone can use propaganda techniques.

    • nevermind

      thanks Brian, just as they studiously ignore day before yesterdays amnesty for those who put their trust in NATO occupiers and worked for them.
      The Taliban seem to realise that they need people who worked and have knowledge of governing functions.
      We on the other hand are still smarting to assist groomed warlords we know and cause more bloodshed via proxies.
      And we have Michael hardly disguising his past objection to go into Afghanistan by reminding us of the many bases we can still use to cause chaos via drones.
      Is that a response for that better future we want for Afghanistan? Will drone strikes encourage those we’d like to walk out via unsecured landcorridors?
      Shutting our embassy and bringing diplomats home, whilst having our SAS training Panshjirs wannabe’s is not promising peace, its colonial aggression.

    • DunGroanin

      It is now crystal clear that many of the casualties were caused after the bomb by gunfire from the guard towers at the airport which has been under CIA control having taken over from nato.

      It is also clear that the CIA head chopper brigade was manning these towers.

      MoA has updated its reports and btl links also informative.
      It is clear that this false flag was orchestrated by these uncontrollable praetorians of the rancid Dominate Empire and its shadow world that will not lay down and die and insist on causing as much murder and mayhem to retain it’s supposed god given rights.

      https://www.moonofalabama.org/2021/08/how-the-cia-used-isis-k-to-stay-in-its-afghanistan-business.html

      Completely explains why the MSM went all gaga about the Afghan Cats and Dogs sob story with its ex-paratroopers ‘charity’ – we are after a nation full of these who love their pets more than our families and neighbours and poor innocents. There were apparently British Afghans there and also so many ‘innocent interpreters’ who could tell us in clear English.

      Will the MSM be reporting it?
      Or will they keep squirrel spotting diversion like fluffy cats and dogs bullshit.

    • DunGroanin

      And here comes the big cover up of the false flag in the MSM via politicos direct fly by wire narrative construction from the very top. A leak of transcripts by the generals from just days ago if anyone is dumb enough to believe that – there are plenty of bridges you can buy, just send me your account details.

      We British get to play the cousin in need that forced the poor US commanders to keep the gate open apparently expecting the bomber at any time in the afternoon. Pathetic . It is obvious they waited and waited and waited for the expected bomber who was finally persuaded to walk to the gates and maybe even from inside the hotel or the gate! (Just guessing)

      The biggest lie ?

      “It was all too late. The bombing, at 6 p.m. Kabul time, came as Austin and Milley were in the White House conferring with the president. The blast ripped through the crowd of civilians and U.S. military personnel at Abbey Gate, killing roughly 200”

      No. It wasn’t the ‘blast’ that killed them.
      It was the US gunners who sprayed bullets and snipers who obviously took out specific targets – these who were hot potato’s who knew too much no doubt, I guess.

      Politicos an absurd ii type setup.

  • Tatyana

    @Pooh
    you say “Google is a technology company, not an MSM outlet, it can’t silence Anatoliy Shari”
    I’m sorry to point out it is Google who own the YouTube, and the YouTube channel is the media where Anatoliy speaks to people.
    Do you think Google cannot silence Sharij?

    • Stevie Boy

      Tatyana.
      I wouldn’t personally classify Google/YouTube (Twitter, FB, Whatsapp, etc) as MSM, more like voice of the establishment.
      However, ….
      The acid test, derived from the Murray/Assange cases, is would they be immune from prosecution based on what they publish ? The answer is quite clearly YES they would.
      Therefore they are, as far as the establishment are concerned, MSM.

  • Republicofscotland

    So the likes of ISIS-K fighters were first spawned in the US jails in Iraq, where innocent Iraqis who were tortured sat side by side with radiclaised Iraqis, throw in the Iraqi army post the US invasion that were sacked, yes the US sack the entire Iraqi army, and you have thousands more men out of work and open to radicalisation.

    Prior to this, we had the US allow to fly out radicialised fighters in Mosul (now members of ISIS-K) to safety, many of the fighters in ISIS-K have been deliberately or inadvertently radicalised by the actions of oppressive Western forces.

    Now ISIS-K have hit the headlines with their attack on Kabul.

  • Anthony

    Afghanistan had a socialist government in the 1970s working hard toward equality for women. The CIA paid millions to have it overthrown by the hardest of hardline Islamist fanatics.

    Then during the direct occupation since 2001 the US bankrolled misrule by depraved kleptocrats and paedophile warlords. (Or liberal democracy if you prefer, in BBC-ese).

    So on both occasions Afghanistan has fallen to the mullahs the responsibility lies with the USA.

    • Republicofscotland

      That’s right Anthony, the progressive Afghan premier was hung from a lamp post in Kabul after going to the UN and pleading for help, it was the USA that wanted the country destablised

      “In August 1979, the U.S. embassy in Kabul reported that “the United States’ larger interests … would be served by the demise of the PDPA government, despite whatever setbacks this might mean for future social and economic reforms in Afghanistan.”

      https://consortiumnews.com/2021/08/24/john-pilger-the-great-game-of-smashing-nations/

      • Squeeth

        The Najibullah regime lasted for quite a while after the Red Army went home, unlike the paper bag of an army the Seppoes left behind.

        • mark

          True.

          In Kabul girls were going to school unhindered under the Najibullah government.

          For the BBC and their credulous reporters all Afghan history started about 20 years ago.

          Nice little puff piece on the BBC last week wherein the Afghani Deputy (or sort of PM) was showing a young female reporter ( not sure whether she was an Afghani National) as to how this democracy via missiles and drones had showered blessings on a luckless country.

          Pure nonsense – I don’t know when it was made but at the end of puff piece doco the BBC failed to tell the watching audience that the boss of the country had legged it to Qatar with a 174 million dollars in cash without a scratch.

          It’s more than likely that his second in command did something similar.

          Interstting to note the BBC reporters all pontificating as to what’s happening in Afghanistan from Delhi and Dohar.

          Lise Duccette ‘s eulogy to war (what war?) was cringe making viewing as if the Taliban could ever match the weaponry of the US Military.

          Then again putting an equals sign where there isn’t one has become the BBC’s leit motif these days as they have charged themselves with defending the worst PM and the worst government the UK has ever seen.

          Lise is a woman so let’s hope when she’s done her job for her employers she will be allowed to leave Afghanistan.

          Tell her to come and see me – if she can’t – said Johnson.

          More woe to come and no amount of Fred Scuttle (Good evening viewers!) videos from a coward to a nation will save him after September ends.

          He’s a walking dead PM.

      • Stevie Boy

        Shades of Iran. The Shah, put into power by the UK and US, was cast adrift as soon as he became less useful to their agendas. Although it’s hard to feel any sympathy for him, he was just a puffed up, pawn and ended his days trying to find a safe refuge as his ‘friends’ ignored him. Ghani take note.
        Who needs enemies with friends like the UK and US ?

  • Loftwork

    “Just abolishing juries and telling judges you want them to convict is of course free, or even a saving.”

    Reminds me of Edwards Demming, who created Total Quality Management. One thing that infuriated him was people testing things because they were convenient to test, not because they had a meaningful impact on quality or efficiency. Slapdash politically-motivated justice is like doing Quality monitoring on an auto assembly line by counting the number of marbles you can fit in the glove box. You know you’re just going to get defective cars with big glove boxes. Or the wrong beads:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMb_UKYHvto

  • amanfromMars

    Re: How to keep freedom alive and kicking ass?

    Although it is encouraging that there appears to be a core of more intelligent souls commenting here and more fully aware of the contrived virtual realities which media commanders and their shadowy and shady controllers are responsible for pimping/pumping and dumping, it is necessary that one does more than just realise the problem with a pathetic acceptance of one not being able to do much, or anything oneself, to bring about a radical and fundamental change of fortune and misfortune, for all one needs to do is to support those who would be so enabled and would present themselves to systems for ….. well, the smarter systems will experiment with novel stealthy engagement whilst the dinosaur operations will exercise an ignorant and arrogant silence on the matter and in so doing prove the existence of a systemic catastrophic vulnerability for comprehensive exploitation.

    You may like to start thinking and realising that systems are not really bothered by nor worried about disinformation. It is the accurate and sensitive information that they cannot convincingly dispute and would try to prevent appearing for audiences to see that has them terrorising administrations and creating themselves increasingly smarter mortal enemies, both physical and virtual, with deadly effective friends in a whole lotta novel spaces and safe and secure places.

    Discover what is neither unlawful nor illegal but in any case thought not fit to print and freely share with one’s peers, and you have found a foundational keystone which cannot be removed if attacked for it supports the entire edifice of a crumbling project.

    Such is pure raw hard core 0day vulnerability exploit gold. And worth an absolute fortune both whenever told and/or kept COSMIC Top Secret.

  • DunGroanin

    Obviously we must have all seen the latest salvo of cold vomit recycling by Deep State stenographers this morning such as Severin Carrell of the Groniad – back from hols or just had his name bylines as usual- there is a book apparently that tells us the fake charges and conspiracy against Salmond is going to be rehashed yet again! Anyone care to see how much jigsawing is going on wit that? Noxious Dorian? They really treat the public as dumb sheep.

    Shameless overreach by the U.K. spookery – they have no fear of running out of rope!

    More popcorn!

    Craig should have been released with tag by now as he is not a flight risk and is no doubt a model prisoner. The Governor has questions to answer.

    As do the grunts of the judiciary who are allowing this miscarriage of justice to progress any further turning their chosen careers into nothing more than rubber stampers of the Crown.

  • Republicofscotland

    So the BBC is not happy that Russia has expelled for good one of their journalists in Sarah Rainsford, the BBC whined and moaned about it in a lunchtime news article, of course they BBC briefly mentioned that the UK threw out two Russian journalists prior to Rainsford’s expulsion, the hypocrisy from the BBC is astonishing as usual.

  • Jon Cofy

    DunGroanin

    “Craig should have been released with tag by now as he is not a flight risk and is no doubt a model prisoner. The Governor has questions to answer”

    Well no. Craig can be released on HDC after serving two months.
    We have questions to answer for not aiding Craig in his application for HDC for over a month.

    • Justin

      “Well no. Craig can be released on HDC after serving two months.”

      Well no. HDC only applies to prisoners convicted of a criminal offence. As explained a while ago, Craig was convicted of a civil contempt of court in a civil trial (for breaching a court order, not committing a crime) and is therefore classified as a civil prisoner. That means he isn’t eligible for HDC.

      Would you rather reclassify him as a criminal prisoner – given that doing so would also remove his privileges as a civil prisoner and result in a criminal record? Well you don’t have that power anyway, and nor does anyone else here or on his campaign team.

      “We have questions to answer for not aiding Craig in his application for HDC for over a month.”

      And how do you suggest “we” aid Craig in his application for HDC, given that he isn’t eligible for it in the first place? Repeatedly posting a basic misunderstanding about civil law won’t help much. Maybe you’d best leave the legal intricacies to his legal counsel and campaign team.

      • Jon Cofy

        Thanks Justin

        “Well no. HDC only applies to prisoners convicted of a criminal offence. As explained a while ago, Craig was convicted of a civil contempt of court in a civil trial (for breaching a court order, not committing a crime) and is therefore classified as a civil prisoner. That means he isn’t eligible for HDC.”

        Well no. What you stated before was Craig is a civil prisoner and I can now confirm that is the case.

        “HDC only applies to prisoners convicted of a criminal offence”

        I have been searching high and low for the statute that supports the above statement.
        Craig directed me to the Criminal Procedure (Scotland) Act 1993.
        The problem with that act is that appears to have been repealed in 1994 and I can’t download a copy.
        The Criminal Procedure (Scotland) Act 1995 may be the current act but I could not find a relevant section that would prevent a civil person from getting HDC.

        Please help us out here Justin.
        Tell us precisely what statute will keep Craig in jail long after he would be eligible for HDC?

        • Justin

          Jon, I’m not sure what your latest iteration of “Well no” refers to, given that I explained at some length that Craig was convicted of civil contempt of court in a civil trial (which is why there was no jury). No matter: at least you now accept that Craig is indeed a civil prisoner – and it isn’t just, as you suggested earlier, “jail talk”.

          Your enquiry for a statute of exclusion begs the question. It assumes that Craig would be entitled to Home Detention Curfew under an existing law unless there’s some kind of statute which removes his eligibility, so if you can’t find one then he must be eligible. Chalk up another basic misunderstanding.

          The HDC scheme in Scotland was first implemented in 2006 under the Management of Offenders (Scotland) Act 2005, but its foundations were laid much earlier. Craig was probably referring to the Prisoners and Criminal Proceedings (Scotland) Act 1993, which introduced the concept. The Criminal Procedure (Scotland) Act 1995 and the Crime and Punishment (Scotland) Act 1997 brought in the Restriction of Liberty Orders which defined the criteria for supervised release. The Criminal Justice (Scotland) Act 2003 extended them to cover probation, drug treatment and parole. (Note the presence of the words “Criminal” and “Crime” in each of those Acts.)

          The key fact here is that the HDC scheme was introduced as part of criminal justice procedures, which don’t apply to civil prisoners. People on HDC are supervised and monitored by Criminal Justice Social Workers, who only deal with criminal offenders because it’s a criminal justice scheme.

          The onus is on you to identify a statute which introduces Home Detention Curfew for people convicted of civil offences.

          In any case, it wouldn’t apply to contempt-of-court convictions. The Home Detention Curfew policy framework clearly states:

          Fine defaulters and contemnors
          4.3.3. Fine defaulters and contemnors, whether civil or criminal, are not eligible for HDC, since they are serving a term of imprisonment, not a sentence of imprisonment.”

          The word “contemnors” means people convicted of contempt of court. Accordingly, it doesn’t matter for HDC purposes whether a prisoner convicted of contempt is classified as civil or criminal: he wouldn’t be eligible anyway.

  • Cynicus

    At Holyrood, 20 minutes ago, Old Angus (her “stop Cherry” anointed successor) has given way to Sturgeon herself – spouting such platitudinous guff as to make Angus sound like Cicero.

    The Greens should be under no illusions: they are there to boost one “green” thing only: Wee Nikki’s credentials ahead of COP26; the latest wheeze in her campaign to become the Mary Robinson of Scotland and land a plum international quango once her time here is up.

    That day cannot come soon enough. And, when it comes, may the Dreghorn Midden take down her #MeTae coven with her.

    • Republicofscotland

      Have you seen Patrick Harvey and Lorna Slater’s new ministerial titles yet

      Harvey is now, Minister for Zero Carbon Buildings, Active Travel and Tenants’ Rights.

      Slater is now, Minister for Green Skills, Circular Economy and Biodiversity.

      Sturgeon creates (at the taxpayers expense) ministerial posts, like the banks create money on a computer screen.

      • Cynicus

        “Slater is now, Minister for Green Skills, Circular Economy and Biodiversity.”

        ——————-
        Unbelievable. Ministerial job titles grow increasingly absurd.

        Mind you, first time round I misread the job title of Ms 36 votes as “ Minister for Green Kilts.. …”

    • nevermind

      Expect the Greens to be hung out to dry when their record of not so green MSP’s comes to light at CO26, they deserve it for being opportune to uphold an increasingly unpopular SNP.

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