The Right of Self-Defence 244

Israel does have the right of self-defence, but only in precisely the same way other countries do. In fact, the only unique factor about Israel here is that it is the only country to have been found by the International Court of Justice specifically to have abused and exceeded the concept of right of self-defence, in its treatment of the Palestinians.

In 2004 the International Court of Justice, in an advisory Opinion to the UN General Assembly, ruled illegal Israel’s construction of its great Wall, which is a fundamental part of the Israeli Apartheid system. The court considered Israel’s argument of self-defence and ruled that this did not justify the numerous breaches of international law represented by the Wall:

While Israel has the right, and indeed the duty to respond to the numerous and
deadly acts of violence directed against its civilian population, in order to protect the life of its
citizens, the measures taken are bound to remain in conformity with applicable international law.
Israel cannot rely on a right of self-defence or on a state of necessity in order to preclude the
wrongfulness of the construction of the wall. The Court accordingly finds that the construction of
the wall, and its associated régime, are contrary to international law.

It flows from this that Israel cannot use “self-defence” as a trump card to tear up international law in the current situation in Palestine. The use of collective punishment against a civilian population—including via starvation, thirst and deprivation of medicine, the carpet bombing, the use of white phosphorus, the attacks on medical facilities, the attacks on medical staff, the execution of prisoners, the clearly genocidal attempt—none of these war crimes is excusable as “self-defence”.

The military cooperation of the US, UK and Australian governments—in an attack which they know is engaged in committing egregious war crimes—also opens those responsible to war crimes charges for their active complicity and indeed conspiracy.

Furthermore, there is in fact a positive legal duty on states to be acting against Israel in view of Israel’s refusal to dismantle the Wall and the Apartheid system in the occupied territories—including the widespread criminal settling and stealing of land which that system embodies. This is the International Court of Justice judgment on the obligations of other states:

Given the character and the importance of the rights and obligations involved, the Court is of the view that all States are under an obligation not to recognize the illegal situation resulting from the construction of the wall in the Occupied Palestinian Territory, including in and around East Jerusalem. They are also under an obligation not to render aid or assistance in maintaining the situation created by such construction. It is also for all States, while respecting the United Nations Charter and international law, to see to it that any impediment, resulting from the construction of the wall, to the exercise by the Palestinian people of its right to self-determination is brought to an end. In addition, all the States parties to the Geneva Convention relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War of 12 August 1949 are under an obligation, while respecting the United Nations Charter and international law, to ensure compliance by Israel with international humanitarian law as embodied in that Convention.

Read that paragraph very carefully. Israel has not undertaken any of the actions specified by the ICJ and has indeed built more settlements and imposed more restrictions. It is absolutely plain that the UK, US and European Union are not only not fulfilling their duty in international law as set out by the International Court of Justice,—

The US, UK and EU are acting directly opposite to their obligation in international law under the ICJ ruling.

The BDS movement is acting precisely in line with the obligations set out by the International Court of Justice, while the states attempting to ban the BDS movement are acting precisely against the obligations imposed on them by the International Court of Justice.

Finally, the ruling must imply the Palestinians do indeed have the right of self-defence. Because you cannot have the “right of self-determination”, which the court acknowledges, without the right of self-defence. Because it is impossible to exercise self-determination if somebody else can remove your bodily integrity at whim. That right of self-defence must perforce be exercised by whoever has de facto control of Palestinian territory at the time.

I am indebted to a number of staff and national delegates at the United Nations in Geneva for pointing out to me the importance of the 2004 ICJ ruling in the current context. I hope it helps you understand why the lies of Biden, von der Leyen, Sunak, Starmer, Macron etc. are indeed lies.

Subject to an “anti-terrorism investigation”, I do not view it as safe currently to return to the UK. Whether the investigation relates to my support for Wikileaks or to my support for Palestine, or to both, I do not know, as the police have not said why I am being investigated.

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244 thoughts on “The Right of Self-Defence

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  • Peter

    I don’t think this has been linked to here yet – Craig gave an excellent and extensive interview to the War Unpacked podcast covering Gaza, Assange, the current political/media clampdown and much else besides – a veritable ‘tour d’horizon’ as Mr Galloway is fond of saying.

    The podcast is over two hours long, features Craig throughout, and well worth listening to fully:

      • Peter

        Sorry, can’t help much, I’m not a techy.

        Nitter just says it can’t handle that function yet and redirects to Twitter.

        I’ve been trying to find a way to download the audio but equally have drawn a blank.

        I’m sure there will be a way to do it and that there will be a commenter here who knows how. Might have to wait a while though.

        Are you averse to setting up a pseudonymous account using 10-minute email in order to be able to read tweets, podcasts etc?

  • Goose

    A “peace-loving” Palestinian leadership is the “most desired” outcome of the war between Israel and Hamas, the Foreign Minister James Cleverly has said.

    Yes, lock the prison door and sit behind that fence without hope. Israel’s allies – the US and UK – will be happily ignoring you.

    What’s that? You don’t want to live and die as Israel’s prisoners, you and your families aspire to more?

    Well, tough! The British and US elite are with ethno-religious State Israel and its religious extremist leadership. As it moves from being a democracy to a full-blown theocracy!

    Our values in action.

    • Republicofscotland


      Cleverly is one many UK politicians who had a Israeli funded trips to Israel. It shouldn’t come as a surprise to anyone as to which side Mr Cleverly comes down on.

      On the ex-NI soldier being punched, the timing of the so-called assault is very convenient, almost as convenient as the head of the medical department in the British army stumbling across the Skripals on a park.

      • Goose

        Cleverly knows the Palestinians have tried ‘peace-loving’ leaderships and gotten nowhere. Israel sees and exploits reasonableness as weakness, by building more settlements. Abbas, and the passive PA in the West Bank, being a prime example. They can’t even protect their own people, let alone taking responsibility for Gazans’ safety.

        Damned if they do… resist, consigned to being ignored and misery by the West, if they don’t.

        The rest of the world can see the US and UK’s unfair approach and hypocrisy here for what it is. However hard the likes of the Telegraph, Times and other RW media Israel apologists try to paint the West and Israel as the ‘good guys’ using Islamophobia, racism and warped reasoning. Deep down, they all know our position is fundamentally unfair to a poor, downtrodden people who were initially robbed of their land, and have suffered injustice after injustice ever since.

      • Dom

        The only surprise in the ranks of genocide supporting MPs is Layla Moran, a Lib Dem. She is actually of Palestinian parentage yet still refuses to sign the ceasefire motion in the HoC despite 10,000 killed in Gaza.

        Could anything better illustrate the sociopathic careerism that defines British politics in the 2020s?

  • Republicofscotland

    The Met Police Commissioner is trying to do the democratic thing (I never thought I’d say that) by allowing the Stop the Slaughter march to go ahead this Saturday. To add pressure to his decent decision the PM Rishi Sunak will meet with him to get across the consequences of his democratic decision if things go belly up and violence breaks out at the march.

    However, in my opinion violence will only break out at the march if right wing thugs are bussed in to confront the peaceful marchers and I think that’s what’s on the cards.

    Manufactured violence and disorder will probably be heavily reported by the complicit media, and this will be followed by calls in the usual quarters to ban any Pro-Palestinian marches in the UK

  • harry law

    The excellent Chris Hedges, sad to say thinks the Apartheid state may get away with this Genocide. If his focus is on the Arab states and their pusillanimous approach he may be correct, however the ‘Arc of resistance. led by Hezbollah have the power to effectively intervene and stop the Israeli Genocide in its tracks.
    The US military armada and the Israeli governments threats to take Lebanon back to the stone age, are not to be taken lightely, because of the threat of Hezbollah’s highly accurate ballistic missiles, the US aircraft carriers need to be out of range therefore heavily laden US fighter jets may either have to refuel midair or land at Israeli airbases. Here is also a problem, most Israeli airbases will be the first to be hit by Hezbollah’s prescision missiles [approx !30,000] they could hit the logistics and other areas of the bases thereby curtailing the IAF’s capabilities. These are very serious considerations for the Hezbollah command to consider I do not make light of them.However Failue to act is the worst of all possible worlds for these reasons…
    1/Failure to stop the Genocide would leave Hezbollah with no credibility.
    2/ The loss of Palestine would fragment the arc of resistance and encourage the West to turn on other compnants of the arc, of which Hezbollah is the leader and the largest. This is clear to me as night follows day. If Hezbollah does not intervene, then they might as well go home and admit that they are the slaves of Israel/US. I suspect/ hope they have more self respect than other major Arab leaders.
    They must take the advice of Gandhi when he scolded cowards. If you are humiliated by your opponents then hit back and hit back hard. We shall see.

    • Republicofscotland

      “The excellent Chris Hedges, sad to say thinks the Apartheid state may get away with this Genocide.”

      harry law.

      I myself have absolutely no doubt that the Israeli government will not be punished or see the inside of a court room, this isn’t the first time an Israeli government has committed war crimes in Gaza or the West Bank and not been held to account.

      With so many governments and politicians backing Israel and its slaughter including the USA, it is unlikely that the ICC will do anything meaningful to hold the Israeli government to account. The ICC did once try to hold the US to account on the actions of its troops, but sanctions against ICC personnel saw the ICC back down, in any case the US says it holds the right to invade the ICC, if any American is arrested and appears in the dock, this invasion also includes rescuing allies of other nations that find themselves in the ICC’s dock.

      • Goose

        The big two US parties seem to be in competition, vying to see which can flatter Israel the most.

        The Israeli lobby’s grip over US politics through AIPAC really is quite insidious. Israel could kill 2.3 million Gazans and there’d be morons in the US Senate and Congress defending it as a ‘merciful escape’ from Hamas, or some such BS.

    • Pears Morgaine

      The US Navy’s F15s have a combat radius of about 1,800 km and can carry air to ground missiles with a further range of 200-300km. Hezbollah’s best anti-ship missile has a range of 300 km. A greater problem for Hezbollah is knowing where the carriers are. If they stay below the horizon they’ll be invisible to the naked eye and radar and of course they’ll be constantly on the move. Not at easy as you might think.

    • harry law

      my reference to Gandhi in the present situation is this …..
      Gandhi, “I do believe that where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence…I would rather have India resort to arms in order to defend her honour than that she should in a cowardly manner become or remain a helpless witness to her own dishonour.”

    • Scott

      Harry, imagine Hezbollah were able to launch missiles and obliterate large parts of Tel Aviv. Would this significantly progress the Palestinian cause, or would it merely allow Israel to reassert its victimhood, and demand US support for the bombardment of Lebanon, followed by a blank cheque from Congress to pay for Israeli reconstruction and more lethal weaponry? The thought of this happening, while deeply depressing to normal humans, would merely escalate the conflict and legitimise a new level of horror to be savoured by war hawks and neo-Cons in the West.

      A number of commentators have made the point that Israel will not deviate from its strategy to ethnically cleanse the Palestinians from Gaza, unless it is militarily defeated and forced to do so. The idea being there is little possibility of a political solution originating from Israel. My small hope, however, continues to be that pressure will be brought to bear against Israel from the US, otherwise escalation seems inevitable.

    • Stevie Boy

      My understanding is that the Palestinian Authority (PA) and Abbas are ‘puppets’ of the Israeli government and that nothing will ever change with them in charge. I suspect the ordinary people are more than aware of this and as such, with current events, Abbas and the PA position is untenable. A rock and a hard place for them. We are told by the usual suspects that there isn’t grass roots support for Hamas, but I suspect that may not be entirely accurate.
      The only 100% certainty is that innocent people are dying and no-one is trying to stop that.

      • Courtenay Francis Raymond Barnett

        Stevie Boy,

        I am on the same page with you.

        Not one for undue sentimentality – but grieves me when I see the faces of all these Palestinian children being slaughtered with impunity.

      • Republicofscotland

        “My understanding is that the Palestinian Authority (PA) and Abbas are ‘puppets’ of the Israeli government and that nothing will ever change with them in charge.”

        Stevie Boy

        You are absolutely correct. Abbas is a bought and paid for puppet, he’s also attended Bilderberg meetings, and he’s a member of the Ambrosetti Club where he rubs shoulders with the likes of Bill Gates and Christine Lagarde, not to mention Jimmy Wales and Henry Kissinger.

  • harry law

    UK Home Secretary Suella Braverman has suggested waving the Palestinian flag “may not be legitimate”. well is it or isn’t it you stupid whore. and immigration minister Robert Jenrick said foreign nationals could be deported if they commit antisemitic acts or praise Hamas..How about executing them you gobshite?.

    But the Met Police said it had written to the Attorney General and Crown Prosecution Service to clarify what constituted a criminal offence in these situations.

  • Goose

    If you are wondering how our MPs can be so obtuse and cold in the face of suffering in Gaza. It can possibly be explained by the unprecedented Israeli lobbying efforts that are underway.

    This from Kemi Badenoch on X(twitter) – in the picture that’s the UK Israeli ambassador, Tzipi Hotovely, sat alongside :

    Yesterday I met 3 Israeli mothers: Renana, Hadas and Batsheva. Their children were stolen from them by Hamas on Oct 7 and are being held hostage in Gaza.

    It was harrowing listening to their stories. The horror they’re experiencing is truly unimaginable. A living nightmare.

    Israel are conducting a huge PR campaign with the ‘missing’ posters, and by bringing people like these to speak to MPs. it amounts to emotional blackmail, as MPs can hardly refuse an audience. Gazans can’t even leave Gaza without Israel’s permission, and that’s in ‘normal’ times.

    • Jack

      Typical paid-by-the-lobby-PR-meeting, it is absurd, especially being like Kemi, a person of color to be supportive of Israel, apparently Kemi have no idea that immigrants of color are certainly not allowed into Israel as refugees = she is a useful idiot:

      52% of Israeli Jews agree: African migrants are ‘a cancer’
      Black lives do not matter in Israel
      Israeli state and religious authorities’ racist attitudes towards African refugees may have deadly consequences.

      At the same time, if one can support Israel killing almost 4000 kids I assume one could stomach some racism too sigh..

      • Goose

        Israelis have been conditioned to believe the Palestinians are their prisoners, to do as the please with. Even execute if they so wish.

        The images today of the IDF marching a mass of Gazan civilians south, at gunpoint. And Israeli govt and spokespeople had the audacity to boast online, that these humanitarian corridors, amounting to ethnic cleansing at gunpoint, show their compassion.

        • Republicofscotland


          What I find utterly galling about politicians that are not screaming out loud for a ceasefire on Gazan civilians, is that come this Saturday the same hypocritical b*stards will all be lined up out side various memorials in the dis-untied kingdom and in Europe and sporting their Red Poppies whilst remembering the war dead, on what is known as Armistice Day.

          Of which the definition is:

          (an agreement made by opposing sides in a war to stop fighting for a certain time; a truce)

          In other words a f*ckin ceasefire.

          Yet these same vile b*stards can’t bring themselves to call for a ceasefire against innocent women and children, when the time comes these politicians MUST be voted out of office they aren’t fit to serve tables in a cafe, never mind serve the public in office.

  • nevermind

    The representation offered to Zionists to infiltrate and subvert the currently hypocritic EU Parliament and its institutions, must end.

    They should be shown the door before they determine the future foreign policy resolve, or dictate how member countries should act to their game playing in the middle east.
    US global hegemony machinations still support this ugly expansionary display towards Lebanon, Syria and Iran.

    If this rogue gang of thieves gets away with trashing all humanitarian rules and regulations that were developed over decades by most countries in the world; then which countries are going to be next?
    Are we witnessing the birth of a global duopoly that is racist, violent and without any accountability to all other countries? Who will stop this devils dance killing thousands of innocents whilst our politicians sit there and clap to the rhythm?
    I despair, but I also hope that Craig can soon find a solution and end to the harassment that keeps him away from his family and the most urgent issues that have beset us all.
    Expel rogue ambassadors, send these PR hyenas back to their lair, they do not deserve to be represented anywhere!

    • nevermind

      Do not vote for all those main parties who are hanging on bloody strings they helped to be put up. Voters should not be asked to be besmirched with the blood of innocent children.
      Tzipi Hotovely should be sent back to Tel Aviv, not be enabled to spread bile; shame on all the broadcasters who give her the air time she craves.

  • Mr Mark Cutts

    It’s so comforting to know that we British live in a tolerant and understanding Nation.

    And anyone who disagrees will get their heads kicked in by The Football Hooligans Association.

    You know, the ones who Thatcher and Ken Bates put fences up for in the hooligan hating ’80s.

    Now the dark State (the media et al) is almost asking for their support.

    Yes, there will be hotheads on the march but they will be few and far between.

    I have been on many demos in the ’80s and ’90s, and the ersatz Littlejohn’s of our days have forgotten that every time there is a demo in London, Churchill’s statue is boxed off.

    A great British tradition.

    As is football hooliganism.

    As is Tory hooliganism on the poor of the nation.

    They may wear suits but their hatred of the poor worldwide always shines through.

    Gazans are poor and, as Kissinger said about Bangladesh, “There’s nothing here for us”.

    That’s why they have ben hung out to dry for 75 years.

  • Jack

    The systematic attacks on hospital (even hospitals for the disabled/mentally challenged/children/cancer/maternity!) are the most vile, evil crimes commited by Israel, it would be one thing if palestinians actually fired rockets from actual hospitals but they are of course not doing that.

    It is chilling how easy westerners came to accept these attacks as something legal and legitimate, if one would ask the western population 1 year ago: ‘Would you support striking hospitals with missiles during war?’, most westerners would protest vehemently against such an absurd question.
    But here we are today…
    Just imagine if the roles were reversed, if Hamas constantly struck israeli hospitals, every single day, for a month, would anyone accept that? Of course not!

    • JK redux


      You say that ” it would be one thing if palestinians actually fired rockets from actual hospitals but they are of course not doing that”.

      “Of course ” does some heavy lifting there.

      We don’t know whether the Israeli claims that Hamas are using hospitals to launch rockets are true.

      If they are true then Hamas are committing war crimes. If not then Israel is.

      This is one of the rare occasions when both sides in a conflict (Hamas and the Israeli government) are equally despicable.

      The heroic IDF bomb Gaza from a distance at no risk to themselves causing indiscriminate civilian deaths and the equally heroic Hamas milita murder civilians and take them hostage.

      Both sides have committed war crimes.

      • Bayard

        “and the equally heroic Hamas milita murder civilians and take them hostage.”

        and how do we know that they did? Because the ever-truthful* Israelis said that they did.

        *Oh, apart from that thing about the beheaded babies, that was a misunderstanding, honest.

        • JK redux


          As I said. ” This is one of the rare occasions when both sides in a conflict (Hamas and the Israeli government) are equally despicable. “.

          • pretzelattack

            uh huh, now tell us the Nazis and the Warsaw Ghetto were equally despicable. who benefits from the false equivalence, i wonder. but hey, you’re an objective observer who sees both sides, right?

          • Republicofscotland


            On the subject, you may find this interesting.

            During WW2 The Nazis confined 400k Polish Jews into a small region of Warsaw and forced them to live in brutal, inhuman conditions. When they rose in defiance, they were called heroes.

            When Israel contains 2 million Palestinians in Gaza, and they rise, they are Terrorists.


          • Bayard

            ” This is one of the rare occasions when both sides in a conflict (Hamas and the Israeli government) are equally despicable. “.

            However, against the well-documented war crimes by the IDF, documented by the UN, we only have the word of the Israelis about the Hamas ones. The only reports of Hamas behaviour outside those form the Israeli governments, the released hostages, say that they were well treated, certainly not tortured or raped, as the Israeli government made out.

      • Jack

        JK redux

        No not even Israel claim rockets are fired from these hospitals. Thus Israel are the ones commiting warcrimes by even targeting refugee sites, let alone hospitals.

        To claim both sides have commited warcrimes is quite ridiculous. Some 200’000 palestinian homes have been destroyed. How many homes in Israel have been destroyed from rockets from Gaza? 1?
        How many civilians have been killed some 1000 in Israel, some 7000 in Gaza.
        Not to mention the warcrimes of cutting water, fuel, aid by Israel.
        There is no comparsion.

        • JK redux

          Israel does claim that Hamas hides militia and arms in civilian locations.

          A war crime if true.

          I don’t know if the IDF/Israeli government are lying when they make this claim.

          But they do make it.

          • Jack

            Every inch of Gaza is considered a legitimate target according to Israel, Israel will make any claim to justify bombing this or that site. It would also be a far worse warcrime to attack, threat refugees in hospitals like israel do systematically. That is their modus operandi

            From 2014: The Dahiya Doctrine: State Terrorism and a Philosophy of War Crime
            Israel has implemented the Dahiya Doctrine in Gaza, using disproportionate and indiscriminate force against the civilian populace through the targeting of schools, religious institutions and government infrastructure.


          • Bayard

            “Israel does claim that Hamas hides militia and arms in civilian locations.”

            Given that there are no “military locations” in the Gaza strip, this cannot fail to be true. However, ignorance of where the militia and arms are is not an excuse for bombing everywhere on the off chance of hitting them. In which war, ever, has one side said “here are where our army and arms are, so bomb here, not the civilains” to the enemy? The onus is on the attacKers to find out where these things are before bombing.

          • Pears Morgaine

            For the binary thinkers who have to take a side it’s inevitable that the usual denial or justification will have to be applied to the actions of the chosen side; even if that is contradictory.

          • Bayard

            PM, agreed, but that doesn’t mean that all information that concerns the merits of one side against the other is necessarily false. There can be good guys and bad guys, it’s just that the good guys are never angels and the bad guys never devils.

  • Goose

    BBC Politics Live today : four guests, all of whom were against a ceasefire. One of whom is Elliot Keck representing the sketchy Taxpayers’ Alliance. Keck was listed as the Communications Officer at BICOM (Britain Israel Communications and Research Centre) in 2019.

    This is not balance.

      • Goose


        Idk, whether he’s Jewish? Seems likely given BICOM are probably quite picky. Former Jewish Labour MP Ruth Smeeth was director of public affairs and campaigns at BICOM.

        Zionists aren’t necessarily Jewish though. In fact some of the most fanatical Israel supporters in the US, UK and EU are those simply on the political right and far right. Israel has courted the far right in the UK. And, bizarrely, Israeli flags are sometimes seen being waved at UK far right rallies.

        Rosie Duffield was another panellist, not Jewish, but very, very anti-Corbyn, she joined in the antisemitism smear campaign c.2017-2018. So much so, her Canterbury constituency CLP wanted her out.

        Some seem to support Israel as an opportunity for ‘fascism by proxy’ as Israel is very similar to a White supremacist state with discriminatory laws and strict immigration policies.

        • Goose

          [ Mod: From the moderation rules for commenters:

          Contributions which are primarily just a link to somewhere else will be deleted. You can post links, but give us the benefit of your thoughts upon them.”

          If you’re just posting a link to direct people to view something on another site, please post it in the Breaking News thread in the discussion forum. ]

        • Aguirre


          Your last sentence is especially interesting.

          In the same light, I believe a lot of the pro-Israel hate speech on the appalling Guido Fawkes website/blog (and others) arises out of unadulterated hate for Muslims and Islam. In other words, Israel, anti-semitism, etc, are merely being used as a club with which to bash Muslims/Islam/immigrants. If it wasn’t Israel, the haters would find another convenient pretext.

          • Bayard

            Yes, it doesn’t matter who the Herrenvolk and the Untermensch are, so long as there is a Herrenvolk and, most importantly, an Untermensch.

  • Republicofscotland

    “Senior Metropolitan Police officers are regular attendees at a think tank closely tied to Israel’s military and intelligence services and have accepted hospitality from its embassy in London.”

    My heart sank when I read this, and thoughts of police brutality on Saturday sprung to my mind even though the Met Chief spoke of doing the decent thing.

    • Aguirre

      I think senior police officers are as capable as many others of seeing through and discounting Israeli hasbara.

      The facts you point to don’t worry me too much, because I believe that the private opinions of most British and Continental European politicians are rather different from the public positions they’re more or less bullied into taking……..and this also applies to others in the public sphere.

      • Greg Park

        I’d love to know what that belief is based on. It was increasingly obvious throughout the austerity and Corbyn years what sort of people British politicians are: breathtakingly unscrupulous and dishonest. Now the mask is completely off. They are simply demonic.

        • Aguirre

          I base that belief partly on the thought that most politicians and public figures know full well that, in reality, Britain owns nothing to Israel and that Israel has not done anything useful for the UK. The same applies to Ukraine, by the way.

          I think you share that belief when you say that British politicians are breathtakingly dishonest. They don’t really care about Israel, but it suits them (or think it suits them) to kiss Israeli ass.

          • damien

            No. Israel has basically taken over UK domestic and foreign policy at the highest levels of government. Lower ranking officials are either unaware of this or get no say in the matter. Every pro-Israel statement from UK ministers is by design. You might want to look up the Mossad collaboration with Liam Fox and Adam Werritty in giving effect to Israeli policy within the UK government.

            Craig Murray has posted about this previously —


          • Aguirre


            I disagree.

            Israel has certainly taken over the public narrative (although more and more people are seeing through it) but to say that it has taken over UK foreign policy is nonsense because the UK has no EFFECTIVE foreign policy in this matter; what effective action is the UK capable of? What levers does it have? None. As far as domestic policy is concerned – eg to make public dissent (in general) as difficult and risky as possible – no government needs much encouraging by an outside state. The fight against anti-semitism and hate speech in relation to the Middle East is just a welcome opportunity to clamp down.

            As for the comment that every pro-Israel statement is by design, I should have thought that was too obvious to be worth saying. The converse would mean that ministers just shoot their mouths off depending on how they feel on the day or what they’ve just read in a newspaper. Your comment doesn’t invalidate my thought that there may well be quite a difference between what some ministers really think and what they say in public.

          • Greg Park

            Even if there was something to substantiate this claim (that they privately oppose the genocide), what then? Would anybody start thinking they are decent human beings?

          • Stevie Boy

            Actually, the UK establishment is fully infiltrated by Israel: from Government links, zionist organisations and Mossad itself. There is no area that is untainted by this filth.
            Policy, Official Statements and Agenda are controlled by Israel directly and indirectly.
            This has been patently obvious for years but now is not even hidden away.

  • Aguirre

    So it appears that either the PM and Suella Braverman have backed down from banning the pro-Palestine march or the Metropolitan Police Commissioner has refused to bow to their pressure.

    However, it appears that politicians have made it clear to the Commissioner that should there be violence or mass law-breaking, this would be on his head.

    As Republic of Scotland has already suggested, the way forward could well be to make sure that there IS some violence and law-breaking. This will create the conditions for banning future marches.

    One can imagine various scenarios, not all of them sinister. There could be “artificial” or false flag violence from agents provocateurs among the demonstrators. There could be violence from right wing, islamophobic elements attending especially to confront. And there could, let’s be honest, be violence and law breaking from some less disciplined genuine demonstrators or indeed anarchist-like group attaching themselves to the demonstrators.

    This means that it will be essential for the organisers of the demonstration to do everything possible to keep things calm: enjoin discipline on the part of the genuine demonstrators; ensure that there are enough march stewards to quell provocateurs and hand them over to the police; no violent reaction to right-wing counter-demonstrators; close cooperation with the police to maintain discipline and order (and make it known that this cooperation is being sought). And, of course, lots of people (preferably professionals) filming all parts of the procession from start to finish.

    • AG

      good luck with that protest!

      (I remember 5 hour discussions on who can take part how at the anti-war rally 2002 and who could not. I think more energy was spent on ensuring that no Neo-Nazis would hijack the event than on the event itself. I understood. But still, all that did display some “Life of Brian”- moments)

    • Pears Morgaine

      You’d have thought the racist and misogynistic thugs in the Met would’ve been more sympathetic to far right demonstrators than to pro-Palestinian protests.

      Perhaps they’re setting things up for an almighty rumble.

  • Brianfujisan

    When we all thought Ukraine – with good reason – would lead to a world war… It seem more likely that the Gaza Genocide Will be the the US send their largest Nuclear sub.. So much for MAD.. That the west think Russia and China Don’t know where their N Subs in the Ocean are …Sigh, And Still the wee ones Die. The Kids walk past IDF with Bit of White paper held aloft.

    And Check out this as N. Finkelstein puts a Genocidal Monster in his Place –

    “That Stupid Smirk On Your Face!” – Israel Apologist SMACKED DOWN By Norman Finkelstein!

    From 0 to 3, mins mark –

  • damien

    The UK government is now preparing a crackdown on political opposition with a new “extremism” definition which includes “sustained support for, or continued uncritical association with organisations or individuals who are exhibiting extremist behaviours.” In other words, the complete silencing of free speech in support of the Palestians or any other groups designated as terrorists or “extremists” by the UK government. This is a total political censorship law.

    There has also been a censure motion by the US House of Representatives against Representative Rashida Tlaib (Democrat-Michigan) for her opposition to the Israeli genocide in Gaza. Political opposition to war crimes and human rights abuses is to be banned in Congress — and likely later, the US itself. Dangerous times with a move to overt fascism in both the UK and the US.

    • Aguirre


      Interesting first paragraph and if true, a highly sinister development.

      But read the text between inverted commas carefully – could those words not apply to….Israel?

      More generally, I believe one should turn free speech limiting laws against those for whose benefit those laws were brought in.

      One would have to know the content of those laws in fine detail, but take hate speech or incitement to violence, for example. Could a fair number of the posts you can read on websites/blogs like “Guido Fawkes” not be reported to the police together with a request for action?

      Sauce for the goose and all that……

      • Bayard

        Aguirre, I think you are making the cardinal error of thinking there is logic to politics. Only people of whom we disapprove are terrorists and extremists. Everyone else – even if they are non-state actors using terror to achieve their aims – is not. They are “moderates”.

  • J Arther Nast

    Pears, I am once again replying to one of your interesting comments. This time the trouble you have with binary thinking, I think you should consider the role of any jury: Guilty or Not guilty.
    If the Israeli military clear Gaza City of its 1 million population and destroy it so that the people are unable to return, will they be guilty or not guilty of a crime?
    This and other questions are now before the Court of world opinion.

      • J Arther Nast

        Yes but the complete lack of equivalence nullifies your point. The one side responds to being locked up from birth in an open prison with rage against their tormentors and the world watches as their oppressors steal more of their land.

      • Aguirre

        In 1939 the Germans occupied most of Poland, and after 1941 all of it.

        During the occupation, about 20% of the Polish population was killed. Many others were sent to the Reich as forced labourers.

        During the occupation was also formed an underground Home Army, which attacked representatives of the occupying power, whether military or civilian.

        Were both the Polish and German sides guilty of all of this?

      • Bayard

        “Both sides are guilty, ”

        You keep saying this, but decline to elucidate how you arrive at that conclusion, which rather weakens your argument.

          • Bayard

            Another of your habitual flights of absurdity. No-one is saying the events didn’t happen.

            From your link: “Videos compiled by Israeli first responders and posted to the social media site Telegram show armed men plunging into the panicked crowd, mowing down fleeing revellers with bursts of automatic fire.”

            These videos appear to be like the one of Hamas beheading babies, much referenced, but never seen. Unless, of course, you can provide a link.

            However, although that was published by Al Jazeera, all the sources were Israeli, so not what I was asking for.

  • Jack

    You might have a backdoor on your smartphone, computer – ideally you should re-install whatever device that might be infected by malign software.

    Also perhaps you already following this tactic but you should buy a smartphone/computer and use it only/specifically for your twitter/social media and do not use it for anything else to reduce the risk from nefarious actors.

    Also what was the meaning of this?
    I do not know if you saw this very tweet, the twitter post is deleted now but someone used your account and said in that post that they were not the hacker and that you should check your email.
    Did you recieve any email from the person that tweeted from your account? If he was not the hacker, how did he get access to your Twitter account?

    • Stevie Boy

      I wouldn’t assume a reinstall or a factory reset would clear all malicious software. I would suggest a replacement of all IT: phones, laptops, PCs, USB drives – particularly anything the filth has had its hands on.

    • Bayard

      Reading that article clarified for me the definitions of “democracy” and “autocracy”, a “democracy” being a country where the US can get their placemen and women into government and an “autocracy” being one that they can’t. So Mongolia is currently a “democracy”. If the attempted color revolution fails and backfires on the US NGOs, it will become an “autocracy” without anything actually changing in its structure of government.

    • Alyson

      Nuland presented the plan for Ukraine’s demise to Congress in 2012. Bernie I think it was who shared the clip of the debate in which she acknowledged Russia’s intervention would be a ‘tragedy for the Ukrainian people’, and that if the war was to go beyond Ukraine’s borders, “Fuck Europe”

  • Yuri K

    It’s not only HOW Israel rightly defends itself; it’s also WHERE Israel has the right to defend itself. Meaning, only inside the internationally recognized borders. Israel can not rightly defend itself in the West Bank, in Golan heights, and in East Jerusalem.

    There was an interesting precedent to this. In 1941, when Finland attacked Soviet Union along with Germany, both UK and US warned the government of Finland that they considered this to be OK only if Finnish Army does not cross the 1939 borders. However, since the Finnish government refused to comply and their army advanced deep into Russia’s lands in East Karelia, UK and USA informed Finnish government that this made them an enemy of their ally, Soviet Union, and declared war on Finland in December 1941.

    • craig Post author

      Yuri is right. Israel has the right of self-defence only within its UN-recognised boundaries. A power in illegal occupation has no right of self-defence.

  • Alyson

    Moving this comment forward from your previous post, Craig, I am suggesting that the pre planned elements of this tragedy be acknowledged: from the 2012 debate in Congress planning the overthrow of the democratically elected president of Ukraine, to the election in Israel of a government which stated its intention to wipe Palestine from the map, leading to half a million Israelis protesting on the streets, this denouement of a carefully laid plan is but the opening movement.
    So…. given that we know that war crimes have been and are being committed by Israel, and given that we support these war crimes, is it possible that we are all scared of Israel? And is appeasement of a territorially limited genocide opening the door to land grabbing by Israel not just of the Golan Heights, which Priti Patel bought mining shares in, on behalf of the government’s overseas development fund, or the current offer of shares in offshore drilling for oil near Gaza, both of which can provide private security forces with an excuse to defend their operations, but to put business in control of the outcome.
    The carpet bombing of civilians in Gaza contrasts greatly with Russia’s efforts to avoid harm to civilian infrastructure in its defence of the Russian speaking people in Eastern Ukraine, who were under siege after the coup replaced the democratically elected leader in 2013, and who voted to secede from Ukraine after Russia had stepped in to pay teachers, infrastructure and pensions, because only Ukrainian was now the official language and it was not used in these regions.
    The war in Ukraine has served as intended to keep Putin occupied, and deplete his weapons stockpile, so that he is less engaged with policing tensions between Israel and Iran.
    Saudi is of course the wild card. Allegedly Bin Salman had agreed to purchase all the latest weaponry from Israel, but was refused some items, and then it declared it supported the Hamas attack on the festival which an IDF spokesman said had all the hallmarks of Islamic State.
    Apparently it is now rumoured that Iran has offered its support to Russia. And UK missiles were used to attack the shipyard in Sevastopol. The chess pieces of the Great Game are moving into position. Oh and Kissinger is still alive.

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