Jamie is co-organising a music festival at Dounce Castle, largely I think because this is the kind of music he likes, and it sounded fun. Makes me wish I were young again. Acts confirmed so far include
Francois and The Atlas Mountains
Glider
Les Bof!
The Junipers
Adam Stearns
My Old Blue Terraplane
The Fast Camels
The Koolaid Electric Company
Punch and the Apostles
The Higher State
Paul Messis
The One Ensemble
The Wise Guys
Sunken, Drunken, and the Broken Boat
While the pitch is enticing:
Doune the rabbit hole is a two day tea party situated in the beautiful countryside surrounding Doune Castle, Stirlingshire. Come sit at our table and let me tell you what treats we have in store. Expect the tea to be strong; a blend of the finest psychedelic music complimented with a dash of folk brewed to perfection in a big pot of sunshine. And we mustn’t forget the cakes; indulge yourself in a delicious array of freshly baked delights comprising of poetry, dancing, philosophy, forests, stories, lights, trees, cows, theatre, comedy, dressing up boxes, whisky, games, face-painting, giant mushrooms, rainbows (but no rain), local ale and cider, lovely organic food, and many more surprises to come.
http://www.dounetherabbithole.co.uk/Doune_the_Rabbit_Hole/Home.html
Interesting to see how they get on with a festival featuring a style of music rather than anybody famous.
Sorry forgot the link:
educationforum.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=11738
Somebody, appropo that building at 32 seconds into the song, it is of Maliean architecture imho., circa 600 years old and either a mosque, or an ancient grain silo.
The pieces of wood you can see sticking out, making it look like a Daleek, have no load bearing purpose, they are purely for maintenance.
Usually once a year, everyone comes from all over the place and coats the surface of the whole building, by hand, with a new layer of mud, a community effort when people get together.
So much to concrete….
Thanks for that Ingo. If a grain store in Mali, sadly now empty in all probability.
http://www.temoust.org/famine-and-drought-in-the-kidal,14560
here is another picture of the main mosque in Dienne, build in 1240, Norman Foster eat your heart out.
These buildings have metre thick walls at ground level and are cool in summer and provide shelter and safety during the ever decreasing rainy seasons.
http://www.sacredsites.com/africa/mali/djenne.html
Did Dr Kelly’s expertise include microbiological weapons? I remembered this article:
http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/02_14_02_microbio.html
Some people may howl that it’s on Mike Ruppert’s old sites. Please note that I’m not suggesting that this article be accepted uncritically, more that it could contain leads for people who know more about this than I do myself.
Yes, Clark, most certainly. He worked at Porton Down.
As I recall, David Aaronobitch’s “Voodoo Histories” contained a section on David Kelly. But here is a link to an article covering the same ground:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/david_aaronovitch/article2719239.ece
Briefly, there are parallels to the case of Hilda Murrell who was killed by a local criminal, but which threw up conspiracy theories at the time similar to those surrounding Dr. Kelly. Someone who takes 29 co-proxamol tablets and slits one’s wrists, however amateurishly, is not likely to need any additional assiatsnce from Iraqi assassins to cross the Big River. Conspiracy enthusiasts may wish to go to Dounce Castle as therapy to get their minds off things.
Anyone who, in attempting to make his case, quotes one word that Aaronovitch writes must himself be similarly prejudiced or at least naive.
It is obvious what his agenda is on this if you make the link to Dr Kelly’s death and how disturbed he probably was about the weaponry that was being used in Iraq from the start of the invasion. I have read that thermonuclear weapons might have been used which would have accounted for injuries that Ali Abbas sustauned. There are plenty of shocking photos of him lying on his hospital bed, having lost 14 members of his family in March 2003.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7797876.stm
Dr Kelly was put out of the way.
This is Gilad Atzmon writing on Aaronovitch’s tantrum at an Oxford debate when Aaronovitch’s attempt to discredit Atzmon failed.
‘Aaronovitch who is notoriously famous for lobbying for a war that that has left (so far) 1.5 million civilians dead, a person that is engaged in spreading vile anti left and Islamophobic Zionised propaganda, is convinced that he is entitled to preach to the public who should participate in the discourse.’
(atlanticfreepress.com/news/1/9110-gilad-atzmon-aaronovitchs-tantrum-and-the-demolition-of-jewish-power.html)
Again with respect Abe I note your pejorative tone bordering on ridicule.
This is no ‘fringe theory’ having been taken up for many years by eminent surgeons and doctors in who I have a great deal of faith.
Do I need therapy? Cardinal McCormick wrote a reply to me some time ago when I questioned the morality of Tony Blair preaching as a Catholic having agreed to attack an innocent country and murder its children – he (via his private assistant) told me I was frantic and needed to stay calm – so yes my mind is in hyperdrive.
This case is supported by conclusive evidence so the term ‘conspiracy’ (which I hate incidentally) I feel should not be used dismissively in an attempt to characterize the facts as outlandishly false and held by person(s) judged to be a crank(s).
So, (in light of the above) was the BMA targeted? Curiously speaking Tavistock Square and Ben Stack are both on a Duke’s land.
Of course just a coincidence? This to take the mind of things:
http://shaphan.typepad.com/blog/2006/05/questions_about.html
Abe Rene,
there are problems with the evidence that you cite. Although packaging for 29 co-proxamol tablets was found, it is not known that they were all taken immediately before Dr Kelly’s death, and the toxicology report is consistent a much lower dose. A slit wrist does not generally induce death; a transverse slit is often regarded as a ‘cry for help’ because it is generally not fatal – as they say, if you’re serious about suicide you slit along the artery. And a Freedom of Information act request revealed that Dr Kelly’s knife had no fingerprints upon it. There should have been an inquest.
Yes, I’d like to attend this festival, but it is quite a long way from me.
“Anyone who, in attempting to make his case, quotes one word that Aaronovitch writes must himself be similarly prejudiced or at least naive.”
I suppose the argumentum ad hominem is always perfectly acceptable when directed against a person you don’t like. Some people might, with justification, say that anyone quoting Gilad Atzmon must be prejudiced or at least naive. On the other hand we may be charitable and think they are simply connoisseurs of irony appreciating his snide contempt for not just Israelis (which is perfectly okay, of course) but pretty much all Jews while simultaneously declaring that there is no such thing as Jews, that he is one (or rather an ex-one), that anti-semitism doesn’t exist and that it is perfectly justified. It’s an Orwellian balancing act to be sure but post-modernism has given fantasy dissidents the immense luxury of being able to make furious moral denunciations without having to worry about staid old conceptions such as truth or consistency.
somebody takes this form of inconsistency, in a more innocent age thought of as hypocrisy, as a central plank of his argument that if someone he doesn’t like argues convincingly that no conspiracy exists then it counts as evidence that that person is PART OF the conspiracy:
“It is obvious what his agenda is on this if you make the link to Dr Kelly’s death and how disturbed he probably was about the weaponry that was being used in Iraq from the start of the invasion. I have read that thermonuclear weapons might have been used which would have accounted for injuries that Ali Abbas sustauned. There are plenty of shocking photos of him lying on his hospital bed, having lost 14 members of his family in March 2003.”
As for this bizarre nonsequiter, where on earth did you read the gem that hydrogen bombs were used in the attack on Iraq? Why would they need to be?
Anyway, what is the extent of the latest charge here? The fact that someone had written “found on Harrowdown Hill” which conspiracy theorists believe the coroner or whoever signed the certificate had hinted in a subtly subversive or proudly intimidative fashion that it wasn’t where he had died? Am I the only one to think that that is extremely weak?
And what on Earth is this about the Kelly family having their wallpaper stripped for listening devices? Is the charge being made here that they had planted bugs so that they could hear when he was leaving the house and then intercept him? If that were the case then why wouldn’t those stripping the wallpaper for these devices know where they are and NOT strip the wallpaper?
My view concerning Dr Kelly is that the SIS murdered him because he was writing a book which might have exposed the goings-on involving chemical and biological warfare programmes and arms sales during the 80s and 90s. It would not surprise me at all if in fact the UK sponsored the work of Dr Basson whose aims alledgedly included the creation of a biological weapon designed to attack the black population while leaving whites unscathed.
Dr Kelly’s loyalty could no longer be guaranteed with his openness about the government sexing up the dossier. His ‘upset’ from being exposed and the parliamentary grilling gave the SIS the excuse they needed to make it appear he was suicidal and in a rush they botched up the appearance of suicide so all the apparatus of the corrupt Establishment came into play to cover up foul play.
Somebody has suggested the police removed wallpaper because they were looking for bugging devices. Surely it’s far more likely they were looking for hidden documents and data storage devices.
I’ve always found Norman Baker’s theory that a group of Iraqis dissidents murdered Dr Kelly bizzare but I understand where it comes from. Whilst writing his book the MP had his computer files at his Lewes constituency office remotely wiped. If the SIS couldn’t stop him reaching the conclusion that Kelly had been murdered they could have quite easily have pointed him in the direction as to who the murderers were. In fact Norman Baker said in the Mail,
‘A well-placed source also told me that the British police or security services had been warned of a likely assassination attempt but were not in time to stop it.’
“It would not surprise me at all if in fact the UK sponsored the work of Dr Basson whose aims alledgedly included the creation of a biological weapon designed to attack the black population while leaving whites unscathed.”
And it wouldn’t surprise you, why?
“Somebody has suggested the police removed wallpaper because they were looking for bugging devices. Surely it’s far more likely they were looking for hidden documents and data storage devices.”
It is?
Have we actually confirmed that the police removed wallpaper at all?
Interesting that after an absence here, inserts like Angrysoba suddenly pop out of the woodwork like the larvae of death watch beetles, appropriately enough.
Angry doesn’t give a damn how David Kelly died. He’s here for argument, and in as arrogant a manner as possible. Same goes for Larry.
There are people here who obviously do care about what they’re writing about. Not those two. They’re here purely to disrupt. Starting from a position of faux-superiority and know-it-all-ness.
“Have we actually confirmed that the police removed wallpaper at all?”
You don’t mean “we”, you mean “you”. You couldn’t care less whether wallpaper was removed or not. You’re simply trying to get someone else to prove that it was. Why should they waste their time on you?
“Interesting that after an absence here, inserts like Angrysoba suddenly pop out of the woodwork like the larvae of death watch beetles, appropriately enough.”
“Inserts”? What are “inserts”?
Somebody,
I don’t think Angrysoba is an “insert”. Take a look at his blog; my impression is that “debunking conspiracy theories” is a sort of hobby of his. He does follow links and he looks into some matters quite deeply, deeper than I have the patience for. I do feel he’s somewhat biased towards agreeing with the mainstream, and tends to follow those links further than the ones that might refute it, but then, that is the nature of his “hobby”. I certainly don’t find it suspicious that his comments follow discussion of the Kelly case, it is simply one of the issues that interest him.
“debunking conspiracy theories” is a sort of hobby –
Which means starting from the given government line in each case, and setting about debunking everyone else? This sounds incredibly naive. It also suggests that one will not seriously investigate anomalies in the “given line”. Rather stupid, I’d have thought, since one will inevitably miss those cases where propaganda has prevailed.
“Conspiracy theories” is a label used by the “authorities” to discredit enquiring minds and dissenting voices.
Slightly off topic. Our old chaotic merchants and murder inc.Blackwater have landed a 100’s of millions contract in Afghanistan guarding embassies and consulates.
Expect the downwards spiral in Afghanistan to speed up.
Meanwhile Karzai si said to hold talks with one of the US opponents Sirajuddin Haqqani, a man who has clout across the border with Pakistan and who is a king pin of the opposition.
He will have to talk to Taliban leaders as well, because without it, nothing will change for those soldiers on the ground, not to speak of urgently needed development of this country, preferably by its own people.
But we all know this economic enabling is not happening.
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/asia/2010/06/20106277582708497.html
“Which means starting from the given government line in each case, and setting about debunking everyone else? This sounds incredibly naive. It also suggests that one will not seriously investigate anomalies in the “given line”. Rather stupid, I’d have thought, since one will inevitably miss those cases where propaganda has prevailed.”
I don’t suppose it would matter if I said that I became interested in the Dr Kelly case BECAUSE I thought there were compelling reasons for believing that he’d been murdered, that I bought Norman Baker’s book, read it and became convinced while reading it that he had actually committed suicide?
Would it matter? No, because I’ll still be accused of having gullibly lapped up the “government story” the very next time this comes up and I enquire, “Where did that story come from?”
Angrysoba,
I hadn’t seen “inserts” used in this context before, it presumably means someone whose job is to discredit arguments that might reveal a truth hidden by some government or authority, as suggested by Cass Sunstein.
McIntyre,
Angrysoba is right in pointing out that ad hominen attacks are not evidence no matter which way they are directed.
Angrysoba’s presence here is positive, his contributions encourage good argument. I wouldn’t want counter arguments to the mainstream to go unchallenged, that wouldn’t serve the truth.
“Angrysoba is right in pointing out that ad hominen attacks are not evidence no matter which way they are directed”
I find it funny that it’s Angry who’s trying to make that point. The vast majority here don’t need telling. He should direct his attention to Larry.
“Angrysoba’s presence here is positive, his contributions encourage good argument.”
That’s a matter of opinion.
Anyone who read Norman Baker’s book, and thereby became convinced that David Kelly’s death was suicide, is a most incurious person indeed.
McIntyre,
you’ve probably noticed the futility of directing any attention to Larry. He’s an output-only device, his input and interactive functions seem irredeemably heat-compromised to me.
Thanks Clark.
Good day to you, McIntyre. I actually thought you were being humourous before with your posting of the “Larry Chomstein” blog. The ironic warnings that Larry would follow Israel’s example and probably neither confirm nor deny being the owner(“watch his language!” you cautioned) struck me as very funny. I’m a little gobsmacked to discover you were actually probably being serious.
I have to agree with you McIntyre that a ‘compelling argument’ for suicide does not ‘stack up’ if we apply two theories of truth.
In brief, using the correspondence theory highlights the weakness of medical evidence for suicide,ie analysis of blood proves a low level of toxins. At least three eminent surgeons agree that cutting the ulner artery does not lead to death by haemorrhaging.
Assessing the Evidence Using a Social Constructionist Theory of Truth we note the 30yr and 70 yr block on evidence by the government.
The likelihood of a body witnessed by two s&r moving from being propped up against a tree to flat out on the ground and the lack of blood witnessed by the s&r team and two paramedics in a case of haemorrhaging is remote. Occam’s razor applies.
“…I became interested in the Dr Kelly case BECAUSE I thought there were compelling reasons for believing that he’d been murdered”
So, Angry, what were those compelling reasons?
“…I bought Norman Baker’s book, read it and became convinced while reading it that he had actually committed suicide”
And what was in Norman Baker’s book that changed your mind and made you believe it was suicide?
I’m not guessing that Larry is Larry Chomstein, by the way. I know he is.
Mark,
Yes, I’ve followed the story from Day 1, far too many oddities … And if there’s nothing suspicious to be revealed, why the 70 year block. It’s virtually unheard of, as I understand it.
“I actually thought you were being humourous before with your posting of the “Larry Chomstein” blog.”
Why?
Mark, thanks for the link:
http://shaphan.typepad.com/blog/2006/05/questions_about/comments/page/2/#comments
Interesting comment there:
“1. The key to understanding what is going on in Britain 2008 is to realise that New Labour is Fabian. 2. The final objective of the Fabians is to create a One World Communitarian (‘Third Way’) government. This ties in with the New World Order project. 3. Common Purpose is the management mechanism being used to carry out the true and hidden agenda of Fabian New Labour. 4. The economic and social chaos that we are witnessing nowadays has been deliberately engineered by Fabian New Labour and Common Purpose along with New World Order plotters in places like the United States and the European Union. 5. There are literally no depths to which this institutionally-corrupt Fabian New Labour government will not descend: multi-billion Eurofraud, relentless and ruthless abuses of citizens, lying, cheating, secrecy, going to war on the basis of lies, oppressive social control, abrogating sovereign rule to Brussels, bankrupting the country and so on. http://www.stopcp.com”