Cheer Up! The Glass is Full for Independence. 146


I find some social media comment unduly pessimistic on the prospects for Independence, which have never been brighter. We have almost all Scottish Westminster MPs. We have a pro-Independence majority in Holyrood (the other Green MSPs are much better than Patrick Harvie) for another four years. The SNP is back for a historic third term, having polled more than twice the votes of anybody else. We can neutralise a Scottish Lib Dem as Presiding Officer – they will do anything for a title and a cushy job. It is not a question of whether the glass is half full. It is full. The head on the beer may be a wee bit deeper than we wanted, but the glass is full.

The percentage supporting Independence has risen fairly consistently and it is now around 50/50, as reflected in this election result. Support will continue to grow.

But the most helpful development of all is that it is now absolutely plain to everybody that the choice is between Independence and the Conservative Party. The falling in of the unionists behind the Tories is the greatest boost we could have – the media promotion of the Gordon Brown social compact lie is now finished for good. In a straight choice between Independence and Tories, Scots would only go one way. Only one in nine of eligible Scottish voters, voted Tory. If that is the unionist base, good. You will also find that the age profile of that 1 in 9 is going to be highly problematic to the unionists.

It is perfectly legitimate for Independence voters to have different tactical views in the election, but now we have to come together again. I am willing to put myself at the disposal full time of the SNP’s pro-Independence campaign this summer. They have expressed an intent that this will not be a purely Party campaign. As we all gear up for it, please remember me as a potential speaker in your area.

I have no doubt something will crop up to justify a new Indyref within the next four years. Brexit. Another illegal war by Westminster. A firm opinion poll lead for Indy. Some nutty right wing Tory policy proposal. Do not worry. It will come.

A brief note on Labour. A quietly spoken truth is that I do not know any Scottish nationalist who would not like to see Jeremy Corbyn in power in England (with all due respect to Caroline Lucas, for whom I have great respect). The Labour Party has no role to play in Scotland before Independence. It is just getting in the way, and humiliating itself. Post Independence, I suspect quite a lot of Nationalists would join a genuine Scottish Labour Party. In the meantime, the unionists should just off and join the Tories.


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146 thoughts on “Cheer Up! The Glass is Full for Independence.

1 2
    • fred

      That’s good, it shows they are progressive and listen to other opinions.

      What we don’t need is a party that sticks to it’s old failed policies like a dog to an old bone.

      I was pleased to hear of the government climb down on forced academies released polling day when .nobody would notice. It’s having a government with a strong opposition makes these things possible, nothing worse for a country than one party having absolute power.

      • Duncan McFarlane

        I’d say it shows they only have a small majority so backbench rebellions by a couple of dozen tory MPs combining with the opposition can force them to u-turn.

        But i agree it’s bad for any party to have a big majority for too long.

  • nevermind

    Once again I urge you to talk to Patrick Harvie, or find out about him by talking to Linda hendry, an ex cllr. in Edinburgh who precedes his ascendancy and ‘knows’ him from his humble beginnings.

    I feel that you can help in establishing a rapport between the two sides, should this be appropriate.

  • Gordon Hastie

    “The falling in of the unionists behind the Tories is the greatest boost we could have – the media promotion of the Gordon Brown social compact lie is now finished for good. In a straight choice between Independence and Tories, Scots would only go one way.”

    Spot on – as is the final paragraph.

    • Scotsfox

      Should really have thought about that before throwing all in with Tories during IndyRef. They even set up a Ltd Co together. Reap what you sow.

    • John Spencer-Davis

      That is really interesting and informative, thank you. Assuming the figures are right – and I am sure they are – that just shows how wrong someone can be. I would have sworn blind that Labour majorities depended heavily on a solid Labour block in Scotland, never having actually sat down and researched the matter out.

      All right, in that case you lot can clear off as soon as you like 😉

    • K Crosby

      Liarbour has colluded in the fascist electoral system since not winning the 1945 election, they’re beyond hope.

  • weather report

    This can be called the Polarisation election. Unionism in Scotland is really Toryism as many of us have long known. If we stay in the union it’s perpetual Tory government either from the real thing or from a Westminster Labour administration with a re-established Blairite leadership pursuing Tory style policies. Whatever your views about Corbyn he is never going to lead Labour to an election win.

    It’s now Progressive Scotland versus reactionary British Nationalism.

  • Republicofscotland

    Yes I imagine some nasty Tory policy or Westminster war will stick its ugly head above the parapet, sooner than later, Brexit, I’d hope will lead to a second indy ref. Though if you listen to the media, Ruth Davidson, will slap any mandate down on another indy ref.

    I hope your bouyant attitude, regarding independence is a sign that something unknown, but beneficial to the cause is astir.

    Now that Labour in Scotland are nothing more than a cautionary tale, of what happens when you side with the nasty party. I wonder if some of it elected MSP’s will openly back the indy campaign, I do hope so.

    Post indy I’d back whoever put forward the best policies.

  • George CGebbie

    Well said , Craig Murray and I for one will be pushing to have you speak in Eastwood in support of independence. The glass is indeed full and I raise mine to you. Slainthe!

  • Node

    But the most helpful development of all is that it is now absolutely plain to everybody that the choice is between Independence and the Conservative Party.

    Don’t underestimate Ruth Davidson. She’s a more skillful politician than Kezia Dugdale, and even more dangerously, she’s likeable. She will have a bigger platform as leader of the opposition in Holyrood, and she won’t waste it.

      • Habbabkuk (calling a spade a spade)

        Yes, I saw Ruth Davidson (for the first time) on the satellite link of Andrew Neil’s “Sunday Politics” earlier today and was impressed by how she handled the interview and indeed by what she said. She came across very well.

        As Anon1 says, it looks as if she could be a match for La Sturgeon.

        La Sturgeon can no longer play the woman leader card; the SNP, being the govt, will get blamed for the inevitable fuck ups and disappointments; independence is a busted flush (tacitly admitted by the SNP): and on a personal level (family income, background, etc) who is the well-off machine politician?

        • weather report

          The SNP have been in government for nine years and yet still keep on winning more constituencies and setting a new record for popular vote total in a Holyrood election.

          Independence is still on the agenda since at least half the population wants it. Just because the folks who don’t want it are making a lot of noise about not wanting indyref2 that doesn’t mean they speak for a majority of the people of Scotland.

          • Habbabkuk (flush out fakes)

            When do you think there should be a second referendum on independence and why then?

          • Habbabkuk (flush out fakes)

            Any thoughts on how Ruth Davidson might affect the Conservative Party’s fortunes in Scotland over the next few years?

            Positively? Negatively? Will she be a match for (or more agreeable than) La Sturgeon on a personal level?

          • Republicofscotland

            Weather Report.

            Explaining the ins and outs of Scottish independence to Habb, is a bit like trying to teach a goldfish how to play the violin, he (Habb) hasn’t a clue.

            His/her specialist subject, is well known in here.

          • Habbabkuk (flush out fakes)

            Well, RoS, if you’re right and I haven’t got a clue, perhaps that’s why I’m asking “Weather Report” some questions. After all, he did assure us that he had some knowledge of Scottish politics.

            However, I don’t mind of you answering them instead (if you can spare the time from posting silly-clever remarks 🙂 )

  • MJ

    “the prospects for Independence, which have never been brighter”

    The prospects were surely brighter prior to the referendum, when independence was an achievable democratic outcome.

    Is there any reliable evidence that a desire for independence has grown substantially since the referendum? Votes cast for the SNP since then obviously don’t count because independence wasn’t on the agenda in these elections and Scots opposed to independence could safely vote for the SNP on other issues.

    I wouldn’t have thought that the collapse in oil prices has done much to help the cause of independence.

    • craig Post author

      Indeed there is a wealth of regular opinion poll information. Go to the excellent Scot Goes Pop website for a psephological feast.

      There has never been a poll asking both at the same time, showing a difference greater than the margin of error between SNP support and Independence support. And don’t forget the Greens explicitly supported Independence in their manifesto also.

      The oil price is marginal to the Scottish economy. Only 5% of economy anyway, and as we don’t export crude – it’s all processed – a fall in the crude price is a fall in raw material cost and industry margins rise. So very little effect overall.

      The referendum campaign saw a rise in Independence support by 15%. Starting from 30% was always a long shot. No, we are much closer now than we were then. I know you are an inveterate British nationalist, but that is the truth.

        • Rob Royston

          Oil is sold on the market to the highest bidder, that will be why the price goes up and down. Sometimes it will be bought by a buyer and loaded into tankers that take it to another part of the world where it will be put back on the market. Tankers still bring crude oil to the UK refineries, I have in the past year seen a few tankers going up to Finnart, the West Coast terminal for Grangemouth and some of them have come from West African oilfields. All oil is not the same, so they probably try to get what suits their operation best and with less waste product to get rid off.
          Craig’s point is more likely that the UK’s downstream side uses up as much as our Upstream production.

    • Anon1

      The SNP are much happier having their mouths stuffed with English gold whilst lording it around lording it around their little fiefdom. They’ll still be making more demands under the threat of independence when Craig is an old man mumbling away that “the prospects for Independence have never been brighter”.

      The case for Independence tanked with the oil price. That leaves whisky and oatcakes. Any “nasty” (for which read necessary and sensible economic) policy of the Tories can be blocked in Scotland while England foots the bill for Scottish largesse. And Scotland trades far more with the rest of the UK than it does with the EU so what exactly is the argument for Brexit justifying a second referendum?

      Nope, there will be no independence, not in Craig’s time and not in mine. I have no doubt, to use a Murrayism, that this is the case.

      • weather report

        If you think the Scottish economy is oil, whisky and oatcakes then it merely shows up your lack of information on the subject.

        • Republicofscotland

          Weather Report.

          Thank you for that, I’m afraid you’re wasting your time on Anon1, (origins unknown) and for that matter Fred, who sees Scotland as a part of the union, no matter how dire, it becomes.

          Not even the McCrone Report, nor the 52% who voted for devolution in 1979, but were cheated by SDP MP George Cunningham’s 40% nonsense fazes the ardent Scots based unionist. Of course Scotland has an unfortunate hidtory of ToomTabards.

          Nor will you hear a unionist wimper over the colossal waste of cash on renewing Trident. Which is situated 30 odd miles from Scotland’s largest city.

          To the unionist acolytes the union is to be held up high on a pedestal, as something that will last forever no matter how inappropriate and outdated it may become.

          • fred

            If you mean I’m not a fully brainwashed member of the Braveheart cult you’re right.

          • Republicofscotland

            What on earth has “Braveheart” got to do with the McCrone Report, the 1979 fixed devolution referendum or Trident or even the 6000 miles of stolen seas.?

            The union has ran its course, and Nicola Sturgeon talking to Gordon Brewer on the Politics show this morning said a summer campaign on independence will be renewed. Persuading no voters to vote yes will be at the front of that campaign.

            Now that the nasty party are the clear opposition at Holyrood, that may in the near future push more voters towards independence.

          • Republicofscotland

            Habb.

            I have on several occasions posted that I’m Scottish and live in Scotland, I thought my username would be a dead giveaway. But anonomus idiots like yourself, can’t quite grasp the fact.

            Now let everyone read what nationality you are and where you come from, I am however confident, that you will, not reveal anything, because to do so would damage your agenda.

            If you can’t put up, shut up.

      • J Galt

        The contrived fall in the crude price has hurt the perps far more than the intended victim.

        It will go back up again – it always does.

          • J Galt

            You’re right it can’t be relied on, but then we’re no different from any other oil producing country.

            SNP claims – well I don’t think they said it was set in stone and would never change, in fact I distinctly remember Salmond saying as much – it was an estimate based on the then price.

            Yes the Scottish Economy ain’t in great shape and perhaps the Scottish people do need a collective rocket up their arse.

            Lack of access to the economic levers of power mean that decisions are made in London which can impact adversely on specific Scottish Industries such as Whisky or Fishing for instance. If we’re making the decisions, we sink or swim on our own merits – that’s Independence for you!

  • Clydebuilt

    “The Labour Party has no role to play in Scotland before Independence”. That belongs on the front of a T shirt……. Brilliant….

  • DerekM

    Some might say it was well planned Craig it exposes the electoral system for what it is broken.

    Some of the hard line SNP vote got their noses put out of joint a bit but these guys need to take a good hard look at the electoral system and ask themselves if trying to get an increased vote in the 1st vote means less list seats then why did their party do that ,then they might figure out the SNP were never trying to get a majority but to get elected 1st vote MSP`s.

    And you are so right Craig its only a matter of time and Ruth is going to find out that she cant hide her masters in London.

    Though i have my doubts about us old Labour flocking back to that wretch of a party i used to belong to ,unless its to take over and turn it into an indy party,though to be honest i dont think we can be bothered as it means dealing with all the vermin in ermin they stashed away under Blair in that unelected house of rejects they call democracy.

    Lots of glum faces in the indy movement but i think its starting to sink in what they just did again even if the system tries to throw some shiny beads in to distract.

      • Node

        Donald Trump :

        Blockquote>“I didn’t want to get involved in it, but people asked me and I think Scotland is better being unified as opposed to being independent,” he said.

      • Habbabkuk (flush out fakes)

        A fair point of mine, surely.

        A little strange, surely, that an American should have to go onto a predominantly British blog to ask about Trump’s position on Scottish independence.

        I mean, it’d be a little like you – a Scot living in Scotland (allegedly) – asking the American readers of a US blog questions about Ruth Davidson’s views, wouldn’t it.

      • Republicofscotland

        Habb.

        That may well be but I’m addressing you what’s your excuse for not revealing your nationality and place of residence.

        Estimated Habb reply..waffle waffle..divert from point..waffle waffle…smiley face.

  • weather report

    Here’s a good one. Rachael Hamilton the new Tory list MSP for South Scotland describes herself on her Twitter account as “hotelierswife”.

    Sounds like she knows her place and is going to try and make sure we know ours too.

  • katherine hamilton

    Hi Craig, I’ve come oot my huff and reading your stuff again, which I like. Especially on the issue of the Palestinians.
    I’ve posted on a few sites but I’ll say it again.
    Finally we’ve got the bastards in our sights. Davidson is a charlatan. The not the Tory Party party. Aye right.

    Let’s destroy them. It shouldn’t be too hard!

  • bevin

    “In my opinion, Labour cannot do it by itself in England…”

    “Whatever your views about Corbyn he is never going to lead Labour to an election win…”

    When one’s views coincide with those of the BBC and The Guardian, they are very likely to be wrong.
    The only thing standing in the way of a Corbyn landslide is a PLP full of Blairite saboteurs. If the local parties, the CLPs, organise to discipline these traitors, something which can be easily done, and ensure that the party is working for a platform of radical change, rather than for another Tory win, the underlying political questions, which vitally concern the majority of electors, will emerge.
    When that happens the majority will surely follow.
    Has nobody else noticed that a man calling himself a socialist and putting forward a platform built around anger at High Finance, just won every rural county in New York State? Plus the State of Indiana. And has won almost every properly administered primary that he entered?
    The reality, and it is one that the SNP is going to have to confront soon, is that the crises in this world are calling out for socialist solutions. The days of identity politics and muted messaging are over. Blairism is a rotting corpse high time it was interred. Or cremated.

    • Anon1

      Without Scotland, Corbyn would need a bigger landslide than Blair in ’97. Not going to happen. England has never voted Labour. Labour is/was kept alive by the Celtic fringes. The only hope for the party is a Blairite leader appealing to voters across the spectrum. But I want my three quid to go a bit further yet. 🙂

      • Republicofscotland

        Anon1.

        You’re sadly mistaken if you thought that, if Scotland voted Labour en masse that somehow at the 2015 GE, that would’ve propelled Milliband to number ten, it wouldn’t have. Even if Scotland had voted Labour adding those votes to Labour’s down South still would not have saw Milliband win.

        The Tories played a blinder by falsley claiming Alex and Nicola would steal cash from the voters pockets or Nicola would control Milliband at Westminster. That’s why the Tories won, and that scenario illustrates why Scotland needs independence, as only one Tory MP held their seat at the 2015 GE. Who is now the Governor General to Scotland.

      • keaton

        “Without Scotland, Corbyn would need a bigger landslide than Blair in ’97.”

        Why? A result like Attlee’s in 1945, or Wilson’s in 1974, or Blair’s in 2005, or any other time Labour won in the UK without needing Scottish seats, would also do.

      • Mochyn69

        “The guardian – wrong about everything.”

        Love it! Just how I’ve been feeling about the Grauniad, like, forever! But especially about independence for Scotland and Jeremy Corbyn.

        Total traitors to their radical, liberal heritage.

    • Habbabkuk (calling a spade a spade)

      “The only thing standing in the way of a Corbyn landslide is a PLP full of Blairite saboteurs.”
      _____________________

      An egregiously silly comment, “Bevin”, even by your standards.

      The only thing standing in the way of a Corbyn landside are the British electors.

      The various elections of the other day refer.

    • Habbabkuk (calling a spade a spade)

      When Bevin writes

      “.. a PLP full of Blairite saboteurs. If the local parties, the CLPs, organise to discipline these traitors…”

      it sounds like something right out of the Stalinist pirges of the 1930s, doesn’t it. 🙂

      • bevin

        Unlike the ‘Stalinist purges’ -which is pretty well the way that the Blairites acted to rid the Labour party of Socialists- what I am proposing is that the local parties should ensure that their candidates in the next election support the policies in the manifesto. At the moment large sections of the PLP are working to defeat the party and to prevent it from developing policies which would win the election and transform society.
        To call this Stalinism is either an indication of complete ignorance of the history of the CPSU or a deliberate smear. The question of whether you are a fool or a rogue is moot.

        • Habbabkuk (flush out fakes)

          “Bevin”

          Insiders always use the acronym “CPSU”, don’t they.

          It’s something they just can’t shake off and it always gives them away.

          • bevin

            An “insider’ in your warped corner of the universe being someone who actually knows what he is talking about. For those unacquainted with the term CPSU it stands for Communist Party of the Soviet Union. It is frequently used in what are known as “history” books.
            What a silly little thing you are, Habbakkuk. A troleen.

          • Habbabkuk (flush out fakes)

            Yes, “Bevin”, but this is a blog and not a history book. Those who use the acronym “CPSU” is ordinary conversational discourse – as on this blog – are clearly “insiders” in the sense I meant and you understood.

            No need for you to get mad – after all, the contents of your numerous posts provide all the proof that’s needed, don’t they.

  • Ben Monad

    Optimism is good but pessimism has it’s uses. My question relates to when optimism morphs into delusion.

    • Ba'al Zevul

      Got to say, I see your point, Ben. However, I’ve started hearing mainstream economists making noises to the effect that if the oilcos don’t get their act together, start divesting production and reinvesting in alternative energy, they’re on the way out. There seems to be ‘a tide in the affairs of men / Which taken at the flood….’ This is a very shaky time for everyone’s economy. It could mark a breakpoint. And I think the SNP has taken on board the idea that alternative energy engineering – neglected on the whole, and even betrayed by the UK government – could be a nice little earner. But I’d want to see much more on economic matters from the SNP, and much less on political games, before I expressed any degree of confidence in its future.

      • Ben Monad

        “it could mark a breakpoint’

        Yes Komo. I find myself almost wishing for a Trump WH because the Dialectic is long overdue. My secret wish is to give things a ‘push’ rather than suffer the death of a thousand cuts. Just bi-sect and re-sect the major arteries with a total blood transfusion.

        If efficient energy is a winner for revenue how about Medical Marijuana?

        Wheels within wheels, as I say.

  • Anon1

    -OT- but this is the blog of a human rights activist.

    I was very sad to hear that Human rights activist Khurram Ali was gunned down last night in Karachi by Islamic extremists. He was a champion of religious minorities and fighting for progressive, secular politics in Pakistan. His murder came just hours after a Facebook post in which he praised this country for its tolerance towards minorities.

    I am sure the whole blog will join me in urging the remaining activists in Ali’s movement, “Let Us Build Pakistan”, not to be cowed by religious extremists.

    • Habbabkuk (flush out fakes)

      “Bevin” – wasn’t Anon1 talking about Pakistan?

      Instead of attempting to divert (that’s very “CPSU” as well, isn’t it…), why don’t you join Anon1 and me in deploring the killing of human rights activist Khurram Ali and in urging the remaining activists in Ali’s movement, “Let Us Build Pakistan”, not to be cowed by religious extremists?

      Unless you approve of the killing, of course…?

    • Republicofscotland

      Apologies Anon1, I just noticed your comment, I think everyone one knows my views on the quasi-lawless, and religiously zealot state of Pakistan.

    • Habbabkuk (flush out fakes)

      Well, Anon1, I joined you yesterday evening but my comment was deleted for some unknown reason.

      Perhaps the reason was my speculation that very few others would be joining you?

  • fred

    Scotland has around 4 million voters of which around a million voted SNP.

    The glass isn’t full, the glass isn’t even half full, the glass is three quarters empty.

  • Tony_0pmoc

    I am all for Independence, specifically Independence from people like this. She actually looks quite sane (though appearances can be deceptive). She used to be a television soap opera producer. Now she is The US Ambassador to Hungary. More or less the same kind of thing?? Which brand of soap is that?

    “US Ambassador to Hungary: Overthrow Assad, Let in Refugees, and Fight Russia… or Else!”

    https://alethonews.wordpress.com/2016/05/07/us-ambassador-to-hungary-overthrow-assad-let-in-refugees-and-fight-russia-or-else/

    Why don’t we in Europe just tell these American Idiots to Fuck Off?

    Tony

    • Ben Monad

      “Why don’t we in Europe just tell these American Idiots to Fuck Off?’

      too many international competing factors….

  • Les Damnés de la Caledonia

    Thank goodness Fred’s here to speak for the indigenous colonizers. He tries to use SNP electoral turnout as a proxy for the distinct issue of Scottish self-determination. (Pro tip: if you’re going to try that trick, stop complaining about the policy missteps and independence trimming that hurt the SNP at the polls.) Fred helpfully points us to the CIA strategy for British interference: hamstring the SNP with nitwits and Quislings, then use the corrupted party to discredit self-determination.

      • Chris Rogers

        Thats about right, indeed so many antisemites exist globally that one cannot move for the buggers, similar to the Mecca debacles we see as pilgrims get stampeded in the rush. Still, lucky Habbabkuk is not in the CPS, lest we have prosecutions without concrete evidence, just FB and Twitter posts, most of which are taken so out of context that the CPS itself could be sued for slander.

      • Chris Rogers

        Strange how Habbabkuk feels more comfortable in ‘anti-semitism’ mode than on other matters, such as being a Unionist and a Tory. I believe the correct phrase we should use for the bugger is: Establishment Toad, which from here on in, is exactly what one will do.

    • Habbabkuk (calling a spade a spade)

      “Fred helpfully points us to the CIA strategy for British interference: hamstring the SNP with nitwits and Quislings, then use the corrupted party to discredit self-determination.”

      ________________________

      I knew that if I waited long enough some ConspiraLoon would come up with the CIA 🙂

      Excuses, excuses…..

      • Ben Monad

        ‘falsely accusing..’

        Sounds familiar. OJ Simpson rings a bell.

        Can we at least agree that Israel is a democracy for certain ethnicities established by the Boers?

    • nevermind

      Thanks Les Damnes, Habby and Fred the sled have their own agenda’s, one’s schoolmastering, cracking the ewhp and all that and the other is todo anyone down who does not agree with the CIA/Union manual.
      Like Berlin, like cabaret and like your response.

  • RobG

    The Trade Union Act 2016 was passed by the Lords last Tuesday, and was passed into law by Her Maj on Wednesday, one day before the local elections. Here’s the TUC take on the bill…

    https://www.tuc.org.uk/about-bill

    The Trade Union Act is yet another nail in the coffin of democracy.

    Also buried in the hubub about the local elections was the government’s u-turn on privatising the education system…

    http://www.theguardian.com/education/2016/may/06/government-backs-down-over-plan-to-make-all-schools-academies

    Labour under Corbyn have been doing very well, but you wouldn’t know this if you only look at the MSM headlines.

    • Republicofscotland

      Thank you for that “bad news” RobG, the SNP can use that at Holyrood to beat Ruth Davidson with, literally speaking that is, as the nasty party rolls out it design for a future Dickensian society across these isles.

      The blood sweat and tears that our fore fathers put in to achieve those working rights, are being eroded by the nasty party. Holyrood must not yield to the Trade Union bill but stand defiant. It’s just another reason why Scottish independence is a must.

      • RobG

        Republicofscotland, the ‘counter-extremism bill’ is even more worrying. It looks like it will be announced in the Queen’s speech in a week or so’s time…

        http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/03/david-cameron-terror-strategy-definition-extremism

        Cameron & Co have been banging on about ‘non-violent extremists’ for a while now. They try to give it the terrorism angle, so that the public will accept such an egregious assault on civil liberties, but basically it means anyone like you and me, who disagree with the government.

        • Republicofscotland

          So Westminster can’t find adequate working to describe fundemental terrorism, that won’t be challenged in a court.

          I’m surprised they didn’t try it on with, a named bill that says anyone who disagrees or looks strangely at the police, or demontrates any form of dissent at being screwed by the government or big business, will be arrested under the terrorism act. ?

        • Ba'al Zevul

          Non-violent extremist = anyone you don’t like. Here comes the thinkpol.

          The Thought Police generally interfere very little with the working class of Oceania, known as the Proles—although a few Thought Police agents always move among them, spreading false rumors, and identifying and eliminating any individual deemed capable of independent thought or rebellion against the Party, and all Party members live their lives under the constant supervision of the Thought Police.

          To remove any possibility of creating martyrs, whose memories could be used as a rallying cause against the Party, the Thought Police gradually wear down the will of political prisoners in a Ministry of Love through conversations, degradation, and finally in a torture chamber known as Room 101. These methods are designed and intended to eventually make prisoners genuinely accept Party ideology and come to love Big Brother, not merely confess. The prisoners are then released back into society for a short while, but are soon re-arrested, charged with new offences, and executed. All other Party members who knew them must forget them, and are prohibited from remembering them by the Thoughtcrime law known as “crimestop”. All records of the executed prisoners are destroyed and replaced with falsified records by the Ministry of Truth, and their bodies are disposed of by means of cremation.
          (Wikipedia: Thought Police (as predicted by Orwell))

          Not too far off, I reckon. BTW, you know ‘Crimestoppers’, the independent charity which accepts anonymous tipoffs from concerned members of the public – or informers, as the uncharitable might put it? Not to disparage it in the least, but ‘crimestop’ was Orwell’s coinage, too. Doubleplusungood.

          • Anon1

            Police Scotland:

            “Please be aware that we will continue to monitor comments on social media & any offensive comments will be investigated.”

      • Habbabkuk (flush out fakes)

        RoS

        “Thank you for that “bad news” RobG, the SNP can use that at Holyrood to beat Ruth Davidson with…”

        _______________________________

        It’s wonderfully “you”, isn’t it.

        In your peculiarly twisted view of the world, what is in reality bad news for some real people who don’t post on CM becomes “good news” for you because the SBP can “use” it at Holyrood.

        What is the matter with you tonight?

  • Johnstone

    Land reform and tax expert Andy Wightman has been elected for the greens!!
    SNP did nothing to further land reform only implemented vague unenforceable measures concerning sustainable management of estates. Read about the Caymen Island lairds on AWs web site
    http://www.andywightman.com/

    • RobG

      I would imagine that most who post on this board can’t speak Spanish, so I can only guess that you posted the link for the photo it contains.

      I’m sure that you would like to congratulate Sadiq Khan, for not only becoming the first Muslim mayor of London, but also the first Muslim mayor of any major city in the West (Rotterdam does not qualify).

      The racist psychos are now all in a quandary about this.

      It was a democratic vote, and the vast majority who voted for Khan were not Muslims.

      Who would you vote for..? A Bullingdon boy total twat, or the son of a bus driver?

      It ain’t rocket science.

      • lysias

        I see nothing noteworthy in that Spanish-language article. Surely it was to be expected that Pakistanis would be delighted by Sadiq Khan’s victory in the election?

        • Habbabkuk (flush out fakes)

          Spanish-language articles are not your strong suit, Lysias.

          Must I remind you of that article on former French FM Dumas which you sourced in support of your latest conspiracy……and which blew up in your face because of your inadequate grasp of the language?

          That was when you diverted away from your own comment (!) by suggesting that there were “several” Habbabkuks…. 🙂

      • Anon1

        Not sure if congratulations or lack thereof are really relevant. He won an election, fair and square.

        “son of a bus driver”

        Please. This is becoming the most tired phrase in British politics. Hope his dad doesn’t brag on about being father to a career politician.

        Zac Goldsmith might be a useless wet Tory twat (in stark contrast to his father), but he was right to point out khan’s links to Islamic extremists and his description of ‘moderate’ Muslims as Uncle Tom’s. For which he was branded racist, vile, obscene, disgusting, disgraceful, despicable etc., and all the other plethora of words deployed by the left in order to close down debate.

        But at least Sadiq’s followers in Pakistan are unashamed of where he stands.

        • RobG

          The British government (and by extension the idiots who vote for these people) are presently butchering men, women and children in Libya, Syria, Iraq, Yemen and Afghanistan, and many other places.

          These are war crimes, and those responsible will be held to account; including the present UK prime minister, David Cameron.

        • glenn

          …his description of ‘moderate’ Muslims as Uncle Tom’s.

          Uncle Tom’s what? An incomplete sentence, or are you saying they belonged to Uncle Tom?

          By a “wet” – a curiously old fashioned Thatcherite stooge’s term – I presume you refer to Zac’s observance of the scientifically established fact of global climate change, or is it some other manifestation of rationality on his part you object to?

          • bevin

            I think RD is referring to Widdecombe Fair and Uncle Tom Cobbleigh’s grey mare.

        • Habbabkuk (la vita è bella)

          To be fair, Anon1, it depends a little on what is meant by “links”.

          Using the word widely, I should imagine that most politicians have links with all sorts of people.

          Re Goldsmith’s campaign, it appears that quite a few Conservatives weren’t too happy either.

  • Mark Golding

    Britain’s asymmetrical war of neo-colonialization has reached a propaganda fever pitch despite a ‘deal’ to cease hostilities in the city of Aleppo. Within this dynamic, Terror has served both as a convenient alibi and a political rationale.

    The terrorist group, Jaysh al-Islam, funded by Saudi, armed with US rocket artillery with media support from the British/US communications company, InCoStrat, headed by Lieutenant Colonel Paul Tilley, MBE, Royal Regiment of Artillery is striking Syrian refugee camps, according to an account by one-leg John, in attempts and efforts to accuse the Syrian government of war crimes.

    I also note the Qulliam Foundation is involved in outlining the concepts based on British intelligence and known agents in bashir Kadabachi.

    This deceit will fail simply because this Islamist group Jaysh al-Islam admitted to using chemical weapons against Kurdish militias in Aleppo. It also uses human shields and publishes execution videos.

    Unsurprisingly Jaysh al-Islam it has a delegation at the UN-backed Syria peace talks in Geneva.

    The evidence has been meticulously documented in pictures, videos and words in the format required for a war tribunal.

    https://www.rt.com/news/338939-islamists-chemical-weapons-talks/

  • Alex Birnie

    Great article Craig.

    I was with you, right up to the second last sentence. I’m sure there are thousands of Labour supporters who joined the SNP after the referendum, who, like me, will never forgive what they did in the dying weeks of the referendum campaign, trawling through their own membership lists for OAP Labour supporters and calling them to warn them that their pensions would be forfeit if the yes campaign won. This tactic absolutely reeked of McTernan and McDougall. I will NEVER join a party that employs such people. I wouldn’t even consider joining a party containing Sarwar, Baillie, Kelly, Smith, McDonald, Lamont, Findlay, and their ilk. Labour are just about finished, and their only hope now is to adopt a pro-federal narrative, which they will never do until those names and the other dinosaurs have been defenestrated.

    • craig Post author

      Alex,

      Thanks. Possibly I wasn’t being plain enough. By “A genuine Scottish Labour Party” I meant “not this one”.

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