Now that Liam Fox is back in the Cabinet and Matthew Gould, ex-Ambassador to Israel, in in charge of Security in the Cabinet Office, it is essential to get answers to what happened in at least eight meetings between Adam Werritty and Gould at least some of which involved Mossad – as Cabinet Secretary Gus O’Donnell acknowledged to a parliamentary committee:
Hansard Public Administration Committee 24/11/2011
Q<369> Paul Flynn: Okay. Matthew Gould has been the subject of a very serious complaint from two of my constituents, Pippa Bartolotti and Joyce Giblin. When they were briefly imprisoned in Israel, they met the ambassador, and they strongly believe—it is nothing to do with this case at all—that he was serving the interest of the Israeli Government, and not the interests of two British citizens. This has been the subject of correspondence.
In your report, you suggest that there were two meetings between the ambassador and Werritty and Liam Fox. Questions and letters have proved that, in fact, six such meetings took place. There are a number of issues around this. I do not normally fall for conspiracy theories, but the ambassador has proclaimed himself to be a Zionist and he has previously served in Iran, in the service. Werritty is a self-proclaimed—
Robert Halfon: Point of order, Chairman. What is the point of this?
Paul Flynn: Let me get to it. Werritty is a self-proclaimed expert on Iran.
Chair: I have to take a point of order.
Robert Halfon: Mr Flynn is implying that the British ambassador to Israel is working for a foreign power, which is out of order.
Paul Flynn: I quote the Daily Mail: “Mr Werritty is a self-proclaimed expert on Iran and has made several visits. He has also met senior Israeli officials, leading to accusations”—not from me, from the Daily Mail—“that he was close to the country’s secret service, Mossad.” There may be nothing in that, but that appeared in a national newspaper.
Chair: I am going to rule on a point of order. Mr Flynn has made it clear that there may be nothing in these allegations, but it is important to have put it on the record. Be careful how you phrase questions.
Paul Flynn: Indeed. The two worst decisions taken by Parliament in my 25 years were the invasion of Iraq—joining Bush’s war in Iraq—and the invasion of Helmand province. We know now that there were things going on in the background while that built up to these mistakes. The charge in this case is that Werritty was the servant of neo-con people in America, who take an aggressive view on Iran. They want to foment a war in Iran in the same way as in the early years, there was another—
Chair: Order. I must ask you to move to a question that is relevant to the inquiry.
Q<370> Paul Flynn: Okay. The question is, are you satisfied that you missed out on the extra four meetings that took place, and does this not mean that those meetings should have been investigated because of the nature of Mr Werritty’s interests?
Sir Gus O’Donnell: I think if you look at some of those meetings, some people are referring to meetings that took place before the election.
Q<371> Paul Flynn: Indeed, which is even more worrying.
Sir Gus O’Donnell: I am afraid they were not the subject—what members of the Opposition do is not something that the Cabinet Secretary should look into. It is not relevant.
But these meetings were held—
Chair: Mr Flynn, would you let him answer please?Sir Gus O’Donnell: I really do not think that was within my context, because they were not Ministers of the Government and what they were up to was not something I should get into at all.
Chair: Final question, Mr Flynn.
Q<372> Paul Flynn: No, it is not a final question. I am not going to be silenced by you, Chairman; I have important things to raise. I have stayed silent throughout this meeting so far.
You state in the report—on the meeting held between Gould, Fox and Werritty, on 6 February, in Tel Aviv—that there was a general discussion of international affairs over a private dinner with senior Israelis. The UK ambassador was present…
Sir Gus O’Donnell: The important point here was that, when the Secretary of State had that meeting, he had an official with him—namely, in this case, the ambassador. That is very important, and I should stress that I would expect our ambassador in Israel to have contact with Mossad. That will be part of his job. It is totally natural, and I do not think that you should infer anything from that about the individual’s biases.
Gus O’Donnell was being examined on his Cabinet Office report into the Fox/Werritty affair, which contained the blatant lie that Gould and Werritty had only met on two occasions. In fact they met eight times that we know for certain, with Gould’s role being:
1) 8 September 2009 as Miliband’s Principal Private Secretary (omitted from O’Donnell report)
2) 16 June 2010 as Hague’s Principal Private Secretary (omitted from O’Donnell report)
3) A “social occasion” in summer 2010 as Ambassador designate to Israel with Gould, Fox and Werritty (omitted from O’Donnell report)
4) 1 September 2010 in London (only one September meeting in O’Donnell report)
5) 27 September 2010 in London (only one September meeting in O’Donnell report)
6) 4-6 February 2011 Herzilya Conference Israel (omitted from O’Donnell report)
7) 6 February 2011 Tel Aviv dinner with Mossad and Israeli military
8) 15 May 2011 “We believe in Israel” conference London (omitted from O’Donnell report)
You can find full details here.
As O’Donnell states, some of the Werritty/Gould meetings happened when Fox and the Tories were not even in power. My own Freedom of Information request for all correspondence between Adam Werritty and Matthew Gould was denied as it would “breach the cost limit”. What is the purpose of the Freedom of Information Act if something as simple as correspondence between two named individuals is refused on grounds of cost.
Astonishingly, the request was denied within one hour of being submitted, and after 11pm!!!!! In reply to a further Freedom of Information Act request for minutes of the meetings between Gould and Werritty while Gould was Private Secretary to Hague and Miliband, the FCO quite literally sent me two blank pages with everything redacted except the date!!!
Various MP’s, including Jeremy Corbyn and Caroline Lucas, dragged out the information bit by bit, like drawing teeth.
The media were by and large prepared to treat the Werritty/Fox scandal purely as sniggering homophobia. Only the Independent reported the actual story
Fox’s resignation enabled the media to bury the real scandal, which was Israeli government influence on both Red and Blue Tories.
I therefore request everybody who reads this to write to their MP and ask them to find the following information. Here is a draft you may utilise, but the more you customise it the better:
Dear ……..,
I am concerned about unresolved questions from the Adam Werritty affair, and I should be grateful if you could discover the following information for me.
1) On how many occasions did Cabinet Office official Matthew Gould meet with Mr Adam Werritty, either
a) in a personal capacity
b) in an official capacity2) Who else was present on each occasion?
3) What was discussed on each occasion?I have been informed of at least eight such meetings which have been collected together from parliamentary questions and FOIA requests. I am concerned that only two of these meetings was detailed in the Cabinet Secretary’s report into the Adam Werritty affair.
1) 8 September 2009 as Miliband’s Principal Private Secretary (omitted from O’Donnell report)
2) 16 June 2010 as Hague’s Principal Private Secretary (omitted from O’Donnell report)
3) A “social occasion” in summer 2010 as Ambassador designate to Israel with Gould, Fox and Werritty (omitted from O’Donnell report)
4) 1 September 2010 in London (only one September meeting in O’Donnell report)
5) 27 September 2010 in London (only one September meeting in O’Donnell report)
6) 4-6 February 2011 Herzilya Conference Israel (omitted from O’Donnell report)
7) 6 February 2011 Tel Aviv dinner with Mossad and Israeli military
8) 15 May 2011 “We believe in Israel” conference London (omitted from O’Donnell report)Can you discover why so many of these meetings were omitted from the O’Donnell report?
I should be most grateful for your assistance.
Yours faithfully,
You can write to your MP via this website , though I awlays prefer to send a physical letter to the House of Commons. I should be most grateful for your assistance in doing this, and in spreading this appeal around by social media.
It is to me disgusting that a politician so thoroughly disgraced as Liam Fox should be back in power. Answers were blanked on the actual purpose of the Werritty connection, and I think collectively we should try to do something about that.
“We don’t forget. We don’t forgive.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JoHwgoXJKQ
Ben.
I particularly like the intro music, epic in nature, to me it sounds like it could’ve come from the studio’s of Immediate music, or E.S. Posthumus.
Here is a prime example. ?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GusLypfx7OQ
Thanks for the introduction. Sounds like Mozart’s dark funeral dirge.
The presstitutes are now pumping out the line that the Munich shooter obtained his gun on the ‘dark web’ (cue the calls for censorship/control of the internet).
It’s comic book stuff, it really is.
That sounds quite credible, given the difficulty of otherwise obtaining a gun in Germany.
In any event, monitoring the dark web seems eminently sensible in these strange days of terrorism, subversion, anarchy directed at the innocent citizen. Indeed, I would expect the security services to pay special attention to it.
Rob.
As I’ve stated in here before, it would be quite easy for German security services, such as the BMD or the BFV, to make contact with vulnerable and easy to persuade individuals, who carry a chips on their shoulders in one form or another.
The befriending and encouraging process, leaves the individual feeling a important part of a group, and that he or she must carry out a important task for the group, the usual criteria is fufilled for them, weapons etc.
It is of course almost impossible to prove than a nations security services were involved in the event, as the group the patsy carried out the deed for doesn’t exist.
I know very little of the Dark web, however if there’s intellectual or physical gain to made from it, and I’m sure there must be, then security services around the world will be involved in it somehow.
Republicofscotland, the security services operate totally outside the law. No one questions why – in supposedly ‘democratic’ societies – this state of affairs is allowed to happen, particularly since these security service loons are all on tax payer’s money.
The name’s Psycho, Mega Psycho.
If it’s a horse race in California it may mean we get Trump for Xmas.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2016/president/us/general_election_trump_vs_clinton-5491.html
Nice attack: Cazeneuve FRENCH Minister of the Interior
denies he “harassed” a female police officer over report of the Nice lorry massacre.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-36879359
The policewoman, Sandra Bertin, was in charge of security cameras!!!!!!!
She said she had been told to report the presence of national police units, although she had not seen them.
Cazeneuve is prepared to sue her.
The game of subterfuge is afoot.
The President of France, Francois Hollande has expressed his “Full Confidence” in the Minister of the Interior Cazeneuve
French ministers were booed when they attended a ceremony in Nice to remember the victims.
President Francois Hollande said on Friday he had “full confidence” in Cazeneuve.
Last week, local authorities in Nice refused a request by French anti-terror police to destroy CCTV images of the attack.
The Paris prosecutor’s office said the request had been made to avoid the “uncontrolled dissemination” of images.
But officials in Nice responded by filing a legal document, arguing the footage could constitute evidence.
Yes, the the government wanted to destroy the evidence – of WHAT?
Other strange goings-on:
‘Richard Gutjahr, Same Guy That Filmed France Truck Attack, On Scene At German Mall Shooting’:
http://thomasdishaw.com/2016/07/richard-gutjahr-guy-filmed-france-truc k-attack-scene-german-mall-shooting/
Quite a ‘coincidence’!!
And of course there is the picture of the snow-white, pristine truck (albeit bullet studded); then on MOST of the pics, the truck is always out of focus, has an odd pink tinge, and is definitely discoloured on the front (because of these terrible (deliberately?) shots, the discolorations look black, but could be red.
No shots of anyone being ‘run over’, nor are any of the ‘bodies’ crushed (one would expect some to have been caught under the wheels) just an extremely fortuitous one of someone filming on the fringe, with a handful of people, at just the moment the truck comes into sight! Then he pans to a few bystanders and that’s it!.
Just another day in Germany. A Syrian refugee becomes involved in some form of argument and naturally enough produces a machete and murders the person he is arguing with.
He also injured 2 more people – it is not yet known whether he was testing the machete before the murder or whether he felt the need for more machete practice after the murder.
It’s all quite normal.
Nothing to see here…
In rural France, the sight of three “scantily dressed” pre-pubescent girls sent a Muslim fanatic into a jihadist rage, resulting in all three girls and their mother being stabbed, one left fighting for her life.
John McDonnell on today’s Marr show…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8QjhKl7dYE
Not quite the train crash that was Angela Eagle on last Sunday’s Marr show.
Marr & Co act like totally naive children: the trots and the commies are taking over British politics. Da, Da, Dah! (but believe me, these media whores know exactly what they’re doing)
I was hiding under the stairs to protect myself from ISIS, but now I’m going to build a big bunker in the garden so that I’m also protected from the trots and the commies who are coming to get us!
Da, Da, Dah!
At least you avoided exclamation marks.
In Europe, during the last seven days, there have been hundreds of violent criminal incidents, none of which gets reported as much as the example you cite.
In the week that Lee Rigby was murdered, there were two beheadings in London connected to criminal gangs. Once again, no high profile reporting.
Do you see where this is going..?
“but now I’m going to build a big bunker in the garden”
Do cover it with vines – looks like you need those extra litres.
You appear to put forward a peculiarly emotive justification for totalitarianism.
Given the expenditure of western blood and treasure in Afghanistan people have a legitimate interest in understanding the situation there. How else can western losses be evaluated, and how else can people form rational arguments either for or against any further proposed military adventurism.
Given the number of refugees welcomed into Europe then all citizens of Europe have an obligation to seek to understand the likely mindset that may exist in certain sections of the refugee population. How can you help people integrate if you do not understand any differences in thinking as between the host population and the newly arrived?
Launching vile ad hominem assaults against people who raise legitimate concerns is not likely to be conducive to the long term peaceful co-existence of disparate cultures.
Compare and contrast the ecumenical tone of the above with the hymn of hate against tolerance and respect of other creeds and faiths launched by the selfsame poster only yesterday:
“Really? As I understand it the UK is now home to a range of “faiths and beliefs” some of these “faiths and beliefs” extol the virtues of criminalizing homosexuality, the necessity of female genital mutilation, the concept of honor killings and the punishment of adultery by death.”
Call me weather-cock 🙂
It is somewhat saddening to observe that your manifest problems with the English language persist.
Both of the posts to which you obliquely refer are logically consistent and neither can be rationally described as either ecumenical or as a hymn of hate – but then rationality would not appear to be your forte. Perhaps that is evidence of intellectual incapacity or perhaps it is because reason is incompatible with smear tactics.
No doubt you will neglect to confirm which of the alternative hypothesis is applicable to you.
Talking of rationality, you were telling me Ronald Reagan’s economic advisor Paul Craig Roberts was some sort of Keynesian just yesterday, and managed to somehow translate his transparent enthusiasm for the methods of Pol Pot into a waffling half-baked pompous lecture about the Monroe Doctrine.
Jim – Another thing connected with rationality is the ability to distinguish between what is true and what is false.. So, for example
It is false to state that I told you (or anyone else) that Paul Craig Roberts is or was “some sort of Keynesian”
It is true that I told you (and anyone else who may read my comments) that Paul Craig Roberts was never a neo-con.
Don’t worry about my English, old chap – focus on substance and on justifying your puzzling changes of tack 🙂
I see that the present Mod holds a distinct dislike of free speech. Clark I suspect.
Yes, I noticed that your comment has been removed.
I did reply to you, in the ‘wine thread’ on the previous page. If interested…
https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2016/07/fox-gould-werritty-israel-please-write-mp/comment-page-5/#comment-615024
I estimate you would need around 45,000 grapes to produce 50 litres of wine. From a creeping vine, on your terrace pergola. You’re a bullshitter, Rob. And nobody makes wine like that anyway.
Yay, free speech!
In other news, for Fedup, in rural France, the sight of three “scantily dressed” pre-pubescent girls sent a Muslim fanatic into a jihadist rage, resulting in all three girls and their mother being stabbed, one left fighting for her life.
Well Said Fedup
never have I heard so much Hate speech Coming From the Establishment, as the Last two Years…Bad Times.
in agreeance, Fed up and Brian, there’s a bit of responsibility towards our grand children, whatever happens to us and if we do not respect humans for what they are, regardless of creed religion or colour, then we are not human.
Tomorrow, Norfolk County counil will consider, after a year of hummin’ and hawin’, whether they can manage to give 50, child refugees a home and support. I’m, ashamed at the lack of enthusiasm and support from the corrupt Tory council for causes that are clearly humane.
Shall join the debate, because underneath, we are all the same, humans!
I would do a lot better if I were the Head Moderator.
Only the loopies, loonies and liars would have cause for complaint.
Honest posters would rejoice.
Congratulations to Chris Froome and Team Sky – at last Murdoch has found a good way to spend some of his ill gotten gains.
Syrian refugee, 21, hacks PREGNANT woman to death with a machete and injures two others before hero BMW driver runs him over, in latest attack to shock Germany…
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3705823/Machete-wielding-attacker-kills-woman-injures-two-new-German-outrage.html
Operation Gladio2 is going well , I see.
Waiting for you, dear post I made at 1.22 on Matthew Gould’s current job and which foreign power it involves working, er, “with”. Posted it again having *ed the swearwords; still got modded.
@Alan – I’d be interested to hear more of your thoughts on the analogy with Gladio. Do you think there is a NATO angle?
Seems to me there is some very sophisticated agent use going on, but how finely-tuned it is, I’m not sure.
Riaz Khan Ahmadzai supposedly showed no sign of being a religious extremist until shortly before the attack.
As for Mohamed Bouhlel, he ate pork, drank alcohol, didn’t pray, and didn’t observe Ramadan – then…wham. As far as I know, no sessions on Jack Abramoff’s casino yacht, though – that was Mohammed Atta. Bouhlel is said to have been receiving treatment for mental problems. What treatment and from whom? Many French people aren’t stupid. Prime minister Manuel Valls was booed when he went to Nice, and then had the gall to slag the booers off. Meanwhile I doubt that François Hollande, who declared after the Nice attack that everything had been done to guard against such attacks but then sent soldiers to patrol the promenade, is seen as anything other than filth by most French people.
‘I’d be interested to hear more of your thoughts on the analogy with Gladio. Do you think there is a NATO angle?’
Just as surely as “The School of the Americas” exists. Like the Philippines is just another American Banana Republic controlling American interests in the far east. Why would they not be operating in Europe too? America, the control freak nation, protecting the might dollar by full spectrum dominance.
Oh yes, and why would this be happening now in France and Germany? Maybe because they refused to join Blair and Bush’s Coalition of the Stupid.
CIA Activities
https://www.hrw.org/topic/terrorism/counterterrorism/cia-activities
Covert Activities – CIA, FBI, NSA, NED
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/CIA/CovertActivities_CIA.html
“The greatest purveyor of violence on earth is my own government.” – Martin Luther King, Jr.
” …the CIA has overthrown functioning democracies in over 20 countries.” – John Stockwell, former CIA official and author
HTH
And I know this to be true because I was working in Africa at the time, listening to their lies on the radio:
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Stockwell/In_Search_Enemies.html
“But worse was to come. A few short months after the CIA’s shameful performance in Vietnam, of which I was part, I was assigned to a managerial position in the CIA’s covert Angola program. Under the leadership of the CIA director we lied to Congress and to the 40 Committee, which supervised the CIA’s Angola program. We entered into joint activities with South Africa. And we actively propagandized the American public, with cruel results-Americans, misguided by our agents’ propaganda, went to fight in Angola in suicidal circumstances. One died, leaving a widow and four children behind. Our secrecy was designed to keep the American public and press from knowing what we were doing-we fully expected an outcry should they find us out.”
But France does appear to be on board, they’re bombing fuck out Syria, targetting pro-government civilians. And what about the absurd EU-wide Russia boycott, did Germany have no say in that? Who, which countries or politicians proposed this in the first place? Scotland’s dairy farmers are losing something like £4 million a week in cheese exports (which of course in U-KOK accounting are ‘English’ exports) Scotlands food and drinks industry are losing easily £40 million every couple of days. Scotland’s government, at the highest level should be contacting Russian officials and political leaders, and unilaterally ending this, on a cash and carry basis, to restart, rebuild and strengthen this trade, immediately.
I’ll come back to this, because those who say the EU is accountable, open, democratic, blah blah blah, have a case to answer, in explaining how the EU response to a fascist coup with genocide of ethnic groups, in Ukraine with US and EU-nation state support and still with media cover for the real course of events, lead to sanctions against Russia? Who or what proposed or formulated this policy, was it voted on by the EU Parliament, or at heads of government level, was there a vote, what was the split, was a simple majority, or qualified majority needed and how did each member countries’ plenipotetiaries vote, if vote there was. It’s all very open, transparent etc.
After Gladio², comes EU², when the mask really slips.
Perhaps because France and Germany are the core members of the EU. Gladio was/is about dividing Europe and that appears still to be the strategy. I believe Brexit was also orchestrated by the Americans – which is why a large part of our media, which is run by the Americans, came out in favour, and that prominent journalists Johnson and Gove fronted the campaign.
Alan.
The hit man’s training school (allegedly ) has changed its name, to the Western Hemisphere Institute for Security Cooperation (WHINSEC), formerly known as the US Army School of the Americas.
It has also been claimed that (WHINSEC) has been used to train terrorists, often deployed in Latin America.
Here is more info on the alleged skullduggery of the school.
http://www.unwelcomeguests.net/Category:School_Of_The_Americas
Thanks RoS! I had this:
http://www.soaw.org/
My friend’s kid sister did 5 months in prison for protesting at Fort Benning with SOAW. She was only a teenager.
Le Monde have this as top page news at the moment…
http://www.lemonde.fr/police-justice/article/2016/07/24/nice-cazeneuve-porte-plainte-pour-diffamation-apres-les-accusations-d-une-policiere-municipale_4974023_1653578.html
I would venture that this is important, because the French media are even more lickspittle Establishment than the British media, and the French media are addressing the CCTV issue in Nice.
Sandra Bertin is a name to look out for. She was in charge of CCTV operations in Nice at the time of the attack.
Here’s how the Guardian are reporting it…
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jul/24/french-minister-sues-police-officer-over-nice-bastille-day-claims
It’s all a smokescreen to deflect from the fact that the French government demanded that the city of Nice should destroy all CCTV footage of the terror attack…
http://www.lefigaro.fr/actualite-france/2016/07/21/01016-20160721ARTFIG00225-attentat-de-nice-quand-la-justice-demande-a-la-mairie-de-detruire-24-heures-d-images.php
Repeat, Sandra Bertin is a name to look out for.
Here she is (in French) explaining how she was leaned upon to alter her report so that Cazeneuve can push the blame on to the police.
People in Nice are livid with the government – they booed Valls last week when he turned up for the memorial service. They wonder why this happened in the middle of an oppressive state of emergency and why the ‘response’ is to drop more bombs on Syria.
Let’s take a closer look at Matthew Gould’s current job. He’s not exactly the head of security at the Cabinet Office. He’s the head of the Office of Cyber Security and Information Assurance, which is part of the Cabinet Office. One could say he was seconded there by the interests he works for, or that he’s effectively doing a liaison job or a neocolonial one. But rather than play with words, let’s note that the organisation he runs, OCSIA, Britain’s cyber defence agency, works closely with its Israeli analogue. His Israeli opposite number said “Britain is one of the most advanced countries in the world on cyber defence”. Like fuck! Well why on shitting earth does it have to work so closely with a foreign power, then, and have a foreign country’s man running its own cyber defence agency? Some “defence”!
N_ Gould is British. That he represents the interests of Israel (rather than Britain) is all too evident as Paul Flynn suggested to the O’Donnell cover-up. He was one of three ambassadors to Israel who are Jewish (totally at odds with an ambassador’s duty to his own country’s citizens) at the time of the Palestinian genocide (2014), whereas any unbiased ambassador would have condemned such an act as strongly as Gould condemns the Holocaust. He set up a charity for Holocaust survivors according to his Wikipedia entry.
” He was one of three ambassadors to Israel who are Jewish (totally at odds with an ambassador’s duty to his own country’s citizens)”
______________________
What a curious statement.
Could you flesh out the bit in brackets, please?
Lots of countries have state religions
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_religion
If we were to follow Mr Goss’s rule sending a Methodist ambassador to Fiji would be totally at odds with an ambassador’s duty to his own country’s citizens.
I am sure those vetting Labour Party membership will be very interested in Mr Goss’s answer given Mr Corbyn’s words on the subject
“We celebrate the diversity of our Party as a place where sexist, racist, anti-Semitic, Islamophobic, homophobic, or other discriminatory or offensive abuse, has no place.”
http://www.jeremyforlabour.com/code_conduct
A Syrian refugee has blown himself up and injured 12 other people in a wine bar in Ansbach Germany.
He had a bomb in a backpack and had placed pieces of metal around the explosives device. German police are yet to determine whether he was just depressed and intended to commit suicide or whether he actually intended to harm other people.
On average just over 11,000 people commit suicide in Germany per year. This provides a significant data set to work with. Oh how I wonder how many people choose to commit suicide by way of a bomb strapped to their body and all packaged together with home made shrapnel.
On the other hand something close to 100% of suicide bombers have a modus operandi similar to that of the man in Ansbach.
What a pity that Inspector Clouseau was both French and a fictional character – I am sure he could have provided valuable assistance to the German police in analyzing such a complex case and determining motive.
He was a budding young doctor/engineer/poet who sadly suffered from depression and tragically took his own life. We should do more to help those with mental illness.
Germany is so far gone that is how it will be played.
So in your book it would be preferable for the authorities to make inflammatory public statements labelling the whole refugee population and all Muslims as potential Jihadi terrorists? How mature of you. As if the security services don’t know there’s a potential deadly problem and are trying their best to deal with it. Grow up for God’s sake.
Merkel wants 2 million more “refugees” by 2020. You deal with the problem by stopping this madness. Everyone could see what was going to happen except the virtue-signalling twits on the left.
Merkel is the only European statesman with a conscience. She towers over the rest of the moral pygmies.
Far from being a statesman Merkel is in fact deliberately creating all of the conditions necessary for civil war in a number of northern European states, and unending economic catastrophe throughout southern Europe.
No doubt this statement of fact will attract some glib ad-hominem response.
However if you disagree all you have to do is to provide one single example of where large muslim minority populations have ever integrated with the host population and to come forward with a plausible theory as to how southern Europe can ever economically recover absent a repudiation of their vassal status to Germany. (Oh look Portuguese banks are collapsing today – que sorprisa)
All my neighbour’s are Muslim, both next door neighbours and probably 80% of the rest of the locale. Everything’s hunky dory round here matey.
NO LINK TO ISLAMIC TERROR
just a SYRIAN nutter?
http://www.euronews.com/2016/07/25/german-machete-attack-no-link-to-terrorism-police
A 21-year-old Syrian refugee was arrested after killing a woman with a machete and injuring two other people in the southern German city of Reutlingen on Sunday, but the attack had no apparent connection to terrorism, police said.
Well that’s quite comforting.
Really? Fortunately I do not know where you live, but you sound British to me.
If this is a correct assumption then presumably you consider the launching of an illegal war for no known reason on Iraq, fighting an unwinnable war in Afghanistan, having bomb attacks launched on the London Transport system, multiple examples of young girls being sexually abused by organized gangs, and a soldier having his head hacked off in the street to constitute a situation that is “hunky dory”
Or maybe you live in the Cayman Islands and just rely on British state propaganda for your access to information.
Fortunately? Why fortunately? I’ve told you my situation, yes I live in the UK, everything’s pretty ok round my way thanks. Sorry if that doesn’t fit with your raging racist stereotypes but there you go.
And what is your solution to the problem of displaced, bombed, and traumatised refugees, Anon.
How many out of 1.2 million refugees that have entered Germany up to now, do you think have had traumatic experiences that made them flee their country? suffer humiliation, near drowning and financial hardship on the way to Europe, and who now require some serious time to heal their wounds?
How many of them are likely to need counselling? with our very own mental health services in total disarray this country could not prevent attacks from unstable and seriously traumatised people.
Anon will now tell us how to stop refugees from leaving their rubble heaps seeking a life somewhere else. Go for it….
Necvermind – Any solution should be rooted in respect for the law.
The origin of these refugees should be identified. All those coming from countries which would not entitle them to claim asylum should be deported back to their countries of origin.
With regard to genuine refugees it is far more cost effective to provide assistance in the nearest safe space from the area they are fleeing from. It is estimated that it costs only one tenth of the cost compared to the cost of offering assistance in Europe. This means you can help 10 times as many people.
The EU, and Germany specifically, should tell the US that it is no longer prepared to bear the costs associated with their desire to destabilize the MENA area. ISIS should be targeted and destroyed – If you are not prepared to do that yourself then you need to work with Iran, Russia and the Kurds.
Once there is peace in Syria then massive aid should be provided to rebuild the country and all Syrian refugees returned to Syria.
Contemporaneously it should be made clear that no-one will tolerate Saudi funding of Madrasses extolling a Wahabbist ideology. All exporters of Wahabbism will be hunted down and killed.
That none of this will happen leaves people free to persist will hollow virtue signalling and other people free to be killed whether that be by the ax, the knife, the truck or the bomb.
It would be better for the authorities to stop lying and to start obeying the laws of the countries that they are supposed to be serving.
State sponsorship of lying lawlessness is not likely to lead to any sustainable solutions.
You obviously have this afternoon off, Loony. But surely you must be able to find better things to do than insulting people on here?
I’ve been to Ansbach (many years ago, when it was still West Germany) It is a major base for US military – nowhere else in my time did I see such an ostentatious military presence, with large convoys of troops parading through the town on a daily basis and many servicemen wandering the streets.
I wonder if our ‘suicide’ bomber might have been in some way related to that.
Last week a 17 year old (or older) Afghan (or Pakistani) asylum seeker seriously injured 5 people in an ax attack on a train in Germany. He was shot dead by Police when he charged toward them wielding the ax. In a message written prior to the attack he opined:
“I will fight to the death, if Allah permits. I will slaughter you with this knife and sever your necks with an ax, if Allah permits”
Naturally this has prompted outrage in Germany with a German MP criticizing police by way of twitter for using lethal force. Why, the MP asked, “could the attacker not have been incapacitated without killing him????Questions!”
Instantly the German police sprang into action. with the Bavarian Criminal Police Office launching an investigation to determine if police were justified in shooting this jihadist.
Someone needs to be held to account for these actions and it is good to see pressure mounting on the Police. What gives Germans the right to defend themselves from ax wielding lunatics. Surely being chopped up is a small price to pay in the cause of humanitarian virtue signalling. How many more refugees will want to come to Germany once they realize that the Police will shoot them down like dogs for such trivial offences as attacking people with an ax.
German police arrested a 16-year-old Afghan youth on Sunday on suspicion of a connection to the killing of nine people by an 18-year-old gunman in Munich, authorities said.
The youth was under investigation for possibly having failed to report the plans of the gunman, who later shot himself, and may have played a role in a Facebook posting that invited people to the scene of the shooting, a police statement said.
“There is a suspicion that the 16-year-old is a possible tacit accomplice to (Friday’s) attack,” it said. Police earlier said the gunman was a deranged Iranian-German who was fixated with mass killings but not inspired by Islamist militancy.
http://www.france24.com/en/20160724-germany-police-arrest-accomplice-afghan-youth-role-munich-shooting
I see after 24 hours have passed,
France 24 still have not reported that the French Minister of the the Interior
has threatened to sue woman police officer Sandra Bertin, who was in overal charge of the CCTV
regarding her claiming he bullied her to falsify her report!!!
Why would this not be newsworthy to France 24 ?????
woman police officer Interior has threatened
Would anybody care to have a go at defining the tern “Lone Wolf”
To me it seems somewhat over used by the Establishment.
Certainly: A “Lone Wolf” is a terrorist who happens to be white and/or a right-wing nut-job.
Especially when, in the vast majority of cases, they are ‘Known Wolves’.
Then there are the Lone Grey Wolves
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey_Wolves_(organization)
Turkey -very dangerous people.
None of this can be true.
The shootings in Munich were carried out 5 years to the day after the massacre in Norway perpetrated by Anders Brevik. This is obviously a “tribute massacre” carried out by right wing European racial supremacists. The corrupt ans racist media are muddying the waters and making it difficult for ordinary people to confront the evil that dwells within them.
Was Richard Gutjahr there to document the event? Perhaps he’s in the doghouse at the moment.
Islamaphobic Theresa May is off to Northern Ireland today, for he first visitation since being crowned Prime Minister of the United Kingdom
I wonder if the good people of Northern Ireland will quiz her on her Islamaphobia,
especially in the light of the last fortnight of terror in Europe?
It is heartening to see that German Police are trying to educate themselves with regard to the epidemic of the senseless slaying of young men who merely want to enjoy themselves with an ax.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzaZTEc0p7Q
The kind of techniques referred to in this video are surely a more appropriate way forward.
See this article by the Canary on UK government infiltration of radical groups in Northern Ireland:-
http://www.thecanary.co/2016/07/23/restricted-document-reveals-british-covert-support-paramilitary-terror/
A quote from this article:-
“Many FRU [Force Research Unit] members not only infiltrated the IRA, the Provisional IRA (PIRA) and the Ulster Defence Association (UDA), but were complicit in dreadful acts of violence by these paramilitary forces.”
Not to deny or condone the reality described Franz (and I’m of Irish stock myself, proudly), but I sort of think ‘what do you expect?’ when you’re engaging in extreme paramilitary violence against the state. If the follow-up to the peace agreement had been a return to British/Protestant brutal domination of the Catholics in Northern Ireland then I’d definitely be more interested in this filthy and brutal history.
So it’s OK if HMG does it?
But it is ‘chilling’ and disgraceful if there is even a suspicion that the Russians are behind a killing.
Read the article. It concerns the deaths of hundreds of innocent people in Ireland at the hands of terrorists working for the British government. Acts of terrorism, moreover, designed to breed hatred and suspicion and thus more terrorism. And more crimes to add to 800 years of them.
This is moral cesspit that must be cleaned out. So far, over the years, we have seen successive attempts to obfuscate and whitewash these crimes. And you ask “what do you expect?”
The answer is that we expect honesty, openness and integrity from all branches of the government.
The Bloody Sunday enquiry was a pretty awesome ‘coming to terms’ with reality in my book. A total state acknowledgement of culpability. Late, but they got there in the end. And who was the main man in securing the peace agreement? Your man the war-mongering ogre in chief Tony Blair.
Moves are afoot by the relatives of those murdered by the paras to see those ***** finally see justice. Though not yet identified, they are now forever seen in the history books as murderers. Hopefully they’ll see some jail time before they die.
The chances of any of Putins henchmen ever being brought to justice, or any state acknowledgement of their crimes is about zero. And who is being murdered? Journalists and opposition politicians. He’s an ultra-nationalist thug. Get real.
Whilst the Germans are busy agonizing over the correct treatment for ax wielding jihadis the German government is busily advancing plans for the the Bundeswehr to declare Russia an official enemy of Germany.
This has terrified the Russians and, and as this video clip demonstrates, are they are about to sue for peace.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQm8L8d8uDc
There is probably something wrong with the English translation as in English it would appear that the Russians are threatening to kill very large numbers of people.
I am a little unsure of the reasoning behind the FRENCH deciding to hole up people travelling between the United Kingdom and France vis the Calais-Dover ferry.
I understand that France has been in a National State of Emergency for 20 months now.
I understand that the last few terror incidents have happened in South East France, Belgium and Southern Germany.
but most of the people who have committed these deeds are either people born in France, Belgium or Germany
or are immigrants coming from the Muslim world of North Africa or the Middle East.
So what is the raison d’être of the hyped up border security between Dover and Calais,
I’m only asking, no doubt they have intelligence on something?
“BBC@
A failed Syrian asylum seeker has blown himself up and injured 12 other people with a backpack bomb near a festival in the south German town of Ansbach.
The 27-year-old man, who faced deportation to Bulgaria, detonated the device after being refused entry to the music festival, Bavarian officials say.
It seems unlikely that this person blew himself up because he was refused entry to a music venue.
More likely he did not want to go to Bulgaria.
However, even that is thin.
Bulgaria is in the European Empire, these days, surely being made to go to Bulgaria would be better than blowing yourself up.
But if you were unhappy about being sent to Bulgaria, why would you need to wear a suicide belt and blow other people up with you?
The idiot could have just hung himself, that would have stopped him being removed from Germany to Bulgaria and it would not have killed /maimed / inconvenienced other innocent people.
There is much more to this than the mere threat of being returned to Bulgaria.
Now what sort of person uses a suicide belt?
It will more likely be as a result of action in opposition to the French govt labour reforms. This truth cannot be mentioned in our press.
“This has terrified the Russians”, Loony?
That’s a surprising statement when set against the noise on here from your idealogical friends about Mr Putin being the supreme geo-strategical master capable of running rings round the stupid West and about the technological supremacy of Russian military hardware (to give only two examples).
Would you care to comment on that, Loony?
“Would you care to comment on that, Loony?”
Sees Loony as easy target – Noted! Misogynist on the loose!
Not all statements are intended to be read literally. The statement you quote needs to be read in conjunction with the video link.
I have never offered any view as to the geo-strategic capabilities of Putin and have similarly offered no analysis of the technological capabilities of the Russian military.
Once again you appear interested in things I have not said rather than things I have said. The salient point in the post you refer to is that the German government is moving closer to declaring Russia an official enemy of Germany. Given history and given current tensions many people (especially those people interested in remaining alive) may view such developments with alarm.
Given that much of German policy is given over to a humanitarian agenda it is also interesting to note that Germany is allowing itself to be used as an agent in the attempt to provoke a major war – a war that Germany cannot possibly hope to benefit from.
Maybe such matters are too difficult for you to contemplate and you find it easier to make responses to the imagined views of others. No doubt a psychiatrist would consider you to be an interesting case study.
TURKEY -multiple coups?
The Daily Express
With fears rebels could be about to try to overthrow the government for a second time, which is likely to result in a Turkish civil war, troops have moved into neighbouring Cyprus and are preparing a rescue mission to save stranded Britons.
Defence chiefs have drawn up emergency plans and fully armed soldiers, together with members of the Special Forces Support Group, are ready to fly into areas popular with tourists and help families get home safely.
Hundreds of jets, helicopters and other aircraft will be drafted in to help the estimated 50,000 Brits flee the danger.
The excuse for the mass arrests and the police state measures that followed the Reichstag Fire was, the new German government said, that the fire was a signal for a mass Communist uprising throughout the country;
The new German govt certainly milked the Reichstag fire – started, as is generally acknowledged by historians, by a lone Dutch nutter with a Communist background for all it was worth.
Not a “Lone Wolf” yet again?
That’s the judgement of most reputable historians, yes.
But, as you know, there are always historians who wheel out revisionist versions of various events in an attempt to break into the major league.
It is generally safer to smile indulgently and pass by.
An “unnamed defense source” told the Daily Star on Sunday that TURKEY “is on the brink.”
now why would an unnamed defence source bother talking to the Daily star, only people of limited intelligence would buy it.
https://www.rt.com/uk/353114-sas-turkey-evacuation-britons/
BRITISH special forces are ready to rescue UK citizens in Turkey in the event of a second coup attempt. The news comes as Amnesty International reports credible evidence of the rape and abuse of detained coup soldiers as part of the government crackdown.
The SAS, as well as the Special Forces Support Group (SFSG), are reportedly ready to deploy from RAF Akrotiri in Cyprus should the need arise.
If any of this twaddle is true
“hundreds of jets” what hundreds of U.K. military jets, I don’t think so.
We scrapped the jump-jets and do not have jets to go on the two new full-sized aircraft carriers, yet.
Why doesn’t the U.K. government tell U.K. holiday makers to
“GET THE FUCK OUT OF TURKEY”
The former commander of NATO forces in Afghanistan, retired US Army General John F. Campbell, was the mastermind behind the failed military coup in TURKEY, the Yeni Safak daily has reported, citing sources close to investigation.
https://www.rt.com/news/353126-campbell-nato-coup-turkey/
Well no idea if there is any truth of this
but it will certainly put the cat among the pigeons.
The Russians conveniently hacked it seems the DNC’s e-mails, and released them to help elect The Donald.
Should be some quandary for Craig to deal with.
Aint it funny how it is always the Russians. Here is a brief run through:
April 2014 The New York Times identifies Edward Snowden as being “Putin;s Useful Idiot”
December 2015 The National Review identifies Donald Trump as being “Putin’s Useful Idiot”
At various points throughout 2015 The Guardian identifies Alexis Tsipras, Jeremy Corbyn and Jean Clause Juncker as being “Putin;s Useful Idiot(s)”
In a particularly targeted article in July 2015 Politico identifies everyone as being “Putin’s Useful Idiot”
If in doubt blame Putin – It must be true since it is in so many western publications.
It seems to me that if you call someone “Putin’s useful idiot” you are criticising that someone rather than blaming Puti (as you put it).
Gamma minus for coherency and logic, I’m afraid.
The inference is that the person in question is engaging in acts of idiocy as a consequence of being unwittingly manipulated by the nefarious Putin. Alternatively the reader is supposed to draw the inference that the omnipotent and evil Putin is constantly and unerringly exploiting to his own advantage the flaws and weaknesses of others.
With your level of comprehension it is little wonder that your view of the world lacks any grounding in observable reality.
That is only your inference, I’m afraid. And as such, although convenient for your argument, not very convincing.
Thee is no evidence that “the Russians” had anything to do with it. Hillary is quite capable of electing (even) Trump if left alone. And these emails show how.
In recent days she has not only nominated Kaine, who adds nothing, to her ticket, she has also rewarded Debbie Watsername by appointing her head of her campaign, thereby confirming the damning emails’ authenticity.
Are you nuts? No-one is interested in evidence. The Russians are both mad and bad (and in the end cowards). What more do you need to know?
Hillary deserves to be elected because she is a woman. Anyone that argues otherwise is both a vile sexist and one of Putin’s useful idiots.
You’re right. Please accept my apologies. No abuse was intended. Any misogyny was accidental. I did not throw the brick through the window. Forgive any suggestions of non violent extremism in my previous posts. Now may I vote in the election?
As some have stated in here to their credit, it would appear that, Sandra Bertin, the woman in charge of video surveillance in Nice on July 14th, had been told what to write in her report, by government officials.
Bertin, claims, (and I can’t thing of a logical reason why she’d lie about such matters) she was told to mention the prescence of police, she had not seen. Taking into account that she monitored the surveillance cameras, it would seem highly unlikely that Bertin, hadn’t noticed the police in question.
Just why were no national police guarding the entrance to the beach front promenade? More importantly why would (if the allegation is true) the French government coerce Bertin, into changing her report?
Unexplained anomalies are beginning to creep into the Nice event, which may lead to doubts, over who was really behind Mohamed Lahouaiej Bouhels actions.
Add to the above, that French Interior minister Bernard Cazeneuve, has publicly stated that the French security services, cannot find anything to link Bouhlel to ISIS, apart from a unverified claim.
“Just why were no national police guarding the entrance to the beach front promenade?”
It has been reported (can’t remember where) that the police were withdrawn a couple of hours before the incident.
“French authorities withdrew police vans blocking off the promenade in Nice just hours before a 19-ton truck crushed at least 84 people to death in an Islamist terrorist attack, it emerged last night”.
“The disclosure raises serious questions over the security for the 30,000 people who had gathered on the Promenade des Anglais for the Bastille Day fireworks.”
“Just 60 officers were on duty, despite France being on heightened alert and concern that Nice was a likely target for attack because of the large number of jihadists from the city who had already travelled to Syria.”
“Four police vans that had blocked off the Promenade des Anglais to protect a military parade earlier in the day were removed before the attack on Thursday, according to eyewitnesses.”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/17/nice-terror-attack-police-vans-blocking-promenade-withdrawn-hour/
It does leave a huge question mark over, as to why they were withdrawn. Seen from another perspective, it could add doubt, to the veracity surrounding, the event, if one were inclined to think that way.
So the German-Iranian shooter, Ali Sonboly, was a loner, who had psychological problems according to German authorities, we’ve heard that description of assailants by authorities on these kinds of events, quite regularly over the last few years, coincidence? Or not?
Other evidence by the German authorities include, the now mainstay, of web history, which showed young Mr Sonboly, had research previous types of attacks. A manifesto showing that the 18 year old, was planning an attack was found in his bedroom. A manifesto? Isn’t that abit sophisticated for young man with (alleged) mental health problems?
Also just how did the young man manage to obtain a sophisticated and modern hand gun, in the shape of Glock 17. It also interesting to note that Robert Heimberger, Bavaria’s top official, has said that the weapon used, had been a prop gun that had been reactivated, by the 18 year old. Just how would a psychologically damaged 18 year old know where to get the parts to reactivate a Glock 17? and then, know how to actually go about it?
Interestingly the Glock 17 hand gun, is used by the French police and security services.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Service_pistol
It would also seem that Germany may be moving in the same direction as France, with the German Interior minister calling for the “Bundeswehr” the military to be deployed, in the event of another “attack.”
Alas another event has already taken place in Germany, Ansbach, it opens the door to many more questions, such as where would a failed asylum seeker get his hands on explosives? And why kill yourself because you’re set on deportation to Bulgaria, a country that joined the EU in 2007?
Germany appears to be moving in the same direction as France, one where fear is instilled in its citizens, in order to ellicit, the reply of protect us. Little do they realise, that in doing so their freedoms will be deeply impinged in the long run.
” Robert Heimberger, Bavaria’s top official, has said that the weapon used, had been a prop gun that had been reactivated, by the 18 year old ”
Typical distortion of facts to suit conspiracy theory. Heimberger, head of Bavaria’s criminal police, said the gun had been reactivated but no mention of the shooter having done it himself.
“Typical distortion of facts to suit conspiracy theory.”
__________
Mr Heimberger also said it was “likely” the gun was purchased on the darknet, that in my opinion, isn’t a fact. Does that make Mr Heimberger a consprialoon? Or does his supposition like mine seem feasible?
On the otherhand Mr Heimberger’s assertion of “likely” leaves the door open to a wide range of options as to where the Glock 17 actually came from, and who provided the weapon.
So one hand we have psychologically damage 18 year old, (allegedly ) who had the ability, to buy a weapon activated or not, on the dark web, and create a manifesto, on how to conduct a mass killing from his bedroom at his parents house.
And on the other hand we have video footage from a unknown source, of the shootings outside MacDonalds, and photos by a journalist who just happened to film the Nice event. Finally we have the “likely” assertion that the Glock 17, came from the dark web,.
Let’s say a young person could get hold of a de-activated gun from a theatre group.
Would not the theatre group be obligued to inform the pigs?
Let’s say this young person had obtained the engineering skill to re-activeate this piece ( rather unlikely0
but how did he get hold of hundreds of bullets?
It seems most likely to me that he obtained the gun and ammo from someone else.
So that someone else is in the frame for a long stretch.
Michael, I’m no expert on firearms but the Glock 17 hand gun only holds 17 rounds, and according to this report, the 18 year old man had 300 rounds in his rucksack, something that when found would have added to the shock factor, as realistically it would’ve been very difficult to reload and shoot all of those bullets, before a armed confrontation occured.
The young man has been described as shy, and quiet, he was also the vicitm in two thefts, he wasn’t known to the authorities, and no links to terrorism have been found so far. However he was depressed and vulnerable (allegedly).
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/munich-mass-shooting-shopping-centre-mcdonalds-gunman-ali-david-sonboly-depression-shy-germany-a7152501.html
The Glock 17 is a favourite of security services around the globe.
“Designed for professionals, the GLOCK 17, in 9×19, is the most widely used law enforcement pistol worldwide. Because of its unsurpassed reliability, above-average magazine capacity of 17 rounds in the standard magazine, and its low weight, it is trusted by law enforcement officers around the globe. With our revolutionary “Safe Action” trigger system, the G17 9×19 pistol is safe, easy, and quick-just what you need in high-pressure situations.”
https://us.glock.com/products/model/g17
ROS
one could “imagine” that this young person is a Patsie who did not fire a shot.
Have they done tests on his fingers yet for gunpowder residue?
How many shots were fired from the Glock they “found” with him?
Any other DNA on that GLOCK?
If he had fired say 100 shots, he would be covered in residue, was this the case.?
Was he supposed to have shot anyone up close, was he covered in blood and human residue?
Where were the 300 bullets kept in, his duffle bag
This is La La Land.
Michael.
I’m certainly not claiming that the young man did or did not fire live ammo, the video footage outside MacDonalds, shows that the firing of a weapon did happen.
The circumstances leading up to the shooting, are the crux of the matter, for instance does the 18 year old fit the profiles (often a loner, depressed, psychology unstable, disgruntled at the West etc) we’ve seen in other events, events that contain unanswered anomalies which instil doubt.
These factors reported by the German authorities are a common thread running through the recent events.
It is very difficult to say with any certainty what actually took place before the young man began firing the weapon. Often the only way to get a glimpse, into this is to read articles and reports, or footage, which can contain small or sometimes large pieces of information, that get you thinking.
In this day and age, where any event can be captured on a mobile device, the need to be alert to subterfuge, is greater than ever.
Replying actually to RoS. Another common factor is prescribed psychotropic drugs.
People are depressed because the world is so screwed-up by those who rule us, and not by accident, it’s an entirely normal reaction, I’d say of far more concern are those who aren’t up in arms and outraged to the point of desperate acts, wtf is wrong with them?
TonyM.
Apathy Tony would be my first answer, and a strong feeling of desensitisation.
We are bombarded hourly with news, news that in the most part, is depressing, war, drugs, mass murder, etc. Those kind of headlines pumped into our homes on a daily basis, leave some of us, with the feeling of despair, and hopelessness. That in turn, pushes those people onto medication, mainly antedepressants.
The percentage of American’s on antedepressants (1999-2012) has nearly doubled, and I’d wouldn’t be surprised if are rise in the use of antedepressants has occured around the world.
http://www.madinamerica.com/2015/11/percentage-of-americans-on-antidepressants-nearly-doubles/
I wonder if anyone else, like me, has paid £25 as a Labour supporter and not received any acknowledgement. I am also a member of the Labour Party, having re-joined recently, and for that I did receive an acknowledgement email saying my card and other information should be with me shortly. There ought to have been an automatic response in this day and age. I left this comment about a week ago.
https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2016/07/fox-gould-werritty-israel-please-write-mp/comment-page-2/#comment-613967
Yes John. My partner was already a lifetime member but has not received a proper receipt or any confirmation of her continued membership. I received one email hours after applying to register under the £25 scheme but no cash has been taken and no receipt given, and no order number or transaction confirmation has been received, in violation of very basic online transaction regulations. The NEC is de facto acting unlawfully and indeed lack of a receipt or transaction number could be construed as fraud. I don’t actually think its intention is to be fraudulent in a financial sense (except for upping the fee in violation of its previous rules) but all the same, this smacks of staggeringly patronising attitudes.
There has been speculation about the boxes one is meant to fill in regarding twitter and facebook accounts. It might well be unlawful to demand info on these accounts, and several people I know appear to have been rejected because they did not declare social media accounts. What if you simply do not have a twittier or facebook account? This is of course a serious breach of data privacy anyway. All that is required is a statement confirming you wish to join the Labour Party and agree with its aims. Anything else is tantamount to a gross breach of private information, Stasi-style.
This is worrying. The legacy of Stalin is alive and well and is no longer a facet of the former Soviet Union. Thanks Leonard for letting me know I am not alone.
What you say about the legality is probably right. I never saw anything about Facebook and Twitter accounts on my application but it did ask for too much unnecessary detail. As someone who started many years ago in the Labour Party Young Socialists I find it an affront to be asking me why I want to rejoin.
I could have gone on at length. I believe in a good NHS free at the point of access and delivery – not a semi-privatised health service where profit is the driving force. I believe in a free education system – not graduates coming out of university more than £30,000 in debt, I believe in essential services and utilities being in public ownership, and I would like to see the imbalance between the super-rich and very poor rectified. I would like to see powerful trades unions to protect workers’ rights – not zero-hours employment where a worker does not know from one day to the next if he will have work or not. Basic ideals, perhaps, but we used have them. Then along came war-criminal and -monger Blair.
I concur John. The Twitter and Facebook account info appears for those who weren’t previous members and who applied for the 48 hour one-off registration. I did see those boxes and elected not to fill them in, not because I have social media comments damaging to the NEC (I don’t) but because I object to giving more info than is necessary. The media allows itself to be free to report on intimidation, so-called, but has ignored fundamental questions about the way the NEC is conducting its membership rules.
I find it extraordinary that these appalling twists in proper procedures have gone unquestioned so I’m very glad you brought this subject up. I have emailed the NEC asking them why they have not even acknowledged my application and have received no reply. I’m not joining a golf club!
There is little doubt that the NEC do not actually want more members because they are assuming that 90% of new applicants will be voting for Corbyn. They are doing everything they can to subvert proper procedures. If they had allowed the ridiculous 48 hrs to be extended to two weeks they know perfectly well that perhaps another 300,000 to 500,000 further applications would have been received. They are trying to restrict numbers, praying that the Corbyn vote will be contained. It is utterly transparent, as is the ludicrous restriction on CLP meetings. I attended a local meeting a few days ago (in violation of the NEC’s rule) and it was conducted with decorum and respect. Not one person was seen to be aggressive or bullying. I wish more here would comment on this Kafakaesque abuse of democracy because this is one issue that really can be addressed through mutual support. I appeal to subscribers here who value decent democracy to make their views known to the NEC, and I would say they same for any political party that is bending the rules.
Quite right. NEC decisions, without the presence of the leader of the party, in opposition to the leader of the party, are amazing but I think as Alan below has shown they haven’t gone unchallenged and a legal case is being made against this political opportunism. Some in the party have a lot to lose. So just you and me and your partner waiting for confirmation that we have the right to vote. I thought there might be others.
I winder why you object to the word “likely” in Mr Heimberger’s statement?
Mr Goss
“The legacy of Stalin is alive and well and is no longer a facet of the former Soviet Union.”
______________________
And you – judging from your posts on here over the years – certainly know your stuff when it comes to Stalinist tactics.
Now look here Noddy, because you did not agree with my Socialist opinions you tried to label me a Stalinist, which only you in your tiny mind really believed (if indeed you did). You used the old tactic of if you said something often enough it might stick. Quite clearly you had no idea of what Stalinism was then. And even now when it has been showed to you through the executive of the Labour Party what opportunist tactics involve even if there was a vote. Without the issuer of diktats, Tony Blair, there is more than one dictator today, unless someone would like to label Iain McNicol a dictator, and I would not do that.
“And you – judging from your posts on here over the years – certainly know your stuff when it comes to Stalinist tactics.”
I particularly liked the way Stalin kept a straight face when the Yanks told him about their “secret new weapon”, he having known about it since the Manhattan Project began.
Alan
I bet Stalin shat his pants when he was first informed of the success of the Manhattan project.
A little like when the Nazis invaded the USSR in 1941. You should read the text of his broadcast to the Russians , which hit the airwaves a mere 11 days after the first day of the invasion. Precious!
Maybe it’s because of this legal action being taken against them?
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/25/labour-party-members-abuse-leadership-vote-ian-mcnicol
Labour is being sued by a group of its members over the decision to exclude 130,000 people who joined the party since January from being able to vote in its leadership contest.
Harrison Grant, a London law firm, issued proceedings against Labour and its general secretary, Iain McNicol, on behalf of the members, who are crowdfunding to pay for their action.
Lord Ashdown launches More Tory Lite United UK
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/24/lord-ashdown-launches-new-political-movement-to-stop-british-pol/
Meanwhile, Sarah Champion MP is first to unresign and request her reinstatement to Labour Shadow Front Bench, which I understand Jeremy Corbyn has graciously accepted.
Let’s have a few more, then perhaps we can have a vote of re-confidence.
Sarah Champion is an interesting exception in the PLP. She wholeheartedly accepted all criticisms of Rotherham Council’s child protection failures (a long running subject) and appeared to be very circumspect. Why she resigned because of Corbyn seems to be unconnected with that scandal, but I wonder whether her “unresigning” now is connected with trying to gain grass roots support after being associated with, but not the cause of, the child protection scandal, and having lost support from those in her constituency who support neither her nor Corbyn
I think she needs to explain fully why she is unresigning.
Just a clarification of the previous post. If you resign because you think your leader cannot lead and is no good, then “un-resign”, there are only two reasons: Either you suddenly think your leader is not useless after all, or something has happened in your own career that makes it expedient for you to turn your views on a sixpence.
Let’s have a vote on whether Seema Malhotra is (a) Ugly and (b) a nasty piece of work.
Btw, should we be giving full credit to Andy Burnham for not jumping on the coup wagon? Or was that just tactical in the course of his bid for the Mayor’s election in Manchester?
The large number of comment deletions almost routinely, the tolerated to the point of being over-indulged trolls new and old, lead me to suspect all it is not as it seems with this site. Whatever happened to the several long poorly formatted, probably pasted-in, but original comments by a Welsh UKIPper anti-muslim nostalgic GEOFFREY (in capitals) DOUBLE-BARRELLED, and the replies to them? It’s all very mysterious.
Maybe the Mods have given him
“both barrels”
Oh what a tangled web we weave when Germans conspire to deceive.
The German Interior Minister, Thomas de Maiziere, denied that the recent spate of attacks in Germany was connected to the German refugee policy and suggested “psychiatric liability” as a possible explanation for these attacks.
Contemporaneously with de Maiziere sharing these thoughts the Bavarian Interior Minister, Joachim Herrmann, was confirming that the suicide bomber in Ansbach had pledged loyalty to the Islamic State via a video message and that he had other bomb making materials and equipment in his apartment.
@Nevermind
They ceased being refugees (if they were in the first place) when they left the first safe country they reached. They then became economic migrants.
I doubt very many of them at all are “traumatised”, just as I doubt many are from where they claim to be from. Columns of fighting age young men advancing on Europe have heard from your dipshit Merkel that they are free to settle in Europe. And guess what? If you issue an open invite to the world’s poor to settle here, then they will keep on coming. Million after million after million. Virtually all young men, destined to be jobless and on benefits, alienated and sexually frustrated, ripe for radicalization.
By supporting this insane policy you are responsible every time a migrant drowns en route to Europe. When inevitably people start to vote for far-right parties, you are responsible for it. You are responsible for these now daily jihadist attacks. You and your Mutti are a fucking threat to Europe.
@Nevermind
“How many of them are likely to need counselling? with our very own mental health services in total disarray this country could not prevent attacks from unstable and seriously traumatised people.”
The NHS doesnt exist to provide mental health services to the entire fucking world. What are we supposed to do with your policy of allowing everyone in the world to come and settle here? Increase the NHS budget to £74 trillion? That if we don’t you’ll blame “Tory cuts” every time a migrant detonates himself?
The NHS would likely collapse if it weren’t for all the foreign born staff that are employed in it. Have you been in a hospital lately and why are your concerns for the mental health treatment capacity of the NHS so apparent? Good luck with your treatment.
Indeed, there is a lot of foreign-born staff in the NHS. Are you so thick that you can’t see the actual point I was making, that the NHS doesn’t exist to treat the entire world?
No and it shouldn’t be there to fix basket cases with a chip on their shoulder who thinks the world and his brother are queuing up to take advantage of the precious NHS . It’s creaking because of sneaky privatisation and lack of funding, nothing at all to do with hordes of invaders.
Enormous profits are being funneled, through the NHS, to private corporations and tug companies.
And then there are the “Public Private Partnerships” which are scams to give lenders and banks enormous profits. At a time when Depression looms and negative interest rates are spreading rapidly the looting of taxes by corporate friends of politicians is truly obscene.
The least of the NHS’s problems is that it treats sick immigrants. Indeed that is one of the purposes it has always been meant to serve.
This may fill in a few gaps on the international dimensions of current PLP/Progress/New Labour tragi-comic effort — tearful Ruth Smeeth et al — to remove Jeremy Corbyn:
https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2016/07/22/smee-j22.html
It is bloody obvious the United Kingdom can not take many more immigrants, unless they go to SCOTLAND.
England density 407/square k
Wales 148/square k
N.Ireland 131/square k
Scotland 67/square k
Finally France 24 has found something it is happy to report about the kerfuffle between the woman police officer in charge of the CCTV cameras and the well respected Minister of the Interior.
“The inconsistencies in Sandra Bertin’s version of events,” read the headline of a story on French magazine Nouvel Observateur’s website on Monday afternoon. “Nice: No, the policewoman did not deal with a member of Cazeneuve’s cabinet,” declared the title of another article on Europe 1 radio’s website.
Is France 24 a government owned rag?
It’s a corporate/Washington owned rag, as are just about all European governments.