Nicola and Independence 1634


I have been gently chided for not giving my reactions to the SNP conference, which I attended as a delegate.

Nicola’s major speech was very good. The media universally attempted to characterise it as kicking a new Independence referendum into the long grass. I did not hear it that way at all. I think they are clutching at the straw of her single mention of patience and perseverance, against the fact she used the word “Independent” or “Independence” an extraordinary 31 times in her speech. Of course she wishes to retain flexibility and an element of surprise, but as someone who has studied the matter extremely closely and who distrusts the highly paid SNP professional “elite” on this issue, I was reassured as to Nicola’s intentions.

The members are in extremely good heart and very confident. I was personally much touched by the many scores of individuals who bothered to come up to me and say they followed the blog. The conference agenda was somewhat bland, though fizzing with righteous anger at the effects of austerity on the vulnerable. My major criticism would be that far too high a percentage of total speaking time on the conference floor is given to MP’s, MSP’s and MEP’s. Constituency proposed motions, for example, were too often used as a showcase for the MP/MSP rather than introduced by an ordinary party member.

I dislike the political class now attached to the SNP in just the same way that I distrust the professional political class in every political party. The horrible Alex Bell should be a serious warning of the kind of false hypocrites that a salary will attract “to the cause”. Seeing MPs I knew as just punters campaigning in 2014, now walking proudly before power dressed entourages of paid staff, was a strangely unpleasant experience.

My major concern is that the SNP’s foreign policy and defence teams at Westminster appear to have been entirely captured by the UK establishment and indeed the security services. They have been willing and instant amplifiers of the Tories’ Russophobia.

It appears to me truly remarkable that I was not allowed to hire a room for a fringe meeting on Independence campaigning, but that the “Westminster Foundation for Democracy” – which is an FCO front and 90% FCO and DFID funded – was allowed a room on the fringe to hold this anti-Russian propaganda fest with a Ukrainian MP imported by the FCO.

Furthermore the meeting was co-hosted by the SNP and “Westminster Foundation for Democracy” and featured two SNP MPs.

I took issue with two other senior SNP figures last month over the party’s slavish devotion to what the UK intelligence services tell them.

The problem here is of course that the SNP is accepting a UK-centric vision of the world. This is a fundamental error, a category mistake. Because Russia is in an antagonistic relationship with the UK does not mean Russia should or will have an antagonistic relationship to an Independent Scotland.

Whatever happened in Salisbury, the root cause was spy games between Russia and the UK. Precisely the kind of spy games an independent Scotland must have no part of.

MI6 recruited Sergei Skripal as a traitor to Russia, who for money revealed secrets of his nation to MI6, including identities of agents. That is the root of the Salisbury events, and it is not the sort of thing an Independent Scotland will be doing. If an Independent Scotland is just going to behave like the UK in foreign affairs, carrying on neo-con foreign policy by illegitimate methods, I see no point in Scotland being independent. The Skripal affair, whatever really happened, is part of an entire system which most people in the Yes movement wish to get out of. We do not see the UK’s enemies as our enemies.

But the UK security services are our enemies. Scottish nationalism is defined in security service tasking as a threat to the UK and we are targets of the UK security services. The British government is not going to agree to another Independence referendum and we are going to have to win Independence, like the Catalans, in the teeth of every dirty abuse of British state power.

I would feel very much better if the SNP leaders, like Chris Law and John Nicholson both of whom I count as friends, would sometimes draw a deep breath, forget what they imbibed as Westminster MPs, and remember which side they are on.


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1,634 thoughts on “Nicola and Independence

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  • Republicofscotland

    The Tories are to create a superdata base by the end of the year. It will be called Law Enforcement Data Service (LEDS).

    “Two existing stores of information — the Police National Computer (PNC), which records criminal convictions, and the Police National Database (PND), a vast store of gathered intelligence — as well as all information held on various other police data repositories.”

    Other UK bodies such as The HMRC or the Border Agency could also be added. Rights groups have openly said this superdata base poses a serious threat to people’s rights.

    In a country that has more CCTV camera’s per head of population than anywhere else the ever creeping expansion of data gathering is a serious threat to the citizen’s privacy.

    https://sputniknews.com/analysis/201810161068905829-uk-police-super-database/

  • Republicofscotland

    The United Nations says that the demolition of a Bedouin village, to make way for a expanded J**ish settlement constitutes as a War Crime.

    The International Criminal Court’s chief prosecutor Fatou Bensouda appears to agree.

    “The UK, France, Germany, Spain and Italy calling for Israel not to go ahead with the demolition.”

  • Hatuey

    As I understand the sequence of events on Brexit over the last few days, the EU basically sent May back to the U.K. to see if she has enough political support for the deal she was hoping to broker. Her deal essentially involves a temporary backstop with NI remaining in the single market and the rest of us remaining in the customs union for a limited period.

    It is known that Nicola Sturgeon was in talks with May on Monday and this cannot be a coincidence. Sturgeon wouldn’t normally go to London just to make a fairly run of the mill statement.

    There are now rumours that a deal has been struck that would entail the SNP abstaining on any deal that May comes back with along the lines suggested above, and, in return for that abstention, a second referendum on Scottish independence would be legislated by the U.K. government.

    A few questions arise from that possible scenario. I think such an agreement probably is in place, it makes a lot of sense, but I don’t see how abstaining could be considered a deal in the same way that the DUP has a deal. It’s not like the SNP would be propping the Tories up. And, of course, over the last 8 years, Labour have been abstaining on nearly everything, including austerity cuts to welfare etc. — truly shameful — and we won’t be taking any lectures from them.

    I believe there’s a case for the SNP going further than abstaining since May’s Chequers deal is really the only proposal on the table that comes close to achieving what the SNP have been arguing for (single market access). At the very least, it would come close to guaranteeing that for a few years.

    The game is most certainly afoot.

    • Jo1

      No Hatuey. If Nicola has done a deal with the Tories then she’s done a deal. Don’t nit-pick on this. There is nothing sensible about it if indeed she has. Agreeing to abstain is doing a deal. And it absolutely IS propping the Tories up.

      Furthermore, if she’s also agreed to NI being treated differently from Scotland then she’s erased another SNP red line. She has repeatedly said she wouldn’t accept that arrangement. So, on the whole, I hope you’re wrong because she’ll be, rightly, crucified if she’s abandoned so many principles just in the hope of getting a second independence referendum.

      In any case, May isn’t in a position to promise anything. She’s hanging by a thread!

      Finally, your attempts to excuse any deal done with the Tories, like, for example, pretending it’s not really a deal, is astonishing. You say these are only rumours. I hope so. And I hope they will be quashed by Nicola Sturgeon as a matter of urgency.

      • Hatuey

        “There is nothing sensible about it…”

        Well, sorry, but actually there’s a lot that’s sensible about it. It would give scotland the chance to remain in Europe which Scotland overwhelmingly to do. And, it would allow Sturgeon to fulfill a major manifesto pledge, something that the Scotland parliament has ratified, a referendum triggered specifically by this brexit scenario.

        But I don’t see how abstaining can be compared to the confidence and supply arrangement that the DUP has with the Tories. And from a philosophical perspective, I don’t see how abstaining or not doing something can be defined as anything other than neutral.

        If abstaining is so bad, how come Labour did it so often without your condemnation? As said, they abstained on a bunch of welfare reforms too. So much for the party of principle…
        https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/these-are-the-184-labour-mps-who-didn-t-vote-against-the-tories-welfare-bill-10404831.html

        What’s more, given that half of Scotland and the SNP want out of the U.K. and attach huge importance to getting out, because of things like Brexit whereby the wishes of Scottish people are constantly and structurally disregarded, you could hardly blame the SNP for coming to such an arrangement with the Tories. We don’t forget Ed miliband pledging never to go into coalition with the SNP and more recently we have the halfwit Scottish Labour leader, Leonard, dictating that he’d never allow us another referendum.

        My instincts tell me that this will happen and will be impactful in terms of the numbers in the House of Commons. As for propping May up, well, if we have an arrangement along the lines suggested with her, it’s in our interests to prop her up. It’s not like Labour are offering us a thing anyway, nobody has a clue what they stand for (vague pish about helping the poor convinces nobody up here), and they seem quite content to sit watching the Brexit car crash without doing a thing.

        • Goodwin

          Scotland will not be able to “remain in Europe”. They will have to qualify in their own right and Spain, for one, will do all it can to ensure that they do not qualify.

    • jake

      Hateuy,
      As I understand it this story about a deal has something to do with George Galloway. Just sayin’.

      • Hatuey

        Yes Galloway, but I’ve been anticipating such an arrangement. And Sturgeon apparently looked very confident about something on Monday, the day she met May.

        It looks likely, I’d say.

        • Hatuey

          You’ll find out when the division bell rings…

          Of course, until then I’ll lie awake at night worrying about all those hard Brexiteers and those they convinced to follow them. And how sad it makes me to think of their hopes dashed by SNP MPs sitting on their sweaty Scottish hands.

          As the good ship independence sets off into the sunset, I for one will be on deck waiving with a tear in my eye. It’s really England that is going on a journey though, not us, and farewell to you.

          God speed, little England.

  • Republicofscotland

    Chinese firm creates supersonic missile, which it may sell to Pakistan to counter the BrahMos missile, which is currently used by India.

    The BrahMos missile is currently the world’s fastest anti-ship cruise missile in operation.

    Trump may up the ante with China.

    “President Donald Trump plans to withdraw the U.S. from a 192-nation treaty that gives Chinese companies discounted shipping rates for small packages sent to American consumers, another escalation of his economic confrontation of Beijing.”

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Postal_Union

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-10-17/trump-is-said-to-plan-withdrawal-from-china-shipping-treaty

    • Charles Bostock

      So the Chinese are helping to ramp up the arms race, eh?

      West-haters please take note 🙂

      • Republicofscotland

        As America has long standing relationship with nations such as the UK. So China has a relationship with Pakistan, building infrastructure and so forth in the country.

        So it shouldn’t come as a surprise that China might supply Pakistan with the missile. In saying that, the BrahMos missile is I believe a joint venture between India and Russia, the latter in my opinion has a good relationship with Russia.

        If anything, it shows that when it comes to selling arms, no nation is off limits, regardless of how friendly it might be with a particular nation, or its enemies.

        • Republicofscotland

          “latter in my opinion has a good relationship with Russia.”

          Should read China, my apologies.

      • Hmmm

        In your bizarre world feeling justly disgusted by your country’s actions equals supporting disgusting actions of a completely different country. Although you appear to enjoy living in your world I’m glad I don’t occupy it.
        It might be nice to visit occasionally though. Maybe you could visit reality on the odd occasion too?

      • giyane

        It’s the age-old question of the bimbos on the Tel-Aviv beach. With China you don’t know who their partners are, but with the West, you do know, and it’s best not even to get the proverbial barge-pole out.

      • Stonky

        “So the Chinese are helping to ramp up the arms race, eh?
        West-haters please take note ?”

        I don’t get it Charles. Sanctimonious prigs like you are always lecturing China on how it has to be “more like the West”. And then when they do behave more like the West, you find fault with that too. I wish you would make up your mind what you want.

    • giyane

      Ref. the Bell Cartoon
      Firstly, Most people didn’t realise before this summer that frozen White Fish in the supermarket actually means Scallop.

      Then, Trump = Zionism = Bin Salman. I get that. But Trump has obliterated Obama and King Salman’s Islamic State. The purity of love, , ” fucking for virginity ” yes I get that. King Salman is a terrorist. But white supremacy, Zionism Saudi money are what keep Trump in gainful employment as president.

      On Radio 4 shortly before the 6 oclock news yesterday there was a 20 minute diatribe of typical, fake, American, pseudo-psychiatry diagnosing Trump’s mental health problems. 20 minutes of diatribe is an age in today’s limited attention space. I kept thinking this garbage has got to end, but no, they worked it for all they could squeeze out of the bloke.

      I have to say, that Trump’s destruction of the neo-cons’ terror group Daesh, the pinnacle of British FCO folly, intrigue and stupidity, marks him out as the most sane president since JF Kennedy. Trump’s negotiations with North Korea, Russia and addressing of trade imbalances with China, all demonstrate that US diplomatic talent is still alive after being suffocated by neo-con terrorrology for 50 years.

      Imho, that doesn’t put a toilet seat on Trumps head. But yes, I do think he should drop his loyalty to his personal business financial backers when he speaks as President of the US. That puts the toilet seat firmly back in place.

  • Tony_0pmoc

    I have just realised 2 weeks later, why my wife got the full treatment at Gatwick Airport, trying to get out of The UK. They were O.K. with me. I simply put my laptop (fully charged), belt, wallet, money, passport, and absolutely everything, including coins, and cigarette lighters except my spectacles which did contain a trace of metal (the Norwegian dentist – gave me a great bridge (also containing no metal, though I still may have a little bit of gold in my back teeth )

    I walked straight through. No problem.

    They were very much harder on my wife – and still they wouldn’t let her through – until she was put in this X-Ray machine. I looked at her in that thing, and I thought why are they doing this to my wife? They have put her in this large plastic tube and made her stand with her legs apart, and her arms held high above her. None of The X-Ray photographers, nor The Interrogators were in This X-Ray machine – that was my wife alone in there. They didn’t themselves go near.

    They quickly examined multiple X-Ray photographs of my wife from all dimensions, analysed them on their computers – and let her through….

    I knew where she had been, I could see her, and asked why did they pick on you?

    Gatwick Security is Rubbish

    They asked me to take My Specs off coming back – cos the stupid machine couldn’t recognise me.

    The Reason they picked on my wife in the first place, is that she has a large piece of metal in her ankle and leg, from a couple of years ago, when she got run over by a car on the way to her dance class..

    Are you idiots going to continue to give my wife a hard time at airport security, cos she has got more metal in her than you?

    You are a bunch of useless cunts. Who The Fuck is Responsible for your Computing, Cameras and Live Software Analysis to do basic identification? Even a liitle rock club is South London were faster than you 10 years ago – and they let us both in no problem – and we did go again.

    Even I could do a better job than that.

    You are RUBBISH

    RESIGN

    Tony

    • John A

      Tony,
      I have got a reverse shoulder joint replacement and the scares of several failed operations on the joint and rotator cuff repairs. The metal sets off the alarm at some airports, but not all, maybe 50/50 I guess. I explain this, their hand held metal detector confirms this as do show the scars but they still make me go in that tube. However, in my little act of defiance, I refuse to lift my arms above my head. But I am civil in my refusal. It is a ritual. I think of it as a draw.
      The downside is that it takes you longer to get back to the tray containing valuables, in my case, usually a macbook, phone and wallet as I put my jacket through the x-ray system too.
      Plus these trays are proven to be a haven of all sorts of bugs and viruses. I sympathise with your wife. Many years ago, i bleached my hair blond. Got stopped at customs and security very time. Bad decision. Have always been close cropped ever since.

      • Paul Barbara

        @ Ian October 17, 2018 at 21:56
        Sure, that’s what every country faced when it voted against the EU – keep voting till the PTB get THEIR result.
        We voted out, come hell or high water.

      • Dave Lawton

        The EU is a dictatorship. It`s not rocket science.”Public opinion will be led to adopt, without knowing it, the proposals we dare not present to them directly. All the earlier proposals will be in the new text, but will be hidden and diguised”
        (Valery Giscard D’Estang. on the Lisbon treaty)

        “They must go on voting until they get it right.”
        (Jose Manuel Barroso, President of the European Commission)

        “The ‘no’ votes were a demand for more Europe, not less.”
        (Romano Prodi, former President of the European Commission)

        “It is an illusion to think that [EU] states can hold on to their autonomy.”
        (Hans Tietmeyer, head of the Bundesbank 1991)

        “The European system of supranationality comes at the cost of democracy.”
        (Lord Leach of Fairford)

        “A European currency will lead to member nations transferring their sovereignty over financial and wage policy as well as monetary affairs”.
        (Hans Tietmeyer, head of the Bundesbank, 1991)

        The single currency is the greatest abandonment of sovereignty since the foundation of the European Community: the decision is of an essentially political nature”.
        (Felipe Gonzalez, a Spanish former PM, 1998)

        “I think the eurozone has turned the corner”.
        (Then French Economy Minister, Christine Lagarde, 29 January 2011)
        She would say that being a convicted criminal and now head of the IMF.

        • Hatuey

          Dave, all the more reasons for you and your country to get the hell out. Good riddance. Everybody is sick hearing xenophobic English people moaning. England is a country that spent over a decade begging to get into the EEC with its failing economy.

          • Tony

            And I think most of us are sick (of) hearing xenophobic Scots, particularly ones who can’t even get their lies straight about something as basic as their drinking habits.

          • Dave Lawton

            Hatuey

            “England is a country that spent over a decade begging to get into the EEC with its failing economy.”
            It is the remainders that keep moaning because the hate democracy. Britain did not beg one little bit.
            You need to get your facts right. It was a one of the biggest frauds and scams engineered on the British people with propaganda and manipulation by the Information Research Department with help from the CIA.Go do some research and find out for yourself. The papers are now freely available. Even Gordon C.Tether of FT lost his job for exposing the truth of the matter.

    • Paul Barbara

      @ Sharp Ears October 17, 2018 at 21:50
      Be fair! At least that should reinforce our assessment that the EU is bad for the people, good for the PTB and their puppets.
      UK, UK, OUT, OUT,OUT!
      Jeremy Corbyn In, In, In!

    • Night Warbler

      As if anything could better serve to illustrate what many who voted Leave suspect, that they were, and are, being stitched up by a neoliberal consensus involving all major UK parties. For the record, I wouldn’t personally include Corbyn’s Labour in this, but I imagine a lot of Leave voters would.

    • IrishU

      Yes who cares about the opinion of a former Prime Minsiter and two former Deputy Prime Ministers…

      Ridiculous comment. Perhaps they should post their views on a blog, would people then care for their opinons?

  • Alf Baird

    When the SNP won 56 of 59 seats in Scotland and still refused to dissolve this ‘union’ con trick, as they were constitutionally entitled to do, I kind of knew then that independence was a forlorn hope. They have either been infiltrated big time or simply don’t have the bottle, probably a bit of both. Given the census and rising inflows of more No voters (one million over the last 20 years) another open franchise referendum would simply make us Quebec2.

  • Sharp Ears

    This is an exceptionally nasty and cruel action from our very own state broadcaster. They knew damn well that it was a parody account.

    BBC accused of ‘fake news’ after quoting parody Assange account as real thing
    17 Oct, 2018 13:18
    The BBC were accused of spreading ‘fake news’ about Julian Assange after attributing quotes to the whistleblower that originated from a parody account.

    The story was instigated after conditions put on Assange for allowing him access to the internet were leaked online.

    In an article headlined: “Julian Assange given feline ultimatum by Ecuador” on the alleged warning the embassy has given the activist over his treatment of his cat, the BBC write: “It is unclear what is behind Ecuador’s concern over Mr Assange’s treatment of his roommate.

    On the subject of cleanliness, however, Mr Assange tweeted earlier this year: “Save water, don’t shower.””

    Historian Mark Curtis was quick to point out that the quote was in fact from a Spanish parody account.

    /..
    https://www.rt.com/uk/441409-assange-cat-fake-news-bbc/

          • IrishU

            Haha, what a cutting response.

            So for clarification RoS, Sharp Ears can question, denigrate, troll and cut / paste, at will, and without comment. Is that your stance?

            As for the remark from Sharpie, she has proved her enviable googling abilities to get to the bottom of numerous conspiracies, it would take less than 30 seconds to pull up a rather detailed bio on Juno Dawson.

      • Isa

        The guardian makes physically ill these days . Their hate of Assange is nauseating .

        Also they insist on mistranslating the Spanish document . Nowhere does it say he has to take “ better care” of his cat .

      • pete

        Who is Juno Dawson?

        Juno has a bit of self disclosure in an article about her roots when writing about the rise of white nationalism in the north:
        “What young, queer, liberal person would want to associate themselves with white supremacy? I went to great lengths at university to distance myself from the shame of these events, hence “I’m from Leeds”.
        But then I grew up and moved to Brighton, then London, and then Brighton again. I have lived in the south east since 2003. I have learned there is, as I think any northerner will tell you, a fundamental difference between us and southerners. We possess a certain realism, a wry pessimism you don’t get down south. Perhaps it’s because, living so far from London, we recognise the opportunities and advantages we miss out on simply because we weren’t born within the commuter belt. If you think the government invests in the north as it does the south, you’re dreaming.
        But my roots set me in good stead for life as an author. Publishing is so posh, so white and so ridiculous – advances and book deals whipped out of thin air, based on nothing more than hopes and crossed fingers – that my scepticism has served me well. And that’s because I’ll always be from Bingley.”
        https://www.theguardian.com/books/2018/jun/30/juno-dawson-made-in-bingley-yorkshire

        I hope this has cleared the matter up.

  • Sharp Ears

    As many of us expected, her latest little jaunt was a waste of time (and fossil fuel).

    LIVE: Brexit transition extension ‘a matter of months’ – PM
    The latest as the PM joins talks on migration and security after the EU27 say there’s “not enough progress” on Brexit.
    Brexit deal timeline slips again as EU scraps plan for November summit sign-off
    PM faces Brexiteer backlash over hint to extend transition period beyond 2020
    Theresa May admits transition extension an “idea” but stresses it would be “a matter of months”
    French, Belgian, German and Luxembourgian leaders go drinking after Wednesday night’s dinner
    PM to join EU talks on security and migration on Thursday

    https://news.sky.com/story/live-pm-back-at-eu-summit-after-no-brexit-progress-11528468

  • Shug

    People getting choppwd up in a consul, uk kidnapping people for torture by gaddafi and russians poisoning the tea and pizza
    What a strange place the world has become

  • 7 Kings

    I see George Cowan has a book out on this very subject.
    It will maybe probably be a good read, perhaps.

    • Graham Venvell

      I’m aghast that he’s had to resort to such reasoning. Skirpal must be seething!

  • Republicofscotland

    Labour refused to investigate bullying claim against their anti-bullying spokesperson.

    https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/uk/2018/10/labour-declined-investigate-bullying-complaint-against-valerie-vaz?amp&__twitter_impression=true

    Meanwhile as Spain holds untried political prisoners for over a year. A Flemish delegate has his diplomatic status removed for speaking about it.

    André Hebbelinck, a Flemish delegate to Madrid, lost his status because he referred to the untried civil leaders as political prisoners.

    The EU could turn against Spain on this matter, after Flemish president Geert Bourgeois, describe it as a hostile act.

  • Republicofscotland

    The often lauded Greek PM Alexis Tsipras, will see Greece drop its objections to the country joining Nato. However his foreign minister, has resigned over the matter, after clashing with Tsipras.

    Tsipras will take over the position as FM, as well as PM.

  • Dungroanin

    I suppose Craig Murray (60 and all grown up!) is waiting for the final shoe to drop before writing, not long now sir.

    I’ll try to amuse and rouse while we wait.

    It seems the farce of Tory brexit negotiations are entering the final furlong, just one more fence before whipping hard for the no-deal, hard brexit, on WTO terms.

    A treaty that neither parliament or a referendum voted for. Arranged and signed upto by John Major.
    Handing legal powers to the opaque pathocrats instead of independent transparent judiciary

    It was planned all along, unless the EU bent over for the ancient City pathocracy.

    No amount of infiltration (Macron) , skullduggery (alr-rightism) and bogeymaning (the russkies are coming to novichok you) is capable of splitting the EU27 resolve to pursue fair banking, taxation and regulation (imperfectly at first as usual).

    Apparently the US [arm of the City] is going to make a direct threat against the new EU regulations! As they try and start a war in Ukraine; As their proxy isis get pulled out of Idlib or destroyed by Putin; As their proxy Saudis get sold down the river, they failed so US boots get to invade them instead (just like Nazi Germany).

    Heads will roll, and let us not forget how we were very keen (still are) on dealing with the dissenters against our robber barons with public torture, choking, eviseration and ultimate dissection while ALIVE too. We taught the world despots well – many at Sandhurst, ahem.

    A coup and dictatorship beckons in the UK, maybe they will restrict it to an expanded City.

    Time to get the pitchforks out!

    If your kids and siblings,family or friends are in the forces (public or private) they need to understand the folly of just ‘following orders’ – there is no such defence.
    Some here (i’m looking at YOU) may have forgotten that or are to far gone to care.

    Off to the garden to collect seeds and plant some bulbs for spring, it is a beautiful day.

    • Sharp Ears

      I would advise getting something edible growing before the next collapse happens. And get some hens if you have room.

      • King of Welsh Noir

        What sort of collapse are we talking here? Something apocalyptic? If so, your chickens won’t last a day. Experience shows when food runs short people eat their pets first and then the dead.

    • Vivian O'Blivion

      Surprised that the ERG haven’t spontaneously combusted as May suggests an extension to the transition ((not that it’ll be needed of course)(talk about letting things down gently)). If they can’t muster the 48 letters to trigger a leadership contest now can they ever?
      The ERG and Jacob Ree-Smugg have all the hallmarks of a cult (nts; check spelling before post). They ain’t stupid enough to believe that free movement of goods is compatible with clinching free trade deals with parties outside the EU, which leaves delusional (wilful or otherwise) or disingenuous. The only thing that ever mattered to the City boys (and girls) in the ERG was protecting they money laundering and tax evasion rackets from the regulation they projected as coming from Brussels. Not that gentleman Jacob would ever be so gauche as to be caught out saying “fuck industry”.

    • Loony

      Ah yes the EU 27 and their altruistic drive to pursue “fair banking…”

      Can it be that you define fair banking as sequestrating customer deposits (unless they are Russian customers) as happened in Cyprus.

      Who could forget (other than apparently you) the money laundering activities of Danske Bank leveraging their branch in Estonia for all it was worth to open the gushers of Russian black money.

      …and what is this? Why Deutsche Bank traders being found criminally guilty for rigging the Libor rate. All this on top of the multi hundred million $ fine already paid by Deutsche Bank. This would be the same Deutsche Bank that has almost $50 trillion of derivatives exposure and the same Deutsche Bank that has gone through 5 rounds of capital raising since the financial crisis.

      No-one knows the exact reasons behind the assassination of Daphne Caruana Galizia in Malta – but financial corruption would seem like the most sensible guess.

      For those so interested in the joys of European harmonization it is strange that they so rarely mention the farce/scandal/robbery of the public that accompanied the wonderful Caja restructuring in Spain – absolutely nothing to see there. Let’s move on. Don’t dwell on Italy or we might need to mention Banca Monte Paschi.

      So yeah – you can take your corruption free EU and stick it where the sun don’t shine. Feel free to let the whole world know exactly how Deutsche Bank came to have $50 trillion of derivatives and what the exact plan is for unwinding this portfolio without causing economic carnage.

      • Dungroanin

        Thank YOU, for the reply Loony me old mucker, who ever said the EU is a completed project? It too had high representation of City interests for decades, as well as gravy trains to keep the MEP’s under control, while serving the usual global robber barons.

        The problem that the status quo has with the ever developing union is that it is very difficult to herd the MEP’s of 28 countries to curtail the bottom up democratic demands, which is how the excesses you identify are being dealt with.

        However the EU is getting better, it is probably 7 out of 10 ok!

      • Vivian O'Blivion

        Loony.
        The examples you cite are accurate. You could add the outrageous deals on Corporation tax offered by Luxembourg and Dublin. The point is, Westminster is bought and payed for by the City. Westminster poses no threat to the City, Brussels does. Don’t doubt for a moment that the City boys have been talking to the Heads of the big hydrocarbon multinationals. The big oil and gas boys could have lobbied the individual European states to stave off financial incentives to reduce CO2 emissions, but they failed at a European wide level. See also, the UK spiking any attempt at a European wide, Financial transaction tax.

      • Xavi

        That 50 trillion euros in derivatives exposure at Deutsche sounds gigantic but it reflects only the notional value of the contracts. Deutsche’s net exposure to derivatives is far lower, around €43 billion. That’s the maximum exposure.

        You might as well worry about what would happen to the bettiing industry if all the horses won.

        • Charles Bostock

          At last, an intelligent response to Loony’s recurring theme (I should perhaps say obsession) of the Deutsche Bank’s 50 trillion exposure! Well nailed, sir.

          By the way, 43 billion is less than half of the money involved in the 3rd Greek bailout so it would be more than do-able (but it won’t need to be done).

    • Sharp Ears

      From leafy Surrey soon to be leafless! That’s three BlueTories, Cleverley (chairman of the partei), Dobbs (once adviser to the old witch) and Minton Beddoes (editor of the Economist), one Red Tory, Starmer and the requisite comedian, Nish Kumar, all superintended by the-soon-to-retire establishment stooge Dimbleby D.

    • Hatuey

      There have been several outbreaks in the rest of the UK over the last few years and nobody said English dairy farming was down the pan as a result or that those outbreaks would make independence from the EU unachievable.

      This case proves that screening works as it should and they’ll be able to trace where it came from thanks to the most advanced tracking systems in the world. One of my old friends was a dairy farmer and he spent a fortune on this stuff, all Scottish farmers do.

      • Dale Craven

        Good luck with that one, what with the live exportation from this farm to the EU via Ireland, this endorses the case for a border of some description. No doubt this is a false flag operation concocted by the Tory party to convince the EU and the UK electorate that a no deal soft Brexit with hard borders should be pursued.
        The SNP’s plan for reducing the risk status for Scottish farms has just dribbled down the side of a bolt gun. “Scotland has had no cases of BSE since 2009 and this announcement is testament to many people’s tireless efforts, including the The Scottish Association of Meat Wholesalers, our beef producers and finishers, our red meat businesses, vets, and this government. We have all worked together to maintain a system of interlocking safeguards against BSE that protects our public and animal health.”
        https://www.scotsman.com/business/companies/farming/low-risk-bse-status-will-drive-scottish-red-meat-exports-1-4457639
        https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-36608605

      • Paul Barbara

        @ Hatuey October 18, 2018 at 12:53
        Anyone seriously interested in BSE should read ‘Animal Pharm: One Man’s Struggle to Discover the Truth about Mad Cow Disease’ by Mark Purdey. This 35-minute video interview will give people an idea what the book is about. Mark ‘contracted’ a virulent form of brain cancer and died before he could finish the book, but his brother, who had been a co-investigator, finished it.
        ‘What causes BSE, CJD & MS? Organic Farmer Mark Purdey on Organophosphates (2001)’:
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MheeiX2w8JU
        Please bring this to the attention of your friend who used to be a dairy farmer, if you are still in touch.

    • Republicofscotland

      Mad Cow disease, yes Theresa May is in Brussels.

      Of course the real threat to Scottish, and British farming for that matter, is the loss of EU subsidies afte we leave the EU.

      Farmers will need to degrade their produce without the subsidies, to compete with foreign inferior produce. Know one knows yet how many farms will fold.

  • Mighty Drunken

    New claims that Julian Assange had a plan to go to Russia as an Ecuadorian diplomat.
    This time they cite Ecuadorian government documents.

    https://hillreporter.com/ecuadors-attempt-to-extricate-wikileaks-founder-julian-assange-to-russia-fails-10769

    https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/5004881-Carta-Canciller.html

    Seems like something the Ecuadorian government could easily fake if they wanted. Though I wouldn’t blame Assange for wanting to acquire his freedom by any means needed.

    • Charles Bostock

      Personally I wouldn’t give too much importance to those new claims.

      But re Julian : I wonder if he would be minded to leave the embassy if the bail-jumping charge were to be dropped?

      Has Julian actually come out with his “conditions” (let’s call them that for the sake of argument) for leaving the embassy? Has he said anything along the lines of “I will leave the embassy provided that x, y and z are guaranteed”?

      • Trowbridge H. Ford

        Since the British covert government went to the extreme of cruelly murdering Gareth Williams for leaking the hacked Afghan File, and Assange had it published in the media unredacted, I doubt Julian will trust HMG on any way.

      • Charles Bostock

        Trowbridge

        Obviously trust is/would be an important factor here. But that gives rise to the following thought – if Julian is distrustful then will he ever leave the embassy? Do you see what I mean?

        But I think my question still remains valid – has Julian gone on record as stating what will get him to leave the embassy?

        • Trowbridge H. Ford

          I see what you mean. Doubt that he will ever choose to leave in light of what has happened.

        • Ian

          He said plenty times if he is guaranteed not to be extradited to the US then he has no problem facing any other charges. Pay attention.

          • Charles Bostock

            Thank you, Ian.

            There is an extradition treaty between the USA and the UK. IF any extradition ordered by the UK government (ie, the executive) is subject to appeal in the UK courts – I suppose it is – then the guarantee Julian is asking for amounts to him demanding in advance that the courts will quash any extradition which may have been agreed. In other words, he would be seeking to determine in advance legal process. Is that acceptable under the rule of law and the separation of executive and judicial powers?

            Now, you may say that situation could be avoided by a guarantee from the UK government, in advance, that the latter would itself refuse any extradition request by the USA. But the problem here might be that the UK executive may have no option but to fulfill such a request provided that the extradition is “legal” under the terms of the treaty.

            I suppose that before continuing the discussion one would need to know exactly what the extradition treaty stipulates.

    • Charles Bostock

      I rather doubt it. But what is far more interesting is the question “why – given inflation over the past decade(s) – is the £50 note still the highest denomination note in circulation?”. After all, the highest euro note is 200 euros (it was 500 euros) and the highest Swiss franc note is a whopping 1000 CHF. It is ridiculous.

    • J

      I’m enjoying the thought of beggars celebrating while newly minted Bullingdon twats burn Thatchers portrait in front of them. They don’t realise that by certain magical principles it will cause a karmic shift in the universe sending Milton Friedman to the darkest rescesses of the underworld and reverse his baleful influence bringing about an era of freedom and love. 😉

      • Charles Bostock

        Look, it’s all good for a little light banter on here and so on, but the £50 note will not have Mrs Thatcher’s head on it. It’s just a canard.

    • Paul Barbara

      @ Blunderbuss October 18, 2018 at 13:20
      I’ve already got Bliar on a £20 (but it’s as dodgy as him!).

  • Vivian O'Blivion

    Apparently Dr Fox has withdrawn from Davos in the desert. Genuinely surprised, I thought he would wait and see what Mnuchin decided before making a call.

  • Trowbridge H. Ford

    It’s all evidence of how fascist our states have become. Ministers have to appear to care about what happerns to their citizens.

    • glenn_nl

      That’s not really much of a coincidence – the Columbine shooters have lots of admirers in the US. Read this in the paper edition of the NYT a few months back:

      https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/30/us/school-shootings-columbine.html

      You might find it of interest.

      —-
      SANTA FE, Tex. — The exact reasons a teenage gunman shot his fellow students and teachers here at Santa Fe High School remain a mystery. His model for carrying it out is more clear.

      The 17-year-old junior wore a black trench coat and fired a sawed-off shotgun, the same attire and weaponry used by the two gunmen who killed a dozen students and a teacher at Columbine High School in Colorado in 1999.
      [ Continues ]
      —-

      • Republicofscotland

        “the Columbine shooters have lots of admirers in the US.”

        I see it from a different perspective, copycat killers? Or pre-programmed patsies, using the same model?

        • glenn_nl

          They appear to have genuine admirers, RoS. One of the mothers of a Columbine killer says she occasionally receives communication from some teenage girl, expressing that she would have liked to have a baby by the killer.

          • Republicofscotland

            “They appear to have genuine admirers,”

            I don’t doubt it, though I should ask for a link. Still in my favour such admirers would be easy to recruit and deploy.

            Is this an insight to the levels of education in America. Has chasing the dollar dumbed them down.

            I’d imagine the security services in the US have a plethro of patsies to choose from.

            https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/food-and-drink/american-chocolate-milk-brown-cows-study-us-dairy-innvoation-adults-a7793016.html

          • glenn_nl

            I’m not quite sure I understand your point. Who do you think is recruiting patsies, or setting up these school shootings, and why?

            It appears that having a country where high powered guns proliferate, together with a highly defective health system – particularly mental health – is reason enough for such events.

            Particularly in a country which is incredibly violent and there is very little social cohesion pretty much by design.

            Of course, I can understand why conspiracy theories would be fashioned by gun advocates, because they want any reason _other_ than the rampant gun culture to be considered the problem.

  • James

    Coming from Perspex Ears: “I did look Juno up but did not want to repeat the stuff”.
    At risk of increasing the already high pH here with additional “caustic”, the innate irony of this desperately silly rejoinder of an own-goal made me snigger childishly; any kind of reluctance to “repeat the stuff” must surely be a precedent for old Prickly Ears.
    The only chiming (of bell(end)s?) I can perceive in these parts comes from a chippy cabal of old-timers including but certainly not limited to RoS, AndyOldLabour, Jimmy, books and many more hitchhikers and their associated sockpuppets.
    Pathetic indeed, and red faces all round I’d say.
    By the way, Sharp Ears, the plural of ad hominem is NOT ad hominems. You’ll need to use the full Latin expression in the plural, viz. arguments ad hominem. Considering you have used the term pretty much on a daily basis for the last eleven years, I thought it was only sporting and decent to put you out of everyone else’s misery: such a hideous solecism!
    It’s all too absurd for words, in truth.

    • Republicofscotland

      “It’s all too absurd for words, in truth.”

      I was thinking the exact same thing about your comment.

      • James

        That’s the meaning of “all” in that sentence, ditto “red faces all round”, ibid.
        “All”: you miss the little words, and therefore I, suspect, the “bigger picture” here as elsewhere.
        I blame myself for this abject foolishness as much as I accuse any other.
        Sadly, the true aficionado of this tripe believes this activity is anything but tripe or foolishness. How easy it must be to get irreparably damaged by becoming sucked in to this load of old Codds’.

    • IrishU

      Excellent post. I am glad somebody else has reached the limit of their tolerance for the circle jerk on here between the likes of Sharpie, RoS, Old Labour etc etc.

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